Dude, holyshit! Never ever ever have I heard a better Brown sound video in my freaking life! There was a point I stopped the video and just sat there in absolute awe. Obviously, you're playing and technique are very very good. But the sound you get on this video IS Eddie's sound. Couldn't thank you enough. Absolutely brilliant
@@jesuschrist2284 I would totally do that. Just someone else will have to set it up for me LOL. I've never had any luck getting great tone out of modeling style amps. Your message is very appreciated, I feel like I should give it one more shot.
I've seen a million of these videos where people try to get that Eddie's Brown sound and honestly I can tell you that in my opinion this is the closest I've heard. And your playing is awesome too by the way.
Just stumbled across this... Easily the most spot-on representation!!!Well done Sir!... And you captured the most important part... The sound has everything...the bite/ the harmonics/..the perfect distortion..it's alive...best take ever!!
im not even a huge evh fan or anything, but ive been facinated with the brown sound for ages now, this is one of the best videos ive ever seen on the brown sound, so informative and entertaining. This should have at least 10x the views man, and your voice is very relaxing!
Dude just stumbled upon this vid and as a producer/engineer u absolutely friggin nailed the tone. It’s a subtle batch of such specific overtones! Seriously well done mate🎶
Not sure if this is the secret sauce (will we ever know?) but this is probably the closest/best Eddie tone I've heard on TH-cam. The way the tone cleans up at lower guitar volumes is just as impressive as the fully open tone. Well done sir!
Nice Work, always enjoy a great tone and outstanding playing, subbed and on board for more. You obviously worked very hard for that technique and all the details.
Aside from the outstanding sound displayed in this video, one has to really sit in awe of all the devastating riffs Ed created. He was a genius on so many levels.
This appeared in my feed and I’m so glad it did! Holy cow man - you have done a fantastic job with the research and tone! Be proud. I’m a new subscriber today. 🎉
Oh my, yes! I closed my eyes a few times and really listened close thru the Sennheiser phones - and you've nailed it! Great vid - and GREAT playing, too.
Wow! Absolutely brilliant tone- and probably the best/closest I've heard to Eddie's famous tone. But I have to re-watch it to try to figure out exactly what you did here- I have a David Bray JC800 and have to start using it because this sounds PERFECT!
It's amazing how close you nailed the tone with different (but similar) equipment. Awesome guitar you've got there. Your playing, of course, is spot on. Great vid.
Nailed the tone and your playing is phenomenal. I only started learning to play guitar 2.5 yrs ago and have become fascinated by Eddies sound and technique. Hats off to you bro, awesome playing, i practice every day relentlessly and look forward to being as good as you one day. Great vid. ❤
The iconic screaming bend at 8:36, You actually got the tone spot on! Wish you can do a brown sound video with Amp Modelers like nux mg-30 since Marshall plexi's are hella expensive and no where to be found in my country. Great video man!
I always thought it was a combo of the variac, maybe re-amping, a fat cap in the amp, (Eddie's touch!) and the sunset sound reverb plate that gave it that extra sizzle! This was so well done. Years spent in the metroamp Eddie forum leads to all of this! I often thought it was like instead of using a distortion pedal, it was basically using a whole other amp head as the pedal!
All parts of the recipe are important, but this get me most of the way there before I even have to bother the soldering iron! Years well spent I say! Thanks for watching 🤘
Dude that was damn near perfect in tone. I’d say the tone from probably the first 6 albums for sure. Sounds like you had that plate reverb on there as well….icing on the proverbial cake. Well done for sure🤘
I have to say, this sounds so authentic. Like I was listening, and waiting for the inevitable little nitpick that one hears when you know the music well. Be it note, or tone, or in this case, overall sound. And it just never came. Everything was so on the money, I wished that there was more to listen to, I was getting into it.
I typically play my Marshall SV20H into a Suhr Reactive Load, which goes straight into my audio interface and I add a IR in my DAW. But this video inspired me to try putting a ToneX plugin instance (clean fender amp, free model) before my IR to simulate the slaving, and it sounds rippin!! Thanks for sharing, this is sending me into a huge rabbit hole 😅
VH1 tone was quite a bit more aggressive than VH2 and WCF but at Fair Warning the tone was back to being aggressive but also darker. In the early years he used a Boss 10 band graphic EQ and the MXR Phase 90 at the front to drive the amp input gain stages harder. The other key point was the use of a Variac to lower the amp voltage down to around the mid to upper 80 volts. This resulted in just the right sag effect which was also key to his tone. As far as the load box use, I agree that it makes sense that he was cascading the gain by using the entire Marshall head as a pre-amp cranked up with the use of the Variac which would give the full tonal headroom of that amp then using the other heads as the power amps with that gain dialed back (as clean as possible). This also allowed him to put effects in the chain between the main head and the slaved power amps to get more saturation on the input side of the effects (for example the Jet Flanger effect which would sound totally different on the input of the primary front amp). It's pretty amazing how all of this gear evolution came along back then, all experimental but it yielded legendary tone.
You're in the ballpark. A few important details that had a BIG contribution to Eddie's early tone. Eddie was indeed "slaving" his main plexi by using a resistive load tapped at roughly 20-24 ohms. His amp was set to 8 ohms, giving him a fudge factor of roughly 3 times the original impedance to prevent the head from blowing up. The load was brought down to line level with a 10k pot wired to the output of the resistors. He could adjust his output signal hotter(or weaker depending on the onstage situation)allowing him to hit his post amp effects harder. Another critical part of his early sound which was an EP-3 echoplex...the preamp in the echo plex gave him more gain and changed the tone slightly. He'd come off the echoplex with a hotter signal then use that to drive any tube amp he had handy(marshall, fender, vox, etc)to drive his cabs and overall stage volume. The second tube amp added harmonics and drive. Lastly, if you look at Eddie in studio from the first album, you'll see pics of his old cabs without tolex. If you examine pics of the cabs, you'll see the aluminum dust caps from JBL D120's on the lower portion of the cabs. Eddie was mixing vintage greenbacks with the D120's. The 120's gave him clarity mixed with vintage green backs all contributed to his early brown sound.
Incredible tone! I'd be very interested to see you delve into the VH2 sound, as this is my favourite of all his guitar tones, althought I know many would dissagree! And may I say, your interpretation of the Mean Streets intro is one of the most articulate I have heard...brilliant!
We’re never gonna get it 100% right because he kept it all a secret. He mentioned the variac in interviews but also said he used the term brown sound to describe Alex’s drum sound… so yeah we’ll never know. To me it sounds like Eddie invented the modern guitar world and never really wanted credit. He put humbuckers in strats, did the whole ox box dummy load thing, attenuation, and basically everything else we’ve just started doing in the last ten years… in the 70’s. Like I’ve always said… it’s his world and we’re just living in it.
Ted Nugent famously said that he played through Ed's stage rig and only heard himself playing. And when Ed played through Nugent's rig, he couldn't believe that sound came out of his own amp.
Well done sir! 🙏 .......a seldom heard and seen capability of what might have had really happening back then. Thank you very much for such a skillful insight 🤘🎸 Greets from Germany 👋
Martin - magnificent. Amazing understanding and interpretation of what was going on back in 78. The tone is beyond compare. Doesn't hurt that your phrasing and fluidity is majestic. Thank you for this awesome post.
The stories about Eddies crazy setups usually end with a note that he was lying a lot, using mostly stock plexis but tried to boost Jose's business. And many people have replicated the tone with stock plexis, I remember one guy on youtube got so close with a stock 60's plexi and also added all the delay and rever so that the only difference basically were the pickups and the hands. But then there are also people who have great results replicating some of the crazy stories. The craziest one I can remember is the "Cerrem resistor mod" where you put one of these 3:00 resistors between the negative and positive half of the power amp, basically making both halves of the amp kill each other adding both distortion and reducing volume. I probably still have the samples of someone brave enough to try this playing Little Dreamer. (Obviously, never try that at home) It's fascinating but in the end the playing technique is the most important thing. The percussive playing really makes the difference.
Thanks for your comments. Yes, the Cerrem mod is a radical solution to the extra gain issue. Whilst many great tone chasers have got close to Ed’s raw amp sound, I haven’t hear one that totally nails the extra saturation , sustain and harmonica on the classic VH albums. I can’t help feel Eddie took some secrets with him.
Your theory is spot on. My former room mate was Tony Iommi's tech for 30 years. He knew Van Halen. He told me what your video shows. We also built a rig like this doing the same. The signal was crushed against the power amp. Great video and sounds amazing. Enjoyed this video.
This My Friend is a 100 percent correct representation of the signal path. I would hope someone could duplicate this signal somehow in a smaller portable format. The maple fretboard is also such a important part of the string sound and snap.
The picture of the band in Sunset Studios apparently was taken during the recording of Jamie's Crying. Edward is playing an Explorer (prior to the cutout seen on WACF) that lacks a tremolo 🎸
Got Grandfather's Ole variac ,,, But all I could do was make an amp spitt ... Got to have pre&pwr tubes ,,, "all the right stuff " ... no one peace will do it ... I'm more of a sound guy ... I'm just good enough for the mike check ... Haha ... No, man, you really got the sound ... It took me right back to those days ... Thanks Brother ... WELL-DONE ...
I showed this video to Paul Gilbert, he said "He plays really well! And interesting gear ideas too. Thank you". I thought you might like to know that ;o)
I got a COCO 50 Bray amp in my pursuit of the brown sound a few years ago. It’s a fantastic amp and Dave Bray is a great guy. Super friendly and responsive and has a ton of knowledge in this area. I’m curious if you could A/B between just running directly into the Bray amp and a cab vs the slave setup. I’m wondering the slaving is actually necessary. Or does it really give the tone those extra harmonics and sustain? Great playing and great video!
Yes, the Bray is a fantastic amp. Really captures all the tonal characteristics. The response and feel change most with the slaving. It becomes a little tighter and simultaneously explosive. To me anyway. I might be going crazy from all the testing. I’ll upload some samples with and without the slaving. Thanks for watching 🤘
@@martinsmith4123 hahaha. Awesome. Thanks for your reply. I’d love to see some comparisons. Even via TH-cam video - the very best way to hear these sort of differences. :)
No mention of the variac voltage regulator. It's the silver box next to the two marshalls in the pic. He would lower the voltage of the Marshalls down to 90 volts (instead of the usual 115)...the amp would struggle to keep up and distort way before it's supposed to. It also gave that cool compression.
Absolutely! That’s a solid portion of the sound for sure. I’m recreating using a Bray head which has features like that built in. And honestly, the slaving gets you so close, you stop worrying about sylvania 6ca7’s. Thank you for watching 🤘
A couple of things I’ve thought about is that one, Eddie’s Marshall was supposedly a 12,000 series which have some balls (Johan Segeborn has a video demoing one and it sounds quite close). Second is that while it might not have been deliberately modded, there could have been lots of minor tweaks and component changes done during repairs. Marshall amps from that era were extremely variable in terms of components.
If I have this right, the first Marshall in the chain is dimed, then run into a load box. The signal from this is run into another amp (just the power amp stage?). The first Marshall is almost reduced to a big, fat, mains-fed overdrive pedal as the preamp and power amp tubes are working hard, albeit with the Variac dropping the voltage enough to make them a bit slushy. The second amp just makes that signal acceptably loud (or otherwise) without adding too much tone characteristics? I gather Ed used HH power amps as part of his rig at one point, presumably because they didn't colour any of the signal.
Holy shit that is close!! So you’re just running the first amp full blast into the resistors and then running into just another poweramp? No other gain added to it after the first amp? Damn the sound is incredible!! Best job so far 🤘🏻
Now, here we are 😁🎸! The proof is in the pudding - there’s all the stuff about using Variacs and the like, but the load-box is what does it, essentially allowing you to use a 100 Watt Marshall head as a “stomp-box” ❤! Incidentally, and you probably know this, but that’s exactly what Tom Scholz (Boston) did in the very beginning - a Scholz Power Soak is exactly this thing, a load-box that sits between the head and the cabinet. Later, of course, he miniaturized the whole works into the Rockman, but Tom began with a homemade load-box 😊!
You really nailed it and I'm sure it sounds 3X as good live than what we hear on this vid. Eddie also ran a Variac due to the voltage difference; i.e. his Superlead was built to run on European voltage. That also had something to do with it but the "dummy box" that dealt with the loading was the secret sauce. When VH1 was released, I had a 65 Fender Showman head I ran through a Marshall 8X10 cabinet. One of my uncles was a working musician (i.e. keyboard player) who had that rig sitting around and didn't need it so he gave it to me. His guitar player had permantly jumpered the channels so that freakin' rig absolutely SCREAMED when it was dimed up. It had gobs of gain - not quite what Eddie was getting but somewhere in between your standard JMP and Eddie's rig. It was an 8ohm head and the cabinet was wired for 16ohms but one of the speakers was blown. After playing at full volume for an hour if you grabbed the speaker cable down near the input jack on the cab, it would actually be hot LOL. I was a 16 year old kid who was just learning about ohms. Thankfully I had 8 ohms running into a 16ohm cab and not the other way around. Those were the days...
Damn right! The stacking of amp, load box, and amp I have never quite understood until now, but you have that VH sound that roars at you when you get up to 7 and beyond. Great explanation and example, not to mention the playing! thanks for doing this.
Awesome tone, helped immensely by your extraordinary playing! Obviously it’s true what say,tone is in the fingers and it certainly is in yours. Thanks a great insight.
It's a version of a POWERSOAK...They had to RECREATE what Eddie found when he had an AMP from the UK wired for 220v mains. He could crank it all up to 11 and not saturate it as hard. The powersoak was also key in Tom Scholz getting his iconic ROCKMAN tones...
Nice job, I heard no mention of the variac here. I do recall seeing Images of rack mount EQs so... slaving through a line voltage signal chain does seem like a real possibility. I have a '73 (plexi style) Marshall Super Lead and use it with a variac, an MXR EQ & Phase90. I set my 4x12 cabinet volume with a Hot Plate/resistance load.....So have everything you describe in our recording room set up 24/7 The MXR EQ supplies my extra gain. I love playing that rig with my drummer, It sounds amazing. I will try pumping it from the Hotplate line out to my Vox Handwired AC15 recording rig. It might be nice twist on the ideas you present here & it would only take me 10 seconds to add one more cable. Great Job...
The way I've always described the "Brown sound" is a rather loose, flubby almost clean bottom end, and then all the brittle, crystal chime harmonics on top. Combined in chords, you get a distorted sound, broken out in riffs, you get all sorts of harmonics and what I call the "cddrraaang" chord sound with a rare clean/harmonic/distortion blend. It is a thing.....
Damn. Loved every bit of info as well as every bit of time your fingers provided us. You are great at guitar my friend and you make me want that sound. Harmonically rich , sustainful, yet not overly saturated beyond single note clarity. That takes a great ear and a great setup on the guitar among many other things But damn you rock🤘🏻
You also take the head off the cabinet when you don't want the vibration from the cabinet shaking the amp and inducing sounds into the amplifier from parts in it acting as microphones. ALL tubes are microphonic to SOME degree, and it's not difficult to get feedback just between the cabinet and the amp head on top of it, if the amp is cranked up high enough and has enough gain.
Yeah, I considered that but they are pretty much all but decoupled in a head with rubber feet. The microphonics are so little impacted I would say that’s unlikely to be the primary reason. More likely he had two heads and two variacs plus a load box making it too tall to safely stack on top a 4x12.
When I was 15 in 1978, my friend said I needed to come over and listen to his new album. Well I was in AWE of VH1 for sure and also saw them in 82'. Anyhow, as a long time guitar player and fan of Van Halen you have nailed the tone for sure! I've watched a lot of youtube videos on the brown sound and this was the best for sure IMHO. Just subbed and thank you for this!
@@IAmJKey of course! Pete’s the man! This is supplemental if you want to get into to the sizzle of the classic Dave-Era albums. Pete’s amp sounds probably as close to Eddie’s as need be. But slaving adds the juice man. I’m telling ya. 🤘
Love your insight where Ed might have got his sound, and dude what you came up with the rig set you have sounds pretty dead on to my ears maybe a tad brighter to my ears , but dude sounds awesome and great playing on top of it!! Love it!!
I personally think the old marshall brown sound is soo much better and supreme than the 5150’s amp that switched to later on. It was just pure, something you could really chew on while listening.
also, just removing lots of 1 to 3k with an eq (say oh up to 4db) can improve your tone towards an Ed tone. His sound wasn't so midrangy like Boston or many other Marshall users. The was a kind of sponginess when he turned it all the way up but it SEEMS to me like it definitely has to be two amps one going into another. He had so much high end that it does sound almost like an amp being fed into a PA system. But not quite that harsh on the highs. What's really strange is how there's a video about how he got the sounds on the early VH albums when we had like 35 years to ask him specifically. Is there no interview where he just spills the beans? That's a REALLY great results you have there. You have that high harmonic thing and not so much mids but not a scooped mid sound either. It's definitely like 95% there. You only needed more reverb on the right speaker! :)
@@martinsmith4123 Whoever or however, it was a cool sound. Sometimes it was super raw and midrangey sounding. Sometimes more spongy and smooth. Always ripping! thank ye!!
Dude, holyshit! Never ever ever have I heard a better Brown sound video in my freaking life! There was a point I stopped the video and just sat there in absolute awe. Obviously, you're playing and technique are very very good. But the sound you get on this video IS Eddie's sound. Couldn't thank you enough. Absolutely brilliant
Thank you for your kind words! Please subscribe for more upcoming 🤘
@@jesuschrist2284 I would totally do that. Just someone else will have to set it up for me LOL. I've never had any luck getting great tone out of modeling style amps. Your message is very appreciated, I feel like I should give it one more shot.
No there is another !
@@martinsmith4123 You won TH-cam! Congrats! Nice playing man.
There are lots of people on you tube that have done the same thing.
I've seen a million of these videos where people try to get that Eddie's Brown sound and honestly I can tell you that in my opinion this is the closest I've heard. And your playing is awesome too by the way.
Now that’s a great review! Thanks 🙏
I’m making some brown sound right now
This is it, the most accurate replica of VH early tone
I've always wondered if we put Randy and Eddie on the same stage at the same time WHAT WOULD happen😁
Ace playing by the way. Thank you.
@@DS-nw4eq I can smell it ALL the way from here!
it`s VERY VERY close. nice to see and hear, thanx man!
Thank you 🤘
Just stumbled across this... Easily the most spot-on representation!!!Well done Sir!... And you captured the most important part... The sound has everything...the bite/ the harmonics/..the perfect distortion..it's alive...best take ever!!
im not even a huge evh fan or anything, but ive been facinated with the brown sound for ages now, this is one of the best videos ive ever seen on the brown sound, so informative and entertaining. This should have at least 10x the views man, and your voice is very relaxing!
Hey, Thank you John! Yes it’s one heck of a grail Tone! Rock on 🤘
This is about as spot on as I’ve ever heard it. All the right harmonics are there and those are usually what are missing!
🙏 Awesome. Thanks watching and listening!
Why is your photo a pentagram?
@@Greeanerbeans77 it’s a star, not a pentagram.
Dude just stumbled upon this vid and as a producer/engineer u absolutely friggin nailed the tone. It’s a subtle batch of such specific overtones! Seriously well done mate🎶
This is very very close, nicely done, I bet it's a lot of fun rippin' with that tone. I dig your Strat too!
Best "brown sound" replication I have heard yet. Great touch, too, Martin. Kudos.
Very kind! Thanks for watching. More upcoming 🤘
Martin, your channel is gold! I just came across it a few days ago and I am on a binge! Great tone and your playing is fantastic! Well done Sir!
@@Joey.Darkwoods-Studio thank you kindly, more coming…🤘🤘🤘
Not sure if this is the secret sauce (will we ever know?) but this is probably the closest/best Eddie tone I've heard on TH-cam. The way the tone cleans up at lower guitar volumes is just as impressive as the fully open tone. Well done sir!
Thanks my good man! 🤘🤘
That's a GREAT guitar tone! The guitar is alive in your hands. Great work, great playing! Thanks!
Thanks dude🤘
The undisputed KING of rock guitar! No one is even close! And that was very informative. Your playing is stellar bud.
Nice Work, always enjoy a great tone and outstanding playing, subbed and on board for more. You obviously worked very hard for that technique and all the details.
This has got to be the closet I have heard anyone get to Eddie's early "brown sound" tone - I want it!!! Fantastic job!
The panned reverb here is doing a lot of heavy lifting too. Excellent vid.
You’ve got my attention. Your tone and playing is spot on! Subscribed!
Aside from the outstanding sound displayed in this video, one has to really sit in awe of all the devastating riffs Ed created. He was a genius on so many levels.
This appeared in my feed and I’m so glad it did! Holy cow man - you have done a fantastic job with the research and tone! Be proud. I’m a new subscriber today. 🎉
Thank you so much 🙏🤘
Oh my, yes! I closed my eyes a few times and really listened close thru the Sennheiser phones - and you've nailed it! Great vid - and GREAT playing, too.
Wow! Absolutely brilliant tone- and probably the best/closest I've heard to Eddie's famous tone. But I have to re-watch it to try to figure out exactly what you did here- I have a David Bray JC800 and have to start using it because this sounds PERFECT!
Thank you kindly 🙏 🤘🤘
It's amazing how close you nailed the tone with different (but similar) equipment. Awesome guitar you've got there. Your playing, of course, is spot on. Great vid.
I wouldn't want to leave the house if I could play through this sound! And don't tell me the Friedman's can do this! This has the voice!
Nailed the tone and your playing is phenomenal. I only started learning to play guitar 2.5 yrs ago and have become fascinated by Eddies sound and technique. Hats off to you bro, awesome playing, i practice every day relentlessly and look forward to being as good as you one day. Great vid. ❤
Thank you man 🙏 it’s taken me all my life to get halfway to Eddie’s technique. It’s humbling
Well _DONE!_ God level tone right there! Everything and everything you could ever want right on the tap? Wild!
Thank you kindly 🤘
The iconic screaming bend at 8:36, You actually got the tone spot on! Wish you can do a brown sound video with Amp Modelers like nux mg-30 since Marshall plexi's are hella expensive and no where to be found in my country. Great video man!
@@sitwo2 thank you 🤘 where are you from?
@@martinsmith4123 from the Phillipines
@@martinsmith4123 can u try to replicate the brown sound in the Diver down album with a Amp modeler?
David Bray has it figured out. Whether its his 20 or his 100 watters, he absolutely nails the EVH tone.
You have my attention so much so I subscribed, and a like. It's a quest for distinct noting and chuck. Very tone helpful.
Spot on! That Mean Street intro especially, the notes just pop!
I always thought it was a combo of the variac, maybe re-amping, a fat cap in the amp, (Eddie's touch!) and the sunset sound reverb plate that gave it that extra sizzle! This was so well done. Years spent in the metroamp Eddie forum leads to all of this! I often thought it was like instead of using a distortion pedal, it was basically using a whole other amp head as the pedal!
All parts of the recipe are important, but this get me most of the way there before I even have to bother the soldering iron! Years well spent I say!
Thanks for watching 🤘
Dude that was damn near perfect in tone. I’d say the tone from probably the first 6 albums for sure. Sounds like you had that plate reverb on there as well….icing on the proverbial cake. Well done for sure🤘
@@diorio5289 very kind 🤘🤘🤘🤘
I have to say, this sounds so authentic. Like I was listening, and waiting for the inevitable little nitpick that one hears when you know the music well. Be it note, or tone, or in this case, overall sound. And it just never came. Everything was so on the money, I wished that there was more to listen to, I was getting into it.
Happy i found your demo through my algorithm...You're a gentleman that plays VERY well and your guitar and tone are magnificent.
Thank you very much 🤘
Outstanding tone my friend,I think you've got it in my opinion
I truly think this channel is going to blow up. It deserves to. You've got the makings of something good
I typically play my Marshall SV20H into a Suhr Reactive Load, which goes straight into my audio interface and I add a IR in my DAW. But this video inspired me to try putting a ToneX plugin instance (clean fender amp, free model) before my IR to simulate the slaving, and it sounds rippin!! Thanks for sharing, this is sending me into a huge rabbit hole 😅
Oh wow, awesome application of this technique. Bonus points 🏆
Thanks for watching 🤘
We were using Tone'x back in the late 60's into Plexis, got the idea from Ritchie Blackmore interview in Creem magazine
Awesome video! I love Eddies legendary brown sound. This is one of the best videos I’ve seen on it. You’re an amazing player btw.
VH1 tone was quite a bit more aggressive than VH2 and WCF but at Fair Warning the tone was back to being aggressive but also darker. In the early years he used a Boss 10 band graphic EQ and the MXR Phase 90 at the front to drive the amp input gain stages harder. The other key point was the use of a Variac to lower the amp voltage down to around the mid to upper 80 volts. This resulted in just the right sag effect which was also key to his tone. As far as the load box use, I agree that it makes sense that he was cascading the gain by using the entire Marshall head as a pre-amp cranked up with the use of the Variac which would give the full tonal headroom of that amp then using the other heads as the power amps with that gain dialed back (as clean as possible). This also allowed him to put effects in the chain between the main head and the slaved power amps to get more saturation on the input side of the effects (for example the Jet Flanger effect which would sound totally different on the input of the primary front amp). It's pretty amazing how all of this gear evolution came along back then, all experimental but it yielded legendary tone.
You're in the ballpark. A few important details that had a BIG contribution to Eddie's early tone. Eddie was indeed "slaving" his main plexi by using a resistive load tapped at roughly 20-24 ohms. His amp was set to 8 ohms, giving him a fudge factor of roughly 3 times the original impedance to prevent the head from blowing up. The load was brought down to line level with a 10k pot wired to the output of the resistors. He could adjust his output signal hotter(or weaker depending on the onstage situation)allowing him to hit his post amp effects harder. Another critical part of his early sound which was an EP-3 echoplex...the preamp in the echo plex gave him more gain and changed the tone slightly. He'd come off the echoplex with a hotter signal then use that to drive any tube amp he had handy(marshall, fender, vox, etc)to drive his cabs and overall stage volume. The second tube amp added harmonics and drive. Lastly, if you look at Eddie in studio from the first album, you'll see pics of his old cabs without tolex. If you examine pics of the cabs, you'll see the aluminum dust caps from JBL D120's on the lower portion of the cabs. Eddie was mixing vintage greenbacks with the D120's. The 120's gave him clarity mixed with vintage green backs all contributed to his early brown sound.
Incredible tone! I'd be very interested to see you delve into the VH2 sound, as this is my favourite of all his guitar tones, althought I know many would dissagree! And may I say, your interpretation of the Mean Streets intro is one of the most articulate I have heard...brilliant!
Hey, thanks a lot! Yeah, vH2 has its whole own thing. Thanks for the idea. I’m just near to finishing a new video which I think will be a good ‘un. 🤘
look forward to seeing it!@@martinsmith4123
We’re never gonna get it 100% right because he kept it all a secret. He mentioned the variac in interviews but also said he used the term brown sound to describe Alex’s drum sound… so yeah we’ll never know. To me it sounds like Eddie invented the modern guitar world and never really wanted credit. He put humbuckers in strats, did the whole ox box dummy load thing, attenuation, and basically everything else we’ve just started doing in the last ten years… in the 70’s. Like I’ve always said… it’s his world and we’re just living in it.
Well, he wound his own pickups so he really did "invent" the sound.
Psh! It’s his guitar world. We’re just breathing his air
Wow, that was awesome! Thanks for taking the time to explain this. Now, on to part 2!!
I lived with Ed for several months and I can tell you it's in those meat hooks he had for hands. His grip could snap drumsticks....literally
Definitely a factor. I heard this as well over the years. For a lot of guitarists, a lot of the tone is said to come from the fingers.
Ted Nugent famously said that he played through Ed's stage rig and only heard himself playing. And when Ed played through Nugent's rig, he couldn't believe that sound came out of his own amp.
@@paulrogers6037 Seems like it's almost magic man, and only a small percentage are blessed with it...
I made this reply for you th-cam.com/video/-4HirR1MKNs/w-d-xo.htmlsi=eRPRAOeeYqksxS2f
Well done sir! 🙏 .......a seldom heard and seen capability of what might have had really happening back then.
Thank you very much for such a skillful insight 🤘🎸
Greets from Germany 👋
Thank you kindly 🤘🤘
David Bray just simply makes the best amps on the face of the earth. What a sound!
Excellent video Martin .I really loved it - I think you have solved it 100% . Cool playing too. Inspiring. More VH videos please.
Thank you! More to come 🤘
Martin - magnificent. Amazing understanding and interpretation of what was going on back in 78. The tone is beyond compare. Doesn't hurt that your phrasing and fluidity is majestic. Thank you for this awesome post.
Many thanks Ian 🤘
The stories about Eddies crazy setups usually end with a note that he was lying a lot, using mostly stock plexis but tried to boost Jose's business. And many people have replicated the tone with stock plexis, I remember one guy on youtube got so close with a stock 60's plexi and also added all the delay and rever so that the only difference basically were the pickups and the hands. But then there are also people who have great results replicating some of the crazy stories. The craziest one I can remember is the "Cerrem resistor mod" where you put one of these 3:00 resistors between the negative and positive half of the power amp, basically making both halves of the amp kill each other adding both distortion and reducing volume. I probably still have the samples of someone brave enough to try this playing Little Dreamer. (Obviously, never try that at home) It's fascinating but in the end the playing technique is the most important thing. The percussive playing really makes the difference.
Thanks for your comments. Yes, the Cerrem mod is a radical solution to the extra gain issue. Whilst many great tone chasers have got close to Ed’s raw amp sound, I haven’t hear one that totally nails the extra saturation , sustain and harmonica on the classic VH albums. I can’t help feel Eddie took some secrets with him.
Your theory is spot on. My former room mate was Tony Iommi's tech for 30 years. He knew Van Halen. He told me what your video shows. We also built a rig like this doing the same. The signal was crushed against the power amp. Great video and sounds amazing. Enjoyed this video.
Thanks very much! I’d be interested to know more… 🤘🤘🤘
This My Friend is a 100 percent correct representation of the signal path. I would hope someone could duplicate this signal somehow in a smaller portable format. The maple fretboard is also such a important part of the string sound and snap.
Thanks man! Yeah, a small box head with load box di and a valve power amp. Should get it all in a rack and we can go back to the 90’s!
Great analyses, thanks for sharing, pretty cool playing too !
The picture of the band in Sunset Studios apparently was taken during the recording of Jamie's Crying. Edward is playing an Explorer (prior to the cutout seen on WACF) that lacks a tremolo 🎸
Correct! Cheers 🤘
Fought my way down to the stage ... Slap hands with Eddie on the diver down tour ... Eddie lives thanks to you brother ... Love it ...
Kudos 🤘
Got Grandfather's Ole variac ,,, But all I could do was make an amp spitt ... Got to have pre&pwr tubes ,,, "all the right stuff " ... no one peace will do it ... I'm more of a sound guy ... I'm just good enough for the mike check ... Haha ...
No, man, you really got the sound ... It took me right back to those days ... Thanks Brother ... WELL-DONE ...
@@davidcarpenter5274 thanks for your Eddie story and for watching 🤘
I showed this video to Paul Gilbert, he said "He plays really well! And interesting gear ideas too. Thank you". I thought you might like to know that ;o)
Dude!! That’s amazing. Thank you very much 🤘🤘🤘
Excellent job and great playing. Nailed it!
Wow !!! That is closer than anybody else has got to it, both in playing and sound ,I bow down to you sir !!!🛐🛐🛐
Love it dude! Totally new information and new approach. I think you nailed it. Add the plate on the right and it's there
Wow🎉 that is the most logical approach, locking the tone in and then amplifying it
Glad you enjoyed it, more VH tone coming soon! Thanks for watching 🤘
What type of head are you plugged into? Also, who is the Sunset Sound interview with that you mentioned?
Hey, it’s a Bray Coco 50. And Doug Messinger is interviewed on Sunset Sounds TH-cam channel. Cheers 🤘
Thank YOu! GREAT video!!!
@@martinsmith4123
Amazing! Does your Strat have a brass nut?
Thanks!! The strat has a bone nut covered in pencil lead.
Great video. Just came across your channel. Awesome stuff Buddy. Thanks for sharing.
🎼🎸👍👏👏👏😎
Yeah man, really close, good work !!!
Thank you for watching 🤘
I got a COCO 50 Bray amp in my pursuit of the brown sound a few years ago. It’s a fantastic amp and Dave Bray is a great guy. Super friendly and responsive and has a ton of knowledge in this area.
I’m curious if you could A/B between just running directly into the Bray amp and a cab vs the slave setup. I’m wondering the slaving is actually necessary. Or does it really give the tone those extra harmonics and sustain?
Great playing and great video!
Yes, the Bray is a fantastic amp. Really captures all the tonal characteristics. The response and feel change most with the slaving. It becomes a little tighter and simultaneously explosive. To me anyway. I might be going crazy from all the testing.
I’ll upload some samples with and without the slaving.
Thanks for watching 🤘
@@martinsmith4123 hahaha. Awesome. Thanks for your reply. I’d love to see some comparisons. Even via TH-cam video - the very best way to hear these sort of differences. :)
@@martinsmith4123 Hey Martin does the Coco have to be cranked to get that sound?
No mention of the variac voltage regulator. It's the silver box next to the two marshalls in the pic. He would lower the voltage of the Marshalls down to 90 volts (instead of the usual 115)...the amp would struggle to keep up and distort way before it's supposed to. It also gave that cool compression.
Absolutely! That’s a solid portion of the sound for sure. I’m recreating using a Bray head which has features like that built in. And honestly, the slaving gets you so close, you stop worrying about sylvania 6ca7’s.
Thank you for watching 🤘
It's all about the Variac.
Variac and PAF pickup.
A couple of things I’ve thought about is that one, Eddie’s Marshall was supposedly a 12,000 series which have some balls (Johan Segeborn has a video demoing one and it sounds quite close). Second is that while it might not have been deliberately modded, there could have been lots of minor tweaks and component changes done during repairs. Marshall amps from that era were extremely variable in terms of components.
If I have this right, the first Marshall in the chain is dimed, then run into a load box. The signal from this is run into another amp (just the power amp stage?). The first Marshall is almost reduced to a big, fat, mains-fed overdrive pedal as the preamp and power amp tubes are working hard, albeit with the Variac dropping the voltage enough to make them a bit slushy. The second amp just makes that signal acceptably loud (or otherwise) without adding too much tone characteristics? I gather Ed used HH power amps as part of his rig at one point, presumably because they didn't colour any of the signal.
Totally correct in every respect! Thanks for watching 🤘
You certainly have gotten the Frankenstein sound. At least as close as is possible! Nice job.
Holy shit that is close!! So you’re just running the first amp full blast into the resistors and then running into just another poweramp? No other gain added to it after the first amp?
Damn the sound is incredible!! Best job so far 🤘🏻
Now, here we are 😁🎸! The proof is in the pudding - there’s all the stuff about using Variacs and the like, but the load-box is what does it, essentially allowing you to use a 100 Watt Marshall head as a “stomp-box” ❤!
Incidentally, and you probably know this, but that’s exactly what Tom Scholz (Boston) did in the very beginning - a Scholz Power Soak is exactly this thing, a load-box that sits between the head and the cabinet.
Later, of course, he miniaturized the whole works into the Rockman, but Tom began with a homemade load-box 😊!
You really nailed it and I'm sure it sounds 3X as good live than what we hear on this vid. Eddie also ran a Variac due to the voltage difference; i.e. his Superlead was built to run on European voltage. That also had something to do with it but the "dummy box" that dealt with the loading was the secret sauce. When VH1 was released, I had a 65 Fender Showman head I ran through a Marshall 8X10 cabinet. One of my uncles was a working musician (i.e. keyboard player) who had that rig sitting around and didn't need it so he gave it to me. His guitar player had permantly jumpered the channels so that freakin' rig absolutely SCREAMED when it was dimed up. It had gobs of gain - not quite what Eddie was getting but somewhere in between your standard JMP and Eddie's rig. It was an 8ohm head and the cabinet was wired for 16ohms but one of the speakers was blown. After playing at full volume for an hour if you grabbed the speaker cable down near the input jack on the cab, it would actually be hot LOL. I was a 16 year old kid who was just learning about ohms. Thankfully I had 8 ohms running into a 16ohm cab and not the other way around. Those were the days...
Damn right! The stacking of amp, load box, and amp I have never quite understood until now, but you have that VH sound that roars at you when you get up to 7 and beyond. Great explanation and example, not to mention the playing! thanks for doing this.
Awesome tone, helped immensely by your extraordinary playing! Obviously it’s true what say,tone is in the fingers and it certainly is in yours. Thanks a great insight.
No idea if you're right or not, but the SOUND is spot on! Importantly also is your playing!!! Amazing!!
Thank you kindly 🤘
Groove Tubes founder, Aspin made great gear, including speaker emulation back in the '70's. Awesome video and your playing is spot on!!
Variac. A brownout is when power is reduced. That’s where the name comes from.
First time I've heard that one. Nice and simple - I like it! 😂
Great Video and Great Playing ! Keep up the EvH content !
Thank you 🙏
Like Eddie’s sound or not it sounds great! And you’re a great player too!
Thanks for the awesome video this guitar sound has been stuck in my brain since the first time I ever heard VH and been chasing it ever since
Me too 🤘
Me too 🤘
It's a version of a POWERSOAK...They had to RECREATE what Eddie found when he had an AMP from the UK wired for 220v mains. He could crank it all up to 11 and not saturate it as hard. The powersoak was also key in Tom Scholz getting his iconic ROCKMAN tones...
Nice job, I heard no mention of the variac here. I do recall seeing Images of rack mount EQs so... slaving through a line voltage signal chain does seem like a real possibility. I have a '73 (plexi style) Marshall Super Lead and use it with a variac, an MXR EQ & Phase90. I set my 4x12 cabinet volume with a Hot Plate/resistance load.....So have everything you describe in our recording room set up 24/7 The MXR EQ supplies my extra gain. I love playing that rig with my drummer, It sounds amazing. I will try pumping it from the Hotplate line out to my Vox Handwired AC15 recording rig. It might be nice twist on the ideas you present here & it would only take me 10 seconds to add one more cable. Great Job...
Very cool man, have fun with that awesome setup 🤘
The way I've always described the "Brown sound" is a rather loose, flubby almost clean bottom end, and then all the brittle, crystal chime harmonics on top. Combined in chords, you get a distorted sound, broken out in riffs, you get all sorts of harmonics and what I call the "cddrraaang" chord sound with a rare clean/harmonic/distortion blend. It is a thing.....
You nailed the Eddie tone and vib my Lord man !!! Great work mate cheers 🤘🏻
So he basically made his plexi into a master volume amp
Oh my god dude, you really got extremely close to it if not the right exact brown sound. Great job and thanks for sharing!
Best EVH tone I've ever heard
You nailed it dude ... I'm a subscriber now, keep it coming!
Thanks Lars🤘 more coming 🔜
Your telling all of Eddie's secrets. That sound will always be his. You got it man. 😢😊
🤣🤣
great video! can you share the settings in the coco? please :)
Sure! I think quiet on 7, output, 7, presence 10 bass 7 middle 8 treble 8 . Gain1 8, gain2 7,
Thanks for watching 🤘
Damn. Loved every bit of info as well as every bit of time your fingers provided us. You are great at guitar my friend and you make me want that sound. Harmonically rich , sustainful, yet not overly saturated beyond single note clarity. That takes a great ear and a great setup on the guitar among many other things But damn you rock🤘🏻
You also take the head off the cabinet when you don't want the vibration from the cabinet shaking the amp and inducing sounds into the amplifier from parts in it acting as microphones. ALL tubes are microphonic to SOME degree, and it's not difficult to get feedback just between the cabinet and the amp head on top of it, if the amp is cranked up high enough and has enough gain.
Yeah, I considered that but they are pretty much all but decoupled in a head with rubber feet. The microphonics are so little impacted I would say that’s unlikely to be the primary reason. More likely he had two heads and two variacs plus a load box making it too tall to safely stack on top a 4x12.
Magic plexi + Variac + Dummy load + Another amp= Heaven
Jose modded Marshall, Steve Via has one or two he got back in the day
in 1987 I learned about the Scholz power soak, and cranked a vintage 50w Sound City into it with perfect results
I remember reading somewhere that the Brown Sound was not Eddie's sound, it was the sound of Alex's drums.
His snare specifically.
When I was 15 in 1978, my friend said I needed to come over and listen to his new album. Well I was in AWE of VH1 for sure and also saw them in 82'. Anyhow, as a long time guitar player and fan of Van Halen you have nailed the tone for sure! I've watched a lot of youtube videos on the brown sound and this was the best for sure IMHO. Just subbed and thank you for this!
Thank you and what a time to be 15! 🤘🤘
I defy anyone to replicate the EVH brown sound with any more authenticity than this. Simply gobsmacked! Wow man.
Also, great playing.
Thank you my good man 🤘
I believe Pete Thorn nailed it.
@@IAmJKey of course! Pete’s the man! This is supplemental if you want to get into to the sizzle of the classic Dave-Era albums. Pete’s amp sounds probably as close to Eddie’s as need be. But slaving adds the juice man. I’m telling ya. 🤘
@@martinsmith4123 I agree
Doesnt get much better then that great playing , Id love to hear aint talkin bout love intro on your guitar !
Awesome. Bray and Friedman are making such chewy, monster amps. Maybe the answer is just running both of those at full go🤔
Word! It’s an amazing time for Amps. Big ups @Bray & @Friedman
Love your insight where Ed might have got his sound, and dude what you came up with the rig set you have sounds pretty dead on to my ears maybe a tad brighter to my ears , but dude sounds awesome and great playing on top of it!! Love it!!
I personally think the old marshall brown sound is soo much better and supreme than the 5150’s amp that switched to later on. It was just pure, something you could really chew on while listening.
also, just removing lots of 1 to 3k with an eq (say oh up to 4db) can improve your tone towards an Ed tone. His sound wasn't so midrangy like Boston or many other Marshall users. The was a kind of sponginess when he turned it all the way up but it SEEMS to me like it definitely has to be two amps one going into another. He had so much high end that it does sound almost like an amp being fed into a PA system. But not quite that harsh on the highs. What's really strange is how there's a video about how he got the sounds on the early VH albums when we had like 35 years to ask him specifically. Is there no interview where he just spills the beans? That's a REALLY great results you have there. You have that high harmonic thing and not so much mids but not a scooped mid sound either. It's definitely like 95% there. You only needed more reverb on the right speaker! :)
@@TruthSurge thank you. Yes, some softness in the 1-3k was certainly happening with Ed. Likely courtesy of Donn. 🤘🤘
@@martinsmith4123 Whoever or however, it was a cool sound. Sometimes it was super raw and midrangey sounding. Sometimes more spongy and smooth. Always ripping! thank ye!!
If you and Jim Gausted get in a room together Eddie will literally come back to life and walk the earth as a 21 year old.
Haha. If only 🤘