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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 29 ส.ค. 2019
- Let's tune a PID-Compact block!
Contents:
- PID-Compact Parameters
- Displaying Block Parameters on HMI's
- Pretuning
- Finetuning
- Manual Tuning
If this video helped you, please consider helping me by joining my "GoFundMe" and donating a small amount to my cause. Link here:
www.gofundme.com/f/let039s-fi... - วิทยาศาสตร์และเทคโนโลยี
It's just what I have been looking for, on the Internet! Thank you so much!
Namaste Hegamurl, thank you for your Simatic uploads, all very helpful. After watching this upload last weekend, I could not resist trying PID_Compact on a V.3.0.1 1212 that I use to automate my polytunnel irrigation and hydroponics. For the 5th winter/spring I have connected up my heated seed propagator which is LOGO! 0BA7 with PT100 AI RTD (probe in seed tray) and a 20A LOGOContact230 switching heat mat with a relay output. The temperature of the seeds is controlled by the S7-1200 with an S7 connection over Ethernet.
I have used PWM in the past for temperature control of industrial processes with resistive elements and semiconductor devices. After a couple of beers on a quiet Saturday evening, and having brought my Field PG home from work, I had to try the PWM output with a dwell and duration of 10 seconds switching a low speed digital output just to see what happened.
Nobody else cares, but I thought people reading this may benefit and learn from my conclusion. My normal method of controlling the temperature is a T#15s TON on each of the inputs of an SR flip-flop. With a difference of 0.3 degC between the On and Off temperature the temperature is controlled to within the 0.25 degC resolution of the LOGO! Input from PT100 thermistor.
I wondered if PID_Compact could improve on my ‘bang-bang’ controllers solid performance by switching a contactor. Step7 would not perform the pre-tuning with the set point of 19.0 degC being so close to the process variable, or temperature in the room of ~17 degC. With a set point of 45 degC I was able to let S7-1200 do it’s magic. Pre-tuning took about 2 hours and fine-tuning took about 7 hours. I left it busy overnight. After tuning and uploading, I reset my set point to 19.0 degC and trended it’s performance with a card on my Home Assistant. Between maximum and minimum temperatures was a shade over 0.5 deg, it worked fine, but I rolled it back to the simple hysteresis controller for less frequent switching of the contactor.
Okay, the point of this comment is how cool it was to watch the PID tuning process generate a percentage output that was effectively switching a single bit in a DB mapped to a DQ of a Siemens LOGO! to control the temperature of 5 chilli pepper seeds.
Hegamurl, am I correct in assuming that the percentage value of PID_Compact PWM output is effectively rounded up to a digital ‘1’ at 50% and subsequently rounded down to a digital ‘0’ when output < 50%? I wish I’d stayed up all night to watch it 😆🍄🌶
Matt
M surprised how the number of likes are in hundreds only. Your videos are way too much informative!! Love from India
All tia videos are superb.thank you very much
Another bomb knowledge! Thank you!
Very good video and well explained. Expecting more ...
Very good explained
I study plc programming lots of concept correct from these videos
Thnks
Great video and super pro explanation. Thank you!!!
Thank you very much! Awesome guides! Why didn`t I find your channel earlier...
The TIA portal series is great, and really helpful,
If it’s possible can you please make a video on how to use the PID with Sinamics?
12:40 checked the info system as recommended by you and in simulation of PID_Compact, set sb_EnCyclEstimation = 0
sb_EnCyclMonitoring = 0
to prevent sampling time error. There's one more but the 2 above seem sufficient for now.
Hi thanks for all the great videos, how have you tagged the Io fields on the HMI to change the gain, integral and the derivative?
Super video! Thank you
Thank you! It is simplifying lots of my testing work. But please show also with the real object for fine-tuning
Hello, thank you best information.
Very useful! Thanks
good explanation thank you
Hi Philipp. Can you please explain why is it bad to use PID FB in OB1? Why is constant cycle time in OB31 so important? Thank you for great video!
Good very helpful.
Thanks for the TIA series. It is really very interesting. Learned more in a couple of videos than 2 weeks in a book!! Is it possible to autotune the PID from the HMI as well? Will it work with slow actuators as well? It goes from 0-100% in about 2 minutes
you can manually tune it from HMI but not automatically. Automatic (or manual) tunning will work with slow actuators but be aware that process alone could take some time. Anyway, automatic tuning should be faster than manual considering that PLC changes those P, I, D parameters in certain fashion following some rules which reduce the area of parameter search (unlike man who just "guesses" them) but it's still long process for slow systems because PLC has to wait (and not just once since it's chaning those parameters every time) for system to reach it's limits ( for example 10L and 0L).
Since I have never done a real project with the PID part, please ask me if in fact when I set a set point and require a tuning, will the PLC help me find the transfer function relatively correctly?
Cool. So if i have a real close loop like controling the flow of via flow control valve versus Setpoint. I can do the two steps? Very easy huh? Because we have problem in tuning our metering system but in our case pid tuning is dobe in a flow computer
Hello thanks for this great videos. Please would it be possible to share your project for simulating the PID controller?
very very nice
Hello Hegamurl I need to feed the cable at a fixed speed and wind it onto the bobbin at a constant speed.
For speed control winder I use a dancer and I'm afraid that when the PID sets the output to 100% during tuning it will damage my machine.
Can I manually set the output value?
Can you show simulation TIA portal with factory I/O by PID tuning level tank control?
I waiting to see you again.Thanks
How do you make the graphic for the wincc and run the simulation with it? Hard to find any tutorials on that.
the customer doesn't want that stabil setpoint for me. I have actual deltaP and the operator can be set and then everything is okey. but the costumer deltaPV.
another question is if the 2 pumps work together with pid same time...can we change PID params again?
If I am using PID compact with output (not PWM, not PER) , and input value reach setpoint value for example 30cm = 30cm what should happend with output? Output should goes to 0% or will be froze at the last value?
please can you explain on a video how the simatic wincc run time the tank an pump are configured...thank you
Found your videos and they are really great ;)
What if you have a system which does not allow the actual value to be higher than the set value (in this case : level must not be higher than 5 l) ? Do I have to use another controller, like PD instead of PID?
no you just have to lower your gain value but its gonna take more time to stable .(i see your comment after 3 years how are you doing with automation ? )
@@user-cb7nn8qj7u thank you :) I'm doing well so far
Thanks for the video. Is it possible to initiate pre & fine tuning via PLC instead using Commissioning in TIA?
How did you achieve it ??? thanks
When I tried to apply for a pwm there an error appeared the output value limit is not correct, how should I fix this because the tuning is not complete
Very good explantion. One question: Do I need to do the pretuning or finetuning again after the setpoint was changed (maybe by the operator over the HMI)?
I wish someone would answer that!
@@kevinhofer4922 OK, sorry for that question!
great
😄thanks
Hi Hegamurl. How does the pre tunning and fine tunning behave in a real system when there is significant changes of the system? Supposing in this case the water consumption changes has a xx m3/h flow rate and after a whil has a yy m3/h flow rate of consumption, then it would need to make again the hit on achieve the new settings of the PID (pre tunning and fine tunning) or the PLC would make that by it self? Thanks
Hmmm not much experience with bigger systems... but the tuning can take MUCH longer in real systems because of the inertia.
@@hegamurl7434 Ok but what I'd like to know if the PID controller SIEMENS can adjust automatically the parameters K, I and T during the running of a system in order to maintain a fast response without great oscillations. Thanks in advance.
how you did pid hmi programming can you upload video
👌
How that setpoint rate is been controlled
Hey friend
How to make same simulation for tank station and chart on Tiaportal v16?
Hey Hegamurl! I am currently trying to use this compact PID to control an electric furnace. The range is 0-2000 degrees F. Have you got any info on how to keep it from overshooting the set point. I have been on this project for a week now and I am lost.
Did you find the solution?
Hey, have you ever done this in labview? I am trying to set an auto tuning pid to control a fan speed
How can I get my first job as SPS programmier in Deutschland ? (without real experience) any advices?
I wanna 2 bar pressure in pipe ,but there are 2 pumps,1 should be master and another one be slave ....
Then how will be the logic
Do you have this program or you deleted it ? My master
Hi, When i click on the button start and then start Pid compact : the PID stays in inactive mode . What should i do ? Help please.
I have the same problem... Have you found a soulution?
same
i chaged p value from 50 to 45, than how to download it to plc.
s7-1500 plc, tia v15 programm
Perfect!? The overshoot is horrible.... that was 10% of set;pint overshoot. Siemens has came a long ways though since I used it 15 years ago, I’m basically all Allen Bradley and some others like automation direct but do wish I had some of the Siemens software and stuff to get back familiar with it.
can u send me this project?
show that the fine tuning works
Actually a good idea! Will do so next week or so
hi bosss
Hi, thanks for the video. Would it be possible to share your project for simulating the PID controller?
Thanks
I am still working on possibilities to share it, it is not really easy to do it. Will make some content in the future on that!
@@hegamurl7434 so is possible share with us code for simulating PID??thank you so much
@@patrikh.753 i did in one livestream some time ago... should still be somewhere