I didn't end up with a 16 SS manual...had to settle for an auto. With a stock stall, gears and no tune or other trickery there is no way the car would pick up anything on a time slip. The peak HP may increase at the tire way up top and it would sound cooler...that's about it.
I'm sorta curious what this LS9 cam would be like with a set of 1.75"-2.5" LTs, cat delete with defoulers and Xpipe in a manual SS sedan untuned. So I could try and get away without tuning to keep the warranty...20whp extra on top of the exhaust untuned isn't going to set the world on fire but, it would be cheap, pretty simple and sneaky. Seems like even untuned CAI, ls9 cam, LTs, X would still probably pickup 40whp and wouldn't go unnoticed for the $ and effort involved while still giving me the chance to put it back stock if I have any freak issues.
+basindawg21 I've heard the LS9 cam will run in a manual LS3 without tuning. It won't run at it's full potential obviously but, from what I was told the wide band O2s, knock sensors and everything would be able to adapt well enough to maintain a safe air fuel ratio and timing curve once the system was powered down and when through a self learn. I would also run the PCV to a vent can and block the inputs on the intake in order to keep the oil vapor and crud out of the engine and maintain the full knock resistance of the 93 octane fuel. I was also planning to use the intake elbow from a Camaro SS rather than the boxy elbow used on the G8/PPV/SS. The end the MAF connects to is larger on the Camaro elbow(4"), I was then going to run a pipe to an open element filter in a location that is in an area where outside air would be ducted directly to the filter. I was also planning to insulate the intake plumbing and move the AIT sensor(a second maf assembly with only those pins run to the plug where the normal sensor is and its temperature pins not connected into that location) to ensure that the maximum timing curves are maintained. I would experiment with the clocking of the sensor as well, by taking O2 readings from a bung after the headers with my own sensor. If it was running too rich or lean at that point there are a few things I could do. Too rich and I would attach a filter to the elbow and adjust to amount of unmetered air allowed in until it leaned out a little(I could also go from the stock MAF housing size of 3.5" on the Holdens to a larger diameter up to 4-4.25" until it becomes adequately lean). Too lean and I would experiment with spacing the MAF sensor on It's housing and a few other things. It could take a litany of tricks to manually manipulate the a/f ratios optimally without cpu tuning. A TB spacer is one tool I could try as well, also experiments by porting out an extra 90mm TB could be done. To make sure that there wouldn't be a dangerous variance between cylinders I would probably have my injectors flow tested before all this as well to make sure that there isn't too much variance in flow rates as the ECU doesn't vary fuel flow inside each cylinder. One could go as far as using an individual a/f sensor inside each header primary, I would like to try to avoid that if I can get the engine running well enough and safe enough without that extra effort. I suppose at a certain point simply locating another ECU for a manual LS3 to take the tuning and allowing you to reinstall the factory unit in the event you go back to stock or need warranty to cover a mechanical failure due to a manufacturing defect would be a good way to go as well. It would depend on which method was the most financially viable. I would do as much inspection of the engine as I could before I started to try to avoid going into all this on an engine with any defects that could cause problems. Seems like the best I could do is compression testing, checking for crank play and such things in case there is a main bearing defect. I could also do a leak down test. Scope the bores and examine from the plug hole at the top while slowly turning the engine and moving the pistons down in the cylinder. Then on the bottom with the pan off examining all I can from the bottom end. Sure is sad that they have decided to be such pricks about tuning to make all this necessary because not everyone has the deep down interest to make sure all their experiments are safe and effective on a defect free engine.
hendo337 you are overthinking it. my car ran lean when i was untuned. id tune the car. if you find someone with hp tuners they can save the stock tune and reapply it if you need warranty work. these cars are easy to work on. i bet you can do most of it yourself.
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Yo bro what supporting mods did you do with the ls9 cam ?
I didn't end up with a 16 SS manual...had to settle for an auto. With a stock stall, gears and no tune or other trickery there is no way the car would pick up anything on a time slip. The peak HP may increase at the tire way up top and it would sound cooler...that's about it.
Did it lose anything under the curve (tq wise ) ?
No. Picked up a little everywhere. Wasn’t anything drastic and worked well with stock springs being a .580 lift
What’s the idle set at? Was it lowered some to get a little lope?
Stock idle. Sold this car years ago. I remember the idle being within the stock parameters.
Since you have a tune, I'm going to assume you did this on a dyno. What kind of power numbers did you end up with? Also, how was the low end torque?
Yes dyno tune. ended up with 443whp and 464wt. nice and smooth torque down low is great.
+basindawg21 Thats a whole lot of torque. Do you know what gear they had it in? And what rpm did you make those numbers at?
+Matthew Lee peak was 5500rpm. 3 and 4th gear pulls
+Matthew Lee the goalnis a whipple in a few months. my end goal is 625whp, and close to that in torque
+basindawg21 Ah ok, that explains the torque numbers. Although you might have been cut short a few hp on that reading, then.
I'm sorta curious what this LS9 cam would be like with a set of 1.75"-2.5" LTs, cat delete with defoulers and Xpipe in a manual SS sedan untuned. So I could try and get away without tuning to keep the warranty...20whp extra on top of the exhaust untuned isn't going to set the world on fire but, it would be cheap, pretty simple and sneaky. Seems like even untuned CAI, ls9 cam, LTs, X would still probably pickup 40whp and wouldn't go unnoticed for the $ and effort involved while still giving me the chance to put it back stock if I have any freak issues.
hendo337 i had 1 7/8 long tubes no cats. your car would be similar
hendo337 you would need a tune for sure
+basindawg21 I've heard the LS9 cam will run in a manual LS3 without tuning. It won't run at it's full potential obviously but, from what I was told the wide band O2s, knock sensors and everything would be able to adapt well enough to maintain a safe air fuel ratio and timing curve once the system was powered down and when through a self learn. I would also run the PCV to a vent can and block the inputs on the intake in order to keep the oil vapor and crud out of the engine and maintain the full knock resistance of the 93 octane fuel. I was also planning to use the intake elbow from a Camaro SS rather than the boxy elbow used on the G8/PPV/SS. The end the MAF connects to is larger on the Camaro elbow(4"), I was then going to run a pipe to an open element filter in a location that is in an area where outside air would be ducted directly to the filter. I was also planning to insulate the intake plumbing and move the AIT sensor(a second maf assembly with only those pins run to the plug where the normal sensor is and its temperature pins not connected into that location) to ensure that the maximum timing curves are maintained. I would experiment with the clocking of the sensor as well, by taking O2 readings from a bung after the headers with my own sensor. If it was running too rich or lean at that point there are a few things I could do. Too rich and I would attach a filter to the elbow and adjust to amount of unmetered air allowed in until it leaned out a little(I could also go from the stock MAF housing size of 3.5" on the Holdens to a larger diameter up to 4-4.25" until it becomes adequately lean). Too lean and I would experiment with spacing the MAF sensor on It's housing and a few other things. It could take a litany of tricks to manually manipulate the a/f ratios optimally without cpu tuning. A TB spacer is one tool I could try as well, also experiments by porting out an extra 90mm TB could be done. To make sure that there wouldn't be a dangerous variance between cylinders I would probably have my injectors flow tested before all this as well to make sure that there isn't too much variance in flow rates as the ECU doesn't vary fuel flow inside each cylinder. One could go as far as using an individual a/f sensor inside each header primary, I would like to try to avoid that if I can get the engine running well enough and safe enough without that extra effort. I suppose at a certain point simply locating another ECU for a manual LS3 to take the tuning and allowing you to reinstall the factory unit in the event you go back to stock or need warranty to cover a mechanical failure due to a manufacturing defect would be a good way to go as well. It would depend on which method was the most financially viable. I would do as much inspection of the engine as I could before I started to try to avoid going into all this on an engine with any defects that could cause problems. Seems like the best I could do is compression testing, checking for crank play and such things in case there is a main bearing defect. I could also do a leak down test. Scope the bores and examine from the plug hole at the top while slowly turning the engine and moving the pistons down in the cylinder. Then on the bottom with the pan off examining all I can from the bottom end. Sure is sad that they have decided to be such pricks about tuning to make all this necessary because not everyone has the deep down interest to make sure all their experiments are safe and effective on a defect free engine.
hendo337 you are overthinking it. my car ran lean when i was untuned. id tune the car. if you find someone with hp tuners they can save the stock tune and reapply it if you need warranty work. these cars are easy to work on. i bet you can do most of it yourself.