It is just mind boggling that any software company wouldn't put a backup of their final source code into a vault somewhere. Same thing happened with Icewind Dale II developed by Black Isle Studios. Though the game actually shipped, Beamdog couldn't make an enhanced version b/c the source code was gone.
for all its faults I love the hell out of ultima 8. I was probably like 8 or 9 years old when I first played it and had no idea how to play it 'correctly' and just spent countless hours wandering around town and exploring the nearby areas. Later on when I found about the hackmover cheats I spent so much time taking apart and re-building new houses for myself on the edge of the map. I did eventually come back years later and Ive played thru it several times since then, but the creative wonder I felt just messing around back then in the world of pagan will always be one of my fondest early gaming memories.
Oh Ultima VIII, the countless hours of my childhood playing you and even dreaming about the game and what the Mountain King even looked like before or how to find the Hall before I could find Lithos. The days of early internet and asking my older cousins on how to complete the game. The music still amazes and gives me goosebumps to this day. What a time to be alive. Have loved replaying the game once a year to relive the nostalgia
I'm glad I'm not the only guy who wasted time trying to open that #$^% door. Every time I found a new key that had no obvious use I'd head back there to try it. No dice.
no matter how many people bag on ultima 8... I loved it. I finished U8 before the patch... YES! before the patch. Only those people who bought this game when it came out, they know how god damn hard it was to play in certain sections. Also, there is no exaggeration when people say it would take ages to save and load, well its 100% true. I save / load that game like crazy. Some parts needed jump by jump, step by step saving. Especially on the side to side moving platforms that also disappeared! Rage quit inducing sections... but yes... I did it and I still love the game like a true fan boy. Just for kicks... I started with U5 Amiga, U4 Amiga , U7.1 New PC, U8 - another new pc (cause I also wanted to play crusader no remorse [note that EA brought out the expansion for this game but not U8?!?]), U6 Mars, U7.2, U6 Normal, U6 Dino, U9 (didn't need a new pc anymore - Thankyou GOG)… and I only played U9 when Spoony's videos came out. Bought on GOG and finished it quiet quickly. Yes, story wise it 'betrays' the complete fiction that is ultima. But as a stand alone game, with no knowledge of ultima at all... its not that bad as an individual 'stand alone' game. And.... I'm still yet to even start U1, U2, U3. I wish there was a Mod version of 1 2 or 3. Cause I played Ultima on dungeon siege which was so cool. I wonder what happened to that total conversion mod?
It was "finished" but not really. It was behind schedule because we kept getting mandates to make changes and it had a hard release date that we couldn't change. Couple the fact that it wasn't really polished/finished with the poor sales of U8, and that's what you get: cancelled.
I played Ultima 8 on my 486 DOS PC without the jumping patch and I don't recall complaining about it. I always thought that it was an amazing game so I was just happy to play it all day. Nice to hear your thoughts on the Lost Vale expansion as well. It would have been great to experience all the new regions, magic system and storyline. I have been waiting for a source leak for this expansion for years. Who knows maybe one day it will surface.
I’ve only ever played the base game of Ultima 7 and Ultima Underworld. I’m learning so much about the series from watching your videos. Do you think you’ll go back and do the older games sometime?
I've been on a bit of an Ultima lore dive recently. Your videos are really interesting! I actually got all the Ulitma's queued up on my original MS-Dos machine and finally going to give them a proper go!
Theres probably way more games that we don't even know about that may have been finished that EA never released, i always wonder what could've been if they continued the Land of Lore series or anything by Westwood. Never knew Ultima 8 was supposed to get an expansion
It never stops to amaze when I see the cult following U8 has to this damn day. Sometimes it feels that I was the only 486 owner that enjoyed it almost 30 years ago. I'm so happy this is not the case. Void, you should reach out to Lord British with this video and address the Lost Vale issue. You never know with Richard Garriott...
Okay, we need to assemble a crew of highly specialized and trained operatives to break into EA's offices and steal the Lost Vale, so it can be released. I shall call this "Ultima's Eleven".
U8 Pagan was my first foray into the world of the avatar and I loved it. I get that it was a departure from the franchise standard on many fronts, but something about the story and theme captured me and really had me engrossed in it. The small island community that was festering from its isolation and tyrannical leadership, the hidden dangers that made living outside the walls of the city pretty much impossible. Add to this the gameplay effects of being able to touch/wield everything from giant swords to basic cutlery and fish, and the surprisingly highly detailed graphics of the landscape and buildings. It's how I wanted ultima online to look, but sadly when I got to UO it think it was already the third age and had a bit of a facelift. If I get to build a 2d iso mmorpg it will have pagan style graphics that's for sure.
I was in college when this game came out. My roommate and I finished it, pre EZmode jump patch! I remember thinking what a crazy departure it was from previous Ultimas, but if you remember, Richard Garriott was a strong believer in his games pushing the tech envelope of PCs. I think U8 missed the mark a bit, because even though I didn't *hate* the game, it just didn't feel like an Ultima. It was also around this time (maybe a little later) that info was starting to come out about Ultima Online!
It's too bad about Lost Vale, and too bad about Pagan. I bought the GOG version of Pagan, and although the platform jumping was a lot better than the version I had as a kid, the Gold version wasn't that good. There were still bugs that crashed the game, for instance. It's nostalgic and worth the few dollars it cost me, but so many problems. The combat was usually best avoided because many of the enemies didn't leave anything of value after killing them. If only we could see remakes of Ultima 7 and 8, but I'm guessing there are copyright or licensing issues or we would have seen them already.
I was satisfied with Ultima8 as it was, but the extra bits sound pretty cool. I'd rather have a bag of holding (unlimited items/weight) than a bag of endless reagents, but not having to farm materials for Necromency sounds nice. I wonder how that bag would've worked for Sorcery tho, put the bag at the top of the pentagram and that takes care of all reagents? (And still limited by those symbol tools things as far as how many spells you can have, I don't think there was enough demon heads for all the spells (maximum charges). Thanks for the extra bits :)
You're welcome. 💀 Not sure how it would've worked out. I was imagining double-clicking on the bag, and you can choose a specific reagent through a dialogue option.
I like Ultima VIII, but experienced it way past it's time, so I'm more or less tolerant of it's frustrating parts. But it's a shame how things turned off for this game. Even bigger shame that EA still exist.
Just on another point... some one HAS to have the source or a beta version of it... why doesn't EA release all these old games? and extras for the games they have. I know that probably everyone in this comments section would shell out some decent cash for this expansion! Seriously, i would easily pay $100 for this expansion.... [physical with U8 and all the feelies] actually with all the little things ultima games came with... $150 anyone else who would in all seriousness pay in that area 100 to 150?
If U8 had the full focus of production and the proper time for polish it could have been a masterpiece. The game is a series of great ideas that were never fully fleshed out. EA purposely ruined the future of video gaming with their tyrannical corporatocracy. There is a U9 demo taken from some sort of expo, I'd be interested to hear your thoughts on it.
Even if Pagan devs done it right with a proper passion with more time been given to cook, Pagan should've been its own spinoffs and probably would've had fit better as Ultima Underworld III: Pagan (if it's done in 3D) or another "World Of Ultima" installment after Savage Empire & Martian Dream (if they keep it isometric). Serpent Isle is the real U8. Pagan is more for another World of Ultima or another Ultima Underworld (probably because it felt like another strange underworld place when the Avatar was dropped onto it after been portal'ed from the beginning)
Ultima VIII wasn't as bad as many people claim it to be. It's a step down on certain things from VII, yes, but the way the engine works with it's physics on a 2D world is quite good. The usecode could probably provide as much freedom as U7 could if they had the time to do so. Issue here was, they didn't have time, nor they have a good way to release it until later. Floppy disks weren't enough for the original intro of Serpent Isle, and weren't enough to acomodate adding more animatioons to the Avatar (like sitting). I do remember on some forum someone saying they got a copy of the Lost Vale as well, but... that was a very long time ago, and I have my doubts that claim was really honest. Anyway, back in the day, Escape from Mount Drash was impossible to find, until it surfaced on some emulator site and from there it was even ported to pc (without the music). So, anything could happen in the future. Lost media keeps appearing from time to time, and maybe some day, the Lost Vale could be among them. I'm hopeful :)
i understand not releasing it when physical media was how the games were distributed, but now with Steam, GOG, Origin, etc?? they could drop it for free and make some money
It's obvious a big chunk of Pagan lore went away with the Lost Vale. Alongside the cuts in the main game, not seeing this released bugs me to this day. Would've certainly made bigger impact on U9 plot had Avatar actually managed to become Titan of Ether along with the other info from the Vale.
I'm very disappointed it would have been great if someone had found The Lost Vale .Can't believe that the creators didn't have bigger ego and say no EA mfckers we will stage a fake theft in our headcounters and actually release it ourselves for free or something like that .
Still, Serpent Isle is the real Ultima VIII it deserved to be. As for Pagan, even if the devs done it right with a proper passion with more time to cook, Pagan should've been its own spinoffs and probably would've had fit better as Ultima Underworld III (if it's done in 3D) or one of World Of Ultima installment after Savage Empire & Martian Dream (if they keep it isometric).
It is just mind boggling that any software company wouldn't put a backup of their final source code into a vault somewhere. Same thing happened with Icewind Dale II developed by Black Isle Studios. Though the game actually shipped, Beamdog couldn't make an enhanced version b/c the source code was gone.
for all its faults I love the hell out of ultima 8. I was probably like 8 or 9 years old when I first played it and had no idea how to play it 'correctly' and just spent countless hours wandering around town and exploring the nearby areas. Later on when I found about the hackmover cheats I spent so much time taking apart and re-building new houses for myself on the edge of the map. I did eventually come back years later and Ive played thru it several times since then, but the creative wonder I felt just messing around back then in the world of pagan will always be one of my fondest early gaming memories.
Oh Ultima VIII, the countless hours of my childhood playing you and even dreaming about the game and what the Mountain King even looked like before or how to find the Hall before I could find Lithos. The days of early internet and asking my older cousins on how to complete the game. The music still amazes and gives me goosebumps to this day. What a time to be alive. Have loved replaying the game once a year to relive the nostalgia
Ultima 8 is in my top 10 of my favorite games. So good to see people like you giving it the love it deserves.
Patiently awaiting your mega-video on Ultima Online
I'm glad I'm not the only guy who wasted time trying to open that #$^% door. Every time I found a new key that had no obvious use I'd head back there to try it. No dice.
no matter how many people bag on ultima 8... I loved it. I finished U8 before the patch... YES! before the patch. Only those people who bought this game when it came out, they know how god damn hard it was to play in certain sections. Also, there is no exaggeration when people say it would take ages to save and load, well its 100% true. I save / load that game like crazy. Some parts needed jump by jump, step by step saving. Especially on the side to side moving platforms that also disappeared! Rage quit inducing sections... but yes... I did it and I still love the game like a true fan boy.
Just for kicks... I started with U5 Amiga, U4 Amiga , U7.1 New PC, U8 - another new pc (cause I also wanted to play crusader no remorse [note that EA brought out the expansion for this game but not U8?!?]), U6 Mars, U7.2, U6 Normal, U6 Dino, U9 (didn't need a new pc anymore - Thankyou GOG)… and I only played U9 when Spoony's videos came out. Bought on GOG and finished it quiet quickly. Yes, story wise it 'betrays' the complete fiction that is ultima. But as a stand alone game, with no knowledge of ultima at all... its not that bad as an individual 'stand alone' game.
And.... I'm still yet to even start U1, U2, U3. I wish there was a Mod version of 1 2 or 3. Cause I played Ultima on dungeon siege which was so cool. I wonder what happened to that total conversion mod?
I finished it without the patch too. And it was the first Ultima I finished, and maybe the first RPG too.
To finish and game and NOT release it is insane. Typical EA
I mean, nowadays they don't finish a game and DO release it 😂
@@bamboebahr2470😂 very good point
@@bamboebahr2470 indeed
It was "finished" but not really. It was behind schedule because we kept getting mandates to make changes and it had a hard release date that we couldn't change. Couple the fact that it wasn't really polished/finished with the poor sales of U8, and that's what you get: cancelled.
@@brianmartin8700 What sort of changes were you asked to make just out of interest?
I am surprised the game was never leaked out after all this time. The code has to exist somewhere.
Really hope this gets found and released someday.
Me too.
My monthly dose of Ultima lore is finally here. Thank you for this!
not releasing a finished game... when releasing unfinished games is industry standard now... publisher moment
I played Ultima 8 on my 486 DOS PC without the jumping patch and I don't recall complaining about it. I always thought that it was an amazing game so I was just happy to play it all day. Nice to hear your thoughts on the Lost Vale expansion as well. It would have been great to experience all the new regions, magic system and storyline. I have been waiting for a source leak for this expansion for years. Who knows maybe one day it will surface.
I’ve only ever played the base game of Ultima 7 and Ultima Underworld. I’m learning so much about the series from watching your videos. Do you think you’ll go back and do the older games sometime?
I probably won't, I just wanted to talk about the ones I grew up with, plus the Underworld games which I missed out on back then.
I've been on a bit of an Ultima lore dive recently. Your videos are really interesting!
I actually got all the Ulitma's queued up on my original MS-Dos machine and finally going to give them a proper go!
Awesome, best way to play them. 💀
Thanks for sharing your thoughts! I hope that a somewhere somehow a copy survived and will eventually leak. Best regards and keep on the good work! :)
Theres probably way more games that we don't even know about that may have been finished that EA never released, i always wonder what could've been if they continued the Land of Lore series or anything by Westwood. Never knew Ultima 8 was supposed to get an expansion
Absolutely loving your videos!
It never stops to amaze when I see the cult following U8 has to this damn day. Sometimes it feels that I was the only 486 owner that enjoyed it almost 30 years ago. I'm so happy this is not the case. Void, you should reach out to Lord British with this video and address the Lost Vale issue. You never know with Richard Garriott...
We're coming out of the woodwoork. There's even Finntrovert among other youtubes, but it's great to finally see people topic it.
Okay, we need to assemble a crew of highly specialized and trained operatives to break into EA's offices and steal the Lost Vale, so it can be released. I shall call this "Ultima's Eleven".
U8 Pagan was my first foray into the world of the avatar and I loved it. I get that it was a departure from the franchise standard on many fronts, but something about the story and theme captured me and really had me engrossed in it. The small island community that was festering from its isolation and tyrannical leadership, the hidden dangers that made living outside the walls of the city pretty much impossible. Add to this the gameplay effects of being able to touch/wield everything from giant swords to basic cutlery and fish, and the surprisingly highly detailed graphics of the landscape and buildings. It's how I wanted ultima online to look, but sadly when I got to UO it think it was already the third age and had a bit of a facelift. If I get to build a 2d iso mmorpg it will have pagan style graphics that's for sure.
I was in college when this game came out. My roommate and I finished it, pre EZmode jump patch! I remember thinking what a crazy departure it was from previous Ultimas, but if you remember, Richard Garriott was a strong believer in his games pushing the tech envelope of PCs. I think U8 missed the mark a bit, because even though I didn't *hate* the game, it just didn't feel like an Ultima. It was also around this time (maybe a little later) that info was starting to come out about Ultima Online!
Love your videos a lot man. My only complaint is theyre too short.
It's too bad about Lost Vale, and too bad about Pagan. I bought the GOG version of Pagan, and although the platform jumping was a lot better than the version I had as a kid, the Gold version wasn't that good. There were still bugs that crashed the game, for instance. It's nostalgic and worth the few dollars it cost me, but so many problems. The combat was usually best avoided because many of the enemies didn't leave anything of value after killing them. If only we could see remakes of Ultima 7 and 8, but I'm guessing there are copyright or licensing issues or we would have seen them already.
WHAT? i never knew this existed!!!
I was satisfied with Ultima8 as it was, but the extra bits sound pretty cool.
I'd rather have a bag of holding (unlimited items/weight) than a bag of endless reagents, but not having to farm materials for Necromency sounds nice.
I wonder how that bag would've worked for Sorcery tho, put the bag at the top of the pentagram and that takes care of all reagents? (And still limited by those symbol tools things as far as how many spells you can have, I don't think there was enough demon heads for all the spells (maximum charges).
Thanks for the extra bits :)
You're welcome. 💀 Not sure how it would've worked out. I was imagining double-clicking on the bag, and you can choose a specific reagent through a dialogue option.
@@VoidbrandGallery Clunky, but workable
I like Ultima VIII, but experienced it way past it's time, so I'm more or less tolerant of it's frustrating parts. But it's a shame how things turned off for this game. Even bigger shame that EA still exist.
Just on another point... some one HAS to have the source or a beta version of it... why doesn't EA release all these old games? and extras for the games they have. I know that probably everyone in this comments section would shell out some decent cash for this expansion! Seriously, i would easily pay $100 for this expansion.... [physical with U8 and all the feelies] actually with all the little things ultima games came with... $150
anyone else who would in all seriousness pay in that area 100 to 150?
If U8 had the full focus of production and the proper time for polish it could have been a masterpiece. The game is a series of great ideas that were never fully fleshed out. EA purposely ruined the future of video gaming with their tyrannical corporatocracy. There is a U9 demo taken from some sort of expo, I'd be interested to hear your thoughts on it.
Even if Pagan devs done it right with a proper passion with more time been given to cook, Pagan should've been its own spinoffs and probably would've had fit better as Ultima Underworld III: Pagan (if it's done in 3D) or another "World Of Ultima" installment after Savage Empire & Martian Dream (if they keep it isometric). Serpent Isle is the real U8. Pagan is more for another World of Ultima or another Ultima Underworld (probably because it felt like another strange underworld place when the Avatar was dropped onto it after been portal'ed from the beginning)
Ultima VIII wasn't as bad as many people claim it to be. It's a step down on certain things from VII, yes, but the way the engine works with it's physics on a 2D world is quite good.
The usecode could probably provide as much freedom as U7 could if they had the time to do so. Issue here was, they didn't have time, nor they have a good way to release it until later. Floppy disks weren't enough for the original intro of Serpent Isle, and weren't enough to acomodate adding more animatioons to the Avatar (like sitting).
I do remember on some forum someone saying they got a copy of the Lost Vale as well, but... that was a very long time ago, and I have my doubts that claim was really honest.
Anyway, back in the day, Escape from Mount Drash was impossible to find, until it surfaced on some emulator site and from there it was even ported to pc (without the music). So, anything could happen in the future. Lost media keeps appearing from time to time, and maybe some day, the Lost Vale could be among them. I'm hopeful :)
Wazzup yo 🎉
i understand not releasing it when physical media was how the games were distributed, but now with Steam, GOG, Origin, etc?? they could drop it for free and make some money
What ever happend to the gold master disk? Did EA distroy it?
Damn pity the last few ultimas seemed rushed a bit with missing content and add-ons. I still prefer turn-based combat but w/e.
Apt name eh. 😂
maybe AI will finish the game one day
It's obvious a big chunk of Pagan lore went away with the Lost Vale. Alongside the cuts in the main game, not seeing this released bugs me to this day. Would've certainly made bigger impact on U9 plot had Avatar actually managed to become Titan of Ether along with the other info from the Vale.
Interesting they went straight to working on an ex-pac instead of finishing the base game.
Lost media is a shame.
'People like you are the reason God doesn't talk to us anymore.'
God is the reason why people don't talk to me anymore.
I'm very disappointed it would have been great if someone had found The Lost Vale .Can't believe that the creators didn't have bigger ego and say no EA mfckers we will stage a fake theft in our headcounters and actually release it ourselves for free or something like that .
Why nobody would just release the game over the internet, stubborn old people.
I don't buy "it was lost"
Still, Serpent Isle is the real Ultima VIII it deserved to be. As for Pagan, even if the devs done it right with a proper passion with more time to cook, Pagan should've been its own spinoffs and probably would've had fit better as Ultima Underworld III (if it's done in 3D) or one of World Of Ultima installment after Savage Empire & Martian Dream (if they keep it isometric).
More like The Lost FAIL