Best channel on TH-cam Joe! Your trouble shooting skills and cool demeanor coupled with no guarantee of success makes for riveting viewing. Thanks for the video! 😃👍🏻
G'day, friends from Australia here. Just be sure that when you time the mags that the rotor is pointing to the A1 mark on the FACE of the magneto, not the casting mark on top of the magneto. The timing indicator on the engine side of things should also be 2 to 3 degrees BEFORE the actual mark. For reference, the A1EM marks and A1TDC marks are 5 degrees apart. It's done this way because as the engine warms up and the revs climb, the mags will need a slight advance. That's why Cents that are improperly timed always die after a few minutes of loaded running. Good luck. I think I have some videos on timing on my channel.
Dear Mr Hewes, Military model builders the world over probably tune into your channel for a close up look at the hardware you service and play around with on a daily basis! (I trust that you will forgive my use of the phrase "play around with"). I will be tuning in again! Regards, Z
I don't know if it's the same on meteors, but on merlins we start on no.2 mag only as it has the booster coil on that mag. Might be worth checking you're getting power to the booster coil as it doesn't sound like you're getting your "shower of sparks" and just the occasional kick from a slowly turning mag. Thinking about it, somebody might have backed the timing off just enough to it to get it to start with a dead booster
With cars they often start with bumping because the maximum energy of the battery goes to the ignition coil as the volts are not dropping by cranking. Also on the old stationary engines I used to mess with you would get a spark from the magneto so many people thought that was ok but you need to see a really energetic hot blue spark. I had a couple of magnetos rebuilt and a lot of the losses was down to the magnet needing re-magnetising. This said if there is some sort of starter booster coil ignition then it very much sounds like that should be investigated.
I don’t know if anybody else did the same but I was just thinking any moment it was going to fire up and get rid of the frustration after getting all the timing in the right place, hard to video with one hand but good job on the information
The timing cover looks the same as a griffon 58. If your valve clearances are ok check the ignition leads to the plugs for shorts to ground with a 250 or 500 volt megger. If these are ok check all your plugs. It’s also worth checking that your mag earthing leads are working right as you may have only one mag working. Leads and plugs can be checked by doing a mag drop test once the engine is running at close to max rpm by selecting one off at a time and seeing what drop you get. Any big drops indicate an ignition system fault.
Real Technical stuff, love it. This is technically on the internet so preserved for others to follow???? Or is it? We see so many basic things like TDC etc not being correct. So who owned the Vehicle before that could not do engine timing ? Its a bit scary that so called people with said Military Vehicles could not maintain them correctly. Well done Guys/Girls again. Who needs REME?
On my cent ARV I always pumped the accelerator 12 x before engaging the starter. It seems to start first time most of the can be a little bit awkward like that. Also we had 4 six volt batteries not two 12 volt batteries. I did once have to start my Cent with flat batteries via the aux gen engine using the starter handle, what a challenging task that was, but it did work.
A will it start video a nice bonus!🤣 You need some of Lord Mucks easy start, oh actually I think you did have some, but you left it in your skid steers he's looking after for you!
Great video - but that last try when it turned over like a sewing machine is a sure sign that the engine is flooded - the fuel has washed the bores clear of oil and you get no compression!
I used to have crazy hair and it was annoying so i just grew it out. Then i found out how much the chicks dig dudes with long hair and beards. Plus you never have to get it pay the barber. It almost always looks good too.
Could be that. Could also be that the hyperlobic accelerator chamber has become clogged with negatively-charged protons, which will lead to excessive wear on the linear micron baffles. Undo that drain plug again and drain out all the excess magnetic desensitiser fluid and it’ll probably start first time. If it doesn’t, use a bigger hammer.
@@Oliverdobbins Talk sense man, the hyperbolic accelerator chamber cant get clogged because the Electrons and Microns grease their transition through the system, granted (if) and its a very BIG (if) the Quantum Directional Centrifuge is out of line then it will impede the Protons,, my money is on the QDC but we'll have to wait till the next video.., Prof Andy Pandy MBE CBD MFI.
Valves seem unlikely, but it would be nice if it was that easy :o) And they are always all over the place. Cam timing check while the tops are off? (If it has the marks). Good luck 🤞
Valves are normally hot engine problem not a cold, if they are effecting things from cold you will be needing new valves. Hope it turns out to a mag thing.
Or indeed if it now runs worse. Something clearly isn't aligned as it should be. Assuming the markings on the flywheel are aligned correctly with the crank (how many bolts does that have ?) .. beyind the valve clearances as Joe mentioned could leave the camshaft alignment ?
Great video! Just a thought - I know you timed it, but did you check for spark right at the plugs? and that there isn't a shutoff switch or wire shorted? Good luck next time you look at it. Cheers!
Far be it for me to tell a tank man about tank engines but as an ex HGV Mech if the engine bump started and ran well even with the mags that far out then I doubt the valves are that far out. But as the mags were out then nowt wrong with checking other adjustable parts. However I suspect the gremlin is sat in an electric circuit: Is there an electric circuit that might be going dead when the starter is fired up? Or a circuit that should be cutting in and isn't when the starter is fired up? You already spotted the coolant sensor was tripped so what other sensors are protecting the engine via the mags? Is that sensor actually switching out with added coolant? I have every confidence Ted will make sure all is well next time round.
If you can get that thing reliably starting on the button, it will be one hell of a useful vehicle. We have seen the winch engine running but does the generator and winch motor work? Do Meteors have fuel and ignition boosters? I know one of the reasons why you sometimes see Merlins start and then cut out on the first go is because it starts on the booster but then dies as fuel hasn't made it up from the carb yet.
Mr Hewes… I’m no tank expert but I am a HGV mechanic. If you’ve got good timing , fuel and compression. Yet it starts on bump but not starter… I wouldn’t suggest it isn’t turning over quickly enough on the battery. Maby bad earth or bad volts ! I’ve had many of truck not start , new battery later and they crank to life…. Sometimes the biggest problems have the simplest answers.. big diesel engines( in a truck let alone a high liter tank) require massive amps compared to Light vehicle .. slightest drop in volts and you’re pissing In the wind
possible problem when you crank the engine there is not enough spark to ignite the fuel but when you bump start all the power from the battery is going to spark the engine ... bad earth or bad battery's or bad wiring connections i dont thing its valve clearance as the engine works when bumped ... just a idea
Pardon my ignorance but I thought Centurians had a Morris pony engine. I'm pretty sure I was shown this around 1969 when being in Vietnam so I would like to be put right on this one. Thanks
Forgive me, i know nothing about this engine but have you timed the magneto's correctly in relation to the piston/valve timing for the cylinder that is first in the firing order ? i.e. its 180 degrees out mechanically....
Watching the clip again. Did you have a timing light for the mag timing or just line up the rotor. I’m not sure about those mags as I’ve only ever used a duplex unit. Use of the timing light will let you get the timing spot on to where the points open and on the duplex unit on the griffon there was a micrometer coupling between the mag and drive that was adjusted to give the right timing.
I'm sorry it hasn't worked out yet, but you'll surely make it! and by the way, just out of curiosity... did you pick that spot for the opening speech on purpose, or is it just a coincidence? 0:16 🤔
@@MrHewes might be still worth checking it’s cranking rpm with a tachometer gun on the crank pulley, If you can get to it? Just keep thinking if it pull starts happily it must be cranking speed. I had a Cummins that was exactly the same, it had turned a main bearing….. not what you want to hear so hopefully it ain’t that…. Lazy starter motor. 🙏 ☹️
Hey Joe, we use to “static time” our old Chevy’s to get em to fire up on the first crank after a rebuild. Is that method even possible with a magneto and boost coil?
I take it the plugs are a nightmare to get at or you'd do a compression test as a valve/piston-ring check rather than going straight to valve clearances?
Joe is it possible that the mags are weak and the extra rpm from a bump start is just enough to get a better spark? We used to have to get one our racing magnetos "re-energized" every few years. We could tell because the car got harder to start (they were ALWAYS push started anyway).
G'day Joe. Have you considered creating an adapter which could enable you to use a pneumatic or perhaps cordless driver to manually crank engines like that to a timing mark? Drivers are available with a right-angled head well suited to the task.
@@MrHewes I've had this with Antar but it was so long ago, wish I was nearer I'd come and rip into it with you, maggs look easier to get the caps back on than the Antar 👌
Not an engine guy...but I would think that oil with a gasoline smell coming out of a dry sump isn't a good sign. So when you re-time an engine in the UK do you set it to Greenwich mean time?
We do tank manufacturers do under tank service / maintenance points. How in hell can such point be used when up to the gunnels in mud on the battlefield. Surely all in-tank access would be best practice.
from my armchair, i reckon you are loosing a bit of voltage whilst cranking, wire up the ignition to a separate voltage source, ie fully charged separate battery/ies
![[LIVE] MCHOICE & MINT AWARDS 2024 at TRUE ICON HALL, ICONSIAM](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/wMewUeT5nbY/mqdefault.jpg)
Best channel on TH-cam Joe! Your trouble shooting skills and cool demeanor coupled with no guarantee of success makes for riveting viewing. Thanks for the video! 😃👍🏻
You’re never on your own if Tank Girl and Ted have got your back!
"Tank Girl & Ted".... Sounds like a 1980's cartoon series.! 😂
G'day, friends from Australia here.
Just be sure that when you time the mags that the rotor is pointing to the A1 mark on the FACE of the magneto, not the casting mark on top of the magneto.
The timing indicator on the engine side of things should also be 2 to 3 degrees BEFORE the actual mark. For reference, the A1EM marks and A1TDC marks are 5 degrees apart.
It's done this way because as the engine warms up and the revs climb, the mags will need a slight advance. That's why Cents that are improperly timed always die after a few minutes of loaded running.
Good luck. I think I have some videos on timing on my channel.
Awww how romantic spending a nice relaxing Sunday with the misses ....
If she can put up with that shes DEFINITELY a keeper !! ❤
Undoing that " dry sump plug " went exactly as i imagined 😅
Dear Mr Hewes,
Military model builders the world over probably tune into your channel for a close up look at the hardware you service and play around with on a daily basis!
(I trust that you will forgive my use of the phrase "play around with").
I will be tuning in again!
Regards,
Z
I don't know if it's the same on meteors, but on merlins we start on no.2 mag only as it has the booster coil on that mag. Might be worth checking you're getting power to the booster coil as it doesn't sound like you're getting your "shower of sparks" and just the occasional kick from a slowly turning mag.
Thinking about it, somebody might have backed the timing off just enough to it to get it to start with a dead booster
Yep it sounds like the booster is not working
With cars they often start with bumping because the maximum energy of the battery goes to the ignition coil as the volts are not dropping by cranking. Also on the old stationary engines I used to mess with you would get a spark from the magneto so many people thought that was ok but you need to see a really energetic hot blue spark. I had a couple of magnetos rebuilt and a lot of the losses was down to the magnet needing re-magnetising. This said if there is some sort of starter booster coil ignition then it very much sounds like that should be investigated.
@@livetillyoudielovelife2299 Sure can't hear it buzzing, and AFAIK, the double contact rotors are only used in one mag.
Booster is working and comes on with the starter motor off the feed. Lots of spark from the booster
@MrHewes cam timing is next logical step then, as you said.
I was really expecting her to fire up - stuff is rarely that simple though. Thanks for sharing
Glad you had someone helping out. I tried to reset the timing on my old Cent years ago all alone and ended up walking away...
You cured me for my desire to own an MBT, I will stick with my MOD 110😊
Very nice. Thanks for taking us along with your Sunday tank tinkering. I enjoyed this upload.
ted overseeing oporations good dog right there
Its not an environmental disaster 😢 the oil came out the ground in the 1st place so your just putting it back 👍very green ♻️ of you
I don’t know if anybody else did the same but I was just thinking any moment it was going to fire up and get rid of the frustration after getting all the timing in the right place, hard to video with one hand but good job on the information
I was hoping it would but I like to keep my channel real life not make a make Believe world were everything works always 🤣
The only channel I save for after tea and enjoy in full screen every episode.
0:16 seconds in got the devil's horn on lol haha
The timing cover looks the same as a griffon 58. If your valve clearances are ok check the ignition leads to the plugs for shorts to ground with a 250 or 500 volt megger. If these are ok check all your plugs. It’s also worth checking that your mag earthing leads are working right as you may have only one mag working. Leads and plugs can be checked by doing a mag drop test once the engine is running at close to max rpm by selecting one off at a time and seeing what drop you get. Any big drops indicate an ignition system fault.
Awesome video thanks for your time and consideration 👍🇬🇧
Real Technical stuff, love it. This is technically on the internet so preserved for others to follow???? Or is it? We see so many basic things like TDC etc not being correct. So who owned the Vehicle before that could not do engine timing ? Its a bit scary that so called people with said Military Vehicles could not maintain them correctly. Well done Guys/Girls again. Who needs REME?
Love all your videos. I look forward to every new one, Ive watched all of your videos and need more! Keep up the good work!
Awesome! Thank you!
What a machine 👍
Great video. Thanks for taking the time to make it.
Nice video. You are very talented Joe.
0:15 - come on… you telling me the placement of those two horns was accidental?
Was just thinking that myself xD
I always thought Joe was a li'l devil.
liked this kind of video, a nice change of pace.
In truth those are not simple engines to handle despite having a good reputation of reliability and you need experience that you have 👍👍
I love these educational videos on tanks if I ever get one ill be sure to ask you more info.
On my cent ARV I always pumped the accelerator 12 x before engaging the starter. It seems to start first time most of the can be a little bit awkward like that. Also we had 4 six volt batteries not two 12 volt batteries. I did once have to start my Cent with flat batteries via the aux gen engine using the starter handle, what a challenging task that was, but it did work.
A will it start video a nice bonus!🤣 You need some of Lord Mucks easy start, oh actually I think you did have some, but you left it in your skid steers he's looking after for you!
But "Start you bastard" aka easy start doesn't always work and too much can damage an engine apparently
@@samrodian919 that's the alternative easy start! Don't want the engine getting addicted to that stuff now do we! 🤣 @LordMuck insert rant clip!
Nice to see Ted helping you to set the timing up....
Brilliant video 👍🏻
I learned to drive cent in 1973, don't remeber half of it now.
Great video - but that last try when it turned over like a sewing machine is a sure sign that the engine is flooded - the fuel has washed the bores clear of oil and you get no compression!
I’m more concerned the rings are worn..
I’m just glad you can smell again!
Me too it’s so useful!
I used to have crazy hair and it was annoying so i just grew it out. Then i found out how much the chicks dig dudes with long hair and beards. Plus you never have to get it pay the barber. It almost always looks good too.
Have you checked to see if the flux capacitor is firing in-line with the quantum directional centrifuge?
I looked eleventeen times last Saturday
@@MrHewes Look again as each day has a different time continuum with the earths gravitational pull.
Could be that. Could also be that the hyperlobic accelerator chamber has become clogged with negatively-charged protons, which will lead to excessive wear on the linear micron baffles. Undo that drain plug again and drain out all the excess magnetic desensitiser fluid and it’ll probably start first time. If it doesn’t, use a bigger hammer.
@@Oliverdobbins Talk sense man, the hyperbolic accelerator chamber cant get clogged because the Electrons and Microns grease their transition through the system, granted (if) and its a very BIG (if) the Quantum Directional Centrifuge is out of line then it will impede the Protons,, my money is on the QDC but we'll have to wait till the next video.., Prof Andy Pandy MBE CBD MFI.
@@formhubfar Sheldon just called .......
Best of luck. Sometimes it can be something that throws you completely off track and you find it by accident. I've had that a few times.
Dude, that oil, ugh. Looks like something that would happen to me. 😂 Cheers from across the water!
The spec was if you cut the mags individually no more than 400 revs difference. You can’t back off because you would lose tolerance.
Valves seem unlikely, but it would be nice if it was that easy :o) And they are always all over the place. Cam timing check while the tops are off? (If it has the marks). Good luck 🤞
Valves are normally hot engine problem not a cold, if they are effecting things from cold you will be needing new valves.
Hope it turns out to a mag thing.
Hi man,
Hope you’ll be able to get this engine running soon.
Send you love from the Netherlands
Hey, thanks!
See if it runs any better after a push start with the mags re timed.👍
Or indeed if it now runs worse. Something clearly isn't aligned as it should be. Assuming the markings on the flywheel are aligned correctly with the crank (how many bolts does that have ?) .. beyind the valve clearances as Joe mentioned could leave the camshaft alignment ?
Great video! Just a thought - I know you timed it, but did you check for spark right at the plugs? and that there isn't a shutoff switch or wire shorted? Good luck next time you look at it. Cheers!
Have you tried getting at the inlet plugs,its a bitch
Far be it for me to tell a tank man about tank engines but as an ex HGV Mech if the engine bump started and ran well even with the mags that far out then I doubt the valves are that far out. But as the mags were out then nowt wrong with checking other adjustable parts.
However I suspect the gremlin is sat in an electric circuit:
Is there an electric circuit that might be going dead when the starter is fired up?
Or a circuit that should be cutting in and isn't when the starter is fired up?
You already spotted the coolant sensor was tripped so what other sensors are protecting the engine via the mags?
Is that sensor actually switching out with added coolant?
I have every confidence Ted will make sure all is well next time round.
If you can get that thing reliably starting on the button, it will be one hell of a useful vehicle. We have seen the winch engine running but does the generator and winch motor work?
Do Meteors have fuel and ignition boosters? I know one of the reasons why you sometimes see Merlins start and then cut out on the first go is because it starts on the booster but then dies as fuel hasn't made it up from the carb yet.
Mr Hewes… I’m no tank expert but I am a HGV mechanic. If you’ve got good timing , fuel and compression. Yet it starts on bump but not starter… I wouldn’t suggest it isn’t turning over quickly enough on the battery. Maby bad earth or bad volts ! I’ve had many of truck not start , new battery later and they crank to life…. Sometimes the biggest problems have the simplest answers.. big diesel engines( in a truck let alone a high liter tank) require massive amps compared to Light vehicle .. slightest drop in volts and you’re pissing In the wind
Weird it still won’t fire but will with a pull 🤷♂. Glad it’s got an oil free sump though… famous last words Mr Hewes 🤣🤦♂
“I should not have said that” 🤣
@@MrHewes could have been worse, loads of people could have seen and filmed it 🤷♂🤣
possible problem when you crank the engine there is not enough spark to ignite the fuel but when you bump start all the power from the battery is going to spark the engine ... bad earth or bad battery's or bad wiring connections i dont thing its valve clearance as the engine works when bumped ... just a idea
It's a magneto, no battery needed for spark.
No idea what im watching but its still great entertainment!
Wow that video brought out the tank motor consultants, by the looks of the comments. My turn then; did you try having a cider?
I didn’t that’s where I was going wrong
Don't forget to charge the batteries!
I was jump-leading it
Pardon my ignorance but I thought Centurians had a Morris pony engine. I'm pretty sure I was shown this around 1969 when being in Vietnam so I would like to be put right on this one. Thanks
Sure did! I removed it on this to work on main engine
😎👍
Forgive me, i know nothing about this engine but have you timed the magneto's correctly in relation to the piston/valve timing for the cylinder that is first in the firing order ?
i.e. its 180 degrees out mechanically....
If 180 degrees out it would never run. Yet this one starts on a push so it must be sparking on the compression stroke.
Watching the clip again. Did you have a timing light for the mag timing or just line up the rotor. I’m not sure about those mags as I’ve only ever used a duplex unit. Use of the timing light will let you get the timing spot on to where the points open and on the duplex unit on the griffon there was a micrometer coupling between the mag and drive that was adjusted to give the right timing.
How can you say you were on your own when Ted was there?.
He was in the house to start with
He came out to lend you a paw!
I'm sorry it hasn't worked out yet, but you'll surely make it!
and by the way, just out of curiosity...
did you pick that spot for the opening speech on purpose, or is it just a coincidence? 0:16
🤔
Is it worth going back to basics, pulling no1 plug, and checking TDC against the flywheel timing marks ?
I know nowt about tanks so I don’t know the setup with the drive train….. but could the drive be dragging on the engine turning over. ie clutch? 🙂
I was pressing the clutch as I crank so doubt full
@@MrHewes might be still worth checking it’s cranking rpm with a tachometer gun on the crank pulley, If you can get to it? Just keep thinking if it pull starts happily it must be cranking speed. I had a Cummins that was exactly the same, it had turned a main bearing….. not what you want to hear so hopefully it ain’t that…. Lazy starter motor. 🙏 ☹️
Is your boost coil working ? do Meteors even have a boost coil ? Merlins do...
They do and it’s working well
Hey Joe, we use to “static time” our old Chevy’s to get em to fire up on the first crank after a rebuild. Is that method even possible with a magneto and boost coil?
nice video chap
Are you sure the starter cranks the right way?????
I take it the plugs are a nightmare to get at or you'd do a compression test as a valve/piston-ring check rather than going straight to valve clearances?
What's that hiding behind the Landy?
Some m548s and a jet 🛩️
Out of interest, why did you not give it any choke when trying to start from cold?
Joe is it possible that the mags are weak and the extra rpm from a bump start is just enough to get a better spark?
We used to have to get one our racing magnetos "re-energized" every few years. We could tell because the car got harder to start (they were ALWAYS push started anyway).
Possibly worth a try !
Looking at the data plate on the rocker cover it would be interesting to know where & when it was overhauled(ie-what workshop etc)
If I had a Cent, for every time you cranked over the Cent………
New vid,cool 👍😎🇬🇧
G'day Joe.
Have you considered creating an adapter which could enable you to use a pneumatic or perhaps cordless driver to manually crank engines like that to a timing mark?
Drivers are available with a right-angled head well suited to the task.
Not a great start but another wonderful video!
I like to try show people things don’t always go to plan
@@MrHewes Of cours! it's not all sweet dreams
Does she have a booster coil same as the Antar and spitfire Joe, I had some bother with an Antar and it was booster coil
It’s got one and it’s working well..
@@MrHewes I've had this with Antar but it was so long ago, wish I was nearer I'd come and rip into it with you, maggs look easier to get the caps back on than the Antar 👌
@@kensjobs2237the meteorite was dog of an engine
@@stewartbrown8115 a thirsty dog aswell lol
Not an engine guy...but I would think that oil with a gasoline smell coming out of a dry sump isn't a good sign.
So when you re-time an engine in the UK do you set it to Greenwich mean time?
Absolutely
16 seconds in......... DEVIL HORNS!
That’s me
Your main seal leaking?
A hair cut and a sense of smell onto a winner
We do tank manufacturers do under tank service / maintenance points. How in hell can such point be used when up to the gunnels in mud on the battlefield. Surely all in-tank access would be best practice.
Yoooooooo
starter motor sounds goosed. put your battery tester on if it drops in will probably go in the red when cranking
from my armchair, i reckon you are loosing a bit of voltage whilst cranking, wire up the ignition to a separate voltage source, ie fully charged separate battery/ies
Did you folks ever consider a pit? All that crawling around on the ground getting
dumped on.........
I did but insurance companies not a fan of them..
0:17 nice horns you have lol
Whoever is controlling the camera, Full Marks, they nearly kept your head in front of the cow horns on the wall to make you look like the devil!
I'm assuming you're ex REME ? I can fiddle about with my MF35 but wouldn't know where to start with this stuff 🙂
is that the blonde bomeshell helpin u ?? still a great show , could be longer though
Distributor more likly to be taken out than the engine striped down and I've seen car engines move timing quite a lot just putting the dizzy in wrong
Who recovers the recoverer
Surely someone makes a practical headband for a phone
Just curious, how do you britts spell aaaaaasss?
A R S E
🤭🤭🤣🤣
@@1chishyes the PROPER WAY lol
I presume TDC on the flywheel mark is actually at true TDC. 👀
🤠
Hi
Timing chains streched???
No chains
@@MrHewes how's the cam driven? is it geared?
@@MrHewes 👍👍👍
As a kiwi I don't like been missed out being upside down, mate..... 😢
🤣 apologies
cheers Joe
Leads on wrong plugs?
Nope
Its very hard to get the leads wrong they are on a harness
My only thought is the batteries are not strong enough and it turning over too slowly
You should try timing the mag’s with the aux gen and fuel tanks in situ b****y nightmare
hey, off and on again actually was the solution to somethin
What's your main job ? .Are you farm contractors. 😊
I’m totally unemployable
@@MrHewesHair gel might help?