Sir, thank you for clarifying and to make I point I didn’t try to call you out but rather follow your line of thought in review of watches. Maybe I’ve sampled too many of your fellow watch reviewers that seem to trash certain watch brands and lumped in the critiques - some just trash choices based on who sponsors them, YOU do not! Your reviews and heart felt enthusiasm have made a difference in helping not only myself, but others in making a choice in watches ( a co worker picked a Squale based on your recommendations and review) Thank you once again and you are truly appreciated! And yes “ onwards and upwards!”
The PRX has been a gateway for so many people into watch collecting and appreciation, it deserves a lot of credit for that. It has a lot of potential for future enhancements to address its shortcomings too, will be interesting to see how that is rolled out as manufacturing techniques and materials improve and become more price competitive
Yeah, I get the dismay about the 'disposability' of the PRX movements, but do we have stats on just how 'many' are breaking or needing replacement? I mean, they might be plastic - but are they really breaking that often? Not defending or attacking, would genuinely like to know...
Agree. It is a unique watch in this sector of the market and has the stand-out design that Tissot needed to appeal to newbies/fashion-conscious buyers. Swiss brand, affordable, cool retro styling, bridges the sporty/dressy divide, huge range, good quality for not a lot of money. I could go on. OK, they are in danger of pushing things too far like they did with the Visodate but that is usually the case with a successful formula. Mine is a 35mm quartz mid-blue dial and owning quite a few Tissots, some of them going back to the 1990s, I would say the PRX is one of their best models for many years.
@@NazidKimmie Good point, plastic in mechanical watch movements may not be the issue it is being made out to be. Plastic is replacing metal in most things from car engines to gas boilers to lawnmowers to save weight, cost etc., most of it out of sight and out of mind. Plastic is widely used in quartz watch gear trains with no problems. Yes there is more force exerted in a mechanical movement, but if the engineering is competent and backed up with appropriate R&D then to me it isn't necessarily a big negative.
In a weird way, the PRX was my gateway watch... but I never bought one. I was somewhat indifferent until the PRXs looks caught my eye in a department store, I tried it on and hated the way it looked on my wrist. That set me on a mission to find a watch I truly liked... and I haven't stopped finding since
I recently got interested in watches again after a 10 year hiatus, and once again have gravitated toward your channel. Your critiques have always been sensible, and you present a wide variety of watches without the feeling of being a storefront for the latest hyped watches.
🙌🙌🙌🙌 That makes it all worth it, welcome back to the greatest (if sometime a tad frustrating) hobby. I deeply appreciate the support and inspiring words, onwards, upwards, and best regards, TGV
I own a lot of watches, from cheap to luxury. I own a PRX and for the price I am not bothered by the plastic pallet fork and escapement. The argument seems to be that the movement is disposable and that this somehow diminishes the profession of watch making and repair. I find that to be a terribly weak argument. Other than simple regulation, who repairs seiko movements? There are Seiko offerings in the same price range as the PRX that use NH 35 and 36 movements. I assure you, if I send it out for repair on the gear train, more than likely they will replace the movement entirely. This is not some new phenomenon with Tissot watches. I would bet that if a watch that is under a grand needs repairs, a good percentage of the time they are going to swap the movement. I expect that in some rare cases even brands like Breitling, Tudor, or Omega do this. If a lower cost company like Tissot does it, I am fine with it.
Tudor has been known to swap movements but TGV won't say anything about that. I think ultimately people want to seem edgy and contrarian, even if the points they are making aren't actual points.
True mate i agree with everything you said, some people just look too much into it and re obsessed with specs , a fuckin plastic part somewhere in a movement in a cheap watch such as a prx powermatic 80 lol . I own a prx 40mm pm80 in my collection of various watches and its just a super fun watch with amazing light play and looks gorgeous in all angles and is a joy to wear! Couldn’t care less about the accuracy or some random low quality parts or the movement being replaced in service, at the end of the day i just want to have a watch that’s working fine and looks great !
I agree with you completely. Why are we holding Tissot to the standards of luxury watches or Haute Horology? Tissot is clearly the brand for the masses and they are currently the best budget brand in the Swatch group IMO as they have a clear direction and intention with their offerings. When we buy the PRX, it's definitely for how it looks and feels on the wrist, not the spec sheet. If I want a watch that has been carefully made with the utmost care and precision with great materials and finishing on the movement, I know I won't be looking at a Tissot nor be able to comfortably afford it anyway. There's a reason why A Lange & Sohne, JLC, VC, Patek Philippe, Moser and many others could charge so much for their offerings. They know people are willing to pay for good materials made by good hands. Tissot is not that at all.
100%. It’s all well and good to support craftsmanship and the watchmaking art; however, the economic reality is if a sub-$1000 USD watch malfunctions after the warranty , it’s not cost effective to fix the movement no matter what it’s built with. At modern watchmaker labor prices, it’ll cost more than the sub-$1000 watch’s worth just to diagnose the problem- to say nothing of additional money to fix it! If the movement is not cost effective to fix , plastic or metal parts content becomes irrelevant.
My take in the suden PRX hate is a three factor issue. 1. The are better options (weak argument, The twelve for instance is twice as good for twice the price). 2. The flood of 70s style with integrated bracelets watches that keeps coming (kind of anoying to be honest) 3. TH-camr's need for clout content, slandering a watch that was praised by all generate clicks (this I hate).
I have spoken to a former manager of GO. She told me, Hayek kids lost the plot completely and they do not have the competence to run the watch brands properly. The former GO manager now works for A Lange und Söhne.
TGV, the better question to ask is...which season of Blackadder was your favorite? I personally adore the first season the most (loved them all, really)...yet, very few can deny how hard hitting "Blackadder goes forth" was, especially the final episode. Quality commentary on your part, as always.
I wasn’t a massive fan of Blackadder but did watch them and they were very funny, the ending of the last series when they go over the top of the trench, bloody hell that was heartbreaking, a very funny comedy to end like that was extremely powerful, i remember watching it and thinking that would have actually happened, blokes joking in the trenches with their mates and then…….🌺
During 2022-2023 due to the bidding frenzy of the bubble, most established watch brands jacked up their prices-often double or even more-with the idea that the more expensive the better. Now with the bubble deflating and a soft economy on the horizon, I think that a lot of these brands may end of in some trouble as the masses begin to look for value for money again-not just an inflated price tag.
Agreed they got out if hand with the increases. I think soon stuggle to sell soon. I'm out of the game now I want a Seiko 5 for £200 and a higher level up Seiko for £500/£600 rrp. I want a Hamilton field watch for £600 rrp not £1000
The problem with powermatic 80 movement is plenty of variations. Entry level powermatic 80 is ending 111 - usually have plastic parts and 23 jewels. However version ending 6 or 8 doesn’t e.g. “Gentlemen” or “Ballade”. I like what MIDO does with powermatic 80 movements, they only use versions with regular escapement and minimum 25 jewels (so version 6 and 8), then their regulate those movements to COSC standards. Regards!
Great video, the powermatic 80 movement is a very controversial subject, I have a Certina Ds Action Diver in 43mm with the powermatic 80, and a cw trident with the sellita sw200-1 in it. Both watches are on par in terms of quality. I do find the powermatic to have amazing accuracy and this is probably due to the fact how the movement is regulated at the factory. Also not all powermatic 80 movements use plastic parts. I believe certina use a all metal version of the powermatic 80 with a Nivachron balance spring. Even with the powermatic 80 the certina is a fantastic tool watch and is accurate to under -1 second a day. I look forward to seeing your next video keep up the great work.
TGV, another great vid. I agree. If Tissot and other Swiss brands continue on this path many true watch enthusiasts will switch gears and start collecting more hand made boutique brands, as well as vintage. Hopefully Tissot is taking note. On another note, I picked up my 3861 Hesalite Speedy from Leah at MOYER’s this afternoon. We had a conversation about you. Hopefully you are planning another visit. I would really enjoy meeting you in person. It is amazing how many things we have in common. Please keep up the great great work. I always enjoy that new vid from you…..
What "hand made boutique brands" are Tissot consumers going to switch to? 50 grand+ Pateks and Vacherons? Because I promise you nothing below that price range is really handmade and boutique. Collectors who actually spend money in this industry are not affected by Tissot's brand strategy in the slightest because they collect Rolexes (not handmade or boutique either btw), APs etc. They also don't care about silly crap like regulating their own movements (since Rolex uses the same regulation method as the PM80 lol) or plastic components (like the nylon bushings in Rolex calibers). The "true enthusiasts" you're thinking about, i.e. forum nerds who want to play collectors on a consumer budget don't matter, they're a tiny pimple on the proverbial backside that is swatch group's revenue. The casual consumer is who counts for entry level brands and the fact that such people still even know analog/mechanical watches exist in 2024 is a miracle that was almost single-handedly made possible by the the swatch group and especially Tissot. I mean, of course it wouldn't be doable in the first place if Rolex wasn't propping up the whole industry by keeping the wrist watch in mass consciousness as a cool object/gift/jewelerry, but the PRX is definitely the new SKX in that it reminded the average consumer, the smartwatch buyer, that a watch they can afford can be desirable. None of the Chinese junk TGV gushes about like the Nivada he "reviewed" (read: advertised) recently would even exist without the PRX or at least you wouldn't have heard about it. I don't even own a PRX but it's silly not to recognise its positive impact.
Followed your advice TGV and got a thin vintage dress watch, a cushion case 1972 Seiko LordMatic and put it on leather. Incredibly understated and elegant for the office.
These videos never being advertisements and always speaking the truth and just your honest perspectives is why your channel is just pure class and will keep succeeding and keep your fans around long term.
Hi TGV, I totally agree with your perspective on the plastic escapement in the Tissot PRX with the eta C07.111 movement. I have owned the Tissot PRX and it was a lovely watch, I just couldn't get past the plastic escapement! I also owned the Hamilton Khaki Field Mechanical, with the H10 movement (based on the eta C07.611 movement) the difference is both these watches is that the Hamilton field watch doesn't feature a plastic escapement, it is the regular pallet fork and stones in that one 😉 I'm a long time follower of the channel and really enjoy the content, onwards and upwards ⌚️
No disrespect, but how does it having a plastic escapement affect your wearing experience in literally any way? If it was a lovely watch then you'd...just wear it and enjoy it?
I find it odd that folks routinely say that the $400 Tissot PRX with its cheapened movement with some plastic parts is a "bargain". One can find full metal watches for less than that. I guess that that Tissot name is work a big premium.
I think it makes sense to fit these modular movements in entry level mechanical watches. Because the service costs is so high compared to buying new, many entry level mechanical watches will end up in the trash instead of getting a service. Watchmakers time on servicing entry level mechanical watches need to be lower. If you own 5-10 entry level mechanical watches you’re sitting on a quite large maintenance debt.
In the end, in regards to which watch brands or styles you like to wear, you take other people's opinions, do your research, experience them, then find the best ones for you. I have watched many watch youtubers' vids but have never found one like TGV who deeply cares about what he says and does thorough research about each watch he introduces. I have a different taste than him, but it has been nothing helpful for me to think about what I need and what I want to make wise decisions. A true gentleman knows how to communicate without bitterness, yet only with respect and honesty. TGV is showing a good example of it and I believe that is why people love him. Much respect to you, sir. Keep up the good work!
3:27 Hamilton does not use the ETA C07.111 23 jewel movement with the plastic escapement. Hamilton H series calibers retain the 25 jewel traditional escapement.
Yes please people up vote this so there is a slight chance TGV sees this. Because it's obvious that he believes that all watches with Powermatic 80 are the same but its not true, they have different grades based on the price point of the watch.
Hi TGV, I recently asked Certina about the powermatic 80 in their DS Super PH1000, they said the below: Please be advised that there are no plastic parts in the Powermatic 80.611 movement, I can confirm that this is one of our most popular movements and more and more new models will contain this. This movement is fully serviceable and will be for many years to come.
i can’t really talk about the powermatic 80 in the Tissot watches, but it’s cousin in the hamilton watches I own also have an advanced laser regulated escapement (but all metal parts as far as I know). Yes, I can’t regulate it myself but to be honest, i set the 3 of them on sunday (a 42 mm Khaki Murph, a Kaki Pilot day date and a Jazz performer), on this wednesday morning, the murph and the jazz performer have less than 2 seconds deviation, and the Day date have 2 seconds deviation. So far they seem to stay within COSC tolerances and I must say except for most of my quartz watches they are the most precise watches I own. I said most because I have a vintage russian електроника -1 watch (with a led display that stays on for a second or two to display the time) that runs too fast due to the slightly higher voltage of modern batteries and gains a few seconds a day.
Those Hamiltons all have 25 jewel variants with normal escapements. The only difference from an ETA 2824 is the reduced beat rate and the P80 regulator/balance. No plastic.
@@tailsneon556the escapement cannot be set like a « normal » one it has no slow/fast lever the balance wheel is balanced using a laser, you can’t do it yourself.
10:00 getting offended when someone criticises what you love means that you don't really love it? Would that mean that I don't love my wife if I got offended if someone criticised her, or my son, or my football club, or my country etc? The implication that I get offended because of a lack of love, I disagree with. I see getting offended as a defence mechanism over what I perceive as an attack on myself, where me means identity, where what I identify with, is the things and people that I have the most attachment towards, commonly known as love. This is the only thing I don't agree with, from your answer and to me it does not support nor contradict any of the, otherwise, lovely arguments, from your answer. Always love your videos! Cheers!
Yes my friend we must never forget how very British TGV is. I guarantee you he goes to sleep every night only after smoking the finest tobacco drinking the finest tea and brandy and then ready charge of the light brigade. He then wakes up every morning crying out the name of Saint George very British 😎
TGV, your criticism is always fair, objective and constructive. I expect Tissot is listening. Their new 1938 COSC line hints at that. At its price point, automation is a necessity. They are left having to focus on design, which they’ve done amazingly in the Gentleman, PRX, Seastar, Telemeter…. They’ve much to improve upon, however. They ruined the beloved Visodate, their new GMT offering is clown sized and two thirds of their other offerings are either hideous or forgettable. No time to rest Tissot!
Thanks for another informative and interesting video. I appreciate your independent stance and balanced views, on the watches you experience. Watching your work helps make being a watch enthusiast more enjoyable.
Everytime I hear your intro my love for watch collecting is renewed it brings out the romance and all the desire that comes from owning a watch with history and style. Thank you for that.
Honestly, my biggest issue with the movement is they sacrificed second hand sweep smoothness {which is one of my major attractions to mechanical watches) for power reserve. For watches designed to be worn mostly as daily timepieces, how much power reserve do you really need?
A fantastic video as always. Please can you do an update regarding your PAM0048. I remember you were selling off your collection including your Explorer and wondered whether you were still enjoying it as much? I have my 40th coming up soon and am deciding between the Explorer 36 and a 40mm PAM so your insight would be great having owned both. I posed the question on the Facebook group and everyone was very kind offering advice. J
How many of us really do send our watches for regulation? I'm might be wrong, but I heard that the PRX is laser regulated from the factory (please don't quote me on that) and that should count some way. Let's say you have a Rolex and want to regulate.... How much it's going to cost you? The price of a PRX maybe? Sometimes way more. My uncle sent his Rolex Date just to see why it was loosing 20 minutes a day. They came up with a sequential replacement part list to fix the poor thing, that would get it back in shape for 1,400 dollars. All things considered, you put your money wherever you see fit. My Son asked me for the PRX auto when it was released. He wears it everyday and says it keeps great time. Win, win.
Im curious what you think about the plastic escapement on the powermatic 80. I've read that it's a high grade synthetic material that also self lubricates.
TGV old chap. One has been following your wonderful channel since its Inception. You have always been open and honest with your reviews. Your reviews are informative and entertaining. You and your channel are pure class. Keep doing what you do. Onwards and Upwards old chap.
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Thanks TGV for another thought provoking and interesting video. Just a few thoughts in response. 1) Mechanisation is not a issue exclusive to watch making. It is a death knell of almost every craft, skill and service once performed expertly by humans. It's one of the prices of capitalism the world over. Profit over people. 2) If you talk about brands like Tissot diluting and endangering the skill of watch making - then for me, equal blame has to be laid at the feet of the big, luxury watch brands who have made their products completely unobtainable for 99% of people who wear a watch in the world. Again, all in the name of profit, not watch making. If the likes of Rolex, AP, PP et al were not charging such mark ups on their products (approx $1.5bn profit for rolex in 2016 - wow, and for such a small percentage of the watch buying public) that wouldn't in turn drive companies like Swatch to make affordable homages to keep up with all the Rolex hype and publicity. If the watch industry goes under, it will only have itself to blame for eating itself alive, IMO.
A few very different thoughts spontaneously came to mind about your video today. When the many well-known or less well-known watch brands release new models, which is not a bad thing, then I constantly hear or read about Sellita movements. Sellita and ETA are of course rock-solid watch movements, but I sometimes think that it would be nice if the older brands in particular also built their own movements, like they used to do. I'm thinking, for example, of Longines, whose history I really like. But that's why I particularly appreciate brands like Glashütte-Original or Jaeger LeCoultre or Girard-Perregaux, which have remained true to their tradition. My list is of course incomplete. But with the pursuit of this, watchmaking would continue to have a future.
I love the analytical emotive mix you bring to your reviews. Im only just over 2 years down the enthusiast rabbit hole but find your content informative and instructive. Long may it continue.
TGV ! I have a genuine question for you. Why do you think Tissot uses polymer (plastic) to make the pallet fork and escapement? Don’t you think it’s easier to just use steel or brass, as the rest of the movement is made from either steel or brass? Do you think Tissot is trying to cut cost? How much can Tissot save by using polymer to make these two tiny parts instead of brass/steel. Neither polymer or brass/steel are expensive materials. Why don’t you spend a few minutes, do some research and think why? I look forward to your educated reply. And then I will give you my perspective. Don’t always believe what you hear or read on the internet. Independent and critical thinking are important.
Really enjoyed this short-form video. Maybe a weekly 10min news piece could be a regular segment? I know the longer format takes time with all the editing and research, so perhaps this could work if it takes less time to produce? My first Swiss was also a quartz Tissot V8 from 20 plus years ago - I still have the thing too lol. Best as always sir !
I am considering it. I'm not sure why but it just pains me a little to make videos like this simplistic, I'm always trying to up my game, but you are absolutely right, far less time consuming and stressful. Thank you, duly noted. Best regards, TGV
My first mechanical ⚙️ Swiss watch was the Tissot Telemeter 1938 black and gold dial with the ETA 7750 chronograph movement. I have had the watch for over a year and I still love it. I think the quality is great.
I own a pre-Powermatic 80 Visodate, and I honestly prefer having the standard ETA movement in there. The extended power reserve isn't worth having the plastic components, reduced beat rate, lack of traditional regulation, and difficulty with servicing imo.
Same reason my Tissot Automatics iii with its 2436-2 is my last Tissot. Nearly everything else they have now is one of those dreadful powermatics. Unfortunately the same goes for Longines now as well, I wanted either a Conquest or Hydroconquest but they are powermatics now too...
Among the many youtubers that talk about watches, there is one that stands above them all -TGV! You have my respect for offering such an exquisite and unaltered opinion on everything related to wrist watches!
I am torn on this one, on one hand the plastic escapement feels like a corporate corner cut but on the other hand I haven't seen enough factual data to identify the long term effects of this aside from the displeasure of knowing it is there. Is there a large pool of data to say it performs any worse between services? In the same way Tag use plastic movement spacers, which lots of us don't like but - but in effect the job of securing the movement in the case is still performed effectively. Modern commercial aircraft skin is constructed of composite and we don't miss aluminium as far as performance, in fact it performs better allowing for higher cabin pressure and a lighter fuselage and so ultimately more efficiency...but it is more difficult to repair when the time comes. Back to watches, I totally agree on the sentimental side - knowing the parts that were there when you bought the watch can still be in it exactly as they were piece for piece with basic maintenance every decade....that is something that disposable plastic parts cannot provide in the current Swatch group form.
I own the PRX Chrono, very beautiful. I love Tissot and love the regular PRX, I handled many and would recommend it to anyone. I think you’re too harsh on it T, its fair to say the Swissmatic movement was an issue, but not the Powermatic IMHO
Tissot makes watches for non watch enthusiasts. A lot of people just want a watch that looks good, is reliable, and has an attractive price point. That's it. Some people really like the mechanical ins and outs of watches. Hey, if you like paying $200/hr shop time to have a watchmaker maintain a watch rock on. Congradulations on your lucrative career that gives you that kind of disposable income.
Thanks TGV for following up on this opinion. I have a Tissot Gentlemen that I love. I really appreciated your insight about the movement and overall opinions into what the swatch group is doing but in the end, I just love the watch for the way it looks and wears on my 7.5 inch wrist. It's such a great GADA watch at a fantastic price. Keep up the great work sir!
Before even checking your channel , I read about the plastic and changed my decision. You are absolutely correct, tgv, as you are supporting my thought. Basically, i am still yet to find a proper good Swiss auto watch under $500.
Impartiality, integrity and genuinely honest. That is why I am a subscriber to this channel. TGV would admit a mistake or error and is not trying to sell a product. BTW, I have long noticed a "Ran" poster in the background....Anyone who is a fan of AK is truly cultured.
Hello TGV, I just wanted to say thank you so much for everything that you do!! I wish more TH-camrs be like you so focused on the comments and so attentive at explaining the ins and outs of the comments as well as breaking it piece by piece to get closer to the truth! I definitely agree with you on the new powermatic 80 movement since I currently own a Tissot with that movement. As efficient as it is in terms of power reserve and performing accurate timekeeping I don’t feel as attached to it as my Glycine watch! I feel that it lacks personality and longevity! It just doesn’t feel the same compared with the Glycine! The fact that you can’t even service it is also a big downside like you mentioned! Thank you so much TGV again for everything that you do! You are one of the best youtube channels that I have encountered!! Great job in engaging and more importantly caring for the TH-cam audience! I would really have the honor to meet you one day in-person!! Stay healthy and well as always! Your watch enthusiast, Nick L ❤❤❤🦖🦖🦖🇮🇹🇮🇹🇮🇹🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧⏱️⏱️⏱️
The Tissot Gentleman got me into this maddening hobby. I’ve bought a lot, sold a lot, lost money and now only have a Solar G Shock Square and a BB58 (although I know TGV isn’t a fan) and I’m ok with that. I’ve enjoyed the journey. I do think Tissot has pulled people into watches as I know a couple of people with Apple Watches and a PRX. The digital PRX is an aesthetic crime however and the Rolex availability issue combined with the ever inflating prices of Tudor, Omega and Seiko is long term commercial suicide.
Good video. Thank you for doing your comparison video with Nivad. To be honest, if you don’t like a watch, you have the right to your opinion. There’s nothing wrong in saying if a watch has cheap parts in it.
Really enjoyed this video. Im just getting into watch collecting and my budget is more in the are of Tissot right now. I like the PRX and have heard the criticism of the plastic parts. I still love the look and will enjoy it until I can get something more expensive. I'll continue to watch your videos. Any recommendations on a decent field watch to shop for?
Thinking about it, I’ve picked up two Tissot watches in recent years. The auto Gentleman and some Chrono Quartz 45mm. I’ll say this much, at the price point you can’t do better for accuracy. The powermatic 80 has been a second per day fast since day 1 which has really pissed me off as it’s outperformed my Rolex watches. Sickening. Also the quartz gives my thermo compensated Breitling Aero a run for its money. These really are class leading quality watches at the tapered end of the luxury watch spectrum. Tissot says Swiss Made and they really take pride in saying that. I’m looking at you Longines - but that’s another story.
This is a very balanced opinion piece. You're correct about the plastic parts in the PRX. Such a shame as its a very good looking watch. The plastic parts is the reason I won't buy one. For the money there's definitely better out there.
From the standpoint of a follower for 10 years, I can say that TGV is completely independent. His reviews are among the truly independent and he is always reflective and self-critical.
tgv i totally support you letting us know about your worries and concerns . swatch group to me are going down a road which is all about total consumerism, like apple with phones etc every few weeks at times the next new thing is brought out . when watches are being made unservable and with plastic or bio ceramic 😂 all its doing is making a mass demand for cheap throw away products .ive owned a junkers flieger fully titanium with the eta 2824 movement in since 2005 which cost 200 pounds , and its still going strong
Your response is pure class as always. I’ve enjoyed your channel for several years now and you never disappoint. Humble and heartfelt thanks for all you have done and continue to do for those of us in the watch collecting community. Well done 🥃
One thing that is worth saying is that the PRX is putting Tissot in a very, VERY good position for the future if it does or is planning on drafting different plans for the next two decades. Having worked in a watch store, you have no idea how many people are having a PRX as their first watch. That is a good position right now as it means sales today. That is an even more powerful position in ten, fifteen years when these people who get a PRX for their 18th birthday, their graduation, are active and in a career in about 10 years and look to go to something higher end and Tissot will be the first name they think of since it's what they have worn for all this time. Wouldn't be surprised if we see a sub-collection or branch of Tissot going upmarket the way Seiko is right now, specifically to fit that future market they could create right now. (also, if you think the "plastic escapement" of the Swatch Group is some bad news, do keep in mind that the exact same problem exists with every single maker that hopped on the "silicon hairspring" bandwagon as if invar, nivarox and all the other alloys with funny names we've had for 50 years weren't already antimagnetic enough ; and that the Richemont group has been putting silicon pallet forks in some of their movements for five years or so now. But when they do it, it's innovative tech or it's just not disclosed. All these uses of new materials aren't even about cost-cutting so much as they are about making sure repair will have to go through their own, group/brand-owned repair centers instead of independent third-party watchmakers by cutting access to these proprietary materials and parts. Swatch has been doing it forever, Rolex for even longer. This is very much about long-term. This is about monopolizing repair in 20 years and it is working, as any watchmaker that ever needed parts for a Rolex repair will tell you)
When it comes to the entry level watches I will always opt for Seiko, Orient or Citizen rather than any Swiss Made entry level watch. If I am gonna have plastic parts in my movement let it be the calendar work and not the pallet fork.
Omega once used a module movement in a chronograph once ( cant remember off hand which cal ) and it had a bad rep within the watch community. Omega also used a plastic part in its speedmaster pro 1861 movement but that wasn't a bad thing. Tissot as a fantastic history behind it and such a shame they dont go back to the good old days and start innovating again in movement tech.
I have three Tissot. The thing that drew me in was a large diversity of styles. The thing with the parts in question with the PRX is the reason I haven't pulled the trigger on one. It kinda scares me a bit. But all in all, I'm glad you made this video. It's always great to get more information. And I do thank you for all the hard work you put into your videos. Massively entertaining, Sir. Thank you.
I agree on your views. The modern Tissot (and other Swatch group) models aren't that great but like others said it can be a gateway watch to become interested in watches. For the money there's many better options. However, the PRX will always be the better choice than a smart watch or a cheap Chinese homage.
TGV, as always, you do an excellent job of conveying your thoughts, encouraging people to enjoy watch collecting. You are an asset to the community. Thank you.
So what I can sense is: if I own watch/watches from brand X and I see a negative comment on brand X (as a company), I feel like my favourite brand/model/taste/purchase decision for a subset of the brand's catalogue has been criticised Why not just buy and stand by what you like?
Tristano, It pains me that you need to justify your position. Most people salute you for being honest and to the point. When people question my integrity it is difficult not to have a response. Your response here is perfect and factual but you shouldn’t have to justify yourself. Well put. Onwards and upwards. Pip pip. Tally Bally Ho. Charlie.
Hello Charlie!! Lovely to hear from you. I hope all is well. I can't tell you how much it's great to still see you in the comments, after all these years, thank you. Onwards, upwards and safe travels my friend, chin chin 😎🍸🇬🇧 T.
My first mechanical watch was the Powermatic 80. I’ve been studying watchmaking on the side and was horrified when I took apart my Tissot to service it and found a plastic pallet fork.
Their heritage stuff (Telemeter, 1938 Chronometer, 1973 Chronograph etc) are absolutely brilliant. They've been knocking it out of the park with those.
What are your thoughts on the closing of the Lititz Watch Technicum? With such an industry wide shortage of watchmakers it's odd to see such a place close up shop, especially when they've got Rolex money behind them.
It's important to differentiate between criticism of taste, or style and criticism of the craftmanship. One is subjective and will never lead to a conclusion, the other objective. And your criticism of Tissot, the fact that they (and the Swatch group in general) want to skip certain steps, to make their watches more affordable (or rather increase their margin) is absolutely correct and also the reason why I will not buy a Tissot currently and will rather get a Citizen Tsuyosa instead of the PRX. What is the point of an Automatic watch if you can't regulate it, anyway ?
Swatch powermatic based movements (especially Hamilton H-10) are very durable and precise, even more precise than most €10,000 Rolexes... This fact is truly incredible for an entry-level movement like the Hamilton H-10/H-50...
I saw a reddit post recently and someone posted their tissot prx and posited if it was just about the best daily wearer for the money. I disagreed but didnt want to rain on their parade or list 25 microbrands, so i just continued scrolling. One of my friends bought a quartz version and i helped show him how to change and adjust the bracelet. He wanted something nice to wear out and otherwise wears a garmin smartwatch. I am fine with tissot getting people into watches, but there are so many options, even within the swatch group itself, that limiting yourself to the most obvious option is not very exciting. Swatch group push tissot, hamilton and longines heavily in the US, even to the detriment of their other brands like rado, and the captain cook is really nice.
My first Swiss watches were formal dress Certina and Omega. I am still dreaming about getting original Janeiro, although Tissot and Eterna issued similar "heritage" chrono watches in recent years.
Tissot sucks, IMHO. Never again. Learned my lesson. I owned the PRX automatic. Beautiful looking watch. Broke after one year of light use. The movement stopped completely. If I send it back to Tissot it would take six months to fix it. No thanks. Sold it 'as is' on eBay. Saving my money for my grail watch: a Breitling Navitimer, blue dial. My friend also had a PRX automatic and the watch never kept correct time. Tissot is a disposable garbage watch. Tissot vintage pieces are lovely, IMHO.
I was actually thinking about buying a Tissot as I am new into automatic watches and want to own a Swiss made watch. Their movements being so disposable just turned me off from doing that. Can you recommend us some great entry level watches that has "true" automatic movements for "manageable" prices? Thank you in advance, would also love to get a video about it from you :)
I'm firmly on your side with regard to the Powermatic 80 and derivatives used in many Swatch brands, my main objection being the removal of what was a very user friendly regulation lever/fine adjustment screw in the eta 2824. That's aside from the plastic parts, and built in obsolescence which many are claiming is now in these movements. It's telling that Tissot went back to a 2824 inside the very nice heritage chronometer recently reissued. That's a watch I'd be proud to own. Is the Powermatic 80 the answer to a non-existent problem? The success of the PRX (the integrated bracelet fad left me unimpressed) might yet come back to bite Tissot if the Powermatic 80 is as bad as some are saying. Since you mentioned Hanhart I was lucky enough to get a good deal on their flyback chronograph recently. Excellent watch.
Sir,
thank you for clarifying and to make I point I didn’t try to call you out but rather follow your line of thought in review of watches. Maybe I’ve sampled too many of your fellow watch reviewers that seem to trash certain watch brands and lumped in the critiques - some just trash choices based on who sponsors them, YOU do not!
Your reviews and heart felt enthusiasm have made a difference in helping not only myself, but others in making a choice in watches ( a co worker picked a Squale based on your recommendations and review)
Thank you once again and you are truly appreciated!
And yes “ onwards and upwards!”
Respect to you, Michael👍
Pure Class from both of you. Nice to see that people can still discuss in a respectfull maner.
The PRX has been a gateway for so many people into watch collecting and appreciation, it deserves a lot of credit for that. It has a lot of potential for future enhancements to address its shortcomings too, will be interesting to see how that is rolled out as manufacturing techniques and materials improve and become more price competitive
The Swatch of the 21st century
Yeah, I get the dismay about the 'disposability' of the PRX movements, but do we have stats on just how 'many' are breaking or needing replacement? I mean, they might be plastic - but are they really breaking that often? Not defending or attacking, would genuinely like to know...
Agree. It is a unique watch in this sector of the market and has the stand-out design that Tissot needed to appeal to newbies/fashion-conscious buyers. Swiss brand, affordable, cool retro styling, bridges the sporty/dressy divide, huge range, good quality for not a lot of money. I could go on. OK, they are in danger of pushing things too far like they did with the Visodate but that is usually the case with a successful formula. Mine is a 35mm quartz mid-blue dial and owning quite a few Tissots, some of them going back to the 1990s, I would say the PRX is one of their best models for many years.
@@NazidKimmie Good point, plastic in mechanical watch movements may not be the issue it is being made out to be. Plastic is replacing metal in most things from car engines to gas boilers to lawnmowers to save weight, cost etc., most of it out of sight and out of mind. Plastic is widely used in quartz watch gear trains with no problems. Yes there is more force exerted in a mechanical movement, but if the engineering is competent and backed up with appropriate R&D then to me it isn't necessarily a big negative.
In a weird way, the PRX was my gateway watch... but I never bought one. I was somewhat indifferent until the PRXs looks caught my eye in a department store, I tried it on and hated the way it looked on my wrist. That set me on a mission to find a watch I truly liked... and I haven't stopped finding since
I recently got interested in watches again after a 10 year hiatus, and once again have gravitated toward your channel. Your critiques have always been sensible, and you present a wide variety of watches without the feeling of being a storefront for the latest hyped watches.
🙌🙌🙌🙌
That makes it all worth it, welcome back to the greatest (if sometime a tad frustrating) hobby.
I deeply appreciate the support and inspiring words, onwards, upwards, and best regards,
TGV
I own a lot of watches, from cheap to luxury. I own a PRX and for the price I am not bothered by the plastic pallet fork and escapement. The argument seems to be that the movement is disposable and that this somehow diminishes the profession of watch making and repair. I find that to be a terribly weak argument. Other than simple regulation, who repairs seiko movements? There are Seiko offerings in the same price range as the PRX that use NH 35 and 36 movements. I assure you, if I send it out for repair on the gear train, more than likely they will replace the movement entirely. This is not some new phenomenon with Tissot watches. I would bet that if a watch that is under a grand needs repairs, a good percentage of the time they are going to swap the movement. I expect that in some rare cases even brands like Breitling, Tudor, or Omega do this. If a lower cost company like Tissot does it, I am fine with it.
Tudor has been known to swap movements but TGV won't say anything about that. I think ultimately people want to seem edgy and contrarian, even if the points they are making aren't actual points.
True mate i agree with everything you said, some people just look too much into it and re obsessed with specs , a fuckin plastic part somewhere in a movement in a cheap watch such as a prx powermatic 80 lol . I own a prx 40mm pm80 in my collection of various watches and its just a super fun watch with amazing light play and looks gorgeous in all angles and is a joy to wear! Couldn’t care less about the accuracy or some random low quality parts or the movement being replaced in service, at the end of the day i just want to have a watch that’s working fine and looks great !
I agree with you completely. Why are we holding Tissot to the standards of luxury watches or Haute Horology? Tissot is clearly the brand for the masses and they are currently the best budget brand in the Swatch group IMO as they have a clear direction and intention with their offerings. When we buy the PRX, it's definitely for how it looks and feels on the wrist, not the spec sheet. If I want a watch that has been carefully made with the utmost care and precision with great materials and finishing on the movement, I know I won't be looking at a Tissot nor be able to comfortably afford it anyway. There's a reason why A Lange & Sohne, JLC, VC, Patek Philippe, Moser and many others could charge so much for their offerings. They know people are willing to pay for good materials made by good hands. Tissot is not that at all.
100%. It’s all well and good to support craftsmanship and the watchmaking art; however, the economic reality is if a sub-$1000 USD watch malfunctions after the warranty , it’s not cost effective to fix the movement no matter what it’s built with. At modern watchmaker labor prices, it’ll cost more than the sub-$1000 watch’s worth just to diagnose the problem- to say nothing of additional money to fix it! If the movement is not cost effective to fix , plastic or metal parts content becomes irrelevant.
My take in the suden PRX hate is a three factor issue.
1. The are better options (weak argument, The twelve for instance is twice as good for twice the price).
2. The flood of 70s style with integrated bracelets watches that keeps coming (kind of anoying to be honest)
3. TH-camr's need for clout content, slandering a watch that was praised by all generate clicks (this I hate).
I have spoken to a former manager of GO. She told me, Hayek kids lost the plot completely and they do not have the competence to run the watch brands properly. The former GO manager now works for A Lange und Söhne.
I could see his point.
The shares falling 7% a year on average for a decade is proof of that.
What is GO? And what is Hayek kids?
Think he means Glashutte. And Hayek are the owners of the group. Weird how a store manager would have insight on a billionaire’s strategy.
If true it is a shame I love some of the products Glasshutte Original puts out.
Thanks for sharing your opinions on the PRX TGV! Have a great week 👍
The plastic parts in the prx movement turned me off on it. And it encouraged me to do even more research before buying something "automatic".
GOOD THINKING!
The Seiko NH34 movement for 50 Euros does not use plastic parts.
So pumped for another TGV video! Nothing like that theme song to take away my office job blues!
TGV, the better question to ask is...which season of Blackadder was your favorite? I personally adore the first season the most (loved them all, really)...yet, very few can deny how hard hitting "Blackadder goes forth" was, especially the final episode.
Quality commentary on your part, as always.
I wasn’t a massive fan of Blackadder but did watch them and they were very funny, the ending of the last series when they go over the top of the trench, bloody hell that was heartbreaking, a very funny comedy to end like that was extremely powerful, i remember watching it and thinking that would have actually happened, blokes joking in the trenches with their mates and then…….🌺
I came here to watch Blackadder...
During 2022-2023 due to the bidding frenzy of the bubble, most established watch brands jacked up their prices-often double or even more-with the idea that the more expensive the better. Now with the bubble deflating and a soft economy on the horizon, I think that a lot of these brands may end of in some trouble as the masses begin to look for value for money again-not just an inflated price tag.
Agreed they got out if hand with the increases. I think soon stuggle to sell soon. I'm out of the game now I want a Seiko 5 for £200 and a higher level up Seiko for £500/£600 rrp. I want a Hamilton field watch for £600 rrp not £1000
The problem with powermatic 80 movement is plenty of variations. Entry level powermatic 80 is ending 111 - usually have plastic parts and 23 jewels.
However version ending 6 or 8 doesn’t e.g. “Gentlemen” or “Ballade”.
I like what MIDO does with powermatic 80 movements, they only use versions with regular escapement and minimum 25 jewels (so version 6 and 8), then their regulate those movements to COSC standards.
Regards!
Great video, the powermatic 80 movement is a very controversial subject, I have a Certina Ds Action Diver in 43mm with the powermatic 80, and a cw trident with the sellita sw200-1 in it. Both watches are on par in terms of quality. I do find the powermatic to have amazing accuracy and this is probably due to the fact how the movement is regulated at the factory. Also not all powermatic 80 movements use plastic parts. I believe certina use a all metal version of the powermatic 80 with a Nivachron balance spring. Even with the powermatic 80 the certina is a fantastic tool watch and is accurate to under -1 second a day. I look forward to seeing your next video keep up the great work.
TGV, another great vid. I agree. If Tissot and other Swiss brands continue on this path many true watch enthusiasts will switch gears and start collecting more hand made boutique brands, as well as vintage. Hopefully Tissot is taking note. On another note, I picked up my 3861 Hesalite Speedy from Leah at MOYER’s this afternoon. We had a conversation about you. Hopefully you are planning another visit. I would really enjoy meeting you in person. It is amazing how many things we have in common. Please keep up the great great work. I always enjoy that new vid from you…..
What "hand made boutique brands" are Tissot consumers going to switch to? 50 grand+ Pateks and Vacherons? Because I promise you nothing below that price range is really handmade and boutique. Collectors who actually spend money in this industry are not affected by Tissot's brand strategy in the slightest because they collect Rolexes (not handmade or boutique either btw), APs etc. They also don't care about silly crap like regulating their own movements (since Rolex uses the same regulation method as the PM80 lol) or plastic components (like the nylon bushings in Rolex calibers). The "true enthusiasts" you're thinking about, i.e. forum nerds who want to play collectors on a consumer budget don't matter, they're a tiny pimple on the proverbial backside that is swatch group's revenue. The casual consumer is who counts for entry level brands and the fact that such people still even know analog/mechanical watches exist in 2024 is a miracle that was almost single-handedly made possible by the the swatch group and especially Tissot. I mean, of course it wouldn't be doable in the first place if Rolex wasn't propping up the whole industry by keeping the wrist watch in mass consciousness as a cool object/gift/jewelerry, but the PRX is definitely the new SKX in that it reminded the average consumer, the smartwatch buyer, that a watch they can afford can be desirable. None of the Chinese junk TGV gushes about like the Nivada he "reviewed" (read: advertised) recently would even exist without the PRX or at least you wouldn't have heard about it. I don't even own a PRX but it's silly not to recognise its positive impact.
Followed your advice TGV and got a thin vintage dress watch, a cushion case 1972 Seiko LordMatic and put it on leather. Incredibly understated and elegant for the office.
👏👏👏👏👏 That is so cool to hear.
Thank you for sharing that, enjoy!
Best regards,
TGV
Very good choice of watch. Elegance personified.
Kudos to you for not conducting paid reviews. You might be the only Watch TH-camr I’m aware of. Always enjoy your sincere objectivity. 🥂
That’s why I’m a Sinn fan!
These videos never being advertisements and always speaking the truth and just your honest perspectives is why your channel is just pure class and will keep succeeding and keep your fans around long term.
Hi TGV, I totally agree with your perspective on the plastic escapement in the Tissot PRX with the eta C07.111 movement. I have owned the Tissot PRX and it was a lovely watch, I just couldn't get past the plastic escapement!
I also owned the Hamilton Khaki Field Mechanical, with the H10 movement (based on the eta C07.611 movement) the difference is both these watches is that the Hamilton field watch doesn't feature a plastic escapement, it is the regular pallet fork and stones in that one 😉
I'm a long time follower of the channel and really enjoy the content, onwards and upwards ⌚️
No disrespect, but how does it having a plastic escapement affect your wearing experience in literally any way? If it was a lovely watch then you'd...just wear it and enjoy it?
I love this channel precisely because it’s unbiased and doesn’t just tell us what we want to hear about the same watches all the time.
I find it odd that folks routinely say that the $400 Tissot PRX with its cheapened movement with some plastic parts is a "bargain". One can find full metal watches for less than that. I guess that that Tissot name is work a big premium.
I think it makes sense to fit these modular movements in entry level mechanical watches. Because the service costs is so high compared to buying new, many entry level mechanical watches will end up in the trash instead of getting a service. Watchmakers time on servicing entry level mechanical watches need to be lower. If you own 5-10 entry level mechanical watches you’re sitting on a quite large maintenance debt.
In the end, in regards to which watch brands or styles you like to wear, you take other people's opinions, do your research, experience them, then find the best ones for you. I have watched many watch youtubers' vids but have never found one like TGV who deeply cares about what he says and does thorough research about each watch he introduces. I have a different taste than him, but it has been nothing helpful for me to think about what I need and what I want to make wise decisions.
A true gentleman knows how to communicate without bitterness, yet only with respect and honesty. TGV is showing a good example of it and I believe that is why people love him. Much respect to you, sir. Keep up the good work!
3:27 Hamilton does not use the ETA C07.111 23 jewel movement with the plastic escapement. Hamilton H series calibers retain the 25 jewel traditional escapement.
2824?
@@popomomo12 2824 based. with a reduced beat rate and the P80 regulator/balance wheel setup
@@tailsneon556 just got a new old stock pr100 with the eta 2824, love it so far
Yes please people up vote this so there is a slight chance TGV sees this. Because it's obvious that he believes that all watches with Powermatic 80 are the same but its not true, they have different grades based on the price point of the watch.
Can you make a series with Hugo ? I love the character , deserves his own show
Hi TGV, I recently asked Certina about the powermatic 80 in their DS Super PH1000, they said the below:
Please be advised that there are no plastic parts in the Powermatic 80.611 movement, I can confirm that this is one of our most popular movements and more and more new models will contain this.
This movement is fully serviceable and will be for many years to come.
i can’t really talk about the powermatic 80 in the Tissot watches, but it’s cousin in the hamilton watches I own also have an advanced laser regulated escapement (but all metal parts as far as I know). Yes, I can’t regulate it myself but to be honest, i set the 3 of them on sunday (a 42 mm Khaki Murph, a Kaki Pilot day date and a Jazz performer), on this wednesday morning, the murph and the jazz performer have less than 2 seconds deviation, and the Day date have 2 seconds deviation. So far they seem to stay within COSC tolerances and I must say except for most of my quartz watches they are the most precise watches I own. I said most because I have a vintage russian електроника -1 watch (with a led display that stays on for a second or two to display the time) that runs too fast due to the slightly higher voltage of modern batteries and gains a few seconds a day.
There are different powermatic variants, 3 i believe. The ones they use in the PRX have plastic parts, gentleman i believe has all metal ones.
Those Hamiltons all have 25 jewel variants with normal escapements. The only difference from an ETA 2824 is the reduced beat rate and the P80 regulator/balance. No plastic.
@@tailsneon556the escapement cannot be set like a « normal » one it has no slow/fast lever the balance wheel is balanced using a laser, you can’t do it yourself.
@@MrTchou They are capable of being regulated. The process is just different.
@@tailsneon556yes, by moving the screws on the balance wheel but you might admit it’s not as easy as changing the spring length with a lever.
10:00 getting offended when someone criticises what you love means that you don't really love it? Would that mean that I don't love my wife if I got offended if someone criticised her, or my son, or my football club, or my country etc? The implication that I get offended because of a lack of love, I disagree with.
I see getting offended as a defence mechanism over what I perceive as an attack on myself, where me means identity, where what I identify with, is the things and people that I have the most attachment towards, commonly known as love.
This is the only thing I don't agree with, from your answer and to me it does not support nor contradict any of the, otherwise, lovely arguments, from your answer.
Always love your videos! Cheers!
Expecting a fight with that stone island on
Fisticuffs sorry
🤣🤣🤣🤣 Let's ave'it!!!!!
Thank you,
Best regards,
TGV
Yes my friend we must never forget how very British TGV is. I guarantee you he goes to sleep every night only after smoking the finest tobacco drinking the finest tea and brandy and then ready charge of the light brigade. He then wakes up every morning crying out the name of Saint George very British 😎
I do think Swatch should be applauded for the Tissot PRX as it has got so many interested in the practice of maintaining a wristwatch
@@OscarOSullivan😂
TGV, your criticism is always fair, objective and constructive. I expect Tissot is listening. Their new 1938 COSC line hints at that. At its price point, automation is a necessity. They are left having to focus on design, which they’ve done amazingly in the Gentleman, PRX, Seastar, Telemeter…. They’ve much to improve upon, however. They ruined the beloved Visodate, their new GMT offering is clown sized and two thirds of their other offerings are either hideous or forgettable. No time to rest Tissot!
Thanks for another informative and interesting video. I appreciate your independent stance and balanced views, on the watches you experience. Watching your work helps make being a watch enthusiast more enjoyable.
Absolutely ❤ my Tissot PRX
Everytime I hear your intro my love for watch collecting is renewed it brings out the romance and all the desire that comes from owning a watch with history and style. Thank you for that.
The PRX 35 quartz ice blue dial is amazing.💙
Yeah loving the Swiss quartz... but really in this day and age.. no solar power...really?
@@NazidKimmie not a big deal I think solar power only if the Citizen Tsuyosa is 35 mm that gone be the winner quartz/automatic.
Bought my significant other this exact same model for her birthday, she loves it!
This is the one to get.
Bought this for my wife!
Agree totally. No plastic parts. No modular movements. Train people for these valuable watchmaker jobs. Thanks for your content.
Honestly, my biggest issue with the movement is they sacrificed second hand sweep smoothness {which is one of my major attractions to mechanical watches) for power reserve. For watches designed to be worn mostly as daily timepieces, how much power reserve do you really need?
A fantastic video as always. Please can you do an update regarding your PAM0048. I remember you were selling off your collection including your Explorer and wondered whether you were still enjoying it as much? I have my 40th coming up soon and am deciding between the Explorer 36 and a 40mm PAM so your insight would be great having owned both. I posed the question on the Facebook group and everyone was very kind offering advice. J
Their quartz stuff is great 😃 as for their version of the Powematic 80, we'll know for sure in 25 years 😅
I wonder if a regular 2824-2 would swap in directly: hands, dial feet... The cost of a movement isn't much more than a service.
How many of us really do send our watches for regulation? I'm might be wrong, but I heard that the PRX is laser regulated from the factory (please don't quote me on that) and that should count some way. Let's say you have a Rolex and want to regulate.... How much it's going to cost you? The price of a PRX maybe? Sometimes way more. My uncle sent his Rolex Date just to see why it was loosing 20 minutes a day. They came up with a sequential replacement part list to fix the poor thing, that would get it back in shape for 1,400 dollars. All things considered, you put your money wherever you see fit. My Son asked me for the PRX auto when it was released. He wears it everyday and says it keeps great time. Win, win.
They've already been around for over 10 years. So far so good.
Their quartz stuff isn't great whatsoever.
@@robert-jason-king it would, for example the Hamilton Khaki field used a 2824 until about 2016 I think. A SW-200-1 and a LJP G100 would also work
Im curious what you think about the plastic escapement on the powermatic 80. I've read that it's a high grade synthetic material that also self lubricates.
Got the Stone Island on, just in case it properly kicked off 😎 thank you as always TGV 💪🏼
Another great video and a pleasure to watch. I live the David Niven look, take care of the mustache.
TGV old chap. One has been following your wonderful channel since its Inception.
You have always been open and honest with your reviews.
Your reviews are informative and entertaining.
You and your channel are pure class. Keep doing what you do.
Onwards and Upwards old chap.
Thanks TGV for another thought provoking and interesting video. Just a few thoughts in response.
1) Mechanisation is not a issue exclusive to watch making. It is a death knell of almost every craft, skill and service once performed expertly by humans. It's one of the prices of capitalism the world over. Profit over people.
2) If you talk about brands like Tissot diluting and endangering the skill of watch making - then for me, equal blame has to be laid at the feet of the big, luxury watch brands who have made their products completely unobtainable for 99% of people who wear a watch in the world. Again, all in the name of profit, not watch making.
If the likes of Rolex, AP, PP et al were not charging such mark ups on their products (approx $1.5bn profit for rolex in 2016 - wow, and for such a small percentage of the watch buying public) that wouldn't in turn drive companies like Swatch to make affordable homages to keep up with all the Rolex hype and publicity.
If the watch industry goes under, it will only have itself to blame for eating itself alive, IMO.
A few very different thoughts spontaneously came to mind about your video today. When the many well-known or less well-known watch brands release new models, which is not a bad thing, then I constantly hear or read about Sellita movements. Sellita and ETA are of course rock-solid watch movements, but I sometimes think that it would be nice if the older brands in particular also built their own movements, like they used to do. I'm thinking, for example, of Longines, whose history I really like. But that's why I particularly appreciate brands like Glashütte-Original or Jaeger LeCoultre or Girard-Perregaux, which have remained true to their tradition. My list is of course incomplete. But with the pursuit of this, watchmaking would continue to have a future.
I love the analytical emotive mix you bring to your reviews. Im only just over 2 years down the enthusiast rabbit hole but find your content informative and instructive. Long may it continue.
TGV ! I have a genuine question for you. Why do you think Tissot uses polymer (plastic) to make the pallet fork and escapement?
Don’t you think it’s easier to just use steel or brass, as the rest of the movement is made from either steel or brass?
Do you think Tissot is trying to cut cost? How much can Tissot save by using polymer to make these two tiny parts instead of brass/steel. Neither polymer or brass/steel are expensive materials.
Why don’t you spend a few minutes, do some research and think why?
I look forward to your educated reply. And then I will give you my perspective.
Don’t always believe what you hear or read on the internet. Independent and critical thinking are important.
Just love your videos and your thoughtful insights into watches... thanks for sharing your knowledge, with us. John
Really enjoyed this short-form video. Maybe a weekly 10min news piece could be a regular segment?
I know the longer format takes time with all the editing and research, so perhaps this could work if it takes less time to produce?
My first Swiss was also a quartz Tissot V8 from 20 plus years ago - I still have the thing too lol. Best as always sir !
I am considering it. I'm not sure why but it just pains me a little to make videos like this simplistic, I'm always trying to up my game, but you are absolutely right, far less time consuming and stressful.
Thank you, duly noted.
Best regards,
TGV
Good video TGV. I have Tissot Quadrato (the Monaco look-a-like) i got in late 2000s, that was my gateway into watches. Still enjoy wearing it now
My first mechanical ⚙️ Swiss watch was the Tissot Telemeter 1938 black and gold dial with the ETA 7750 chronograph movement. I have had the watch for over a year and I still love it. I think the quality is great.
I own a pre-Powermatic 80 Visodate, and I honestly prefer having the standard ETA movement in there. The extended power reserve isn't worth having the plastic components, reduced beat rate, lack of traditional regulation, and difficulty with servicing imo.
Same reason my Tissot Automatics iii with its 2436-2 is my last Tissot. Nearly everything else they have now is one of those dreadful powermatics. Unfortunately the same goes for Longines now as well, I wanted either a Conquest or Hydroconquest but they are powermatics now too...
Among the many youtubers that talk about watches, there is one that stands above them all -TGV! You have my respect for offering such an exquisite and unaltered opinion on everything related to wrist watches!
I am torn on this one, on one hand the plastic escapement feels like a corporate corner cut but on the other hand I haven't seen enough factual data to identify the long term effects of this aside from the displeasure of knowing it is there. Is there a large pool of data to say it performs any worse between services? In the same way Tag use plastic movement spacers, which lots of us don't like but - but in effect the job of securing the movement in the case is still performed effectively.
Modern commercial aircraft skin is constructed of composite and we don't miss aluminium as far as performance, in fact it performs better allowing for higher cabin pressure and a lighter fuselage and so ultimately more efficiency...but it is more difficult to repair when the time comes.
Back to watches, I totally agree on the sentimental side - knowing the parts that were there when you bought the watch can still be in it exactly as they were piece for piece with basic maintenance every decade....that is something that disposable plastic parts cannot provide in the current Swatch group form.
Good points made there.
But not very accurate!
@@davidcrandall4958explain?
Well said, TGV. Everyone likes different things. My grail may be laughed at by someone else and vice versa. Wear what you love.
I bet in you past life you are a spitfire pilot, you give me that vibe.
It’s gotta be the pencil moustache!
I own the PRX Chrono, very beautiful. I love Tissot and love the regular PRX, I handled many and would recommend it to anyone. I think you’re too harsh on it T, its fair to say the Swissmatic movement was an issue, but not the Powermatic IMHO
To be fair too.. the other powermatic range (non PRX) are using the slightly different ETA movement without the plastic, so there's that
Tissot makes watches for non watch enthusiasts. A lot of people just want a watch that looks good, is reliable, and has an attractive price point. That's it. Some people really like the mechanical ins and outs of watches. Hey, if you like paying $200/hr shop time to have a watchmaker maintain a watch rock on. Congradulations on your lucrative career that gives you that kind of disposable income.
Thanks TGV for following up on this opinion. I have a Tissot Gentlemen that I love. I really appreciated your insight about the movement and overall opinions into what the swatch group is doing but in the end, I just love the watch for the way it looks and wears on my 7.5 inch wrist. It's such a great GADA watch at a fantastic price. Keep up the great work sir!
Before even checking your channel , I read about the plastic and changed my decision.
You are absolutely correct, tgv, as you are supporting my thought.
Basically, i am still yet to find a proper good Swiss auto watch under $500.
Impartiality, integrity and genuinely honest. That is why I am a subscriber to this channel. TGV would admit a mistake or error and is not trying to sell a product.
BTW, I have long noticed a "Ran" poster in the background....Anyone who is a fan of AK is truly cultured.
Hello TGV,
I just wanted to say thank you so much for everything that you do!! I wish more TH-camrs be like you so focused on the comments and so attentive at explaining the ins and outs of the comments as well as breaking it piece by piece to get closer to the truth! I definitely agree with you on the new powermatic 80 movement since I currently own a Tissot with that movement. As efficient as it is in terms of power reserve and performing accurate timekeeping I don’t feel as attached to it as my Glycine watch! I feel that it lacks personality and longevity! It just doesn’t feel the same compared with the Glycine! The fact that you can’t even service it is also a big downside like you mentioned!
Thank you so much TGV again for everything that you do! You are one of the best youtube channels that I have encountered!! Great job in engaging and more importantly caring for the TH-cam audience!
I would really have the honor to meet you one day in-person!!
Stay healthy and well as always!
Your watch enthusiast, Nick L ❤❤❤🦖🦖🦖🇮🇹🇮🇹🇮🇹🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧⏱️⏱️⏱️
Got my 25 yr old daughter a large tissot chronograph blue faced quartz. She loves it and gets tons compliments on it. A solid brand for what they are.
The Tissot Gentleman got me into this maddening hobby. I’ve bought a lot, sold a lot, lost money and now only have a Solar G Shock Square and a BB58 (although I know TGV isn’t a fan) and I’m ok with that. I’ve enjoyed the journey. I do think Tissot has pulled people into watches as I know a couple of people with Apple Watches and a PRX. The digital PRX is an aesthetic crime however and the Rolex availability issue combined with the ever inflating prices of Tudor, Omega and Seiko is long term commercial suicide.
Good video. Thank you for doing your comparison video with Nivad. To be honest, if you don’t like a watch, you have the right to your opinion. There’s nothing wrong in saying if a watch has cheap parts in it.
Really enjoyed this video. Im just getting into watch collecting and my budget is more in the are of Tissot right now. I like the PRX and have heard the criticism of the plastic parts. I still love the look and will enjoy it until I can get something more expensive. I'll continue to watch your videos. Any recommendations on a decent field watch to shop for?
Perhaps we should think of two classes of Swiss watches: industrial and artisanal.
Genius idea, thank you.
Best regards,
TGV
Thinking about it, I’ve picked up two Tissot watches in recent years. The auto Gentleman and some Chrono Quartz 45mm. I’ll say this much, at the price point you can’t do better for accuracy. The powermatic 80 has been a second per day fast since day 1 which has really pissed me off as it’s outperformed my Rolex watches. Sickening. Also the quartz gives my thermo compensated Breitling Aero a run for its money. These really are class leading quality watches at the tapered end of the luxury watch spectrum. Tissot says Swiss Made and they really take pride in saying that. I’m looking at you Longines - but that’s another story.
This is a very balanced opinion piece. You're correct about the plastic parts in the PRX. Such a shame as its a very good looking watch. The plastic parts is the reason I won't buy one. For the money there's definitely better out there.
From the standpoint of a follower for 10 years, I can say that TGV is completely independent. His reviews are among the truly independent and he is always reflective and self-critical.
tgv i totally support you letting us know about your worries and concerns . swatch group to me are going down a road which is all about total consumerism, like apple with phones etc every few weeks at times the next new thing is brought out . when watches are being made unservable and with plastic or bio ceramic 😂 all its doing is making a mass demand for cheap throw away products .ive owned a junkers flieger fully titanium with the eta 2824 movement in since 2005 which cost 200 pounds , and its still going strong
original watcher from your 1st videos greatest content sharpest wit and easily the most honest reviews.
Your response is pure class as always. I’ve enjoyed your channel for several years now and you never disappoint. Humble and heartfelt thanks for all you have done and continue to do for those of us in the watch collecting community. Well done 🥃
One thing that is worth saying is that the PRX is putting Tissot in a very, VERY good position for the future if it does or is planning on drafting different plans for the next two decades.
Having worked in a watch store, you have no idea how many people are having a PRX as their first watch. That is a good position right now as it means sales today. That is an even more powerful position in ten, fifteen years when these people who get a PRX for their 18th birthday, their graduation, are active and in a career in about 10 years and look to go to something higher end and Tissot will be the first name they think of since it's what they have worn for all this time.
Wouldn't be surprised if we see a sub-collection or branch of Tissot going upmarket the way Seiko is right now, specifically to fit that future market they could create right now.
(also, if you think the "plastic escapement" of the Swatch Group is some bad news, do keep in mind that the exact same problem exists with every single maker that hopped on the "silicon hairspring" bandwagon as if invar, nivarox and all the other alloys with funny names we've had for 50 years weren't already antimagnetic enough ; and that the Richemont group has been putting silicon pallet forks in some of their movements for five years or so now. But when they do it, it's innovative tech or it's just not disclosed. All these uses of new materials aren't even about cost-cutting so much as they are about making sure repair will have to go through their own, group/brand-owned repair centers instead of independent third-party watchmakers by cutting access to these proprietary materials and parts. Swatch has been doing it forever, Rolex for even longer. This is very much about long-term. This is about monopolizing repair in 20 years and it is working, as any watchmaker that ever needed parts for a Rolex repair will tell you)
I own a Mido ocean star tribute. Does anyone know if their Caliber 80 movement is different to the Powermatic 80?
There are some minor differences that I can't recall offhand, but they are essentially the same.
Quartz prx and the newer sideral are pure class.
Prefer the quartz over powermatic.
@@durbanpoison100 totally agree. Feels closer to the original and less royal oak wanna be
When it comes to the entry level watches I will always opt for Seiko, Orient or Citizen rather than any Swiss Made entry level watch. If I am gonna have plastic parts in my movement let it be the calendar work and not the pallet fork.
What do you think of the PRX quartz watches? are those perhaps more honest along with being even more affordable ?
Omega once used a module movement in a chronograph once ( cant remember off hand which cal ) and it had a bad rep within the watch community. Omega also used a plastic part in its speedmaster pro 1861 movement but that wasn't a bad thing. Tissot as a fantastic history behind it and such a shame they dont go back to the good old days and start innovating again in movement tech.
I have three Tissot. The thing that drew me in was a large diversity of styles. The thing with the parts in question with the PRX is the reason I haven't pulled the trigger on one. It kinda scares me a bit. But all in all, I'm glad you made this video. It's always great to get more information. And I do thank you for all the hard work you put into your videos. Massively entertaining, Sir. Thank you.
I agree on your views. The modern Tissot (and other Swatch group) models aren't that great but like others said it can be a gateway watch to become interested in watches. For the money there's many better options. However, the PRX will always be the better choice than a smart watch or a cheap Chinese homage.
Great video TGV, love the way you tactfully and respectfully responded to a follower! Well done!
TGV, as always, you do an excellent job of conveying your thoughts, encouraging people to enjoy watch collecting. You are an asset to the community.
Thank you.
What a unexpected treat so quickly TGV you should have a patron option I bet people will pay for this level of pure entertainment and insight
The new green and ice blue blue Gentlemen Tissots are very nice looking watches.
So what I can sense is:
if I own watch/watches from brand X and I see a negative comment on brand X (as a company), I feel like my favourite brand/model/taste/purchase decision for a subset of the brand's catalogue has been criticised
Why not just buy and stand by what you like?
PRX? I love it!
Tristano,
It pains me that you need to justify your position. Most people salute you for being honest and to the point.
When people question my integrity it is difficult not to have a response.
Your response here is perfect and factual but you shouldn’t have to justify yourself.
Well put. Onwards and upwards. Pip pip.
Tally Bally Ho.
Charlie.
Hello Charlie!! Lovely to hear from you. I hope all is well. I can't tell you how much it's great to still see you in the comments, after all these years, thank you. Onwards, upwards and safe travels my friend, chin chin
😎🍸🇬🇧
T.
@@theurbangentry all well thanks! I’m always watching! Just rarely have anything to say as you always cover everything so comprehensively! 😂
My first mechanical watch was the Powermatic 80. I’ve been studying watchmaking on the side and was horrified when I took apart my Tissot to service it and found a plastic pallet fork.
Their heritage stuff (Telemeter, 1938 Chronometer, 1973 Chronograph etc) are absolutely brilliant. They've been knocking it out of the park with those.
What are your thoughts on the closing of the Lititz Watch Technicum? With such an industry wide shortage of watchmakers it's odd to see such a place close up shop, especially when they've got Rolex money behind them.
Wonderful content and superb editing as always.
Ohh and the LJP G100 can fit into the 2824 footprint (any Powematic 80 movement) as can the SW-200-1 😁
It's important to differentiate between criticism of taste, or style and criticism of the craftmanship. One is subjective and will never lead to a conclusion, the other objective. And your criticism of Tissot, the fact that they (and the Swatch group in general) want to skip certain steps, to make their watches more affordable (or rather increase their margin) is absolutely correct and also the reason why I will not buy a Tissot currently and will rather get a Citizen Tsuyosa instead of the PRX. What is the point of an Automatic watch if you can't regulate it, anyway ?
Swatch powermatic based movements (especially Hamilton H-10) are very durable and precise, even more precise than most €10,000 Rolexes... This fact is truly incredible for an entry-level movement like the Hamilton H-10/H-50...
I saw a reddit post recently and someone posted their tissot prx and posited if it was just about the best daily wearer for the money. I disagreed but didnt want to rain on their parade or list 25 microbrands, so i just continued scrolling. One of my friends bought a quartz version and i helped show him how to change and adjust the bracelet. He wanted something nice to wear out and otherwise wears a garmin smartwatch. I am fine with tissot getting people into watches, but there are so many options, even within the swatch group itself, that limiting yourself to the most obvious option is not very exciting. Swatch group push tissot, hamilton and longines heavily in the US, even to the detriment of their other brands like rado, and the captain cook is really nice.
My first Swiss watches were formal dress Certina and Omega. I am still dreaming about getting original Janeiro, although Tissot and Eterna issued similar "heritage" chrono watches in recent years.
Tissot sucks, IMHO. Never again. Learned my lesson. I owned the PRX automatic. Beautiful looking watch. Broke after one year of light use. The movement stopped completely. If I send it back to Tissot it would take six months to fix it. No thanks. Sold it 'as is' on eBay. Saving my money for my grail watch: a Breitling Navitimer, blue dial. My friend also had a PRX automatic and the watch never kept correct time. Tissot is a disposable garbage watch. Tissot vintage pieces are lovely, IMHO.
I was actually thinking about buying a Tissot as I am new into automatic watches and want to own a Swiss made watch. Their movements being so disposable just turned me off from doing that. Can you recommend us some great entry level watches that has "true" automatic movements for "manageable" prices? Thank you in advance, would also love to get a video about it from you :)
Being a huge quartz fan, I like Tissot since they offer a good range of quartz options.
Great point about quartz, very true. Thank you.
Best regards,
TGV
I'm firmly on your side with regard to the Powermatic 80 and derivatives used in many Swatch brands, my main objection being the removal of what was a very user friendly regulation lever/fine adjustment screw in the eta 2824. That's aside from the plastic parts, and built in obsolescence which many are claiming is now in these movements. It's telling that Tissot went back to a 2824 inside the very nice heritage chronometer recently reissued. That's a watch I'd be proud to own. Is the Powermatic 80 the answer to a non-existent problem? The success of the PRX (the integrated bracelet fad left me unimpressed) might yet come back to bite Tissot if the Powermatic 80 is as bad as some are saying. Since you mentioned Hanhart I was lucky enough to get a good deal on their flyback chronograph recently. Excellent watch.
I do love my Tissot Gentleman Powermatic as it's the crown jewel of my collection.