Canyon's $1,200 Stoic Review: Ready For Almost Everything | 2021 Pinkbike Field Trip
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 31 ก.ค. 2024
- Canyon has put together an incredibly impressive package with the Stoic for just $1,200 USD, but how well does it perform on the trails? Mike Levy and Sarah Moore put the Stoic through its paces on the Sunshine Coast.
Note: The model is called the Stoic 2 in all markets outside the USA. Canyon released it as the Stoic 3 in America, however, in a week’s time Canyon USA will also adopt the “Stoic 2”, so that the names are the same in all markets.
0:00 - Intro
4:13 - Setup
4:52 - Climbing
6:59 - Descending
9:20 - Components
12:17 - Pros
12:53 - Cons
13:31 - Verdict
More 2021 Field Trip: pinkbike.link/2021fieldtrip
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Great to see the bike industry making stuff available to many more people.
They are putting bike shop out of business because you can’t buy Canyon bike in store
Well bike shops make a lot of money off of repairs for customers not only selling bikes and not many companies are direct to consumer so the bike shops will all ways be in business.
Ya
@@shwinner8714 I don't think bike shops make much money at all from bike sells.
@@EthanAdey nah people will continue to buy from good shops, bad jobs will go under tho
Bike companies want consumers to think that $3000+ is entry level...I hope this bike makes more people realize this isn't true.
Well if you want carbon or full sus
@@ark8tct Technically bikes are getting more advanced (front suspension, etc.), which kind of warrants higher prices. However, I have no doubt that bike manufacturers are taking a big slice for profits.
You can find pretty good rigid dirt jumpers around 875 (COVID has made prices much higher, the same rigid GT dirt jumper used to be 800). Assuming a 20%/decade inflation rate, prices have increased ~20% for a pretty decent dirt jumper.
If you want a dirt jumper with a good fork, you will have to pay the price for it as good budget dirt jumper forks somehow don't exist (or at least aren't specced often)
$3k is a good entry point for full suspension aluminum. What you get for $3k aluminum these days can be a really good value, but yes it’s expensive.
This is a game of skill and fun, and I think the industry doesn’t always tell you that. A hardtail like this with some upgrades would suit a very large percentage of riders.
But there will still be 95% of buyers thinking that you need such bikes and those prices are normal. That one needs 150 mm of travel front and back to ride over 30cm of roots..... It's absurd. It's becoming more about the bikes than just riding and having fun. Plus you become way better rider with a hardtail than a fully in its core. Sure it does limit you after you peaked. But none of us will be Nico Vinks or Thomas Vanderhams....
Bro my bike is full carbon has fox suss and is gx 12 speed all for 3000$ with 3000 you can get a dream bike if you know what your doing
To be clear, in Europe this is the Canyon Stoic 2 and is priced at £850 or €1000. It is the same bike just has a different name
For me it says 850€ soooo?
£950 now :(
Not worth it in the UK for just under a grand. Several better options at that price.
@@rescyn1190 I know right, I'm planning on going with the Vitus nucleus but the Vitus sentier and the merida BT 400 are both great looking options
@@ElderlyAnteater Had my eyes on a Sentier VR myself. Decided to give the old bike a few upgrades and make do for now with all the stock issues.
A few years back a downhill bike would have a 65* HTA, now it's for a casual trail bike 😋
Yeah, and it's not like those hills have got any steeper but suddenly we all need raked out bikes to ride blue trails 😜
@@superspecky4eyes I ride this bike in black diamond trails it handles like a beast!
@@superspecky4eyes it’s what we ride that have gotten gnarlier
@@superspecky4eyes To be fair tho these long bikes handle a lot nicer and less sketchy.
@@ark8tct inflation, it’s the same thing
Something you missed to mention is that pretty much all the "negatives" you pointed out _(brakepads, rotors, cassette)_ are *consumables* and will need changing anyways - the aspiring rider will run the OEM parts into the ground, getting to know the bike, and experience first hand what needs *upgrading* when it's time to replace them!
Same concept regarding the dropper.
But note: not all derailleurs can handle a wider range cassette so upgrading might require to get a new one as well!
Same for 11x and 12x => need to add the price for a new shifter/trigger.
Just bought the Stoic 4, lots of little things I had to change like grips, seat, and dropper lever but overall a great bike. Thing feels like an absolute rocket
Thanks... I was waiting for Canyon Stoic review... And this is dream review... Made by Pinkbike 🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥 yeah
The guys at gmbn made a new vid with the Stoic ;)
@@szb0_tms42 thanks man 🙌🏼
Great review!! Please keep them coming. You guys are my new favorite go to bike test!!!
Keep up the good work!!!
*Looked at a lot of options for getting my **Latest.Bike** . Great find in SAVA. Super light, nice components, really good value as it comes with many options only found in much higher priced bikes.*
Good review! I bought the 2022 model along with a dropper, 11-46 cassette, and ODI locking grips. That added about $250 to the price, minus a $100 discount from Canyon. So for $150, I addressed most of the shortcomings you two mentioned. I could have afforded more bike out of the box, but I have some bike mechanic experience and modifications are half the fun for me. I also like the frame and color. The fork was definitely sticky the first couple rides, which made my wrists go numb, but it loosened up significantly after being broken in. No more stickiness or numb wrists! Was thinking Manitou, my favorite fork brand, but now I'll probably just run what it came with until it breaks or otherwise can't be serviced. As I treat my gear with care, hopefully that won't be necessary. The matching lowers are kind of neat.
By far the best looking bike at that price point🔥🔥🔥🔥
Yep 65 HTA is only for flat and flowy trails. Will explode on the steeps. Need The Grim Donut geo for anything steep.
Lol
exacly lol. I've ridden 66.5 ha bikes down stuff you had to walk on all fours so I don't sweat head angle too much as long as bike is the right size and the stack is appropriate you can get away with a lot.
I watch this every day to stay motivated to save money for that bike when I feel the urge on spending it on something useless 😅
Did you get it yet?!
Did you get it my man?
Oh damn I was really broke back then😂
I bought one last year...
This is my first mountain bike since I was 13 and let me tell you I’ve been getting roudyyyyy.
It’s a little sketchy, but I’ve been gripping onto those bars like a beast. I hit trails were most people have dual suspension enduro MTB and this bike handles all of it like a champ.
I say if you have guts to handle the trail do it!
Bliw your trumpet more kid
Love how the stoic looks!
yeah me too
Great job, hard tails are awesome
Great review, love watching you both! I'm keeping my eyes open for hardtails, but I think I'd pass on this one. For my style of riding in my area, I'd have to do brakes, cassette, and dropper, which puts it in the $1500+ range.
That said, I do love the looks of the Stoic.
Thats a nice frame
ordered one!! woohhooo coming soon!!! excited to shred with this beast!!!
Congratulations......nice bike
Congrats. What is the ETA on delivery?
This bike only needs a qr seat clamp and a smaller chainring up front if you dont want to spend another $300
Are you talking about a front derailleur
@@alexander47681 i'm talking about the dropper and the rear cassette
@@alexander47681 he means you can spend $50 to swap out the chainring to a 28t instead of paying $150 for a cassette with a 46 or 50 cog.
@@szb0_tms42 Without corona tax Atleast a wide range cassette should only be like 50bucks in the case of 10spd and about the same if you go for 11spd wich the derailleur can also be used for.
@@skullsroad3642 150 for a cassette? Why? This has a HG freehub body cassette's are cheap for those as long as you don't go the weight weenie route.
I bought the Stoic 2 in Germany for 800 EUR. Changed the cassette to 11-46 = 50€ - 25€ sold the 11-42, changed the fork for a Rock Shox Yari = 110 EUR (270 EUR eBay dissambled from New bike - 160 € sold the Suntour), 200mm Dropper post TrancX XL = 170 €, sold seatpost for 25, put my old SLX brakes = 0 so ended up with approx 1100 EUR very capable Hardtail. I love it
You can buying the stoic 3 for 1200€
That bike honestly looks so clean
I have an XCR on my rangefinder. Originally felt exactly like you guys described, but additionally was really stiff and never worked in the cold. Turns out Suntour uses very little lubricant in fork assembly to cut down on manufacturing costs. I got a lowers service on mine, with emphasis to proper lubrication, and the damn thing has consistently felt like my neighbor’s brand new Fox 34 for months now
Probably going to get this bike as my winter commute/fun bike :)
Just bought a Stoic 2. Looking forward to trying it out. 😎
Same bro how do you like it
Coming back to this one year later, I've just bought one!
Man, I just saw a video or Yoann Berelli ripping double blacks on a Commencal city bike. This should be able to handle everything!
Also, Id like to see a field test of the BEST enduro oriented hardtail
A bit late to the party, but I just (literally 10 minutes ago) purchased a Stoic 3 in the US. Since this video came out, the Stoic 3 is a different spec - 35 Silver, Sram NX/SX mix, dropper post. It was on sale for $1100. All the "value issues" are GONE at that price w/RockShox and a dropper and a 12 speed Sram drivetrain.
My first hardtail!! So stoked.
The big balance of the lower part of the chain, especially while descending, is one thing I think we all hate. A chain guide seems a must for this bike.
I think this is a good fit for me, where i live there are not any "trails", so i mostly wheelie and go to a pump track and small dirt jumps.
Shimano lists the RD-M6000-GS as 10 speed 11T to 42T. Is it actually possible to put a wider range cassette on it like a 11 to 46?
Great video! When the Vitus Sentier VR vídeo will be released?
It's crazy just in 2017 65 degrees was what you wanted for Enduro bikes.
Good review...
at 5:30 please note, that the mounted derailleur doenst support anything but 42-11 cassettes, as shimano says. if you know, your going to upgrade anyways, i would just pick the stoic 3 for 300€ more and have a nice fork upgrade aswell. on the downside you should now swap the sram dot brakes, shigura is love.
Damn so not just a simple cassette upgrade. Ouch on upgradability.
I'm so glad they specced decent wheels on the bike, and only cut corners on the things that are cheap to upgrade. Too many entry level bikes come with wheels that won't survive hard riding and a couple cases on dirt jumps.
No budget wheelsets survive hard riding, because wheels and bikes manufacturers do not include manual. Most new people to the hobby, do not know that riding the bike lightly in mild terrain for 300km and then retruing the wheels is OBLIGATORY. I never had any problems with any budget wheels except their weight.
I only recently had to replace my rear wheel on my budget hardtail (Trek Marlin from 2013). It lasted me 7.5 years and I abused that rim by mainly riding downhill trails and practicing drops. Budget rims perform better then you would think. That's why I consider this a mistake on Canyons end. This bike is clearly noteant for hard riding and yet they invested into a good wheelset... why? If this were a more downhill oriented hardtail I could understand but it doesn't appear to be that way. Thus, I'd prefer a better groupset or a dropper.
That’s a good looking bike!
@Pinkbike: Did have you tested the 23 Stoic 4 yet? What do you think about the frame as base for a custom build with 1x12 GX or XT (components) with a higher quality FOX or RockShox suspension and a better cockpit to save weight and better overall performance?
Great to see the "trail hardtail" category getting into the more budget end of bikes. Not always the xc-only hardtail.
The Euro version seems so much better, for 1.2k€.
RockShox Recon, dropper, 1x12 (11-50) SX.
but It's also gotta compete with the Ghost Nirvana and Orbea Alma for instance, both of which are similarly specced and, depending on where you look, a bit cheaper, even.
The Stoic 2 in Europe is the same as the 3 here in the states. We don’t have the middle option, which is the one I want. If you hover your curser over the picture on the US site Stoic 2 pops up on the screen
@@tracymcmanus550 I really dont think the stoic 3 is better than 2, you can get the 2 and + dropper and better brakes for less than a 3. You don't get a recon, which has thin cross country legs and SX, which is not good acording to reviews. Also the sram brakes are something I would change.
My stoic 2 should be comming soon and I already have some maguras and dropper waiting (and a Yari though)
Dropper and 1x12 yes, but I don't see the Recon as an upgrade over this Suntour fork, it's got no support and to stop the front diving you gotta pump it up really high which makes it harsh, plus the skinnier 32mm stanchions are a downside. I'd probably take the Suntour in a pinch.
@@chrisburn7178 Have the Siskiu T7 and totally agree on the Recon.
I bought this bike a month ago and i love it very capable bike
65 hta, 470mm reach and 1222 mm wheel base saw on a size large is not suited for technical terrain and is ideal for relatively flat and smooth trails????
Dayumn. That color thooo.
Is there a specific reason why we in Europe get the same bike for 799€ and is called Stoic 2, plus have an extra model for 1100€?
so! If I want to learn trail, but practice more cross country, is this bike right for me? I'm talking about the new Canyon Stoic models, will it be good to buy it?
Any chance to get this bike as a frame only? I would love to build this up differently.
would like to see Canyon Grand 7/8 review!!
My GF bought a Norco Fluid and it came with Resin pads. Not only did they suck I would even say they are dangerous because they don't stop for shit which means when you need to get on the anchors quickly, which happens a lot with new riders, you have nothing to stop you. 1st thing I bought here were a set of metallic pads and she is so much more confident now on the trail.
Beware that the brake rotors are likely meant for resin pads only. They dont have the treating to withstand the heat from metal pads. You should plan to replace the rotors as well.
@@rated89 Tektro site lists it as able to use either pad. She is a 110 soaking wet so I am not too concerned with her doing damage but it is good information to have.
Start reviewing sr suntour forks but the higher end ones 💯
I used to ride xc and climbing doesn’t really bother me. 11-42t is big enough for me. I have a 11-50t and i dont even use the last 3 biggest cogs even on steep uphill. This bike is perfect imo especially in our country where there is little to no bike specific trails
Same for the Specialized Rockhopper.Great allround bike for the money.
That thing has a quick release axles. It's pretty much a gravel bike.
@@skullsroad3642 in the past it was an entry level trail hardtail.My first bike was a 26 rockhopper.Very agile and fun and also very realibile.
What about marin bobcat trail 5?
That's the Stoic 2!!!
In my opinion, 10-42 is adequate range for anyone. I've been using a 10-42 cassette for years and I've never found myself needing a bigger ring on the back.
I hate how they complain about the cassete but dont mention the chainring. Like cmon how often are you hammering it in the 11t on the trail.
same for me
Agree, a 11-speed 10-42T (xD cassette with 420% range) would be great. But this bike has 10-spd 11-42T HG cassette (with 318% range). To get similar range as 10-42T, a 11-46T cassette (418% range) would be needed. This old Shimano RD-M6000 derailleur on the bike doesn't love 46T cassettes and use the dated "direct mount" link-link construction. Canyon choosing a RD-M6000 on this bike is just plain stupid since both the RD-M5100 and RD-M6100 (and corresponding shifters) cost the same or less as M6000. To my knowledge (?) all of these derailleurs can be used either as 10/11/12-spd, with corresponding 10/11/12-spd Shimano shifter. Modern M5100/6100 shifters use iSpec EV and there are cheap M4100 iSpec EV brakes to match, priced similar to the Canyon speced and dated MT200's. Even better of course would be M6100 brakes (servo wave, 1-2 finger) that only cost 25-40 $ more for a complete set.
The climbs are REALLY steep where I live, and the trail access is paved. The wider range of gears helps a ton here. If I drop my front ring too low I can't keep up on the paved portion jerdon mountain challenge, and if I size up the front ring too far it gets really hard to do the super steep climbs on the way up. The large range makes a huge difference in some situations but if you don't need it, you don't need it. It is a revelation here in wnc
I didn’t realise there was an option. I just pedal the thing.
Based off of your pump track comment, you guys ever considered reviewing dirt jumpers? For example, based off of that type of use, why would I choose this over a Canyon Stitched?
This bike is actually really good for 800 euros (right now it costs 900). This bike has boost, good rims and tires, air fork and deleulier with a clutch! I couldn't find anything this good, with good geometry for 800 euros in Europe!
If you find it let me know. I've pre-ordered my bike on February 1st, and the current estimate is that it will be delivered in mid August. Since I didn't pay it yet I can change my mind :D
What about vitus sentier
@@Chris-de2qc not worth the price in the EU with the new taxes
new stoic 3's are coming equipped with a dropper and a rockshox recon fork for same price. looking like its going to be a certain buy
I heard Canyon is coming to Canada. Do you guys have a link to the Canadian website?
I want to know your thoughts about comparison GT Avalanche Elite 2021 vs Canyon Stoic 3
is the giant fathom a similar bike to the stoic ?
Great review. One thing though. Isn't this the Stoic 2 and not 3? At least here in Europe that's the case...
I really have a hard time with how components are "judged" when the manufacturer really just uses from 3-5 different brands for suspension, drivetrain, tires, wheels
Really manufacturers design the frame and build the rear suspension on progressively again basing their choices on only a "few" different methods to suspend... DW link, VPP/Maestro, Horst etc..
Love this frame Geo, and that it uses a thru axel dropout... way more advanced than Trek's old Gary Fisher based Roscoe (like k'mone you just took a GF 29er and put a 27.5+ tire on it)
I think if Canyon sold this frame only -- killer, and if they can spec this for $1100 USD... then put I could imagine that a 1x NX (Guide) or Deore SLX (i.e. crank brakes) build with a RockShox 35 and this is a rowdy trail bike for probably a very good price.
Me? I'd buy this frame only, GX Eagle, Fox 34 @ 130/140 and I'd keep it mechanical BB7 as I'd use it in the rain and winter
in my country (Germany) this is actually the stoic 2 and we get it for 799€ but because of corona for 899€
In the US its called the Stoic 2, I don't care for the 4 all that much. I hope the 3 is something worth looking at
Dang, I missed levy!
What are the measurements of the test rider?
Can you guess why they didn’t put one of the cables inside frame, although this frame designed for that and has (clearly seen) cable “entrance” on right side? Maybe because it is mail order company and it will be easier for consumer to assemble it?
I think you need a reference section in the description where you describe to the world that Tim Horton's is a restaurant. Not some guy you give $1100 every month.
Who doesn’t know what a Tim Hortons is 😂
@@nikoleunig7932 I’m from Germany and I had no clue what it is.
I needed to google it and was surprised that a fast food chain that only serves breakfast and sweet stuff is able to survive.
Is it not a thing outside of Canada?
@@nikoleunig7932 Probably about 99.9% of the world population.
I had this bike for the past 6 month. Agree with everything from the review, except the wheels. Soo heavy... changed them out to Dtswiss E1900 wheels, even those are lightweight compared to these.
giant fathom 2 is $200 more, comes with deore 12 speed, and comes with a dropper. also comes with a little bit nicer cranks and tires... the giant fork it comes with looks a little nicer, but time will tell on both...
any plans for a cannondale habit ht review?
what is the max cassette you can put on this deore shifter?
What's a HONZ DOMPF?
Should i go for this or marin bobcattraiil 5?
Hello sir,is it okay to install 110mm travel fork?
the canyon stoic is a bike for someone who hits mostly dirt jumps but occasionally a mtb trail that has a tighter budget not an enduro hardtail or an xc hardtail perfectly trail
You can convert the fork to an oil bath configuration to get rid of that notchiness! Makes the lower end air suntours pretty darn nice!
How can you do that?
@@XxNoMercyNL buy the right foam oil rings for your stanchion size and install them beneath the seals, then pour 10ml of fork oil in each side of the lowers the next time you do a lower service. Make sure your fork's not complete ass like an xct or xcm though
It would be nice if you said why the bike isn't so good going down. Bottom bracket height? Chain stay length? Fork travel? Head tube angle?
Mostly HTA I'd assume, and wheelbase to a lesser extent.
I just built a ragley mmmbop w/ 63.75 HTA. It's super stable and confidence inspiring going down but noticeably less agile climbing. Worthwhile tradeoff since I ride for fun more than fitness.
Jason didn't seek too happy about the lack of squishy bits
hey I bought a radon jealous al 8 for xc riding, please tell me it was a good choice, personally I couldn't be happier but what do you think guys?
If you're happy why would you care what others say?
This is Canyon Stoic 2, at the beginning of the video he said Canyon Stoic 3, i am wrong?
The problem with this bike is my nukeproof scout sport (2018) was spec'd basically the same and all in (shipping, pedals, dropper, tax) was $1,200USD. I get pandemic supply problems but atleast give a dropper!
You keep digging into the 10spd, but 11-42 is what everyone had 5 years ago. It won't hold anybody back who hasn't tried eagle.
Also, shifting on a Shimano cassette with that KMC chain is going to be compromised; a directional Shimano chain will improve the shifting markedly
They tend to forget that these are not meant for seasoned riders who keep buying the latest and greatest. This 10 speed setup probably has more gears than a novice rider that dislikes constantly shifting up and down and plenty of range to tackle any climb they would ever attempt. Combined with lower price and slightly lower maintenance requirements it's a pretty dope choice for this segment. I find clutches and narrow wide chainrings the greatest innovation in the MTB world in the last 15 years and I'm really happy it trickled down to lower-mid tier components.
I always use shimano stuff with a KMC chain and it works just fine. Think this is just marketing by shimano. But the main reason I'm using KMC chains is they are cheap, reliable and they come with a quick link so it's easier to install.
I'm an OK climber, and 28/42 ,isn't quite high enough for when it's steep send I'm getting tired. A novice rider would notice that tough granny gear even more. Of course there had to be compromises but it's the reviewers' job to point them out.
Depends on terrain. Where I live it would honestly be better to have a 2x or 3x due to the climbs if you don't have an 11 or 12.
Thank you sold me on not buying 2023 stioc 3 canyon my marin wildcat 3 1/9 is more rounded than stioc i was debating between Canyon ,cannondale se 3 , ribble 725 ht thanks canyon off my list My Marin brakes are 5 k miles on my bike i hardly use brakes on my trail ride suntour 120 mm handles most of my trail rides i have a lot short quick hills lots rounded gravel it kills it but my marin cant handle my higher hills i'm looking for more gear range it was tempting with 1/11 canyon in 2023 its off my list great review
My bike is running a 1x10 with less range, same brakes, but a 69 degree hta and a 120mm Manitou Markhor. That lack of range really sucks on the climbs sometimes but with a 30t front chain ring it’s manageable. Plus since I don’t have a dropper I keep the post slammed 100% of the time and suffer on the climbs
Your knees and your back will suffer too,it's not that hard to get off the bike for 10 seconds and adjust your seat. Or if it is,then try to get a dropper,but don't keep riding like that😖
@@almabatekert_villanykorte3387 oh I don’t sit while I climb. I’m out of the saddle the whole time
Looks like a slacker Trek Stache minus the funky chainstay and adjustable dropouts
BMC twostroke al two or canyon stoic 2?
11-42 is okay if you run a 28/30 tooth front depending on 29/275.
Sun tour forks are great value for money they just need oil bath in the fork lowers. I don’t know why they don’t. Throw in 10cc of oil in each lower and that fork will feel as supple as anything double it’s price. I think that they need to spec a smaller front ring as I doubt any entry rider will ever use 32f 11r gear combo.
The problem I see with this bike is that by the time you spend the money for the upgrades Levy recommended, you've already spent the same amount as you would have on the Vitus Sentier VR which comes with a better Marzocchi Z2 fork, wide range 11 speed drivetrain, and a dropper post out of the box.
Another option would be to just get the Stoic 3 instead?
Sentier has resin nreak pads too.
Looking into this bike but as a taller rider (198cm height, 91cm leg length) I am having doubts if it will fit at least OK, are there any tall Stoic owners here that could give some feedback?
only 191 but the XL is more than enough. You should be fine
This seems like a great bike, but it also seems to one of those instances were going up a model solves most, if not all, issues with the base model.
The "true" Stoic 3 (as this is actually a Stoic 2, and has since been renamed accordingly) adds a dropper post, a 11-50T SX drivetrain and a Rockshox Recon RL fork, for an extra US$300, which is probably less than it would cost to upgrade the dropper and cassette yourself.
gli steli sono trattati o cromati?
I can’t find this bike for us 1100 is there an address I can be pointed to? I’m keen though I’m in Australia
this must be old u have that one in a vid stoic 2 than the 3 and the 4 ? i was looking for the stoic 4 revew xd
How does this compare to the trek marlin 7
"You might want a bigger cassette" or just a smaller chainring. Is anyone in the target market for this bike seriously going to be spinning out on the 11t cog?
Honestly my current hardtail is fine with 11-34 with 32t chainring, works just fine, I think that 30t with 42 back is more than enough.
Carbon copy of my trek roscoe, love my hardtail.
The scott scale 970 comes with sram sx, rochshox fork, and its 12 speed for about the same price
Cassette problem or the range? Can't you just change the chainring to a smaller one?
Then you'd be spinning gears in the downs
they talk about the bike like it was a cross country bike. But it is a dirt bike. Same for suspension.... if the fork has a dirt setting, don't expect it to be butter smooth for trail application.
Damn, I have a ful sus and I like this bike. Throw a PNW dropper in it with some Chester pedals and you’ll have a great bike for