Being from Germany I thought I give this a try. Imagine my surprise when I tried to turn it on and turn the throttle. Nothing was happening. Canyon does have a good costumer support and sent out a replacement but it had the same issues. Idk... I think I'll keep my KTM a while longer till they can figure their QC out.
To be fair in Europe the prices of Canyon bikes are really difficult to beat, boxing and shipping is around 80€, the bike actually reaches you half built (yes with the back wheel, derailleur and derailleur hanger installed) and you have no import duties. The only companies that compete with Canyon are other german companies like YT, Propain, Radon or Rose
Yeah, for the price and components, Canyon beats other brands here. Some other brands like Trek, Kona, Giant are more expensive and with poorer components. That's why I ordered mine Stoic 2 in 2020, when it just came out
In December, I bought this Bike (I live in Germany) for 999€ with all the required tools included. The shipping was 60€. I'm really happy with the Bike. The only parts that I changed was the brake system. The SRAM brakes are crap and I mounted a set of Magura MT5. I use the Bike in winter when it is wet and dirty outside. It's easier to maintain and wash an Hardtail rater than a Fully. This Bike ist a perfect match to my Enduro MTB
Pretty informative and interesting and I really like the way bicycle guy presented it. I mean he’s no 44… But at least he survives his bicycle trip without dying
Appreciate keeping the pricing and realities of being Canadian. I get why, but so many Canadian content creators (no matter the industry) default to US pricing, and don't address the reality of what we, as Canadian pay when importing products either from the US, or further abroad. Great video, highlights the bike for the budget conscious, but then notes the ballooning post-purchase costs.
Seems like more Canadians are actually youtubers as well. I atribute the cold winters and need to have an income despite it. Our northern entertainers.
@@HALLish-jl5mo There are a number of Canadian content creators, who, when reviewing products, etc all put it in USD vs CAD dollars. So, when the budget of $2,000 was mentioned, my first skepticism went to "oh, this must be USD", but clearly it became clear it was CAD later in the video. So, I'm giving F9 props for reviewing products and making CAD pricing their priority, it's more relatable than seeing a product for a price, only to search it myself to find that it is USD pricing referenced in their video. Top2BottomMTB is one Canadian content creator that does this, referencing USD pricing vs CAD. I get why they do it, appealing to the larger US market, so I was giving kudos to F9 for keeping it Canadian.
Got a Roscoe 8 in May and been loving every moment. As someone who is done riding a motorcycle on the street, i appreciate the mtb content. Off road on anything the way.
I like those MTB intermezzo spots for two reasons: 1) I ride mountainbikes during the winter to stay in shape and to further my off-road skills 2) It makes motorcycling look even cooler in comparison 😅
No experience with Canyon, but my direct-to-consumer purchase from Lynskey back in 2018 was outstanding. And thanks to them being handmade in Chattanooga, Tennessee, I did not have to pay any import or duty fees as a resident of Pennsylvania. A delight to do business with.
Out of curiosity, what are the three motos? As someone who only has bikes at the moment (and wants more variety among them for different types of rides), and someone who watches this channel because having a motorcycle seems pretty dang fun, I'm extra-curious what reasons there'd be for having multiple motorcycles rather than just one 'favorite' one.
@@Saftkeur Diffrent types of motorcycles are just better at certain things than others. Learned to ride on a SV650. Still own it, it's just really fun on twisties or for short hops around town but a pain for longer highway rides. On long trips something with more wind protection and a comfy seat / position is better (cruiser large naked with windshield or adv) . For trips in the wild take a adventure, dualsport, .. bike. For the track take a sports or naked bike
@@Saftkeur I'll let you know about mine 3 motos, despite fact that you didn't ask me. #1 - Triumph Tiger 800 - My long distance, "expedition" bike. i use it to travel, mostly highway to destination and some offroading there. also some weekend rides with friends who own faster bikes, and for those, where my wife stoles my offroader but i want to ride too #2 - Honda NX 250 - 1992 - youngtimer, because i wanted one, as i enjoy old bikes. this bike is small, light offroader for me to have fun at weekends. Not an enduro itself, but on my skill level It can do anything i want to try. it's a bike to have 2-3 hours of fun. i chose this model as it's seat height is quite low, so sometimes my wife take it to ride some gravel (this is why i use my tiger also at weekend to ride with her) #3 - Yamaha N-Max 125. yep, a scooter. I use it for daily commuting, to work, to do groceries. It's way cheaper to ride than other ones (both in fuel and maintanence) and it can still split lanes in traffic. Moreover, I Live in Poland (Europe) - so we have snow for 2-3 months a year. my scooter has a second set of winter tires, knee blanket and neoprene hand covers. together with low power and low center of weight it makes it easy also to ride in winter. Bikes with higher weight center are more prone to slides when you loose grip in winter, this schooter just "waves" it's tail like a drifting pro but is always upright. Also it has huge bagabe compartment under seat so i can put my work laptop, food and groceries into it, without need of backpacks. And i can leave helmet there when i arrive at office/cinema/shop and this is why i own 3 motorcycles. if i'd had chance i would add some touring bike like kawasaki Z1000SX, as my wife owns her own touring bike, so for holidays with her i use my Tiger, but If i could I'd like to split it into something more highway oriented (Z1000SX) and lighter adventure bike for longer trips (Husquarna 701 or GasGas Es 700 with some added ari protection or older Yamaha XT660Z due to it's low weight that would came usefull in offroad trips like oi had to Albania last year)
@@stillsalty947 Yeah that makes perfect sense! Hadn't really thought about how much of a pain it'd be to get on the highway with a slower, more nimble bike or vice versa with a highway cruiser in the city. (and I should probably rethink looking at Goldwings as a silly first bike, since I'm not really planning on highway trips if I got one.)
Some of the best bike videos around, so glad I started shopping with you guys last year and now this, added bonus. It's amazing how you started off as a bike review and ended up with a LBS advert, bravo. When I was looking for a bike in Ontario, the DTC brands seemed very attractive until I added the extra duty, at which point the LBS became more competitive which is the point of the duty I guess. I ended up buying an Optic and haven't looked back.
Fantastic video! I'm so glad you highlighted the importance of the local bike shop; it really is a gateway to a local biking community and amazing source of information.
Awesome video. Hidden costs are the worst costs because hidden. Go to a bike shop. Establish a rapport. Ride with a group from the bike shop. In the end you'll spend the same or less and get to know people. And have a bike shop on your side.
Yeah i agree, was looking at belt driven mtb without an electric motor, its from the us so until its at my doorstep in switzerland or germany itll be 650usd shipping plus over 1000€ import tax. Making a 3500usd bike cost 5 grand easily. Kind of a joke.
I dont get issue with 11 or 12 speeds. Those 11 speed bikes have even larger big gear on rear cassete than 12 speed Stoic. Ok, you get "extra" gear in middle but it doesnt matter if you aint in some race. If you aint fit enough then climbing on 11 speed shimano would be easier.
Exactly right. Sram S(u)X comes with a 50t granny gear while Shimano Deore 10 and 11 speed both run a 51t. And Deore shits all over SX. SX is the worst drivetrain from the big 2 of anything 8 gears or more. You have to get down to Shimano Tourney to get a worse system. I actively try to discourage customers from buying bikes with it on and try not to stock bikes specd with it
I approve. Been riding for decades, but I call BS on MX riding. We have precious little wilderness left for wildlife without terrorizing them. Lots of habitat is one of the main reasons that wildlife numbers are plummeting all over the world.
Two of my three current bicycles are from BikesDirect. One beginner trail bike and a road bike. I like them both and the shipping was free. I held off for years on my first purchase, finally decided that for $1500 and up I was NEVER going to spend that kind of money on a bicycle, therefore the bike shops were never actually going to get that money, so I should stop worrying about supporting them and ordered an $800 bike from BD. Component and build-wise it was IMO about equivalent to the $1500 bikes from the bike shops. I have not used the trail bike much but I have about 15,000 miles on the road bike and it's been flawless over sometimes questionable road surfaces. I would like to support local shops, but not at double the price. As for community, I'm an introvert and actively avoid groups when riding, and I have never found a problem that the bike shop can solve better than me. In fact once I had a problem I couldn't figure out, took it to the shop, the mechanics there couldn't fix it either, I came home and figured it out on my own.
I've turned to online bike purchasing because my local bike shops aren't friendly. They charge extra for assembly and it looks like they hired the kid who was assembling gas grills at Walmart.
I was so trigger happy to give this a thumbs down because of "Canyon" in the title. Thank you for coming full circle at the end and not being one of those channels that is easily bought by a new direct to consumer brand and forget about what local bike shops mean... a local business (most of the time) that hire local people, and is a hub for new and experienced cyclist to meet and learn from each other.
I started riding mountain bikes to get better at motorcycle racing. Now I love both! Glad to see Fortnine helping to develop the intersection of these two hobbies.
i appreciate the mindfulness that beginner/intermediate riders (myself included) have different needs, wants, and budget constraints than experienced and competitive racers.
DOD and FortNine, thank you for a high quality bike content and a fairly honest review. The only thing that bothers me is that you recommend clunky plastic SX drivetrain over reliable and fairly robust 11spd Shimano... The "not fit enough" argument can be dealt with a smaller sprocket at the front, if it's that bad.
@@naskicha468 I think it's more likely that they wanted to make a video specifically showing the downsides of direct-ordering a bike from overseas, and so justified it by requiring specs that could only be found on that bike. That being said, it was an excellent video and I do not mind the manipulation, if there was manipulation, at all.
In our town, we have two bike shops. One is for "hardcore" single-speed, triathlon, or trustfund riders. The other is for regular people. If we only had the snobbish one to use, I would definitely be leaning more to mail-order (ehem, "direct to consumer") options.
What a great review! Great job and I’m sure glad you didn’t join the OTB club once again. As an avid rider and instructor I’ve heard of Canyon and rarely have seen them here in south Florida. Your review gives me a different perspective. Thanks again! Rock on!
First, I love that you're doing MTB reviews now, please keep them up! Second, as someone who regularly joins local group rides, I can't say how much I agree with this review. Canyon does make legitimately good bikes, but when you factor in hidden costs, they aren't any better in price to performance - and one final hidden cost you missed: I found that most local bike shops are happy to help you with "free" quick tune ups and adjustments and advice on how to progress when you have supported them by getting a bike with them. And that advice and those quick tune ups can be invaluable to keeping newbies in the sport!
In Europe things are different. I J-U-S-T got a Bianchi Impulso gravel (full carbon) on a web-shop. It is the 2024 model, 10% discount on list price. Free shipment, in TWO days. It took me 15' to assemble, and was perfect. This is the 4th or 5th bike I bike from the net. I can state I have been always super happy and had no problems. Lucky? I do not know, but a few bikes from different shops are already a pretty good statistical basis. Conclusion: North America is different than Europe
Was not the direction I imagined that review taking. Stellar nonetheless. Affordable bikes should have been a priority long ago, but now maybe that the economies of scale are here, we're beginning to see a change in the wind.
Man, I gotta say I love the bicycle video! Biking is a good way for us motorcyclists to touch grass. The work required to pedal helps to appreciate the magic of a motor!
Thanks. You've saved my day. I recently bought a $1.5k ebike and I was BEATING myself coming to this video from another, where, for the same price, some dude bought a used pitbike, sold the motor and all the ICE parts, and spent the remainder on a decent conversion kit, making himself a nice and cool budget sur-ron that puts mine to shame in every single aspect. But now I see that I'm at least financially responsible enough not to drop $2 grand on an unpowered 15kg aluminium HARDTAIL. WTF?? Bicyclists are weird, man.
Thenk you very much for the first honest review about canyon bikes. They make nice bikes but even here in germany their support is bullshit. So if you can wrench yourself they are great. If you need someone to do it for you, go to your local bikeshop. They help you picking the right bike and care for you when things go bad.
@@1dameister1 of course I was joking, comparing an MTB review to a motorcycle review. If I had my choice, I would ride an MTB rather than a motorcycle. But at age 75, that time has passed. Sure enjoy my touring motorcycle, tho I recognize the danger, certainly far higher than a bicycle. Keep the shiny side up.
Still don't have any interest in mountain bikes, still thoroughly enjoy an informative, fun, well made video by someone who is passionate and enthusiastic about their subject. Well done, and keep up the excellent quality, inclusive videos - take note Evil Overlord RyanF9!
Great commentary on putting a bike together instead of the LBS doing it for you, this is something you grow into in the sport with experience, I think much more so than with motorcycles. Note Jenson which advertises ready to ride is closer to that 95% than Canyon is however when you have handlebars where the rise is pointed at you instead of up you have to wonder if Jenson bike builders know their ass from a hole in the ground and unlike the Canyon Marin does have it's logo and degree indicator lines to orient handle bar placement. So beware in direct to consumer purchasing that even if they build for you to ship that you might still need a trip to LBS for something. In my case it was the tubeless setup on the tires I asked for that they did not perform. Also very good video on laying out the extra costs that advertising doesn't lie about but has no interest in revealing to the consumer. Disagree with you on the LBS though in the sense that YMMV. Despite the current economic disadvantages it's surprisingly there are LBS's that don't really meet the mark on customer service.
Some Canyon bikes come to Canada duty-free and some don't. Depends on whether they count as produced in Europe or not. Currently when you go through the checkout process, it will show you a duty estimate based on whether or not it is eligible for duty free import.
Why not a Polygon Siskiu? I have one and it seems to do everything this Canyon does but better in every aspect. Good parts, good build quality, way cheaper price, better instructions, everything needed to build it is included, etc while also being dual suspension (or even cheaper again if you want one of their hard tails)
I ordered and built my YT Jeffsey with zero issues. A couple years back I had a great experience ordering and building my Polygon T7 as well. Not all direct to consumer brands are bad. Pretty sure if you got a higher end Canyon those problems are less likely.
Bruh, NO. You buy second hand something like a YT Capra/Tues, or Canyon Torque which will be great for so much money. I myself got a YT Tues model 2011 from Germany, I've been riding since 2017 for 1000€. I had to pay 500€ additionally for delivery, a new back suspension, repair of the fork and new brakes, it's a bit heavy (it's almost a retro bike at this point), I've yet to change some frame barings, but it's still good enough for up to 15m jumps. Even my previous Scott Gambler 2008 was good enough at 700€ for touring the country on some Downhill races, but it was heavy AF at 21kg with a single- crown fork and an S frame size. It's 2024 now, so we're past such tanks on two wheels and you can get an amazing soft bike for 2k on the secondhand market!
I bought the Stoic 3 last year and put the 35 silver tk fork on my brothers mtb, then I bought a second hand Yari RC Debon Air & front wheel for 450€ (from a Haibike ALLMTN 6 CARBON) and put it on the Stoic 3. It's pretty good. The Stoic 3 costs 1300€ in Europe, so even with the upgraded fork I stayed below 2000€ and was able to switch my brothers 500€ bike from a coil to an air fork. I initially wanted to buy the Stoic 4, but the Pike fork just didn't feel right for downhill. I'm quite happy with my setup now.
In this hardtail price range I'd go for a Rocky Mountain Growler 40 (or 50 if it's a previous year discount), can even go into a local shop and most likely sit on one. It's a deceptively capable bike going downhill.
Having worked as a bike mechanic myself, I absolutely recommend spending those five hours more to get to your local shop and try out some bikes. Then get to another one, and try out even more bikes. Especially if you're not a mechanic, assembling bikes yourself is a pretty demanding thing to do. Trusting your front teeth to a local mechanic makes your ride less worrisome and ensures that their shop might still be around when you're really looking for someone to fix your bike. Cheers from Germany!
I see a lot of comments saying to put this kind of content on a different channel. As someone who like motorcycles and bikes, I am loving this. I like seeing the fortnine channel’s take on different bikes and motorcycles. Everything two wheels is cool!
right so you can see it on channel 2..its not just the bikes either i dont think anyone likes this pretentious guy who insists peddle bikes can only be enjoyed if you pay motorcycle prices for them and that direct to consumer companies are the devil while shilling for overpriced shops to work on a peddle bike that 8 year olds have been repairing themselves for 80 years
@@AndrewBrowner People complaining about the bike content need to understand that FortNine is a store that sells accessories for motorcycles, bikes, snowmobiles, etc. that ALSO has a YT channel to get people to check out their store.. It's a store first, YT channel second.
@@AndrewBrowner I love this guy...so your premise is incorrect from the start. It's the Fortnine style that's important. I ride both so I love that it is all on one channel. Speak for yourself.
The nice thing about bikes is you can basically buy a used frame and then simply add the parts that matter the most for a significant discount from anywhere in the world: Forks, derailleurs, breaks, gift shifters, seats, wheels, etc. The best part is the ability to mix and match by taking the best each brand has to offer instead of putting up with whatever their weak link is in the ensemble deal. Besides, I've never known a serious cyclist who didn't change out or upgrade at least one part of the bike they bought.
Agree. It 100mm let you feel all the notches on the road and it 17 kg frame is sturdy, in all seriousness the $500 mtb can do the work, also the price tag allow me to ride it without caring in the bad area of the city where the pavement is pretty close to that of a mtb trail
@@beerenmusli8220 well they didnt break in 5 years so i see no reason why it would give me trouble. That bike costs 2k and welds look 100 times worse than on my frame. All the accessories are shimano on my bike so its not the worst. And all that for 1/4 of the price.
@@beerenmusli8220 that's why you can change part, if you think that the brakes are not enough then you change them, people customize their bicycles all the time, they are not a marvel of complexities, just grab your hex key of the correct size and change them, i hardly believe a good set of brakes and a new suspension will inflate the price to the thousand dollar mark
I built my Ragley Big Wig for just over 2K USD but it has 34 Fox Factory fork, Spank 359/350 wheels w Hex hubs, SRAM GX 12 speed, carbon handle bars, Nukeproof Horizon stem, BB, alloy pedals and a Crank Bros 3 dropper. Seems when some companies discount their products to extinction, the deals can allow you to build you dream bike on a budget. Some of my parts were new take offs through PinkBike. If you can work on your own bike, or have a good relationship with your LBS, you can wheel and deal pretty well these days.
The duties factor might be a good idea for a video. Try to see if in Canada there are any bike manufacturers to be had and see if they are worth consideration.
i managed to get a Scott Spark 970 under €1900 at a sale in autumn 2022. Biggest mistake was assuming came correctly assembled.. I attached the front wheel and bar and went out and rode. Sub 200km later spokes started to come loose and the dropper cable started causing problems. Next bike I'll probably buy from a bike store.
You can get a better full suspension for 2k. The Superior xf 939 tr. If you have to have a hardtail you can get the full carbon superior xp 969 fur under 2k
i just dont care about bikes man, i like the content, it's well made, but i dont like that it takes the place of motorcycle content that is genuinely important to me as i learn to ride
I've been watching F9 for years, despite never having ridden a motorycle, let alone owned one. But I do ride MTB, so this new direction is my favourite YT thing ever.
I've got some theories about that and have switched between moto and MTB helmets for bike park in the past. I'll put this on the long list of video ideas! -DOD F9
Some pretty tricky stunts, I’ve never tried riding ( a bike ) backwards. Found out fast that even swapping hands from normal right hand to right bar grip, left hand to left, led to an immediate unrecoverable situation. That seemed enuf fun 😊
I have to confess: I was skeptic initially when I saw FortNine incorporating MTB content but I can see now how it does make sense: it's the logical evolution -or rather, devolution- now that the newest MTBs have become almost as good (or better) than a small displacement enduro bike from decades ago -when they were so light, simple and playful-. I find myself looking more for content about ebikes, automatic MTB gearboxes and MTB abs (go flip yourself...) that I'm actually looking for FortNine pulling out one of his cinematic masterpieces featuring an ebike, go figure...
I don't understand the hate for 11speed drivetrains. I'd prefer 11 over 12 speed anyday of the week. Heck, I'm happy with 10 speeds. The only range you're losing is for top speed because you don't have a 10 t cog (which is pretty inefficient due to the small radius anyway). If I was racing that might be a concern, or trying to maintain speeds over 35km/h, but neither of these probably appy to a 35lb hardtail with knobbies. YMMV.
Why are Americans so afraid of owning tools? I don't doubt this guy, he clearly knows his shit, but the warning about the monumental 8mm allen key quest implies that most Americans are mortified at the prospect of going to the hardware store to buy literally one of the simplest tools one can own.
i bought a canyon year ago, given components was better than rival at same price, little i know that i had to pay custom and additional bucks , i would have definitely equivalent or better bike form local store.. I 100% agree with this review!
I got this feeling of F9 will produce their own bike with n without motor that's so innovative, after acquiring so much knowledge from both worlds.. Really, bicycle world is full of rabbit holes, it's competitive but u can't put a motor on it therefore u need to think hard about stuffs to make it fast and efficient whilst maintain the safety aspect.
Great review and agree on going to the local bike shop Beg to differ on the drivetrain though I would choose 11 speed over 12 for better reliability in shifting, and if the gearing is too hard for the climbs, change the chainring for a smaller one and voila!
Like others are saying. In Europe this is much better value. I bought and eMTB from them a few years ago and the value was unbeatable even after VAT and shipping. It also arrived in a much more complete state.
![Горные велосипеды CANYON. Exceed, Lux, Spectral, Torque, Sender, Strive, Dude и др. / ПРО [БРЕНДЫ]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/pmrQfuUWl4M/mqdefault.jpg)
Being from Germany I thought I give this a try. Imagine my surprise when I tried to turn it on and turn the throttle. Nothing was happening. Canyon does have a good costumer support and sent out a replacement but it had the same issues. Idk... I think I'll keep my KTM a while longer till they can figure their QC out.
Damn, absolutely outrageous! Did you check if they even gave you gas with it?
@@call_me_mado5987 they didn't! It didn't even have any brake fluid in it.
Nain nain you dont darfst hier ofeoading or the polizai is komming
Was soll das für eine Sprache sein? @@tvexpert_xd2388
Costumer! 🤣🤣😂😍
Us Germans are pretty cool, sometimes!
To be fair in Europe the prices of Canyon bikes are really difficult to beat, boxing and shipping is around 80€, the bike actually reaches you half built (yes with the back wheel, derailleur and derailleur hanger installed) and you have no import duties.
The only companies that compete with Canyon are other german companies like YT, Propain, Radon or Rose
Don't forget Cube 😉
Focus does make really competitive bikes to
Yeah, for the price and components, Canyon beats other brands here. Some other brands like Trek, Kona, Giant are more expensive and with poorer components. That's why I ordered mine Stoic 2 in 2020, when it just came out
Isn't propain based out of Vancouver Washington?
Owned by Canyon
As a guy who has just picked up a Roscoe 8, Luke behind the counter, gave good advice, this things awesome.
I agree
In December, I bought this Bike (I live in Germany) for 999€ with all the required tools included. The shipping was 60€. I'm really happy with the Bike. The only parts that I changed was the brake system. The SRAM brakes are crap and I mounted a set of Magura MT5. I use the Bike in winter when it is wet and dirty outside. It's easier to maintain and wash an Hardtail rater than a Fully. This Bike ist a perfect match to my Enduro MTB
You didn’t. It’s the frame with absolute bottom shelf parts
Pretty informative and interesting and I really like the way bicycle guy presented it. I mean he’s no 44… But at least he survives his bicycle trip without dying
#44 is overrated. I miss #43.
Appreciate keeping the pricing and realities of being Canadian. I get why, but so many Canadian content creators (no matter the industry) default to US pricing, and don't address the reality of what we, as Canadian pay when importing products either from the US, or further abroad. Great video, highlights the bike for the budget conscious, but then notes the ballooning post-purchase costs.
Even some British content makers do that (Mr who's the boss)
Seems like more Canadians are actually youtubers as well. I atribute the cold winters and need to have an income despite it. Our northern entertainers.
They are a Canadian shop.
Non Canadian viewers are essentially irrelevant to them.
@@HALLish-jl5mo There are a number of Canadian content creators, who, when reviewing products, etc all put it in USD vs CAD dollars.
So, when the budget of $2,000 was mentioned, my first skepticism went to "oh, this must be USD", but clearly it became clear it was CAD later in the video.
So, I'm giving F9 props for reviewing products and making CAD pricing their priority, it's more relatable than seeing a product for a price, only to search it myself to find that it is USD pricing referenced in their video.
Top2BottomMTB is one Canadian content creator that does this, referencing USD pricing vs CAD.
I get why they do it, appealing to the larger US market, so I was giving kudos to F9 for keeping it Canadian.
Must admit Canadian dollar always puts me off guard, being used to Euros.
Got a Roscoe 8 in May and been loving every moment. As someone who is done riding a motorcycle on the street, i appreciate the mtb content. Off road on anything the way.
I like those MTB intermezzo spots for two reasons:
1) I ride mountainbikes during the winter to stay in shape and to further my off-road skills
2) It makes motorcycling look even cooler in comparison 😅
heeeeyy, don't do my mountain biking like that
This motorcycle doesn't have a motor in it? I'm very confused here.
It does... you are the motor!
you are the motor
It's a very eco-friendly motor. 30 miles per cheeseburger.
@@John_Ridley What a deal!
@John_Ridley I'm pretty sure with a fuel budget supplied to me like that I could do several runs for several cheeseburgers.
No experience with Canyon, but my direct-to-consumer purchase from Lynskey back in 2018 was outstanding. And thanks to them being handmade in Chattanooga, Tennessee, I did not have to pay any import or duty fees as a resident of Pennsylvania. A delight to do business with.
As a guy who has three motos and four mtbs in the garage. I approve of this message.
Out of curiosity, what are the three motos? As someone who only has bikes at the moment (and wants more variety among them for different types of rides), and someone who watches this channel because having a motorcycle seems pretty dang fun, I'm extra-curious what reasons there'd be for having multiple motorcycles rather than just one 'favorite' one.
@@Saftkeur It is like having three girlfriends, you never really know which one your want.
@@Saftkeur Diffrent types of motorcycles are just better at certain things than others.
Learned to ride on a SV650. Still own it, it's just really fun on twisties or for short hops around town but a pain for longer highway rides. On long trips something with more wind protection and a comfy seat / position is better (cruiser large naked with windshield or adv) . For trips in the wild take a adventure, dualsport, .. bike. For the track take a sports or naked bike
@@Saftkeur I'll let you know about mine 3 motos, despite fact that you didn't ask me.
#1 - Triumph Tiger 800 - My long distance, "expedition" bike. i use it to travel, mostly highway to destination and some offroading there. also some weekend rides with friends who own faster bikes, and for those, where my wife stoles my offroader but i want to ride too
#2 - Honda NX 250 - 1992 - youngtimer, because i wanted one, as i enjoy old bikes. this bike is small, light offroader for me to have fun at weekends. Not an enduro itself, but on my skill level It can do anything i want to try. it's a bike to have 2-3 hours of fun. i chose this model as it's seat height is quite low, so sometimes my wife take it to ride some gravel (this is why i use my tiger also at weekend to ride with her)
#3 - Yamaha N-Max 125. yep, a scooter. I use it for daily commuting, to work, to do groceries. It's way cheaper to ride than other ones (both in fuel and maintanence) and it can still split lanes in traffic. Moreover, I Live in Poland (Europe) - so we have snow for 2-3 months a year. my scooter has a second set of winter tires, knee blanket and neoprene hand covers. together with low power and low center of weight it makes it easy also to ride in winter. Bikes with higher weight center are more prone to slides when you loose grip in winter, this schooter just "waves" it's tail like a drifting pro but is always upright. Also it has huge bagabe compartment under seat so i can put my work laptop, food and groceries into it, without need of backpacks. And i can leave helmet there when i arrive at office/cinema/shop
and this is why i own 3 motorcycles. if i'd had chance i would add some touring bike like kawasaki Z1000SX, as my wife owns her own touring bike, so for holidays with her i use my Tiger, but If i could I'd like to split it into something more highway oriented (Z1000SX) and lighter adventure bike for longer trips (Husquarna 701 or GasGas Es 700 with some added ari protection or older Yamaha XT660Z due to it's low weight that would came usefull in offroad trips like oi had to Albania last year)
@@stillsalty947 Yeah that makes perfect sense! Hadn't really thought about how much of a pain it'd be to get on the highway with a slower, more nimble bike or vice versa with a highway cruiser in the city. (and I should probably rethink looking at Goldwings as a silly first bike, since I'm not really planning on highway trips if I got one.)
Some of the best bike videos around, so glad I started shopping with you guys last year and now this, added bonus. It's amazing how you started off as a bike review and ended up with a LBS advert, bravo. When I was looking for a bike in Ontario, the DTC brands seemed very attractive until I added the extra duty, at which point the LBS became more competitive which is the point of the duty I guess. I ended up buying an Optic and haven't looked back.
Fantastic video! I'm so glad you highlighted the importance of the local bike shop; it really is a gateway to a local biking community and amazing source of information.
Awesome video. Hidden costs are the worst costs because hidden.
Go to a bike shop. Establish a rapport. Ride with a group from the bike shop. In the end you'll spend the same or less and get to know people. And have a bike shop on your side.
Yeah i agree, was looking at belt driven mtb without an electric motor, its from the us so until its at my doorstep in switzerland or germany itll be 650usd shipping plus over 1000€ import tax. Making a 3500usd bike cost 5 grand easily. Kind of a joke.
Duty really isn't a "hidden" cost though. Anyone with half a brain should know to consider it and find out how much it is.
I may have visited only the wrong kind of bike shops, but the only rapport they truly wanted to establish was with my wallet.
I think that if pay for assembly you don't pay the 1st delivery fee
I have no interest on this, but still watch it cause I like you guys
Exactly
Weirdly enough I feel the same about the motorbike stuff. Don't and won't own one, but I like bikes enough for Ryans vid's to interest me.
@@cornishcactus just get a cheap one already, it's fun
@@Bugside Too many chances to overtake cars that annoy me now, too many chances to screw that up.
@@cornishcactus you don't need buy a race bike, get a cool, relaxed bop around town bike and have fun, at least you'll know if you like it
I dont get issue with 11 or 12 speeds. Those 11 speed bikes have even larger big gear on rear cassete than 12 speed Stoic. Ok, you get "extra" gear in middle but it doesnt matter if you aint in some race. If you aint fit enough then climbing on 11 speed shimano would be easier.
Exactly right. Sram S(u)X comes with a 50t granny gear while Shimano Deore 10 and 11 speed both run a 51t. And Deore shits all over SX. SX is the worst drivetrain from the big 2 of anything 8 gears or more. You have to get down to Shimano Tourney to get a worse system. I actively try to discourage customers from buying bikes with it on and try not to stock bikes specd with it
Thank you! That part really bothered me. That's a detail I would really expect to be caught by a F9 video.
@@mad082sss Deore 12 spd also has a 10-51t
Love both the motorcycle and bike contend. Since it's illegal to go offroad on a motorcycle over here, bikes are a nice alternative for me.
where are you?
What country are you in you can't MX?
@@virginiascurti5036like every country in Europe? Probably lots of other countries too.
I approve. Been riding for decades, but I call BS on MX riding. We have precious little wilderness left for wildlife without terrorizing them. Lots of habitat is one of the main reasons that wildlife numbers are plummeting all over the world.
Two of my three current bicycles are from BikesDirect. One beginner trail bike and a road bike. I like them both and the shipping was free. I held off for years on my first purchase, finally decided that for $1500 and up I was NEVER going to spend that kind of money on a bicycle, therefore the bike shops were never actually going to get that money, so I should stop worrying about supporting them and ordered an $800 bike from BD. Component and build-wise it was IMO about equivalent to the $1500 bikes from the bike shops.
I have not used the trail bike much but I have about 15,000 miles on the road bike and it's been flawless over sometimes questionable road surfaces.
I would like to support local shops, but not at double the price.
As for community, I'm an introvert and actively avoid groups when riding, and I have never found a problem that the bike shop can solve better than me. In fact once I had a problem I couldn't figure out, took it to the shop, the mechanics there couldn't fix it either, I came home and figured it out on my own.
I've turned to online bike purchasing because my local bike shops aren't friendly. They charge extra for assembly and it looks like they hired the kid who was assembling gas grills at Walmart.
Love the human powered bike content!
I was so trigger happy to give this a thumbs down because of "Canyon" in the title. Thank you for coming full circle at the end and not being one of those channels that is easily bought by a new direct to consumer brand and forget about what local bike shops mean... a local business (most of the time) that hire local people, and is a hub for new and experienced cyclist to meet and learn from each other.
I came to this channel to see motorbike stuff, but hey, I love the bicycle content you do too. Keep on the great work you do guys! THX
I started riding mountain bikes to get better at motorcycle racing. Now I love both! Glad to see Fortnine helping to develop the intersection of these two hobbies.
i appreciate the mindfulness that beginner/intermediate riders (myself included) have different needs, wants, and budget constraints than experienced and competitive racers.
DOD and FortNine, thank you for a high quality bike content and a fairly honest review. The only thing that bothers me is that you recommend clunky plastic SX drivetrain over reliable and fairly robust 11spd Shimano... The "not fit enough" argument can be dealt with a smaller sprocket at the front, if it's that bad.
exactly, good 10/11spd is way better than cheep 12s. At some points he sounded like car guy reviewing a motorcycle. Not always more is better.
@@naskicha468 I think it's more likely that they wanted to make a video specifically showing the downsides of direct-ordering a bike from overseas, and so justified it by requiring specs that could only be found on that bike.
That being said, it was an excellent video and I do not mind the manipulation, if there was manipulation, at all.
It’s crazy how good FortNine is. I have no interest in owning a pedal bike at all yet I watch every one of these videos
In our town, we have two bike shops.
One is for "hardcore" single-speed, triathlon, or trustfund riders.
The other is for regular people.
If we only had the snobbish one to use, I would definitely be leaning more to mail-order (ehem, "direct to consumer") options.
What a great review! Great job and I’m sure glad you didn’t join the OTB club once again.
As an avid rider and instructor I’ve heard of Canyon and rarely have seen them here in south Florida. Your review gives me a different perspective. Thanks again! Rock on!
That Ryan F9 impersonation was uncanny.
Who knew Ryan liked bicycles so much?
D.O.D. enjoy your vids very much!!!
Some local bicycle shops also might offer free tune-ups for bikes you buy new from them; the one I worked at did.
First, I love that you're doing MTB reviews now, please keep them up!
Second, as someone who regularly joins local group rides, I can't say how much I agree with this review. Canyon does make legitimately good bikes, but when you factor in hidden costs, they aren't any better in price to performance - and one final hidden cost you missed: I found that most local bike shops are happy to help you with "free" quick tune ups and adjustments and advice on how to progress when you have supported them by getting a bike with them. And that advice and those quick tune ups can be invaluable to keeping newbies in the sport!
In Europe things are different. I J-U-S-T got a Bianchi Impulso gravel (full carbon) on a web-shop. It is the 2024 model, 10% discount on list price. Free shipment, in TWO days. It took me 15' to assemble, and was perfect. This is the 4th or 5th bike I bike from the net. I can state I have been always super happy and had no problems. Lucky? I do not know, but a few bikes from different shops are already a pretty good statistical basis. Conclusion: North America is different than Europe
I was skeptical about push bikes on this channel but I'm actually really enjoying it
I enjoy the Acoustic Motorcycle content but always end up wondering how much better it would be if you strapped a motor to those things.
Pretty sure they made a video about that.
They do. It’s a electric mtb. They are the way to go
Was not the direction I imagined that review taking. Stellar nonetheless. Affordable bikes should have been a priority long ago, but now maybe that the economies of scale are here, we're beginning to see a change in the wind.
Man, I gotta say I love the bicycle video! Biking is a good way for us motorcyclists to touch grass. The work required to pedal helps to appreciate the magic of a motor!
RF9 Is allowing someone with no throttle hand to make videos now?
As a long-time viewer I'm super pumped!!!!!!!!!!!
MTB and motorbiking is the ultimate combo! ❤ Nice to see, that F9 has also found this recipe.
Thanks. You've saved my day. I recently bought a $1.5k ebike and I was BEATING myself coming to this video from another, where, for the same price, some dude bought a used pitbike, sold the motor and all the ICE parts, and spent the remainder on a decent conversion kit, making himself a nice and cool budget sur-ron that puts mine to shame in every single aspect. But now I see that I'm at least financially responsible enough not to drop $2 grand on an unpowered 15kg aluminium HARDTAIL. WTF?? Bicyclists are weird, man.
Thenk you very much for the first honest review about canyon bikes. They make nice bikes but even here in germany their support is bullshit. So if you can wrench yourself they are great. If you need someone to do it for you, go to your local bikeshop. They help you picking the right bike and care for you when things go bad.
I am not interested in bicycles at all, yet I watched and enjoyed the whole video. Now Ryan, back to motorbikes.
I didn't see it mentioned, so shoutout to Obsession bikes at the end there. Ooh the Roscoe looks pretty great in that Mulsanne blue.
Lower Lonsdale represent!
I appreciate the moral of the story at the end. The LBS is still relevant and valuable. ❤
Enve rigid fork. Sign of a true mtb’r.
The excitement of seeing a new Fortnine video uploaded quickly followed by the disappointment of finding out it's a FortNOT video.
Let it be known I have no idea what you’re talking about, but I was interested the whole time
Feel the same. Where are the torque and HP ratings?
@@bjb7587 It depends how hard you push down on the pedals. Riding MTB's is harder then riding motorcycles.
@@1dameister1 of course I was joking, comparing an MTB review to a motorcycle review.
If I had my choice, I would ride an MTB rather than a motorcycle. But at age 75, that time has passed. Sure enjoy my touring motorcycle, tho I recognize the danger, certainly far higher than a bicycle.
Keep the shiny side up.
@@bjb7587 Thanks you too.
Well done in true Fortnine fashion. More please.
Still don't have any interest in mountain bikes, still thoroughly enjoy an informative, fun, well made video by someone who is passionate and enthusiastic about their subject. Well done, and keep up the excellent quality, inclusive videos - take note Evil Overlord RyanF9!
This channel ain’t about motorcycles anymore, it’s about the 2 wheeled cultures.
And I’m all for it👍
Great commentary on putting a bike together instead of the LBS doing it for you, this is something you grow into in the sport with experience, I think much more so than with motorcycles. Note Jenson which advertises ready to ride is closer to that 95% than Canyon is however when you have handlebars where the rise is pointed at you instead of up you have to wonder if Jenson bike builders know their ass from a hole in the ground and unlike the Canyon Marin does have it's logo and degree indicator lines to orient handle bar placement. So beware in direct to consumer purchasing that even if they build for you to ship that you might still need a trip to LBS for something. In my case it was the tubeless setup on the tires I asked for that they did not perform. Also very good video on laying out the extra costs that advertising doesn't lie about but has no interest in revealing to the consumer. Disagree with you on the LBS though in the sense that YMMV. Despite the current economic disadvantages it's surprisingly there are LBS's that don't really meet the mark on customer service.
Some Canyon bikes come to Canada duty-free and some don't. Depends on whether they count as produced in Europe or not. Currently when you go through the checkout process, it will show you a duty estimate based on whether or not it is eligible for duty free import.
If they sold and shipped the wheels seperately, they could avoid the13% complete bike duty.
Why not a Polygon Siskiu? I have one and it seems to do everything this Canyon does but better in every aspect. Good parts, good build quality, way cheaper price, better instructions, everything needed to build it is included, etc while also being dual suspension (or even cheaper again if you want one of their hard tails)
I ordered and built my YT Jeffsey with zero issues. A couple years back I had a great experience ordering and building my Polygon T7 as well. Not all direct to consumer brands are bad. Pretty sure if you got a higher end Canyon those problems are less likely.
I'm learning more about bicycles this way.
But I'm still going to spend my riding time on motorcycles!
As somebody who doesn't ride a motorcycle but mainly watches for the production value, I'm here for the biking content :P
I love how FortNine has become somthing of an ensemble cast as of late.
They gotta come up with something, it's been years since they've done any sort of actual riding outside making a review.
Bruh, NO. You buy second hand something like a YT Capra/Tues, or Canyon Torque which will be great for so much money. I myself got a YT Tues model 2011 from Germany, I've been riding since 2017 for 1000€. I had to pay 500€ additionally for delivery, a new back suspension, repair of the fork and new brakes, it's a bit heavy (it's almost a retro bike at this point), I've yet to change some frame barings, but it's still good enough for up to 15m jumps. Even my previous Scott Gambler 2008 was good enough at 700€ for touring the country on some Downhill races, but it was heavy AF at 21kg with a single- crown fork and an S frame size. It's 2024 now, so we're past such tanks on two wheels and you can get an amazing soft bike for 2k on the secondhand market!
Dude this bike is sick! I wish i could afford it man!
Guys, why don't you strap an accelerometer up your saddle and test how varying tire widths and pressures affect vibration on that hardtail?
I can't wait for Bike9 to be it's own channel
I bought the Stoic 3 last year and put the 35 silver tk fork on my brothers mtb, then I bought a second hand Yari RC Debon Air & front wheel for 450€ (from a Haibike ALLMTN 6 CARBON) and put it on the Stoic 3. It's pretty good. The Stoic 3 costs 1300€ in Europe, so even with the upgraded fork I stayed below 2000€ and was able to switch my brothers 500€ bike from a coil to an air fork. I initially wanted to buy the Stoic 4, but the Pike fork just didn't feel right for downhill. I'm quite happy with my setup now.
In this hardtail price range I'd go for a Rocky Mountain Growler 40 (or 50 if it's a previous year discount), can even go into a local shop and most likely sit on one. It's a deceptively capable bike going downhill.
Agree. Or get a growler 20 and buy a fork. Lots of great deals on forks on FB or Pinkbike.
Having worked as a bike mechanic myself, I absolutely recommend spending those five hours more to get to your local shop and try out some bikes. Then get to another one, and try out even more bikes. Especially if you're not a mechanic, assembling bikes yourself is a pretty demanding thing to do. Trusting your front teeth to a local mechanic makes your ride less worrisome and ensures that their shop might still be around when you're really looking for someone to fix your bike. Cheers from Germany!
Fortnine got me back into riding a motorcylce, and now Im interested in mountain bikes again.
I look forward to more MTB reviews for the average joe.
I went from a cr500 to a mountain bike 😅 I love my mtb I ride full ridgid mtb so fast and climbs like a Mountain Goat 🐐 😅🤠🇬🇧🤘
I think these bicycle things might have potential, but if you put a motor on there it would be awesome
Imagine that! LOL
I see a lot of comments saying to put this kind of content on a different channel. As someone who like motorcycles and bikes, I am loving this. I like seeing the fortnine channel’s take on different bikes and motorcycles. Everything two wheels is cool!
right so you can see it on channel 2..its not just the bikes either i dont think anyone likes this pretentious guy who insists peddle bikes can only be enjoyed if you pay motorcycle prices for them and that direct to consumer companies are the devil while shilling for overpriced shops to work on a peddle bike that 8 year olds have been repairing themselves for 80 years
@@AndrewBrowner People complaining about the bike content need to understand that FortNine is a store that sells accessories for motorcycles, bikes, snowmobiles, etc. that ALSO has a YT channel to get people to check out their store.. It's a store first, YT channel second.
@@AndrewBrowner I love this guy...so your premise is incorrect from the start. It's the Fortnine style that's important. I ride both so I love that it is all on one channel. Speak for yourself.
The nice thing about bikes is you can basically buy a used frame and then simply add the parts that matter the most for a significant discount from anywhere in the world: Forks, derailleurs, breaks, gift shifters, seats, wheels, etc. The best part is the ability to mix and match by taking the best each brand has to offer instead of putting up with whatever their weak link is in the ensemble deal. Besides, I've never known a serious cyclist who didn't change out or upgrade at least one part of the bike they bought.
I'm perfectly happy on my *€500* MTB. I don't care that it MIGHT brake or that it's not the best. I DOES THE JOB!
Agree.
It 100mm let you feel all the notches on the road and it 17 kg frame is sturdy, in all seriousness the $500 mtb can do the work, also the price tag allow me to ride it without caring in the bad area of the city where the pavement is pretty close to that of a mtb trail
When the brakes just *might* work and are not reliable, it doesn't to the job, at all, lol
@@beerenmusli8220 well they didnt break in 5 years so i see no reason why it would give me trouble. That bike costs 2k and welds look 100 times worse than on my frame. All the accessories are shimano on my bike so its not the worst. And all that for 1/4 of the price.
@@beerenmusli8220 that's why you can change part, if you think that the brakes are not enough then you change them, people customize their bicycles all the time, they are not a marvel of complexities, just grab your hex key of the correct size and change them, i hardly believe a good set of brakes and a new suspension will inflate the price to the thousand dollar mark
@@ecthelionalfa Uh I know?
Some 11 and 12 speed powertrains have the same range just smaller steps in between 12s. I think that was the case with Shimano deore
Not the content i subscribed for but still just as high quality
Did enjoy
I built my Ragley Big Wig for just over 2K USD but it has 34 Fox Factory fork, Spank 359/350 wheels w Hex hubs, SRAM GX 12 speed, carbon handle bars, Nukeproof Horizon stem, BB, alloy pedals and a Crank Bros 3 dropper. Seems when some companies discount their products to extinction, the deals can allow you to build you dream bike on a budget. Some of my parts were new take offs through PinkBike. If you can work on your own bike, or have a good relationship with your LBS, you can wheel and deal pretty well these days.
The duties factor might be a good idea for a video. Try to see if in Canada there are any bike manufacturers to be had and see if they are worth consideration.
How about what to look for/check on secondhand bikes, from a source we can all trust.
i managed to get a Scott Spark 970 under €1900 at a sale in autumn 2022.
Biggest mistake was assuming came correctly assembled.. I attached the front wheel and bar and went out and rode. Sub 200km later spokes started to come loose and the dropper cable started causing problems.
Next bike I'll probably buy from a bike store.
67.5* HTA is steep nowadays... my how things have changed. I remember when my ROS9 at 69*ish was SUPER slack.
"DIY cure for Peyronie's disease" had me dying
I very much enjoyed your video. Most amusing, interesting and very informative.
"look at all those colours" i got the reference from scram 411 video😂
You can get a better full suspension for 2k. The Superior xf 939 tr. If you have to have a hardtail you can get the full carbon superior xp 969 fur under 2k
Great reminder of extra costs of mail order, and the benefits of a local shop. Plus you don’t get Lou in the box from Germany.
Correct.
Lou is outside of all the boxes.
-DOD F9
Fort Nine now covering bikes? Cool! I’m a cyclist too. 👍🏻
i just dont care about bikes man, i like the content, it's well made, but i dont like that it takes the place of motorcycle content that is genuinely important to me as i learn to ride
I've been watching F9 for years, despite never having ridden a motorycle, let alone owned one.
But I do ride MTB, so this new direction is my favourite YT thing ever.
2021 polygon siskiu D7 is a full sus with 120mm front and rear travel for $1880 after tax and shipping
Canyon has better parts and quality
Also Canyon as a brand has more value
could you do a comparison between off road motorcycle helmets and full face mtb helmets? i wonder if they are interchangeable
I've got some theories about that and have switched between moto and MTB helmets for bike park in the past. I'll put this on the long list of video ideas!
-DOD F9
@@FortNine alr tysm i appreciate it
I'm alright with keeping mtb and motorcycle stuff on the same channel, two wheels, trails, all good.
I can't believe a Canadian channel would skip the Rocky Mountain Growler!
Some pretty tricky stunts, I’ve never tried riding ( a bike ) backwards.
Found out fast that even swapping hands from normal right hand to right bar grip, left hand to left, led to an immediate unrecoverable situation. That seemed enuf fun 😊
Loving the MTB content!
The assembly part with the chipped frame and lack of proper tools (even though i have them) has made me not want to purchase anything from them.
I have to confess: I was skeptic initially when I saw FortNine incorporating MTB content but I can see now how it does make sense: it's the logical evolution -or rather, devolution- now that the newest MTBs have become almost as good (or better) than a small displacement enduro bike from decades ago -when they were so light, simple and playful-. I find myself looking more for content about ebikes, automatic MTB gearboxes and MTB abs (go flip yourself...) that I'm actually looking for FortNine pulling out one of his cinematic masterpieces featuring an ebike, go figure...
I don't understand the hate for 11speed drivetrains. I'd prefer 11 over 12 speed anyday of the week. Heck, I'm happy with 10 speeds. The only range you're losing is for top speed because you don't have a 10 t cog (which is pretty inefficient due to the small radius anyway). If I was racing that might be a concern, or trying to maintain speeds over 35km/h, but neither of these probably appy to a 35lb hardtail with knobbies. YMMV.
Why are Americans so afraid of owning tools? I don't doubt this guy, he clearly knows his shit, but the warning about the monumental 8mm allen key quest implies that most Americans are mortified at the prospect of going to the hardware store to buy literally one of the simplest tools one can own.
i bought a canyon year ago, given components was better than rival at same price, little i know that i had to pay custom and additional bucks , i would have definitely equivalent or better bike form local store.. I 100% agree with this review!
I got this feeling of F9 will produce their own bike with n without motor that's so innovative, after acquiring so much knowledge from both worlds..
Really, bicycle world is full of rabbit holes, it's competitive but u can't put a motor on it therefore u need to think hard about stuffs to make it fast and efficient whilst maintain the safety aspect.
Deore 11-sp has a 11-51t cassette. The cassette on the Stoic is 11-50t, so the SRAM 12-speed has LESS range.
Great review and agree on going to the local bike shop
Beg to differ on the drivetrain though I would choose 11 speed over 12 for better reliability in shifting, and if the gearing is too hard for the climbs, change the chainring for a smaller one and voila!
Like others are saying. In Europe this is much better value. I bought and eMTB from them a few years ago and the value was unbeatable even after VAT and shipping. It also arrived in a much more complete state.
FYI, Kona Honzo is now $1200 USD ($1648 CAD) and Kona Big Honzo is $999 USD ($1372 CAD) as of early June 2024.