Yep. It's frankly insane that K and T were able to write songs like Green, Call Me, Hate My Way and Vicky's Box when they were 17 years old. Most of us were barely past 12 bar blues at that age!
They are still producing great stuff. Sun Racket in 2020 was excellent but I actually think Purgatory/Paradise, the album before is absolutely brilliant. Speed and Sleep off Throwing Muses is an worth a listen as well.
The Real Ramona is such a great album, I don't think there's a bad song on it. 2 bands come to mind to me when reflecting on Throwing Muses.... Early PJ Harvey and The Faith Healers.
I may have only been 10 when it came out and did not hear in full until I was 15 (1994) It stands as my favourite album of all time. I'm from Liverpool, England to pit this into context. I will listen to Kristen or Tanya recite a shopp8ng list over most stuff today
This is one of my favourite songs of all time on one of my favourite albums of all time. The Real Ramona isn't usually placed in pole position when it comes to assessing The Throwing Muses' body of work (I don't think) but for me it's their most satisfying album both sonically and lyrically. There's a song on this album called Honeychain which contains the musical equivalent of a horror movie jump scare. I play my music LOUD. And the moment one minute into that song has startled me more than once. A remarkable band. Would also recommend Kristin Hersh's solo albums. Especially her debut solo full length Hips and Makers. A stupendous album.
Absolutely read her memoir "Rat Girl" to get a better appreciation of where this music comes from. It's an incredible story and the writing is excellent. Here is an excerpt: "I was used to sound tapping me on the shoulder and singing into my ear. I've heard music that no one else hears since I got hit by a car a couple years ago and sustained a double concussion. I didn't know what to make of this at first, but eventually I came to feel lucky, special, as if I'd tapped into an intelligence. Songs played of their own accord, making themselves up; I listened and copied them down. Last fall, though, the music I heard began to feed off the Doghouse's evil energy. Songs no longer tapped me on the shoulder; they slugged me in the jaw. Intsead of singing to me, they screamed, burrowing into my brain as electricity."
According to an interview Kristin Hersh said the song was about two things -- the first time she ever saw someone die (which was on a bus -- "I saw this lady close her eyes/The bottle slipped between her fingers and slid along the aisle") and a news story she had read about a woman with mental health issues who thought her husband had put a hook in her head and was dragging her around everywhere and she couldn't stop him. Its quite heavy subject matter for a youngster to be writing about, hard to believe how young they all were when they recorded this song. I don't know if either of you have read her most recent book "Seeing Sideways" but a lot of the songs relate to the things going on her life at the time -- she was going through a vicious divorce from her former husband/manager (who was also The Pixies manager) and he got full custody of her oldest son by exaggerating and exploiting her mental health issues and that she was in a touring band. She had also been "outed" in the UK music press about her struggles with mental illness which her bandmates and her record label 4AD had tried to keep away from the press. I never knew any of this until I had read the memoir, its very sad but amazing she could make such compelling art out of it.
I saw a video about a week after we posted this where Kristin was talking between songs and told the story about the woman on the bus. Wish I'd known sooner! Cheers, Jon.
Awesome album! My favorite track too. If my memory services me correctly, like the Pixies , early in their career they were more popular in the U.K. than the states.
Great song from a wonderful album. I agree with another poster that Kristin's songs were almost always more interesting than Tanya's. And it gives me a chance to roll out this anecdote- when I was about 17, me and a few mates saw Throwing Muses and Pixies on their joint 4AD tour in London. We were right down at the front of stage and Tanya's spot was right in front of me. She is one of those performers who likes to choose an audience member to play to, and by sheer luck that night it was my turn. She smiled at me a lot, made loads of eye contact while dancing a little sexily and even reached down to stroke my face at one point. It was both an incredibly sexy and utterly terrifying experience for this then naive teen but a memory that has always stuck with me.
On the album it goes straight from this interesting sonic mess to Not to Soon, the poppiest song they do. I love the Throwing Muses. The singer has a pretty good book called Rat Girl which is definitely worth checking out.
Hey Lord B, thanks for your comment. There are certain songs that when they end the next track starts playing in your head. This is definitely one of them. I think it's the contrast, like you said. Cheers, Jon.
Someone once said that to understand Kristin Hersh lyrics you need to understand just two things. Firstly, if there's a noun you don't recognise, it's probably a species of bird, or possibly reptile or insect. Secondly, if the lyrics tell a strange, surreal, absurd story, it's usually something that literally happened to Kristin.
Also, Fred Abong was never permanent in any of those bands. He stepped in for Real Ramona when Leslie Langston quit, but was soon replaced by Bernard Georges who was the band's guitar tech. He then recorded the first Belly record, but by the time they started touring he was replaced by Gail Fucking Greenwood. Juliana Hatfield also provided harmonies on that first Belly record. Fred was last seen touring with Kristin a few years ago as bassist in her solo band as well as doing a support set of his own songs.
This is my favorite song from my favorite album. Hook in her Head is about Kristin Hersh’s mental illness. You can hear how the song becomes more disjointed and dissonant: there are polyrhythms that separate, then weave back together, then separate again. The drums have a relentless drive, and you can hear voices, which are song fragments from earlier. Is devolves in to outright traffic noises, still relentless, with drums like gunshots. I’m a psychologist who trains other psychologists, and this is the most artistically impactful representation of mental illness. Better and deeper than Van Gogh in my opinion. Thanks for covering this one. Excellent choice and excellent analysis.
@@theaudiophiles7889 Agreed, and sorry for all the brutal typos! I need to stop commenting on youtube on my phone at night without my reading glasses. 👓
If I could point to one album that, as a musician, inspired me as much as or more than any other album, it would be the first Throwing Muses album along with the Doghouse demo of those songs
I owed their first album and to tell you the truth I never put it on often. Same era of EVOL/BH Surfer. Don’t know this one, but liked the guitar freak.
This is way, way above their first album. This was the same year as Blue Lines, Loveless, No Pocky for Kitty, Every Good Boy Deserves Fudge and of course Schubert Dip by EMF....unbelievable! Cheers, Jon.
@@theaudiophiles7889 Thanks, I'll give it a try. I was a traveling military man, so in UK (home) it was vinyl, and for away, cassettes. Somewhere in 90-91, I just stopped and didn't resume until the 00s. I know I missed a lot of music. Cheers
Great song, great album, greater band. Both Hersh and Donnelly’s guitar playing is so recognisable… not to mention their voices. Had the pleasure of seeing them play in a small venue in Cork in 2011… no Donnelly though. But the drummer Narcizo was amazing on drums… he likes to pound those toms…. But he did use the cymbals too!😅….here my recording of a song Pearl from that gig…. th-cam.com/video/K4pJq7hTULc/w-d-xo.html
@@theaudiophiles7889 yeah… great venue…small….leading to intense gigs….like I’ve seen Swans there (super intense)…Lemonheads…Wedding Present…Mudhoney….House of Love…now there’s a band that you could drop a track from…. Real Animal Maybe!👍
Wow, I hadn't heard this in a bit! 😀 You can tell that David Narcizo was trained in classic drum technique by the way he holds his sticks: mallet grip in the right hand, pencil grip in the left. The reason being, that when playing a drum slung on your hip, if you hold both sticks as mallets you get uneven weight and can't play a proper roll. See also: Stewart Copeland. (I'm just full of stuff today you didn't need to know.) @Jon - TH-cam had one of its better moments today and offered me The Skids, who I don't think made a ripple the other side of The Pond; though their late lamented guitarist did in a later incarnation.
Love me some Adamson (Chance is one of the great songs from that period), but never that keen on Jobson. Copeland is an amazing guy and I loved the way he never took any of Sting's shit - always baiting him. Was thinking about some early album track Police for Andy. Cheers, Jon.
I enjoyed it. The Throwing Muses were a band that were around when I was getting into music as a teen, but I never bought their music. The wig-out at the end reminded me of Hüsker Du's Reoccurring Dreams. It was a bit light on melody, but interesting sounds.
A great song. I’ll admit that I lean toward their later work when introducing people to them if I don’t know their tolerance of punk. I gave Greg “She Floated Away.” I lean toward giving Andy “Sorry Somehow” or “Don’t Want to Know if You Are Lonely.”
Some of the guitar parts towards the latter part of the song has echoes of the guitar playing in some Butthole Surfers songs. Their main guitarist…Paul Leary was a ‘mind blowing’ guitarist….in a Butthole Surfers sort of way!😅
The line about the woman character in the song literally having a hook in her head is taken from actual testimony in a police case or something. Unlike the majority of Hersh's songs it is not autobiographical but taken from a news item.
Thanks Jon. Not sure if the following band is on your list… Let’s Active Hard to find songs on TH-cam, but I did find a posting of the studio version of “Waters Part” th-cam.com/video/FHZNMw_68NQ/w-d-xo.html
Hi guys. Musically this was interesting but a bit of a miss for me. But, it's good to be open to new stuff. (I might add, being deaf in one ear and not hearing stereo means I don't hear the stereo effects which may be important for some songs).
![เป็นไปได้ไหม - WanMai [Official MV]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/_6lZ6b3_7Vo/mqdefault.jpg)
![เปิดบ้าน โคตรสวย ป๋องกพล รู้จักตั้งนาน เพิ่งรู้ว่ารวย!!! l [Nickynachat]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/tmgCF_2HfYI/mqdefault.jpg)
No one ever reacts to Throwing Muses and they are one of my favorite bands of all times. Good on you guys for posting this
And that's why we do this shit. It certainly isn't for the fame and millions of views!
Cheers, Jon.
The first Throwing Muses record is one of the best debuts ever!
I'd agree. Along with original albums by The Smiths and REM
Yep. It's frankly insane that K and T were able to write songs like Green, Call Me, Hate My Way and Vicky's Box when they were 17 years old. Most of us were barely past 12 bar blues at that age!
They are still producing great stuff. Sun Racket in 2020 was excellent but I actually think Purgatory/Paradise, the album before is absolutely brilliant. Speed and Sleep off Throwing Muses is an worth a listen as well.
The Real Ramona is such a great album, I don't think there's a bad song on it. 2 bands come to mind to me when reflecting on Throwing Muses.... Early PJ Harvey and The Faith Healers.
Love both of those - there's a Th' Faith Healers track coming up in a few weeks.
Cheers, Jon.
I may have only been 10 when it came out and did not hear in full until I was 15 (1994) It stands as my favourite album of all time. I'm from Liverpool, England to pit this into context. I will listen to Kristen or Tanya recite a shopp8ng list over most stuff today
This is one of my favourite songs of all time on one of my favourite albums of all time. The Real Ramona isn't usually placed in pole position when it comes to assessing The Throwing Muses' body of work (I don't think) but for me it's their most satisfying album both sonically and lyrically. There's a song on this album called Honeychain which contains the musical equivalent of a horror movie jump scare. I play my music LOUD. And the moment one minute into that song has startled me more than once. A remarkable band. Would also recommend Kristin Hersh's solo albums. Especially her debut solo full length Hips and Makers. A stupendous album.
Absolutely read her memoir "Rat Girl" to get a better appreciation of where this music comes from. It's an incredible story and the writing is excellent. Here is an excerpt:
"I was used to sound tapping me on the shoulder and singing into my ear. I've heard music that no one else hears since I got hit by a car a couple years ago and sustained a double concussion. I didn't know what to make of this at first, but eventually I came to feel lucky, special, as if I'd tapped into an intelligence. Songs played of their own accord, making themselves up; I listened and copied them down. Last fall, though, the music I heard began to feed off the Doghouse's evil energy. Songs no longer tapped me on the shoulder; they slugged me in the jaw. Intsead of singing to me, they screamed, burrowing into my brain as electricity."
According to an interview Kristin Hersh said the song was about two things -- the first time she ever saw someone die (which was on a bus -- "I saw this lady close her eyes/The bottle slipped between her fingers and slid along the aisle") and a news story she had read about a woman with mental health issues who thought her husband had put a hook in her head and was dragging her around everywhere and she couldn't stop him. Its quite heavy subject matter for a youngster to be writing about, hard to believe how young they all were when they recorded this song.
I don't know if either of you have read her most recent book "Seeing Sideways" but a lot of the songs relate to the things going on her life at the time -- she was going through a vicious divorce from her former husband/manager (who was also The Pixies manager) and he got full custody of her oldest son by exaggerating and exploiting her mental health issues and that she was in a touring band. She had also been "outed" in the UK music press about her struggles with mental illness which her bandmates and her record label 4AD had tried to keep away from the press. I never knew any of this until I had read the memoir, its very sad but amazing she could make such compelling art out of it.
I saw a video about a week after we posted this where Kristin was talking between songs and told the story about the woman on the bus. Wish I'd known sooner!
Cheers, Jon.
Great band. Great book(s)
I love this band. One of my favorite tracks by them was 'Fish'
Awesome album! My favorite track too. If my memory services me correctly, like the Pixies , early in their career they were more popular in the U.K. than the states.
Great song from a wonderful album. I agree with another poster that Kristin's songs were almost always more interesting than Tanya's.
And it gives me a chance to roll out this anecdote- when I was about 17, me and a few mates saw Throwing Muses and Pixies on their joint 4AD tour in London. We were right down at the front of stage and Tanya's spot was right in front of me. She is one of those performers who likes to choose an audience member to play to, and by sheer luck that night it was my turn. She smiled at me a lot, made loads of eye contact while dancing a little sexily and even reached down to stroke my face at one point.
It was both an incredibly sexy and utterly terrifying experience for this then naive teen but a memory that has always stuck with me.
Lucky boy. 😊
On the album it goes straight from this interesting sonic mess to Not to Soon, the poppiest song they do. I love the Throwing Muses. The singer has a pretty good book called Rat Girl which is definitely worth checking out.
Hey Lord B, thanks for your comment. There are certain songs that when they end the next track starts playing in your head. This is definitely one of them. I think it's the contrast, like you said.
Cheers, Jon.
Someone once said that to understand Kristin Hersh lyrics you need to understand just two things. Firstly, if there's a noun you don't recognise, it's probably a species of bird, or possibly reptile or insect. Secondly, if the lyrics tell a strange, surreal, absurd story, it's usually something that literally happened to Kristin.
Also, Fred Abong was never permanent in any of those bands. He stepped in for Real Ramona when Leslie Langston quit, but was soon replaced by Bernard Georges who was the band's guitar tech. He then recorded the first Belly record, but by the time they started touring he was replaced by Gail Fucking Greenwood. Juliana Hatfield also provided harmonies on that first Belly record. Fred was last seen touring with Kristin a few years ago as bassist in her solo band as well as doing a support set of his own songs.
This is my favorite song from my favorite album. Hook in her Head is about Kristin Hersh’s mental illness. You can hear how the song becomes more disjointed and dissonant: there are polyrhythms that separate, then weave back together, then separate again. The drums have a relentless drive, and you can hear voices, which are song fragments from earlier. Is devolves in to outright traffic noises, still relentless, with drums like gunshots.
I’m a psychologist who trains other psychologists, and this is the most artistically impactful representation of mental illness. Better and deeper than Van Gogh in my opinion. Thanks for covering this one. Excellent choice and excellent analysis.
Thanks for your comment. I don't understand why The Real Ramona isn't held up as one of the finest 90's albums. It is in my book.
Cheers, Jon.
@@theaudiophiles7889 Agreed, and sorry for all the brutal typos! I need to stop commenting on youtube on my phone at night without my reading glasses. 👓
I recommend the recent Throwing Muses album .... start with 'Bo Diddley Bridge' ....
Thanks Andy - not familiar with the new album. I'll add it to the list.
Cheers, Jon.
If I could point to one album that, as a musician, inspired me as much as or more than any other album, it would be the first Throwing Muses album along with the Doghouse demo of those songs
Enjoyed the show guys, the tune was pretty good, I didnt notice the cymbals either, however I thought the drumming was great.
Brilliant Band with so many Fantastic Albums. The Pixies seem to be better known but Throwing Muses were head and shoulders above them.
They are a brilliant band. Can't agree with you about Pixies. Each to their own.
Cheers, Jon.
I owed their first album and to tell you the truth I never put it on often. Same era of EVOL/BH Surfer. Don’t know this one, but liked the guitar freak.
This is way, way above their first album. This was the same year as Blue Lines, Loveless, No Pocky for Kitty, Every Good Boy Deserves Fudge and of course Schubert Dip by EMF....unbelievable!
Cheers, Jon.
@@theaudiophiles7889 Thanks, I'll give it a try. I was a traveling military man, so in UK (home) it was vinyl, and for away, cassettes. Somewhere in 90-91, I just stopped and didn't resume until the 00s. I know I missed a lot of music. Cheers
Great song, great album, greater band. Both Hersh and Donnelly’s guitar playing is so recognisable… not to mention their voices. Had the pleasure of seeing them play in a small venue in Cork in 2011… no Donnelly though. But the drummer Narcizo was amazing on drums… he likes to pound those toms…. But he did use the cymbals too!😅….here my recording of a song Pearl from that gig…. th-cam.com/video/K4pJq7hTULc/w-d-xo.html
Another great song of theirs. Looks a fantastic venue - up close and personal. Nice to see those cymbals getting smacked!
@@theaudiophiles7889 yeah… great venue…small….leading to intense gigs….like I’ve seen Swans there (super intense)…Lemonheads…Wedding Present…Mudhoney….House of Love…now there’s a band that you could drop a track from…. Real Animal
Maybe!👍
Wow, I hadn't heard this in a bit! 😀
You can tell that David Narcizo was trained in classic drum technique by the way he holds his sticks: mallet grip in the right hand, pencil grip in the left. The reason being, that when playing a drum slung on your hip, if you hold both sticks as mallets you get uneven weight and can't play a proper roll. See also: Stewart Copeland. (I'm just full of stuff today you didn't need to know.)
@Jon - TH-cam had one of its better moments today and offered me The Skids, who I don't think made a ripple the other side of The Pond; though their late lamented guitarist did in a later incarnation.
Love me some Adamson (Chance is one of the great songs from that period), but never that keen on Jobson.
Copeland is an amazing guy and I loved the way he never took any of Sting's shit - always baiting him. Was thinking about some early album track Police for Andy.
Cheers, Jon.
@@theaudiophiles7889 Another drummer who used classic technique and took no shit from his singer: Charlie Watts.
Go to one of the up and coming concerts.
I enjoyed it. The Throwing Muses were a band that were around when I was getting into music as a teen, but I never bought their music. The wig-out at the end reminded me of Hüsker Du's Reoccurring Dreams. It was a bit light on melody, but interesting sounds.
Andy needs some Husker Du.
@@bobpage665 everybody needs some Hüsker Dü! 'Chartered Trips' might be a good introduction.
A great song. I’ll admit that I lean toward their later work when introducing people to them if I don’t know their tolerance of punk.
I gave Greg “She Floated Away.”
I lean toward giving Andy “Sorry Somehow” or “Don’t Want to Know if You Are Lonely.”
@@boq780_2.0 ‘Whatever’ from Zen Arcade is brilliant too. Great lyrics.
Some of the guitar parts towards the latter part of the song has echoes of the guitar playing in some Butthole Surfers songs. Their main guitarist…Paul Leary was a ‘mind blowing’ guitarist….in a Butthole Surfers sort of way!😅
The line about the woman character in the song literally having a hook in her head is taken from actual testimony in a police case or something. Unlike the majority of Hersh's songs it is not autobiographical but taken from a news item.
I’ve always gravitated more to Kristin’s songs than Tanya’s. They make me feel off balance in a good way.
Not a bad assumption Andy. They were on the 4AD record label.
I would never accuse you of lying Jon. I was leaning toward Counting Backwards.
@@bobpage665 And I was toying with Red Shoes, but here we are...
@@bobpage665 I think I bought their early stuff purely because it was on 4AD.
Cheers, Jon.
Thanks Jon.
Not sure if the following band is on your list…
Let’s Active
Hard to find songs on TH-cam, but I did find a posting of the studio version of “Waters Part”
th-cam.com/video/FHZNMw_68NQ/w-d-xo.html
Hi guys. Musically this was interesting but a bit of a miss for me. But, it's good to be open to new stuff. (I might add, being deaf in one ear and not hearing stereo means I don't hear the stereo effects which may be important for some songs).
We appreciate your candor and love your approach. Thank you for the view and the comment! - Andy