@@rexsceleratorum1632 They really don't. Leadscrews would be better and don't cost much more. About 150 USD total. On a 3D printer? Fine, because the toolhead has a negligible force exerted on it by the "workpiece." But with a router? There's quite a bit more force, and that resultant deflection is evident in this video. You shouldn't have to compensate that much as Stefan did.
@@theofficialczex1708 I think belts could work. But should not be the way to go in the 3000€ priceclass and not those tiny (9mm?) belts. They could've used 15mm belts. Open V-Slot rollers for a chip producing machine is simply not thoroughly thought through.
Ooh, those XLR-style plugs are a real highlight of the whole thing. More devices should do that; those are highly durable, hard (or impossible if arranged correctly) to mix up, and made to be disconnected/reconnected thousands of times, which makes it possible to hack this thing to do more by swapping cables...
Mini-XLRs are great. I used them for my bike light batteries! Not waterproof but it's corrosion, rather than short-circuiting, that's the enemy for low voltage power connections and the mini-XLRs are almost always gold plated so they work great.
@@cooperised oooh there are mini 5-pin connectors too! That would be great for connecting up stepper motors and such. For waterproof needs, looks like there are many off-the shelf and automotive connectors for that too. I'm just glad to see nicer connectors than the standard small JST-variations, which aren't meant for many cycles or rugged use at all! (I do see that JST offers a billion connectors, but I mean the usual JST-XH you see on 3D printers)
I won't ask my questions here, it would take too much space... lol I am working on R&D on a 5 axist #D printer that can allow you to reduce to nill the internal suppots and to a minimum the external ones, also working to an add on to make it a 7 axis machine, the idea is that anybody can 3D prnint the key components and than dissasemble their regluar cheap 3D chinese made printer, and with a few more parts to buy online can transform them in a 5 or 7 axis machine. If Zellerfeld is interested in such an approcah for the machines they use, I can help. It reduces the printing time (by not printing supports, at least not everywhere) reduces the materials consumed, for the same reason, and the post printing time for not having to clean so many supports and than sand the part to make it look nice where the supports were attached.
I appreciate the effort they put in the user experience. The assembly, the screen, remote folder and ease of use are all nice. That being said the construction of the machine seems concerning. Massive extrusions for the frame but a flimsy board to mount the Y-axis? Weak belt drives, rollers that clog, a trapezoidal thread z and open-loop steppers??
The Pro version uses ball screws and linear rails, but those high-quality & precision parts are reflected in the price. The y-axis plates are similar design though, and will likely have the same rigidity problems. Seems like the Pro version is still intended for soft materials or light aluminum work. Are the steppers (without encoders) a big deal? They should be more than accurate enough, unless they lose steps - which shouldn't happen at the cutting loads this machine is intended for.
I absolutely LOVE their use of XLR connectors for the connections. Its such a great and sturdy connector, especially considering they're using the best brand available, Neutrik.
While you can get complete kits for significantly less money that have much better mechanics (e.g. RatRig Killerbee with linear rails and leadscrews on all axis) the premade electronics and interface looks very well made and definitely much better than what RatRig offers. Also 5h assembly is very quick for a CNC kit, my RatRig one was closer to 25h.
Totally agree, but then again Stefan has a lot of experience and there is a chance a newbie would have a hard time assembling this. Also killerbee at least the last time I looked has a huge waiting list
I'll laugh at any company that chooses to purchase one of these. Absolute garbage for commercial use. You say time is money, so why would a company waste time cutting a part that is going to be under or over sized. Sounds like it produces plenty of scrap or parts that require unnecessary post processing.
Another great video! I need to get back to playing with my 3040 CNC machine. I did notice that it looks like your Y-axis belt path would be better if it ran under two rollers on both front and back instead of just one as shown at 0:22. It would give more tooth engagement on the drive pulley.
I think these machines would be great for educational use or in maker spaces. IMO it is too expensive for makers and not professional enough for, well, professional use.
Great video! I do think the Mekanika cnc's performance is lackluster for the price. Could you try building the MPCNC? It's 3D printed, costs ~300$, and can be configured for CNC milling, plasma cutting, laser cutting, and more. I would like to see how competitive it is with this machine.
Interface and software looks awesome, but i don't like belts and rollers. I made time ago my own small cnc machine and i love it. The most important, if you have time and like diy universe, search info and make your own machine. Great video!!
Before you route out the final guitar body, ask your friend to consider ditching the "swimming pool" pickup cavity and instead routing around the shapes of the individual pickups. it's less machining and many consider it to make a better sounding guitar.
It's gonna sound exactly the same, the body of an electrical guitar does nothing for the sound. I't is just gonna take less machining, and for me it's gonna look better because you don't need to use an ugly pickguard on your guitar. :)
@@hebus4 the most important thing about the body of an electric guitar in terms of affecting sound is the rigidity of the structure from bridge to nut. It won't make much difference in a strat because of the tremolo has a much greater impact on rigidity. Still, guitarists enjoy arguing the toss.
Interesting kit but I would rather recommend a better construction using ball screws and trapezoidal linear guides. I have had great experience with two machines from OmioCNC (China): a X6-2200L and more recently a X8-2200L. It is way stiffer than the Mekanika (Hiwin HR20 guides and ball screws on all axes) and has a 2kW water cooled ER20 spindle..
Zellerfeld is looking for the best 3D printing engineers globally. Check out their job listings: geni.us/ZellerfeldJobs _Would you rather build a DIY CNC router or buy a finished kit?_ Update #1 22-03-07: The "DI Spindel" upgrade is not only the spindle itself but also includes additional electronics within the electronics box, which makes the €300 price a bit more reasonable but also means that you will not be able to upgrade to the DI Spindle if you purchase the Standard Spindle at first.
Thank you for the fantastic, honest, useful and detailed review. I prefer to build my own, more capable and hackable for under 2k. MPCNC: th-cam.com/video/ztcMPmEYCmw/w-d-xo.html
Vielen Dank für die Werbung, ich schreibe gerade meine Masterarbeit im Themenbereich 3D gedruckter Schuh. Das sie jetzt in Hamburg (in der Nähe) sind wusste ich nicht und ich denke ich werde mit ihnen Kontakt aufnehmen. Vielen Dank
Thank heavens that instrument body was only a test piece. I gasped in horror when I saw the cupping-prone grain pattern on your pine blank! I loved your plywood/3D printed clamps.
This is a formidable piece of kit! I think you are used to Chinese prices, but I think, specially with this sophisticated interface, it is a very very good router
The price is expected because just those "color coded connectors" (depending if they're 3, 4 or 5-pin ones) cost like 3.50-7.50€/piece.... +0.25e for the color coding ring :) I mean... they use *Neutrik* XLR connectors... they're serious.
Deckel FP3 or an old Maho with heidenhain language cost about 5000 - 10000 Euro. Imho a much more better deal. Because those machines have a more powerful engine with 9,6 kW and are heavy 4200 kg (which is important for vibrational stiffness and so on). These are properties which are necessary for machining steel and other alloys.
Great points and fair conclusion. I do like that transparency! Cool machine though, but definitely would have liked to see covers on the rails. Seems similar to the X-Carve here in the states, if so, there are tons of printed things you can use for upgrades.
I still feel like these things seem way more expensive than they should be. If 90% of the parts they are using are things you'd see on a CR-10 but with bigger extrusions then they aren't likely worth the multi-thousand $ pricetags. I feel like it should be relatively easy for the community to make something in this same style for far far cheaper.
There are already countless projects for DIY CNC routers that use alu extrusions (or metal pipes), linear rails and/or v-rollers and 3D-printed parts that can get you a decently sized machine for
@@NiyaKouya Sounds like what I would've expected (I'm not in the DIY CNC community). It has been constantly ridiculous seeing these multi-thousand machines that are no where near worth that much getting tons of attention by YTers.
That where my first thoughts too as an ender3max user. The big difference is that 3d printers produce a workpiece and had not to cut off something which has always a force resistance. That's why I see the timing belts and rolers a very cheap method for cnc routers.
for hobby level it's fine but if you want to be serious with aluminum and other metal project you need to upgrade with linear bearing and ball screw and don't forget the motor need more HP and torque.
I would be interested to see what the ideal need for this machine would be? Love your work but the limitations you listed had me scraping my head as to where it shines. I will be buying my first cnc this year and would love some ideas for a less limited machine or where this machine would be excellent.
I´m in search for a good CNC Router for hobbyist. Should have a bed size of at least 300x300mm and should be possible to drill a 100mm deep hole. Also it should can handle aluminum without problems all day long.
I rather like the idea of the belts - but I think they should be used in the OX style, where there´s a belt glued to the bottom of the V-channel with the teeth up abd the drive belt engages with the glued belt - resulting in very little - to no flex,
I appreciate your honesty Stephan! I agree with you on the last point. There is a better choice for makers and even businesses which is to build their own cnc. There are many open source machines on the internet that are far more capable than the Mekanika with an affordable price. Check out PrintNC for example. In my opinion the electronical side of the mekanika is solid but the mechanical side is a joke for that price.
joke is maybe a bit too harsh. you have to consider that the hole is more than the sum of the pieces here. I also think the belts are a very brave decision but the results prove they made it work. I personally see more of a problem in the low z travel. that could have been fixed with very little money
@@Shocker99 yes that is in fact a little bit worrying. I personally upgrade these Maschines after I buy them. That belt system would be the first thing to go. But in general I think it's still a good value for Money
@@savejeff15 I only meant that if you want to charge customers for that money, at least choose parts that have lower maintenance such as ball screws instead of 3d printer wheels and belts. That is just how i see it.
Great video, I like the most is the touch probe find part location. thank you. I have added the wire and is working fine. appreciate your input with this video.
very nice product. I think the price is pretty good. i think its the lowest price where no important corners must be cut. The belds are a brave decision but they seemed to make it work. only real negative point is the low z travel. would have been super easy to just add 5-10cm by just increasing the length of some parts. i consider buying this at it seems very well made and I don't want the pain of finishing/fixing half complete china cnc mashines
If they increased the Z travel they would increase the leverage on the v-rollers making the machine much less rigid. While I agree that it is very limiting (I have 12cm on my KillerBee and still wish I had more), it would likely make the machine unusable for anything apart from wood if they increased the Z height much at all.
I disagree. It's not using anything that you wouldn't find in any cheap chinese 3D printer but for thousands of $. I feel like the community could easily design something with equal performance for a fraction of the price.
@@LanceThumping That's not the point here. You will always be able to build something cheaper and better yourself, but not in 5 hours and not with easy to follow instructions and prewired electronics. Those who know how to build something themselves or have the time to learn should not buy this machine, but they're also not the target audience.
I feel like the belt system isn't so great. Thicker belts are almost certainly a must to make it stiffer, and a dual-belt system like used on some MPCNCs would help as well. Maybe you can try modding it for larger belts and make a video? Also, the upgrades are almost certainly overpriced.
Nice Video! Could you show more of the Electronics of this Mill. Which parts are used & how the emergency stop is connected to the mill? Its open source, but i dont understand which parts needed. Could you show as a video with detail rich of the wiring and electrics.
Wish I lived near Hamburg so I could apply for one of the jobs. The CNC information at their website looks interesting and I hope to learn a lot there. Thank you Stefan.
interesting. i would like a home cnc mill for small projects but so far the money is tight. this is the only personal use machine i knew of, i'm more used to the big professional ones. i have to look into what else is there! thank you for the review!
I used PlanetCNC for my onwn diy CNC machine. It's a nice packed, but becarfull with more advanced commands like G41/G42/G40. They will crash your Machine! PlanetCNC sas they support thos commands, but they don't do it right. You are fine as long as you don't us cuttercompensation in Fusion360. If you want to build your onw CNC use LinuxCNC or EdingCNC. I use LinuxCNC in my newest machine.
In my opinion the v rollers is not a good idea. I think Chinese linear rails would have even been a better option. Some mgn15s or a little bigger would have been nice to see. I get that they are more expensive, but you can already see some wheel wear in your b role
Wow, 4k for a machine that does not have normal rails, ball screws and the cheapest spindle instead of a normal three-phase one. I do not know something about the construction of machine tools in the EU.
Hi Stefan, nice piece of hardware, but sometimes you are saying "sometimes" a bit too often... lol For such a large machine I would of cohoosen cable cored timing belts (that also require larger radius pulleys) to avoid the backlash. On this tune, while working to my Rumba 5 axis design, I decided 6 models would be available, defined by the available working cube, so there is 200X200, than 300X300 and 400X400 series that can use regular timing belts, but personaly at 300X300 and above I suggest cable cored ones (plus wider belts: 10mm) and 8mm shaft Nema 17 steppers, (also because if you add the other 2 axis, S and T to go 7 axis printing, you actually add more weight that can cause baclash in printing). Bu the next 3 sizes cube are 600X600, than 800X800 and 1000X1000, and here not only I jump to Nema 23 steppers and mandatory cable cored timing belts, slighlty wider, like ... 12 mm to 16mm wide, at least for the X, Y Z U and V axiz, the S and T might still do with Nema 17 at 8mm shaft motors. Obviously with such belts my 3D printers can do routing of light materials as well, up to Aluminium and some tough hardwood, but not iron or steel. And I want my printers to be easy to fully enclose in their own oven, that means I am now designing water cooling systems for the cheap stepper motors you can find on the shelf, for there are no water cooled stepper motors at decent prices tht I know of..
7:57 H.O.L.Y. C.R.A.P. a "warranty void if removed" sticker on a machine targeting makers? The audacity to do that is enough to make me never want to buy anything from that company.
Those roller guides are a crime to put on an a CNC router imo. Once this has been spec'ed out to acceptable level you probably pay just as much as for a Sorotec that has a much more rigid frame. The control panel is kinda neat though but would not get me to buy this.
I would love to see more videos on current cncs. I've been looking at a suuuuper cheap one (like $200 if possible) that at least isn't a fire hazard. It's more for me to see if I should learn more about cncs or possibly laser cutter. Oh, a DIY cnc cutter? I do have a dremel....
I wouldn't be too concerned about the machine starting a fire, because unlike a 3D printer, you can't really leave a CNC Router unattended anyway. So a fire extinguisher does work since there's someone around to use it.
What sucks is that they are taking the printer/razor approach to prices, by selling the main machine at a fair price but selling accessories/necessary consumables at a ridiculous cost
Moin Stefan Ich weis nicht was die mehr kosten rechtfertigen wenn man bedenkt das es einfach nur ein 3D Drücker ist in ein wenig größer, das einzige was anders ist, ist der fräse Kopf. Vllt kannst du mir auf die Sprünge helfen warum die kleine Ausführung knapp 2700€ rechtfertigt, wenn es jetzt heist es ist die tolle Software die es aus macht, muss ich leider sagen das es Klipper auch getan hätte. mit 2000€ wäre ich noch einverstanden für ein CNC tisch aber keine 2700€ und auch nicht bei der geringen Präzision die du ja selber wenn ich das richtig verstanden habe im Video ansprichst
What I do not get is the frame of this machine. For some reason, extremely rigid and thick aluminum extrusions are used, of course for sturdiness. But why use those timing belts, to throw all that accuracy you gain with such a frame away? But well, it could just be my bitch *ss complaining.
Excluding the HMI/control system, i wonder how much the machines costs? Using timing belts seems like a silly cost cutting idea for an aluminium machine. We have a 'budget' CNC machine at work. The HMI/control system on it costs $€£250. And it cuts parts to well within tolerance every time.
I don't like the design of the tool length probe. Some endmills are coated in a non conductive coating which would make the measuring process not very reliable. At this price point I would have expected better. At leas a tactile switched probe.
With an ACME screw you cannot get the hi movement speed you need for cutting wood. If you machine moves slow, your spindle must turn slow, and everything is slow then, otherwise you burn mills and material pretty fast.
Vielen Dank für die gute Produktvorführung samt Tipps, Tricks und auch negativen Punkten. Die begrenzte Bearbeitungshöhe ist natürlich blöd, eventuell könnte man diese durch Erweiterungsplatten erhöhen.
Hey mate, Cornelius (CEO) here. For good fits we can definitely cover moving costs! Most important to us is that we build a strong culture of people who are as passionate about printing as we are!
@@corneliusschmitt3629 Heyo, that's mighty generous. I'm bound by family and PhD studies (lattice optimization in AM). Would you consider offering remote opportunities in the future? I'm not too far away but can't move over to Hamburg, even if I wanted to, but your company and goal is really interesting.
@@corneliusschmitt3629 As I replied to Layershift comment above: I am working on R&D on a 5 axist 3 D printer that can allow you to reduce to nill the internal suppots and to a minimum the external ones, also working to an add on to make it a 7 axis machine, the idea is that anybody can 3D print the key components and than dissasemble their regluar cheap 3D chinese made printer, and with a few more parts to buy online can transform them in a 5 or 7 axis machine (works for the expensive printers too). If Zellerfeld is interested in such an approcah for the machines they use, I can help. It reduces the printing time (by not printing supports, at least not everywhere) reduces the materials consumed, for the same reason, and the post printing time for not having to clean so many supports and than sand the part to make it look nice where the supports were attached.
Ugh, a warranty void if removed sticker on a CNC router that you mostly have to assemble yourself? I guess it's not sold to USA consumers which would make that sticker illegal...
@@CNCKitchen das war bei mir auch so, die Steuerung bietet einige Features wie das 3D antasten, und eine Werkzeugverwaltung. ist eben nicht so Verbreitet, doch vll. helfen die Jungs etwas nach ;)
I can see a future where you order you shoes online an receive a .stl/3mf file and a spool of filament. Or, you scan your feet with your phone the send that with your order to receive said file and a spool of filament.
This guy is probably one of my favorite TH-camrs
😍 Appreciate it!
Same here!
@@CNCKitchen is it postible to Print using solder Wire as Filament ?
@@Enderkruemel that could be interesting
It so crazy how much time and effort you put in your videos to achieve such an high quality!
The belt-driven XY plane and V-slot rollers are a dealbreaker.
He said it is the smallest of the lineup, I guess the belts make sense in a low-end large format CNC
@@rexsceleratorum1632 They really don't. Leadscrews would be better and don't cost much more. About 150 USD total. On a 3D printer? Fine, because the toolhead has a negligible force exerted on it by the "workpiece." But with a router? There's quite a bit more force, and that resultant deflection is evident in this video. You shouldn't have to compensate that much as Stefan did.
@@theofficialczex1708 I think belts could work. But should not be the way to go in the 3000€ priceclass and not those tiny (9mm?) belts. They could've used 15mm belts. Open V-Slot rollers for a chip producing machine is simply not thoroughly thought through.
Ooh, those XLR-style plugs are a real highlight of the whole thing. More devices should do that; those are highly durable, hard (or impossible if arranged correctly) to mix up, and made to be disconnected/reconnected thousands of times, which makes it possible to hack this thing to do more by swapping cables...
Mini-XLRs are great. I used them for my bike light batteries! Not waterproof but it's corrosion, rather than short-circuiting, that's the enemy for low voltage power connections and the mini-XLRs are almost always gold plated so they work great.
@@cooperised oooh there are mini 5-pin connectors too! That would be great for connecting up stepper motors and such.
For waterproof needs, looks like there are many off-the shelf and automotive connectors for that too.
I'm just glad to see nicer connectors than the standard small JST-variations, which aren't meant for many cycles or rugged use at all! (I do see that JST offers a billion connectors, but I mean the usual JST-XH you see on 3D printers)
Thanks for the shoutout Stefan! If anyone has questions regarding Zellerfeld do not hesitate dropping them here!
Any time!
I won't ask my questions here, it would take too much space... lol
I am working on R&D on a 5 axist #D printer that can allow you to reduce to nill the internal suppots and to a minimum the external ones, also working to an add on to make it a 7 axis machine, the idea is that anybody can 3D prnint the key components and than dissasemble their regluar cheap 3D chinese made printer, and with a few more parts to buy online can transform them in a 5 or 7 axis machine.
If Zellerfeld is interested in such an approcah for the machines they use, I can help. It reduces the printing time (by not printing supports, at least not everywhere) reduces the materials consumed, for the same reason, and the post printing time for not having to clean so many supports and than sand the part to make it look nice where the supports were attached.
I appreciate the effort they put in the user experience. The assembly, the screen, remote folder and ease of use are all nice.
That being said the construction of the machine seems concerning. Massive extrusions for the frame but a flimsy board to mount the Y-axis? Weak belt drives, rollers that clog, a trapezoidal thread z and open-loop steppers??
The Pro version uses ball screws and linear rails, but those high-quality & precision parts are reflected in the price.
The y-axis plates are similar design though, and will likely have the same rigidity problems. Seems like the Pro version is still intended for soft materials or light aluminum work.
Are the steppers (without encoders) a big deal? They should be more than accurate enough, unless they lose steps - which shouldn't happen at the cutting loads this machine is intended for.
I absolutely LOVE their use of XLR connectors for the connections. Its such a great and sturdy connector, especially considering they're using the best brand available, Neutrik.
While you can get complete kits for significantly less money that have much better mechanics (e.g. RatRig Killerbee with linear rails and leadscrews on all axis) the premade electronics and interface looks very well made and definitely much better than what RatRig offers. Also 5h assembly is very quick for a CNC kit, my RatRig one was closer to 25h.
Totally agree, but then again Stefan has a lot of experience and there is a chance a newbie would have a hard time assembling this. Also killerbee at least the last time I looked has a huge waiting list
Mine too I wish I was into 3D printing when he was in Goshen it’s only an hour from my house now I watch him nonstop
I'll laugh at any company that chooses to purchase one of these.
Absolute garbage for commercial use. You say time is money, so why would a company waste time cutting a part that is going to be under or over sized. Sounds like it produces plenty of scrap or parts that require unnecessary post processing.
Another great video! I need to get back to playing with my 3040 CNC machine. I did notice that it looks like your Y-axis belt path would be better if it ran under two rollers on both front and back instead of just one as shown at 0:22. It would give more tooth engagement on the drive pulley.
I think these machines would be great for educational use or in maker spaces. IMO it is too expensive for makers and not professional enough for, well, professional use.
The last couple seconds at every vid makes this just so great! ❤️
Great video! I do think the Mekanika cnc's performance is lackluster for the price. Could you try building the MPCNC? It's 3D printed, costs ~300$, and can be configured for CNC milling, plasma cutting, laser cutting, and more. I would like to see how competitive it is with this machine.
I never would have watched this video if it wasn't CNCKitchen
Happy to hear that :-)
Interface and software looks awesome, but i don't like belts and rollers. I made time ago my own small cnc machine and i love it. The most important, if you have time and like diy universe, search info and make your own machine. Great video!!
Before you route out the final guitar body, ask your friend to consider ditching the "swimming pool" pickup cavity and instead routing around the shapes of the individual pickups. it's less machining and many consider it to make a better sounding guitar.
It's gonna sound exactly the same, the body of an electrical guitar does nothing for the sound. I't is just gonna take less machining, and for me it's gonna look better because you don't need to use an ugly pickguard on your guitar. :)
@@hebus4 the most important thing about the body of an electric guitar in terms of affecting sound is the rigidity of the structure from bridge to nut. It won't make much difference in a strat because of the tremolo has a much greater impact on rigidity. Still, guitarists enjoy arguing the toss.
@@KX36 yup that's the only thing besides strings and the electro stuff. All other is just bs to sell ;)
Interesting kit but I would rather recommend a better construction using ball screws and trapezoidal linear guides. I have had great experience with two machines from OmioCNC (China): a X6-2200L and more recently a X8-2200L. It is way stiffer than the Mekanika (Hiwin HR20 guides and ball screws on all axes) and has a 2kW water cooled ER20 spindle..
Zellerfeld is looking for the best 3D printing engineers globally. Check out their job listings: geni.us/ZellerfeldJobs
_Would you rather build a DIY CNC router or buy a finished kit?_
Update #1 22-03-07: The "DI Spindel" upgrade is not only the spindle itself but also includes additional electronics within the electronics box, which makes the €300 price a bit more reasonable but also means that you will not be able to upgrade to the DI Spindle if you purchase the Standard Spindle at first.
Thank you for the fantastic, honest, useful and detailed review. I prefer to build my own, more capable and hackable for under 2k. MPCNC: th-cam.com/video/ztcMPmEYCmw/w-d-xo.html
@@StevePotter neia
Vielen Dank für die Werbung, ich schreibe gerade meine Masterarbeit im Themenbereich 3D gedruckter Schuh. Das sie jetzt in Hamburg (in der Nähe) sind wusste ich nicht und ich denke ich werde mit ihnen Kontakt aufnehmen. Vielen Dank
@@jamesmor5305 Guter Witz
Thank heavens that instrument body was only a test piece. I gasped in horror when I saw the cupping-prone grain pattern on your pine blank! I loved your plywood/3D printed clamps.
I expected that hate already 😁 No, since the NC program is really complex I rather ruin a $10 pine board than a $100 beautiful swam ash piece.
Thank you Stefan, that's a clean cut video ❤️❤️❤️
You're welcome 😊
This is a formidable piece of kit! I think you are used to Chinese prices, but I think, specially with this sophisticated interface, it is a very very good router
thats my dream since years. making my own guitars with a cnc
The price is expected because just those "color coded connectors" (depending if they're 3, 4 or 5-pin ones) cost like 3.50-7.50€/piece.... +0.25e for the color coding ring :)
I mean... they use *Neutrik* XLR connectors... they're serious.
Deckel FP3 or an old Maho with heidenhain language cost about 5000 - 10000 Euro. Imho a much more better deal. Because those machines have a more powerful engine with 9,6 kW and are heavy 4200 kg (which is important for vibrational stiffness and so on). These are properties which are necessary for machining steel and other alloys.
Alternatives; RatRig Stronghold, Ooznest Workbee (and derivates like stronghold)
Even though I would have almost no use for this, I still want to buy one! Great video Stefan :)
That's the proper flow : see a great machine - get it - create some use for it 😁
I am saving to buy a Onefinity and I like the ballscrews over the belts. Considering the price I would have thought it would be much more solid.
Great points and fair conclusion. I do like that transparency! Cool machine though, but definitely would have liked to see covers on the rails. Seems similar to the X-Carve here in the states, if so, there are tons of printed things you can use for upgrades.
I still feel like these things seem way more expensive than they should be.
If 90% of the parts they are using are things you'd see on a CR-10 but with bigger extrusions then they aren't likely worth the multi-thousand $ pricetags.
I feel like it should be relatively easy for the community to make something in this same style for far far cheaper.
There are already countless projects for DIY CNC routers that use alu extrusions (or metal pipes), linear rails and/or v-rollers and 3D-printed parts that can get you a decently sized machine for
@@NiyaKouya Sounds like what I would've expected (I'm not in the DIY CNC community).
It has been constantly ridiculous seeing these multi-thousand machines that are no where near worth that much getting tons of attention by YTers.
That where my first thoughts too as an ender3max user. The big difference is that 3d printers produce a workpiece and had not to cut off something which has always a force resistance. That's why I see the timing belts and rolers a very cheap method for cnc routers.
for hobby level it's fine but if you want to be serious with aluminum and other metal project you need to upgrade with linear bearing and ball screw and don't forget the motor need more HP and torque.
I would be interested to see what the ideal need for this machine would be? Love your work but the limitations you listed had me scraping my head as to where it shines. I will be buying my first cnc this year and would love some ideas for a less limited machine or where this machine would be excellent.
Thank you for the review. The collects are not custom - they are off the shelf ER 16 or ER 11 and can be purchased at any machine tool supplier.
Nic. The collets shown are NOT ER series. Go back and look again. 10 minute mark.
Unfortunately they aren't ER collets. I made the mistake in the past and purchased ER11 and ER16 collets that didn't fit 😅
Your correct the collets are Kress/ AMB and not as widely available as ER
I´m in search for a good CNC Router for hobbyist. Should have a bed size of at least 300x300mm and should be possible to drill a 100mm deep hole. Also it should can handle aluminum without problems all day long.
I'm printing parts for a custom CNC... CNC are quite expensive for me and I will make a smaller version to fit the half of the table.
I rather like the idea of the belts - but I think they should be used in the OX style, where there´s a belt glued to the bottom of the V-channel with the teeth up abd the drive belt engages with the glued belt - resulting in very little - to no flex,
Is there more information about the reference system you've built on it? For double sided machining?
I appreciate your honesty Stephan! I agree with you on the last point. There is a better choice for makers and even businesses which is to build their own cnc. There are many open source machines on the internet that are far more capable than the Mekanika with an affordable price. Check out PrintNC for example. In my opinion the electronical side of the mekanika is solid but the mechanical side is a joke for that price.
joke is maybe a bit too harsh. you have to consider that the hole is more than the sum of the pieces here. I also think the belts are a very brave decision but the results prove they made it work. I personally see more of a problem in the low z travel. that could have been fixed with very little money
@@savejeff15 Parts that are under/over sized is not a good result - indicates that it doesn't work.
@@Shocker99 yes that is in fact a little bit worrying. I personally upgrade these Maschines after I buy them. That belt system would be the first thing to go. But in general I think it's still a good value for Money
@@savejeff15 I only meant that if you want to charge customers for that money, at least choose parts that have lower maintenance such as ball screws instead of 3d printer wheels and belts. That is just how i see it.
Great video, I like the most is the touch probe find part location. thank you. I have added the wire and is working fine. appreciate your input with this video.
love to see the process for designing the cutting for the guitar.
Can I buy the cut file for the Guitar Body
Do you still use this maschine and what is your experience with it after 1 year of use?
are the bananas finger proof?
Das Ende! Herrlich!!!
Is this machine comparable to Stepcraft and would there be any noticeble difference?
Mekanika is one of my favorite bands
very nice product. I think the price is pretty good. i think its the lowest price where no important corners must be cut.
The belds are a brave decision but they seemed to make it work. only real negative point is the low z travel. would have been super easy to just add 5-10cm by just increasing the length of some parts.
i consider buying this at it seems very well made and I don't want the pain of finishing/fixing half complete china cnc mashines
If they increased the Z travel they would increase the leverage on the v-rollers making the machine much less rigid. While I agree that it is very limiting (I have 12cm on my KillerBee and still wish I had more), it would likely make the machine unusable for anything apart from wood if they increased the Z height much at all.
I disagree. It's not using anything that you wouldn't find in any cheap chinese 3D printer but for thousands of $.
I feel like the community could easily design something with equal performance for a fraction of the price.
@@LanceThumping you forget that community is not getting payed for there work. These people want to live from there product.
@@LanceThumping That's not the point here. You will always be able to build something cheaper and better yourself, but not in 5 hours and not with easy to follow instructions and prewired electronics. Those who know how to build something themselves or have the time to learn should not buy this machine, but they're also not the target audience.
Just looking at this machine it looks big enough to cut guitar necks, is this capable of this task?
Greatly appreciate your videos! Love your channel as well😍
So basically convert it to linear rails, upgrade belt and it's a decent cnc router... Got that. Thanks for the thorough review :)
Great video, how does it compare to the
I'm still using your first wooden design
Oh, that's awesome!
I feel like the belt system isn't so great. Thicker belts are almost certainly a must to make it stiffer, and a dual-belt system like used on some MPCNCs would help as well. Maybe you can try modding it for larger belts and make a video? Also, the upgrades are almost certainly overpriced.
Nice Video! Could you show more of the Electronics of this Mill. Which parts are used & how the emergency stop is connected to the mill? Its open source, but i dont understand which parts needed. Could you show as a video with detail rich of the wiring and electrics.
Wish I lived near Hamburg so I could apply for one of the jobs. The CNC information at their website looks interesting and I hope to learn a lot there. Thank you Stefan.
As mentioned by the CEO in a different comment: If you're able/willing to move to Hamburg there is always a way to make it happen 😊
It would be really cool it you built the PrintNC and reviewed it, I've wanted to make one for some time
At first I kind of bulked at the price, but when I think about it, this is about how much money I'm spending to build a custom dimension voron 2.4.
interesting. i would like a home cnc mill for small projects but so far the money is tight. this is the only personal use machine i knew of, i'm more used to the big professional ones. i have to look into what else is there! thank you for the review!
Requesting a series on making a DIY CNC tool changer
I have been converting my 3d printer into a multitool machine starting from a router, i love the fact that i had the same idea for a touch probe :P
The issue I have with hobbyist cnc machines (I have a 2nd gen Shapeoko 3) is that the z axis machining envelope is way too small.
how does it compare to the machines stepcraft makes?
I used PlanetCNC for my onwn diy CNC machine. It's a nice packed, but becarfull with more advanced commands like G41/G42/G40. They will crash your Machine! PlanetCNC sas they support thos commands, but they don't do it right. You are fine as long as you don't us cuttercompensation in Fusion360. If you want to build your onw CNC use LinuxCNC or EdingCNC. I use LinuxCNC in my newest machine.
In my opinion the v rollers is not a good idea. I think Chinese linear rails would have even been a better option. Some mgn15s or a little bigger would have been nice to see. I get that they are more expensive, but you can already see some wheel wear in your b role
Wow, 4k for a machine that does not have normal rails, ball screws and the cheapest spindle instead of a normal three-phase one. I do not know something about the construction of machine tools in the EU.
Hi Stefan, nice piece of hardware, but sometimes you are saying "sometimes" a bit too often... lol
For such a large machine I would of cohoosen cable cored timing belts (that also require larger radius pulleys) to avoid the backlash.
On this tune, while working to my Rumba 5 axis design, I decided 6 models would be available, defined by the available working cube, so there is 200X200, than 300X300 and 400X400 series that can use regular timing belts, but personaly at 300X300 and above I suggest cable cored ones (plus wider belts: 10mm) and 8mm shaft Nema 17 steppers, (also because if you add the other 2 axis, S and T to go 7 axis printing, you actually add more weight that can cause baclash in printing).
Bu the next 3 sizes cube are 600X600, than 800X800 and 1000X1000, and here not only I jump to Nema 23 steppers and mandatory cable cored timing belts, slighlty wider, like ... 12 mm to 16mm wide, at least for the X, Y Z U and V axiz, the S and T might still do with Nema 17 at 8mm shaft motors. Obviously with such belts my 3D printers can do routing of light materials as well, up to Aluminium and some tough hardwood, but not iron or steel.
And I want my printers to be easy to fully enclose in their own oven, that means I am now designing water cooling systems for the cheap stepper motors you can find on the shelf, for there are no water cooled stepper motors at decent prices tht I know of..
Excellent video review, thanks!!
7:57
H.O.L.Y. C.R.A.P.
a "warranty void if removed" sticker on a machine targeting makers? The audacity to do that is enough to make me never want to buy anything from that company.
The Onefinity looks much sturdier and is cheaper.
Please review 👍
what's that black FS bike in the background ? ;-)
Canyon Spektral AL👍
Not shipping to the US.
You can contact them directly for shipments outside of Europe ;)
Those roller guides are a crime to put on an a CNC router imo. Once this has been spec'ed out to acceptable level you probably pay just as much as for a Sorotec that has a much more rigid frame. The control panel is kinda neat though but would not get me to buy this.
I would love to see more videos on current cncs. I've been looking at a suuuuper cheap one (like $200 if possible) that at least isn't a fire hazard. It's more for me to see if I should learn more about cncs or possibly laser cutter.
Oh, a DIY cnc cutter? I do have a dremel....
I wouldn't be too concerned about the machine starting a fire, because unlike a 3D printer, you can't really leave a CNC Router unattended anyway. So a fire extinguisher does work since there's someone around to use it.
Interesting review mate. Thanks 👍👍💫
Sticker at 7:57 illegal in the USA per the Federal Trade Commission.
Hallo, ich baue E-Gitarren, im Moment noch alles vor Hand 😊.
Suche aber für die Zukunft eine CNC. Wäre diese Fräse dafür geeignet ?
Gruss
What sucks is that they are taking the printer/razor approach to prices, by selling the main machine at a fair price but selling accessories/necessary consumables at a ridiculous cost
Moin Stefan Ich weis nicht was die mehr kosten rechtfertigen wenn man bedenkt das es einfach nur ein 3D Drücker ist in ein wenig größer, das einzige was anders ist, ist der fräse Kopf. Vllt kannst du mir auf die Sprünge helfen warum die kleine Ausführung knapp 2700€ rechtfertigt, wenn es jetzt heist es ist die tolle Software die es aus macht, muss ich leider sagen das es Klipper auch getan hätte. mit 2000€ wäre ich noch einverstanden für ein CNC tisch aber keine 2700€ und auch nicht bei der geringen Präzision die du ja selber wenn ich das richtig verstanden habe im Video ansprichst
Very good vídeo, though with that money you can buy a ratrig killerbee cnc...way more sturdy and using linear rails instead of vslot!
Super Video! Das hat mich sehr interessiert, gerne mehr davon! 😊👍
What I do not get is the frame of this machine. For some reason, extremely rigid and thick aluminum extrusions are used, of course for sturdiness. But why use those timing belts, to throw all that accuracy you gain with such a frame away? But well, it could just be my bitch *ss complaining.
Excluding the HMI/control system, i wonder how much the machines costs? Using timing belts seems like a silly cost cutting idea for an aluminium machine.
We have a 'budget' CNC machine at work. The HMI/control system on it costs $€£250. And it cuts parts to well within tolerance every time.
I love your content man always awesome
I don't like the design of the tool length probe. Some endmills are coated in a non conductive coating which would make the measuring process not very reliable. At this price point I would have expected better. At leas a tactile switched probe.
THe thing I really don't like on this machines is the fact they're belt driven. An ACME screw would be good enough
With an ACME screw you cannot get the hi movement speed you need for cutting wood. If you machine moves slow, your spindle must turn slow, and everything is slow then, otherwise you burn mills and material pretty fast.
Not gonna lie, that ad was interesting to me.
I'm imagine if it used on epoxy resin. More design can be unlocked.
Vielen Dank für die gute Produktvorführung samt Tipps, Tricks und auch negativen Punkten.
Die begrenzte Bearbeitungshöhe ist natürlich blöd, eventuell könnte man diese durch Erweiterungsplatten erhöhen.
That board at 7:45 must be hard to get a hold of these days.
What isn't....
@@MisterMakerNL Looking at Amazon, it's over $110 for a 2GB board thanks to scalpers.
I spoke with them and they ship world wide fyi
you can build atleast 3 for that price ivn did it
Damn why am I not in Hamburg
Hey mate, Cornelius (CEO) here. For good fits we can definitely cover moving costs! Most important to us is that we build a strong culture of people who are as passionate about printing as we are!
@@corneliusschmitt3629 Heyo, that's mighty generous. I'm bound by family and PhD studies (lattice optimization in AM). Would you consider offering remote opportunities in the future? I'm not too far away but can't move over to Hamburg, even if I wanted to, but your company and goal is really interesting.
@@corneliusschmitt3629 As I replied to Layershift comment above:
I am working on R&D on a 5 axist 3 D printer that can allow you to reduce to nill the internal suppots and to a minimum the external ones, also working to an add on to make it a 7 axis machine, the idea is that anybody can 3D print the key components and than dissasemble their regluar cheap 3D chinese made printer, and with a few more parts to buy online can transform them in a 5 or 7 axis machine (works for the expensive printers too).
If Zellerfeld is interested in such an approcah for the machines they use, I can help. It reduces the printing time (by not printing supports, at least not everywhere) reduces the materials consumed, for the same reason, and the post printing time for not having to clean so many supports and than sand the part to make it look nice where the supports were attached.
Interesting as always
Thanks for sharing :-)
Ugh, a warranty void if removed sticker on a CNC router that you mostly have to assemble yourself? I guess it's not sold to USA consumers which would make that sticker illegal...
schicke Fräse sieht mit nach PlanetCNC software aus für die Bedienung, ich verwende diese auch
Musste mich nach UGS erstmal dran gewöhnen, aber mittlerweile ist es wirklich eine feine Sache!
@@CNCKitchen das war bei mir auch so, die Steuerung bietet einige Features wie das 3D antasten, und eine Werkzeugverwaltung. ist eben nicht so Verbreitet, doch vll. helfen die Jungs etwas nach ;)
Mmm about nzd 5000 plus shipping for the small one is out of my spending range…thanks anyway…Laurie NZ.
Great fair review.
The moment, when CNC Kitchen covers actual CNC routers, feels weird 😂
Hab mir eine Haase Cut200 geholt, dtarte morgen mit Fräsen und bin seeeehr gespannt :) lg
show us how to make one :D
I can see a future where you order you shoes online an receive a .stl/3mf file and a spool of filament. Or, you scan your feet with your phone the send that with your order to receive said file and a spool of filament.