Mig Welding Downhill Problems
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 28 ก.ย. 2024
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Mig Welding downhill is much easier and usually quicker than uphill.
But its not always the best way to go. for 1/4" and thicker, uphill welding is my choice. But Mill scale on Hot rolled steel can be a problem either way. - แนวปฏิบัติและการใช้ชีวิต
I really love how you go between views of the molten puddle, the finished weld surface, and the etched joint. This is a great aid to understanding how what you see in the molten puddle relates to the strength of the weld.
This isn't a substitute for practice, but it really helps me see what to look for in the puddle.
we use .045 where i work for everything from .250" to .125" downhill much of the time for irrigation system pipe, with Miller Axxess 300 accupulse machines running 90/10 gas and never have penetration issues. I think that i will try cross sectioning some scrap and see how well it is all the same anyway. Thank you for your time with these videos, have not done much SMAW or GTAW in recent years and it is fun to reminisce.
I spent many years beginning with a small pocket computer, writing algorithms which produced 16 Ordinate lengths to create the templates for any type of cope and piping intersection. Any size, any schedule, any angle, any offset, concentric fit, negative eccentric, mirror images, Y fits, branch Set on, branch set in. etc. Absolutely everything and anything that needed a pattern to give a fit up and which would barely let daylight through. I began this challenge as a young welder when welding structural pipework on site. On construction. I spent most of my time welding (filling) 'daylight' from the shop fabrications with their average fit ups. That was just how it was but being lazy, I decided to set about to 'nail' the exact pattern needed for every conceivable fit up just to make life easier. It certainly did and 40yrs later it still does. Just thought I'd blow my own 'trumpet' for a minute... And I'm still learning even today from your excellent videos.... Big thanks.
How do I get a hold of you...?
Great video, I love the sectioning, polishing and etching to really see the quality of the weld.
Great video Jody, I can’t wait to start cutting and etching! This is so cool how you can see the weld quality of the technique and settings just used! Thanks
We appreciate you taking your time for these awesome videos!! Very helpful
Awesome helpful videos .Greetings from Croatia(Europe)
Awesome video. I always learn something new watching your videos.
Hi Jody, I have been told over the years that downhill welding is not as strong because of limited penetration. Your demonstration shows the results of these facts. I have always preferred to do vertical up on anything thicker than 2.5 mm, and this proves it, especially if it is not clean. I can't understand why they do downhill STICK welding on pipeline welding it just doesn't make much sense, because you are also asking for slag inclusions.
Great information Jody. I've heard many car guys over the years say how good they can weld downhill. I also had the same thoughts about the penetration. You showed it first hand.
Adam
Like to have seen the uphill outcome! Plus said cleaned it before welding hmm biased? or just to highlight it better?
Jody, i love watching your videos, i have learned a lot from you in the last six months or so since i have discovered your channel. I've been doing industrial welding and fabrication for the better part of eight years now, went from VOTECH machine shop class as a senior in HS into welding and fab ever since (i do not have the patience to cut chips all day long haha). I had first had experience welding when i was eleven, my problem is that everyone i have ever worked with said you can only mig with hard wire vertical down, never weld vertical up. I have practiced vert up since i saw you do it and just cannot get it. Do you have a vid that explains your method in detail? Thank you for your time and these videos, you have really opened my eyes to new techniques and have sort of re-invigorated my passion for welding and fabricating.
Could you make a video of proper mataniance of gmaw mig machines and then quick tips for a dirty tip that keeps sticking on the job? And even when your wire gets an overlap and won't proper eject?
You should've shown the results of the uphill! I was hoping to see how much better it was.
Uphill with 100% CO2.
I would assume that some of the lack of fusion on thicker items is the time that it takes for the base to come up to temp? Would a clean and a preheat to 400 help if you had to do a downhill pass?
We are being ask to perform “structural welds “ at my work but with out material seems almost unnecessary because we work with containers and their corrugation are only like 1/8 thick or 16 g thin and putting side plates that are a 1/4 thick down hill seems to be the most convenient for container building ?
We mostly perform down hill welding but if y’all have suggestions let me know plz
I think. Not a bad technique, but only for thin metal. For 1-2,5mm
I know its old video but do you think if you cleaned the 1/4" plates and maybe did a tight root bead then a cap over it wouldve penetrated better?
THANK YOU!
Got To Love That Sound!!!! :)
i dont know why but my work places fronius transsteel with 1mm wire has almos too much penetration like you cant uphill weld at all as soon as i start the arc the weld pudlle just falls off or clumps up
any tips
If welding company's made excellent videos like yours they would sell heaps more, most that do are really poor.
Hi and nice vid... Im having problems with a cebora machine, the wire dont always came at the same speed, even in some points stops once in a wile....
I already remove the steel linner and flush the hose with alcohol, let it dry and test it.. but it keep doing it. The motor seems to be good, but te wire gets stuck.... I should changue the mig gun ??
Thanks in advace, for your videos I will buy a hobart machine, withc doble rollers for the wire... much more professional than cebora.
Thanks!
AlexLPD could be a bad liner. or crappy wire. hell, it could be the torch its self. could be your wire speed. eh with hobart cus of the tapped voltage. go miller or everlast.
Hi, I changue the linner the old problem is gone finally! ... But the machine is not of my like... has numbers intead of proper scales, and cant weld very hot... I have seen some reviews...I will test a everlast to see a difference. Thanks for the tip!
no problem! glad to help
What's the PAM cooking spray for?
not to be that guy,
but you said 1/8" plate, but "plate" is anything 3/16" or more...
Rasta Mon But you were that guy.
This is known as a stove weld, technically an illegal weld. should only use this for asthetic purposes for stuff that won't be under any stress
lol
Сварной хороший!Но трус!!! Писал ему по теме,не ответил.Я из Руси.Наверное байден ,запретил или запугал его. )
How do you think a globular transfer would go downhill?
Thanks Jodie, now I can show people this instead of banging my head against the wall trying to get it though their heads how potentially weak a downhill joint can be.
Very well demonstrated in both the weld and the macro test.
Hi Jody
Fantastic series!
I'm trying to get my workshop to buy all your videos to train our apprentices,but Man this is right up there with the best of them . thanks for your efforts ,they're appreciated
Welding downhill isn't wrong, you just prep the metal and use a burn-back method where you run the wire back into the puddle then pull it back out front.
Wire speed and tail length (short) are key here, but with a little practice you'll know exactly when your frying it in there good just by the sound.
Wow. Amazing lack of fusion and penetration on that downhill. Wish you had done the uphill etch cuts. Good deal though
This is the only thing I've ever disagreed with on one of your videos. You stated that to properly cope (saddle) pipe tee joints, a person must have a tubing notcher. Sir, every journeyman pipefitter saddles pipe joints, By Hand (port-a-band, torch, grinder), with either store-bought templates or a wrap-a-round and "do the math". All of these joints are inspected, and usually x-rayed. While there is nothing wrong with tubing notchers, etc.(beveling machines), please don't discount a craftsmans skills. The new generation of welders and fabricators need to keep these skills and not rely solely on "fancy tools" as it is unlikely that these tools are available or practical in the field.
I think every welding program should have an entire course titled "CLEAN YOUR METAL"
Overkill...that part can be covered in 30 seconds.
I would really enjoy a update to this video with dual shield Flux core.
When I watch a video like this one Jody, it makes me question every weld I've ever done!!! (It's not a good feeling)
Really glad you made this video. I build heavy duty equipment trailers. Mass production. And speed is the key. So I run really hot. No preparation on cold rolled steal. An a lot of down hill. Never get time to do test on welds. But this video has enlightened me. I’ve never had a trailer come apart yet. But just seeing this video makes me wonder.
Working on similar stuff. Cultivators and forks and manure foks and stuff like that. And all of the welders go downhill. Some of them look good some dont. But hey machines like that dont usually break but In my opinion its always safer to do it the right way. And I do both up and down. When I weld simple square pipes with an 5mm wall I usually go down hill and it works for that. But when I had to weld an attacher for the telehender thats 2.4 m wide you bet I did all of it uphill. And any other heavy things I do uphill like frontloader attachers where there is lots of weight on it. And I even had to fix an broken manure fork. Were the forks where broken with the pipe itself and somewhere the welds didnt even penetrate and that musth have been the old mans low amp settings and not enough strong welds. Ive seen a lot of stuff like that. So thats why Im here to learn the best methods possible.
Wow, this was eye-opening. Just found your channel and your attention to detail and thoroughness is impressive. Good to know that a good looking weld doesn't necessarily mean anything. I thought for sure that second-to-last weld with the heavier wire and bigger machine was gonna be perfect, but it was garbage.
I'm becoming addicted to watching your videos,the best comment you made:"it doesn't matter how beautiful the weld looks,what matters is how well the penetration", applies so well in downhill welding ,thanks for the tip: ( triangle /upward) , we forget what works best and try what's the easiest instead.
Great video. Very educational and informative.
We do a lot of downhill welding in the sheet metal trade, especially so in duct fabrication in shop. Dont have to worry much about penetration when your wall thicknesses range between 10-18 gauge.
What’s the name of your online store? Thanks.
The tubenotcher program is a lifesaver! i'd recommend it to anyone who hasn't used it....
Thanks Jody. You have made me a student of welding.
btuce
I learned very quickly at Hobart that you don't use downhill for much of anything unless it's very specific open root pipe applications. Like you demonstrated, all of the negative aspects of incomplete fusion can happen without a perfectly prepared closed-root joint. Even with perfect preparation, if your technique or settings are the least bit off... arg.
As always thanks for the video and for experimenting for us.
Im comfortable in downhill ♥️
Thanks a lot for the video helped me a lot
Thanks for the videos you produce. They help me a lot.
Thanks Jody, really appreciate the efforts you put in this, very graphic and easy to understand, great teaching.
Pierre
I guess it's a good thing I prefer welding uphill anyway, LOL! I guess running can after can of 7018 in the tank farms of Hawaii ingrained it into all of my welding flavors...Thanks for the show Jody.
Most of my troubles stem from the puddle and weld being to quick so whenever I can slow it down it's better for me.
I weld downhill on 3/16 plate with .045 wire off of a miller wire feed unit.
Would you say I need to reevaluate what I'm doing? Much of the stuff is somewhat beveled etc
Gday Jodie, I am with you on the thicker material and going up hill but will always move fast down hill with the thin RHS,rolled hollow section,furniture tube. I like a small pause on each side as I move up. As old welders are wont to say "more heat more money!!!!!!!" Cheers Ross
hey i was wondering have you thought about doing more videos for welding? I would love to see more if you are able to. Anyway thanks for the videos and keep them coming because i really enjoy watching them
Hey jody. You got an experience using phillips safety super magenta drop in lens? Cant find any solid videos on it and i don't want to drop $80 on something with no reviews. Claims in eliminates yellow and orange flares and leaves you with only the rod and the puddle.
Thanks for another informative video, Jody. One year ago, i knew practically nothing about welding, started watcing your videos, bought an old esab 250 amp mig machine, and trained, trained, burnt my fingers (no tig finger yet!) and trained some more... since then i've welded tables for my workshop, decorative tables for my wife, changed the rear cross member on my car, and a lot more. Not that i'm a pro in any way, but your advice brought me forward a lot. My next project will be a rigid welding table. Its difficult to make anything straight on a dodgy concrete floor. Its funny, i hear your voice whenever i pick up the helmet and aim the gun: "watch the front of the puddle". ..."do cursive e's". Hey, it works!
I have learned so much from your video's.
Thanks so much, keep up the great work.
I have 181i Thermal Arc for about 3 years, thanks to your video's I finally figured it out.
The door chart for flux core .035 is not even close. But the way you figure wire feed speed and voltage is perfect.
Thanks again,
Wish you had done a side by side for the last weld you did that was uphill. Getting some great info from your video's thank you, please keep them up.
thanks jodi > the expert testimony and practice weld inspection(s) are just awesome incldng. the machine settings,bond materials, wires...the works > outstanding demo.
Hey Jody, A problem I have had with downhill mig is you tend to streak a bit faster as you get along and lose gas coverage and then pourosity comes in.
Just a thought.
I'd be curious to see this done with spray transfer. I build tillage and downhills are somewhat common (with whipping, no less) for dealing with bad fitup when parts arent cut quite right
Yeah it gotta be cleaned For MIG especially on flat bar where those rolled edges hold more scale.
im not surprised by the results i was planning to practice downhill but is there any need to learn it?
hey jody can you make a video of 3F 1" thick mig. cant seem to get it right
Thanks!!👍👍👍👍👍🙂
Amazing video, just shows how a good looking weld isn't good at all
I'm on my last year of college and they always teach us to go up hill, I can see why now, great video
Thanks for teaching us... 🇧🇷
Good info. Can you run 0.024 in a gun with a 0.035/0.030 liner just by changing the contact tip and rollers?
Yes - IF it is a 10ft gun .... On a 15 ft gun if it is not perfectly straight you might get into some feeding issues. But i guess you will see if it works or not
Awesome video Jody. Liked very much the format of showing the welding action, the welding puddle, and the reveal of whats underneath. I will be glad if you make one like this with gtaw and thin tubing. Greetings from Brazil.
eddie K with gtaw you can almost see the penetration as you move along the joint prior to adding filler wire.
Thanks! Now I feel more confident when I weld!
Good video/lesson. Thanks
mate thats not the way you weld a vertical, you always weld from the bottom to the top ... pritty sad that you do it like that
I see the pipeliner guys always stick welding downhill. Wondering if that why there's so many pipeline blow outs / leaks?