In the intro you say that we don't care about the leverage ratio in terms of shock doing the work, but doesin't it affect how rebound works? If the leverage ratio is higher, the rebound will be weaker, so I suspect that it will not be as fast as with lower ratios. Am I figuring it out right?
Make more videos Steve I've never learned so much about suspension got a new full suspension and for once didn't feel overwhelmed set it up from what I've learned and my bikes never felt so good!
Hi Steve! One question ... what would be difference between a 2 to 3 LR vs a 2.5 to 3.5 ? Sorry if you explain in the video i can read and write engish but earing is more difficult to me. Thanks
When the shock and leverage rates are added what are the normal desired force curves at the wheel? Is there an ideal curve that manufacturers try to hit?
Every manufacturer seems to have a different idea of what is ideal - to the point where some of the leverage rate curves are literally the exact opposite (inverse) of one another. There is not a particularly strong consensus on what works best. I think aiming for a generally progressive wheel spring curve is the most widely-agreed-upon characteristic, but even then there are some extremely popular bikes that go the other way.
Hi ! Very interesting vidéo ! Would you concider the 2016 specialized enduro as linear ? Witch could mean that an air shock is a better choice than a coil one ?
If a bike has a linear curve, would it make more sense to have an air shock so that you have an element of control over what the curve is doing, or would a coil shock be better? Im guessing personal preference has a large part to play in this as well?
Would like to ask a couple of questions relating to the leverage ratio video concerning a 2016 gt sanction 1 is this bike considered to be a single pivot ? 2 how would I go about measuring the Swingarm to shock eyelet to find the leverage rate/ ratio on this bike 3 and how would said measurement be interpreted to the rest of the leverage rate/ ratio Trying to find out what type of shock would work best with this bike and what to avoid, been trying to work this out myself bur can't seem to find enough information, standard shock is fox float x evol 215x63. thanks
Does that mean the best shock for a VPP bike is a coil shock? What about all the SC bikes with air shocks? Good for pedaling but hard to use all the travel?
Not necessarily. Leverage ratio has almost no influence on pedaling performance, that is to do with anti-squat. VPP bikes can be more up one end or the other of that curve as well, not all of them ramp up significantly at the end of the stroke, and not all of them are substantially falling rate at the beginning (eg the 951... which ramps up MASSIVELY but has almost no falling rate early on). The specific details ALWAYS matter.
Would you think coil would be suitable, specifically, for the Hightower which has regressive/linear/progressive curve I believe? If the end stroke is only slightly progressive would you run less sag at the expense (perhaps?) of suppleness at the start of the stroke?
At first I thought you might have been making a mistake, but now I see the language is just a bit confusing (to me). For a Progressive leverage geometry, as the rate rises it drops on the chart, indicating a decreasing wheel-to-shock travel ratio, requiring LESS spring force per mm of wheel travel. For a Digressive leverage geometry, as the rate decreases it raises on the chart, indicating an increasing wheel-to-shock ratio, and thus requiring MORE spring force per mm of wheel travel. That makes perfect sense! But it is a bit confusing.
Yes, it's more intuitively understood when using motion ratios rather than leverage ratios (the two are the same thing, but motion ratio is the inverse of leverage ratio). Basically the spring rate increases at the wheel throughout the travel in a progressive system.
Great video
In the intro you say that we don't care about the leverage ratio in terms of shock doing the work, but doesin't it affect how rebound works? If the leverage ratio is higher, the rebound will be weaker, so I suspect that it will not be as fast as with lower ratios. Am I figuring it out right?
Make more videos Steve I've never learned so much about suspension got a new full suspension and for once didn't feel overwhelmed set it up from what I've learned and my bikes never felt so good!
Where can i find the leverage ratio of bikes nowadays? there is no information ( or easily obtainable ) from bikes companies
I travel race to race. Listening on my phone the audio is not easy. Thanks for the effort.
Hi Steve! One question ... what would be difference between a 2 to 3 LR vs a 2.5 to 3.5 ? Sorry if you explain in the video i can read and write engish but earing is more difficult to me. Thanks
When the shock and leverage rates are added what are the normal desired force curves at the wheel? Is there an ideal curve that manufacturers try to hit?
Every manufacturer seems to have a different idea of what is ideal - to the point where some of the leverage rate curves are literally the exact opposite (inverse) of one another. There is not a particularly strong consensus on what works best. I think aiming for a generally progressive wheel spring curve is the most widely-agreed-upon characteristic, but even then there are some extremely popular bikes that go the other way.
Hi Steve, can you do another video on leverage rate and it's effect for either heavy (>110kg) or light (
Hi !
Very interesting vidéo !
Would you concider the 2016 specialized enduro as linear ? Witch could mean that an air shock is a better choice than a coil one ?
If a bike has a linear curve, would it make more sense to have an air shock so that you have an element of control over what the curve is doing, or would a coil shock be better? Im guessing personal preference has a large part to play in this as well?
Would like to ask a couple of questions relating to the leverage ratio video concerning a 2016 gt sanction
1 is this bike considered to be a single pivot ?
2 how would I go about measuring the Swingarm to shock eyelet to find the leverage rate/ ratio on this bike
3 and how would said measurement be interpreted to the rest of the leverage rate/ ratio
Trying to find out what type of shock would work best with this bike and what to avoid, been trying to work this out myself bur can't seem to find enough information, standard shock is fox float x evol 215x63. thanks
How do you calculate the progression of the linkage in %?
I also would like to know this. Vorsprung please comment
Does that mean the best shock for a VPP bike is a coil shock? What about all the SC bikes with air shocks? Good for pedaling but hard to use all the travel?
Not necessarily. Leverage ratio has almost no influence on pedaling performance, that is to do with anti-squat. VPP bikes can be more up one end or the other of that curve as well, not all of them ramp up significantly at the end of the stroke, and not all of them are substantially falling rate at the beginning (eg the 951... which ramps up MASSIVELY but has almost no falling rate early on). The specific details ALWAYS matter.
Would you think coil would be suitable, specifically, for the Hightower which has regressive/linear/progressive curve I believe?
If the end stroke is only slightly progressive would you run less sag at the expense (perhaps?) of suppleness at the start of the stroke?
At first I thought you might have been making a mistake, but now I see the language is just a bit confusing (to me). For a Progressive leverage geometry, as the rate rises it drops on the chart, indicating a decreasing wheel-to-shock travel ratio, requiring LESS spring force per mm of wheel travel. For a Digressive leverage geometry, as the rate decreases it raises on the chart, indicating an increasing wheel-to-shock ratio, and thus requiring MORE spring force per mm of wheel travel.
That makes perfect sense! But it is a bit confusing.
Yes, it's more intuitively understood when using motion ratios rather than leverage ratios (the two are the same thing, but motion ratio is the inverse of leverage ratio). Basically the spring rate increases at the wheel throughout the travel in a progressive system.