Why Are Western Muslims Moving to Turkey? with Thomas Abdul Qadir
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 28 พ.ค. 2024
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Theres a growing movement in Europe and North America to reconsider where the future of Muslim communities lie. In recent years, a host of security and social concerns have brought to question just how much Muslims can maintain their commitments to Islam and leave peacefully in a society that constantly looks for opportunities to marginalise Islamic practice. The Liberal state is intent on secularising and liberalising Muslims. This has led to a call for Hijra, or migration away from the west and back to the Muslim world.
Thomas Abdul Qadir is the former president of the Majlis of Istanbul Muslims, an organisation that caters for foreign Muslims living in istanbul. They organise talks and activities to foster a community. He has a masters in civilisational studies from Ibn Haldun University - and is currently pursuing traditional Islamic education.
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The Thinking Muslim Podcast Episode 100
0:00 - 2:05 Introduction
2:05 - 8:27 Migrant life in Turkey
8:28 - 14:04 Migrant demographics in Turkey
14:05 - 15:46 Why Turkey?
15:47 - 21:29 Secular and conservative diversity in Turkey
21:30 - 23:18 Scale of Muslims migrating to Turkey
23:19 - 27:57 Reasons for Muslims to leave the West
27:58 - 33:22 Muslim Political Shift in the West
33:23 - 39:19 Personal decision to make Hijra
39:20 - 43:42 Tradition of Migration in Islam
43:43 - 44:33 Collective freedoms in the West
44:34 - 51:46 Trade-offs of living in the Muslim World
51:47 - 59:38 Nationalist and Political environment in Turkey
59:39 - 1:03:22 Secularization in Turkey
1:03:23 - 1:06:27 Advantages of Embracing Muslim Migration
1:06:38 - 1:10:23 Turkey as a good destination for Islamic knowledge
1:10:24 - 1:12:50 Reconnecting with the Ummah through globalization
I am currently moving to Turkey/Sakarya. I was living for 34 years in Austria. I was even born in Austria and now moving with my family to the lands of my parents. I was considering a more modest and conservative life for my family. Please make dua for me that I will have a more spiritual life there 🤲
Good choice brother/sister Austria is awful to Muslims
May Allah make it easy for you and give you barakah in your migration.
Möge Allah dir beistehen … Amin!
@@TheThinkingMuslimthank you so much, I really appreciate that. By the way I loved your podcast 👌 Jazakallahu Khairan 🤲
@@MrDoenerliebhaberAmeen, danke das bedeutet mir sehr viel 🤲
Why dont you move to afghanstan? It is a full islamic place. You can enjoy the islamic life as much as you like. Turkey is a secular country and will remain so.
Relax, I don't think any of these people are trying to change the constitution of Turkey lol
I was going to write the same thing. Or he could go to Arab countries.
I will admit that Turks and Arabs have a long history and there is some racism between Turks to
Arabs this goes back 100 years and what happened with the fall of the Ottoman Empire and the role the Saudi Arabs played in that.
But in general Turks are very nationalist but they are not racist. I’m african American and I live in Istanbul with my family and I know tens of families here from all over the world, Egypt, Sudan, America, Ethiopia, Somali, Uk and many more countries they are not facing racism in Turkey.
To here some of the comments making Turkish people to seem like racist is not balanced. I know racism being African American male.
Many of y’all never been to Turkey don’t pass judgment without seeing yourself.
The problem is American Muslim look at our countries politics regarding racial issues and apply it to the global world. When ever we hear racism we automatically correlate it to black people or dark-skinned people. Which is wrong from a global perspective.Racism is not exclusive to one race at all.
@@amalmohamed4242 exactly, alot of indians are actively discriminated against in madagascar and many african countries like sudan and zimbabwe just because they're indians.
Salaam I’m an AA also. I’d like to move my family to Turkey. Any tips?
Ironically, one of the founders of the MHP Party (which is now considered almost Fascist) was a Black Afro-Turk. James Baldwin lived in Istanbul off and on for 10 years during the late 50s/mid 60s. Frederick Bruce Thomas- African American- opened the first "night-club" concept in Istanbul during World War 1. Black Americans need to stop walking around with a stick on your shoulders and realize the whole world is very complex and NOT your neighborhood back in Philly.
Respect my brother, much luv from UK
I’m Turkish living in Mexico and I miss Türkiye ❤
Dont !because of the inflation!!!
Are you muzlim bro ?
I'm Half Turkish Half Russian(mother side) And Elhamdulilha I'm Muzlim ✨
OMG how can a Turkish person opt to live in Mexico. You definitely need to do a U turn back to the best country on earth.
I would not ever want to live in MX. I would like to go to Nica or El Sal, or Turkey, Turkey was my first choice but then the earthquakes happened and so I started to investigate the western geography more. I also wish that the Ottomans were still in control of the area of "Palestine". I know I am a dreamer. No I am not a Muslim, neither am I a xian,. or RCC or any denomination thereof. My journey in life has brought me to begin to seriously study the Quran and the Hadith. So far, so good.
@@nji7772 May Allah guide you to that which is best for you
One correction: the western secular=atheist idea does not apply to Turkey. All kemalists and secularists I know are believers here and also practice Islam in certain degree. They ARE muslims and believe in Allah. They just think that belief is a private matter and that the state should be religiously neutral.
As a practicing Catholic, I agree with that and thank Turkish police for protecting us when we worship. Turkey is truly a multicultural country starting already with Ottomans. I’m a happy Christian living in a Muslim dominated country. Thank you Muslim brothers and sisters for respecting my faith. Thank you for inviting me to celebrate Eid bayrams and iftar dinners and thank you for congratulating Christmas and Easter. Peace with you!
Fight those who believe not in Allah nor the Last Day, nor hold forbidden that which hath been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger, nor acknowledge the religion of Truth, (even if they are) of the People of the Book, until they pay the Jizyah with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued. Quran 9:29
@@moholah3745 go sleep and thats not Islaam.byeeee hater
same to you.
@@moholah3745 fight against your nefs (ego). Then you can contribute to ummah than anyone else.
yeah most secular minded people in Turkiye are also Muslim. Because secular is about personal liberties and freedoms, want to be muslim you can, you want to not be muslim you can. That is what secularlism means to the Turkish people. You could argue that Islam was the most secular of Abrahamic faiths since it gave rights to other religions.
Selam aleykum muslim brothers! I’m a western catholic and i have lived in Turkey 24 years! It’s fantastic here…I feel that I can live conservative life here better than ever in west. People respect religion and behave well. I don’t need to face degrading comments daily about christianity and faith. I’m also happy to see that Turkey is the hub of western muslims! Strangely I feel that I have much more common with muslims than western liberals.
@@AmeliaforChrist yes we hate you all
I hope you are white western man/woman. I don't think Turky peoples like other race in their country only if you white they like you.Muslim or non muslims.
@@AmeliaforChrist Turks happily marry Arabs and there are many mixed families. Race or ethnicity is not an issue but the refugees/illegal immigrants are mostly from Syria and Afghanistan. They take the low paid jobs and work illegally, i.e. cheap and don’t pay taxes. However, it’s the Turks who employ them! Some districts have been taken over by poor Arab refugees. So, it’s not being racial/ethnic but economics.
@@AmeliaforChrist The numbers of Christians - all denominations- are increasing. One day I had even Jehovahs Witnesses behind my door ☹️. I’m not very aware what protestants do here but the catholic communities attract Turks. Many times we have muslims attending the mass and they ask questions. I have to say that I’m not very comfortable about talking about this issue in a muslim discussion, it’s kind of not polite. I know that I’m wrong in this issue based on the Bible. I’m more worried about European godless people. But yes, we have growing number of conversions to Christianity and have even a Christian TV channel.
@@AmeliaforChristyeah I think they do unfortunately. Not sure if it’s because of the Syrians that are there or other underlying issues that dates back to history. That is my opinion anyway
They should migrate to actual Muslim countries like Syria and Saudi Arabia.
😂😂😂😂 No actual Muslim country except Afghanistan and Aceh in Indonesia
saudi used to be @@mas-udal-hassan9277
Syria ain't Muslim it's Secular
@@binnasserrsecular means zero religious laws! I doubt syria has no religious laws
Saudi Arabia is not an Islamic country
Another Muslim country one can consider for hijjrah is Malaysia. It’s English speaking. Well connected to the world. Relatively low cost of living.
Malaysia doesn't want foreigners. Getting a PR is extremely difficult. Citizenship is impossible.
@@achinoy ,
Forget about obtaining citizenship. If you stay over 5-10 years there’s a chance for pr if the country can benefit from you. I think most countries are that way..
@@Hawker400xp my sister has been in Malaysia for 22 years. No PR. I know another family that got PR after around 30 years. Forget about Malaysia. Renewing visas every year is a major hassle. Things move extremely slow.
@@achinoy . I feel you in the visa renewals as I have been in that situation before but you also have to understand that most countries with a young population works the same way. If you work in the medical or education industry or able to contribute to the economy then the government will take notice and offer PR for the family. No one just gives it away.
Can we apply for residence visa? If so, how could one do it ?
Living in USA for almost fifteen years i have concluded that it’s impossible to raise your children in an islamic way. Nudity vulgarity obscenity is inescapable. When my children migrated to this country they were already matured enough. Now I’m worried for my grandchildren and very often i ask my children to look for other options to move out from here and Turkey is top of the list.
May Allah have mercy on us and glue our hearts as one ummah. Ameen!
Trust me I'm from Turkey and Turkey is a no go for Islam unless you want to move to the border with syria where alot of Syrians live, Syrians are more religious. because every filth in USA exists in turkey even lgbtq is legal
In border province or Central turkey people take Islam more seriously but in big cities most don't alot of students commit Zina school system is fitna, most turks don't pray 5 times a day Islam isn't the main identity for alot and for them natiolism can come before Islam, Islam is culture for many in Turkey, many turks can't even say Salawat nor know the meaning of Shadah, if you bring your kids they will look at turkish youth, will see them as Muslim and will start seeing doing haram normal since they see it from all other people named Muslim, its so bad in turkey when it comes to school system Islamically that many Muslim parents don't send their kids to school which is illegal but they care more about Islam and their children then anything else some even see sending kids to school in turkey is shirk, because secularism is teached and adorned and Shariah can be shown backward. If you care for Islam know that even erdogan send his daughter to usa so she could go to school with hijab even before 5 to 7 years ago hijab was banned in turkey turkeys secularism and liberalism is way worst then many western countries because it is enforced.
Don't watch erdogan or ertugrul then have image of turkey, turkeys real image is opposite of erdogans or ertugruls image. And erdogan only did so much to change it.
nudity was also present at the Prophet's time when slave girls were designated to go topless in order to differentiate them from free women - however! there isn't any LGBTQ+ and jew love in Muslim countries
I hope that your relatives will go to Turkey as soon as possible. It's a favor they do to America.
They have this all over the world . Maybe move to a country town in America.
@@sureyyaekinci4630 not in Afghanistan
I Just came from Turkey. When I went there first time, I fell in love and wanted to move there. This was my 5th trip since 2020. Cant wait to MOVE there.
Please make research beforehand. Holidaying and living somewhere are two entirely different things.
You are not welcome here. Do not come.
They can't wait for you to come
People who want to move to Turkey or anywhere else. Don't just Holiday there for a few weeks and decide to move. Rent an apartment for a few months at different locations and get a real feel for it. You may find once the novelty wears off it not a place for you. If you have roots to a majority Muslim place. Then move there. Its the best chance for you to settle there. Uprooting based on Muslim lands is a naive idea. Culture and nationalism is a deep rooted thing.
But as Dr.Ambedkar the Indian philosopher and freedom fighter quoted. For Muslim their allegiance is first to Islam and then to the state
@@agnescraig2912 This guy probably didn't travel very much.
Perhaps what he is saying is true for Indian and Pakistani Muslims. Not so true everywhere else.
But his government gives the tourist visa to thousands from all countries get a feel of the city place then invest thousands of dollars.
And does other countries Malaysia Indonesia uae and Canada and USA n UK and Portugal and so on n on
SEEMS LIKE THE HYPOCRITE ARAB LANDS ARE BEST TO MOVE TO AFTER TURKEY
I am not Muslim but I like visiting Turkiye. A nice family atmosphere and people are very warm and friendly. Great country ! I would not move there first because I have a life here where I am already and second, being Catholic I need my good old church close. But I am jealous 🙂
I haven’t visited yet but will in 2025. I can’t wait. I’m in love with the country. I too, is Catholic and I need my church. However, I’ve been in love the Muslim religion since I was 10 years old. I know, it’s different.
Did u know Turkey has holy 7 churches? It is like Mecca for you. Also, Chora church in old town is a must, mesmerizing mosaics of Christianity
Secular Muslims who do not follow the ideology are one of the nicest people you have ever seen contrary to the practicing Muslims who behave nicely on the surface but whose true color comes out thereby resulting in violence and sometimes exploding themselves amongst innocent people by thinking houries are waiting in line in heaven to receive and have sex. Freaking promises from the pervert Allah.
@@tinageorge8058I am curious what do you actually live about Islam?
@@tinageorge8058åå
islam in turkey WAY different than you can imagine. Anything about Allah and Qur'an will get respect wherever you are. Other than that you better keep you ideas for yourself. there are people who dont pray or fast, and they drink alcohol; if u ask them theyll say they are muslim. thats like 90% of muslim population on paper. People not supporting Erdogan coz he is islamist. Migration in turkey is nothing about religion , its 100% political. Even Erdogan supporters against that. this will change whatever happens. so if you wanna visit turkey and see islamic places in history, youll have good time doesnt matter how secular the place you visit. if you are planning to live here and you have an expectation about regime change or living islam like islamic countries or having a word about it. this is not gonna end well for you.
Yes, fully agreed.
As a Turk, I would welcome you all as long as you guys obey the rules in our country. I live in Basaksehir, Istanbul. There a lot of Arap, Afghan, Chechen, Somali brothers and sisters and we all live peacefully. One of the biggest problem that I encountered was the language barrier. Brothers and sisters, when you move to a new country you cannot expect the locals to speak english or any other languages because it’s their country and they have been living there for centuries. If you are planning move here, please learn the language, obey the rules and be friends with us. Otherwise, it would be so difficult for you to survive here. Jazakallah khayr!
No piss off, we don't want any of these bugs in our country!
My kids love Turkey so visited Istanbul amazing city but majority people were not friendly, small business just ripped off, taxi drivers exploited foreigners. It’s not language it’s behavior & attitude. Muslims all around the world love turkey. Anyhow May Allah guide Muslims on right path. Ameen
Basaksehir is not a part of The Republic of Turkey. A real TURK does not share his country and live peacefully with Arabs, Afghans, Chechens, Somalians 😈
Absolutely Alhamdulillah
Öğreniyoruz. Kolay değil
Loved this discussion. Great questions and great answers /insights from Brother Thomas!
Maşallah, what an insightful and refeshing discussion of Islamic life in Türkiye! I have been studying Islam for the past 2 years, taught myself a little Turkish, and last year spent 7 weeks exploring Türkiye (İstanbul, Bursa, Söğüt, Konya, Kapadokia, Ankara) and I loved every place. I also attended Cuma (Friday prayer) for the first time. After spending half my life overseas, it was the first time I felt at home. As an American woman, I received wonderful hospitality and made so many, many friends, from Islamic scholars and merchants to little children and grandmothers who sell tesbih made by prisoners, from Anatolian and Bulgarian Turks to Kurdish restauranteurs and resettled Syrians. Your description of the diversity of private and public life in Türkiye resonates with my own experience and validates the path I am attempting to follow, inşallah.
As I have just learned through your program about this concept of "Hejira" on a social plane, would it be possible to host a program lead by Muslim Sisters on Hejira and relocation from the United States to Türkiye? To hear about the concerns, challenges and rewards for Western Muslim women would be very helpful. I have been seriously considering relocating to Türkiye and such advice would be invaluable.
Also, I would add that as Türkiye was a cultural, scientific and spiritual crossroads during the Seljuk and Ottoman Eras, not to mention the fountainhead of Sufism, Türkiye is richly endowed to revive a vibrant, robust, and nurturing İslam.
Çok şükür for all your noble work!
Best decision of my life. I was in Michigan America full of Muslims and yet the "Islamic" lifestyle was soo polluted. I moved to Antalya, Turkey. A utopia, I love it. There is no internal battle to remain pure. Life is just so natural and pure, it becomes effortless to just be this way❤
@@herneyse11 haha ya it's pretty secular. But I have found many conservative Muslims to be friends with. There are an increasing amount of Arabs coming in here too. So I'm satisfied ☺️
@@haya.syou all will go!
@@haya.s i think its more sad that theres 20 plus arab majority countries and many of them are terrible to live in.
@@yusufmuslim4420 I know! It would def be my preference to live in an Arab country if there was peace, comfortable living and was affordable like Turkey.
Do you have kids? What did you do about schooling? We had that problem in Fethiye. No English schools
Thank you Thomas n the presenter on this and all other programmes - very informative, penetrating and inspiring. Also admire the presentation format - so simple, unobtrusive, and communicating clearly.
In Turkeye, people enjoy wonderfully hospitality of the turksih people.
Respect of cultures, religious beliefs and utterly humanity is widely exercised in Turkiye!
Yeh right
Also strick secular prostitute,nightclub, alcohol everywhere all kind of misfortune is allow and LGBTQ is free, rotten fruit of secular
You really believe that??
@@user-dm8tl7ls9d what????
Turks hate Kurds and vice versa. The Kurds been fighting for 30 years in a low level insurgency for their rights.
Dunno what naive world you live in, mate.
Dear brothers and sisters, please consider Southeast Asian Countries to make hijra such as Indonesia and Malaysia, we would like to welcome you here.
that's not true, moved there 7yrs ago and the visa process is ridiculous, the amount of visa runs we had to do was nuts.
it's hard to move to a so called MUSLIM country, if your host country is not oppressing you then wallah it is better to stay there.
@@Shabzanadepends on the passport you have I found that Malaysia it was much easier to work with my Arab passport than my US one. I never declared my US passport actually as my friend advised me it makes it worse
Getting resident visa in Indonesia and malaysia is very hard. It only would be possible by marriage or if you are rich enough to invest or have special skill where you can obtain a work permit with it.
If you don't have any, its not possible, unless you plan to live "illegal" there; in Malaysia its extremely hard, in Indonesia might be possible.
@@Shabzana I find it interesting you said "so-called" Muslim country.
It's upon you to decide what a Muslim country is and how it should be?
Considering the language you're using perhaps it's best you stay where you are lol
This was an incredible discussion, fascinating, enlightening, and honest.
Loved every second of it.
Thank you both.
An absolutely excellent and informative dialogue. Jazakallah khayr to both the host and the guest. Brother Thomas should consider establishing a TH-cam channel - he has a lot of wisdom and insight on the situation in Turkey.
Thanks brother Thomas AbdulQaadir for mentioning the desert of Mauritania ……… A handful of Westerners ( I’m one of them since 1990) made it there and it’s totally worth the experience ,although culturally quite challenging
Selam aleykoum warahmatulahi wabarakatoehoe
I have a bunch of questions brother if I may ?
GO BACK YOU'RE NOT WELCOME HERE
@@aboeyousfie2409don't need any Qs. You're not welcome here
@@GG-gh8dy your ancestors did not fought for you so you can follow this little backward ideology. Haha it’s amusing how you can still follow atheism while it’s the most easiest debunked ideology there is . But yeah go with your rainbow friends and pretend you are someone
Turkiye is a secular, democratic and tourist country! You should not expect any different!!! The beauty is here the freedom of going to a cafe and eating while others fast. Religion should run private between you and Allah!
We Muslim Turks think differently then you european christians In Islam rule comes from Allah so it needs to be Shariah
Of course! That's the key!
@@kubilaykhan No Turkey isn't Mongolia go make comment to mongold videos you mongol
Religion is everything public and private
@@k.r.6800no
This is such a valuable rendition that a young Muslim would feel very regenerated after having listened carefully. Turkiye has a tremendous future !
no we don’t want any fking immigrants
Turkiye is secular country as long as you do not try to radicalize Islam you’re welcome but it’s impossible
Real Muslims are radical
I received this TH-cam video group with a great Joy.
"And respect Turkey 🇹🇷 for having such a great body responsible for the well been of the foreigners who are practicing Islamic Life".
It's a good idea the compliments of this kind of video.
Cheers, Alhamdulillah!
By Nura KC Nigeria 🇳🇬
I bought an appartment in Turkiye. I will eventually retire in Turkiye. I feel very much at home. Beautiful mosques, halal food and very friendly Turkish brothers and sisters.
Did you also choose the Istanbul area? Idk I went to Istanbul, I didn't feel all that at home... But ofc maybe diff parts of Turkey have diff vibes.
Istanbul the Asian side is better then European side Asian side is more Islamic and very friendly people who practice Islam .
I dont respect halal, because it is horrible abuse of an innocent animal, who can't protest against the fear and pain, and dont tell me that they dont feel pain, then you are a liar, i have seen it, and it was horrible, and dont think that God like it it any way, because it all belongs in the Old Testament, and New Testament does not allow any blood sacrifice,
Animal abuse is a sin......because we have the same creator, and all animals have a soul, so dont take my words for it, let God tell you......
@@guledfaisalali9388 how do Turks treat south asians?
Good for you islam for islam
I’d prefer moving to an Arab country if I had the choice
You have a choice
Move turkey. And lead a moderate Muslim life.
Merhaba everyone. Ayaan here, from Karachi, Pakistan. Two years back, my family and I made the move to Turkey, seeking a more Islamic way of life. Initially, it was incredibly enchanting - Adhans resonating, daily prayers - a perfect fit. But, as time passed, things shifted.
We didn't always experience kindness. Doubtful looks came our way, despite our simple wish to blend in. My young sons, innocent and capturing subway moments, faced shouting and even hurtful names like "pedophiles." Truly heartbreaking.
I believed Turkey, being a Muslim country, would embrace us, yet we encountered racism. Despite conversations, it felt like our differences in appearance and speech set us apart.
With hope for an Islamic bond, I came, but after enduring two painful years, my family and I chose Egypt. A different place, fresh challenges, but Alhamdulillah, there's a sense of understanding among people here.
May Allah guide us all. If you're contemplating a move, reflect deeply and pray for guidance.
Nice. Be a example who thinks come to Türkiye.
DO NOT COME WHERE YOU ARENT WANTED
Turkey is a secular country
We aren't gonna embrace you just because you are Muslim
@@justerginWe must come. Nothing you can do.
Making hijra back home to Muslim lands is a dream for me. Please make dua for me so that it becomes possible.
May Allah facilitate it for you. Ameen.
May Allah accept your intention and ease the path for you
@@IkemenDanshi amin
it is called turkey not muslims lands
It's a secular country not a Muslim land.
İ am Turkish born to Turkish father and Italian mother and grew up in Australia, Turkish is such an easy language to learn! İ learnt it when I went to Istanbul to live with my family when i was 17 for 1 year. İ want to migrate with my kids back to my motherland İnşallah. Türkiye is the best! People best, culture best, and for Islam is best compared to any western country. Turks haven't forgotten how the Arabs stabbed the Ottoman Empire in the backs and collaborated with the English and Islam's enemies. That's why Turks don't trust Arabs. Also a lot of the Arab migrants from Syria harass Turkish women in the streets and Turkish men are fighting back. That's part of the reason more and more Turks are against Syrians staying. Also, Turks, all throughout our history, we've always fought and died for our land and we are confused why so many Syrian men are in Türkiye running front he war in Syria and why they are not staying in Syria and fighting for their land? İ love Türkiye ❤
Well said brother. A fellow Aussie here I just want to let you know why Syrians are flowing into Turkey and not staying there. The ones that are living where Assad is in control are in fact staying there and fighting the real enemies and Assad is not the enemy. The others that are flowing into Turkey are stuck due to rebels not permitting them to move across into the areas Assad is in control. These people have no choice but to escape into Turkey as they can't stay and fight where they are bombing. They are not fighting they are bombing these people. Please don't compare this war to one that took place 100 years ago. There are not chemical weapons being thrown in the air and burning these people. What would you do if you were a father? I personally would take my kids and run away.
The Arabs did not betray the Ottomans, they tricked the British and dictated their false school history books to Turkish children for years, as if all Arabs did what a handful of Bedouin Arabs did. These games were made so that Arabs and Turks would not become stronger as an Ummah by causing discord. There is no racial superiority in Islam, no matter what race you are, a Muslim is the brother of a Muslim. That's why the Ottoman Empire managed to stand for 500 years because it ruled with sharia. When he moved away from the sharia, he went into decline. The chiefs of some Arab tribes succumbed to their ambitions and became the puppet of the British. This is true, for example, Sheikh Hussein, the grandfather of the current Jordanian king, and the grandfathers of the Saudi King family, the Wahabis, were (was) puppets of the British. The British brought the greatest disaster to the Turkish nation, the person called Atatürk. They swallowed the troublemaker as a hero. Now Muslims are waking up from the nightmare slowly.
Don't spread your false and racist ideas as if it belongs to all Turkish people. Stop that. The true betrayal is from Greeks Armenians and Bulgarians who massacred so many Turks and Muslims in Anatolia in collaboration with western countriesm . So learn your facts better and then talk about them.
@@ErelfBow what racist ideas? İt's not an opinion I'm stating it's a fact. Many Ottoman soldiers were stabbed in the back by Arabs who sided with the English and revolted against the Ottoman Empire. İ have an uncle who is Palestinian who I love dearly. I'm far from racist, but if telling the truth makes me racist, then I'm proud to be racist.
What you are describing here is pure fiction. You are malicious. You are trying to muddy the water with lies and false information. You are an evil and ignorant person.
More migration = more nationalism, across the world, as the brother said.
Are you allowed to use social media according to sharia since you have that type of clothing Naima?
@@otgunzstrawman
@@otgunz what?
@@otgunz The hell are you talking about
@@NewSmithsonian According to islam women should preserve themselves.
Amazing discussion Mashallah. I just returned from 9 day trip to Istanbul, we have been there 3 other times in past 7 years. I am a Shia Muslim living in America for past 38 years and married with an American convert wife for past 27 years. We have to kids a 22 yr old son and 11 year old daughter and we are looking at moving to Istanbul/ Turkey in th next 4 to 6?years inshallah, fro many of the same reasons.
Istanbul has always been in my heart and dream to permanently live there since my childhood before emigrating to US
Interesting. My friend and his parents just moved to turkey from america.
@@khairt1731 wow. Muslims?
@@symo9097 of course, bosnians.
If you are shia, you had better settle in Iran.
@@Msaglamm there are many Shias in Istanbul, I have been to a few Shia mosques and I like Istanbul very much .
I lived in Turkey for 6 years 2014-2020 and i promise you it is a very bad place to go for islamic reasons. It is very anti Islam more than the west even, only move to eastern parts of Turkey but you must know that it is very hard to adjust there since literally 0% of people speak any other language and their are no work opportunities AT ALL. I highly recommend somewhere in the gulf region such as Qatar or Oman or Saudia. Please spare your family the hardship of moving to Turkey. To be very blunt we are not welcomed there.
Exactly same with Egypt... The UK is ironically the best place to study and practice islam
@@skp8748At least in Egypt the people are religious. It’s a good place to go for Islamic knowledge.
@@luqmanosman4508 Lol... It has its spots like every country does... The good thing about Egypt is it doesn't foster heretical islamic interpretation but its still STATE>Deen
@@skp8748 You're crazy to think the UK is better. I can't even go outside anymore without being bombarded with 10 half naked women in 2 minutes.
@@skp8748 LOL, in the UK it is a compulsory now to teach the alphabet mob ideology in the schools, even the orthodox British Jews were protesting against this policy that also is pushing in their schools by the gov, Britain also set up a system that targeting Muslims, similar to the inquisition, a network of informants, everywhere that may include your employers and teachers in the schools to report about any Muslims they think he or she is too much conservative !!! I am very well aware of Egypt issues, the political and economic ones, but Egypt as a society is still Muslim regardless anything else you may see there !!!
Although Turkey has an Islamic image from history, this is just an image. Life in Turkey itself is completely secular. male-female relations drinking tradition lgbtq situations are not like in a Muslim country and according to some statistics, only five percent of Turkish people, consisting of old people, worship. When a child is born, a prayer is said and when he dies, a second prayer is said. There is almost nothing about religion between these two prayers. That is the religion in Turkey.
That's your Kemalist CHP bubble. There are millions of Turks who regularly pray in the mosques. Go and visit the landside as well, but even in places like İzmir you will find hundreds of thousands of people that are living a modest Muslim life, pray 5 times etc. On top of that, demographics are in favor of religious people on the whole world. Whether you look at UK, US, Israel or Türkiye. Secularists in Türkiye are of course not so happy with this reality, but well, that's their choice in life to make and answer to their Creator afterwards.
@@roenin Except jummah and eid prayers you can not see any mosque full. During regular days its always empty and it proves how delusional you are . Not even 1% praying 5 times. It never was. its your islamist cult bubble.
@@roenin What are you talking about? There are lots of mosques in Turkey but few people inside. Only friday prayers are a little bit crowded but even that is not comparable to how it was before. I voted for CHP. But I have lots of friends that vote for AKP. Literally none of them pray 5 times a day. Maybe half of them go to friday prayers. More than half of them drink alcohol and go to clubs. Almost all of them have girlfriends and most of them have sex with their girlfriend without marrying. But these are the young AKP generations because I am 27 years old. I would say 35+ AKP voters are much conservatives but they are hypocrites most of the time. Just watch Müge Anlı and you'll understand what I mean
@@roeninYou're spitting bullshit here, millions of people who pray 5 times a day? Especially in İzmir? Hahaha
@@roeninTurkish people say prayer. But they culturally secular. Chp won the latest election. If you want 100% islamic life like Saudi you won't get it.
May Allah bless Istanbul. Great conversation with such a beautiful brother.
Please always pray for us
Shut the cut you're not welcome in here
Answers were great but man the questions were so relevant and so well chosen!
جزاكم الله خيرا ، الله يعطيكم العفو والعافية والتوفيق
Thank you for this very informative interview. May Allah bless you in this life and the Hereafter.
Muslims have lots of options to live under their Islamic rules. Turkey is secular and it is the only option in Muslim world. please dont try to change it, cause most Turkish people are feeling more Turkish than Muslim, Turkic tradition has its own values, respect it. Dont migrate to Turkey or any other country just for trying to change.
All the Muslims are welcome here. Come and live here. We can change this country once again we want an Islamic country.
It will change. As a Turk I prefer Sharia more than a secular state.
@@ErelfBowyou are not Turkish, go to Afghanistan or Pakistan. Türkiye is unique.
@@ErelfBowYou are not Turk you liar. There is not a concept of "sharia wanting Turk" in the history. Thats single handedly shows that you are a liar.
@@ErelfBow I am living one of most conservative regions in med Anatolia, there is no such demand among the society, maybe 100 people within 1 million population think similar to you, dont try to manipulate data according to your political views … Turkish epic/culture/ancient life style secular in nature.
The answer is simple, instead of going to their homeland they go to secular Turkey because there is a kind of trans country created by Erdogan.
There are Muslim-style "entertainment venues", Muslim-style housing estates, Muslim-style gyms, Muslim-style restaurants, etc.
But the strange thing is that with the money they earn in western countries, these people take advantage of the Turkish economy and the exchange rate deficit, which Erdogan has ruined, and vote for Erdogan, who has made that country a disgrace with the house and citizenship they buy, causing Turks to live a life that is getting worse every day and the social demography to deteriorate.
It is worth noting that these people will multiply with Muslim style birth rates and soon they will have a say in the bureaucracy and they will not see Turkey, where they went for freedom, as Muslim enough and they will turn it into a barren country with civil wars like their ancestral homeland.
Let this comment be left here and soon Turks will read it and say "the man said it years ago".
Without a weak Lira Türkiye can't export as much and also can't attract tourists either. So, a weak currency is not the blame for all. On the contrary, thanks to the many tourists and diaspora Turks, economy is still alive. Türkiye has to tighten the belt, as economists like to say, especially in a global economy that is not keen on taking risks like investing in emerging economies like Türkiye. So, in essence, my friend: be thankful to the many tourists! They bring in important foreign currency to you. If you want to blame anyone for voting Erdoğan, don't blame the 2000-3000 Arabs that gained Turkish citizenship, but the 27+ million Turkish conservatives that don't want to see their country ransacked again by coalitions such as the one Kılıçdaroğlu came with. Turkish saying I like goes like this: there is always a worse of the worse (Beterin de beteri var) 😂
You should write about those male "muslim" refugees too. Why most of the Turks hate them.
@@notalent7369 No matter what political problem you talk about, this person will always answer you with Erdogan.
@@roenin cheap tourists are coming turkiye and not spending much. cleaning their dirt is much expensive, so turkiye doesnt need them.
turks will soon see the worse of worse and that will be not because of coalitions sure.
I wonder why people who want an Islamic life don't migrate to Saudi Arabia, for example? Or Iran? or Pakistan?
9/10 of the majority-Muslim countries in the world have a more "islamic" life than Turkey, and yet people here in the comments (and in the video), for some reason, talk about Turkey, one of the handful of majority-Muslim countries where life is normal, and people can breathe a little.
Just migrate to Saudi Arabia, it is more Islamic, trust me!
Saudi is beautiful but if you are not rich you have to work with either a skill or a qualification e.g degree thats how the world works unfortunately. Its hard to get visas, residency permits and impossible for citizenship in saudi. Turkey is dirt cheap it has a more or less failed economy but the people are decent. I guess the more you deal with innovation shirk and major haram sins such as alcahol, interest, gambling, zina, music etc the less blessings the country gets. Well Saudi is alot less of these things compared to Turkey.
@rvist1 Saudi sit on a giant oil reserve if you count the USA a god yes they have their protection and blessing. Also, having a big religious tourism helps.
@@rvist1 Turkey has way more innovation, R&D going on than Saudi Arabia.
Also, alcoholic beverages are commonly drank in Turkey, there are bars and nightclubs and cafes where people drink beer and wine.
Sex before marriage is 100% legal and people do it a lot. Turks love music too. Remember, it's not Taliban republic it's Turkey.
So if you're looking for a place without music, sex, alcohol, etc. you should go to Saudi Arabia or better yet, Afghanistan.
None of the reasons you mentioned justify immigrating to Turkey. Maybe it's precisely the existence of a normal life that attracts people to Turkey, actually?
@ertugrulgenc8540 Even though I disagree with his overall analogy, you really think 'hedonism' is a way to go for a 'normal' society? Your deluded akhi.
Right.
I am turkish, i grow up at usa , moved to tırkey, its been 23 years now . Living islam in usa was more beautifull,
We turkish people now want leave country, becouse of syrians and afgans , turkish doctors best in world and almost 100k doctors apply for imigration to germany, my brother tries to move back to usa,
Turkish goverment gave passport to arabs and becouse of them EU stoğ gaving visa to turks…
I went to university in malaysia and travelled all around the world , if u wanna live in muslim country prefer malaysia
Lgbt staff in western and family values are going bad in usa
WE WILL HEAL TURKEY STOP BEING SO DIVIDED MUSLIM FIRST AND STRONG MUSLIM PARTNERSHIPS WILL HEAL US, PLUS WHY DON'T YOU PARTNER WITH MBS HE LOOKS MUSLIM BUT HATES US ALL SO HE WILL HELP YOUR TYPE MONEY MINDED
Mashallah this discussion was so interesting. The questions, pacing and responses were thoughtful and illuminating. I like a lot of things about Turkey including people, architecture, food, and customs and would also choose to settle in Turkey or Malaysia if I had to make hijra. I found Thomas’ stance on the importance of Muslims needing family, neighbors and community particularly eye-opting , especially the way he described in the examples he gave from living in Türkiye.
This is why we and our children should have the education, skills and training to be ready to move and work to start a new life in another country. Otherwise the locals would be concerned or upset that we would depend on aid or charity. But if my new neighbor didn’t like me simply because of my skin colour or that i didn't speak the local language of a new country, at least I would pray next to them in the masjid. Patience is key here. Thank you so much for talking about your own experiences, Thomas.
You can't hijra to Türkiye, we are not an Islam country, go to Arabistan. We as Turks very racist. You are not welcome here.
As an atheist Turk, I respect your views. However, Turkish Constitution states that the Turkiye is a secular nation and it can't be even proposed to change it. Majority of the population being muslims does not add up to an islamic nation where certain rights of freedom can be oppressed. In Turkiye you can believe in whatever you want, practice any religion you want, eat or dress the way you like it as long as you don't try making it a monochromatic norm in terms of the way of life. You can not force one way of life as the right way.
Turkey have always had, till recently, a pretty unique mix of common unwritten rules and understanding with each other whether you are religious or not. When the immigrants from middle east and African countries come most of them do not respect the way of life in Turkey and instead they have been trying to force their traditions and their cons on to the population here. We had our own issues but now we have a lot of immigrants acting like animals released from captivity. No issue with hard working honest immigrants.
We are not just going to allow people coming here insulting our founding father Ataturk, stepping on our flags or sending social media posts claiming the country for themselves since they are better muslims than those who didn't vote for Erdogan. Religion is not even the main factor here. We don't have any problem people coming here, adopting our traditions and respecting our way of life. Seems to be case with Thomas Abdul here. The problem is the guy who comes to Turkey, follows our wives and daughters and films them because apparently it's a normal thing to do in wherever they come from and expect no recourse. I am a turk, if you follow my wife and film her with your phone you are going to lose all your teeth and beaten to a pulp damn the legal consequences.. If you come here, dress like an ISIS jihadist and threaten those living a secular life, then you seriously underestimate the Turks. As long as you know you are our guests and you are not the "natural" owner of the land we are good. We built this country with our blood, nobody has a right to claim it because they are too afraid to fight for their rights in their countries.
Just coming here does not make anybody have a right to turn neighborhoods into a mini syria, mini africa etc as well. We see this as an attempt to divide a part of the nation, however small it is, and any threat to a unified Turkey can not be tolerated.
Imagine 10 million christians from syria migrating to USA, not respecting the social fabric of the country because they are also christians. Why guard the borders at all, why not let all the Mexico migrate into USA so that all christians can embrace together.
+++ agree. As a Turk we will follow way of Ataturk. Guys dontforget this is not muslim country, this is secular country. The state has no religion. So never have expectation to have privilege from Turkish state because of you are muslim. Never forget, most of the Turks are having different type of Islam you believe. Turkish islam is softer. People dont want any kind of shariat belief in here. Be aware of it. So never imagine shariah in Turkiye
Kardeşim ne respectinden bahsediyorsun. Bu adamların şu konuşmasında sana en ufak bir respect görüyor musun. Adam açık açık değiştireceğiz diyor.
As an another atheist Turk, totally agreed. But arabs are arrogant cause of their culture. They can't change themselves. They have too archaic customs which will make hard for them to adapt our society. They should better be off.
@@ersgtr3421 Hekes dilediğini düşünebilir, düşünce özgürlüğüne saygım var.
@@elleshar666 yok senin saygın olduğu anlaşılıyor orada sorun yok. Sorun şu adamın anlattıklarında onun pek yok gibi çünkü adam değiştireceğiz diyor.
One of my friends is making Hijra to Saudi Arabia and I’ll be going to Morocco this year Inshallah. Please make dua for us.
Does Saudi Arabia allow you to settle there? Definitely not if you are middle class
@@MusaiftekharThey don't give out citizenships except for special cases.
@@Musaiftekhar my friend will be working there on a work visa. She has a masters degree.
I know a lot of of people moving to Morocco as well.
As a Moroccan from the diaspora, I strongly advise not to move to Morocco.
Yes it will always be more conservative than any Western country. But the secularization of Moroccan society is in full swing.
Please do not come to Turkey, we are full of people from everywhere.
I agree! I actually found some Turkish people unwelcoming. I stopped holidaying there to be honest.
@@ugbadfarah7928 thank you
what an amazing American. I am impressed the way humble he is unlike many Americans,definetely hijra has made positive impact on him.
Great discussion. Muslims from the West, especially converts, are probably in a position of privilege and advantage when it comes to emigrating to countries such as Turkey. If you are poor, of dark complexion, or a refugee then Hijrah is a highly discriminatory process. This is quite ironical as the purpose of hijrah is to save yourself from oppression etc.
I am not sure its as clear as that. We interviewed an Indian (to go out soon) and his views were quite positive about the response from the people. But agreed, as Thomas says, ‘refugees’ get a very bad deal amongst some nationalists.
There is a difference though. After all the bad times, in sha Allah all the immigrants to the West or the refugees can go back to the land of their ancestors. Reverts don't have that option.
@@AA123TDNot so much for Indian Muslims too... Things are looking very precarious for India's muslims.
@@AA123TD - why claim that there is a choice of going back to the country your ancestors originated from? How so? 2 to 3 generations and you don't have any rights to live in that country nor would you get rights automatically because your family originated from there. You would be subject to the same process anyone else, e.g. the revert, may have to go through to live in that country. Only advantage maybe that you may speak that language. In most countries you would be allowed to move there if you can get a job, work there a number of years and maybe apply for right to live there permanently. If you can't then you are in the same position as a revert.
To be honest local Turks are quite unhappy about islamist migration towards to Turkiye. People do not feel secure . 90 percent of people waiting election to send syrians and limiting the migration here
This was very interesting and enjoyable interview. Regards from Iceland.
This is a very decent video. As a muslim turk, i would like to explain certain things about Turkey for people who think of migrating here. Especially the things regarding why turks mostly opposse migration in the recent years, and why we started to embrace our nationalistic side once again. Of course some of the aspects have been talked in the video, but still. I hope my own explanations will be helpful on the subject. This will be a long comment, so i should warn you if you would get bored or do not have the time :)
So, why are turks reluctant to accept foreigners right now? There are important elements that cause this such as history, economical situation and other current events that have been going on.
1) History: First of all, it is useful to remember that due to its expansionism and the propaganda that was done, Ottomans have never been liked by most countries. Along with other historical developments, this situation has lead to the invasion of the lands of Turks in the aftermath of World War 1. Ottomans had already lost most of their lands because of their inabilities and the rise of nationalism before the Great War, and they lost the lands where arabs lived during the Great War when arabs basically betrayed the empire(this part is important, we will get back to here later on). So here they were, the turks, abandoned and alone, their own lands(not the ones where other ethnicities lived, i mean the very lands Turkey Republic was founded on) being shared between the allies. Thanks to Mustafa Kemal Ataturk and his brothers in arms, there was a revolution and a war for freedom. And turks never forgot that. So this nation is kind of founded in xenophobia, not by choice mind you, but it is an undeniable truth. If you are british, or french, or greek, a turk might treat you with respect and politeness, but you can be sure that behind the closed doors when two turks are talking about world events and such, they might be calling your nations names, they will be seeing England as evil, they will be seeing the french and the greeks as enemies in a wider range. Even if they dont see you evil or as an enemy indiviudally, they will still be wary of you or your nation. This doesnt mean this would be the situation with every turk of course since as the education increases a person starts to comprehend things like leaders of nations are not the same as people in it, and the example i have given is rather a historical perspective that has been passed on. In short, Turkey kind of inherited a form of xenophobia because of the hardship and animosity it had to endure when it was founded. Now lets get back to the arabs, who are the biggest group of people who come to this country as immigrants or refugees, syrians being the most and then the others. Turks never forgot what has been done to them during the Great War, they did nt forget the atrocities that was done to Ottoman soldiers by the very people they were trying to defend during the war. And you can be sure that turks will never ever forget that until the apocalypse arrives and we leave this world. We have a very strong memory when it comes to such things. We are very forgetful of recent history, but we sure have a weirdly strong memory for other things. Turks like to personify nations, races, countries. And Syria or arabs, are personified as "traitors" and "racists" to turks. Where does the "racists" part come from? it even predates the Ottomans and goes back to Emevi Dynasty, so another historical thing that turks do not forget. So in short: Turks are vary and cautious people when it comes to foreigners. They might not even show it, but they are, and its not entirely their fault. PS: People like non-arabic africans are exceptions to this xenophobia since we never fought with these people or treated badly by them, therefore we dont have a bad history with them to be xenophobic towards them.
2) Economical Situation: Roughly 20 years ago, before Erdogan came to power, Turkey wasnt in a great place economically. And now, after roughly 20 years, oh boy, do we miss those times... Country is going through the worst time in its history. Do not be deceived by turks who live abroad. Do not be deceived by government supporters who receive money from the ruling political party. Do not be deceived by the unlawful companies who get contracts just because they are connected to the ruling party. The middle class is almost gone, and a very low percentage of it managed to go into the upper class, the rest have dropped into low class. Official inflation numbers are outright lies, the media is under the control of Erdogan, the country is full of lies, rich got richer, poor got poorer. More than half of the people that are employed receive minimum wage(which is under the poverty limit) and there are also many people who cant find a job. So imagine, in this situation, your government keeps getting refugees (legally AND illegally) even when there isnt even a war going on anymore, paying them, giving them prioritized and free healthcare when your own countrymen literally suffer. Turkey was already a populated country(especially in big cities) before all the immigration and such, but now, it has become even worse. Not only that, the foreigners who migrate here can also be people who have a certain amount of money in their country, and when they come here, they are like kings. So basically, they enter the fray from the upper class, which kind of increases the pressure on people who are on the middle class or lower even more. So most turks want the foreigners gone. Not becuase they hate foreigners or anything, because they want to live in better conditions, and naturally they are in the mindset of "Look, being a guest is always alright, but everyone should live in their own home, and this is mine.". If the country wasnt a shitshow, if people werent living such difficult lives, you can be sure that they would be much different, but it is what it is.
3) Current Events: Some of the things happening in the country are very upsetting and alarming. First of all, crime has increased exponantially. Sorry but it is the truth. Im not saying Turkey was ever a heaven, and we sure have our own problems regardless of the people who have come here or still coming, but as a turkish proverb goes "One can not cover the sun with mud.". The sad thing is, many of us experience this. And it will not be long before people take justice into their own hands. Some of the so called muslim immigrants act very poorly. The video mentioned about "anti-islamic nationalism". Well, when so called "muslim brothers" keep recording our females on their phones like perverts because they dont wear hijabs or because they wear modern outfits, basically treating our women like "halal" objects, you can be sure that we will fight with those disgusting fake muslims. If these people keep sexually harassing our women, we will of course react. We turks do not give a f*ck whatever you call yourself, be it a muslim or a christian or a judaist or something else, you act like a pervert, then you will be labeled and treated accordingly. If you start committing crimes, then you will be treated accordingly. When we see that all those people who call themselves muslims act like that, its inevitable to say things like "we do not want your religion, we dont want what you have in this country". If you want so called "sharia" rule, go to arab countries, if thats the only way you can keep your pervert ways in check, this isnt the right country for you. This is the land of turks and this is our way. Dont shit where you eat. So basically, if you have such cultural differences, if you have strong beliefs which will make you treat others in unacceptable ways, then you should stay away from Turkey. Because to be honest, many turks honestly think that this will eventually end up with a civil war and no one should be stupid enough to be on the opposite side of turks considering history and how well turks have been at war. So huge cultural differencs between Turkey and other muslim countries is a huuuuge problem. We turks do not see most of the muslim world compatible with us. We have no intention of becoming an arabic country, or afghanistan or pakistan or whatsoever. That is why we dont care if we share a religion or not. We hate it with a passion when someone comes and starts to dicate their own way of life. You do not get to do that. The video says "Earth is Allah's", that may be true(Not to mention to the fact that no turk has to believe that, this isnt a islamic state, its a turkish state), but go somewhere else in the world if you dont like the lands we turks live, dont effing try to change it and dont be surprised if we hate you when you try to do that.
So those 3 are the main reasons why we turks are not hospitable as we once were and why we dont look at migration very warmly right now. I hope it has been informing. Have a nice day all!
There's a lot of anger it seems in your comment. I'm from the UK and it may surprise you but if you look at the bigger picture, what you will find is a lot of your issue's you mentioned are the same things that people say across the world whenever there is large migration. In a globalised world, especially one in which the west is losing man power to shrinking population, migration will always be increasing.
Also migration is a human reality that existed long before Turkey and will exist perhaps long after Turkey. Human migration does not care for abstract borders, the Romans couldn't stop migration, the Muslims couldn't the Europeans cannot, the Americans cannot from the South. Whenever ecological or political problems occur, people migrate. That's why there's also large migrant population of turks in Europe.
Your 2nd point is missing one important factor; Covid and the war in Ukraine has affected deeply the entire western world economically, and Turkey isn't a exception. The other thing you should know is economically here in England over the last 20 years its only getting worse too. This I'd a global trend in industrialised western nations. In fact the Middle class squeez is happening here and America too, in America and Uak, real wage increase when adjusted for inflation has not occurred at all for most people! As the economies grew in the last 60 years the rich got richer; welcome to capitalism. I don't know in and outs of Turkiye economics but we live in a world economy and Turkiye's experience is shared by many countries.
Also I find it strange that you say "that may be true". The world is Allah's and his alone. The byzantine Romans, and the Romans and Greeks before them didn't own the land, it was Allah's and when he decreed for the Turkic tribes to migrate there, they did. This is a deep metaphysical point that you must know because nation states only came into existence with the domination of european powers, but they are not absolute thing, independent of time and social context.
Bro you should know its strange but your third point is common around the world too! In Europe whenever there's a large number of immigrants, the complaint is that they're causing most of the crime and sexually harassing the women. In fact, this happens to immigrants, black, muslim, and in UK now Eastern European migrants are considered lazy crooks. In America the black people were accused of commiting all the crimes and sexually assaulting white women and considered savages. Also, the migrants from South americas are considered the same. I find it striking that your sentiments are just like that of anti immigrant people across the world.
This is a common pattern that whenever poorer migrants come, whatever issues may exist with them are exaggerated and they are made to seem like the root cause of all evil. The truth is that the one who does not aid his fellow man and his fellow believer and is loyal to the state over what is ethically more superior (loyalty to Allah), then such a person is a loser in this life and the next. People have problems but hatred and preservation of status qou at the the expense of doing the morally right thing is misguidance at the highest level.
Your first point is appreciated (as are all your perspectives, brother) but I think it isn't a accurate portrayal. Turkic rulers existed all across the Muslim and Arab world (mamluks in Egypt, even Afghanistan and Pakistan at one point had Turkic rulers, the Seljuks etc). Muslims didn't consider rulers illegitimate based on ethnic origins; the creed and belief of a person trumped everything else. This is important.
The ottomans in the beginning were very different from the later ottomans, the later ottomans started europeanization and westernization project socially and culturally and were victims of their own designs by some degree. Before colonisation division upon ethnic lines wasn't sought by Arabs or any one else. After colonial empires came into the mix they stoked the fires of nationalism among the elites of arab nations but you must understand one thing; this worked partly because the ottomans them selves were trying to redefine themselves in a european manner and a more ethnocentric way; the ottoman project of secularizing gave rise to the young turks movement and eventually to attaturk. But one must realize the adoption of these foreign ideas regarding identity etc made ottomans seem more like Turkish supremacists rather than leaders of the Muslims, this then isolated them from their Muslim fellows of differnt backgrounds. The colonial only used this to their advantage and split the countries up bases on nationalism which ottomans were already embracing themselves. Why would the turks feel betrayal? Loyalty was based on the foundation of islam and islamic identity, when that was abandoned by turks and then the Arabs then ofcourse all they can do is divide through the remaining ideology of nationalism.
Harassing women is ofcourse evil and bad thing far from islam but its hypocritical to attack muslim migrants as the cause of all this. What about decades of alcoholism and white westerners co ing over to party and commit debauchery in your lands? There's no mention of this, the notion that migrants caused secual voilence etc is ridiculous and common trope used against migrants everywhere almost as if it was never happening before which is ridiculous.
Lastly I'd like to point out a matter I'm confused with about your post. You don't like Muslims coming over because you think they're changing your country and committing crimes and want shariah (I don't personally think this is plausible but just general angry sentiments of people dealing with new changes of migration). Don't you thinks it's hypocritical? Kamal attaturk and the ottomans before him tried to force change on muslim society to reshape their minds to be more europeanized, to abandon their previous culture and ways and their previous moral codes. The sharia law which ironically was implemented across the ottoman world, was removed by Kamal, he forcefully changed the culture by unveiling women and banning the viel during a time when most women wore the hijab as it was a cultural norm. He banned the adhan, sufi lodges etc which were all deep part of the Turkish muslim culture, changed the alphabet of your language. The point I'm making is the founding father forcefully changed the entire culture and valued of the society, but your now saying other people can't attempt to change your culture and society?
I understand times are difficult and everything is politicised. It's sad when people give up their morals in favor of blind nationalism;
if you're a Muslim my brother then you should know that the prophet and his companions were MIGRANTS. Poor migrants who went to abyssynia for refuge against persecution and most people there were non muslim but they protected the Muslims. The prophet (peace be upon him) was a migrant to Medina! And he and his companions were migrants accepted by medina and had to leave due to the persecution they faced. The prophet forbade tribalism and nationalism and got angry when the migrants and the people of medina divided on lines of tribalism. The Syrians are in Turkiye because the leader Bashar (who'sfamily was installed by europeans) started killing his people. The people escaping are migrants Fleeing persecution just as the Muslims once did before
Remember the saying of the prophet when he said :
" Whosoever leaves off obedience and separates from the Jama'ah and dies, he dies a death of jahiliyyah. Whoever fights under the banner of the blind, becoming angry for 'asabiyyah (partisanship and party-spirit), or calling to 'asabiyyah, or assisting 'asabiyyah, then dies, he dies a death of jahiliyyah"
@@Mohammed-bz8lt Atatürk didn't ban hijab; the hijab ban was issued in 1980 and continued up until 2013. Atatürk didn't ban ezan; he just changed the language of it because Turks don't speak Arabic and can't understand what the ezan says. The so-called alphabet of our language wasn't even ours; our own alphabet is the Orkhun alphabet, so we have every right to change it however we want. Why should we use the Arabic script? Is it ours? No. Also, Atatürk actually helped the Muslims strengthen their faith by translating the Kuran to Turkish because, again, Turks can't understand Arabic, so they didn't even know what the Kuran said and blindly believed in Islam. By doing this, he made the people actually understand their own religion. And no, just because Atatürk did what was necessary doesn't mean you can do it again, especially if it's about Sharia. I don't get why you all think you can go to a country and change it however you like; you have absolutely nothing to say on this topic. If you don't like living in a secular country and seeing women wander around in skirts and tank tops, seeing people drink even during Ramazan, and seeing people not praying, don't come to Turkey. Our state is founded on secularism and Kemalist nationalism, so of course we want to keep these values. The things the commenter said about immigrants are all correct; there are thousands of people recording our women in bikinis, skirts, and even in normal clothes such as pajamas. Then they share these videos and leave comments like, "Turkish women 🤤" You don't get to do that in a country you migrated to; you don't get to sexualize our women. You can't rape girls like you did back in your country; you can't kill women because you don't like them not covering.
The thing about Syrians is that they refuse to adapt to our norms, refuse to learn the language, claim the lands where there is a Syrian majority, set up signs in Arabic, get to benefit from the thousands of priorities our government provides us, and still complain about everything. They literally occupied the most touristic parts of Istanbul, even when claiming to escape from a war, because I personally wouldn't change continents if I had to escape from one, and they act like they own the place. I can't even go to Fatih anymore because there are Syrians everywhere, and they look down at me and talk behind my back about my dress attire. They act like we have Sharia in Turkey, so they think they get to decide how I act and how I dress. And the stupidest thing of all is that they ACTUALLY demand Sharia. We won't tolerate anyone who tries to change our country's laws, and Syrians are a part of this. It is ILLEGAL and sentenced to lifelong prison to change the first four laws of the constitution, and laicism is one of these four laws.
Again, if you integrate, speak the language, don't demand having four wives, don't judge anyone, don't set up ghettos, make Turkish friends, and don't rape, steal, or kill, you're welcomed. The land might belong to God, but the ownership is ours, so we get to decide who stays and who doesn't.
@@Mohammed-bz8lt It is true that we are frustrated and angry about certain things, but my words do not come from those, my words come from observations and experiences. Like it or not, my words represent the truth, and i couldnt care less if you wish to ignore the truth. Also sorry but your words are full of irrelevent or false data. Like, almost in every point you tried to make. Let me just try to clarify some of them:
1) Turkey is not in the same situation with Europe. We do not need manpower at all, like at all. So we dont need immigrants, we do not need them one bit. If they are educated, if they will integrate, if they will be part of the community and add something to it, sure they can come. But it doesnt mean Turkey is in need of manpower, we could go for a very long time without ever needing such a thing i assure you.
2) Economical situation is no way near any other country. %135+ infation is not the same inflation as Europe's %9-12, not to mention to the fact that even before this inflation thing, Europe was way better than us and our money was already bad. You cant just google stuff and know everything you need to know about a country. You wont find the real numbers of Turkey on google, you will only find what the government wants you to find. Dont ever go with that "whole world going through this" argument when talking to a turk, thats a friendly advice to you.
3) Look man, im gonna make it simple for you. Just because you are a muslim, it doesnt mean what you believe should be considered facts by all people and treated as such. You say its Allah's world, and i, as a muslim say, sure, yes that is true, but im not going to let anyone dictate stuff where one can just ignore other people's liberty just because of their faith, especially when even Allah tells us how important freedom and liberty are. Both as a MUSLIM and a TURK, it is my obligation to protect LIBERTY. Liberty basically means your freedom ends where other person's freedom starts. And liberty is one of the core beliefs of our country as well. So anyone who wants to change things in a land they go to, especially in Turkey, can just go away. Muslims were indeed immigrants correct, but they didnt go somewhere where they were minority and then dictated their ways and forced others to change. Muslims were not arrogant like that when the religion itself was born. You can not just simplify and call such things as the same things you know.
4) Ottomans were a european/balkan nation and they were much more western than the being the opposite until they turned to east during Sultan Selim I. era when they took the caliphacy. The greatest sultan of Ottomans was Mehmed the Conqueror who literally wanted to be acknowledged as a roman emperor because he wanted to continue that legacy in the world. So politely, do not try to teach me my own history brother, espcially since im not an average everyday person regarding it :)
5) Sorry but immigration can be and will be stopped if the people come here continue to harass people who live here, disturb the people whose ancestors paid for these lands with their blood. And about crime rates and other things, keep those leftist thoughts(which are in truth false) to yourself please, we come across these things ourselves. My words do not come from some propaganda or anything i assure you, they come from experience. Like i said, our country has never been a heaven but these atrocious acts we see each day is not something we will tolerate. So this no "blind nationalism" nor its political. We are defending our ways of life, we are defending our women. Its as simple as that. So keep your "they blame immigrants everywhere" rhetoric to yourself please, I know what i myself experience. Oh and a bonus for you: the so called refugees who keep coming to Turkey are a part of the Greater Middle East Project.
6) Im not against "muslims" in general coming to my country in normal conditions. But we are not in normal conditions. Right now, muslim or not, regardless of any label, any label at all, Turkey needs to fix itself first. Turkey needs to recover a bit, heal a bit. We really are not in a place where we can accept and handle immigration, we really cant. But lets say Turkey has gone better. Then would i like muslims in my country? that depends. First of all, i do not care if a person is muslim or not. What i look at, what many of us look at is how willing they are to be a part of this culture. How much morality do they have? How do they look at women? How do they look at the other beliefs? Are they secular? It's many turks' opinion that, sadly, an overwhelmingly huge part of the Islamic world is incompatible with us. By that, i mean the countries where so called sharia is being applied, or the countries where the majority of people are muslims. Sorry but its just the way it is. We simply do not think that "all muslims" are actually, truly and deservingly muslims(for starters, including our own country, muslims take the religion for granted, just look at all the muslim countries and you will see some sort of authoritarion regime which will be swimming in wealth. So much for an Ummet whose prophet lived a humble life, its very ironic isnt it?). There are many human rights that are being butchered in muslim countries, and that basically is against Islam in the first place. To many Turks, most of muslim countries are not even truly muslims. But they are the majority so they will be called muslims, world will keep calling them muslims. In any case, such things eventually translates to culture. Just like this looking at women who dont wear hijab as sinners or lowly women, thinking that they are "halal" sex objects and whatnot. So in conclusion, if one leaves their incompatible cultural differences behind and chooses to integrate, then they would be welcome. If not, they would not be. Being a muslim or rather one calling themselves muslim doesnt matter at all, it will be the actions of one who would show if they would be welcome here or not. If they are compatible, thats good. If they are compatible AND a muslim, then its even better.
Also Well, i hope this reply will be helpful enough to make you understand the situation. I believed that i have said everything that is required to understand the situation so i wont be commenting furthermore. Have a nice day!
Edit: I also wanted to add something about this topic. I should tell that when Syrians first came to the country, we were very welcoming. And it was very natural, because they were running away from war and even though turks do not like the concept of running from a war in your own country(its an honor to die defending your lands in here) especially if you are a male, we understand that war is an ugly thing. The problem is, as the time passed by, as the war ended, they did not go back. Even that, even them staying here couldve been accepted if they didnt start to try change things and start to act arrogantly. Mind you that of course not every refugee or immigrant is the same, im well aware of that. But these people chose to stay here, got citizenship easily just because Erdogan wanted their votes, they voted for that awful man thus affecting the life of turks whose ancestors bled for this country(we are really against the concept of people who escaping war coming here and start owning another land which was earned with a lot of sacrifices, a lot of lives), kept ignoring the country's language and culture, so here we are... Basically what im trying to say is, it is a very different thing to provide shelter for people who are actually in need of shelter. its a very different thing to help the oppressed. But aside from that part, turkish hospitality solely depends on you. It depends on the immigrants themselves.
Let me give an example every turk knows: there are many africans in Turkey, black people to be specific. Some are muslims, some are not. They were here before the syrians and whatnot. All those years, living in this country, they never ever never created any kind of negative reaction on turks. They are the greatest example when a turk talks about immigrants. They come to this country because their countries are not good to live in. They come here for economical reasons mostly. And they never disturb anyone. They work at their jobs, they do honest work, they never commit crime, never catcalling a turkish woman, never taking videos like that. They all learn turkish. And turks are always, always happy to welcome them into this country. So do not think that nationalists in Turkey are racists or whatsoever. Do not think that we reject someone who would be in need of help. Ask the so called racist nationalists about africans, the black people, and you would hear "nah, they are alright, they are welcome, wish everyone was like them". So like i said, it depends on people :)
@@irmkc Well said 👏👏👏
why you are always considering christian or secular countries to migrate? there are lots of seria countries go there and live happily after, don’t try to change others countries including Turkey
Agreed.
Because you can't rule a country with conservative beliefs and expect it to have high standards of living. Advancements and prosperity always come from places who promote freedom since the antiquity. These people also know it, but they are blinded by their poltiical and religious beliefs. They never learn this and keep tring to ruin the remaining still functioning countries.
Turkey has higher standards of living than any other muslim majority country because it has been ruled under secular law. Erdogan's agenda is to try to revert this and he is partly successful. You can already see the signs in the the huge decline in financial trust and the economic recession. The good days are temporary as it keeps getting worse each day.
Exactly right👏
Please, we need more information like this, or more videos like these.
Turkey is a beautiful country and Turks can be very loving people, but a long stay can bore the host, after all, Turkey is a nation-state, not a country of immigration like the USA or Canada.
I wish that was the case for syrians so they could return to their spam-hole.
I really hope you understand Istanbul is only a city & bombarded WAY OVER its capacity. Try to go to Hakkari maybe, or Şırnak please. You’d still enjoy the islamic life you pursue 😄
I totally agree with this comment. During summer time hakkari and şırnak very beautiful Also in winter too no traffic no overwhelmingly crowded also living cost lower than istanbul. Please consider these cities.😁
@@tahtalikoyunkavalcisi I was astonished by the level of selfishness throughout the interview. No idea what they are doing to a beautiful city collectively to damage. If it’s genuinely “religious” culture they want to experience, just wanted to remind them how big Turkey is…just go to the unexplored. Afterall, they must be after modesty, self reflection & being a good humanbeing, so living in Istanbul doesn’t make one more muslim than living in Hakkari. Or maybe…purpose isn’t just that. You got my drill 🥴
Turkiye is a secular nation state. If you identify yourself as a Muslim and want Arab rules called Sharia, go to Afghanistan! Turkiye is not the place for you! Here it is forbidden to practice Arab rules under the guise of religion. Polygamy is forbidden in Turkiye. Women receive an equal share of inheritance. Beating a woman is a crime. Women have the right to vote and be elected, you cannot impose prohibitions on them like in Arab culture and treat them like animals. Drinking, adultery and gambling are allowed. In short, the Muslim lifestyle you are looking for is not here! The most suitable place for you is Afghanistan. You can live the Arab religion as much as you want.
But nobody is forced to gamble, drink alcohol or commit adultery. So, people are still welcome to live a modest Islamic life in Türkiye!
Arab religion? Wtf are u even talking about and afghans are not arab...
I'm turk from the US ur embarrassing us... ur mustafa kemal died and his supporters keep losing long live erdoğan long live Islam...
Nah you can go to a more secular country, we turks want an Islamic country
@@Eserimumin LoL less than %1 If you don't believe me, look at the mosques at prayer time. Not even 3 rows of people. :D :D
@@burgazada A regular Turkish person wouldn’t know what Sharia and secularism is. If you would explain to the Turkish people, whom the majority is muslim, what Sharia (the laws from the Qur’an as revelation from Allah) and secular laws (kufr belief, disbelief in God), they all will definitely say that Sharia is what they want
don't come. turkey is secular and will stay secular. if you want to live in a "muslim" country, move to united arab emirates, saudi arabia or smth... most turkish people are not even conservative.
Heriflere bak ya aralarında bir tane beyni olan adam yok şaka gibi. Diğerlerine de giderim ama en iyisi türkiye diyor! Neden acaba? İçlerindeki en liberal ülke türkiye olduğu için olabilir mi?
Bu islamcılar mikrop gibi her yere yayılıyorlar ve ürüyorlar devamlı. Nasıl kurtulacağız bunlardan of!
Yes, we come because beatiful Turkiye is perfect equlibre betven secularity and conservativ. Perfect tolerance. So ,we come.❤
@@neptun7776 thanks to you, we are losing our secularism day by day. u took our country from us.
@@neptun7776go to your country to change it. Turkish people don't want migrants
We want no Arab, afghans, iranian, ırak... What ever from the east! Turkey belongs to the Turks and it's secularists for ever... For ever!!! ❤
Turkiye is very VERYYYY secular . . .lots of Masjids , yet no one praying . . . And not many Turks speak English there . . . So think twice before you move there . .
Yes, listen to him and don't come. We don't want you here.
@My-cj1sg
You're going to make a sweeping generalization about 80 million people and their private religious habits.
Then you're going to ride them for not speaking the language of your choosing?
The fact you wont' be moving to Turkiye is doing a HUGEEEE favor to the people of Turkiye.
@@williamdavis9562 with a name like " William Davis". . . I think your in the wrong country ! Lol
@@MY-cj1sg Absolutely not.
Been hanging out here for 20 years, no issues. There are thousands and thousands just like me.
This isn't Pakistan my man.
@@williamdavis9562 certainly wouldn't want you in Pakistan . . It'd make my blood boil , don't need more evil there !
TÜRK olarak bize soran varmi 13 milyon gelmis dahasi gelecek ,kardesim burası yol gecen hanımı ???
What makes Turkey great is its secular system and not being a Muslim country. Muslims rights, and others, of worship are fully protected and respected. I wish other Muslims understand this and to stop trying to Islamize Turkey.
May God help anyone that wants to undêrstand the Kur'an and read it regûlarly ,The world needs healing.
Ameen
I really loved the way you guys studying and educating us about your experience l would love to visit and meet you guys inshallah
Very important. It takes time to answer in full. I'll come back insyaAllah for extensive response.
Best place right now it's Afghanistan everything is organic.😋👌
Even the heroine
Afghanistan is on the list for massive Muslim emigration ,mutter of time
@@user-tt8yj7vm3m which world do you live in as it's not earth 🌎
@@erikmorales1004 it's spelled heroin and the Taliban destroyed the heroin trade
Insha allah, it's a matter of couple of years
My new favourite podcast I love the expediency with which each of these videos are released and how relevant they are to the fitna faced by the Ummah today. May Allah reward you for your efforts.
Bastard arab
Excellent, very thoughtful and indepth discussion
Mashalla a very good podcast jazakhalla to brother Thomas for his insight on this interesting topic we all learnt alot and will adhere to brother Thomas advice and guidance we need more of brother Thomas podcast and jazakhalla to the interviewer too good questions mashallah thoroughly enjoyed.
Absolutely amazing and intelligent discussion. Your guest is amazing, highly nuanced intelligent and well informed. May Allah bless him for his efforts for the Muslim ummah and Islam
Salaams, I am a tech entrepreneur, is there any neighborhood or area in Istanbul that has the most tech startups - I would love to go spend a few weeks there, working remotely. Thx.
Please keep on moving. Strict adherents to your faith can never fit comfortably within an enlightened open society and will always be under tension and separate from society. Far better for all to move to where you can live fully with your beliefs.
Although, if I’m honest, I spent a lot of time in Istanbul. I found it to be just as decadent and liberal as any major city in the West, but I didn’t stray out of the city so perhaps the rest is very different, this was 20 years ago too.
This is same today. Turkey is same as European, only difference is you won't face racism just because you are Muslim. If you can blend with Turkish conservative you will be fine. Salafi,wahabi,deobandi isn't tolerated. And keep your religion to yourselves.
I was born and raised in İstanbul and have been living abroad more than 15 years.I am watching all tv reports and reading news from different aspects where available in Turkish to understand whats happening right now.I don't want to come back in place that actually I would be now stranger.Please,stop mixing the wording between IMMIGRANTS vs REFUGEES!!! Both have totally different meanings.Immigrants that bring value to Turkiye are most welcome but Refugees should be ready to be packed up, and Turkish people would say our hosting time is ended up.Please,consider to go back your hometown with Turkish people good wishes and strong support.Anyway,if Muslims are on dawaa then better to stay where you are and show your Islamic attitude by helping other people,at least with nice smile.Every Ramadan,all my non-muslim collegues ask about fasting and they show their expression how Muslims are able to fast that long time without eating and drinking.How do we pray 5 times a day, why Ribaa(interest) is haraam,cheating is haraam and such as.Stay where you have jobs and families, and get together and demonstrate how to be a good Muslim to others.Watch your kids and teach them why do they need to wear hijaab,why we do need pray.All the best brothers and sisters.May Allah grant you peace and place where you can live happily with your familises
+++ They do not understand that we Turks do not want to live with this amount of imported muslim community. We are less happy. We are less safe. Our girls are harrased on streets everyday.
Gotta love Turkish nationalists. Not a charitable bone to be had - just what's in it for us and we don't want to see foreigners in our country. Meanwhile millions fled Turkey and are laboring away or committing crimes in Europe.
I'm hearing nothing but excuses. It is a major sin to migrate away from a Muslim nation to a kafir one which scholars have said.
DO NOT MOVE TO TURKEY WE HAVE ENOUGH FOREIGNERS AS IT IS! We are not the worlds refugee camp, enough is enough!
Saying ever European country the last 5 years 😂
@Peasantarcher9807, That really isn't how it works.
The types of people watching this video aren't going to up and move to Turkey unless they have special skills or enough money where they won't be working.
It's called brain drain and it will only help you by bringing in highly qualified people, not to mention people with cash.
I can see your reflex though considering the amount of Syrian refugees your nation took in, it's been a burden on Turkiye but the types of people who will move to Turkiye from the west will bring lots of skills, knowhow and capital. No low wage worker in the west will up and and move to Turkiye. They wouldn't be able to survive in Turkiye.
@@kyliekia8917there isn't only Europe in the World. Stop your colonial inferiority complex
The world is vast. And I feel like every human has the right to move wherever they please. Maybe one day you will want to move somewhere, for whatever reason, and how will you feel if you’re told you’re not welcome?
@@Jannah928 yeah that’s how you feel, sure. But in our culture great emphasis is placed on the sacrifices our forefathers had to make to obtain the right to call oneself a Turk and to be a citizen. Now every Joe Shmo get’s to be one. Whoever is not very careful with their demographics in Anatolia is bound to lose it: Hittites, Persians, Greeks, Armenians…etc
If I will ever do hijrah from the US, Türkiye 🇹🇷 would be my choice. For our hearts Ottomans, for soulful Mevlana Rumi, and for the lover of Rasulullah ﷺ Abu Ayub Ansari. ❤
Thats all lovey-dovey and romantic but did you even watch this entire video?
When Abdulrahman Ibn Awf (who was based in Jerusalem at the time) wrote to Bilal Ibn Rabah (who was in Damascus) saying “Come to Bayt Al Maqdis”, Bilal replied “it is not a city which makes you Maqdis (sacred) but one’s deeds”. The Sahaba were able to take Islam with them wherever they went, away from Makkah and Madinah after the Prophet’s passing (sal-Allahu alayhi wa sallam). They not only took their Islam with them via their knowledge, wisdom and deeds, but were also able to change the environment around them by instilling Islam into the area and people. I hope this brings some peace for those chasing something out there to fix their spiritual void. ❤
I was born and raised in Istanbul and as a Turkish person I am really surprised about Thomas' command over our culture and society (he even knows the changing social scene for the last ten years). I have never seen a foreigner with so much knowledge on our culture and cities of Turkey, particularly Istanbul. I can't say anything but praising words. I think his success in knowing Turkey and Turkish people so deep, lays on his ability to speak Turkish and interact with all the parts of the Turkish society not just the English speaking ones. But still this can't be only reason, his view on Turkish people differs from western orientalist minded people, he sounds like he has become one of us.
Bizden biri değil. Böyleleri eğitimli casus. Müslüman oldum ayağına İslamcıların arasına giriyor. Bizim saf insanlar da yiyor. Ülkemiz elimizden gidiyor, farkında değilsiniz.
Onur, CIA makes sure they are well integrated into the society they need to filter in 😄. After the unfortunate Iran rev, I had met 2 CIA agents who looked exactly Iranian/Persian, and who knew all about the society, history and geography of the region, as well as speaking the languages fluently
@@yesimkirdar3160
😅😂🤣 Don't forget about the Mossad and MI6.
But all conspiracies aside, why shouldn't Westerners migrate to Turkey? Cultural exchange needs to happen on both sides. Too many Turks are sheltered from the outside world and they only learn languages like German and English for economic reasons.
For example, how many Turks can speak Fluent Arabic or Persian (Farsi)? Or even Russian?
as a Turkish person, Türkiye is not easy place to live ( economic problems)
to live in Istanbul is not peaceful ( if you live in central places). this City has 17-18million population and city is vomiting human, traffic, pollution.
you will see many ethnicity ( everyone says this for their country same but If you come you will understand what I mean ). So whenever you think the person even speaks Turkish remember this person might be non Turkish.
and it's my request from all people who live here be respectful, don't throw your rubbish around street, keep it clean, no violence to people and animals.
Very thought provoking discussion
Mashallah dear brother Thomas Abdul Qadir.
I enjoyed listening you, one of the best explainations of nuances on hijrah.
❤May Allah bless you all the khayr
Look friends, Turkish people are generally hospitable. But in the last 10 years, because of the government's policies, secular life in Turkey has been threatened and especially immigrants from places like Pakistan and Afghanistan, which are not humanitarian, have started to take videos of Turkish girls wearing normal clothes outside and post them on social platforms and this has infuriated the Turkish community and we don't want to see any more unknown immigrants coming across the border illegally. We won this land by fighting and shedding our blood, nobody gave it to us. Let me give you an example; you see a lot of African people in Turkey and our people love them because they don't harm anyone, they don't become mafia. Some have come for education, some for work. But these uneducable perverts who have been coming lately are attracting the reaction of our people and believe me, everything depends on a spark, no one can tolerate them anymore. The world is enough for all of us, but you have to respect the rules in the house where you come as a guest. I hope I have been able to explain the problem of Turkish people in general about immigration. Peace be with you.
The guest should know how to be a guest but also there is a capacity for a house to host guests. Turkiye is the first country hosting the most refugees in the world. Turkiye has been hosting millions of refugees for years. This is a very heavy burden for a developing country like Turkiye which has many problems.
The tolerance of people in Turkish culture is naturally high in both ways. However, conservative propaganda in Turkey in the last ~10 years has given away to populism and became increasingly aggressive. This creates fervour and tension between people, and it tips the good balance that makes this country and the culture attractive in the first place. Events such as art galleries getting raided in Istanbul, or school curriciulum overhauls that selectively ignore evolution and other scientific topics are quite concerning, even for muslims that are non-conservative. Erdogan is feeding fuel to this fire constantly for his political reign and he isn't going to stop soon, and I think he has already overdone it.
tl:dr: Enjoy Turkey while it's still beautiful, I'm afraid it will slowly become the worst-opposite of the West that is so despised.
DONT COME HERE YOU ARE NOTTT WELCOME
The thinking Muslim, please I live in Istanbul and would be happy to see you
Thank you for such an interesting discussion, many of us living in Turkiye tend to avoid these topics due to a lack of knowledge and proper wording to describe the atmosphere/situation without sounding too controversial. My mouth dropped at the questions asked and discussed here and I was so impressed with the intelligent way of answering those sensitive questions, so spot on and precise. May Allah reward your efforts and put barakah in your work and time. I totally agree with promoting Islamic values in Turkiye through example and have experienced the benefits of having a foreign-practising Muslim community living here in Turkiye within the Turkish community, especially from those coming from the West. We have been questioned so many times in confusion by the Turkish ppl why we would give up living in UK to come and live in Turkey? They are totally astonished when we say our reasons for valuing their country. It's like they don't know what they have been blessed with. So yes, dawah is still important here, and I think even more so because it is a Muslim country.
Turkey is not a Muslim country. Turkey is a secular country with a fairly dumb and mostly Muslim population which will let millions of foreigner in exchange for a promise “visa free travel to Europe”.
Your comment about Turkish ppl... desperation and poverty in the Islamic world is what the ppl of Turkey experience daily and that's why they are surprised. Face reality,. 50k Pakistanis in Norway, millions in the U.K. And more spread across the world even in Japan mostly poor ppl. Millions more would love to leave for the West. The world is filling up.
@@agnescraig2912 Well, I guess if a nation is willing to let in millions of foreigners while “acting European” so that themselves could go to Europe is not a nation and should not be in political control of any “national” territory. The narrative you are describing doesn’t exactly fit the secular republic of Turkey. The “dumb” behavior of citizens of Republic of Turkey can be attributed to two things: 1) Confusing and conflating Ataturk’s objective of reaching the “level of contemporary civilizations” with EU membership. 2) The “guest worker” program signed between the government of Turkey and a number of European governments in early 1960. Those created the dumb and confused people who want to have it both ways: Muslim and European. It’s not going to happen.
Turkey is a small county ( relatively terms) to absorbs too many people. Human needs enough space and resources matter. How about consider a relatively less developed country which has space. well educated people from west with some wealth come to those countries who are very Islamic to the core. I am referring to Afghanistan or Pakistan or even Somalia.
just a thought. It will be a win-win situation. locals will appreciate it and it will be a positive change.
Oh, dear. So wrong. So wrong. Turkiye has always been a secular country even though the politicians try very hard to portray it differently. Turkiye is not an Islamic country-it just has people who call themselves muslim but do not practice it. Only 8-10 percent of Turkish people can be considered 'real Muslims. Ordinary Turkish people's Islam is a very misinformed and altered version of the religion. Turkish people deeply resent arabs, their customs and those who live like arabs. Turkish people are not politically correct like you are used to in Europe. I warn you those who are considering this.
Very interesting and insightful!
Turkey is a secular country and will stay that way. Deal with it and if you wanna live in a muslim country plase consider other options
You are peroq repeat repeat repeat why like that
This is an excellent interview. I too left the states 35 years ago for Egypt for the same reasons.
After. studying Quran and aqidah for 20 years, I choose to split my time between the two in order to teach muslim women converts as it is a fard ayn for me.
Sadly, the tribal ethos of Arabs living in the U.S. does not allow for much help and integration within the ummah. Also, there is always the fear from the wives that her husband may marry the American convert, secretly or otherwise.
The husbands are reluctant to allow their wives to interact with the converts fearing they could be informants.
Allah owns the universe and everything in it. QURAN TELLS US THAT SOME MUST MIGRATE TO LEARN THE DEEN AND WARN THEIR PEOPLE WHEN THEY RETURN BACK.
SURAT Al Tawbah Repentance verse 122
@@turan_kayabro where did you get that we won’t help??? How did you reach that conclusion???
Leave turkey
@@user-vb6df4sd8d from her comment
@@turan_kaya her comment literally was talking about the ones in the US not in actual egypt
@@user-vb6df4sd8d yes your right. I'll delete my comment. Shukran
Super interesting topic. Where can we find more about Thomas? Cannot find him anywhere online.
Fascinating and thought provoking
As a convert in USA would love to migrate to Madina, and Turkiye is on my list too... Never been to Turkiye and I hear so much mixed information about the culture, secularism, and hating migrants there, etc. Visited Madina twice and cried my heart out having to come back to USA. This is very informative. I like what you said about the intention to migrate. I rather have more quality and a community to live in than quantity. Allah knows best!
Why not Saudi Arabia -the birth place of Islam ?
You cant compare any muslim countries with Turkey. You have to experience, it is very unique
@@mynameisraylights I am from Turkey Türkiye🤗 thanks to Atatürk, there is relatively acceptable İslam in real life -thanks to secularity. But political Islamists are trying to destroy the secular regime and build an Islamist regime. Things are getting worse under Erdoğan
@@tgunersel born and raised in Ulus, Besiktas, Istanbul. Living in CA, USA. Following closely what is going on. Thanks for the explanative comment.
Well I can assure you that if you're Arab, Pakistani or Afghan you'll face racism. And the secularism part is true, Western Turkey holds no Islamic values and people actually value their secularism.
Thomas, you are very knowledgeable. I love that about you. As a researcher, it really appeals to me when I hear someone trying to give information as ethically as possible in the sense of accuracy. Thank you.
Machallah i really liked this conversation tanks a lot ❤❤
I remember Br. John Fountain also has series about Hijrah in his channel. Including hijah to Turkiye, others are hijrah to African countries.
Great podcast! Please make it a bit longer.
Noted!
I get where you're coming form, but I think most people don't really complete, let alone click on longer streams. I guess mileage may vary though. Timestamps forsure are a MUST.
Apart from Turkey, western Muslims can also try Malaysia.
Malaysia is among top 10 for expatriates based on reliable sources including Nomad capitalist.
If someone is going to migrate to a majority Muslim population nation there are really only 4 choices.
Bosnia, Turkey, Malaysia and Indonesia.
Not a coincidence either that all 4 of them have extremely low inbreeding rates.
@@williamdavis9562 Turkey is secular, islamists not wanted here. yallah Malaysia and Indonesia .
How do we connect to brothers there to continue the conversation as Thomas instructs us at the end?
Is there anything called what the name of your channel is ?
*Atheists claim that they are intellectually superior to religious people because they are willing to question their beliefs, whereas religious people are dogmatic and refuse to question their deepest beliefs and won't consider evidence that could potentially undermine those beliefs.*
Well, have you ever heard an atheist say:
"I wonder if constantly increasing individual freedom is a good thing."
"I was wrong about democracy being a viable system."
"Maybe the sexual revolution was a mistake."
"The evidence shows that equality of the sexes is destructive."
"Let's have a debate on if freedom of speech and religion is good for society."
"Could it be that women need fewer rights?"
I have never seen an atheist raise these questions or hold these positions up to serious scrutiny. Nor do they provide any evidence for their beliefs on these matters. They simply assert them and ridicule and mock anyone who disagrees with them.
When i look at the comments, its very interesting to see how lovely living in turkey ( especially istanbul) are we talking the same istanbul I wonder🤣 because born and raised( istanbul) turk , I find very difficult to live in Istanbul, especially with housing car expenses and cost of living . Istanbul has secular and conservative parts very complex city with multicultural people… some doesnt even respect laws .. living in a country is different than having a vacation just fyi!!!!
Do not come to Turkey