While I've covered Orange Piccolo before, this is by FAR my most detailed video. I am making a video on Broly, and most likely on why the Gammas could defeat Ultra Instinct Goku and Ultra Ego Vegeta. So if theres anything I missed or need to update, feel free to let me know, and I'll likely cover it in that video! Thanks for watching, I hope you all enjoy!
Piccolo is the reason why Gohan is fighting relative to UI Goku. Piccolo is the reason why Gohan can control his Beast form as well as he could, we saw time and time again that controlling power becomes harder the more power you have. So if piccolo is able to teach Gohan how to control his Beast form this implies that piccolo himself can control that level of power which means that even after the time skip Orange Piccolo is relative to Gohan and Goku. Piccolo also was WEAKENED against Cell Max seeing as he didn't get a senzu bean after his fight against the Gammas
@@ACertainMan All very true and good points! Hadn’t even thought about Piccolo being fatigued before fighting Cell Max, but definitely true. I think narratively it’s implied that current Orange Piccolo is relative to everyone else although he didn’t spar with anyone.
@@JaylonDBZ Carthu also made power ranking I think I will stick to that.where he mentioned that production of super super hero started with broly movie you are on to nothing mate piccolo gets demolished by vegeta
@@Axyz1006 Maybe he didn’t know how strong Piccolo was when he was writing the movie, but that statement about Orange Piccolo came out only a few months before the manga finished the Gas and Granola arc. Over time more context is added. Just like how when Battle of Gods was being created, Akira didn’t think Beerus would be as strong as he is now, but it’s been retconned through the story.
People always fail to mention how strong piccolo actually is before Yellow. Get to unlock power. He's stronger than Majin boo And he beat ssj2 Gohan when training him before the top
Piccolo was able to have fight with 73 so his base form should be minimum SSJ God Goku tier from ToP(red hair). I can't believe someone who have power of SSJ3 tier or lower can do something against 73. Piccolo also survived his first fight(when he was only in base form) with Gamma who was compared to Goku and Vegeta and who destroyed arm of Cell Max. People thinks if someone is not main character or if someone don't have transformations should be always in same power level. Mistake. Piccolo trains whole life, he was always stronger and stronger, he just was only too weak for fresh Goku and Vegeta transformations. Now he have his own transformations and I think he is finally stronger than Goku and Vegeta including UE and UI.
@@JaylonDBZ Fun Fact:His What-If Evil King Form(Him Absorbing His Father)In Legendary Super Warriors(GBC)Has Stats(Barring Speed)Surpassing SS3 Goku!19 Ki Is Badass!
If you want canonical, then during the Majin Buu Arc, piccolo was able to sense the Grand Kai so either he can directly send Scott key or he has some other sense that is even better than normal sensing God key cuz he could tell exactly who the grand Kai was. He can sense it. It's Canon deal with it
This is one of, if not the only, transformation(s) that doesn't bother anyone even if it is an asspull. Piccolo is one of the most deserving characters of a powerup, and having him use shenron to get it doesnt even matter because of the long connection between him and the dragon balls
Piccolo always was so important character in DB, I will never understand why Piccolo is most underrated character in this fandom. People really thinks this show is only about Goku and Vegeta?
It's clear that Super Hero's was originally meant to make Piccolo relevant again, hopefully in future movies and manga chapters they continue to put Piccolo at the forefront!
You scale them higher than I would, but I do appreciate it. Honestly can’t stand people doing everything they can to downplay characters power because they for some reason refuse to accept that they’re strong. I’ve seen it with Piccolo, Kefla, Gohan, the Gammas. Dragonball power scaling has always been nuts, just deal with it.
Piccolo has always been such a selfless character always sacrificing himself and had an amazing character. Arc, I was always sad to see him falling.Behind. i'm glad he's finally getting the love. He deserves, and I hope he keeps it!!
Piccolo in orange was only stated to rival Goku and Vegeta in blue as that is there strongest forms in the movies who is the only medium that he was stated to rival them
Welp. Orange piccolo can one shot MUI goku i guess. You know who else actually did that instead of one shotiing an equal fighter? Black Frieza. I'd say black frieza is Stronger than orange piccolo still. Frieza probably prepared for Gogeta (At the bare minimum MUI goku and Gogeta SSB. Take your debates on which is stronger between the two) But probably UI Gogeta. So Black frieza wins. I aint adding Black frieza to those events because it was made before he existed. And it isn't cannon yet. Beast gohan is a maybe close.
@@FoCl-j7v If I had to place Black Frieza I’d definitely say during Super Heros he’d be able to beat Cell Max. And in the manga probably Beast Gohan also. Not sure how much of the gap Goku and the others have closed at the current point in the manga though
@@JaylonDBZ I think Goku/Vegeta might have closed like 1-5% at a low and 5-10% at a high. I'd say Beast Gohan is at best. 70% of the way to Black Frieza's level. If Orange piccolo and beast Gohan teamed up they Should be able to win with the logic in this video
@@JaylonDBZ But that winning estimate for the 2v1 is conservative. Lowballing black Frieza as much as it would make sense to while giving Orange piccolo/beast Gohan the logic in the video. I could've maybe lowballed black Frieza to Orange piccolo level (They have the same MUI-level one shot achievement) But oh well.
It's hard compare Black Frieza to Orange Piccolo. BF was "wow" because one shotted Goku and Vegeta but in fact they was a little tired. Also : - Granolah saga was 3 years ago compare to Super Hero. - Piccolo probably pretended his fight with Cell Max. Idk how he was KO and in Orange Form at the same time. After fight he was looks very fine.
@@devanplays3509 Gohan mentioning he trained the ability is just proof that he did train during that period. In that training he still grew stronger (for example, Vegeta went to Yardrat to learn an ability to counter Moro, but he also got a massive power boost through that). Same thing but different.
@JaylonDBZ Learning ki controll to make your attacks stronger and getting a new ability isn't the same as simply learning one ability by putting your fingers in your head. It would make way more sense for the gammas to be blue level fighters since we saw ultimate gohan is around that level. We already saw that beast is relative to mui goku
Before Akira Toriyama's passing, it felt like the story was building toward an epic showdown: Black Freeza facing off against Piccolo, Vegeta, Goku, Gohan, and Broly. It seemed to be setting up an even bigger twist, hinting that Goku might ascend to the rank of Angel while Vegeta takes on the role of God of Destruction, leaving Gohan as Earth’s new protector.
I feel like Piccolo is gonna heavily involved in future arcs. Toriyama prior to his death already started involving him more first with Superhero and now with Daima. Toyotaro is likely gonna continue that
It just devalues gokue/vegeta’s abilities if piccolo and gohan caught up to them. Goku/vegeta are training under Whis, an angel, and posses GOD ki. In what way can piccolo and gohan catch up without whis
God ki was essentially retconned immediately after it's first appearance (Battle of Gods) in the very next movie (Return of F) by making Golden Frieza stronger than not only God Goku but also SSB Goku. DB Super has horrible writing even for a Dragon Ball series.
In the last manga before the break Piccolo power level must of increased hella. Goku was able to pinpoint Piccolo’s power in his base form with weights and didn’t even charge up too. So who knows how strong he is now
0:22 bro first of all you need evidence and can’t just say that. Second of all we literally see in dbs that ultimate gohan cant come close to ssb kaioken goku. In the first 30 seconds of this video i can already tell you are full of crap.
@SandwichRL12 That is what the rest of the 18 minutes is for. I walk through statements from Akira and official producers of the movie, chronological timelines of when those statements were made to give more context, context from the manga and the anime to provide evidence including but not limited to quotes, lines from the characters, direct feats that prove Piccolo’s line of thinking.
@@JaylonDBZ that still doesn’t prove that ultimate gohan is just as strong as goku and vegetas ultra forms, we literally saw in the anime that gohan doesnt come close to ssb kaioken goku
Bills (Beer Sus? Virus?) went to all the trouble of looking for the SSJ God to fight him, when all he had to do was make Gohan angry, buff a namekian with the dragon balls or force Broly to sit and read 3 sentences of a book. The Oracle clearly didn't see *that* coming.
@@UltraArchieSonic I think if anything everybody will be around the same level to prep for Black Frieza. But even if Piccolo has surpassed Vegeta it won’t last long
@@UltraArchieSonicThey did it before tho. Early android arc piccolo was a ssj level fighter. The anime version also had him putting even more work against the cell jrs than Vegeta and trunks did. Same with the Bojack movie. He was forgotten about for a long time but piccolo being a top tier is just a return to normalcy for the character
@@JaylonDBZ It's the creators fault for underestimating Piccolo. They are always dominated by the Saiyan mania and I don't think it's fair that Piccolo was removed from the main role in the film because of this. I think Gamma 2 was stronger than Gamma 1 and they must have been at the blue level, since C17 also competed against the blue Goku, but also against a tired Jiren. I will be relieved if we can see the Orange Piccolo vs Ego Vegeta fight in the manga continuation and in the future Piccolo will be promoted in individual winning fights.
Should've still at least had small dragon spikes poking out on orange piccolo, it's the magic clan boosting the warrior clan. Give him some cool shit even if just barely poking out spikes anywhere.
Wrong if Gohan trained he wouldn't have lost his powers, so that is debunked right their. Your overscaling the Gammas. Gohan in a weakened state was giving them trouble. If they were truly as strong as Goku and Vegeta. Gohan would be struggling to keep up with them in a rusty state.
Whenever Gohan awakens his Ultimate form, the results of his training always emerge, sometimes not before. Just like when he got stronger after awakening his Ultimate form in Dragon Ball Z, and when he got stronger after awakening his Ultimate Form in Dragon Ball Super. Likewise, Gohan's Ultimate form is not a linear multiplier, his potential grows, and thus, everytime we've seen him unlock the form he's been stronger than the last (being stronger when he reawakens ultimate before the ToP than he was in the Buu Saga, and being stronger in Super Heros than he was pre-ToP).
One thing your failing to realize, if Gohan wasn't getting stronger from his training and weakening then it doesn't. Its bad training. You have to challenge your body to get stronger for you to grow, and their is maintenance training where you just maintain your current skills and muscles. Gohan clearly wasn't doing either these, if he was challenging himself he'd be stronger, if he was maintaining he wouldn't be rusty. The type training Gohan supposedly did was basically next to useless. So the it doesn't really matter he didn't anything from, except maybe copying Piccolo's technique, and like I said he still weakened himself doing that.
In other words, it doesn't matter how strong Gohan is BEFORE unlocking his ultimate form, because he will always climb to his potential power at the time once his Ultimate Form is reawakened. Best believe if he ever has to reawaken his ultimate form again it will be even stronger, that's just how it's been written
@@JaylonDBZ No he was regaining the skills he lost, lets pretend your a bodybuilder and you decide to take a year off and not do any bodybuilding. Since you don't use those muscles your body decides to get rid of them. Its basic biology really. The reason Gohan is able to keep up is because of his forms. SS1 50X base SS2 50x on top of that. Gohan's mythic form is about on par with SS3 with way better kai control. So roughly 500X boost. Even in a weakened state the boost to his power was enough to overcome his enemies. He is still in a weakened state his muscles aren't gonna magically come back right. Thats not how biology. He'd have retrain to gain them back, but his forms boost him even in a weakened state. Also I'm not against Gohan getting catching up to Vegeta and Goku. But come the Gammas didn't look anywhere close to Vegeta or Goku they were struggling against a weakened Mythic Gohan. If a weakened Mythic Gohan fought Vegeta or Goku. Gohan would get annhilated especially if Super Ego or Ultra Instinct. If the gammas are supposed to be as strong as Goku or Vegeta they sure don't look like it.
@@thomaswest2583 Gohan's potential is massive compared to everyone elses, in some cases, Gohan with no training and just getting angry is enough for him to surpass everyone else. But, overall he has to train far less than characters like Goku and Vegeta to get stronger, probably just bad writing on the creators part. But also, to be fair we don't know if he was ONLY training to copy Piccolo's technique, we just know that it was a part of his training. But just like before the Tournament of Power, where Gohan went from being to weak to beat Piccolo, to the narrator saying he rivaled Blue Goku, here Gohan reawakening his ultimate form made him far stronger, strong enough to rival Gamma 1 evenly. (So he'd probably be a rival to Moro Arc Goku and Vegeta, if not stronger, but maybe not stronger than both at the same time)
idk if what im about to say will be stupid but if considering anime and manga not being the same anime orange piccolo is indeed ssb level during broly arc or maybe even a little bit stronger. manga orange piccolo on the other hand is indeed mui and ue level during the moro arc or slightly stronger. in short: anime orange piccolo on=> ssb goku and vegeta broly saga manga orange piccolo>perfect ui goku and ssbe vegeta moro arc so manga orange piccolo ~ perfect ui goku and ue vegeta during granola arc. the manga has better details and better statements than the anime which is logical since anime hasn’t got any moro,granola and gas arc and knowing the anime those 3 arcs will happen differently due to fan service. in anime beast gohan is shown to be heavens above cell max,manga beast gohan has shown a lil bit of struggle. so yes just to say that I agree with ur opinion. Gammas=> Pui Goku and Ssbe Vegeta Gamma 2~>Yellow Piccolo Ultimate Gohan=Yellow Piccolo
@@JaylonDBZ that wouldn’t be too shocking giving DBS, I mean remember, Gohan was blue level in the manga during the ToP but then one arc that’s not even a year later he was folded by someone who lost to Base Goku, just saying.
I think orange Piccolo could take Ultra Ego Vegeta if he uses a grappling style and just tries to put him in a choke hold or something. Tank the damage and minimize the buff Vegeta gets from trading blows and battle lust. DBZ’s take on BJJ as it were.
I'm still watching the video but I will point out a few things just from where I am now about why Piccolo is still not anywhere near as strong as Goku and Vegeta. Just the fact he's weaker than Gohan Beast makes him automatically not at their level. Plus when Gohan was sparing with Goku (outside of surprising him with his brief power and speed boost by pushing his anger to it's limit) he didn't really give Goku much trouble while in Ultra Instinct. And during the free-for-all we never see Vegeta go UE. You can tell because he has his eyebrows in each panel. So while it was only sparing we can assume Goku and Vegeta were definitely holding back while Gohan, at least briefly, pushed his power higher to catch up and hit Goku. And again, Piccolo is shown to be far weaker than Gohan during the fight against Cell Max.
I'm not sure if I just didn't hear or if you didn't pick up on it, but if piccolo before awakening thought the androids were on par with or stronger than ssb goku, and after awakenings he found out they weren't even at full powre. doesn't that suggest that they're EVEN MORE stronger than ssb. Which would suggest orange, which is stronger than the androids, that piccolo just found out were actually even more stronger than ssb, would have EVEN MORE wiggle room in terms of being even higher in power
@@matt.b5984 In the manga continuity they would have to be at least stronger than UI Sign from the Moro arc. Anime only continuity it’s harder to say, because Piccolo can’t read God Ki, so he’d either be guessing Goku and Vegeta’s power based off Broly and Friezas, or by reading the power of Gogeta before turning Super Saiyan Blue. But even anime only yeah Piccolo is definitely ultra level and beyond God of Destruction level, insanely cracked.
Orange piccolo is cruis'n around the evolved states (ssbkkx20/ssbe) and thats about it, he gets absolutely stomped out by even ui omen. He could barely survive cell max, which was state weaker than broly without a mind to control his power. The ultra forms melt current broly (in the anime at least). The manga has really wack scaling but its pretty much the same.
@@christianworcester6851 just like Orange Piccolo, Broly is another one of those characters who just doesn’t get the credit he deserves. But, at least in the Super Hero’s movie, you can build a pretty good case based off various statements and such that Broly was actually stronger than Goku, Vegeta, Orange Piccolo, and Cell Max.
@@Royalwrathbecause of plot armor duhh he forced both of them to master their powers fighting him he even scared gas he just wasn’t use to the form since he unlocked it mid battle Goku mastered his powers along with them as well they made wishes then tapped into their potential fighting him so of course vegeta lost on top of the mental nerf too he literally stated he couldn’t wield it because of his mindset
“There is no single objective way to scale a character, there is only interpreting evidence with scrutiny” as Lonks Take once said. While I think I got REALLY close to getting the right answer, until it’s outright said, I could be wrong. And I also agree that Dragon Ball Power-scaling can get to “sweaty” sometimes. But if this video takes off it’ll become evident why tackling every angle was necessary when going against an extremely popular almost 3 year old head canon haha.
Ok what about the fact that beast gohan was weaker or on par with a mui goku, the same mui goku ultra ego vegetas also on par with, and since the fact that gohan has more potential then piccolo and was just weaker then gohan when they got their new transformations it’s fair to say piccolos orange form didn’t catch up to gohans beast form (a form pretty much equal to ultra ego) meaning vegeta would beat piccolo
Anime Continuity Only: 1. Beast Gohan 2. FP SS Broly 3. Cell Max 4. Gamma 1&2 (Final Sacrifice Attack that damaged Cell Max) 5. FP Goku & Vegeta 6. Orange Piccolo 7. Gamma 1&2 Normal full strength 8. Ultimate Gohan 9. Potential Unleashed Piccolo 10. Heavily Suppressed Gammas Manga Continuity Only: 1. Black Frieza 2. FP SS Broly (Fully Realized) 3. Beast Gohan (Fully Realized) 4. MUI Goku 5. UE Vegeta 6. Orange Piccolo 7. Cell Max 8. Gammas 1&2 (Final Sacrifice Attack) 9. Zombie Gas 10. Granola FP These are at least my top 10’s for the current Dragon Ball series only factoring in the manga and anime continuities separately from eachother. (Not including Beerus or Fusions)
@@JaylonDBZwow FP SS broly> Beast Gohan? This was unexpected. They fought in the manga and Gohan won, Gohan was tired...Goku and Gohan are the strongest so Broly can't beat him, but I respect your opinion
I think we are looking too much into what power is. This has been used fast and loose by Toryiama and others. The Gammas were powerful but I wouldn't say they were UI strong. Scaling is hard with Super and I mean that as a good thing. "Power levels" and strength mean far less and technique is now far more important (see master roshi in ToP). Orange Piccolo rivals UI in technique not necesarrily power. I know this is a bit pedantic to argue power over technique when gauging strength but it is important for the mystic or God like powers the characters now have. I really wish we could see more of what Orange Piccolo was capable of and if he has any other techniques, same with Beast. With Beast it was like we were told it was powerful but all we really get is a single awesome special beam canon and some off panel fight if you look at the manga. I would say MUI is top of the food chain since that is what the angels use and as far as we know they are the most powerful. Then it would Ego because it is similar to destroyer gods, and then....this is a hot take, I think Piccolo is would beat Gohan. This is where technique comes in and beats raw power. They are roughly equal now so it is hard to say. I hope it stays this way and they don't go into power but continue focusing on styles with each having a unique fighting style. I love Z but by the end of Cell saga everyone just had the same techniques with different color beams. Anyway great video, I will always take Piccolo love since like I said he is my favorite (probably why I like Super so much since it made him relevant again)
Tbh toriyama saiyan it and before he died we should all jsut accept it 😂 people hating he literally was excited that piccolo was on par now and tbh so am i😂
Bro this vid is based on ifs and probabilities they never said piccolo could rival ultra instonct goku they may be relative but no way in hell u really think vegeta amped up wit the power pf destruction wont wipe him ...granolah was literally The Strongest in the Universe at the time and He couldnt do shit wit vegeta only reason vegeta lost is cuz he got big headed n took too much damage ...if jiren has been training hes definitely stronger than piccolo cuz even in super hero they admitted jiren was stronger than them but not that much stronger ......
The statement about Piccolo does literally say that he rivals Goku and the others. And if you apply in universe logic to it. The Super Heros arc DOES take place after the Gas and Granola arc (and Goku has even been training for months after). I do agree that they don’t specify which form. But if we are being 100% unbiased here, not specifying a form either implies orange piccolo is as strong as BASE Goku, or that he rivals Goku’s full power. Especially considering that statements made in the past by directors and akira toriyama have stated specific forms (like Blue Goku coming close to the Gods in the Broly Movie, or Black Frieza coming close to rivaling a God in the Manga). So it really probably comes down to if Orange Piccolo rivaling BASE Goku or Orange Piccolo rivaling full powered Goku makes more sense
@@JaylonDBZ i dont see it like that and in the movie verses ultra instinct n ego dont exist , blue kaioken doesnt exist either neither blue evo .....hence y goku didnt go ui in the broly movie n they only used regular blue .... the movie shits be messin wit ma head and if we goin by the logic u used this arc happened later but that also means goku and vegeta are significantly stronger than what they were and all theyve been doing is training ...so ill say it again piccolo isnt beating goku , vegeta , nor gohan at this point i love piccolo but no bro
@ the Broly arc in the manga is also before the Moro and Granola arc, and the Super Heros arc is some time after the Granola arc. I hope one day we get the both arcs in the anime though!
@@alexwilliamson-i7i It's never stated that that he hasn't proven to rival a form beyond Blue. You could try to make evidence that Orange Piccolo hasn't rivaled Super Saiyan Blue, but there is no official statement for that.
@@JaylonDBZ I respect you but orange piccolo hasn't proven anything he defeated cell Max while then he defeated the game is okay but that is not even a feat Goku has defeated
@@JaylonDBZ I respect you and I do like your videos but orange pekoe has no feet yes he has defeated cell Max in the game is but Goku has defeated universal threads that is way stronger than orange piccolo and if you watch the manga orange piccolo wouldn't even stand a chance
No way, I'm sorry Vegeta is a badass warrior, him and Goku. Piccolo was my favorite in dragonball but when Vegeta came along he took a back sit. Even if in one arc Piccolo becomes stronger than Vegeta trust me it will be brief because I think Piccolo orange will be a one off because I think Goku and Vegeta can still go beyond their forms and another thing Vegeta still hasn't totally mastered Ultra Ego, once he does and learn how to avoid the damages to his body, Piccolo want stand a chance.
I would think that piccolo could beat EGO vegeta if he knew how it work, like if you cut his arm off would he get stronger from it? Or if you put him in a headlock, and squeeze his neck,”
@@DangitBobby9960 I don’t think that vegeta would use it as he didn’t do it in the last arc he was in he probably just did it was the only way he could beat moru
Hiw did shenron make that strong if in dbz he couldnt make anyone as strong as the saiyans cause that would overwhelm his own abilities. But now he can make Piccolo who is maybe at best base goku strength into a guy who could spar with beerus wtf ??
Definitley a lapse in how they wrote it, but if I had to make an explanation for them, I would say that Shenron can’t MAKE somebody so strong, he can only give them the ability to unlock what’s already within them. But yeah I agree, kinda crazy how strong he made Piccolo
I find this ridiculous that they closed the SSG gap, not to mention higher forms. By that logic if Beerus never came and they never learned about SSG, Goku and Vegeta would have been left in the dust and got a job in Krilins police station :) . I mean this things getting anoying. What now Beeruses and Whises training and power is a joke is it? Like let me train a little in my back yard and surpass them all, and little scientist making bots that are on GoD level. Those producers are a fuc*ing joke. Ok now let Goten and Trunks train a little for a fight with Grand priest. 🤮🤮 i mean there should have been a series showing their strugles with this power gap that has been created by Goku and Vegeta and cumulating with them catching up in Super Hero.
It is all trash because Piccolo didn't earn it himself. He wished for it. It would have been better if he wished for the potential to grow with practice.
@@EELLISON2012 i think the wishing part made sense (Shenron being made by a Namekian which is tied to Piccolo’s lineage). But it shouldn’t have been THAT strong. In my opinion, Orange Piccolo should have been like Piccolo’s Super Saiyan God. Instead of a supposed Ultra Level form.
Orange piccolo is always stronger to super Saiyan blue Goku so let's just say this if Goku bumps it up the kaioken times 20 or 10 or just f***** like orange pickle is getting his ass whooped super Saiyan blue kaioken Goku don't get me wrong yeah piccolo is strong in his own right but if you're getting one thing Goku is stronger than orange piccolo even Vegeta's evolution blue former stronger than piccolo I could be wrong there but Goku has mastered ultra instinct altruistic signs of
I just love how everyone thinks so highly of such an asspull of a power up.same as for Gohan two of the most undeserved and unearned power that only exists because of plot armor.lets make a wish on the dragon balls for more power...as pathetic as granola. No wonder super is pretty much done go Diama hopefully they don't mess this one up too
why vegeta why cant yall pick on somebody else the suffering of vegeta fan is everlasting u know ho many vids ive seen of dbz fans putting vegeta against different character just for my goat to get clapped
UI Goku couldn't beat Beast Gohan either. The match was stopped, and we don't know who would have won if it had continued But from what we have seen, Beast Gohan's berserk full power was able to overwhelm UI Goku's evasive speed and knock him out of UI
@@BeastXIS Sure but the lesson we learned from the SS Goku vs 100% power Frieza fight was anyone who has to be at 100% power to fight will be defeated as their power decreases over the course of the fight. Beast Gohan can't keep up with UI Goku. The moment he drops below the power needed to overcome UI, Goku wins.
@Turtlesarecool609 Yes and the point he makes is weird. I don't think it validates any statement that Orange Piccolo is stronger or even at level with the Beast Gohan we saw fight UI Goku.
There’s absolutely nothing stopping Goku and Vegeta from having their potentials unlocked but bad writing. Goku was going to do it before to Tournament of a Power but there wasn’t enough time.
In the next arc Krillin will be the strongest cause he wished to be the strongest let’s go plot convenient power ups hurray, hard work? No no no everybody in Dragonball is a prodigy or Super Uber talented, Frieza you’re a prodigy, Gohan you’re a prodigy, Broly you’re a prodigy, everybody is a prodigy.
False lol Piccolo is Already a GOD He absorb GOD-Kami & Nail…. it’s Equivalent to THE TRINY … GOD-Kami Sun-Nail -Holy- Spirit Yall go off words alone ITS READ BETWEEN the LINES!! Nobody that far apart in power anyways. Beerus Flicks Goku SSJ3 to death… Majin buu fights beerus and not even hurt… All powers that came after SSJ3 is not even GOKUs it’s 5 others Sayins & Majin buu is still the strongest character OP he’s by himself and his own creator & Piccolo Always been Top tier Goku ask to spar PICCOLO he said NO because Piccolo smokes GOKU effortlessly His form is Invincibly
While I've covered Orange Piccolo before, this is by FAR my most detailed video. I am making a video on Broly, and most likely on why the Gammas could defeat Ultra Instinct Goku and Ultra Ego Vegeta. So if theres anything I missed or need to update, feel free to let me know, and I'll likely cover it in that video! Thanks for watching, I hope you all enjoy!
Piccolo is the reason why Gohan is fighting relative to UI Goku. Piccolo is the reason why Gohan can control his Beast form as well as he could, we saw time and time again that controlling power becomes harder the more power you have. So if piccolo is able to teach Gohan how to control his Beast form this implies that piccolo himself can control that level of power which means that even after the time skip Orange Piccolo is relative to Gohan and Goku. Piccolo also was WEAKENED against Cell Max seeing as he didn't get a senzu bean after his fight against the Gammas
@@ACertainMan All very true and good points! Hadn’t even thought about Piccolo being fatigued before fighting Cell Max, but definitely true. I think narratively it’s implied that current Orange Piccolo is relative to everyone else although he didn’t spar with anyone.
@@JaylonDBZyeah Piccolo is so underatted
@@JaylonDBZ Carthu also made power ranking I think I will stick to that.where he mentioned that production of super super hero started with broly movie you are on to nothing mate piccolo gets demolished by vegeta
@@Axyz1006 Maybe he didn’t know how strong Piccolo was when he was writing the movie, but that statement about Orange Piccolo came out only a few months before the manga finished the Gas and Granola arc. Over time more context is added. Just like how when Battle of Gods was being created, Akira didn’t think Beerus would be as strong as he is now, but it’s been retconned through the story.
People always fail to mention how strong piccolo actually is before Yellow. Get to unlock power. He's stronger than Majin boo And he beat ssj2 Gohan when training him before the top
Yeah he's very underatted and powerful
Yeah buu level and rusty gohan level buu saga level is not something to brag about in super
Piccolo was able to have fight with 73 so his base form should be minimum SSJ God Goku tier from ToP(red hair). I can't believe someone who have power of SSJ3 tier or lower can do something against 73. Piccolo also survived his first fight(when he was only in base form) with Gamma who was compared to Goku and Vegeta and who destroyed arm of Cell Max.
People thinks if someone is not main character or if someone don't have transformations should be always in same power level. Mistake. Piccolo trains whole life, he was always stronger and stronger, he just was only too weak for fresh Goku and Vegeta transformations. Now he have his own transformations and I think he is finally stronger than Goku and Vegeta including UE and UI.
@@zetset57 yeah Piccolo Trains a whole lot
Everyone is stronger than Kidd Buu. Gohan was weak and piccolo wasn’t stronger than him
I loved it when Piccolo said “It’s Piccling time” and Piccled all over the place.
Super Based!
@@JaylonDBZ Fun Fact:His What-If Evil King Form(Him Absorbing His Father)In Legendary Super Warriors(GBC)Has Stats(Barring Speed)Surpassing SS3 Goku!19 Ki Is Badass!
Haven't seen this foolishness in awhile
@@chimuoma390 GBC(game boy color)
I’m pretty sure piccolo should be able to sense god Kai he was technically a “lower god” before he fused
See if they could just put that in an official statement, I could rest easy knowing the Gammas are above MUI level lmao
No only people with God kai can sense God kai.
If you want canonical, then during the Majin Buu Arc, piccolo was able to sense the Grand Kai so either he can directly send Scott key or he has some other sense that is even better than normal sensing God key cuz he could tell exactly who the grand Kai was. He can sense it. It's Canon deal with it
This is one of, if not the only, transformation(s) that doesn't bother anyone even if it is an asspull. Piccolo is one of the most deserving characters of a powerup, and having him use shenron to get it doesnt even matter because of the long connection between him and the dragon balls
Piccolo always was so important character in DB, I will never understand why Piccolo is most underrated character in this fandom. People really thinks this show is only about Goku and Vegeta?
It's clear that Super Hero's was originally meant to make Piccolo relevant again, hopefully in future movies and manga chapters they continue to put Piccolo at the forefront!
Always
Great video! Orange Piccolo is underrated!
@@rodthedigger2902 Appreciate it, thanks for taking the time to watch! Piccolo is def underrated!
Yeah he is definitely underatted he needs more love
You scale them higher than I would, but I do appreciate it.
Honestly can’t stand people doing everything they can to downplay characters power because they for some reason refuse to accept that they’re strong. I’ve seen it with Piccolo, Kefla, Gohan, the Gammas. Dragonball power scaling has always been nuts, just deal with it.
I hope Piccolo gets back some popularity after His Orange form
@@WorlBoss To me Orange Piccolo felt like when Piccolo merged with Kami and surpassed the Saiyans, but we’ll see if it lasts!
@@JaylonDBZ Yes I agree I loved those days when piccolo was actually relevant even the nail fusion was epic too
He never lost popularity he was just so weak no one took pride in being a fan of his because there were no feats to glorify
When he comes to Sparkling Zero. He will be my main. Love Piccolo and love this new form.
Great Video Jaylon 💯💪
@@malone4735 Appreciate it day one! Glad you enjoyed🔥
Piccolo has always been such a selfless character always sacrificing himself and had an amazing character. Arc, I was always sad to see him falling.Behind. i'm glad he's finally getting the love. He deserves, and I hope he keeps it!!
Great video. You earned new subscriber
orange piccolo immediately made me think of "You're just mad you're not the legendary super Namekien." that joke aged like fine wine.
my goat is finally getting what he deserves
Piccolo in orange was only stated to rival Goku and Vegeta in blue as that is there strongest forms in the movies who is the only medium that he was stated to rival them
Oh so piccolo dies by the hands of black freezia then goku and vegetta save the day I get it
I think all of us have been waiting for Piccolo versus Vegeta for the longest time
I’m kinda mad the manga just skipped over it, Goku even asked Piccolo and Piccolo said no
“The mero arc”
😂😂
😂😂
“Super Heroes”
Vegeta dog walks.
Maybe if mean toryiyama said on par 😂
Welp. Orange piccolo can one shot MUI goku i guess. You know who else actually did that instead of one shotiing an equal fighter? Black Frieza. I'd say black frieza is Stronger than orange piccolo still. Frieza probably prepared for Gogeta (At the bare minimum MUI goku and Gogeta SSB. Take your debates on which is stronger between the two) But probably UI Gogeta. So Black frieza wins. I aint adding Black frieza to those events because it was made before he existed. And it isn't cannon yet. Beast gohan is a maybe close.
@@FoCl-j7v If I had to place Black Frieza I’d definitely say during Super Heros he’d be able to beat Cell Max. And in the manga probably Beast Gohan also. Not sure how much of the gap Goku and the others have closed at the current point in the manga though
@@JaylonDBZ I think Goku/Vegeta might have closed like 1-5% at a low and 5-10% at a high. I'd say Beast Gohan is at best. 70% of the way to Black Frieza's level. If Orange piccolo and beast Gohan teamed up they Should be able to win with the logic in this video
@@JaylonDBZ But that winning estimate for the 2v1 is conservative. Lowballing black Frieza as much as it would make sense to while giving Orange piccolo/beast Gohan the logic in the video. I could've maybe lowballed black Frieza to Orange piccolo level (They have the same MUI-level one shot achievement) But oh well.
It's hard compare Black Frieza to Orange Piccolo. BF was "wow" because one shotted Goku and Vegeta but in fact they was a little tired. Also :
- Granolah saga was 3 years ago compare to Super Hero.
- Piccolo probably pretended his fight with Cell Max. Idk how he was KO and in Orange Form at the same time. After fight he was looks very fine.
Thank you!!!!!! 🙏🏽
Any time!
@@JaylonDBZ like I'm tired of people trying to downplay my man's!!! Lol
Training a new ability isn't the same as getting a ultra instinct level amp💀.
@@devanplays3509 Gohan mentioning he trained the ability is just proof that he did train during that period. In that training he still grew stronger (for example, Vegeta went to Yardrat to learn an ability to counter Moro, but he also got a massive power boost through that). Same thing but different.
@JaylonDBZ Learning ki controll to make your attacks stronger and getting a new ability isn't the same as simply learning one ability by putting your fingers in your head.
It would make way more sense for the gammas to be blue level fighters since we saw ultimate gohan is around that level. We already saw that beast is relative to mui goku
Before Akira Toriyama's passing, it felt like the story was building toward an epic showdown: Black Freeza facing off against Piccolo, Vegeta, Goku, Gohan, and Broly. It seemed to be setting up an even bigger twist, hinting that Goku might ascend to the rank of Angel while Vegeta takes on the role of God of Destruction, leaving Gohan as Earth’s new protector.
I feel like Piccolo is gonna heavily involved in future arcs. Toriyama prior to his death already started involving him more first with Superhero and now with Daima. Toyotaro is likely gonna continue that
a broly and gohan fusion would be insane
Now we need tenshinhan to wish for a power up lmao
King demon piccolo deserves this upgrade
It just devalues gokue/vegeta’s abilities if piccolo and gohan caught up to them. Goku/vegeta are training under Whis, an angel, and posses GOD ki. In what way can piccolo and gohan catch up without whis
God ki was essentially retconned immediately after it's first appearance (Battle of Gods) in the very next movie (Return of F) by making Golden Frieza stronger than not only God Goku but also SSB Goku. DB Super has horrible writing even for a Dragon Ball series.
I cant wait for the krillin power up. The Yamcha power up is gonna feed generations.
In the last manga before the break Piccolo power level must of increased hella. Goku was able to pinpoint Piccolo’s power in his base form with weights and didn’t even charge up too. So who knows how strong he is now
0:22 bro first of all you need evidence and can’t just say that. Second of all we literally see in dbs that ultimate gohan cant come close to ssb kaioken goku. In the first 30 seconds of this video i can already tell you are full of crap.
@SandwichRL12 That is what the rest of the 18 minutes is for. I walk through statements from Akira and official producers of the movie, chronological timelines of when those statements were made to give more context, context from the manga and the anime to provide evidence including but not limited to quotes, lines from the characters, direct feats that prove Piccolo’s line of thinking.
@@JaylonDBZ that still doesn’t prove that ultimate gohan is just as strong as goku and vegetas ultra forms, we literally saw in the anime that gohan doesnt come close to ssb kaioken goku
You could argue the people that were power scaling in-universe don't know about the events of the Granola arc and Beerus's planet.
They definitely don’t. Possibly. So that’s why I say that Piccolo’s last reference would have been the Moro arc.
Thumbs up just for the thumbnail, put that edgy manlet in his place.
@@trenthoward6800 DarkHans definitely went crazy on the thumbnail!
Thanks, doc.
Actually, piccolo can sense God Ki.
Remember in the Boo arc, he was the ONLY one who knew who Shin really was.
@@TonyStarkCLC Definitely can add to the case that Piccolo knew what he was talking about!
Bills (Beer Sus? Virus?) went to all the trouble of looking for the SSJ God to fight him, when all he had to do was make Gohan angry, buff a namekian with the dragon balls or force Broly to sit and read 3 sentences of a book.
The Oracle clearly didn't see *that* coming.
But let's be real, the creators will never allow orange piccolo to be as strong as MUI and UE
But I agree
@@UltraArchieSonic I think if anything everybody will be around the same level to prep for Black Frieza. But even if Piccolo has surpassed Vegeta it won’t last long
Why wouldn’t they? It’s not like they’d lose anything from doing so. If anything, they’d garner more interest from the audience.
@@selfloathinggivesmelife7810 well, u have a point there
@@UltraArchieSonicThey did it before tho. Early android arc piccolo was a ssj level fighter. The anime version also had him putting even more work against the cell jrs than Vegeta and trunks did. Same with the Bojack movie. He was forgotten about for a long time but piccolo being a top tier is just a return to normalcy for the character
Piccolo best!
@@Roberto.Cavalli-p6 definitely an underrated character!
@@JaylonDBZ It's the creators fault for underestimating Piccolo. They are always dominated by the Saiyan mania and I don't think it's fair that Piccolo was removed from the main role in the film because of this. I think Gamma 2 was stronger than Gamma 1 and they must have been at the blue level, since C17 also competed against the blue Goku, but also against a tired Jiren. I will be relieved if we can see the Orange Piccolo vs Ego Vegeta fight in the manga continuation and in the future Piccolo will be promoted in individual winning fights.
Tf they getting freaky in the thumbnail for 😭
My bad😭
Should've still at least had small dragon spikes poking out on orange piccolo, it's the magic clan boosting the warrior clan. Give him some cool shit even if just barely poking out spikes anywhere.
Wrong if Gohan trained he wouldn't have lost his powers, so that is debunked right their. Your overscaling the Gammas. Gohan in a weakened state was giving them trouble. If they were truly as strong as Goku and Vegeta. Gohan would be struggling to keep up with them in a rusty state.
Whenever Gohan awakens his Ultimate form, the results of his training always emerge, sometimes not before. Just like when he got stronger after awakening his Ultimate form in Dragon Ball Z, and when he got stronger after awakening his Ultimate Form in Dragon Ball Super.
Likewise, Gohan's Ultimate form is not a linear multiplier, his potential grows, and thus, everytime we've seen him unlock the form he's been stronger than the last (being stronger when he reawakens ultimate before the ToP than he was in the Buu Saga, and being stronger in Super Heros than he was pre-ToP).
One thing your failing to realize, if Gohan wasn't getting stronger from his training and weakening then it doesn't. Its bad training. You have to challenge your body to get stronger for you to grow, and their is maintenance training where you just maintain your current skills and muscles. Gohan clearly wasn't doing either these, if he was challenging himself he'd be stronger, if he was maintaining he wouldn't be rusty.
The type training Gohan supposedly did was basically next to useless. So the it doesn't really matter he didn't anything from, except maybe copying Piccolo's technique, and like I said he still weakened himself doing that.
In other words, it doesn't matter how strong Gohan is BEFORE unlocking his ultimate form, because he will always climb to his potential power at the time once his Ultimate Form is reawakened. Best believe if he ever has to reawaken his ultimate form again it will be even stronger, that's just how it's been written
@@JaylonDBZ No he was regaining the skills he lost, lets pretend your a bodybuilder and you decide to take a year off and not do any bodybuilding. Since you don't use those muscles your body decides to get rid of them. Its basic biology really.
The reason Gohan is able to keep up is because of his forms. SS1 50X base SS2 50x on top of that. Gohan's mythic form is about on par with SS3 with way better kai control. So roughly 500X boost.
Even in a weakened state the boost to his power was enough to overcome his enemies. He is still in a weakened state his muscles aren't gonna magically come back right. Thats not how biology. He'd have retrain to gain them back, but his forms boost him even in a weakened state.
Also I'm not against Gohan getting catching up to Vegeta and Goku.
But come the Gammas didn't look anywhere close to Vegeta or Goku they were struggling against a weakened Mythic Gohan.
If a weakened Mythic Gohan fought Vegeta or Goku. Gohan would get annhilated especially if Super Ego or Ultra Instinct.
If the gammas are supposed to be as strong as Goku or Vegeta they sure don't look like it.
@@thomaswest2583 Gohan's potential is massive compared to everyone elses, in some cases, Gohan with no training and just getting angry is enough for him to surpass everyone else. But, overall he has to train far less than characters like Goku and Vegeta to get stronger, probably just bad writing on the creators part.
But also, to be fair we don't know if he was ONLY training to copy Piccolo's technique, we just know that it was a part of his training. But just like before the Tournament of Power, where Gohan went from being to weak to beat Piccolo, to the narrator saying he rivaled Blue Goku, here Gohan reawakening his ultimate form made him far stronger, strong enough to rival Gamma 1 evenly. (So he'd probably be a rival to Moro Arc Goku and Vegeta, if not stronger, but maybe not stronger than both at the same time)
idk if what im about to say will be stupid but if considering anime and manga not being the same anime orange piccolo is indeed ssb level during broly arc or maybe even a little bit stronger. manga orange piccolo on the other hand is indeed mui and ue level during the moro arc or slightly stronger. in short:
anime orange piccolo on=> ssb goku and vegeta broly saga
manga orange piccolo>perfect ui goku and ssbe vegeta moro arc
so manga orange piccolo ~ perfect ui goku and ue vegeta during granola arc.
the manga has better details and better statements than the anime which is logical since anime hasn’t got any moro,granola and gas arc and knowing the anime those 3 arcs will happen differently due to fan service.
in anime beast gohan is shown to be heavens above cell max,manga beast gohan has shown a lil bit of struggle. so yes just to say that I agree with ur opinion.
Gammas=> Pui Goku and Ssbe Vegeta
Gamma 2~>Yellow Piccolo
Ultimate Gohan=Yellow Piccolo
Piccolo's cell mate form is fire.
I can’t when the Black Frieza arc happens and Least Fraudhan and Poorange Fraudolo get put under.
I have a strange feeling they won’t be involved in the final battle for some reason. Not in a major way at least
@@JaylonDBZ that wouldn’t be too shocking giving DBS, I mean remember, Gohan was blue level in the manga during the ToP but then one arc that’s not even a year later he was folded by someone who lost to Base Goku, just saying.
I think orange Piccolo could take Ultra Ego Vegeta if he uses a grappling style and just tries to put him in a choke hold or something. Tank the damage and minimize the buff Vegeta gets from trading blows and battle lust. DBZ’s take on BJJ as it were.
I want the gammas in sparking zero so badly
Random question. Where do you get the colored manga?
I'm still watching the video but I will point out a few things just from where I am now about why Piccolo is still not anywhere near as strong as Goku and Vegeta. Just the fact he's weaker than Gohan Beast makes him automatically not at their level. Plus when Gohan was sparing with Goku (outside of surprising him with his brief power and speed boost by pushing his anger to it's limit) he didn't really give Goku much trouble while in Ultra Instinct. And during the free-for-all we never see Vegeta go UE. You can tell because he has his eyebrows in each panel. So while it was only sparing we can assume Goku and Vegeta were definitely holding back while Gohan, at least briefly, pushed his power higher to catch up and hit Goku. And again, Piccolo is shown to be far weaker than Gohan during the fight against Cell Max.
I'm not sure if I just didn't hear or if you didn't pick up on it, but if piccolo before awakening thought the androids were on par with or stronger than ssb goku, and after awakenings he found out they weren't even at full powre. doesn't that suggest that they're EVEN MORE stronger than ssb. Which would suggest orange, which is stronger than the androids, that piccolo just found out were actually even more stronger than ssb, would have EVEN MORE wiggle room in terms of being even higher in power
@@matt.b5984 In the manga continuity they would have to be at least stronger than UI Sign from the Moro arc.
Anime only continuity it’s harder to say, because Piccolo can’t read God Ki, so he’d either be guessing Goku and Vegeta’s power based off Broly and Friezas, or by reading the power of Gogeta before turning Super Saiyan Blue. But even anime only yeah Piccolo is definitely ultra level and beyond God of Destruction level, insanely cracked.
3 MONTHS IN PRISON?!?....ONLY 3?...
Orange piccolo is cruis'n around the evolved states (ssbkkx20/ssbe) and thats about it, he gets absolutely stomped out by even ui omen. He could barely survive cell max, which was state weaker than broly without a mind to control his power. The ultra forms melt current broly (in the anime at least). The manga has really wack scaling but its pretty much the same.
@@christianworcester6851 just like Orange Piccolo, Broly is another one of those characters who just doesn’t get the credit he deserves. But, at least in the Super Hero’s movie, you can build a pretty good case based off various statements and such that Broly was actually stronger than Goku, Vegeta, Orange Piccolo, and Cell Max.
Just watch piccolo absolutely catching up to the ultra form because fuck power scaling completely just like any arc
Gohan said Goku and Vegeta might not have been able to beat cell max
Why did no think that much about when piccolo when from getting bed by Nappa to flighting freiza
Then went from that to ssj level during cell saga
UE Vegeta can DOMINATE people stronger than his unbuffed UE state when buffed. Vegeta takes the W
So stop coping tell me why did he lose to granola and gas because he can't beat them they are stronger
@@Royalwrathbecause of plot armor duhh he forced both of them to master their powers fighting him he even scared gas he just wasn’t use to the form since he unlocked it mid battle Goku mastered his powers along with them as well they made wishes then tapped into their potential fighting him so of course vegeta lost on top of the mental nerf too he literally stated he couldn’t wield it because of his mindset
I want to know how strong Majin Buu actually is when he’s training and slim
Probably stronger than Krillin.
Idk. Its fun to think about but its half all assumptions and theory crafting.but i dont always appecriate how devoted the DBZ fans are.
“There is no single objective way to scale a character, there is only interpreting evidence with scrutiny” as Lonks Take once said. While I think I got REALLY close to getting the right answer, until it’s outright said, I could be wrong.
And I also agree that Dragon Ball Power-scaling can get to “sweaty” sometimes. But if this video takes off it’ll become evident why tackling every angle was necessary when going against an extremely popular almost 3 year old head canon haha.
Dragon king Piccolo absolutely hulk smashes.
Broly is the definition of unearned power
Ok what about the fact that beast gohan was weaker or on par with a mui goku, the same mui goku ultra ego vegetas also on par with, and since the fact that gohan has more potential then piccolo and was just weaker then gohan when they got their new transformations it’s fair to say piccolos orange form didn’t catch up to gohans beast form (a form pretty much equal to ultra ego) meaning vegeta would beat piccolo
What is the final scale for Orange Piccolo and Others? (Anime&manga)
My scale (anime):
1. Beast Gohan
2.Broly SSFP (Super hero arc)
3/4.Cell max ≈ Orange Piccolo
4/3 Cell max /Orange Piccolo
5. SSB Gogeta
6. Broly SSFP (Broly movie)
7. Goku
8. Vegeta
9. Jiren ToP.
From manga:
1/2. Black Frieza
2/1. Beast Gohan
3. Ui Goku
4. UE Vegeta = SSFP Broly (chap 103) = Orange Piccolo (chap 103)
5. Gas
6. Granolah
7. Angel Moro
8. Broly SSFP (broly arc)
9. Jiren ToP
Anime Continuity Only:
1. Beast Gohan
2. FP SS Broly
3. Cell Max
4. Gamma 1&2 (Final Sacrifice Attack that damaged Cell Max)
5. FP Goku & Vegeta
6. Orange Piccolo
7. Gamma 1&2 Normal full strength
8. Ultimate Gohan
9. Potential Unleashed Piccolo
10. Heavily Suppressed Gammas
Manga Continuity Only:
1. Black Frieza
2. FP SS Broly (Fully Realized)
3. Beast Gohan (Fully Realized)
4. MUI Goku
5. UE Vegeta
6. Orange Piccolo
7. Cell Max
8. Gammas 1&2 (Final Sacrifice Attack)
9. Zombie Gas
10. Granola FP
These are at least my top 10’s for the current Dragon Ball series only factoring in the manga and anime continuities separately from eachother. (Not including Beerus or Fusions)
@@JaylonDBZwow FP SS broly> Beast Gohan? This was unexpected. They fought in the manga and Gohan won, Gohan was tired...Goku and Gohan are the strongest so Broly can't beat him, but I respect your opinion
I think we are looking too much into what power is. This has been used fast and loose by Toryiama and others. The Gammas were powerful but I wouldn't say they were UI strong. Scaling is hard with Super and I mean that as a good thing. "Power levels" and strength mean far less and technique is now far more important (see master roshi in ToP). Orange Piccolo rivals UI in technique not necesarrily power. I know this is a bit pedantic to argue power over technique when gauging strength but it is important for the mystic or God like powers the characters now have. I really wish we could see more of what Orange Piccolo was capable of and if he has any other techniques, same with Beast. With Beast it was like we were told it was powerful but all we really get is a single awesome special beam canon and some off panel fight if you look at the manga.
I would say MUI is top of the food chain since that is what the angels use and as far as we know they are the most powerful. Then it would Ego because it is similar to destroyer gods, and then....this is a hot take, I think Piccolo is would beat Gohan. This is where technique comes in and beats raw power. They are roughly equal now so it is hard to say. I hope it stays this way and they don't go into power but continue focusing on styles with each having a unique fighting style. I love Z but by the end of Cell saga everyone just had the same techniques with different color beams.
Anyway great video, I will always take Piccolo love since like I said he is my favorite (probably why I like Super so much since it made him relevant again)
Tbh toriyama saiyan it and before he died we should all jsut accept it 😂 people hating he literally was excited that piccolo was on par now and tbh so am i😂
ridiculous ORANGE JUICE ! !!!
Bro this vid is based on ifs and probabilities they never said piccolo could rival ultra instonct goku they may be relative but no way in hell u really think vegeta amped up wit the power pf destruction wont wipe him ...granolah was literally The Strongest in the Universe at the time and He couldnt do shit wit vegeta only reason vegeta lost is cuz he got big headed n took too much damage ...if jiren has been training hes definitely stronger than piccolo cuz even in super hero they admitted jiren was stronger than them but not that much stronger ......
The statement about Piccolo does literally say that he rivals Goku and the others. And if you apply in universe logic to it. The Super Heros arc DOES take place after the Gas and Granola arc (and Goku has even been training for months after).
I do agree that they don’t specify which form. But if we are being 100% unbiased here, not specifying a form either implies orange piccolo is as strong as BASE Goku, or that he rivals Goku’s full power. Especially considering that statements made in the past by directors and akira toriyama have stated specific forms (like Blue Goku coming close to the Gods in the Broly Movie, or Black Frieza coming close to rivaling a God in the Manga). So it really probably comes down to if Orange Piccolo rivaling BASE Goku or Orange Piccolo rivaling full powered Goku makes more sense
@@JaylonDBZ i dont see it like that and in the movie verses ultra instinct n ego dont exist , blue kaioken doesnt exist either neither blue evo .....hence y goku didnt go ui in the broly movie n they only used regular blue .... the movie shits be messin wit ma head and if we goin by the logic u used this arc happened later but that also means goku and vegeta are significantly stronger than what they were and all theyve been doing is training ...so ill say it again piccolo isnt beating goku , vegeta , nor gohan at this point i love piccolo but no bro
@ the Broly arc in the manga is also before the Moro and Granola arc, and the Super Heros arc is some time after the Granola arc. I hope one day we get the both arcs in the anime though!
@@JaylonDBZ i fully agree on that the moro and granolah arc especially the story elements n lore drops in the granolah arc shit will be peak
Orange Piccolo is strong as SSGOD above all Z but below all SUPER.
A specifically says in the manga or toriyama himself say orange piccolo's only strong as a super Saiyan blue kaioken Goku
It's never stated in any continuity that Orange Piccolo is only as strong as Super Saiyan Blue Kioken Goku. Only that he "rivals Goku and the others".
@JaylonDBZ but also says that orange piccolo hasn't really proven two rivals Goku's forms beyond super Saiyan blue
@@alexwilliamson-i7i It's never stated that that he hasn't proven to rival a form beyond Blue. You could try to make evidence that Orange Piccolo hasn't rivaled Super Saiyan Blue, but there is no official statement for that.
@@JaylonDBZ I respect you but orange piccolo hasn't proven anything he defeated cell Max while then he defeated the game is okay but that is not even a feat Goku has defeated
@@JaylonDBZ I respect you and I do like your videos but orange pekoe has no feet yes he has defeated cell Max in the game is but Goku has defeated universal threads that is way stronger than orange piccolo and if you watch the manga orange piccolo wouldn't even stand a chance
No way, I'm sorry Vegeta is a badass warrior, him and Goku. Piccolo was my favorite in dragonball but when Vegeta came along he took a back sit. Even if in one arc Piccolo becomes stronger than Vegeta trust me it will be brief because I think Piccolo orange will be a one off because I think Goku and Vegeta can still go beyond their forms and another thing Vegeta still hasn't totally mastered Ultra Ego, once he does and learn how to avoid the damages to his body, Piccolo want stand a chance.
I'm pretty sure beast gohan fought PUI goku
I would think that piccolo could beat EGO vegeta if he knew how it work, like if you cut his arm off would he get stronger from it?
Or if you put him in a headlock, and squeeze his neck,”
@@skylerwarren7300 yeah at least during Super Heros it would definitely be a battle of durability imo.
Vegeta has spirit fission he could just Unfuse piccolo from kami and nail
@@DangitBobby9960 I don’t think that vegeta would use it as he didn’t do it in the last arc he was in he probably just did it was the only way he could beat moru
🎉🎉🎉❤
@@CHANCECOOLEY Appreciate you for stopping by and taking the time to watch!🔥
You have great content sir!! Totally agree with your assessment 👏
Spirit fision...a couple hits and he gets slpit back into 3 people ...as strong as piccolo is vageta's hax makes it a mismatch
If Jiren came back he would be stronger
I agree, he would probably be rivals with MUI Goku as he is now if I had to place a guess
Not as strong as Krillan unleashed.
Orange picolo gets beaten by cell max, cell max was almost one shot by gohan, gohan is a bit below mui goku. End.
Hiw did shenron make that strong if in dbz he couldnt make anyone as strong as the saiyans cause that would overwhelm his own abilities. But now he can make Piccolo who is maybe at best base goku strength into a guy who could spar with beerus wtf ??
Definitley a lapse in how they wrote it, but if I had to make an explanation for them, I would say that Shenron can’t MAKE somebody so strong, he can only give them the ability to unlock what’s already within them. But yeah I agree, kinda crazy how strong he made Piccolo
Hey look a superstard
A huh?!
Bro chill with the text pop up sound effects
Noted! Thanks for watching!
I find this ridiculous that they closed the SSG gap, not to mention higher forms. By that logic if Beerus never came and they never learned about SSG, Goku and Vegeta would have been left in the dust and got a job in Krilins police station :) . I mean this things getting anoying. What now Beeruses and Whises training and power is a joke is it? Like let me train a little in my back yard and surpass them all, and little scientist making bots that are on GoD level. Those producers are a fuc*ing joke. Ok now let Goten and Trunks train a little for a fight with Grand priest. 🤮🤮
i mean there should have been a series showing their strugles with this power gap that has been created by Goku and Vegeta and cumulating with them catching up in Super Hero.
MORE OH! MORE OH! Moro
Got owned in SH anyway. The movie should have been about picocolo story full stop. and not included the beast Gohan A$$ pull for no reason
It is all trash because Piccolo didn't earn it himself. He wished for it. It would have been better if he wished for the potential to grow with practice.
@@EELLISON2012 i think the wishing part made sense (Shenron being made by a Namekian which is tied to Piccolo’s lineage). But it shouldn’t have been THAT strong.
In my opinion, Orange Piccolo should have been like Piccolo’s Super Saiyan God. Instead of a supposed Ultra Level form.
Krillin had the same unlocked potential and he ain't even top 20
Orange piccolo is always stronger to super Saiyan blue Goku so let's just say this if Goku bumps it up the kaioken times 20 or 10 or just f***** like orange pickle is getting his ass whooped super Saiyan blue kaioken Goku don't get me wrong yeah piccolo is strong in his own right but if you're getting one thing Goku is stronger than orange piccolo even Vegeta's evolution blue former stronger than piccolo I could be wrong there but Goku has mastered ultra instinct altruistic signs of
I just love how everyone thinks so highly of such an asspull of a power up.same as for Gohan two of the most undeserved and unearned power that only exists because of plot armor.lets make a wish on the dragon balls for more power...as pathetic as granola. No wonder super is pretty much done go Diama hopefully they don't mess this one up too
I’m ngl it sounds like Dragon Ball Super might not be for you haha. Hopefully Diama is more enjoyable, but thanks for watching!
why vegeta why cant yall pick on somebody else the suffering of vegeta fan is everlasting u know ho many vids ive seen of dbz fans putting vegeta against different character just for my goat to get clapped
Lol true true
Its MORO not morou 😂😂😂
Short answer no
He’s certainly stronger than most people give him credit for at least to me.
Yes but weaker than Black Freiza
Remember, Orange Piccolo is weaker than Beast Gohan. Beast Gohan couldn't beat UI Goku. We didn't need this video.
UI Goku couldn't beat Beast Gohan either. The match was stopped, and we don't know who would have won if it had continued
But from what we have seen, Beast Gohan's berserk full power was able to overwhelm UI Goku's evasive speed and knock him out of UI
@@BeastXIS Sure but the lesson we learned from the SS Goku vs 100% power Frieza fight was anyone who has to be at 100% power to fight will be defeated as their power decreases over the course of the fight. Beast Gohan can't keep up with UI Goku. The moment he drops below the power needed to overcome UI, Goku wins.
Did you watch the end of the video?
@Turtlesarecool609 Yes and the point he makes is weird. I don't think it validates any statement that Orange Piccolo is stronger or even at level with the Beast Gohan we saw fight UI Goku.
@@Alassandros I mean. UI Goku's accuracy literally drops overtime according to the Granolah arc
So Beast Gohan is not the only one whose stamina drops
Dragonball was good, until God-forms where just trash
UI OMEN level YES MUI NO
Hey ultra ego Vegeta is stronger than orange piccolo that's for sure 😊
@@AymenSassi-s9e That’s definitely fair to say, we need a common enemy or an arc where they fight together to really tell who’s stronger
No he’s not
Na
@@Spirosbotos he is
downvoted
This aint reddir bub
upvoted
Got a bunch of sayin suckers in this comment section losing their mind
There’s absolutely nothing stopping Goku and Vegeta from having their potentials unlocked but bad writing. Goku was going to do it before to Tournament of a Power but there wasn’t enough time.
Yeah they really could have done it by now, not sure why they haven’t
In the next arc Krillin will be the strongest cause he wished to be the strongest let’s go plot convenient power ups hurray, hard work? No no no everybody in Dragonball is a prodigy or Super Uber talented, Frieza you’re a prodigy, Gohan you’re a prodigy, Broly you’re a prodigy, everybody is a prodigy.
False lol Piccolo is Already a GOD He absorb GOD-Kami & Nail…. it’s Equivalent to THE TRINY … GOD-Kami Sun-Nail -Holy- Spirit Yall go off words alone ITS READ BETWEEN the LINES!! Nobody that far apart in power anyways. Beerus Flicks Goku SSJ3 to death… Majin buu fights beerus and not even hurt… All powers that came after SSJ3 is not even GOKUs it’s 5 others Sayins & Majin buu is still the strongest character OP he’s by himself and his own creator & Piccolo Always been Top tier Goku ask to spar PICCOLO he said NO because Piccolo smokes GOKU effortlessly His form is Invincibly
lol what?
@ Read it nice and slow 8xs you’ll get it buddy
*Well Finally*
🟢🟣 Gonna Miss Seein Green And Purple
🟠🔴
M’ROE M’ROE M’ROE M’ROE M’ROE M’ROE M’ROE M’ROE
@@DT-pm8yu I don’t watch other Dragon Ball TH-camrs, I just read the manga so forgive me if I mispronounce a manga only name😭