Hifi Myths & Misconceptions - Placing Speakers Close To Walls
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 2 มิ.ย. 2024
- In this video I discuss how low frequencies behave in a room and how the rest of the frequencies behave differently. I then go on to explain how this relates to speakers being placed close to walls and how to mitigate some of the problems that close to wall placement causes.
Link to my related video on speaker placement...
• Hifi Myths & Misconcep...
Time stamps 0:00
Below transitional frequency 1:20
Above transitional frequency 4:20
Close to wall placement 9:37
Sealed vs ported speakers 12:03
Conclusion 14:13
![โอ้มายก๊อด! ไม่ถึงชั่วโมงหมดเป็นแสน 😅 [cc] แดนแพทตี้ SS2 | EP.42 |](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/OH2ShXfO6tA/mqdefault.jpg)
In my 70th year, this is the best and most comprehensive explanation of listening sonics I have encountered.
Wow, thank you G Gray. Praise doesn’t come any higher. Very much appreciated 😊👍👍
@Fat Rat cheers buddy 😊👍
@@abritishaudiophile7314 Agreed. Don't think I can say it better either. I really enjoy your channel
@@markallenster thank you Mark. I really appreciate it 😊👍
@@abritishaudiophile7314 hi could i ask what your speaker stands are sitting on. Some sort of acoustic foam I'm guessing.
If the better half says you can’t move the speakers further out from the wall then simply get a builder in to move the wall further back. Problem solved 👷🏻♂️
Very good. I suspect that may solve the problem as once you are a bachelor again, you no longer have to worry about the spouse acceptance factor 😂
I miss them musical jam intros you were doing at the beginning of videos. You find they were just space fillers early on or being cracked down on by you tubes stringent copyrights restrictions? Just a observation. Enjoyed your video as always. A different perspective on this topic is always appreciated! You would probably surprised by how many have hadicaped their $$$ system right off the bat with its compromises in its placement in the room. Perhaps an idea for future videos would be a subscriber looking to better his systems placement or using room treatment to better improve the sound. Even be cool if perhaps a expert on room acoustics and simple room treatments could chime in as well. Just tossing out ideas. Thanks as always for taking the time to make these videos!
@@brandonburr4900 thank you Brandon for you support and suggestions. 😊👍You are right I can’t get those music intros past TH-cam copyright 😢
Ha!! That's an idea 💡build bigger
I run in a 4.2 system configured as follow 805 d4 fronts 705 s2 surrounds and 2 saw 500 subs. I have the 805 d3 as thought of using them as surrounds but found the 705 ultimately was the better blend to the 805 d4 fronts. Many would say let’s match all diamonds but I found trying both the rear port 705 s2 for surrounds were better than the 805 as surrounds. Another thing that stopped me was the tweeter. The d3 had harshness issues I did not want to reintroduce into the d4. The carbon dome has been excellent. Time the sound and leveled the speakers it’s excellent. I also find the 705 s2 rear port helps the subwoofer in a way the rear porting and placement. Bass is very smooth deep not bloated and not exaggerated at all. Results have been amazing
Congrats Tarun on reaching 20k. Well deserved, your content is on point and well delivered. Hope the lockdown isn’t too stressful, I could imagine Diwali must have been very different this year. Hopefully we’ll have the opportunity to see loved ones from the wider family/community again soon
Thanks Shahid. You are right, it has been a strange year. Diwali was no exception 😢
What a fantastic video. Everything is explained so well. The content quality of your videos just keep getting better. Excellent work Tarun.
Thank you for watching and your kind words of support Neil 😊👍👍
My hat's off to you Tarun. You've created more than a YT channel. Your viewers are interacting with one another to help each other with audio topics. Well done!
Thank you buddy. One of the best things about this format is that it allow us to build a community. I learn as much from my viewers as they do from me 😊👍👍
Thank you Tarun for another excellent video. As usual a clear explanation of a complex topic. And it's great that your son and dog are part of the show.
As a subscriber I'd like to thank you for this entertainining and informative channel. And your pesonality shines through on all of them. Congrats on 20k subscribers. I hope your audience keeps growing.
Thank you you brown-eyed-man. Very kind of you to say. I would personally like to thank you for all the support you have shown me on this channel 😊👍👍
Awesome! Well done hitting 20K. Thoroughly deserved. Don’t be humbled - as I’ve said before, you have a special way of explaining technical subject matter to non-technical people, and this video is a very good illustration of that. Keep ‘em comin’!
Thank you for watching and all the support you have shown to myself and the channel my friend 😊👍
@@abritishaudiophile7314 I mean every word. I’m very distracted by other things at the moment, but yours is still a go to channel
This is refreshing to watch a video without all the extraneous noise and drama and just straight to the point. I'm simply an enthusiast who enjoys listening to something that I would like to think to be 'better quality' than the average setup and casually learn more about everything related to passive speaker systems and headphone setups. Now that I've found you I look forward to watching more of your videos. Liked and subscribed!
Thank you. I appreciate you watching and your support 😊👍
Thoroughly enjoying your channel, which I just found. The admirable dad moment at the end: taking care of background “room gains” earned my subscription 😎 nicely done!
Thank you theotherserge. I appreciate you watching and your support. My son did really well to keep himself quiet for as long as he did 😊👍
Excellent! Absolut excellent and it is so sweet the way you bring in your family life while walking us through the acoustics of speaker design. You truly have the humor and the intellectual headroom to capture it all. Thanks again.
Thank you Kjeld. I appreciate you watching and your kind words of support 😊👍👍
He's doing so many things wrong, and he doesn't even know it. Sorry, but this guy knows VERY little about acoustics.
I'd rather point you to someone that knows infinitely more than this guy.
You deliver the most consistent and thorough explenations I’ve heard on TH-cam. Thank you. I have made a trade-off of putting my Devialet Phantom Gold a bit to close to the side walls. Will have to reconsider that and try moving them out. Also I’m enjoying my Poly-Mojo-Oppo PM3-setup listening to you.
That is a very nice system Andreas. Thank you for watching and your kind words of support 😊👍
As usual, you have a great way way of explaining these things very simply and on the whole, correctly.
Thank you J Ked 😊👍
@@abritishaudiophile7314 no prob. Wish there was a way I could talk to you about your channel. Live the human-ness of needing to go take care of the child.
@@jked7463 thanks J Ked. I am only on TH-cam I am afraid. It is the only way I can manage my time 😉
@@abritishaudiophile7314 Thank you!
@@abritishaudiophile7314 I understand and that is actually what I wanted to discuss.
This was a great video Tarun. Really appreciate the effort on your part. I learnt a lot. Please keep them coming.
Thank you. I appreciate your support 😊😊
As a speaker and acoustics engineer it is refreshing to hear someone with a decent grasp of the basic principles involved.
In a nutshell your room dictates what happens more from 350hz and below than you have control over. Baffle step is the frequency below which wavelengths wrap around the speaker but if I may, it is still a pressure system and not wholly reflective. Think of earbuds. They work on a pressure basis.
The baffle step frequency at which sound starts transitioning from 2 pi to 4 pi space is proportional to baffle width and edge design for refraction. As you correctly theorise, early reflection takes place at a period of time proportional to baffle step wavelength frequency delay to the rear wall and distance to the listener. Speed of sound is about 340m/s.
Baffle step can be calculated from baffle width as can refractive out of phase direct refracted baffle edge sound and these are critical to perceived accuracy of timbrel quality of lower frequency sound which is why wide baffles will always provide better upper bass detail but at the cost of more panel resonance direct sound contribution unless accounted for in design.
The 6dB increase is usually accounted for by the speaker designer in even passive crossovers. Bass traps do not work unless several feet deep...not 6 inches! You can more efficiently use helmholtz resonators to passively achieve the same as dsp but with the significant advantage of not messing up polar response.
I have to correct you on your statement that ported designs dont control bass well. They do if designed properly. It's an annoying urban myth to hear such things repeated I'm afraid. At least this is true if properly designed as there should be NO peaking if properly designed. I use distributed vent tuning in my flagship Canterbury and Malmesbury speakers. These are tuned to partially modulate driver impedance for lower group delay of bass and flatter response. I am happy to send you a few articles I have written on the subject. Sealed boxes work just the same close to the walls. The real problem is most designers do not design their ported systems properly and deliberately peak response to make them sound more impressive.
Please do get in touch if you would value some articles specific to this
topic.
Paul
Thank you Paul. I really appreciate you taking the time to sharing your knowledge and understanding from a professional perspective. I would love to further develop my understanding in this field and appreciate you reaching out to me. Would you mind posting you email address so that I can get in touch? Please feel free to delete it afterwards. Many thanks, Tarun
@@ReferenceFidelityComponents thank you Paul 😊
I converted my onkyo D-N9BX from slot ported too sealed. Was simple as they have a slotted base which can be removed and flipped, then reattached. Removed the bass boom from their difficult corner bookshelf placement.
Would like to upgrade but no sealed speakers in the budget-midfi market.
Thanks Tarun, I moved my Atc Scm 40 passives to your recommended distance and it made a huge difference.
The bass improved the imaging improved .
Thank you for your very clear and detailed advice in your video
Thank you Greg. Great speakers, I am glad you have them singing 😊👍
20k+ I’m not surprised tarun as yours is one of the few channels actually explaining complex matters & helping us hifi enthusiasts learn about the often used words in hifi which most of us know but don’t really understand, add to the fact that your not just reviewing new product after new product spouting the same ole strap lines & filling your boots with £££’s.
I have problems with my room acoustics which I’ve never got to grips with this will definitely help me.
I was wondering what’s your thoughts on open baffle speakers, their gaining popularity & popular in the USA, certainly seem to fix a lot of problems which box speakers create, very linear & the definition of notes is magical. Seem to have all the detail of electrostatics but with bass & a wider stereo image.
Thanks again for another in depth video
Thank you Madds66. I haven’t the space to accommodate open baffle speakers here. They are a good option if you have the space for them. The back wave cancellation and lack of cabinet means that they need a large front baffle with an equally large woofer. This has its drawbacks but there are benefits to the approach as well. You also need a beefy amplifier to keep the larger woofer in check. Thank you for all the support you have shown this channel 😊👍👍
Congratulations on your subscriber’s number! I love your channel and appreciate all you do.
Much appreciated 😊👍
I've learned alot from watching your videos and you explain everything in a very good and understandebel way, so I thank you for that and wish to congratulate on reaching 20k subscribers.
Thank you, I appreciate you watching and your support 😊👍👍
I played around with the placement after watching this and the setup guide. What an improvement for zero investment. Thank you so much Tarun!
Thank you Fluxi. Much appreciated 👍😊👍
Yet again an incredibly in-depth review and great info indeed. Thank you so much for sharing.
Thank you Simon. Much appreciated 😊👍
Congratulations on the 20K subscribers reached. Knew this was coming. I saw it when from the first video I saw of yours. You have an easy and laid back style which lends itself to attracting more attention. People can easily be annoyed by know it alls. You make no such claims ergo you have more people to watch. It is also possible to learn the hows and whys the way you do your videos. Keep up the good work Tarun. You’re going places here! Stay safe mates!😊👍🏻😷
Thank you my friend. I appreciate all the support you have shown me and all the professional knowledge you have taken the time to share on this channel 😊👍👍
Thank you for sharing your knowledge. I enjoyed the no-nosense delivery, concise descriptions, and calming tones. Liked and subbed.
Thank you. Much appreciated 👍
All of us subscribers should thank you for sharing your audio knowledge with us and the wonderful way you explain things. Thank you sir and stay well
Thank you Cruzing RSX. Very kind of you to say. Thank you for all the support you have shown me 😊👍👍
All well said.
@@mohis4299 thank you 😊👍
You certainly know how to make a great technical explanation of room acoustics. Bravo!
Thank you Neil. Much appreciated 👍😊👍
Enjoyed your video as usual. It was very thought provoking for me. I never really understood the time smearing affect of placing speakers close to walls. I will definitely research this some more. Thanks!
Thank you Jim 😊
Great topic, well presented as usual. Thank you for sharing your knowledge.
Thank you eholmwood 😊👍
Absolutely excellent video. This has given me something to think about and I shall be experimenting with my own system set up. Thank you for sharing. It’s a pity we are only able to give you one thumbs up!
Thank you Tony. I appreciate you watching and your kind words of support 😊👍
I enjoy the way you explain things. Well done!
Thank you Joe. Love your channel too. Watched a bunch of your interviews at the Hifi Summit 😊👍
Fantastic episode! Please keep these episodes coming!
Thank you Rohit. I will do my best 😉👍
That's great, I have elsewhere not heard the issue so clearly and simply explained of early reflections and the distance to rear and side walls needed to generate at least 5 ms delay, thanks so much for your time.
Thank you my friend. I appreciate your kind words of support 😊👍
"you may want to watch this video"..... oh I feel a binge of your vids coming on. Thank you for your time and effort, all the best.
Thank you Daniel. Very much appreciated 😊👍
Very enjoyable and well presented, a nice technical approach without being overbearing. Keep up the good work please.
Thank you Steve 😊👍
Thanks for your video. It’s refreshing to see an explanation in terms of physics, not opinions! I have a rectangular room and due to the furniture I was forced to set up on the long wall. I’ve moved the speakers about and I find that having them 4” from the wall works, even though they are rear ported. I think what I now need to deal with are reflections off the wall that is 18” behind my head. I will buy some absorption panels and place them there. I am not absolutely convinced of the need for bass traps as I live in a modern house without solid walls and my amp keeps a very tight grip on the speakers.
Thank you 😊
Happy to be a subscriber, your videos are always interesting to watch.
I am unfortunate to have to place my speakers close to a wall but fortunate to have vintage speakers that in my opinion work well in that case. They are rear ported speakers but have quite a tight base (we used to call that dry base back in the 80's but I have the feeling this definition has changed a bit over time). Any way, the result is still a tight but also a punchy base and I think that if I would move them out they would sound too thin. An other interesting aspect is that back in the late 70's early 80's it would be quite easy to find literature recommending placing speakers closer to the wall or even to the corner of a room to augment the base. I also think modern speakers are designed to go deeper but are also woollier than many vintage speakers.
Very interesting Hugo. You are right a lot of vintage speakers have a wider front baffle and narrower depth. Really enjoyed reading you comments. As always, thank you for your support 😊👍
Another great presentation! I'm fond of a 10 millisecond reflection. I'm also a big fan of nearfield listening. Thanks again!
Thank you Brucemarino 😊👍
Bruce-i agree- first time you listen to a good near field setup is revelation. I tell people to spend some money setting their computer for stand up. Mode rather than sitting down, then get some decent powered near field monitors (Focal, Adam, Genelac , let alien Neumann or PMC) and decent but now crazy sub and you hav rot spend far far more to duplicate the sound for a traditional sitting down situation in the room.
@@johnwhite2576 An excellent prescription, John! I'm in the midst of designing some inexpensive dipoles optimized for near-field listening.
Great video Tarun as always. In my lifelong interest with music and hifi I have found that the sock bonged into a ported speaker design to reduce bass output unfortunately tends to play a bit of havoc with the midrange response causing some coloration. I have also found that listening position relative to the back wall ( wall behind the listener) also is of great importance, when it comes to bass response. Personally I’m sat with my ears just over 2 feet in front of an absorption panel resting on a window ledge behind me. Well, we could talk room acoustics for days I have no doubt 👍🏼 All the best Peter
Thank you Peter. I appreciate you watching and taking the time to share your experiences 😊👍
As always another very interesting video. I think this is the first time I have really understand about speaker placement.
Thanks and keep up the good work
Thank you Richard 😊👍
Thank you too, for the wonderfully presented videos.. Wishing you all success in the future..
Thank you pvravi. I appreciate you watching and your kind words of support 😊👍
Well, I'd say Your channel growing so quickly is a direct result of the excellent quality of Your vids - just like this one: Pretty much all the relevant info on the topic wrapped up in a well organized, easy to follow package.
About that 12% direct sound thing: I may be wrong here, but I thought this holds true for big rooms like concert halls; In fact, I believe that the Bose 901 speaker with one driver firing forwards and eight to the rear was designed around a naive misinterpretation of how big room acoustics work. Either way though, reflected sound definitely plays a huge part in the sonic performance.
Thank you Sebastian. I appreciate you watching and your kind words of support. I believe Dr Sean Olive conducted the research in a domestic sized living space. Worth checking for sure though 🤔😊👍
I surrounded my speakers with books to sort of act as an extension of the baffle and, in my small room, I was very surprised at how wide the sound-stage became, the speakers disappeared more while also gaining extension in the room. The back of the speakers are just 10" from the wall. We have a cafe/bookstore I've struggled to figure out a speaker placement for. Now I can't wait to try it there and hear what it does. In an actual bookshelf it may sound different but worth the try. Thanks for mentioning this in your video. I would have never guessed.
Thanks you. Please let me know how you get on 😊
Another well constructed and perfectly presented video 👍
Thank you Justin. Very kind of you to say 😊👍
Congratulations Tarun💫
Helpful job⭐️
Cheers👍
Thank you for watching 😊
Excellent Tarun!!
I second what J Ked said.
In my opinion you became a standard how the audio reviews should be. ( this I am saying after 8 to 10 years reading/listening to audio reviews and this including many prominent/top reviewers )
Great work!!!
Thank you Sandeep. Very kind of you to say and very much appreciated 😊👍👍
I second that! It’s a minefield hi end audio but Tarun navigates it very well with a combination of skepticism, open mindedness, logic and clarity, and is not frightened of acknowledging where we are or he is unsure about something.
@@Coneman3 thank you my friend. That pretty much sums up what I try to do 😊👍👍
Great Video Tarun, well explained, As always. Glad to see your Channel reach the 20 000 subscriber mark.
Greetings my Friend, be safe 😉
Thank you my friend for watching and your continued support of what I do. It don’t not go unnoticed and is very much appreciated 😊👍👍
Great information Tarun, a lot of people will find this useful.
A few years ago a chap local to me put his TDL Studio 1's up for sale, he had owned them from new and they looked as they did the day he bought them. He really did not want to part with them, but he had recently moved home and was being forced to use them in a relatively small room. They were close to the rear wall and the sides, they sounded quite dull and bass heavy when he demonstrated them.
My man cave is 4m x 5m, a similar size to his room, but I knew I had more flexibility as regards placement, a rap on the wall behind his speakers also revealed drywall construction. I suspected his walls were not helping his sound.
I did suggest to him that he could skin the wall, adding another layer of plasterboard, but his wife also felt the speakers now dominated the room so his hand was forced. I picked them up, with the stands for the price he was asking, a measly £200 the pair. They sound great with a solid wall behind them.
Basically, as you mentioned, the materials the room is constructed from can affect the sound greatly. If folks with problems have a drywall room, they might consider adding an extra skin under the guise of redecorating :).
Thank you Donk. A lot of people will benefit from you experiences. I appreciate you watching and sharing 😊👍
Can’t even begin to say how helpful this has been! You’ve directly and succinctly tackled the big issues, but also in a manner that’s realistic (and affordable). I’ve ordered some somewhat substantial corner bass traps for my small room, to be places in the corners next to my Quad s2’s and hopefully tame the 70-200Hz bump I’m getting. But will also implement/experiment with your suggestions 🙏🏼
Very kind of you John. Those corner trap usually work well in the 100Hz+ range. I may be useful to ask the manufacturer for absorption specs of the traps you have ordered 😊👍👍
Many thanks for your great lesson. I really need to focus about the matter and every time I move them I get different sound performance. The best is to place the speakers far from the walls.
Thank you for watching Pierangelo. Always a pleasure to hear from you 😊👍
Dear sir, this video was exactly what I needed. Instead of buying more expensive speakers as an immediate remedy, I have spent few hours playing with the speaker placement according to your suggestions. The results are dramatic.
Thank you my friend. Great feedback 👍😊👍
This is such a great explanation, thank you. Coming from headphones, I was having a hard time sorting out what was going on when I decided to purchase speakers. I may have to put speakers on hold as my living room acoustics and placement options are limited. The soundbar sadly may have to stay.
Thank you JD. Much appreciated 👍😊👍
Well...after watching your setup/speaker positioning and top tips videos I convinced my wife to let me convert our dining room into a listening room (it's the best room in our house for it), she even moved all the furniture for me! I got the hifi kit out of the bedroom and set it up downstairs and wow what a difference, I think it needs a bit more tweaking but it's so much better than in the bedroom already, I just need some comfortable seating now and I'm set, so thanks a lot for all the inspiration and advice :)
That is fantastic. Please say hi to your wife for me ❤️👍
Great video that explains some situations to better place speakers!
Thank you Ernestino 😊👍
This is exactly what I needed, thank you!
Thank you for watching Kasper 😊👍
Thank you - I really enjoyed and benefited from your excellent video.
Thank you Thomas 😊
Great video Tarun. Many thanks for the knowledge. 🏴🎱🐙😺
Thank you Paz 😊👍
Thanks ... Really appreciate your contributions..
Thank you Chevyimp 😊👍
Generally I use the tone controls. When I'm getting serious I pull my speakers out a couple extra feet. My room is not great, and the wife won't let me keep my speakers 4 feet out in the living room for very long. Another great video. Thanks. Btw, I just built a subwoofer box for my tool locker at work. I made it sealed and agree with everything you just said. Really does a great job. I'm an electrician in a factory and I put together a system to rock out the maintenance shop.
Hi Eric, I have great admiration for people who roll up their sleeves and go the DIY route. Thank you for watching and sharing your experiences 😊👍
It is so plesent to listen to you...beside all other positiv atrbutes your presentations contains
Thank Hrvoje. I appreciate you watching and all the support you have shown this channel 😊👍👍
Hey Tarun ! So much to learn from your videos ...👍Happy Diwali !
Thank you Anand. Happy Diwali to you and your loved ones too 😊👍
A treasure trove of information. Thank you! :)
Thank you Azar 😊👍
Clear explanation. Useful knowledge.
Thank you St Chan 😊👍
Another great video. Reason I got the Yamaha R-N803D amp. I can play with the base level and as I have found out, it is a lovely sounding amp anyway. DSP works although I turn it off sometimes as some music plays nice and warm with it off. Yamaha has the YPAO which measures the room and when it is turned on there is a noticeable difference in the base.👍
Thank you Michael 👍
Absolutely love the video, you've gained a new subscriber! One question though, if let's say I were to design a loudspeaker that fits in the corners of a room (so the baffle blends into the two walls without having to make an in-wall speaker) and then linear-phase EQ using FIRs were used to linearise the response (due to the bass reinforcement that would occur). Could this be an adequate close-to-wall placement method?
I know you cover the DSP in your video but I mostly wanted your opinion on the corner speaker idea. I know it will be good for bass (as in its quality not just quantity) as it has been found having subwoofers in the corners of your room produces less nulls in the bass response. I'm just not 100% sure in terms of the rest of the frequency range and soundstage. I'm planning on using a tweeter that cover highs and midrange which is flat up to 180 degrees off axis all the way up to 180 degrees (a BMR if you are interested). The acoustics goes quite a bit beyond what anyone is covering. But I'd be massively thankful if you could share any knowledge on this topic. Thank you!!!
Thank you for watching and the sub Elliott. I am not sure how you could implement a linear-phase FIR filter to optimise for corner room placement. It isn’t something that I have looked into. The main things I would look at is compensation in the bass response for the lack of baffle step loss and a waveguide on the midrange (in a 3 way) and the tweeter to control the directivity. Tricky stuff to get right. I admire you for having a go 😊👍👍
Really enjoyed this one, thank you
Thank you for watching Marcus 😊👍
Great video Tarun👍
Thank you 👍
I use small stand mount speakers and think you need the speakers a bit closer to the back wall, if you pull them out too far you lose that mid bass coupling. Also depends on what type of walls you have. Most new homes have the hollow drywalls, so reflections are less of a problem than traditional hard walls. Modern houses have rooms that are too small so doesn't leave you with much option for placement. Also room shape, square or rectangle will have a bearing. More importantly you need to find a speaker that best fits the room.
Thank you for watching and sharing Din 😊
Yes thats correct, they work really well in the basement, about 10 inches from the cement backwall
Absolutely I noticed if you pull them too far out they get lost
Enjoyed the chat m8. I'm using socks in ports and rolls of carpet in the corners behind the seakers. Just about keeps bass under control.
Thank you for watching and sharing your experiences Chris 😉👍
Fantastic. You are extremely well informed. HAAS effect! Sabin effects (reverberant sound). Back wall isn’t nearly as important as side walls for early reflections as there is very little rear wall reflected energy above 300Hz in forward facing speakers (and none where are ears are super sensitive around 1000Hz). Rear wall room gain is good for direct sound quality of upper bass (million $ studios place soffit mount speakers in the wall) but it does excite room modes more heavily (ultra LF bass response). Books packed around and flush with baffle doesn’t work so well (lots of edge diffraction from the sharp book binding edges unfortunately). Sealed box indeed work better close to rear walls. Your advice is spot on!!! Rear wall quarter wave bass cancellation is an important consideration - due to symmetry of speakers and listener with respect to the rear wall surface this is usually quite strong. Close to rear wall (less than 3 feet to front baffle) or far from rear wall (more than 8 feet to front baffle) is a good place to start - anything in between is likely to have a quarter wave cancellation in the bass at a specific frequency.
Hi Jeremy, thank you for watching and sharing your extensive knowledge. Much appreciated on both accounts 😊👍
what outstanding information! Thank you.
Thank you. Much appreciated 😊👍
Thank you for the clear explanation!
Thank you for watching Eng 😊👍
As I thought, your channel as of recent is sure flourishing based on the 1K thumbs up I am seeing after only 3 days! Humm, I must be either a fortune teller or just really understand great content when I see it!🤔🤔🤗😉😇😜
Thank you Big Jay. Much appreciated 😊👍👍
Really good info ! Thanks !
Thank you for watching buddy 😊👍
Great informative information moved my Klipsch RP600's slightly wider apart and now it appears that the base is coming from the middle when sitting in the sweet spot thanks for sharing information
Thank you for watching James 😊👍
That was a superb video Tarun, thank you. I discovered your channel yesterday, and have watched quite a lot of your videos since. They're really very good, and I've learned a lot. I've also just re-organised my lounge, and things are already sounding a lot better. I'm forced to place my speakers near the back wall, and am currently comparing 3 sets of speakers that I have available to me. I'll definitely experiment with stuffing the ports! Thanks again.
Thank you Graham. I appreciate your watching and your kind words of support 😊👍
Excellent video Tarun. I was also thinking, another possibility, would be to have stands at the ready, to place your speakers out into the room, when you want to critically listen and have greater sound stage and depth. Speakers could be placed back against the wall after the listening session, and significant other will be happy.
Thank you buddy 😊
Great information and easy to understand, I love it!
I was recently looking at a bunch of speakers and ended up with the Klipsch Forte III, a large part was due to the fact that the owners manual and various reviewers said they sound best close to the wall (seems their bass and especially the 15" passive radiator is setup for that gain to be there). They might not be as refined as other options but they're still a lot of fun with the music I listen to! I'd love to have a dedicated room where I can put the speakers anywhere but for a living room the significant other said they need to be out of the way.
Thank you for watching and your kind words of support. I have to have my hifi in the main family space. Speakers need to be designed to work in real loving spaces not just dedicated listening rooms. The Forte III are a great example of this philosophy. Wishing you many years of listening pleasure 😊👍
Congrats on 20k! How is the puppy doing?
Thank you Derek. Bob is 4 months old now and his personality is coming out more and more. He is a lot of fun 😊👍
Happy New Year Tarun !! Wish you the best for you and your family ,
This is a much awaited video for me , understand that and my house is same where your with different settings now where your vine storage is I have to place my right speaker there and it has only 3 feet away from the wall abs on the other side it’s 17 feet where you have your dinning table that’s long distance so when I listen to my recordings images are not in centre but more on left side right after the speakers , how can I improve my image to that sharp and pointy middle centric ?
Happy new year to you and your loved ones too Atri. It is tricky to advise without being there. I suspect the location of the speakers and the lack of acoustic symmetry is always going to be a problem. I would experiment with the toe-in of the two speakers and see if that shifts the centre image. In you case they may need different amounts of toe-in. Good luck 😊👍
Thank you for a very educational video!
Thank you. Much appreciated 😊👍
Thanks again Tarun, another in depth video on my favourite subject of speaker placement. I'd love to hear your thoughts sometime on (speaker) cable lifters, worthwhile or not?
Thank you Keith. With this hobby, I have leant not to knock anything until you have tried it. Having said that I haven’t personally paid any attention to it. Like you say, maybe sometime in the future 🤔😊
Nice tight explanation and I can confirm that you are very right. If you can't get away from the wall enough then go as close as possible - with the matching speaker.
I'm myself in the problematic situation with my room and how I have to place everything. I also use the system for TV/movie and gaming-pc. All not possible to place central or move them forward. But it happens that this unfortunate meet my very old and a few years ago customized (with new midrange driver and tweeter as well with a self designed, high quality components, 3-way type.2 crossover) Sharp-GP6200. Pretty hefty, big sealed box from think late 80's. And putting them like 3-7cm near the back wall and the right one also smashed right to the sidewall give them like a loudness effect and sound very nice with full and precise bass and wide stage and good instrument position...
So, my recommendation is simple: if you need/ want more low frequency just try to put them near the wall and see if it works or if you sacrifice more important things so you need another solution;)
Thank you for sharing your experience 😊
Wow. Very refreshing content here!
Thank you Em 😊👍
Hi taran , another very interesting and informative video quite a few parameters to consider in speaker placements, I have been trying to find the best place in the restraints of my lounge . Kind regards mark
Thanks Mark 😊
I have a pair of pristine Carlsson OA50s - now 37 years old - which were designed to work in any room. Stig Carlsson was the chief designer at Sonab in the 1970s and went solo in the 1980s. His were always radical designs and some were a bit hit or miss. The OA50s were designed to be placed directly against a wall with minimal adverse effects and in my experience, no other placement worked well. They were surprisingly fussy for some reason and I have never figured out why that was. They shouldn't have been but they were. But when they worked they were spectacular and threw a widely dispersed sound stage all over the room. They received a mixed reception from the HiFi press at the time, mainly because the tweeter was thought to be a bit of a disappointment. For that reason, the commercial success they should have received eluded Stig Carlsson and he died in relative poverty. Tragic, especially considering his talent. The OA51 and OA52 designs were similarly radical but the OA51s really needed wall mounting. Someone has actually solved that tweeter problem with a retro fit today but I have never done it.
These days I'm using a pair of Dynaudio X34s which are similar in character to the Carlssons but less demanding of placement.
Wonderful anecdote. Thank you 🙂
@@abritishaudiophile7314 My Pleasure.
Tarun, this was very interesting and a little different in content to other set up videos I have seen. Well done! I just wanted to chip in. I am using a desktop set up mostly in lockdown whilst I work. My Dali Menuets seem to do nearfield well but it’s interesting how big a difference a small adjustment makes. With them pointing at near head height but slightly below it was like listening to a miniature band just behind them. Now I’ve raised the front of the speakers at a small angle that band in miniature has gone and the sound field is more complete.. but which one is right and which do I actually prefer?? Perhaps a subject for the future?
Thank you for watching Andrew. In the nearfield small adjustments make even more difference 😊👍
Great stuff Tarun
Thank you Merlin 😊👍
This is excellent information 👌 thank you
Thank you Ronald 👍😊👍
First time coming across your channel. Well done!
This vid made me realize, I don’t understand volume very well. If sound is a wave, what accounts for the db’s?
Thank you Trevor. I appreciate you watching. I am not sure I understood your question correctly. Decibels (dBs) is a measure of sound pressure level. Waves are just a model used to describe how sound propagates 😊
Great Info, Many thanks
Thank you for watching Phil 😊👍
Thank you for this video!
You are most welcome Manuel. Thank you for watching 😊👍
I've been putting at least a foot between my speakers and back wall, but just recently I heard the idea to push them back close to the back wall and making the distance between the speakers and side walls disproportionate to the back wall. Now, they are 4" from the back wall and >12" from the sides. That instantly improved the sound overall. I would say even the bass became better, not boomier. Adding some bass traps to my corners may improve it, but I've yet to try.
It that works in your room then that is all that matters. Some speakers work really well right up against the back wall. Thank you for watching 😊
You mentioned that positioning loudspeakers with rear ports close to the wall will cause a bloating in the bass. I have Klipsch RF 63 with three rear ports and they are about 4 inches from the back wall due to room constraints. I noticed that on some music, like Miles Davis Doo Bop, the bass sounded rather huffy for lack of a better word. I thought that I would rather not plug the ports as the loudspeaker was designed for ports and instead I put two cushions behind them. And hey, presto, problem fixed. It is not a placebo effect either as I tested it with a cd and vinyl I listen too frequently and also the Miles Davis Doo Bop one. Thank you for implanting an idea in my mind. Simple and cost me nothing and fixed in a few seconds. Also I find it astounding how the sound waves from all frequencies rearrange themselves with the subwoofer in the mix.
Hi Roddy, thank you watching and sharing your experiences. I really enjoyed reading your comments 😊👍
Super interesting video! I'm a fan of old school big driver, wide baffle speakers, perhaps it's because of the reasons you detailed in the video. That was very interesting about front vs rear ports as well. There is another reason for port placement, (and the affect of port plugs), but it doesn't have anything to do with your topic, more about speaker design in general. Good job covering both of those with relation to the topic though, it was conveyed well.
Very very good job on the video. I noticed you have the same Achilles heal as I do... I get so involved in what I'm talking about, that I may cover 10 topics in one video, only to later think hmmm... probably would have worked better sliced and diced into separate videos.
Kudos on the research, sharing practical insight and talking through all that with minimal cuts... that's not easy.
Thank you my friend 👍
if the listening room and budget are small, mission lx-2 is a good alternative. Plays nicely close to the back wall, and even in a bookcase. It has bass reflex with port on the back. But it does not create problems. It also comes with foam plugs that change the character of the bass somewhat
Thank you for watching and sharing Bjarne 😊
Consider talking about the option to analyze measured frequency response at listening positions in a future video. Theoretical rules are great to be aware of, but A $100 microphone(UMIK) and REW(free) can be very beneficial to optimizing each unique space. Measuring you speakers placed in multiple positions can be eye opening. Not sure how close to wall to go with? Start right up against it and measure in set increments pulling away.
Informative, thx for sharing
Thank you 👍
Very informative Thank you so much
Thank you for watching John 😊👍
Sealed speakers of past like NS1000s benefit greatly from getting placed as close to the wall as possible. Thanks for bringing this subject up. Ported speakers benefit from being placed away from wall and also the reward is better imaging.
It depends on the individual speaker. Yes, the bass on a sealed box will roll off earlier and a more gradual slope than a ported speaker. This means they tend to generally work better close to walls 😊
Brilliant video... Again! I can only repeat all the praise you are getting. I'm building the dtqwt mkiii and it has whopping bass drivers on the back and is more than 50cm deep 😯. My solution will be rather simple. Slide them out when I want to listen alone. Slide them back when the WAF sirens are on. Dsp is in Roon so that might be useful as well. Hey did you like Liberty?
You are a very wise man GD 😉👍
Closer than you think..... Super pleased with my £295 PSB Imagine B speakers, impressed. Haven't put my AE1 Series 2 back in.... Still love the AE1's but the PSB's are better if not as iconic.
Great, thank you for the update 👍
Thanks Tarun. There is some confusion on the terms ‘front wall” and “back wall”. The wall behind the speakers is generally referred to as the “front wall”. Speakers that radiate equal sound energy from the back, such as electrostatics are an entirely different proposition for room placement.
Thank you for watching and sharing Geoff