I was a Christian for 8 years! I walked away about a month ago. I tried justifying it for years. I’ve read dozens of apologists including the most revered. At the end of the day, I simply can’t believe anymore. There is insufficient evidence for the claims of Christianity.
One of Hitchen's great one-liners. But even that's not really relevant, since there's no evidence Mary claimed a virgin birth at all, or that anyone during Jesus' lifetime, including Jesus, made any claim about a virgin birth. The nativity story appears much later and is pretty clearly based on, or at least influenced by, the contemporary myths/stories about several different gods/semi divine beings which were known throughout the Roman empire at that time, eg Mithras, Horus.
@@sherpacool9931 Correct, he was quoting David Hume I believe. The original is admittedly bigoted because Hume says "Jewish mink" where Hitch says "teenage girl," so yet another instances of Hitch's hatred of anti-Semitism.
I've watched a lot of these, and this episode is like a college-level class on why Christianity warrants zero claims for belief. Those who do so are clearly doing it for bad reasons. Religion is indeed a poison that we need to outgrow.
Unfortunately, one needs to draw the poison from the wound, which is where I think that’s the problem; this poison in particular is fucking deep, and has been there a long time, and there are A LOT of folks who unfortunately lack critical thinking, and just go about their merry lives believing in the holy Flying Spaghetti Monster.🫠
The thing is those books were not written as fiction but as histroical documents: 1 Many have undertaken to draw up an account of the things that have been fulfilled[a] among us, 2 just as they were handed down to us by those who from the first were eyewitnesses and servants of the word. 3 With this in mind, since I myself have carefully investigated everything from the beginning, I too decided to write an orderly account for you, most excellent Theophilus, 4 so that you may know the certainty of the things you have been taught The author of luke is claiming that he is writing down things that have been fulfilled
@@ellasmith6554 "I couldn't believe it was happening, but it was" -- Peter Parker You're really not appreciating what's happening here. I'm not originating these arguments. I'm pointing out the absurdity of them. Obviously not even you believe that more books = more true. Nancy Drew would be one of history's best attested figures if all that mattered were the number of separate books. And even you seem to agree, since you don't immediately endorse that 800 separate books attesting to Spider-Man makes Spider-Man real. You don't believe that more books = more true, so my argument, so far as you are concerned is correct. Given that, you should agree that Andrew should not have made such a silly argument. Likewise Shakespeare's plays, Ovid's tales, Norse sagas, and Greek epics all include statements similar to Luke's that they're really telling the really, really real facts for realzies. Now, the fact that Luke's language is mirrored in works of fiction doesn't prove that Luke was writing a work of fiction, but that mirroring means you can't use "it really happened" language in the middle of a work to prove that work true. So neither you nor Andrew are making persuasive arguments, and because I respect you and Andrew, I expect better. That's why I don't belittle you, but do point out that your arguments are absurd and that not even you believe every work that includes "it really happened!" in the text. If you want me to believe that the author of Luke was writing an historically accurate account, you're going to have to come up with something completely different from "there were a lot of books" or "the book itself said the book is true".
Dear god: Why not use global telepathy instead of contacting Prophets in the Sinai Desert to write your instructions in a foreign language? Hello...? Hello...? Is anyone there?
"There are an infinite number of numbers between Zero and One, and none of them are Two." Not really sure how this applies, but it was something cool I read a long time ago.
I feel bad for Andrew because I was Andrew. He’s a fairly intelligent person and he KNOWS there’s no evidence for what he’s saying. But he simply HAS to believe it. It’s part of his identity and losing it feels like losing an arm. I been through it. I was sad and angry when I started coming to this realization that what I was reading was bullshit. But it all gets better in time
According to Pew research, Atheists and Jews have the highest degree of understanding of Theist text. Besides Matt and the ACA need to understand their adversary so it would be a pre-requirement for their task. Callers also don't get 20+ years of call-in experience to develop their skills.
@@anfo_4241 They ought to be savvy enough to argue their position though. If you can't argue your position thoroughly, you don't understand your position.
@@anfo_4241 yeah, only about 3% of theists claim to actually read their holy book. That has to be the best selling yet least successful book in history.
@Late to the Game 1) If Jesus is only salvation, then God is unfair, because Americas, South Africa, Far East, North Europe, Oceania were kept in dark, never heard about Jesus for 1500 years. 2) If people can be saved without Jesus, then Bible is unnecessary. 3) If Bible is necessary to make people better beings and increase their chance of heaven, then God is again unfair for providing such book to some and not to others.
@@goranmilic442 1) God as the omniscient LORD has ordained the world in such a way that salvation is achievable for all. [Acts 17:27]. Those who have never heard of Christ will be judged based on what they DO know and not what they DO NOT know, responsible for the amount of universal light and grace given to ALL human beings by their conscience and the world around them But, the common thing is that everyone is saved THROUGH Christ, Christ enables the savings. 2) They cannot. 3) Bible is centered around fishing people to God's kingdom through his infinitely valuable but free gift in Christ Jesus.
@@SerendipitousProvidence I accept your first and second answer, but you didn't really answer directly to my third claim. My question is - is Bible necessary for saving people? For example, we have remote island with 1000 inhabitants. Nobody heard about Jesus. Let's say God will judge them justly, by whatever standard he chooses, and 400 of them will be saved. Now, if somebody comes to that island and spreads gospel, will the number of people saved stay at 400 or increase? If it stays at 400, Bible and gospel are useless. If the number increases, if Bible saves additional people and turns them to Christ, then God is unfair for not providing such book to everybody, for keeping 75% of the world in the dark for 1500 years.
@@goranmilic442 God might've ordained it as such that those who never heard the gospel wouldn't have believed it anyway. [ omniscience ]. What I presented is just one view. Consider another argument as well : i> God has granted universal grace and light [Romans 1:20] ii> Men is responsible to make a choice to seek God with universal grace and light iii> Deuteronomy 4:29 declares that anyone who truly desires to know God, God will make Himself known. [ Refer to Cornelius who didn't know Jesus Christ but yet believed in Abrahamic God. ] iv> Your question assumes that there are people who haven't heard of Christ but refer to John 12:32 and John 6:44. Every Christian was drawn by Father to Christ and Christ also draws "all men" to Him.
@@goranmilic442 As for your thought experiment, I believe the exclusivity of the first scenario is impossible if Jesus has been lifted up at the time, because none of them will not NOT hear of Christ. If Christ = lifted up then every one saved = heard of Christ. You can't get saved without believing in Christ at a certain time in history is my belief. If Christ = not incarnated or lifted up, judged through their response to God's innate imprint of his existence. If he hadn't been then they will already be believing in Abrahamic God and justified through Christ. Bible doesn't save people, Christ does. Bible is a way for God to reach out his salvational message and expanded instructions. Also hypothesis don't have truth value, we remember things as they are.
Another excellent video of course. During my own deconversion my atheist sons directed me to this very channel to listen to Matt. I could listen to this man for hours, he is just that good.
Andrew here, from Twinsburg OH, has called in MULTIPLE times to both the Atheist Experience and Talk Heathen and has been caught out publicly EACH time failing to argue honestly lol and he must enjoy this particular notoriety because he's clearly a glutton for punishment just from Matt alone! 😂 Dude doesn't know WHEN to quit! Which would be admirable, under any other circumstances, but instead of trying new arguments he likes to try resurrecting his SAME ones over and over again no matter HOW many times it's stomped into the mud.
There is nothing better than hearing Matt logic smack someone. I'd love to meet you one day and shake your hand. I tip my fedora to you and the whole atheist experience crew for your contributions to the atheist and theist.
Daniel Hurley If,according to you, persistence is the measure of falsehood, then how can any honest person persist when faced with long-winded dishonesty? Matt and Don ask pertinent questions and counter dishonest arguments with evidence and rationality. The rest of your argument wasn’t clear imho so that is all I have to say.
Daniel Hurley Wow. Your fingers must hurt from typing. To follow up on your basketball analogy, I would recommend dribbling the ball less and just try to take one high percentage shot. As he has said to his callers numerous times, Matt conscientiously went searching for the evidence that his religious beliefs were true and came back empty. One doesn’t get to say that atheists are just upset because they couldn’t find the truth. Matt usually starts with “what is it you believe and why, and why would anyone else believe it?”. If you have a coherent argument limited to 60-70! words I will entertain you, otherwise I’m out. Good day.
Most religions are older than Christianity. So why do they not go back and look into where their religion started from? And then look back to were Judaism came form, etc., and they will soon come to learn that Christianity's roots are not legitimate. They have been spun out of a culmination of several past religions. They just won't go into the theology of their own religion to find out the truth. That's called willful ignorance. Many ppl that have, and are currently, studying to be priests,etc., actually loss their religion once they find out the truth in the texts and what they do and do not say, and where they come from. They tend to find a different truth than they expected. That, to me, is very telling. Cheers.
Yes. With each rebuttal, he spews a random biblical “factoid,” if you will. It’s a tactic to divert attention from the rebuttal, but also to keep HIMSELF convinced of his delusion. It’s really sad to witness
How can someone reject the Bible when it gives such clear advice? Here's a couple examples. Here is some clear concise advice from the Bible on how to answer a fool: Proverbs 26:4 Answer not a fool according to his folly, lest thou also be like unto him. ... and while you are following that advice, don't forget to also follow this advice one sentence later: Proverbs 26:5 Answer a fool according to his folly, lest he be wise in his own conceit.
@@Chief-Solarize I don't care what's in the Bible. My post was to illustrate how contradictory it is. Tells you one thing and the next sentence tells you the exact opposite.
My wife just asked me, "What did you say yesterday about your plans for today ?" I said, "Can't you remember ? It was only yesterday !" "No, I can't remember !" She replied. When she gets around to writing my biography, she'll have to make up most of it.
When asked a question, this guy recites scripture, or anything else to avoid answering what is being asked. Repeat caller. Repeat failure. There's no way this guy has a savings account. He would be talked out of it in seconds.
@R B "There's no way this guy has a savings account. He would be talked out of it in seconds.," this is not true. Religious people don't use the same line of thinking that justifies their in faith, when they interact with people in society. They have more common sense in day to day dealings with other humans. Most people move the goal post and use mental gymnastics depending on the context they find themselves in. Also, personality plays a huge role on how people apply their belief systems. For example, naturally kind people love the "lovey dovey" passages of their holy books, and naturally angry people love the "fire and brimstone" passages of their holy books.
@@MicrophoneHell-ec3bm He didn't say "religious people". He said "this guy". "This guy" demonstrated his inability to follow logic. "This guy" was more or less reciting from a source, most likely his pastor. When people in general follow a certain pattern they tend to repeat it. So you would say it was an "educated guess" about a person, not the collective
@Pedro Chávez If you are going to play the knit-pick game, then the guy didn't demonstrate anything that could inform anybody who is listening about his banking ability. My point was; just because he behaves as he did arguing with Matt about religion, it doesn't mean that is how he behaves in other aspects of his life. Some of the richest people in the world are religious. I will even bet that religious people are richer than atheists.
Well, you are correct in that. The thing is that you jumped to say "not all" and the topic was "this guy". Your tone is confrontational. My guess is you had a knee-jerk reaction and asumed he was generalizing. The point was the guy looked gullible and the rest was hyperbole. Yes, the guy was unprepared and his failure was so curious that we can say he is the kind of guy who even copies the name in the exam when cheating (again, last part is an exaggeration, hopefully you got it now)
@THE PEOPLE SING Well. There is always the tie breaker: Fact-checking. Authority figures are only as good as their sources. You can have your ego as high as the moon as long as your facts are right and your methods are testable.
Regarding the caller's assertion that Mark 16:9-20 is always called out as being added, I am looking at a Gideons bible from a hotel room and there is no such annotation.
and because of these stories, and people's belief in these fictional stories, so many people have lost their lives. PLEASE, religious people, stop pushing these unreasonable ideas.
Daniel Hurley Well, you haven’t read the Bible then. God is a very human-like violent entity. He demanded every heinous act from his followers. And, committed such acts. It has human emotions, very violent ones. Religion on the other hand, just takes the violence of god as permission to act in the same way in his name.
@Daniel Hurley But you are missing the point of the video. It has nothing to so with any of that. The point is how do we know that any of that is true? How do we know if god is real? That's all that matters really.
@Daniel Hurley People were able to get away with those rationalizations because belief in the Christian god is irrational and contradictory because the Bible is irrational and contradictory. It is also deeply immoral as Sherri quite rightly pointed out. If you can't see that then maybe YOU are the one who needs to improve their Biblical literacy. The sooner humanity abandons the idea of religion as a valid worldview the better. It certainly isn't making you a very nice person.
@@Jarumo76 "Judas, let me ask you a question. When you came pulling in here, did you notice a sign out in front of my house that said "Dead Messiah Storage"?" "Mark, you know I ain't seen no..." "Did you notice a sign out in front of my house that said "Dead Messiah Storage"?" "No, I didn't." "You know _why_ you didn't see that sign?" "Why?" "'Cause it ain't there, 'cause storing dead messiahs ain't my fucking business, that's why!"
that is the crux of the problem with religion, and Christianity in particular. No matter what facts exist, there is no amount of twisting they are not willing to do to keep their stone age beliefs.
Have you not been playing attention ? You throw your misconceptions to God then let him sort it out ! Obviously you did not drink your share of holy water..... it has not sunk in yet !!! 🤣
In science, a good hypothesis or theory has to be the simplest natural explanation that requires the fewest assumptions. Which is more likely, Andrew: A) Jesus accurately and correctly predicted the destruction of Jerusalem in 70 C.E. or B) The book of Matthew was written after 70 C.E. to make it look like Jesus made an amazing prediction?
Or C. The origin of the god concept is the human mind, thus invalidating all religion, religious ideology, spirituality, and metaphysics. This is the simplest natural explanation and certainly more plausible and more probable than any version that "god did it".
Imagine a Fortune 500 company that had a very confusing employee handbooks, yet the CEO just let those contradictions and errors stand and never made any corrections.
Nothing scrambles a brain better than the malware of religion. "Why'd you choose such a backward time in such a strange land? If you'd come today you could have reached a whole nation Israel in 4 BC had no mass communication" -Jesus Christ Superstar
Lower crime rates, raise education rates, help the homeless, encourage people to live happy/healthy/moral lives. Contribute to scientific advancement. push for fair and equitable laws that protect all people equally. Basically built all of modern civilization and all the luxuries you enjoy. You're welcome.
My apologies for not being clearer about my premises. “Religion is a system of wishful illusions together with a disavowal of reality, such as we find nowhere else but in a state of blissful hallucinatory confusion. Religion's eleventh commandment is "Thou shalt not question.” ― Sigmund Freud, The Future of an Illusion Religion is a pathological socially sanctioned mental disorder (not mental illness) that falls on a spectrum of benign, insignificant delusions like God finding one's keys, to profound psychopathologies that drove people to kill their children because God told them to. Religion involves three primary areas of the brain associated with the prefrontal cortex: The Anterior Cingulate Cortex (ACC) , the Hypothalamic Pituitary Adrenal Axis (HPAA) and the Nucleas Accumbens (NAC). These areas are also associated with major depressive disorder, schizophrenia, delusions and hallucinations of external agencies. Double blind fMRI studies revealed that people with the mental illnesses above present with hyperactivity in the ACC, HPAA and NAC. Multiple fMRI studies were performed in combination with interviews to assess religiosity against control groups who identified as non-religious. It was discovered that mentally stable individuals with higher executive function had HYPOactivite ACC, HPAA and NACs, whereas those who presented with more devout faith had HYPERactive ACC, HPAA and NACs. Thus we see a neurological correlation across two psychopathologies. The people who identified as devoutly faithful had poorer executive function due to the HPAA's influence on the Amygdala which regulates blood flow to the frontal cortex where higher reasoning is found. A hyperactive HPAA causes the amygdala to diminish blood flow to the frontal cortex, thus diminishing executive functioning, metaconsciousness and higher reasoning. That's just the tip of the iceberg, I haven't touched on the dopaminergic axis in the NAC that causes the rewards center of the brain to become addicted. Analagously, Philosophy is the operating system of the human mind, whereas religion is the malware.
@THE PEOPLE SING I donated money to 7 different charities, did two decades of volunteer service, tutored people in college without charge, never raised my hand to anyone, helped a community college to stay open, donated food to homeless people, rescued stray animals...shall I go on? You should expand your circle of friends.
Andrew: Christianity is true because it spread quickly to Rome. Me: Islam is currently spreading like wildfire across the planet. Does this mean Islam is true?
Just saying that makes it looks like many people are converting to islam, I'm not sure that's the case. Probably it's just about population growt and the fact that zones of the planet where they are already muslims have a bigger population growt comparing to others.
No, it was not meant to reflect conversion, although that is happening as well. However, conversion rates are irrelevant to Islam being the fastest growing religion in the world.
@@ChristianIce That pretty much covers it. Muslims are having children at a far greater rate than Christians these days. Unfortunately, due to this practice, Islam is predicted to overtake Christianity as the largest religion by 2030. Thankfully, due in large part to the internet, secularism is also growing at a phenomenal rate.
GOD doesn't get smaller matey...you're just so busy looking at the technology you just don't realize how big GOD has become .....I just see technology as a tool....that's what it is. Keep well and safe in these eird times. Gilly wife of Mark
@@dx1450 ...You're obviously not tied down with religious superstition...so how far have you got then?? Time is running out...keep well in these troubled and prophetic times. Gilly wife of Mark
I actually do know a pastor who told people to rip out the pages containing the additional ending and he was basically thrown to the lions. People get bent out of shape when you mess with their traditions. I knew another pastor that literally got cussed out and lost members when he decided stop wearing robes for the service. Because robes have magic powers apparently.
~ I got lost in Twinsburg once and thank goodness found my way back to Cleveland. Andrew, however, still sounds so still lost. In Twinsburg. Cheers, DAVEDJ ~
I love having this on in the background while I’m at work. Just the shutdown of people who aren’t making any sense gives me hope and energy for the day 😂
I really liked this particular segment. Both sides had an encyclopedic knowledge of the Bible (I hope that’s not too hyperbolic) and discussed the nuances really well. But seriously, the more I hear about the nuances of biblical history (even from the most influential apologists), the crazier it seems.
Never understood how an endless, all powerful creator/destroyer, that is simultaneously everywhere - is so careless when it comes to the closest thing we have to his book.
U.S. citizens - when is your next census? I can't wait for my next one because up until now I was lazily writing Church of England, when I should have been putting Atheist all these years.
Also, a lot of people don't put atheist because they get confused by those bastardizing the term on the news. A lot of people don't even realize that atheist and agnostic are basically the same thing, it's just the news doesn't tend to make fun of those saying "I'm not sure if God exists" and they just want to get the clicks from the more extreme "God is bullsh*t". Most people don't realize that most atheists are technically agnostic atheists as though that is kinda buttering the turd they gave us as they want to ridicule the term atheist. Gotta love the news.
@Daniel Hurley What leads you to believe that? Surely you have a good reason to believe God exists? Also, why does every church seem to hate each other? I was raised Catholic and everyone hated us yet we didn't say anything about anyone else. Granted, the Catholics think the wine turns to the actual blood of Christ while still tasting and looking like wine, but still.
@Daniel Hurley what do you mean the message gets through every time? Half the divisions of the Bible are built around what it should and shouldn't say and how we should follow it. The Batists think the book is infallible, the Mormons rewrote it by staring in a hat with a rock (yeah, let's not talk about them), and the Catholics just say it's all moral stories except Jesus who is apparently real. If this is the word of God he failed to tell us what is his actual word and what are words of man. He has also failed to interject when we assume differently. If God really wants everyone in heaven, than why doesn't he bother and correct us? That means he is either benevolent but malevolent, not benevolent, benevolent but indifferent, or just not there. The Catholics think the priest turns wine to blood while still looking and tasting like wine for f*cks sakes! I have still yet to find a compelling reason to believe anything the Bible says. Why should I trust the Bible, how do I know the Bible wasn't made up, if Jesus was real why is there nothing left of him (no documents beyond the Bible, no statues, paintings, the cross, the grail, etc), and why shouldn't I trust another holy book instead? I mean, Jesus doesn't even fit the actual descriptions of the messiah in the Old Testament. The most obvious one is were it says "his name will be Emanuel", obviously not Jesus. Also, only Paul says the story of his birth was from a virgin, the other scriptures seem to absolutely ignore that even though Paul is the one author who says he is just compiling stories of Jesus, Jesus was supposedly long dead before Paul even wrote a single word. At least the Quran doesn't make nearly as rediculous claims as the Bible does, why should I not believe that is the real holy book? You must have a "good" reason to believe that the Bible is correct. Also, have you actually read the Bible? It makes some absolutely bonkers claims. Like the story you can make striped cows by having them mate next to a pile of sticks, immediately after getting the first set of commandments which Moses smashes he tells everyone to kill their 4th and 5th relatives which they apparently do, the 4th commandment is to offer your first son as a blood sacrafice on the alter (that's the real 10 commandments, the prior set doesn't have that title and has 26 commandments), it says women don't have the right to teach or preach to men, it says you can abort a child if your wife committed adultery by having the priest make a potion, in Revelations it says there are spholy spirits that surround God in Heaven, in the same story it mentions a Rainbow that sits over God that shines emerald (it's not a rainbow if it is specifically green), it says the world is flat with a dome on top to hold out the waters of space with slits that open to let in the rain, etc. Why should I trust anything this book says if it gets so much demonstrably wrong? Why should I even trust we have a soul if brain damage can drastically change a person's personality, what the hell is a soul supposed to do. The book gives no good reasons to believe this crap than "just trust me, this book is ordained by God". Even out of body experiences have been found to be bull. Back in 2007 they made a helmet that made people feel they had f*cking left their bodies and met God. There is also the recurring test that they placed a paper with a number on top of cabinet where they ask the patient to say what number was it after having an out of body experience, none have got it right so far. We have even done extensive tests to see if praying can actually help people get better and the results have continued to be no better than shear chance and sometimes worse as it puts pressure on the one being prayed to to hope it works. Why is there so much evidence that the Bible is wrong and basically nothing to support it? You'd think God would have at least left us crumbs to see, but nope. And do you really think God is instilled within your being? Do you really think you would have come up with the concept of God if you weren't told about him from a young age? What leads you to believe the God you worship is the real God? How do you know you even understand God's commands (like that gags should be stoned or only one man and one woman may marry)? Why is the Bible so vague on what it claims is truth?
@Daniel Hurley wow... That is one long paragraph. Skylancer already picked apart most of your comments so I'll be brief. Did you actually conflate atheism to pedophilia? The vast majority of pedophiles have some sort of religious beliefs. Most Holy books have pedophilia in them. That includes your disgusting bible. That is all.
For me, Matt is simply a genius. In 17:55, the guy asks him: "So what evidence would you be looking for?" Matt answers: "I don't know". For me, this summarizes the genius of Matt. The guy is desperately trying to defend some things (about christian doctrine) that don't make sense. Rebuttal after rebuttal, he realizes that all his arguments are questionable. He himself is not sure of anything: who wrote the gospels (Marc and Matthew)? How do you know? What gospel was written before which one? etc. Everything the guy says is pure speculation. He is not sure about anything because he doesn't have any proof about his claims. Then he thinks it is Matt who should define what evidence is valid. How desperate are christians?
Man, I think this guy is just on the spectrum and can't get the point that it doesn't matter if any of this shit is true or false unless you can prove the existence of a god.
This caller seems incapable of responding to another person's words. They're a walking non-sequitur. Matt: "How do you know this actually happened?" Caller: "I personally believe the last supper was at Mark's house."
2:25 When I was a Messianic believer, I've heard of these added verses on the messianic "Torah lesson" and when we studied this chapter in a small group, I've mentioned it. It wasn't accepted very well by my group. They responded, "Well I don't see why it shouldn't be three. It's the obvious truth!". And the others added "Amen".
While Matt could obviously carry the show himself I like that they have Don and John to put an everyman's perspective on things, bring a bit of humour and balance Matt's intensity. Props to them
Just about finished reading Richard Carrier's 'Jesus From Outer Space'. Terrific work by Carrier. I lean to Carrier's position on the existence of an historical Jesus over the views espoused by Bart Ehrman. And... I've never been to Mark's house.
Confirmation biases and fallacies. I guess that's what you get when you're so invested in your own position that you can't dare, even for a moment, allow yourself to question your own beliefs.
I was brought up as a Christian, not very strongly more tradition than faith. I've looked at Christianity often over the years, read about it, thought about it, debated about it. I still am an interested student. One consistent thing in those years was that while church goers often treat the Bible very seriously most scholars as opposed to preachers treat it as a very dubious source. Few churches have treated the Bible as inerrant, and the Catholic church was very concerned about the laity seeing it because they knew it would lead to confusion. The scriptures were never seen by the early church as being that important, as few Christians were literate. When did the Bible achieve this semi divine nature?
Don and Matt are a great team. Callers can be confusing; their beliefs can be hard to understand, but in this episode Don and Matt dissected the callers comments and, as usual, by-passed the bullshit and got to the core of the issue and that, my friends, is where truth lies.
These videos fascinate me simply because this close biblical study -- which I did as a part of church leadership training -- is exactly what started me down the path to leave Christianity. The irony was that the information is out there for folks that are headed into leadership but not taught to the masses -- especially things like textual criticism
I'll bet Andrew put a great deal of effort in memorizing "Methodological Naturalist"! And couldn't wait to find just the right place to insert his Buzzwords Fizz! Whoooey we got's us an intellectual here'im.
What an upstanding and courageous citizen Andrew must be to go to the witness protection program- as he recently called as Rick-CA in the vid "Biblical Genocide the same as defending home"
To any God, next time you want to do a written down "revelation to all humans", use the Moon as canvas: it can be seen from every place on Earth, and is harder to tamper with than man-made manuscripts. Oh, and carve it using black ink for literal meaning and red for allegories and metaphors. That can spare a lot of souls! You are welcome!
If you compare the writing styles of the gospels with a biography of Abraham Lincoln and The Jewels of Opar (A novel) you will notice that they are more like the latter than the former. Events occur that could not have been witnessed by anyone, yet are described in detail. Only novels can accurately describe a person's feelings, for example, because they are imagined.
When I think of the time and energy that so many committed Christians invest in their pursuit of a closer relationship with their god/s, I can't help but feel a little sad, at least. The desire to find evidence is understandable, despite the glaring fact that one critical element of religious faith is to believe without evidence. I suppose, in that context, it's only natural that their search for evidence pushes them further away from the very simple circular flaw: we know god exists because the book says so and god wrote the book so we know god exists because the book says so and god wrote the book so we know god exists because the book says so and god wrote the book so we know god exists because the book says so and god wrote the book so we know god exists because the book says so...
8:47 "what god wants our role to be.." I thought our role is to give the church 10% of what we earn. I believe in God, I just don't trust anyone who works for him. ~Author unknown, from a stand-up comedy routine on television
so "A Study in Scarlet" is a true story, but "The Hounds of Baskerville" is complete nonsense ... and Sherlock Holmes must exist because he's in both of them ... wowsers ...
Lol. As an aside speaking as someone who lives not far from the place where "The Hounds of Baskerville" is set I can confirm this story is confirm that there is a number of aspects in this story that fail to conform to reality from places and names, down to the very geography of the location its set in. Its almost as if Doyle heard stores from different sources most of which may not have been true about a location or person and then made a story based on that collection of myths... Like how most of the bible was written....
Deuteronomy 4:2 New American Standard Bible (NASB) (Originally the Torah) 2 You shall not add to the word which I am commanding you, nor take away from it, that you may keep the commandments of the Lord your God which I command you. The adding of the Gospels (New Testament) is in violation of this scripture.
I was a Christian for 8 years! I walked away about a month ago. I tried justifying it for years. I’ve read dozens of apologists including the most revered. At the end of the day, I simply can’t believe anymore. There is insufficient evidence for the claims of Christianity.
👏🏾👏🏾👏🏾
Congratulations 👏👏👏
Oh yeah? Well I was a Christian for TWENTY years bucko 😤 high score for wasted time belongs to ME in this comment thread lmfao
@@MNMNMNMNMNMNMNMNMNMNMNMNMNMN nah bro I was a Christian for 31yrs before I gave up on it
@@13bellhop man I can't have SHIT around here lmao
You know something that Hitch said always sticks in my mind.
"What's more likely, a virgin had a baby or a teenage girl lied?"
Actually he said "... or that a Jewish minks lied."
One of Hitchen's great one-liners. But even that's not really relevant, since there's no evidence Mary claimed a virgin birth at all, or that anyone during Jesus' lifetime, including Jesus, made any claim about a virgin birth. The nativity story appears much later and is pretty clearly based on, or at least influenced by, the contemporary myths/stories about several different gods/semi divine beings which were known throughout the Roman empire at that time, eg Mithras, Horus.
Well Hitch didn't say that line he was quoting someone else...but I say it all the time
@@sherpacool9931 Correct, he was quoting David Hume I believe. The original is admittedly bigoted because Hume says "Jewish mink" where Hitch says "teenage girl," so yet another instances of Hitch's hatred of anti-Semitism.
@Homer Jay Why did I type mink? My apologies.
I've watched a lot of these, and this episode is like a college-level class on why Christianity warrants zero claims for belief. Those who do so are clearly doing it for bad reasons. Religion is indeed a poison that we need to outgrow.
Agree 100%
100%
Having binged AXP videos and others it is clear that Christianity - in Andrew's case here - is a putrid brain rot on the spectrum of mental illness.
Unfortunately, one needs to draw the poison from the wound, which is where I think that’s the problem; this poison in particular is fucking deep, and has been there a long time, and there are A LOT of folks who unfortunately lack critical thinking, and just go about their merry lives believing in the holy Flying Spaghetti Monster.🫠
Amen!
"there are 27 books" - Andrew.
"There are 800 issues of Spider-Man" - Crip Dyke
*AND* New York _exists_ therefore that proves Spider-Man is real!
The thing is those books were not written as fiction but as histroical documents:
1 Many have undertaken to draw up an account of the things that have been fulfilled[a] among us, 2 just as they were handed down to us by those who from the first were eyewitnesses and servants of the word. 3 With this in mind, since I myself have carefully investigated everything from the beginning, I too decided to write an orderly account for you, most excellent Theophilus, 4 so that you may know the certainty of the things you have been taught
The author of luke is claiming that he is writing down things that have been fulfilled
@@ellasmith6554 "I couldn't believe it was happening, but it was" -- Peter Parker
You're really not appreciating what's happening here. I'm not originating these arguments. I'm pointing out the absurdity of them. Obviously not even you believe that more books = more true. Nancy Drew would be one of history's best attested figures if all that mattered were the number of separate books.
And even you seem to agree, since you don't immediately endorse that 800 separate books attesting to Spider-Man makes Spider-Man real. You don't believe that more books = more true, so my argument, so far as you are concerned is correct. Given that, you should agree that Andrew should not have made such a silly argument.
Likewise Shakespeare's plays, Ovid's tales, Norse sagas, and Greek epics all include statements similar to Luke's that they're really telling the really, really real facts for realzies.
Now, the fact that Luke's language is mirrored in works of fiction doesn't prove that Luke was writing a work of fiction, but that mirroring means you can't use "it really happened" language in the middle of a work to prove that work true.
So neither you nor Andrew are making persuasive arguments, and because I respect you and Andrew, I expect better. That's why I don't belittle you, but do point out that your arguments are absurd and that not even you believe every work that includes "it really happened!" in the text.
If you want me to believe that the author of Luke was writing an historically accurate account, you're going to have to come up with something completely different from "there were a lot of books" or "the book itself said the book is true".
@@ellasmith6554 and we have no idea who that author was....
What a name. 😂
if the speed of something spreading determines how true it is, internet memes are the highest form of truth
...I can accept this
I'm unapologetically stealing this line.
"Don't believe everything you read on the internet." -Abraham Lincoln
Lol!
Praise Kek!
@Daniel Hurley The Bible definitely does not stand on it's own. Have you ever read the Old Testament?
The dude was so zoomed in on the pixels of his argument that he couldn't
stand back and realize his picture was out of focus.
Charles Dahmital his camera was on selfie mode
I like the way you put that.
very well said
I appreciate that Matt was willing to chase the believer down his various tunnels. Thanks, Matt!
GOD wrote a number of books , that number is zero , CHRISTOPHER HITCHENS
Put it on a tee-shirt!
Dear god:
Why not use global telepathy instead of contacting Prophets in the Sinai Desert to write your instructions in a foreign language?
Hello...? Hello...? Is anyone there?
Well... at least he cranked out a large number of manuscripts.
Which he can't prove.
"There are an infinite number of numbers between Zero and One, and none of them are Two."
Not really sure how this applies, but it was something cool I read a long time ago.
I feel bad for Andrew because I was Andrew. He’s a fairly intelligent person and he KNOWS there’s no evidence for what he’s saying. But he simply HAS to believe it. It’s part of his identity and losing it feels like losing an arm. I been through it. I was sad and angry when I started coming to this realization that what I was reading was bullshit. But it all gets better in time
Well said!
Andrew gets the "Missed the Point Repeatedly" award.
Matt has Jedi level bible knowledge.
According to Pew research, Atheists and Jews have the highest degree of understanding of Theist text. Besides Matt and the ACA need to understand their adversary so it would be a pre-requirement for their task. Callers also don't get 20+ years of call-in experience to develop their skills.
@@anfo_4241 They ought to be savvy enough to argue their position though.
If you can't argue your position thoroughly, you don't understand your position.
@@anfo_4241 it's not a requirement, he literally says this in another episode
@@anfo_4241 yeah, only about 3% of theists claim to actually read their holy book. That has to be the best selling yet least successful book in history.
I've taken to compiling some key verses in the back of my notebook (one of many I've accumulated) along with physics notes...
"It's hard to see red flags in rose colored glasses" -BoJack Horseman
@Late to the Game 1) If Jesus is only salvation, then God is unfair, because Americas, South Africa, Far East, North Europe, Oceania were kept in dark, never heard about Jesus for 1500 years. 2) If people can be saved without Jesus, then Bible is unnecessary. 3) If Bible is necessary to make people better beings and increase their chance of heaven, then God is again unfair for providing such book to some and not to others.
@@goranmilic442 1) God as the omniscient LORD has ordained the world in such a way that salvation is achievable for all. [Acts 17:27]. Those who have never heard of Christ will be judged based on what they DO know and not what they DO NOT know, responsible for the amount of universal light and grace given to ALL human beings by their conscience and the world around them But, the common thing is that everyone is saved THROUGH Christ, Christ enables the savings. 2) They cannot. 3) Bible is centered around fishing people to God's kingdom through his infinitely valuable but free gift in Christ Jesus.
@@SerendipitousProvidence I accept your first and second answer, but you didn't really answer directly to my third claim. My question is - is Bible necessary for saving people? For example, we have remote island with 1000 inhabitants. Nobody heard about Jesus. Let's say God will judge them justly, by whatever standard he chooses, and 400 of them will be saved. Now, if somebody comes to that island and spreads gospel, will the number of people saved stay at 400 or increase? If it stays at 400, Bible and gospel are useless. If the number increases, if Bible saves additional people and turns them to Christ, then God is unfair for not providing such book to everybody, for keeping 75% of the world in the dark for 1500 years.
@@goranmilic442 God might've ordained it as such that those who never heard the gospel wouldn't have believed it anyway. [ omniscience ]. What I presented is just one view. Consider another argument as well :
i> God has granted universal grace and light [Romans 1:20]
ii> Men is responsible to make a choice to seek God with universal grace and light
iii> Deuteronomy 4:29 declares that anyone who truly desires to know God, God will make Himself known. [ Refer to Cornelius who didn't know Jesus Christ but yet believed in Abrahamic God. ]
iv> Your question assumes that there are people who haven't heard of Christ but refer to John 12:32 and John 6:44. Every Christian was drawn by Father to Christ and Christ also draws "all men" to Him.
@@goranmilic442 As for your thought experiment, I believe the exclusivity of the first scenario is impossible if Jesus has been lifted up at the time, because none of them will not NOT hear of Christ. If Christ = lifted up then every one saved = heard of Christ. You can't get saved without believing in Christ at a certain time in history is my belief. If Christ = not incarnated or lifted up, judged through their response to God's innate imprint of his existence. If he hadn't been then they will already be believing in Abrahamic God and justified through Christ. Bible doesn't save people, Christ does. Bible is a way for God to reach out his salvational message and expanded instructions. Also hypothesis don't have truth value, we remember things as they are.
Another excellent video of course. During my own deconversion my atheist sons directed me to this very channel to listen to Matt. I could listen to this man for hours, he is just that good.
Same although it was my atheist daughter
i was awed by what Matt was saying when i was still a catholic. i think i became an atheist within hours of listening to him.
Andrew here, from Twinsburg OH, has called in MULTIPLE times to both the Atheist Experience and Talk Heathen and has been caught out publicly EACH time failing to argue honestly lol and he must enjoy this particular notoriety because he's clearly a glutton for punishment just from Matt alone! 😂
Dude doesn't know WHEN to quit!
Which would be admirable, under any other circumstances, but instead of trying new arguments he likes to try resurrecting his SAME ones over and over again no matter HOW many times it's stomped into the mud.
There is nothing better than hearing Matt logic smack someone. I'd love to meet you one day and shake your hand. I tip my fedora to you and the whole atheist experience crew for your contributions to the atheist and theist.
Andrew, ladies and gentlemen, is a demonstration of a mind pickled by religion.
So by this guy’s way of thinking that would make Egyptian mythology true because it was around way before any of the Bible’s works were written. Lol
Even worse as there are names of actual rulers and priests of ancient Egypt in those myths!
Religious text is made true by including the magical incantation: "this book is true"
Daniel Hurley
If,according to you, persistence is the measure of falsehood, then how can any honest person persist when faced with long-winded dishonesty? Matt and Don ask pertinent questions and counter dishonest arguments with evidence and rationality. The rest of your argument wasn’t clear imho so that is all I have to say.
Daniel Hurley
Wow. Your fingers must hurt from typing. To follow up on your basketball analogy, I would recommend dribbling the ball less and just try to take one high percentage shot. As he has said to his callers numerous times, Matt conscientiously went searching for the evidence that his religious beliefs were true and came back empty. One doesn’t get to say that atheists are just upset because they couldn’t find the truth. Matt usually starts with “what is it you believe and why, and why would anyone else believe it?”. If you have a coherent argument limited to 60-70! words I will entertain you, otherwise I’m out. Good day.
Most religions are older than Christianity. So why do they not go back and look into where their religion started from? And then look back to were Judaism came form, etc., and they will soon come to learn that Christianity's roots are not legitimate. They have been spun out of a culmination of several past religions. They just won't go into the theology of their own religion to find out the truth. That's called willful ignorance. Many ppl that have, and are currently, studying to be priests,etc., actually loss their religion once they find out the truth in the texts and what they do and do not say, and where they come from. They tend to find a different truth than they expected. That, to me, is very telling. Cheers.
This caller is the living embodiment of a non-sequitor.
Yes. With each rebuttal, he spews a random biblical “factoid,” if you will. It’s a tactic to divert attention from the rebuttal, but also to keep HIMSELF convinced of his delusion. It’s really sad to witness
It kills me when they use quotes from the questionable book to try to prove the validity of the questionable book.
It goes totally over anyone's head that treats the Bible as a literal book.
It demonstrates a rejection of the real world for an illusion built on ancient Hebrew writing.
Good luck with that.
How can someone reject the Bible when it gives such clear advice? Here's a couple examples.
Here is some clear concise advice from the Bible on how to answer a fool:
Proverbs 26:4 Answer not a fool according to his folly, lest thou also be like unto him.
... and while you are following that advice, don't forget to also follow this advice one sentence later:
Proverbs 26:5 Answer a fool according to his folly, lest he be wise in his own conceit.
@@cnault3244 you can't appeal to a mystery to explain a mystery. It's not logical. Why should anyone care what's in the Bible?
@@Chief-Solarize I don't care what's in the Bible. My post was to illustrate how contradictory it is. Tells you one thing and the next sentence tells you the exact opposite.
My wife just asked me, "What did you say yesterday about your plans for today ?"
I said, "Can't you remember ? It was only yesterday !" "No, I can't remember !" She replied.
When she gets around to writing my biography, she'll have to make up most of it.
This is one of the best calls ever. Matt keeps his cool. The caller actually concedes points. It's a great conversation. I'm only at 16:40 btw.
When asked a question, this guy recites scripture, or anything else to avoid answering what is being asked. Repeat caller. Repeat failure. There's no way this guy has a savings account. He would be talked out of it in seconds.
@R B
"There's no way this guy has a savings account. He would be talked out of it in seconds.," this is not true.
Religious people don't use the same line of thinking that justifies their in faith, when they interact with people in society.
They have more common sense in day to day dealings with other humans. Most people move the goal post and use mental gymnastics depending on the context they find themselves in.
Also, personality plays a huge role on how people apply their belief systems. For example, naturally kind people love the "lovey dovey" passages of their holy books, and naturally angry people love the "fire and brimstone" passages of their holy books.
@@MicrophoneHell-ec3bm
He didn't say "religious people". He said "this guy". "This guy" demonstrated his inability to follow logic. "This guy" was more or less reciting from a source, most likely his pastor. When people in general follow a certain pattern they tend to repeat it. So you would say it was an "educated guess" about a person, not the collective
@Pedro Chávez
If you are going to play the knit-pick game, then the guy didn't demonstrate anything that could inform anybody who is listening about his banking ability.
My point was; just because he behaves as he did arguing with Matt about religion, it doesn't mean that is how he behaves in other aspects of his life.
Some of the richest people in the world are religious. I will even bet that religious people are richer than atheists.
Well, you are correct in that. The thing is that you jumped to say "not all" and the topic was "this guy". Your tone is confrontational. My guess is you had a knee-jerk reaction and asumed he was generalizing. The point was the guy looked gullible and the rest was hyperbole. Yes, the guy was unprepared and his failure was so curious that we can say he is the kind of guy who even copies the name in the exam when cheating (again, last part is an exaggeration, hopefully you got it now)
@THE PEOPLE SING
Well. There is always the tie breaker: Fact-checking. Authority figures are only as good as their sources. You can have your ego as high as the moon as long as your facts are right and your methods are testable.
q: so how do you know that superman lived in an orphanage?
a: it says so in the earliest text, action comics #1, and was confirmed in superman #1!
Regarding the caller's assertion that Mark 16:9-20 is always called out as being added, I am looking at a Gideons bible from a hotel room and there is no such annotation.
What do they mean by added? I've never read the bible. Who do they think added it and when? Are they saying that the added may not be the word of God?
and because of these stories, and people's belief in these fictional stories, so many people have lost their lives. PLEASE, religious people, stop pushing these unreasonable ideas.
Daniel Hurley Well, you haven’t read the Bible then. God is a very human-like violent entity. He demanded every heinous act from his followers. And, committed such acts. It has human emotions, very violent ones.
Religion on the other hand, just takes the violence of god as permission to act in the same way in his name.
@Daniel Hurley But you are missing the point of the video. It has nothing to so with any of that. The point is how do we know that any of that is true? How do we know if god is real? That's all that matters really.
@Daniel Hurley People were able to get away with those rationalizations because belief in the Christian god is irrational and contradictory because the Bible is irrational and contradictory. It is also deeply immoral as Sherri quite rightly pointed out. If you can't see that then maybe YOU are the one who needs to improve their Biblical literacy. The sooner humanity abandons the idea of religion as a valid worldview the better. It certainly isn't making you a very nice person.
Bästa Karen, religioner är MILJARD- BUSINESS ! ......................
Daniel Hurley your delusional conspiracy theories about “the left” don’t really speak to whether or not the bible is reliable or true. It’s neither.
_Whoever wrote mark inserts himself in there and the last supper happened at his house..._ Sounds very _Tarantino_ of him...
You dont have to tell me how good my wine is, im the one who buys it
"When Judas goes shopping, he buys SHIT. I buy the gourmet expensive stuff because when I drink it I want to taste it."
Was time travel involved? Look for signs of a Delorean or a tardis. Or a starship.
@@Jarumo76
"Judas, let me ask you a question. When you came pulling in here, did you notice a sign out in front of my house that said "Dead Messiah Storage"?"
"Mark, you know I ain't seen no..."
"Did you notice a sign out in front of my house that said "Dead Messiah Storage"?"
"No, I didn't."
"You know _why_ you didn't see that sign?"
"Why?"
"'Cause it ain't there, 'cause storing dead messiahs ain't my fucking business, that's why!"
Mental gymnastics 1o1
How to make anything fit ur preconceptions
that is the crux of the problem with religion, and Christianity in particular. No matter what facts exist, there is no amount of twisting they are not willing to do to keep their stone age beliefs.
Phil Kallahar my mother doesn’t bother with gymnastics, it’s faith; faith is the answer to all. 😑
Have you not been playing attention ? You throw your misconceptions to God then let him sort it out ! Obviously you did not
drink your share of holy water..... it has not sunk in yet !!! 🤣
Matt on a roll is an absolute delight to watch.
Truly brilliant discussion. Well done Matt
I slowed down my consumption of dialogue between atheism and religion for about 4months
Matt seems even more polished as a debater than ever.
In science, a good hypothesis or theory has to be the simplest natural explanation that requires the fewest assumptions. Which is more likely, Andrew: A) Jesus accurately and correctly predicted the destruction of Jerusalem in 70 C.E. or B) The book of Matthew was written after 70 C.E. to make it look like Jesus made an amazing prediction?
Or C. The origin of the god concept is the human mind, thus invalidating all religion, religious ideology, spirituality, and metaphysics. This is the simplest natural explanation and certainly more plausible and more probable than any version that "god did it".
Imagine a Fortune 500 company that had a very confusing employee handbooks, yet the CEO just let those contradictions and errors stand and never made any corrections.
Nothing scrambles a brain better than the malware of religion.
"Why'd you choose such a backward time in such a strange land?
If you'd come today you could have reached a whole nation
Israel in 4 BC had no mass communication"
-Jesus Christ Superstar
I'd be suspicious of any religion than takes 15 centuries to reach your continent with a business card full of diseases, powder, and steel.
Lower crime rates, raise education rates, help the homeless, encourage people to live happy/healthy/moral lives. Contribute to scientific advancement. push for fair and equitable laws that protect all people equally. Basically built all of modern civilization and all the luxuries you enjoy. You're welcome.
My apologies for not being clearer about my premises.
“Religion is a system of wishful illusions together with a disavowal of reality, such as we find nowhere else but in a state of blissful hallucinatory confusion. Religion's eleventh commandment is "Thou shalt not question.”
― Sigmund Freud, The Future of an Illusion
Religion is a pathological socially sanctioned mental disorder (not mental illness) that falls on a spectrum of benign, insignificant delusions like God finding one's keys, to profound psychopathologies that drove people to kill their children because God told them to.
Religion involves three primary areas of the brain associated with the prefrontal cortex: The Anterior Cingulate Cortex (ACC) , the Hypothalamic Pituitary Adrenal Axis (HPAA) and the Nucleas Accumbens (NAC). These areas are also associated with major depressive disorder, schizophrenia, delusions and hallucinations of external agencies.
Double blind fMRI studies revealed that people with the mental illnesses above present with hyperactivity in the ACC, HPAA and NAC.
Multiple fMRI studies were performed in combination with interviews to assess religiosity against control groups who identified as non-religious. It was discovered that mentally stable individuals with higher executive function had HYPOactivite ACC, HPAA and NACs, whereas those who presented with more devout faith had HYPERactive ACC, HPAA and NACs. Thus we see a neurological correlation across two psychopathologies. The people who identified as devoutly faithful had poorer executive function due to the HPAA's influence on the Amygdala which regulates blood flow to the frontal cortex where higher reasoning is found. A hyperactive HPAA causes the amygdala to diminish blood flow to the frontal cortex, thus diminishing executive functioning, metaconsciousness and higher reasoning.
That's just the tip of the iceberg, I haven't touched on the dopaminergic axis in the NAC that causes the rewards center of the brain to become addicted.
Analagously, Philosophy is the operating system of the human mind, whereas religion is the malware.
@THE PEOPLE SING I donated money to 7 different charities, did two decades of volunteer service, tutored people in college without charge, never raised my hand to anyone, helped a community college to stay open, donated food to homeless people, rescued stray animals...shall I go on? You should expand your circle of friends.
@@samanthajayewardene4523 Good on you. My dog is a shelter pup, too 😁
23:35: "You're reading a tabloid holy book" PRICELESS!!!!!!!
Wow...the bible is a big tabloid magazine , but with no pics..i absolutely love it..never thought about it that way..
And almost all religions are just big glorified book clubs.
Andrew: Christianity is true because it spread quickly to Rome.
Me: Islam is currently spreading like wildfire across the planet. Does this mean Islam is true?
Just saying that makes it looks like many people are converting to islam, I'm not sure that's the case.
Probably it's just about population growt and the fact that zones of the planet where they are already muslims have a bigger population growt comparing to others.
No, it was not meant to reflect conversion, although that is happening as well. However, conversion rates are irrelevant to Islam being the fastest growing religion in the world.
@@ChristianIce That pretty much covers it. Muslims are having children at a far greater rate than Christians these days. Unfortunately, due to this practice, Islam is predicted to overtake Christianity as the largest religion by 2030. Thankfully, due in large part to the internet, secularism is also growing at a phenomenal rate.
@Pichkalu Pappita True. That is where intelligence and logic reside.
Michael Dobson I would go as far as to say Islam has been around and grown just as much. It didn't just pop into popularity like Scientology
This is the most studious theist I've ever heard call into the show, hands down.
Isn't it interesting that as technology grows larger, gods miracles quickly grow smaller.
He's become the god of the gaps, and as those gaps close in he gets even smaller.
It's a miracle how humanity came so far when most humans are idiots. ;)
@@MaxxMcGeePrivate Just think how far we could go if we weren't tied down with religious superstition...
GOD doesn't get smaller matey...you're just so busy looking at the technology you just don't realize how big GOD has become .....I just see technology as a tool....that's what it is.
Keep well and safe in these eird times.
Gilly wife of Mark
@@dx1450 ...You're obviously not tied down with religious superstition...so how far have you got then??
Time is running out...keep well in these troubled and prophetic times.
Gilly wife of Mark
I actually do know a pastor who told people to rip out the pages containing the additional ending and he was basically thrown to the lions. People get bent out of shape when you mess with their traditions. I knew another pastor that literally got cussed out and lost members when he decided stop wearing robes for the service. Because robes have magic powers apparently.
~ I got lost in Twinsburg once and thank goodness found my way back to Cleveland. Andrew, however, still sounds so still lost. In Twinsburg. Cheers, DAVEDJ ~
“You’re reading a tabloid holy book!!!” I died!!
I love having this on in the background while I’m at work. Just the shutdown of people who aren’t making any sense gives me hope and energy for the day 😂
I really liked this particular segment. Both sides had an encyclopedic knowledge of the Bible (I hope that’s not too hyperbolic) and discussed the nuances really well. But seriously, the more I hear about the nuances of biblical history (even from the most influential apologists), the crazier it seems.
Never understood how an endless, all powerful creator/destroyer, that is simultaneously everywhere - is so careless when it comes to the closest thing we have to his book.
I remember when Al from Married With Children sweat out the image of Elvis on his sweatshirt. Now that is the Gospel Truth.
U.S. citizens - when is your next census? I can't wait for my next one because up until now I was lazily writing Church of England, when I should have been putting Atheist all these years.
Also, a lot of people don't put atheist because they get confused by those bastardizing the term on the news. A lot of people don't even realize that atheist and agnostic are basically the same thing, it's just the news doesn't tend to make fun of those saying "I'm not sure if God exists" and they just want to get the clicks from the more extreme "God is bullsh*t". Most people don't realize that most atheists are technically agnostic atheists as though that is kinda buttering the turd they gave us as they want to ridicule the term atheist. Gotta love the news.
@Daniel Hurley What leads you to believe that? Surely you have a good reason to believe God exists? Also, why does every church seem to hate each other? I was raised Catholic and everyone hated us yet we didn't say anything about anyone else. Granted, the Catholics think the wine turns to the actual blood of Christ while still tasting and looking like wine, but still.
@Daniel Hurley what do you mean the message gets through every time? Half the divisions of the Bible are built around what it should and shouldn't say and how we should follow it. The Batists think the book is infallible, the Mormons rewrote it by staring in a hat with a rock (yeah, let's not talk about them), and the Catholics just say it's all moral stories except Jesus who is apparently real. If this is the word of God he failed to tell us what is his actual word and what are words of man. He has also failed to interject when we assume differently. If God really wants everyone in heaven, than why doesn't he bother and correct us? That means he is either benevolent but malevolent, not benevolent, benevolent but indifferent, or just not there. The Catholics think the priest turns wine to blood while still looking and tasting like wine for f*cks sakes!
I have still yet to find a compelling reason to believe anything the Bible says. Why should I trust the Bible, how do I know the Bible wasn't made up, if Jesus was real why is there nothing left of him (no documents beyond the Bible, no statues, paintings, the cross, the grail, etc), and why shouldn't I trust another holy book instead? I mean, Jesus doesn't even fit the actual descriptions of the messiah in the Old Testament. The most obvious one is were it says "his name will be Emanuel", obviously not Jesus. Also, only Paul says the story of his birth was from a virgin, the other scriptures seem to absolutely ignore that even though Paul is the one author who says he is just compiling stories of Jesus, Jesus was supposedly long dead before Paul even wrote a single word. At least the Quran doesn't make nearly as rediculous claims as the Bible does, why should I not believe that is the real holy book? You must have a "good" reason to believe that the Bible is correct.
Also, have you actually read the Bible? It makes some absolutely bonkers claims. Like the story you can make striped cows by having them mate next to a pile of sticks, immediately after getting the first set of commandments which Moses smashes he tells everyone to kill their 4th and 5th relatives which they apparently do, the 4th commandment is to offer your first son as a blood sacrafice on the alter (that's the real 10 commandments, the prior set doesn't have that title and has 26 commandments), it says women don't have the right to teach or preach to men, it says you can abort a child if your wife committed adultery by having the priest make a potion, in Revelations it says there are spholy spirits that surround God in Heaven, in the same story it mentions a Rainbow that sits over God that shines emerald (it's not a rainbow if it is specifically green), it says the world is flat with a dome on top to hold out the waters of space with slits that open to let in the rain, etc. Why should I trust anything this book says if it gets so much demonstrably wrong? Why should I even trust we have a soul if brain damage can drastically change a person's personality, what the hell is a soul supposed to do. The book gives no good reasons to believe this crap than "just trust me, this book is ordained by God".
Even out of body experiences have been found to be bull. Back in 2007 they made a helmet that made people feel they had f*cking left their bodies and met God. There is also the recurring test that they placed a paper with a number on top of cabinet where they ask the patient to say what number was it after having an out of body experience, none have got it right so far. We have even done extensive tests to see if praying can actually help people get better and the results have continued to be no better than shear chance and sometimes worse as it puts pressure on the one being prayed to to hope it works. Why is there so much evidence that the Bible is wrong and basically nothing to support it? You'd think God would have at least left us crumbs to see, but nope.
And do you really think God is instilled within your being? Do you really think you would have come up with the concept of God if you weren't told about him from a young age? What leads you to believe the God you worship is the real God? How do you know you even understand God's commands (like that gags should be stoned or only one man and one woman may marry)? Why is the Bible so vague on what it claims is truth?
@Daniel Hurley wow... That is one long paragraph. Skylancer already picked apart most of your comments so I'll be brief.
Did you actually conflate atheism to pedophilia? The vast majority of pedophiles have some sort of religious beliefs. Most Holy books have pedophilia in them. That includes your disgusting bible.
That is all.
The message as to why the Test exists at ALL - did THAT get through? Clearly? or mangled by parable and idiom?
For me, Matt is simply a genius. In 17:55, the guy asks him: "So what evidence would you be looking for?" Matt answers: "I don't know". For me, this summarizes the genius of Matt. The guy is desperately trying to defend some things (about christian doctrine) that don't make sense. Rebuttal after rebuttal, he realizes that all his arguments are questionable. He himself is not sure of anything: who wrote the gospels (Marc and Matthew)? How do you know? What gospel was written before which one? etc. Everything the guy says is pure speculation. He is not sure about anything because he doesn't have any proof about his claims. Then he thinks it is Matt who should define what evidence is valid. How desperate are christians?
This guy is just rambling aimlessly, spewing out anything that comes into his head. His whole conversation is nonsensical.
Hey! Leave the moron alone.
@@JohnMorris-ge6hq lol
Man, I think this guy is just on the spectrum and can't get the point that it doesn't matter if any of this shit is true or false unless you can prove the existence of a god.
Sounds like the Bible
to be fair he is American
Matt, your my hero,,I always thought I was the only Atheist,,through yourself,,I don’t carry guilt anymore,,Thank you my friend,👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻🇬🇧
The resurrection of Elvis has me all shook up
"...or 666 books"... Oh Matt, you low-key troll you.
We love you.
This guy wrote a fan fiction about how his favorite book is written by its own characters.
The order of lies makes no difference. The proper order is truth. 1 2 3 4 5 etc
I like that one. Probably gonna steal it.
It's like, there are only so many ways you can tell an adult that santa does not exist. Matt has god level like patience
This caller seems incapable of responding to another person's words. They're a walking non-sequitur.
Matt: "How do you know this actually happened?"
Caller: "I personally believe the last supper was at Mark's house."
Love how the caller keeps making new claims every time Matt skewers the last one.
It's ridiculous.
2:25 When I was a Messianic believer, I've heard of these added verses on the messianic "Torah lesson" and when we studied this chapter in a small group, I've mentioned it. It wasn't accepted very well by my group. They responded, "Well I don't see why it shouldn't be three. It's the obvious truth!". And the others added "Amen".
Damn Matt is as sharp as a razor's edge!!
Plus...how much more was added or edited according to even earlier manuscripts that haven't been found yet?
Don is my dude. Love when he's on the show.
His sense of humor cracks me up!
While Matt could obviously carry the show himself I like that they have Don and John to put an everyman's perspective on things, bring a bit of humour and balance Matt's intensity. Props to them
This was a great call! Way to go Matt!
Historical reliability? Zero.
The choice of ads that the TH-cam algorithm has decided to pair with this video is hilarious. LOL
Just about finished reading Richard Carrier's 'Jesus From Outer Space'. Terrific work by Carrier. I lean to Carrier's position on the existence of an historical Jesus over the views espoused by Bart Ehrman. And... I've never been to Mark's house.
Just, Oh My! I truly have no words
Confirmation biases and fallacies. I guess that's what you get when you're so invested in your own position that you can't dare, even for a moment, allow yourself to question your own beliefs.
I was brought up as a Christian, not very strongly more tradition than faith. I've looked at Christianity often over the years, read about it, thought about it, debated about it. I still am an interested student. One consistent thing in those years was that while church goers often treat the Bible very seriously most scholars as opposed to preachers treat it as a very dubious source. Few churches have treated the Bible as inerrant, and the Catholic church was very concerned about the laity seeing it because they knew it would lead to confusion. The scriptures were never seen by the early church as being that important, as few Christians were literate. When did the Bible achieve this semi divine nature?
This call felt like trying to get a child to admit they got into the paint when they swear they didn't but have paint all over their face.
Andrew can't live in a world without magic.
Don and Matt are a great team. Callers can be confusing; their beliefs can be hard to understand, but in this episode Don and Matt dissected the callers comments and, as usual, by-passed the bullshit and got to the core of the issue and that, my friends, is where truth lies.
Jerusalem was at odds with Rome well before 70 AD. So a guess could have been made easily but it would not been a prediction.
This was one of the better dives that Matt has done for the bibble with a caller.
WOW Matt, you da man ! This is such a superb session of REASON ! ...... and common sense ....👍👍👍
A shame it's not universal sense.
Drink every time he starts the sentence with “well”
These videos fascinate me simply because this close biblical study -- which I did as a part of church leadership training -- is exactly what started me down the path to leave Christianity. The irony was that the information is out there for folks that are headed into leadership but not taught to the masses -- especially things like textual criticism
Matt never ceases to amaze
This dude just dodges every single question. His brain is truly broken.
He dodges every question 'cos he has the demeanour of all fundamentalist preachers ie Crooked as the hind leg of a dog.
I'll bet Andrew put a great deal of effort in memorizing "Methodological Naturalist"! And couldn't wait to find just the right place to insert his Buzzwords Fizz! Whoooey we got's us an intellectual here'im.
What an upstanding and courageous citizen Andrew must be to go to the witness protection program- as he recently called as Rick-CA in the vid "Biblical Genocide the same as defending home"
Every time someone wants to quote from the Bible I just pick a quote from Alice in Wonderland. Sama, sama.
For how indoctrinated the caller is I got to hand it to his patience and willingness to listen actively.
To any God,
next time you want to do a written down "revelation to all humans", use the Moon as canvas:
it can be seen from every place on Earth, and is harder to tamper with than man-made manuscripts.
Oh, and carve it using black ink for literal meaning and red for allegories and metaphors. That can spare a lot of souls!
You are welcome!
Great idea.
Idiot
@@JoshA0669 no god complained about my help, why would you? Remember what Forest's mom said: *Idiot is as idiot does.*
@@JoshA0669Idiot ? Such a tiny amount of information was all that was needed to prove that you are.
@@Wardads1 😂😂😂 lets actually here an argument otherwise keep it moving troll.
All of Andrew's calls could have been answered with one simple response: "WHO GIVES A SHIT?!?"
The first piece of new testament we have is a scrap of papyrus 150 ad size of a credit card full page of mark and Matthew 220 ad
Andrew is like the black knight in Monty Python.
😂
I predicted that Matt would start swearing lol
i half expected the christian to say " i know you are but what am i "
If you compare the writing styles of the gospels with a biography of Abraham Lincoln and The Jewels of Opar (A novel) you will notice that they are more like the latter than the former.
Events occur that could not have been witnessed by anyone, yet are described in detail.
Only novels can accurately describe a person's feelings, for example, because they are imagined.
When I think of the time and energy that so many committed Christians invest in their pursuit of a closer relationship with their god/s, I can't help but feel a little sad, at least.
The desire to find evidence is understandable, despite the glaring fact that one critical element of religious faith is to believe without evidence. I suppose, in that context, it's only natural that their search for evidence pushes them further away from the very simple circular flaw: we know god exists because the book says so and god wrote the book so we know god exists because the book says so and god wrote the book so we know god exists because the book says so and god wrote the book so we know god exists because the book says so and god wrote the book so we know god exists because the book says so...
A great episode. I think yhe gumballs in the jar is a nice touch.
Any time andrew said "Wellll…" you knew some random bullshit is about to come out of his mouth.
8:47 "what god wants our role to be.."
I thought our role is to give the church 10% of what we earn.
I believe in God, I just don't trust anyone who works for him. ~Author unknown, from a stand-up comedy routine on television
so "A Study in Scarlet" is a true story, but "The Hounds of Baskerville" is complete nonsense ... and Sherlock Holmes must exist because he's in both of them ...
wowsers ...
Lol.
As an aside speaking as someone who lives not far from the place where "The Hounds of Baskerville" is set I can confirm this story is confirm that there is a number of aspects in this story that fail to conform to reality from places and names, down to the very geography of the location its set in.
Its almost as if Doyle heard stores from different sources most of which may not have been true about a location or person and then made a story based on that collection of myths...
Like how most of the bible was written....
Matt fucks me up with his humor! I don't even think he tries but he's hilarious!
We are all Atheists about MOST of the "GODS" that humanity believes in except that SOME of us go "one GOD" further.
Man, it’s amazing how these people can twist words and assumptions to be fact.
Deuteronomy 4:2 New American Standard Bible (NASB)
(Originally the Torah)
2 You shall not add to the word which I am commanding you, nor take away from it, that you may keep the commandments of the Lord your God which I command you. The adding of the Gospels (New Testament) is in violation of this scripture.
Thank you so much for quoting The Final Frontier lol
Matt is the only person we need on this show.
Well that’s not fair
BTW, the reference about "not added to nor taken away..." referred to the book of revelation alone.