I wish it would be brought back to live today. Like all the issues are solved as with todays camera and drone technology there's far less reason to stand around on the track.
To deal with the G's we have two options. 1) Gimbal seet that rotates to optimize the angle the Gs are felt at. 2) Its no rules dummy! Loose the dead weight and have a computer drive the car.
@@commieTerminator yes this. High bandwidth hotspots along the track for low ping. Simulator setups in the paddock, line up of celebrity drivers, no rules extreme remotely controlled cars. Zero spectators close to the track for safety. I'm kind of surprised no one has done it yet as an exhibition. Ahem Red Bull....real X car anyone?
Lol this reminds me of the nate bargatze snl skit where they are making fun of how the US has the most rtrtd measurement systems. And the real of the planet uses one.
I believe that a different video on the channel specifically addressed the conditions and goals at Pikes Peak, unless I'm thinking of one from a different channel.
Not so much, as forced induction engines easily make sea level horsepower as high as 20,000 ft. The real reason is instantaneous torque available after corner exit, especially after slower corners.
My 11-year-old just looked at this video title and said: "If there were no rules, I'd start 0.5mm from the finish line in a big, wide truck and win ..."
Why would a semi truck be a race car I don't think that would be the vibe smh they do race em tho with out the trailers it's kinda fun to watch but it's a giant waste of money.
Tubular space frames filled with helium. Hang on... that would detract from downforce, and the cars would still have the same mass and inertia when accelerating, braking, and changing direction. So tubular space frames filled with lead. Hmmmm... this isn't working. I'll get my coat. 😕
@@TrevorDennis100 Don't confuse/conflate weight ( or more accurately _mass_ ) with downforce. You want to make the mass as low as possible & add the downforce with aero. Low mass & high downforce means faster cornering! Replacing air with helium, or better hydrogen, reduces maybe a couple of grams of mass?
Something I'll never forget is when Sammy Miller brought his high speed record attempt motorcycle to my motorcycle club at Southend in Essex UK. He said that the brakes were useless at high speed as they would slow the bike for a moment before fading to nothing. He no doubt used the standard bike brake shoes (this was before disk brakes). So what he did was to simply sit from behind the faring, which apparently created huge drag slowing the bike to a point where the brakes would work, at around 80mph. I just looked Sammy up and was pleased to see that he is still alive aged 91.
Glad to hear someone remembers the great Sammy Miller. Owns a very interesting museum in Dorset and have had a couple of conversations with him. Great guy and recommend a visit to his homage to a much overlooked part of motor history.
Another cool thing about the skirts: they were inspired by birds. the unsealed edges cause a bit of a vortex effect around the sides of the car which speeds up the air over the sides of the car and reduces down force. In the same way, the tips of a bird's wings cause a bit of a loss of lift due to the same effect, water birds gliding close to the surface will dip the tips of their wings into the water to seal off the air flow and make it easier to stay up. Engineers at lotus noticed this and applied it to the car. It was very effective and also almost immediately banned lol.
@@awildhampter8570 it is very common for us to take things existing in nature and turn them into machinery tho, its balled biomimicry, and velcro is a really good example of a popular product that was invented due to biomimicry.
Dipping the wingtips prevents lift spoiling air spillover at the wingtips, whether they are dragging into the water or not and being that close to the surface, they are in ground effect. Am I the only gear head who bothered to studied physics?
Things possible when there are no rules: • Remote or computer driving, eliminating the cockpit entirely • Turret to blow opponents up • Declaring that this spot from my laser pointer is actually my car
@@nike01x26 Claw Viper wins acceleration. But hyper-shock and some others could have a chance. And Walker Chomp and Wrecks are still coming out of pit lane.
I genuinely think a no-rules racing series would be fantastic and would accelerate innovation that could trickle down to road cars. The only problem is that there’s no way to guarantee a safety standard .
Pretty sure CVTs were being experimented with for F1 but were banned since they were too fast. That plus it’s not as fun when you can’t hear them climb through the rpms
If we're talking no rules whatsoever, we indeed don't need a driver. We also don't need the engine to move the wheels. We don't even need wheels. We build a missile that is remote controlled. No wheels, no petrol, no driver, no ICE. It uses a liquid hydrogen rocket and flies at low altitude. Because I guess that would be the one rule: It has to stay under a certain height to be considered "on" the track.
@@GeneralKenobi69420 "I pissed myself laughing" You "No you didn't literally urinate. Liar." "my sides were splitting" You - "Prove it! Show me the stitches!"
As an international watcher, I would really apprechiate if you would also display the speed as km/h, next to mph. You don't need to mention it, at it would waste time, but for those unfamiliar with mph we can immediatly focus on the numbers we are familiar with and can compare to our real life experiences. Otherwise a great video and very entertaining! Thanks!
@@robcrissinger776 Yes and simple math also tells you that it is way more efficient when the video creator to do it once and share the info with us. Even the currently 149 upvotes show that more time will be WASTED with everyone needing to do the math themself. How about respecting our time? Not everyone needs every skill, especially not if it is really irrelevant in our daily lifes!
@@DundGIf you are the one that wants the information, it's up to you to find it. Expecting others to provide it for you seems lazy. Over 2.5 million people watched this and 149 agree that it's too hard to learn about mph. Your defense of ignorance is not a good one. Just look at any speedometer.
I think it would be really cool if the Formula E had almost no rules, just a couple rules about the battery. The battery can only take up a certain volume of space, can not be recharged during the race, and the volume the battery can take up shrinks a certain amount each X years. This would create incentives to put a lot of resources into R&D for batteries and could have a big positive impact on the world.
@@TackerTacker it was a 1990s anime series that features Cyber Formula, a formula racing that runs on electric and sustainable fuels with basically no limitations on the cars in near future (as of the show's airing time in the 1990s) . In the show, the Cyber Formula would supposed to be the top tier Formula Racing series above F1, F2, and F3. So, the realization of these ideas in the comment above and this video would be the equivalent to Cyber Formula race of the show (although the nearest thing we have in real life is the Formula E series that runs on battery electric cars)
@@Lurch-BotThat statement is reductionistic, simplistic, classist, prejudiced and ignorant. Your titles specially nowadays may not reflect what you know.
@@brazoon1They look different and one was designed by an actual F1 designer leading the way. So majority of it is theoretically possible, except for the driver surviving sustained 7+G's forces upon their bodies. He mentioned enclosed wheels to keep air flow under control, enclosed cockpit, large rear wing, active fans for low speed aero down force. This came from the video itself, so the difference is all those things and then some.
@@brazoon1 Jimmy Broadbent via Asseto Corsa used to run laps around the Nurburgring to see how fast each car was. The 2004 Ferrari F1 does it in 5:10.3, in the 919 EVO he scored 4:58.8, and the X2010 he scored 3:10.5 (2 minutes faster around the Nordschleife than the 2004 F1, which is a bit quicker than modern F1s). To call the X2010 rapid is an understatement. The two problems anything noticeably faster than F1 faces are tires and the human. As far as I know there are no tires which can stand the abuse the X2010 would deliver, and the rapid shifting G's at such massive levels could genuinely be fatal to an average human (The G loads on their own are dangerous, but the duration of them on top of how rapidly they shift in every direction likely would do real and potentially fatal damage even without a crash).
@@demomanchaos Yeah, that difference is insane. lol I used to play GT on the PS3 and those X cars were barely drivable for my skill level. Interesting to see those lap times when done by more capable gamers.
Imaginary cars would be the lightest of all. If they are that concerned with safety, maybe the teams should just design them and then run a simulation in Solidworks to see who wins :P
The concept worked pretty good. It had some trouble with getting someone to develop smaller tyres specifically for you. And with way uneven degradation.
Williams had a test car with four rear wheels. Acceleration was much faster, and in the wet, you could run slicks on the rearmost, because the 'middle' removed all the water
they essentially had blades in nascar 2015 bc they pulled the side skirts on the car outward to get more downforce but its a sharp metal point on the side of the car which punctured jeff gordons car and took him out of championship contention (obv banned)
If I'm not mistaken, I remember hearing that the one who originally designed the aerodynamics used by the Aston Martin Valkyrie (with the prominent use of the underside of the car) wanted to use them for F1 racing, but the competition restrictions prevented them from doing that, so they just decided to create the Valkyrie to not let that design go to waste. I think it just goes to show how much more creative people could be if they were allowed to
I've only been going to Mosport since the mid 2010s (born in 2002), but I've grown to love it as well. I would've liked to have seen some of the Can-Am action or even some Group C/F1 stuff! Even so I'm still quite happy with what IMSA offers right now, and it's quite nice to see some of the older racecars brought out during some of the historical racing support races or more recently the Drive Festival. Shame IMSA removed the GTPs from running this year, but I'm still looking forward to supporting the Multimatic folks running the new Mustang.
Hell yeah, and a good modern Group C/GTP game as well. I used to watch those series as a kid, but once Group C stopped, i stopped bothering to watch or go to races. Back in the day when i was a baller (late 80's) i seriously almost bought a retired Nissan Group C car but ended up getting a classic grey market Benz instead (450 SLC) as it's a lot more practical to daily lol.
@@GeneralKenobi69420 Yeah no person under 45 listens to music from the 70s, also can am was from 66 to 87. And its not like there is a lot of love for music etc. from that era..... Your a marketing genius
@@GeneralKenobi69420 I'm 48 and i LOVE racing games and 70's music, but most racing games suck because they're all about modern racing VS vintage. I don't care about F1 or the various touring car series, or dumb modern 'supercars' that look like a place to put a bunch of goofy looking air vents that don't fit anywhere else.
I love that “deliciously complicated” line. My late grandpa taught me that you can always learn and improve. In his words “the car can always be faster”. So. cool that everyday the world of motorsport is constantly getting faster because of hungry engineers, mechanics, and drivers.
You missed out AWD with torque vectoring (active diffs) for aiding cornering, acceleration and deceleration. Would act something like differential braking for corners (under engine braking), but works also on the exit (and also alters front to back for accel / decel on straights). Needs to be tied in to the active suspension and braking.
Thank you for recognising Can-Am as one of the series which pioneered motor racing technology. I am delighted to have conversed with the great man himself, Jim Hall, at the Goodwood Festival of Speed in 1997. (He said the Chaparral 2 was the most fun to drive of all his cars).
Obscene 2000hp turboshaft-electric hybrid, with the excess thrust from the turbine exhaust used to energize the rear diffuser (or maybe even the entire floor as well)
For the high Gs, one answer is to just do the more tires thing. More tires = the force divided up across more of them. Also, sequential sets of tires have been shown to be better for less ideal conditions like wet pavement, since the first rear tire just clears a path for the second rear tire. Having doubled and/or extra wide tires could work for the front too, if you are free to adjust the design of that area more. One interesting idea though, if all the tires can turn 90+ degrees, you could have the car rotate almost sideways while in a turn, which would let you potentially use the LATERAL aerodynamics to take a little lateral pressure off the tires. Plus it would look like drifting even if the tires would still be actually maintaining grip, and people love watching drifting. Edit: Also, by turning while the body is about sideways, the G forces on the driver would be front-to-back, which is MUCH easier to handle than side-to-side.
Something you didn't mention about active aero is that the downforce doesn't need to be singular between the left and right sides of the car. There was talks about increasing downforce on the inner side while turning to reduce bodyroll without needing stiffer springs, increasing both high speed aerodynamic grip and low speed mechanical grip. Independently adjusting drag laterally across a car's cross section (e.g. putting something akin to an aircraft's rudder on the rear wing's supports, and something similar up front) would effectively let you yaw the car via airflow management, taking that lateral load off the tyres. Then its a strategy on whether you pull more peak lateral Gs, or the same peak Gs but longer tyre life.
Love these idea about yawing the car with rudder. Combining this with active suspension to keep the car level and adding air brakes the deploy to slow the car would make it extremely quick. Computer systems could also be use to adjust the control surfaces continuously.
Giving engineers no rules, except the natural ones, in competition is a magical experience. It really is an honor to have a rule created because you came up with a solution no one else did and it worked. The last point in this is actually one of the biggest, tires and wheels. It’s all pointless unless you put it all to the ground. Some concepts have actually already been tested, active air management in the tire, so ideal pressure all the time and a capability to introduce cooler air. You’re not constrained to F1 dimensions, figure out ideal width. Temperature is your biggest enemy, systems to keep the temperature down would be key
I remember the X2010 from Gran Turismo, I believe it had four-wheel steering as well. Too bad it was limited in where and how it could be run, only in a certain section of the game menu and a completely different drive from anything else but it was fun.
It's still in GT7 and still faster than all hell, but the game has included even faster concept cars like the Dodge Tomahawk and it's 2500hp+ motor, active aero and sleek space looking shape.
For fans, consider gas turbines, jet engines. Both the intake can be utilized for vacuum as well as the exhaust for both directional thrust and utilizing venturi action for more vacuum. I've also thought about weight shifting. Probably possible only with electric cars where the battery is long, off center, and can be quickly shifted from one side to the other. I also think that wings could be actuated variably based on distance from the ground. That is also something that I think could be done in speedboat racing to keep the boat from going airborne.
I wouldn't use the jet inlet for underbody aero. Far too much chance of a FOD passing through & wrecking the turbine. A jet-blown diffuser could work though, but only if you're using the turbine to generate electrical power, not directly driving the wheels - jet throttle response is much slower than ICE throttle response, so you'd need some way to keep the jet spinning at high rpm to blow the diffuser. So, jet powers electric, probably a supercapacitor to store the energy (lighter than a battery pack), electric motors to all wheels, probably with torque vectoring to aid turn-in & corner-exit, regen braking, active suspension, and active aero to aid braking on corner entry, downforce through corner, and reduce drag on the straights. In theory, all of this is possible to do, but it would produce a car that NOBODY could drive. The car would be able of producing physical loads on the driver that would be unsustainable for a full race, even with a full G-suit. Then there's the question of "what happens if it goes wrong?". All the systems that would be needed to make such a car practical, would need to be computer controlled, and even today, computers occasionally derp & cease working properly. Sensors fail, rf interference affects signals, competitors could jam telemetry, etc. What happens if the control system derps and sends the car airborne at 300+mph into a spectator stand??? F1 rules have mostly been slowing cars down since the mid 80's precisely for this reason. The technology has existed for decades - active aero? 1960's. Stupid power? 80's turbos. Active suspension? Early 90's. Gas turbine electricity generation? 50's(?). The technology all exists, but it is a historic fact that the safety standards of the sport has ALWAYS lagged behind the technology, and modern society just isn't prepared to allow a sport to be anywhere near as dangerous to spectators as a truly unregulated F1 series would be...
Not a lot of thrust left over after it spins the PTT. A turboprop or turboshaft motor doesn't really contribute enough thrust to be relevant. But the amount of air it moves can provide an effect similar to the 2J's fans. All you have to do is put the intake under the nose of the car and you'll have negative pressure underneath. The articulating skirts could probably be ditched considering how low a modern F1 car sits and still get 80% of the downforce. Could put vortex generators underneath at the edges about midway down the car to help keep air from spilling in under the sides and potentially having no downforce or possibly even lift on the back of the car.
“It’s deliciously complicated.” 10:42 His description just made me remember all the ‘deliciously complicated’ ways I learned how air moves in our atmosphere in ‘Atmospheric Dynamics’ class. Good video! Thanks 👍🏼
I'm a bit surprised a thrust vectoring jet engine wasn't discussed. Removing the need for the wheels to transfer 100% of the power and cornering would make it a lot easier on them. Of course you could still have very powerful electric motors in the wheels for better acceleration as well as regenerative braking.
There's a Chaparral fantasy car on Gran Turismo that uses some sort of laser propulsion. It takes a bit to get used to driving with thrust, but it's very interesting once you have. Of course, it would take all the fun out of melting the windshield behind you😅
This material is so great and fun!!! Thank you for your videos. Just a suggestion: if you could put the numbers in metric system as a quote it’ll be very helpful to other people (kg, km/h, m, etc…) 😊
Great video, thanks! I actually think that the most interesting competition wouldn't be fully no rules like this, but more "here are your safety rules, your car must have four wheels, you can use this much energy (max battery size and fuel bladder volume), now go make the fastest machine", because not only would it make for incredibly fast cars, it would also make for incredibly efficient cars. The current F1 propulsion system has an efficiency unparalleled in road going ICE cars, and I would really love to see more effort in that direction, unfortunately I don't really see that happening with the new regulations coming.
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I feel that one thing that could also play a huge role compared to the last decades is to have a fully integrated control system across all sensors and actuators, combining real-time all-wheel, all-axis torque-vectoring, active aero, active suspension, actively controlled fans, engine controller (if we are even opting for an internal combustion engine, depends on whether we are aiming for a single flying lap or a full race), etc. in a single "omniscient omnipotent" computer.
Funnily enough, this is the exact main premise of an anime from 1991! (Future GPX Cyber Formula), interesting how this show predicted some stuff in a way 30 years later (drs and kers, just cranked up to 11)
I have an idea i'd like to comment about: I call it the "Golden Arrow" Project. The basic format of it would be the Deltawing concept, with the front wheels being fitted inside the long beak. It would also have the Mercedes W11 front wing (or something similar to it), the X 2014 rear wing, and in the back, the blown difuser from the Brawn GP F1 car, along with the Chaparral 2J-like fans, powered by an independent eletric motor. Just like commented in the video, it would have the wheels fully covered, a closed cockpit and active aero. As for the power of this machine, i was thinking about the W11 Mercedes again, take the engine used by that thing, but now with two turbos, no restrictions and maybe revving up to 20.000 RPM. This stays behind the cockpit and produces power to the rear wheels. The front wheels would be powered by two small Formula Student-grade eletric motors. As for suspension, we can think about active suspension yes, but what about the possible benefits of hydro-elastic suspension? If we can get this to work, it might reduce weight, costs and complexity. For the tires, the best thing we have now are the Pirelli P Zero tires already used in F1, and qe could call this same enterprise for the front wheels as well. Proper tires? Maybe within 10 years and about 10 billion dollars... Finally, and most important, the driver must have fighter jet or aerospace grade training to handle the G's. One should consider the safety measures theses pilots have and how they could be applied to this project. And also consider updating the HANS device to prevent a catastrophic neck break at those 8 G's of force. If you read until this point, please consider making a concept art of this car. Also, thank you for the attention.
W11 motor!! You crazy, modern F1 motors are underpowered pieces of junks ! An old Renault F1 turbo from the 70th was double the power of a modern F1!! We could easely make a 2000 2500 HP from a V8/V10 today (with short life)
You don't need wings on a car to generate downforce. You're just building an ostrich at that point. Ailerons on a racing bike would be useful though because those roll through turns instead of yawing. Could get much more precise lean angles, have downforce that always acts through the vertical axis of the bike (and is electronically variable) and eliminate the drag caused by countersteering. Don't even need the front wheel to articulate when racing so you could have a swingarm suspension without a bunch of complexity. Hell, with aerodynamics, you could eliminate the front wheel altogether, hypothetically. Would be easy to put an electromagnetic grid in a circuit and run magnetic repulsion hoverbikes. That's gonna be the future of racing.
Hi Scott, I love the amount of detail that you put into your videos. Would you be able to make a video about the evolution of the F1 car? If so that would be amazing. Thanks again
Hear me out… Turboshaft engine production close to 2000hp linked to a CVT for constant peak power driving the wheels. Streamline the body and have the intake partially underneath the car using the jet engine intake to suck air from under the floor making the vacuum. Angle the jet engine slightly downwards for more downforce and thrust to accelerate the car. You could even have active exhaust ports that blow exhaust out points on the car to help it turn. Obviously you are going to need active suspension and air brakes to slow the car so you don’t die
A large CVT will have problems - it has to transmit quite a lot of power through friction. But you could go with a proven way to accomplish that: A smaller turbogenerator, powering a hybrid system. The turbine generates power with no direct connection to the wheels, feeds a medium-sized battery-pack, which feeds four electric motors - one on each wheel - for quick throttle response, 4-wheel drive, regenerative braking, and torque vectoring. Granted, the batteries add weight, but not that much if you size everything properly. It would, though, probably be heavier than present F-1 powertrains - fuel weight, batteries, and four motors will all add up. Would that matter? Don't know.
If I was in charge of F1 rules I would make it that a car had to be within certain physical dimensions and a spending cap. After that let the teams design the fastest possible car for the track they can. Would be so much more interesting to see the concepts
@@yutiros5174 Why is there always a safety nanny in the convo? If you don't want to climb into a machine, that is good on you. If somebody else wants to find out what is possible, why is that your business?
First things: I think you made too many restrictive rules. Four wheels? Why. Who can forget the Tyrrell P34. The rules I propose are: 1) There must be a driver. 2) The competition will be a season consisting of the race tracks used in the F1 season plus the Nurbergring; Goodwood; Pikes Peak; Isle of Mann TT; Le Mans 24; Santa Pod Raceway; and the Indianapolis Raceway Park over 1/4 mile and full mile in a straight line. This will ensure the winner is the most rounded car and in a game of Top Trumps - would be the undisputed overall best car. 3) The car must not fly (this is actually quite a hard rule to define but I am sure somebody can do this - and if per-chance, somebody developed a fly-by-wire hovercraft that had enough control to compete; I'd want to see that in the mix - I just don't want to limit engineers.) 4) The risk of driver dying or spectator dying must be no greater than twice that currently seen in F1, and a proving programme must be passed before racing. (Back in the early days of F1 - one driver would die every year out of a grid of approximately 15 drivers. It means that every driver had an almost seven percent chance of dying during a season, or if he raced for five seasons, he had a 1 in three chance of being killed driving an F1 car. I couldn't really enjoy something that dangerous, but put it out there that perhaps F1 has got too safe? I don't know. In terms of cars, I was disappointed that your coverage of the McMurty was limited to a brief flash around 17 mins. This car has already wiped Lewis Hamilton's F1 record out at Silverstone mcmurtry.com/silverstone-gp-onboard-with-overtakes-mcmurtry-speirling-pure-vp1/ and several other notable records. This blend of technology looks like a winner to me. However - it's an EV, and we all know that battery technology is the limiting factor - especially as I've included the Le Mans 24 in my season. So I put on my school-boy naive engineer's hat and asked myself "How can we fix that?" and my answer is "The Rotary Engine" as a Range Extender - but F1 style, and couple this with a super-capacitor array. This immediately sheds battery weight as you could go to 25% of the car's current load if you were able to generate enough energy to top it up. The Wankel seems perfect for this job because despite its faults (which Maxda seem to have fixed in the current MX-30 REX) it has an insane power to weight ratio. The emissions problems of old are not relevant as I will use some bio-eco-CO2 neutral fuel and there are plenty of candidates out there. Advances in metallurgy have allegedly fixed the reliability issues - plus this isn't an engine that needs to change revs - it is tuned to a constant speed to generate electricity and dump it into my super capacitor and battery (I wonder if I even need a battery if my capacitor can be topped up from my wankel). Now this is the killer bit -- the power to weight. A typical turbocharged V8 diesel engine might have an engine power of 340 hp and a mass of 840 lb, giving it a power-to-weight ratio of 0.40 hp/lb. A race tuned wankel design would be over 5 hp/lb!!!! Their designs are modular, so you can bolt them together to make insane HP - plus you get the benefits of eco-fossil fuel energy density - which should also reduce weight. I remain convinced that having a super-capacitor in the power train will be worth it as they remove the energy loss associated with battery charging, and I am betting that using regenerative braking to charge a super capacitor will be a good thing. Loved the video ... just felt you missed some valid here and now technologies and world leading manufacturers.
I've been saying this for years, and been pilloried on F1 forums, so I'm so glad others have thought the same. Similarly, I would like a sort of 'Touring Car' championship where all the cars MUST be UK road legal. To prove that they can't be too low, they would have to be driven on the roads prior to the race. Other than that, no rules.
IIRC Bose (the headphones and stereos Bose) came up with some insane active suspension years ago. With current sensors and processing power I'm sure we could make either self-driving or remote-controlled or worse-case-scenario "drive by wire" with superhuman speed of adaptations to all details of the car per given situation.
Yes, bose suspension was insane and the result of decades of research. Renault Formula 1 came with insane active suspension too in 1992 that won championship and was promptly banned. imagine how much better active suspension could be today with computing power, camera & sensors, actuators and motors.. you can bring down the ground clearance close to zero, corner perfectly flat, and continuously adjust the pitch angle/ground effect. meaning also the camber can also be controlled indirectly and stay consistent. the problem is then if you rely on huge ground effect down force, if the active suspension fails, car gets further from the ground because of a curb taken too hard, you have a car suddenly losing grip, I think it was the reason behind the ban (remember the flying mercedes) I thik its going to progressively come back into road cars . The purosangue has a TRUE active suspension but Ferrari is too conservative...they were afraid to create a flat cornering mode so they let the car have a some roll, to not disturb the drivers. But the tech is going in the right direction. small independent motors with worm gear, means its not hydraulic based like mercedes class S active suspension from 10 yeas ago or even older citroen active suspension according to ferrari active suspension increased the lateral grip by 10% and the car is not even cornering flat
@@justmejustme4444 That car is incredible. Mat Watson from Carwow has driven loads of quick cars including a Bugatti Chiron and a RimavNevera. He did 0-60 in 1.49 seconds in the McMurtry and was rendered speechless. Gordon Murray's also got a fan in his new T50, which makes sense as he designed the Brabham!
One exotic way to address cornering forces is to have the cockpit roll to make the forces always be "down" to the driver rather than lateral. It would add a bit of weight, but staying conscious is likely to improve lap times.
If you rolled long lengths of skirt material up you could constantly feed it out with rotational actuators as it is worn away by the track surface. And add new rolls during pitstops...
Dump the piston engine. Andy Granatelli proved just how superior the turbine is for road racing. He used off the shelf aero engines which were quite heavy compared to what could be made for a dedicated race application and STILL mopped the floor with his competition. Costs would go down. No more $100, 000 for a set of 8 pistons. One engine last a whole season, maybe longer. No more gasoline.
First rule above all else in the racing world is safety, next is power and aero. So before they design and aero package that would make racing more competitive but without sacrificing safety and even improving it then this has all the hallmarks of a legendary car. I think they should slacken more of the competitive rules in F1 cars. Allow them up to 1,200 horse power as well as any engine they want with a limit of 12 cylinders and free rein on Aero design but they also have to make them safer as well. Allow them their choice of wheel rim size and tyre size as well. Do this and F1 will be more competitive and more interesting and fun to watch.
I would love to see a “No Rules” racing class ….. It would probably need remote viewing because it would be going so fast. Very saleable around the world. Fingers crossed.
Another thing you could do, is change the fuel. With NitroMethane fuel, you can get up to about 600 HP per litre of displacement. This means less weight, smaller engine, smaller vehicle, less drag.
What about the drivetrain? Would it be better to have a 4wd system to improve acceleration, or simply a rwd system to keep the weight and complexity down? And what about the use of a hybrid power system ?
I imagine you'd need a hybrid engine at the very least. Part of what makes the fan so effective on the McMurtry Spierling over the old Chapparel 2J is being electric. Means the fan had a smooth power source for the dame level of fan suction at all times. Part of the issue with the 2J is the fans were tied to the ICE, meaning the same issues with delivering smooth power exist for the fan.
Unnecessary because the have fans, which are far lighter than including mechanicals for AWD, plus the fans can be turned controlled by onboard to increase aero when necessary and reduce when not needed.
8G’s at full break would literally make you black tf out 😳 lol you have to do fighter jet training and learn how to AGSM breathing just to drive these things and stay awake 😂
I feel like jet engines might have some role here: Having a second source of acceleration that doesn’t rely on wheel grip would give you a huge advantage in the acceleration and top speed departments. Using thrust reversers like on commercial jets could also improve your braking. If you could find some way to push sideways as well, you’d be able to turn harder, too! The suction from the engine’s intake might also be able to function as a downforce fan. Speaking of fans, a movable skirt could help seal off the underside of the car better.
Jet engines are against the spirit of a ground race. Everyone knows their fast, faster than a car. Anyone can strap a jet engine to something and make it go faster than a wheel driven car. The challenge comes from maximizing the speed you can gain from wheel traction and power. The moment you strap a jet engine to a car, you’re a wingless plane.
@@Chronicleropejet engines are used in many type of ground-based and water-based vehicles, including tanks, speedboats, and the current land and water speed record holders. The question wasn't "what if F1 had some rules everyone followed" but "what if F1 had NO rules". I think for a car race, rules requiring that the majority of vehicle speed come from tires in contact with the ground would be entirely reasonable, as would rules against making a car as wide as the track to prevent passing or rules against vehicle-mounted weaponry. But those would still be rules, and thus out of the parameter of the question.
![[MV] A leap of faith...ความเชื่อใจครั้งสุดท้าย (From "Petrichor the series")](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/U1piZH2CNXA/mqdefault.jpg)
![[TH] 2024 PMGC League | Survival Stage วันที่ 1 | PUBG MOBILE Global Championship](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/FVFT-PFwU80/mqdefault.jpg)
This is why Group B rally was legendary. "Rule 1). Have driver. Rule 2). No maiming spectators (optional)."
😂😂😂
I wish it would be brought back to live today.
Like all the issues are solved as with todays camera and drone technology there's far less reason to stand around on the track.
What if my driver happens just so happens to fly a aerobatic jumpjet? There have to be more rules.
rule 3 ... airtimes are mandatory !!! :D
@@jannikheidemann3805
driving on the track is a good rule indeed
To deal with the G's we have two options. 1) Gimbal seet that rotates to optimize the angle the Gs are felt at. 2) Its no rules dummy! Loose the dead weight and have a computer drive the car.
That's actually no rule racing, but it would be more interesting with a driver in the car. Rotating seat is actually a genious move!
@@ScKTM68computer driven cars could be interesting it there was a lot of crashes
@@ScKTM68naa, remote controlled racing sounds much safer and lighter. The driver can sit in a simulator
Ask a Fighter Jet Pilot how ther do it u Simple need a very Special Suit ^^
@@commieTerminator yes this. High bandwidth hotspots along the track for low ping. Simulator setups in the paddock, line up of celebrity drivers, no rules extreme remotely controlled cars. Zero spectators close to the track for safety. I'm kind of surprised no one has done it yet as an exhibition. Ahem Red Bull....real X car anyone?
I’m glad that racing organizations make sure the rules of physics are followed
That one time when they failed to do so, entire galactic structures disappeared into baby black holes. Never again, they said.
I dont
Santa Claus would rock as a F1 driver.
Tyler Joseph?! Have yu made it out of dema?
Probably don't want to offend their true hidden sponsors, the Old Ones.
292 mph = 469.92 km/h; 310 mph = 498.89 km/h for 94.7% of the world’s population
Ty m8
Lol this reminds me of the nate bargatze snl skit where they are making fun of how the US has the most rtrtd measurement systems. And the real of the planet uses one.
The first numbers are for anyone who lives in a country that has a flag on the moon….
@@alexcolumbus1710 using the apollo guidance computer that ran, computed, and stored all its speeds and distances in metric
Nobody asked
You forgot to mention specifically why the iDR won Pike's Peak: altitude oxygen density no concern
Kinda obvious anyways and not even a concern for the videos topic...
I believe that a different video on the channel specifically addressed the conditions and goals at Pikes Peak, unless I'm thinking of one from a different channel.
Downforce is reduced so it is a concern.
Not so much, as forced induction engines easily make sea level horsepower as high as 20,000 ft. The real reason is instantaneous torque available after corner exit, especially after slower corners.
Isn't it fully electric
My 11-year-old just looked at this video title and said: "If there were no rules, I'd start 0.5mm from the finish line in a big, wide truck and win ..."
Genius!
Thinking outside the box. I like it.
Would have saved us a bunch of time at Monaco this year.
He'll make a great lawyer
Why would a semi truck be a race car I don't think that would be the vibe smh they do race em tho with out the trailers it's kinda fun to watch but it's a giant waste of money.
"Engineers added lightness" is a funny quote 😂
Car too heavy? Just add more lightness
Worked for Colin Chapman, one of the greatest racing car designers ever. "Simplify, then add lightness"....
That’s a phrase made popular by Colin Chapman describing a key concept of Lotus race car design.
@@christopherdean1326 Lightness killed a few people when things broke.
Tubular space frames filled with helium. Hang on... that would detract from downforce, and the cars would still have the same mass and inertia when accelerating, braking, and changing direction. So tubular space frames filled with lead. Hmmmm... this isn't working. I'll get my coat. 😕
@@TrevorDennis100 Don't confuse/conflate weight ( or more accurately _mass_ ) with downforce. You want to make the mass as low as possible & add the downforce with aero. Low mass & high downforce means faster cornering! Replacing air with helium, or better hydrogen, reduces maybe a couple of grams of mass?
Something I'll never forget is when Sammy Miller brought his high speed record attempt motorcycle to my motorcycle club at Southend in Essex UK. He said that the brakes were useless at high speed as they would slow the bike for a moment before fading to nothing. He no doubt used the standard bike brake shoes (this was before disk brakes). So what he did was to simply sit from behind the faring, which apparently created huge drag slowing the bike to a point where the brakes would work, at around 80mph. I just looked Sammy up and was pleased to see that he is still alive aged 91.
Nice
Glad to hear someone remembers the great Sammy Miller. Owns a very interesting museum in Dorset and have had a couple of conversations with him. Great guy and recommend a visit to his homage to a much overlooked part of motor history.
Yes his huge balls caused wind drag
what a mad man, happy to know he's an old and well man today!
Of course, his method killed everyone else who tried it. ;-)
Another cool thing about the skirts: they were inspired by birds. the unsealed edges cause a bit of a vortex effect around the sides of the car which speeds up the air over the sides of the car and reduces down force. In the same way, the tips of a bird's wings cause a bit of a loss of lift due to the same effect, water birds gliding close to the surface will dip the tips of their wings into the water to seal off the air flow and make it easier to stay up. Engineers at lotus noticed this and applied it to the car. It was very effective and also almost immediately banned lol.
@joevarga1769yeah gonna be honest kinda sounds made up
@@awildhampter8570 it is very common for us to take things existing in nature and turn them into machinery tho, its balled biomimicry, and velcro is a really good example of a popular product that was invented due to biomimicry.
Dipping the wingtips prevents lift spoiling air spillover at the wingtips, whether they are dragging into the water or not and being that close to the surface, they are in ground effect. Am I the only gear head who bothered to studied physics?
@joevarga1769 Adrian Newey explains the design and the inspiration in his book
@@RatKingKitKat
It is very common for us to take existing things and turn to nature and say: this must have been inspired by it.
What if F1 had no rules?
"This Sunday is a great day for F1 as only five drivers have died in today's race."
We would need AI racing with no rules, the best Car and the best AI wins
Drones on a freaking gigantic hot wheels track
@@LucasFerreira-gx9yh Or watch a Marble WC instead
Sounds like the good old days of F1 pre 1980.
Drivers would be the first to go if there were no rules. Unnecessary weight, can drive the car remotely. Sim racers would reign supreme
Things possible when there are no rules:
• Remote or computer driving, eliminating the cockpit entirely
• Turret to blow opponents up
• Declaring that this spot from my laser pointer is actually my car
Battle Bot Extreme: Racing edition
look how a drone controlled by a neural net dominated the world champions in drone racing
@@nike01x26 Claw Viper wins acceleration. But hyper-shock and some others could have a chance. And Walker Chomp and Wrecks are still coming out of pit lane.
Or declaring that this point 10cm away from my car is the finish line
Double slitster
Hear me out, turrets
88 kwk
Haha😂
120mm smoothbore
I genuinely think a no-rules racing series would be fantastic and would accelerate innovation that could trickle down to road cars. The only problem is that there’s no way to guarantee a safety standard .
Pretty sure CVTs were being experimented with for F1 but were banned since they were too fast. That plus it’s not as fun when you can’t hear them climb through the rpms
Just get pilots off the board.50 cars is not that much for modern wireless technology.
@@rasurin it's just about marketing
If we're talking no rules whatsoever, we indeed don't need a driver. We also don't need the engine to move the wheels. We don't even need wheels. We build a missile that is remote controlled. No wheels, no petrol, no driver, no ICE. It uses a liquid hydrogen rocket and flies at low altitude. Because I guess that would be the one rule: It has to stay under a certain height to be considered "on" the track.
@@HappyBeezerStudios on the other side it is issue with turns. And what is the goal of race to be first or make the most of the show?
"very aerodynamic looking"
Spat my drink out.
No you didn't, stop lying
@@GeneralKenobi69420 "I pissed myself laughing"
You "No you didn't literally urinate. Liar."
"my sides were splitting"
You - "Prove it! Show me the stitches!"
I can clearly hear this in Jeremy Clarkson's voice.
Literally spatting rn
😂😂....tye vw Guy designed himself as a car...that car looks just like him.haha
0:20 I'd really, _really_ love to see a car with properties where the laws of physics are not followed....
IOW, you want to see a spectacular crash.
May I introduce you to anti grav racing games?
As an international watcher, I would really apprechiate if you would also display the speed as km/h, next to mph. You don't need to mention it, at it would waste time, but for those unfamiliar with mph we can immediatly focus on the numbers we are familiar with and can compare to our real life experiences.
Otherwise a great video and very entertaining!
Thanks!
SRT TOMAHAWK GTS-R to X2014: Finally a worthy opponent.
Mph are sus 😅
SiMPLE MATH LETS you figure out the conversion without thinkimg about it..
Practice
@@robcrissinger776 Yes and simple math also tells you that it is way more efficient when the video creator to do it once and share the info with us.
Even the currently 149 upvotes show that more time will be WASTED with everyone needing to do the math themself.
How about respecting our time?
Not everyone needs every skill, especially not if it is really irrelevant in our daily lifes!
@@DundGIf you are the one that wants the information, it's up to you to find it. Expecting others to provide it for you seems lazy. Over 2.5 million people watched this and 149 agree that it's too hard to learn about mph. Your defense of ignorance is not a good one. Just look at any speedometer.
I think it would be really cool if the Formula E had almost no rules, just a couple rules about the battery.
The battery can only take up a certain volume of space, can not be recharged during the race, and the volume the battery can take up shrinks a certain amount each X years.
This would create incentives to put a lot of resources into R&D for batteries and could have a big positive impact on the world.
that's just the Cyber Formula
@@chenyeanmingtakumi9033 what's that?
@@TackerTacker it was a 1990s anime series that features Cyber Formula, a formula racing that runs on electric and sustainable fuels with basically no limitations on the cars in near future (as of the show's airing time in the 1990s) . In the show, the Cyber Formula would supposed to be the top tier Formula Racing series above F1, F2, and F3. So, the realization of these ideas in the comment above and this video would be the equivalent to Cyber Formula race of the show (although the nearest thing we have in real life is the Formula E series that runs on battery electric cars)
Yes. Formula E will eventually supplant Formula 1. I can't stand the awful racket made by ICEs anyway.
@@chenyeanmingtakumi9033 "anime series" imagine any reasonable person reading past that point?
i just cracked up "added lightness"
lmao i cracked up at aerodynamic looking
1:04 ‘the very aerodynamic looking Head of Exterior Design’ 🤣😂🤣
😂😂
Yes, his head was extremely aerodynamic.
@@dazofthemoo1531 extra downforce
@@dazofthemoo1531 crosswinds might be problems O_o
“Juicy. Nice. Sexy. Desirable.” Mr. Aerohead imposing restrictions on “unlimited” performance.
This video makes a very effective lesson on race car aerodynamics. Kudos to the creators!
Learning aerodynamics from a car enthusiast is sort of like learning gourmet cooking from the fry cook at McDonalds.
@@Lurch-BotThat statement is reductionistic, simplistic, classist, prejudiced and ignorant. Your titles specially nowadays may not reflect what you know.
You forgot to take into account the weapons each car would have. There would be an amazing development in lightweight offensive driving aids! 😮
I always thought about caltrops but you are right. No rules racing would be a tank race armed with RPGs
To the best of my knowledge there is nothing in the current FIA rules banning weapons
Banana peels.
@@xeridea *Green and red turtle shells*
The live-action Speed Racer timeline
Love how this 20m video concludes with "how fast does all this stuff make a car go? Eh, we don't know" lol
I would have at least liked to know the difference between the F1 and the X2014 on Gran Turismo.
@@brazoon1They look different and one was designed by an actual F1 designer leading the way. So majority of it is theoretically possible, except for the driver surviving sustained 7+G's forces upon their bodies. He mentioned enclosed wheels to keep air flow under control, enclosed cockpit, large rear wing, active fans for low speed aero down force. This came from the video itself, so the difference is all those things and then some.
@@evilformerlys4704 I meant in terms of lap times. Sorry I didn't specify that but thanks for that explanation.
@@brazoon1 Jimmy Broadbent via Asseto Corsa used to run laps around the Nurburgring to see how fast each car was. The 2004 Ferrari F1 does it in 5:10.3, in the 919 EVO he scored 4:58.8, and the X2010 he scored 3:10.5 (2 minutes faster around the Nordschleife than the 2004 F1, which is a bit quicker than modern F1s).
To call the X2010 rapid is an understatement. The two problems anything noticeably faster than F1 faces are tires and the human. As far as I know there are no tires which can stand the abuse the X2010 would deliver, and the rapid shifting G's at such massive levels could genuinely be fatal to an average human (The G loads on their own are dangerous, but the duration of them on top of how rapidly they shift in every direction likely would do real and potentially fatal damage even without a crash).
@@demomanchaos Yeah, that difference is insane. lol I used to play GT on the PS3 and those X cars were barely drivable for my skill level. Interesting to see those lap times when done by more capable gamers.
That 200mph impact demonstration was VERY convincing👍👍
"Add more LIGHTNESS!"
"How much?"
"ALL OF IT!"
ITS OVER 9000! (X2014 FAN CAR).
Imaginary cars would be the lightest of all. If they are that concerned with safety, maybe the teams should just design them and then run a simulation in Solidworks to see who wins :P
In the 8G car, the survival cell could be swiveling to make it stricly vertical loads on the body, at least in the corners.
You mean lateral. Because the heart won't pump to the brain at such Gs pointing downward.
@@Dakkyun For that we have the fighter pilot G-suits ;-)
@@Dakkyun i think there are fighter pilots living right now and their brains need blood ... at least i think so
Actually, forward G-forces are better
@@Dakkyun F1 drivers only experience 2-3 G's when accelerating.
6:48 lol love his mimicking a 200mph impact with a kick
„There must be 4 wheels“ - Tyrell: hold my beer
The concept worked pretty good. It had some trouble with getting someone to develop smaller tyres specifically for you. And with way uneven degradation.
Came here for that:
Who says it must have 4? Anything more than 2 would be fine (as that would just be a bike). Why not 3 ? If it works it works.
@@ABaumstumpf three would give you front end grip and minimise rear drag but would also limit what you could do with the defuser.
Williams had a test car with four rear wheels. Acceleration was much faster, and in the wet, you could run slicks on the rearmost, because the 'middle' removed all the water
If 4 is good then 6 is 50% better
No rules? What about extendible blades, flame thrower, gas grenades?
Pointless when chasing lap times mate
😂 definitely sounds good to me.
@@adamstilldrives did you watch the chariot race in Ben Hur ? Blades work 😂
@@adamstilldrivesnot pointless in finishing the finish line before your opponents
they essentially had blades in nascar 2015 bc they pulled the side skirts on the car outward to get more downforce but its a sharp metal point on the side of the car which punctured jeff gordons car and took him out of championship contention
(obv banned)
If I'm not mistaken, I remember hearing that the one who originally designed the aerodynamics used by the Aston Martin Valkyrie (with the prominent use of the underside of the car) wanted to use them for F1 racing, but the competition restrictions prevented them from doing that, so they just decided to create the Valkyrie to not let that design go to waste. I think it just goes to show how much more creative people could be if they were allowed to
6:51 this shit had me fuckin dead, dude just said it’ll take a 200 mile impact and just kicks it 😂
they should shape f1 like my weaner and it will be all winner
@@DJ_POOP_IT_OUT_FEAT_LIL_WiiWiiidk how a pencil with a mushroom attached to the top measuring in at 1 inch could be a winner
@@MommyKhaos it's all about the weight reduction and the air to surface ratio
Bruhhh shit is hilarious 🤣
The driver won't though.
I went to a Can-Am at Mosport in the early 70’s . Quite the spectacle!
I was at all races at Mosport for 30 years , I love that place
I've only been going to Mosport since the mid 2010s (born in 2002), but I've grown to love it as well. I would've liked to have seen some of the Can-Am action or even some Group C/F1 stuff! Even so I'm still quite happy with what IMSA offers right now, and it's quite nice to see some of the older racecars brought out during some of the historical racing support races or more recently the Drive Festival. Shame IMSA removed the GTPs from running this year, but I'm still looking forward to supporting the Multimatic folks running the new Mustang.
You are blessed to have been young in those days mate !!!
lmao whoever put that sponsorblock highlight at 18:22 you're a legend
Anybody want a CAN-AM themed racing game complete with 60's and 70s licensed soundtrack and theme ? Yeah, me too.
CAN-AM was basically when a bunch of American Speed Racer fans got together and tried to make it reality.
Hell yeah, and a good modern Group C/GTP game as well. I used to watch those series as a kid, but once Group C stopped, i stopped bothering to watch or go to races. Back in the day when i was a baller (late 80's) i seriously almost bought a retired Nissan Group C car but ended up getting a classic grey market Benz instead (450 SLC) as it's a lot more practical to daily lol.
Bro what? People who like racing games are all under 45 and people who like 70s music are all over 50. The venn diagram of those two is two circles
@@GeneralKenobi69420 Yeah no person under 45 listens to music from the 70s, also can am was from 66 to 87. And its not like there is a lot of love for music etc. from that era..... Your a marketing genius
@@GeneralKenobi69420 I'm 48 and i LOVE racing games and 70's music, but most racing games suck because they're all about modern racing VS vintage. I don't care about F1 or the various touring car series, or dumb modern 'supercars' that look like a place to put a bunch of goofy looking air vents that don't fit anywhere else.
I love that “deliciously complicated” line. My late grandpa taught me that you can always learn and improve. In his words “the car can always be faster”. So. cool that everyday the world of motorsport is constantly getting faster because of hungry engineers, mechanics, and drivers.
Faster cars, more intense battles.
You missed out AWD with torque vectoring (active diffs) for aiding cornering, acceleration and deceleration. Would act something like differential braking for corners (under engine braking), but works also on the exit (and also alters front to back for accel / decel on straights). Needs to be tied in to the active suspension and braking.
perhaps thruster and rudders. run turbines/fans from breaking
@@brade2681 and bazookas too, front and rear.
2:23 For a split second I thought I had just witnessed the most horrifying crash.
lol
same lol
Thank you for recognising Can-Am as one of the series which pioneered motor racing technology. I am delighted to have conversed with the great man himself, Jim Hall, at the Goodwood Festival of Speed in 1997. (He said the Chaparral 2 was the most fun to drive of all his cars).
Which variant?
Thanks for using the Italian TV MIVAR in this video, I miss it very much. It was an amazing brand.
"Engineers also added lightness..." 1:47
1:03 "the very aerodynamic looking head..." lmao
Why is it true, though 😭
Dont forget Tubercalls for the leading edge, Shark skin for body. And Owl wing for trailing edges.
Obscene 2000hp turboshaft-electric hybrid, with the excess thrust from the turbine exhaust used to energize the rear diffuser (or maybe even the entire floor as well)
Why not do like topfuel dragsters and use the exhaust pressure to push the car into the road?
The speed racer vibes are strong with this idea😂 love it.
@@MrMartinSchou lmao that's something, angle the turbine exit upwards, I reckon we can get at least a couple of kilonewtons of downforce out of that
@@pvtnewbIf we're ignoring rules, yes. Also, use something like 85% nitromethane and 15% alcohol like in top fuel, to really up the power production.
I would use excess thrust to suck the air from beneath the car by the way of Venturi effect. Simple, efficient, no extra equipment required.
19 min video just to hear an "I dont know" at the end...
Well done, well done!
But if you listened, you know why he doesnt know, and you leave vith more knowledge
Afraid to draw a conclusion because it could be the wrong one. Absolutely no journalistic integrity.
For the high Gs, one answer is to just do the more tires thing. More tires = the force divided up across more of them. Also, sequential sets of tires have been shown to be better for less ideal conditions like wet pavement, since the first rear tire just clears a path for the second rear tire. Having doubled and/or extra wide tires could work for the front too, if you are free to adjust the design of that area more.
One interesting idea though, if all the tires can turn 90+ degrees, you could have the car rotate almost sideways while in a turn, which would let you potentially use the LATERAL aerodynamics to take a little lateral pressure off the tires. Plus it would look like drifting even if the tires would still be actually maintaining grip, and people love watching drifting.
Edit: Also, by turning while the body is about sideways, the G forces on the driver would be front-to-back, which is MUCH easier to handle than side-to-side.
Something you didn't mention about active aero is that the downforce doesn't need to be singular between the left and right sides of the car. There was talks about increasing downforce on the inner side while turning to reduce bodyroll without needing stiffer springs, increasing both high speed aerodynamic grip and low speed mechanical grip.
Independently adjusting drag laterally across a car's cross section (e.g. putting something akin to an aircraft's rudder on the rear wing's supports, and something similar up front) would effectively let you yaw the car via airflow management, taking that lateral load off the tyres. Then its a strategy on whether you pull more peak lateral Gs, or the same peak Gs but longer tyre life.
Love these idea about yawing the car with rudder. Combining this with active suspension to keep the car level and adding air brakes the deploy to slow the car would make it extremely quick. Computer systems could also be use to adjust the control surfaces continuously.
I do believe eventually you'd get dozens of fans with some trained AI model that would decide how much power to give each fan for optimal performance.
"Aerodynamic 'head' of design"... i chuckled
Giving engineers no rules, except the natural ones, in competition is a magical experience. It really is an honor to have a rule created because you came up with a solution no one else did and it worked. The last point in this is actually one of the biggest, tires and wheels. It’s all pointless unless you put it all to the ground. Some concepts have actually already been tested, active air management in the tire, so ideal pressure all the time and a capability to introduce cooler air. You’re not constrained to F1 dimensions, figure out ideal width. Temperature is your biggest enemy, systems to keep the temperature down would be key
I remember the X2010 from Gran Turismo, I believe it had four-wheel steering as well. Too bad it was limited in where and how it could be run, only in a certain section of the game menu and a completely different drive from anything else but it was fun.
Still available in Assetto Corsa, even better actually
I hated driving that thing, I just couldn't keep up with it
It's still in GT7 and still faster than all hell, but the game has included even faster concept cars like the Dodge Tomahawk and it's 2500hp+ motor, active aero and sleek space looking shape.
Odd you saying about limited area to play in. I am almost positive I used it all over. Did you get it by beating Vettels time in the challenge?
@karlwithak.What a bad take 😂😂😂
For fans, consider gas turbines, jet engines. Both the intake can be utilized for vacuum as well as the exhaust for both directional thrust and utilizing venturi action for more vacuum. I've also thought about weight shifting. Probably possible only with electric cars where the battery is long, off center, and can be quickly shifted from one side to the other. I also think that wings could be actuated variably based on distance from the ground. That is also something that I think could be done in speedboat racing to keep the boat from going airborne.
I wouldn't use the jet inlet for underbody aero. Far too much chance of a FOD passing through & wrecking the turbine. A jet-blown diffuser could work though, but only if you're using the turbine to generate electrical power, not directly driving the wheels - jet throttle response is much slower than ICE throttle response, so you'd need some way to keep the jet spinning at high rpm to blow the diffuser.
So, jet powers electric, probably a supercapacitor to store the energy (lighter than a battery pack), electric motors to all wheels, probably with torque vectoring to aid turn-in & corner-exit, regen braking, active suspension, and active aero to aid braking on corner entry, downforce through corner, and reduce drag on the straights.
In theory, all of this is possible to do, but it would produce a car that NOBODY could drive. The car would be able of producing physical loads on the driver that would be unsustainable for a full race, even with a full G-suit.
Then there's the question of "what happens if it goes wrong?". All the systems that would be needed to make such a car practical, would need to be computer controlled, and even today, computers occasionally derp & cease working properly. Sensors fail, rf interference affects signals, competitors could jam telemetry, etc. What happens if the control system derps and sends the car airborne at 300+mph into a spectator stand???
F1 rules have mostly been slowing cars down since the mid 80's precisely for this reason. The technology has existed for decades - active aero? 1960's. Stupid power? 80's turbos. Active suspension? Early 90's. Gas turbine electricity generation? 50's(?). The technology all exists, but it is a historic fact that the safety standards of the sport has ALWAYS lagged behind the technology, and modern society just isn't prepared to allow a sport to be anywhere near as dangerous to spectators as a truly unregulated F1 series would be...
fastest quarter mile car has a fan now, the mcmurry spierling
Not a lot of thrust left over after it spins the PTT. A turboprop or turboshaft motor doesn't really contribute enough thrust to be relevant. But the amount of air it moves can provide an effect similar to the 2J's fans. All you have to do is put the intake under the nose of the car and you'll have negative pressure underneath. The articulating skirts could probably be ditched considering how low a modern F1 car sits and still get 80% of the downforce. Could put vortex generators underneath at the edges about midway down the car to help keep air from spilling in under the sides and potentially having no downforce or possibly even lift on the back of the car.
Wow! this video is very informative and understandable for non-experts like me. Well done
“It’s deliciously complicated.” 10:42 His description just made me remember all the ‘deliciously complicated’ ways I learned how air moves in our atmosphere in ‘Atmospheric Dynamics’ class. Good video! Thanks 👍🏼
I took intro to atmospheric science. But I'm also a certified aviation maintenance tech.
@@Lurch-Bot A&P!
I'm a bit surprised a thrust vectoring jet engine wasn't discussed. Removing the need for the wheels to transfer 100% of the power and cornering would make it a lot easier on them. Of course you could still have very powerful electric motors in the wheels for better acceleration as well as regenerative braking.
There's a Chaparral fantasy car on Gran Turismo that uses some sort of laser propulsion. It takes a bit to get used to driving with thrust, but it's very interesting once you have. Of course, it would take all the fun out of melting the windshield behind you😅
This material is so great and fun!!! Thank you for your videos. Just a suggestion: if you could put the numbers in metric system as a quote it’ll be very helpful to other people (kg, km/h, m, etc…) 😊
Great video, thanks! I actually think that the most interesting competition wouldn't be fully no rules like this, but more "here are your safety rules, your car must have four wheels, you can use this much energy (max battery size and fuel bladder volume), now go make the fastest machine", because not only would it make for incredibly fast cars, it would also make for incredibly efficient cars. The current F1 propulsion system has an efficiency unparalleled in road going ICE cars, and I would really love to see more effort in that direction, unfortunately I don't really see that happening with the new regulations coming.
I feel that one thing that could also play a huge role compared to the last decades is to have a fully integrated control system across all sensors and actuators, combining real-time all-wheel, all-axis torque-vectoring, active aero, active suspension, actively controlled fans, engine controller (if we are even opting for an internal combustion engine, depends on whether we are aiming for a single flying lap or a full race), etc. in a single "omniscient omnipotent" computer.
Funnily enough, this is the exact main premise of an anime from 1991! (Future GPX Cyber Formula), interesting how this show predicted some stuff in a way 30 years later (drs and kers, just cranked up to 11)
"You must obey the laws of physics" *car starts floating* "🤦🏻"
Toyota TS010: let me be the example of why rules exist
also the toyota IMSA 4 tonnes of downforce monster
I have an idea i'd like to comment about: I call it the "Golden Arrow" Project.
The basic format of it would be the Deltawing concept, with the front wheels being fitted inside the long beak. It would also have the Mercedes W11 front wing (or something similar to it), the X 2014 rear wing, and in the back, the blown difuser from the Brawn GP F1 car, along with the Chaparral 2J-like fans, powered by an independent eletric motor. Just like commented in the video, it would have the wheels fully covered, a closed cockpit and active aero.
As for the power of this machine, i was thinking about the W11 Mercedes again, take the engine used by that thing, but now with two turbos, no restrictions and maybe revving up to 20.000 RPM. This stays behind the cockpit and produces power to the rear wheels. The front wheels would be powered by two small Formula Student-grade eletric motors.
As for suspension, we can think about active suspension yes, but what about the possible benefits of hydro-elastic suspension? If we can get this to work, it might reduce weight, costs and complexity.
For the tires, the best thing we have now are the Pirelli P Zero tires already used in F1, and qe could call this same enterprise for the front wheels as well. Proper tires? Maybe within 10 years and about 10 billion dollars...
Finally, and most important, the driver must have fighter jet or aerospace grade training to handle the G's. One should consider the safety measures theses pilots have and how they could be applied to this project. And also consider updating the HANS device to prevent a catastrophic neck break at those 8 G's of force.
If you read until this point, please consider making a concept art of this car. Also, thank you for the attention.
W11 motor!!
You crazy, modern F1 motors are underpowered pieces of junks !
An old Renault F1 turbo from the 70th was double the power of a modern F1!!
We could easely make a 2000 2500 HP from a V8/V10 today (with short life)
You don't need wings on a car to generate downforce. You're just building an ostrich at that point. Ailerons on a racing bike would be useful though because those roll through turns instead of yawing. Could get much more precise lean angles, have downforce that always acts through the vertical axis of the bike (and is electronically variable) and eliminate the drag caused by countersteering. Don't even need the front wheel to articulate when racing so you could have a swingarm suspension without a bunch of complexity. Hell, with aerodynamics, you could eliminate the front wheel altogether, hypothetically. Would be easy to put an electromagnetic grid in a circuit and run magnetic repulsion hoverbikes. That's gonna be the future of racing.
Hi Scott, I love the amount of detail that you put into your videos. Would you be able to make a video about the evolution of the F1 car? If so that would be amazing. Thanks again
Hear me out… Turboshaft engine production close to 2000hp linked to a CVT for constant peak power driving the wheels. Streamline the body and have the intake partially underneath the car using the jet engine intake to suck air from under the floor making the vacuum. Angle the jet engine slightly downwards for more downforce and thrust to accelerate the car. You could even have active exhaust ports that blow exhaust out points on the car to help it turn. Obviously you are going to need active suspension and air brakes to slow the car so you don’t die
Jet engines are not good at rapidly changing speeds.
@@darkknightx0992that's the point of the CVT. You run the engine at peak power all the time and just adjust the gear ratio to change speed.
Punch that description in an AI image generator!
Here me out: The McMurtry Spierling....thats what an F1 car would be wirh no rules....its already been made
A large CVT will have problems - it has to transmit quite a lot of power through friction. But you could go with a proven way to accomplish that: A smaller turbogenerator, powering a hybrid system. The turbine generates power with no direct connection to the wheels, feeds a medium-sized battery-pack, which feeds four electric motors - one on each wheel - for quick throttle response, 4-wheel drive, regenerative braking, and torque vectoring. Granted, the batteries add weight, but not that much if you size everything properly. It would, though, probably be heavier than present F-1 powertrains - fuel weight, batteries, and four motors will all add up. Would that matter? Don't know.
Thumbnail made me think of RealRacing3. That car is insanely fast. MP4-X
And one of the most difficult to drive. Once you started sliding, you'd never stop till you hit a barrier.
It is more like the Red Bull X1 2010, though a great contender against MP4-X
@@Red_Bull_DieHardFan the livery of the car in the thumbnail is of the MP4-X
“The laws of physics must be followed” 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣 indeed had me balling
would love to see a no rules series to see what we can really do.
Marco Pavone is called "the aerodynamic-looking head of exterior design" - this is timeless!
I though he looked like a kewpie doll, but that's just me.
That no rules 919 Porsche set the all time lap record at the Nürburgring.
One step closer to Future GPX Cyber Formula
Or speed-racer with can-am
If I was in charge of F1 rules I would make it that a car had to be within certain physical dimensions and a spending cap. After that let the teams design the fastest possible car for the track they can. Would be so much more interesting to see the concepts
and safety rules
@@yutiros5174 yah obviously couldn’t purposefully attempt to cause harm to other cars/drivers
@@yutiros5174 Why is there always a safety nanny in the convo? If you don't want to climb into a machine, that is good on you. If somebody else wants to find out what is possible, why is that your business?
That is my dream, too. Spending cap, and fuel cap. Let the engineers take over. Much more interesting results!
I think theyd all just create somethink like the McMurtry Spierling
In the words of Alonso:"We put Rocketship!"
0:05 - Jeremy Clarkson in the Ariel Atom from the old Top Gear!! 🤣🤣 👍👍
Is that the fat one from former TopGear?
@sonnylatchstring of course😂
No rules? Red shells for everyone!!
I've never seen blue spelled like that before.
It would be called ”Car 1” after that
It feels like the Cyber Formula anime or the upcoming HIGHSPEED Etoile anime racing car.
I would love to see unruled F1. It would be 1000x more exciting
First things: I think you made too many restrictive rules. Four wheels? Why. Who can forget the Tyrrell P34. The rules I propose are:
1) There must be a driver.
2) The competition will be a season consisting of the race tracks used in the F1 season plus the Nurbergring; Goodwood; Pikes Peak; Isle of Mann TT; Le Mans 24; Santa Pod Raceway; and the Indianapolis Raceway Park over 1/4 mile and full mile in a straight line. This will ensure the winner is the most rounded car and in a game of Top Trumps - would be the undisputed overall best car.
3) The car must not fly (this is actually quite a hard rule to define but I am sure somebody can do this - and if per-chance, somebody developed a fly-by-wire hovercraft that had enough control to compete; I'd want to see that in the mix - I just don't want to limit engineers.)
4) The risk of driver dying or spectator dying must be no greater than twice that currently seen in F1, and a proving programme must be passed before racing. (Back in the early days of F1 - one driver would die every year out of a grid of approximately 15 drivers. It means that every driver had an almost seven percent chance of dying during a season, or if he raced for five seasons, he had a 1 in three chance of being killed driving an F1 car. I couldn't really enjoy something that dangerous, but put it out there that perhaps F1 has got too safe? I don't know.
In terms of cars, I was disappointed that your coverage of the McMurty was limited to a brief flash around 17 mins. This car has already wiped Lewis Hamilton's F1 record out at Silverstone mcmurtry.com/silverstone-gp-onboard-with-overtakes-mcmurtry-speirling-pure-vp1/ and several other notable records. This blend of technology looks like a winner to me. However - it's an EV, and we all know that battery technology is the limiting factor - especially as I've included the Le Mans 24 in my season.
So I put on my school-boy naive engineer's hat and asked myself "How can we fix that?" and my answer is "The Rotary Engine" as a Range Extender - but F1 style, and couple this with a super-capacitor array. This immediately sheds battery weight as you could go to 25% of the car's current load if you were able to generate enough energy to top it up. The Wankel seems perfect for this job because despite its faults (which Maxda seem to have fixed in the current MX-30 REX) it has an insane power to weight ratio. The emissions problems of old are not relevant as I will use some bio-eco-CO2 neutral fuel and there are plenty of candidates out there. Advances in metallurgy have allegedly fixed the reliability issues - plus this isn't an engine that needs to change revs - it is tuned to a constant speed to generate electricity and dump it into my super capacitor and battery (I wonder if I even need a battery if my capacitor can be topped up from my wankel). Now this is the killer bit -- the power to weight. A typical turbocharged V8 diesel engine might have an engine power of 340 hp and a mass of 840 lb, giving it a power-to-weight ratio of 0.40 hp/lb. A race tuned wankel design would be over 5 hp/lb!!!! Their designs are modular, so you can bolt them together to make insane HP - plus you get the benefits of eco-fossil fuel energy density - which should also reduce weight. I remain convinced that having a super-capacitor in the power train will be worth it as they remove the energy loss associated with battery charging, and I am betting that using regenerative braking to charge a super capacitor will be a good thing.
Loved the video ... just felt you missed some valid here and now technologies and world leading manufacturers.
i would make a category with no rules, but driven by IA, with no pilot, to be safe...that way you can get closer to the performance edge
"there must be 4 wheels" Uhhhh 1976 Tyrrell called and they have some news for you.
Now THAT was a cool car! Of course they and Williams were why they brought in that rule.
I've been saying this for years, and been pilloried on F1 forums, so I'm so glad others have thought the same. Similarly, I would like a sort of 'Touring Car' championship where all the cars MUST be UK road legal. To prove that they can't be too low, they would have to be driven on the roads prior to the race. Other than that, no rules.
6:49 ah, now I see where the cybertruck got its tough skin inspiration from
IIRC Bose (the headphones and stereos Bose) came up with some insane active suspension years ago. With current sensors and processing power I'm sure we could make either self-driving or remote-controlled or worse-case-scenario "drive by wire" with superhuman speed of adaptations to all details of the car per given situation.
Yes, bose suspension was insane and the result of decades of research. Renault Formula 1 came with insane active suspension too in 1992 that won championship and was promptly banned. imagine how much better active suspension could be today with computing power, camera & sensors, actuators and motors.. you can bring down the ground clearance close to zero, corner perfectly flat, and continuously adjust the pitch angle/ground effect. meaning also the camber can also be controlled indirectly and stay consistent. the problem is then if you rely on huge ground effect down force, if the active suspension fails, car gets further from the ground because of a curb taken too hard, you have a car suddenly losing grip, I think it was the reason behind the ban (remember the flying mercedes)
I thik its going to progressively come back into road cars . The purosangue has a TRUE active suspension but Ferrari is too conservative...they were afraid to create a flat cornering mode so they let the car have a some roll, to not disturb the drivers. But the tech is going in the right direction. small independent motors with worm gear, means its not hydraulic based like mercedes class S active suspension from 10 yeas ago or even older citroen active suspension
according to ferrari active suspension increased the lateral grip by 10% and the car is not even cornering flat
Absolutely awesome video!!! Great use of vintage video!
I didn't know about the Can-Am fan car, I thought that the Brabham / Murray fan car was the first one. Thanks!
there was also the 2021 McMurtry Spéirling car that broke the Goodwood festival of speed record.
@@justmejustme4444 That car is incredible. Mat Watson from Carwow has driven loads of quick cars including a Bugatti Chiron and a RimavNevera. He did 0-60 in 1.49 seconds in the McMurtry and was rendered speechless. Gordon Murray's also got a fan in his new T50, which makes sense as he designed the Brabham!
I was just asking this question 5 mins ago and this video appears! Perfect timing
One exotic way to address cornering forces is to have the cockpit roll to make the forces always be "down" to the driver rather than lateral.
It would add a bit of weight, but staying conscious is likely to improve lap times.
How about active skirts? You add an actuator on each end, and you can make the skirts ride as low as you want, following road contours.
Capparel 2j i am not wrong
If you rolled long lengths of skirt material up you could constantly feed it out with rotational actuators as it is worn away by the track surface. And add new rolls during pitstops...
1:05 'very aerodynamic looking head', then I look at his hair lol
"added lightness" is certainly a description
Dump the piston engine. Andy Granatelli proved just how superior the turbine is for road racing. He used off the shelf aero engines which were quite heavy compared to what could be made for a dedicated race application and STILL mopped the floor with his competition. Costs would go down. No more $100, 000 for a set of 8 pistons. One engine last a whole season, maybe longer. No more gasoline.
As many nopes as I have.
Interesting, I didn’t realise Adrian Newey had dreams when they power him down…
First rule above all else in the racing world is safety, next is power and aero. So before they design and aero package that would make racing more competitive but without sacrificing safety and even improving it then this has all the hallmarks of a legendary car. I think they should slacken more of the competitive rules in F1 cars. Allow them up to 1,200 horse power as well as any engine they want with a limit of 12 cylinders and free rein on Aero design but they also have to make them safer as well. Allow them their choice of wheel rim size and tyre size as well. Do this and F1 will be more competitive and more interesting and fun to watch.
I was at Pikes Peak for that amazing run of the ID R. It’s so much smaller than it looks. Pretty incredible.
I would love to see a “No Rules” racing class ….. It would probably need remote viewing because it would be going so fast. Very saleable around the world. Fingers crossed.
Another thing you could do, is change the fuel.
With NitroMethane fuel, you can get up to about 600 HP per litre of displacement.
This means less weight, smaller engine, smaller vehicle, less drag.
i've seen that Sunoco Can-Am porsche at the Porsche museum in Stuttgart..... it really is a beast
What about the drivetrain? Would it be better to have a 4wd system to improve acceleration, or simply a rwd system to keep the weight and complexity down? And what about the use of a hybrid power system ?
I imagine you'd need a hybrid engine at the very least. Part of what makes the fan so effective on the McMurtry Spierling over the old Chapparel 2J is being electric. Means the fan had a smooth power source for the dame level of fan suction at all times. Part of the issue with the 2J is the fans were tied to the ICE, meaning the same issues with delivering smooth power exist for the fan.
As for drivetrain, MR is probably the way to go. Best responsiveness for minimal weight. Most of the cars on this list were MR.
8:37 That's clearly an MR design.
I was also thinking active differentials, so you can vector the power around corners
Unnecessary because the have fans, which are far lighter than including mechanicals for AWD, plus the fans can be turned controlled by onboard to increase aero when necessary and reduce when not needed.
The NO_RULE racing would be encouraged and will draw million audience. I love this idea.
8G’s at full break would literally make you black tf out 😳 lol you have to do fighter jet training and learn how to AGSM breathing just to drive these things and stay awake 😂
"oops, we accidentally built a particle accelerator!"
I was mildly disappointed when the option of maglev wasn't brought up.
E wheels, fits a driver, and follows the laws of physics.
Yup these 3 rules are all you need, anything else is excessive
I feel like jet engines might have some role here: Having a second source of acceleration that doesn’t rely on wheel grip would give you a huge advantage in the acceleration and top speed departments. Using thrust reversers like on commercial jets could also improve your braking. If you could find some way to push sideways as well, you’d be able to turn harder, too!
The suction from the engine’s intake might also be able to function as a downforce fan.
Speaking of fans, a movable skirt could help seal off the underside of the car better.
And, as an added advantage, a massive plume of four-figure temperature gas behind your vehicle would potentially discourage opponents drafting.
cool ideas
Jet engines are against the spirit of a ground race. Everyone knows their fast, faster than a car. Anyone can strap a jet engine to something and make it go faster than a wheel driven car. The challenge comes from maximizing the speed you can gain from wheel traction and power. The moment you strap a jet engine to a car, you’re a wingless plane.
@@Chronicleropejet engines are used in many type of ground-based and water-based vehicles, including tanks, speedboats, and the current land and water speed record holders. The question wasn't "what if F1 had some rules everyone followed" but "what if F1 had NO rules".
I think for a car race, rules requiring that the majority of vehicle speed come from tires in contact with the ground would be entirely reasonable, as would rules against making a car as wide as the track to prevent passing or rules against vehicle-mounted weaponry. But those would still be rules, and thus out of the parameter of the question.
@@PaleImperator correct .
If formula one had no rules it would actually be good again lol