Thank you Dom for actually pointing out how it looks like the coaching staff at Fly is to blame , it’s baffling that after getting a decent roster on paper nothing has improved since spring split
He’s getting paid to not play and look for a team for the rest of the split while not having to play for the embarrassing roster that is GG this honestly is the biggest w for him
I really relate, to what Dom says about Team Fan/Player fan. I am from EU, and there has been some nights that I would skip watching LCS because it is pretty late and you don't want to watch a game without your favorite player, in my case it is Alphari.
tbh I can't stand watching the LCS anymore. It's like watching a homeless guy saying "look what I can do" then he eats shit, dies, comes back to life and says "Look what I can do" and it just loops for years.
@@BlackEcology LEC has it's problem but it's nowhere near as bad as NA. Can you even imagine what NA would look like without all the EU players it imports? It wouldn't even qualify as a wildcard region. Also, you mention G2 is bad right now, but you completely ignore that the League is more competitive than ever with Rogue and MAD as international contenders.
Straight facts. Having a playoffs of 8 out of 10 teams is the dumbest shit i have ever see. Is like the Vienam LoL scene where they only got like 4 teams and they all go to playoffs and play each other a millions times.
WTH is going on with Licorice. The guy doesn't play any soloq at all, and he is currently Plat 1 after a hefty loss streak before he stopped playing. Talk about mentally booming.
i think relegation would be a good thing, so the shit orgs can't continue with THAT level of shit anymore. more teams wouldn't really help though. its just 2 more teams that aren't worth it and more boring games to watch.
@@mithenmedina540 loco had no place in the public scene . From getting dropped for sexual harassment to getting replaced for not having the decency to hide personal dispute against a host on a show he was getting paid on . Glad he’s off TH-cam and the league scene
Before I continue watching the show, I just wanted to comment on LS' thoughts about orgs lying about roster swaps for the past 7-8 month. Abedage is a great exception, S04 said they're running out of business and selling Players, and on the other hand 100T said they go with Abedage, cuz he's better than their current midlaners.
I don't understand why orgs fail to realize that people are fans of the players and not the teams. This isn't like real sports where you support your local team, or your national team, in every event. Most people have no loyalty to the brands because why would they? C9 isn't like, "the Washington team" where everyone from there will support them through thick and thin. We support the personalities and when the fan-favourites leave so too does their fanbase.
Dom is right I was a huge flyquest fan during 2020 Summer and Worlds because of the roster Seeing them sell everyone and take a nose dive in the standings pushed me far away It only pushed me to watch the other teams in which the the original players ended up
Same. In the end I ended up being an Immortals fan because I like Revenge and they seem like thr team making the most with a really meh roster. Current FLY is the opposite
One of the main reasons that i think that there no hardcore team fans is that there is nothing to connect fans with teams. Esports teams in contrast to traditional sports do not represent anything like a city or a certain group of people, they are more like represented by their players and so they have nothing to tie down a fan with a certain organisation except for its long existance.
I only watch HLE for Chovy and that's getting rough cause his team so bad. Hope he leaves. Hell TSM has been nothing but pain to watch since Bjerg left. At least Spica is there
I watch HLE for Deft and Chovy as I've been a massive Deft fan for years. Deft is still doing Deft things (Inting and popping off in cycles) but generally it's just torture to watch the team crumble around Chovy. Yohan demolished my mental state...
@@NotASummoner I've liked Deft for a long time too but he ain't it no more. His "pop-offs" are so few and far between its not worth. He's kinda washed. Maybe you could say he needs a better support but idk man. At this point I only have faith in Chovy. It's like watching Old TSM at this point lol.
If there were a few more weeks in the split, I would feel confident saying Solo is gonna be back starting in GG, but there's probably not enough time for that to happen this year.
I don't get what GG are trying to achieve anymore. We started the year as them trying to have a developement roster, now they bring in licorice which is performing really badly and arguably doesn't really have much development. Are they just trying to make play-offs and call that a success, are they trying to develop a roster for next year? I have 0 clue at this point
They went back on their word and are trying to find a way to basically "explode" a new roster onto the scene to either get more hype, fans, or lucky wins. Im definitely thinking they abandoned the long term and are looking short term now though.
@@lordgvh5902 the problem is, with licorice and the rest of the team, what are you going to achieve short term? 8th place and get eliminated 1st playoffs game? Weird thing to try and achieve
They signed Inero. The most overrated piece of trash on the LCS scene. The dude is straight up trash as a coach,manager and decision making. They just can't do anything good and yet everyone praising him and when someone call him out for his mediocrity he start blaming everything on "infrastructure" and everyone else, but not himself. Look at his track Record. Failed at Echo Fox, Failed at OCE and has been failing at GGS in both Academy and LCS. Hunter is another garbage CEO or whatever his role is inside GGs. The guy knows absolutely anything about League of Legends. He's just there stealing paychecks from the Golden State Warriors. Nobody is calling his idiot out for being awful what he do?. Travis keep protecting his ass, nobody on the scene mention how this dude is doing nothing to make this org better. A clueless CEO or whatever signed and give hand off control to a failure of a coach/gm/decision making. of course you will fail as a ORG
5:15 Strong disagree with LS. The manner in which you say something is indeed important. Even in written work, this is true. This is more important if you're actively trying to influence something. LS and Dom have always come across to me as aggressive and hostile. It's great on the outside, where someone can just take it or leave it, but a team's interpersonal dynamic can be gravely damaged if the wrong person or the wrong tone is used to convey a message, regardless of the truth of that message.
Think his point was the message is the same, what changes is your perspection of it. If I yell at you that the earth is round or wisper it doesnt matter, the earth is still round. If you want to listen to what I say tho is what changes
Criticizing the tone of a factual message, is an ad hominem and an anti debate tactic. It detracts from the validity of the message by attacking the tone rather than the message itself.
That's not his point though. He's not saying that the manner doesn't matter. He is saying it doesn't change the truthfulness of the subject matter. I agree with you, tone and phrasing matters, whether that's in education, science or literature. BUT that's not the argument.
@@Arqunited I agree that it can be used that way, as a chosen tactic to shut down the debate, but it could also be reactionary. Engaging in debate with someone that you have prejudiced to be a hostile debater (which I believe LS might be) seems to be a primary lead-in to Ad Hominem, because it feels like you have to deal with your opponent before you can deal with their argument.
@@gobucket8128 His point suggests to me that as long as he's spouting the truth, it doesn't matter how he gets it across, which is a mistake made by the entire league community.
Dom, could you do a video of some examples of good teams forcing teams into bad decisions with their leads? Show us what kind of things these teams do and the set ups they use?
I think one of the problems with play styles in NA is that teams like TSM and Liquid dominated NA for so long by playing passive and capitalizing on worse teams mistakes. Therefore top teams have a tendency to go “if it ain’t broke don’t fix it”
I’m confused, am I supposed to be mad/anger by Greg Kim being hired by CLG or am I supposed to be happy? head of esports sounds like what In soccer a director of futbol is called. Director of Football generally is in charge of the hiring and firing of managers/coaches, scouting, recruitment of players, long-term strategy and the improvement of facilities. Their responsibilities can vary from club to club, with some being heavily involved in all aspects of the business, including the hiring and firing of managers, scouting, recruitment of players, long-term strategy and some being heavily involved in all aspects of the business.
I don't think swapping a well performing academy roster into LCS is a bad idea. It's happened in other games, in fact to Virtus Pro's Dota team TWICE. Both times their amateur team VPP ended up outperforming the main roster in events with open qualifications, and as a result were promoted and the team has continued to remain relevant, even looking strong against international competition. It seems like the smart move would be the full roster swap, and THEN integrating Josedeodo like the panel suggested. They already proved the new roster has the right mentality to at least play spoiler, and that's a good starting point.
5:14 @LS. It may not change the subject matter but it DOES CHANGE how people react. If you shout and use insults people automatically get defensive. It's human nature. If you want to show someone what they are doing wrong and want them to take your advice then you should take care how you phrase your sentences. Generally speaking. It also helps a ton if one doesn't use direct words like "you". Instead of saying "Why did you do that, can't you see that roaming is the right choice here?!" one should/could say "I think that roaming would've been the right choice here." They convey the same information but the other person won't feel attacked and get defensive. Then one can talk and discuss the topic calmly.
@@TheBR4INP4IN but he never seems to do it. It's like saying "I won't steal money because I know its bad" and then proceed to do it. I watch LS enough and like his content a lot but I personally think that sometimes he just is straight up mean. Even though he is right.
Tone policing is used for the person of higher power or privilege to silence others below them or without as much control, not ppl telling you your tone when discussing someone is shitty, cmon you can look that up LS
"anti-debate tactic based on criticizing a person for expressing emotion. Tone policing detracts from the validity of a statement by attacking the tone in which it was presented rather than the message itself." Did you look it up?
God, there was just so much wrong in this split and so much information revealed that it's like the serious, otherworldy qualities that made the pro scene so grandeur for spectators is crumbling down. Nobody watches EG face a team thinking they want to watch the best players in our region perform, at this point they're thinking "how's jizuke going to throw this match?" Proview and roster swaps just inflated (or drew eyes to) the problems we've already seen and if it doesn't get better soon, then who can say the LCS will last another 5 years? It's scary to think about.
It’s like saying something like courage made 100T popular which is true. Although the team already had a fan base, the streamer gets more views and hits and grows its fan base.
@@Ice_Icemb 🧢 100T was popular because of Nadeshot and then the drama with Nickmercs. Yeah Jack has contributed greatly but definitely isn’t popular because of him.
"Non-specialists hiring specialists never works, because it can't work." Who, then, should hire a team's GM? Is he saying a team which has executive leadership who are generally skilled in org operations and administration can never find a GM who can find a coach? Is he suggesting the players hire their GM? Or teams that aren't literally owned by currently high ranked pro players should be dissolved? What world-state is LS arguing for here I genuinely don't see it.
People who never have even touched the games are making these kind of descions, buisnessmen who literllay dont know anything about anything are making choices for these teams. So whenever people at the top are hiring people who dont know the ups and downs of who there hiring or if there even qualified to do the job at hand theres a issue.
@@Lamestreet1 I wonder if part of the problem is that the scene is so new? I'm sure there's some favoritism going on. That being said, I do wonder how many industry veterans/former pros are actually trying to get these jobs
@@Lamestreet1 right, no, like I can comprehend his words. That's not the problem here. What I'm asking is who, in these multimillion dollar brands most of which have operations involving content, multiple games, apparel brands, etc. Who is he suggesting is supposed to make these decisions. And would those "specialists" be competent in the wider business operations of the organization?
@@chancewestonjordan Right. But also like... that's what they do. Like The orgs have a COO, then a director of esports, then sometimes a LoL GM, then a head coach. There are the odd cases of like TSM and maybe TL with Steve who have hands on owners, but that's rare. But the standard in the industry is still these tiers of organization, getting more specialized the further down you get. But at the end of the day, the COO and Director of eSports... those guys aren't supposed to be game matter experts.
@@vegacareless do you think ls knows shit about orgs? a gm's job isn't to coach people, his job is to keep shit in the org afloat, ofc a gm would be chosen by higher ups, what the fuck would a na lcs rank 1 18 years old know about management?
I agree with the take on C9 vs TSM, but I got flamed. People thought that it was a fucking clean game by TSM when it clearly wasn't. They argue that it's because of cloud soul. BUT BRO.... TSM got like 3 barons 2 elders cloud soul, and like DOM said, the game ended at lvl 1 when Vulcan ran it down. it's still a 40 minute game?!
I rarely watch LCS anymore I just wait for semis and finals. It is a clown fiesta in game and out with the orgs. Players are being treated badly, incompetent management of orgs, and young talent getting gatekept or screwed over. It is just so annoying and sad to watch.
It's ironic tho. When a ORG tries to put the new players everyone complaint and start defending the players getting benched and stop watching their games. LoL Fans are not fans of ORG they are fans of players
@@RomnysGonzalez Whats ironic tho? People are pissed cause the orgs are benching the best players on the team while replacing them with sub-par players who are either hardstuck academy for years or washed LCS players who are just clinging on like just take a look at academy HALF OF THEM ARE FORMER LCS PLAYERS FROM YEARS AGO. It is VERY RARE that orgs actually try to scout new talent because orgs are lazy and would rather throw money at imports praying the team will work out. Nothing is new and exciting it is the same people being recycled. It is so dumb and tiring to watch LCS in game and the incompetency happening outside of the game. Sorry got too ranty but I am just super pissed what happened to our region and if it goes downhill orgs have no one to blame but themselves.
So team fan vs player fan seems very difficult for new teams. Clearly teams from the old guard like CLG TSM C9 TL (also have won something) has a much easier time getting a team fan base even Dig has some fans of the team. However is anyone out there really a GG/immortal/FQ fan? I think 100 thieves actually has made the template for new teams getting a team fan base. One invest smart in players for winning in the future. Two they have heavily invested in popular streamers and good PR Valykrae & Yassuo etc. This is what needs to be done the brand itself has personality. The player should not have the ability to take your fans from you. If he is benched for valid reasons like underperformance/Toxic DARDOCH!
Man I feel terrible for josedeodo I actually was super hyped to hear he was coming to NA and was ready to see him show his true potential in a more popular and major region. He looked like a shining star on his team at worlds and honestly I thought he was gonna do amazing here too. He is just in a terrible position IMO licorice regressed a shit ton and looks like the worst top laner, while paradox was smurf in academy last year he just hasn’t lived up to the hype and looks mediocre and Johnson just seems like he mental boomed and just doesn’t care anymore especially with the crab thing. I think Johnson is just a mad player at this point and doesn’t try to win anymore. The only time flyqueat gets anything done or atleast makes a play is purely off of Jose he’s the only proactive one and is someone who actively looks to get something done all of which it feels like the rest of his team doesn’t do. maybe I’m blind and bias but I just think Jose is much better then shown so far in the lcs and if potentially a team like team liquid might be struggling with their new jg since Santorin is injured I’m taking a chance on Jose and putting him on the squad instead of armao. Once again I could be bias and wrong but honestly I feel like Jose is a good player
Respectfully disagree with Dom on the TSM vs C9 point. What we learned is both are good teams (in the context of NA). C9 was able to stabilize a losing game. And TSM were able to choke C9 out methodically. I really really disagree with people's assessments on when teams end the game. Ultimately no one looks back on Ali's fights and says "Ya but he should've ended this one 4 rounds sooner" They only remember he won the fight and that he was a champion. So if TSM,C9,100T win NALCS then this whole point of being "unable to end games" will be irrelevant. Also if you're doing objective analysis. You should be looking at the difference between say TSM this week and TSM at the beginning of the split. That way you get a legitimate comparison to compare to. Not game to game. Or week to week. Improvements that are consistent can't be made that fast. Because all this ends up looking like is Hot takes like Skip Bayless.
But it does matter. If you don't win when you have the chance, the other team gets chances to beat you that shouldnt exist. Like that c9 vs tsm game where c9 whas 10k ahead at 15 minutes and they lost. Thats what it means being unable to end when you should, against better competition they will be more and more likely to lose
@@yondres but we shouldn’t be talking about “against better competition”. Because unless they win or place high in na they never get to face it. They also get to bootcamp to “learn how to”. This is why I believe na teams actually suck internationally. They spend all split shadow boxing against international competition they don’t actually learn anything. They try to achieve things before ever creating a foundation built upon their region.
@@jonlane6527 oh but im not Just talking about international competition. Take last summer playoffs as an example: ggs was 2-0 up against tsm and they couldnt close game 5 having multiple opportunities to do so, until fbi inted really hard. Then tsm won the split, when they should not have reached even semis if their opponents knew how to finish
@@yondres that’s certainly one angle to narrate that. Or you could narrate it that the veteran tsm squad found or created opportunities to come back and then reverse swept. In traditional sports they like to use the term the stage is too bright. Teams suffer from that when they aren’t quite ready to be in the big dance.
I dont get dom saying TSM botlane won by default, they set up the brush and even if vulcan wards they have naut to hook him in. After that they split the map FORCING c9 in to playing defensive bot, then they stacked the wave called spica over en killed them. Is that not forcing an enemy into makeing a choice between to evils? Yes they should have closed it out earlier, but to say they got a free win and that they dindt do anything because a lv 1, i mean cmon. Then every game a team is only winning because they enemy team makes mistakes. C9 is also shit for that matter
LS is the Ben Shapiro of LoL lots of fast jabbering without substance lmao All of his stuff about hiring practices just sounds like a twelve year old talking about "being an engineer and all those mean managers ruining his work"
LS is talking about tone policing? Come on use common sense. If you want to tell a friend they need to lose wieght, you dont say "you are a fat piece of crap lose wieght. You may say "Hey i think you would be happier with a healthier lifestyle".
lock cam when moving to fights is probably because his team is calling for him to join a fight and he trusts his team so he doesn't even look. still bad overall
Thank you Dom for actually pointing out how it looks like the coaching staff at Fly is to blame , it’s baffling that after getting a decent roster on paper nothing has improved since spring split
dgon deserves a shoutout for his ability to summarize then segway between subjects S tier hosting
I got a mental picture of Dgon riding a Segway around his room lol
He’s improved so much since back in the days with loco and you can tell he tries to improve every episode
dGon is the Glue Man. RIP Solo 🙏 get this man decent infrastructure
I get tired of seeing this. His champ pool arent carrys, plays tanks, and still gets caught out on weak side. Why are you rooting for him?
@@xthaking because every single team he plays on improves, and when they get rid of him, they always get worse
@@xthaking Plenty of pros/ analysts praise his weak side play
He’s getting paid to not play and look for a team for the rest of the split while not having to play for the embarrassing roster that is GG this honestly is the biggest w for him
@@YNOBLITZ Lol, this is a great point
the facecheck hosts are the best combo ever god this show makes me happy
I really relate, to what Dom says about Team Fan/Player fan. I am from EU, and there has been some nights that I would skip watching LCS because it is pretty late and you don't want to watch a game without your favorite player, in my case it is Alphari.
tbh I can't stand watching the LCS anymore. It's like watching a homeless guy saying "look what I can do" then he eats shit, dies, comes back to life and says "Look what I can do" and it just loops for years.
lol wtf
Ahaha
Well, that's one way to put it, I suppose
based
@@BlackEcology LEC has it's problem but it's nowhere near as bad as NA. Can you even imagine what NA would look like without all the EU players it imports? It wouldn't even qualify as a wildcard region.
Also, you mention G2 is bad right now, but you completely ignore that the League is more competitive than ever with Rogue and MAD as international contenders.
Can we please talk about the fact that there's 8 teams in playoffs? What's the point of a season? No wonder there's tons of lackadaisical play.
IMO playoffs should be top 4 teams, that way teams actually need to win during the regular season.
@@varelasensei i would even settle for a top 5 and 6th gauntlet spot.
For 6 play off teams
Straight facts. Having a playoffs of 8 out of 10 teams is the dumbest shit i have ever see. Is like the Vienam LoL scene where they only got like 4 teams and they all go to playoffs and play each other a millions times.
@@varelasensei should have stayed 6 tbh
and no actual relegations
WTH is going on with Licorice. The guy doesn't play any soloq at all, and he is currently Plat 1 after a hefty loss streak before he stopped playing. Talk about mentally booming.
He thinks it isnt a productive practice enviourment. He does 1v1's and scrims
@@jeyserreacts3444 I'm sure FlyQuest and Golden Guardians have productive practice environments when they are the worst teams in the LCS.
@@varelasensei as i know he did that while he was at c9 too. Idk if it its good or not.
My theory is... He played so much 1v1 than he forgot the game got other 9 players on the map and forgot a role called Jungle often visit your lane
GODLY ULTRA INSTINCT LICORICE APPEARED FOR GOLDEN GUARDIANS HE IS THE SECOND COMING OF JESUS YOU HAVE NEVER BEEN MORE WRONG IN YOUR LIFE.
Dgon should have a section where LS and Dom both have to say something positive about what they say in LCS
end franchising in LCS, bring back relegation, add more teams
i think relegation would be a good thing, so the shit orgs can't continue with THAT level of shit anymore.
more teams wouldn't really help though. its just 2 more teams that aren't worth it and more boring games to watch.
@@MrLowbob i think the combination of teams not being able to directly buy their way into an lcs spot plus relegation would make for a better league
@@mayachun7778 me too, i just think that more teams in and of itself wouldn't do anything good. but relegations would be nice.
I think the best ever Roster Swap was the one involving LS and Loco... lol
I liked loco, he gave a sense of balance to the show
Yeah I liked both of them. Honestly miss Loco’s league content I think it was really well done.
@@cousin_of_dora agreed
@@mithenmedina540 loco had no place in the public scene . From getting dropped for sexual harassment to getting replaced for not having the decency to hide personal dispute against a host on a show he was getting paid on . Glad he’s off TH-cam and the league scene
@@anthonydominguez4744 oh? Sexual harassment? When was this?
If Dom is casting LPL, I guess I am watching
Hey Venn can you upload this shit on Spotify or something. I wanna listen to this on commute
Agree
I can’t wait for the Summer 2021 LCS documentary in a couple of years
Breaking point 2 Ft. Alphari
Holy smokes Just realised that with the current standings a team with a winrate of less than 30% would make playoffs 9-24 = 27%
Yeah, but they would need to be good all of a sudden and win all their next games, which is unlikely
Before I continue watching the show, I just wanted to comment on LS' thoughts about orgs lying about roster swaps for the past 7-8 month. Abedage is a great exception, S04 said they're running out of business and selling Players, and on the other hand 100T said they go with Abedage, cuz he's better than their current midlaners.
28:00 who was LS talking about there i didnt get that
im thinking its jiizuke
@@SSJGohan2000YT why do they keep picking on jiizuke
It's not clear, but my guess would be Yusui
99% sure its jiizuke.
@@BloodMC yes but what's wrong with jiizuke, he's pretty good when he's not inting, most lcs mids int a lot
I don't understand why orgs fail to realize that people are fans of the players and not the teams. This isn't like real sports where you support your local team, or your national team, in every event. Most people have no loyalty to the brands because why would they? C9 isn't like, "the Washington team" where everyone from there will support them through thick and thin. We support the personalities and when the fan-favourites leave so too does their fanbase.
Dom is right
I was a huge flyquest fan during 2020 Summer and Worlds because of the roster
Seeing them sell everyone and take a nose dive in the standings pushed me far away
It only pushed me to watch the other teams in which the the original players ended up
Same. In the end I ended up being an Immortals fan because I like Revenge and they seem like thr team making the most with a really meh roster. Current FLY is the opposite
Ayone got a confirm on the secret mid laner?
One of the main reasons that i think that there no hardcore team fans is that there is nothing to connect fans with teams. Esports teams in contrast to traditional sports do not represent anything like a city or a certain group of people, they are more like represented by their players and so they have nothing to tie down a fan with a certain organisation except for its long existance.
League of legends is a sport where you are fans of the players and not of the ORG because the ORG do nothing to connect with fans.
I only watch HLE for Chovy and that's getting rough cause his team so bad. Hope he leaves. Hell TSM has been nothing but pain to watch since Bjerg left. At least Spica is there
I watch HLE for Deft and Chovy as I've been a massive Deft fan for years. Deft is still doing Deft things (Inting and popping off in cycles) but generally it's just torture to watch the team crumble around Chovy. Yohan demolished my mental state...
@@NotASummoner I've liked Deft for a long time too but he ain't it no more. His "pop-offs" are so few and far between its not worth. He's kinda washed. Maybe you could say he needs a better support but idk man. At this point I only have faith in Chovy. It's like watching Old TSM at this point lol.
TH-cam. Find out who that player they were talking about in 28:12 is!
did you find out?
Love the dynamic of this podcast, informative, humorous and downright cynical 🤣
If there were a few more weeks in the split, I would feel confident saying Solo is gonna be back starting in GG, but there's probably not enough time for that to happen this year.
I don't get what GG are trying to achieve anymore. We started the year as them trying to have a developement roster, now they bring in licorice which is performing really badly and arguably doesn't really have much development. Are they just trying to make play-offs and call that a success, are they trying to develop a roster for next year? I have 0 clue at this point
They went back on their word and are trying to find a way to basically "explode" a new roster onto the scene to either get more hype, fans, or lucky wins. Im definitely thinking they abandoned the long term and are looking short term now though.
@@lordgvh5902 the problem is, with licorice and the rest of the team, what are you going to achieve short term? 8th place and get eliminated 1st playoffs game? Weird thing to try and achieve
They signed Inero. The most overrated piece of trash on the LCS scene. The dude is straight up trash as a coach,manager and decision making. They just can't do anything good and yet everyone praising him and when someone call him out for his mediocrity he start blaming everything on "infrastructure" and everyone else, but not himself. Look at his track Record. Failed at Echo Fox, Failed at OCE and has been failing at GGS in both Academy and LCS.
Hunter is another garbage CEO or whatever his role is inside GGs. The guy knows absolutely anything about League of Legends. He's just there stealing paychecks from the Golden State Warriors. Nobody is calling his idiot out for being awful what he do?. Travis keep protecting his ass, nobody on the scene mention how this dude is doing nothing to make this org better. A clueless CEO or whatever signed and give hand off control to a failure of a coach/gm/decision making. of course you will fail as a ORG
For 27:09 are u guys talking about Yusui?
Has to be Jiizuke, no? If Dom asks is it the guy Im thinking. Also Nasus support...
who is the mid at arund 28:00?
5:15 Strong disagree with LS. The manner in which you say something is indeed important. Even in written work, this is true. This is more important if you're actively trying to influence something. LS and Dom have always come across to me as aggressive and hostile. It's great on the outside, where someone can just take it or leave it, but a team's interpersonal dynamic can be gravely damaged if the wrong person or the wrong tone is used to convey a message, regardless of the truth of that message.
Think his point was the message is the same, what changes is your perspection of it. If I yell at you that the earth is round or wisper it doesnt matter, the earth is still round. If you want to listen to what I say tho is what changes
Criticizing the tone of a factual message, is an ad hominem and an anti debate tactic. It detracts from the validity of the message by attacking the tone rather than the message itself.
That's not his point though. He's not saying that the manner doesn't matter. He is saying it doesn't change the truthfulness of the subject matter. I agree with you, tone and phrasing matters, whether that's in education, science or literature. BUT that's not the argument.
@@Arqunited I agree that it can be used that way, as a chosen tactic to shut down the debate, but it could also be reactionary. Engaging in debate with someone that you have prejudiced to be a hostile debater (which I believe LS might be) seems to be a primary lead-in to Ad Hominem, because it feels like you have to deal with your opponent before you can deal with their argument.
@@gobucket8128 His point suggests to me that as long as he's spouting the truth, it doesn't matter how he gets it across, which is a mistake made by the entire league community.
why is this not on spotify or apple podcasts
It used to be
How may people wanna bet the D1 peak with gifted acc is Jizzlords’?
The best streamer in LCS
What games did they say dom is gonna color cast?
Poor Jose I was so hyped to watch him play but he doesn’t have a team that plays off him well :(
I think it should be Tripple + Jose as starters. Tripple is a control mage player a lot like PoE.
narvuntien nooooo, NXI with triple/kumo is so clean
Dom, could you do a video of some examples of good teams forcing teams into bad decisions with their leads? Show us what kind of things these teams do and the set ups they use?
Does anyone know who the D1 Korea player was that starts in LCS
My bet is on pobelter
I'm guessing yasui, maybe palafox
@PureEclipse ok, yusui
Is this podcast going to go on spotify? I listen to a lot of podcasts during work, and it would be cool if this was on there.
Imp is super famous on chinese streaming, and that sad stream he has was only like two months ago, imp is making tons of cash and hes back
I think one of the problems with play styles in NA is that teams like TSM and Liquid dominated NA for so long by playing passive and capitalizing on worse teams mistakes. Therefore top teams have a tendency to go “if it ain’t broke don’t fix it”
38:00 Doms not wrong here, if this was a best of 5 or 3 even that is not going to happen again.
Yea but in a bo5 one game could the difference in winning the match. Imagine FNC vs TES and FNC got an extra win based on a lvl 1
I’m confused, am I supposed to be mad/anger by Greg Kim being hired by CLG or am I supposed to be happy?
head of esports sounds like what In soccer a director of futbol is called. Director of Football generally is in charge of the hiring and firing of managers/coaches, scouting, recruitment of players, long-term strategy and the improvement of facilities. Their responsibilities can vary from club to club, with some being heavily involved in all aspects of the business, including the hiring and firing of managers, scouting, recruitment of players, long-term strategy and some being heavily involved in all aspects of the business.
I don't think swapping a well performing academy roster into LCS is a bad idea. It's happened in other games, in fact to Virtus Pro's Dota team TWICE. Both times their amateur team VPP ended up outperforming the main roster in events with open qualifications, and as a result were promoted and the team has continued to remain relevant, even looking strong against international competition. It seems like the smart move would be the full roster swap, and THEN integrating Josedeodo like the panel suggested. They already proved the new roster has the right mentality to at least play spoiler, and that's a good starting point.
5:14 @LS. It may not change the subject matter but it DOES CHANGE how people react. If you shout and use insults people automatically get defensive. It's human nature.
If you want to show someone what they are doing wrong and want them to take your advice then you should take care how you phrase your sentences. Generally speaking.
It also helps a ton if one doesn't use direct words like "you". Instead of saying "Why did you do that, can't you see that roaming is the right choice here?!" one should/could say "I think that roaming would've been the right choice here." They convey the same information but the other person won't feel attacked and get defensive. Then one can talk and discuss the topic calmly.
His point is that it shouldnt change how people react, and its been known that kindly giving feedback is not as effective.
He acknowledged that tho one second later lol. Thats exactly what they agreed on...??
@@TheBR4INP4IN but he never seems to do it. It's like saying "I won't steal money because I know its bad" and then proceed to do it. I watch LS enough and like his content a lot but I personally think that sometimes he just is straight up mean. Even though he is right.
The treatment solo is getting for past year and half is just criminal
I agree but we can't say without knowing what happens behind the scenes.
Solo’s the new dardoch
Tone policing is used for the person of higher power or privilege to silence others below them or without as much control, not ppl telling you your tone when discussing someone is shitty, cmon you can look that up LS
"anti-debate tactic based on criticizing a person for expressing emotion. Tone policing detracts from the validity of a statement by attacking the tone in which it was presented rather than the message itself."
Did you look it up?
God, there was just so much wrong in this split and so much information revealed that it's like the serious, otherworldy qualities that made the pro scene so grandeur for spectators is crumbling down. Nobody watches EG face a team thinking they want to watch the best players in our region perform, at this point they're thinking "how's jizuke going to throw this match?" Proview and roster swaps just inflated (or drew eyes to) the problems we've already seen and if it doesn't get better soon, then who can say the LCS will last another 5 years? It's scary to think about.
Jizz man point straight on the nose. I always watch EG for that and end up thinking they should be a decent team
You're point is bullseye. Nobody is watching LCS because we are having a great or exciting match is mostly to see what will go wrong
Good luck for the cast dom
I’ll say the eg contractz and immortals were true right?
I think Vit are getting fans as its quite a unique roster
Did LS really just say GenG is popular because of nemesis LOL
How does one measure the popularity of a brand? LS mentioned stream hits and interacts. Nemesis has contributed to those.
He said geng gets more interaction since nemesis joined and thats true
It’s like saying something like courage made 100T popular which is true. Although the team already had a fan base, the streamer gets more views and hits and grows its fan base.
I think he is right at some extends
@@Ice_Icemb 🧢 100T was popular because of Nadeshot and then the drama with Nickmercs. Yeah Jack has contributed greatly but definitely isn’t popular because of him.
Why do I feel like it was powerofevils Korean account
"Non-specialists hiring specialists never works, because it can't work."
Who, then, should hire a team's GM? Is he saying a team which has executive leadership who are generally skilled in org operations and administration can never find a GM who can find a coach?
Is he suggesting the players hire their GM? Or teams that aren't literally owned by currently high ranked pro players should be dissolved? What world-state is LS arguing for here I genuinely don't see it.
People who never have even touched the games are making these kind of descions, buisnessmen who literllay dont know anything about anything are making choices for these teams. So whenever people at the top are hiring people who dont know the ups and downs of who there hiring or if there even qualified to do the job at hand theres a issue.
@@Lamestreet1 I wonder if part of the problem is that the scene is so new? I'm sure there's some favoritism going on. That being said, I do wonder how many industry veterans/former pros are actually trying to get these jobs
@@Lamestreet1 right, no, like I can comprehend his words. That's not the problem here.
What I'm asking is who, in these multimillion dollar brands most of which have operations involving content, multiple games, apparel brands, etc. Who is he suggesting is supposed to make these decisions. And would those "specialists" be competent in the wider business operations of the organization?
@@chancewestonjordan Right. But also like... that's what they do.
Like The orgs have a COO, then a director of esports, then sometimes a LoL GM, then a head coach. There are the odd cases of like TSM and maybe TL with Steve who have hands on owners, but that's rare. But the standard in the industry is still these tiers of organization, getting more specialized the further down you get. But at the end of the day, the COO and Director of eSports... those guys aren't supposed to be game matter experts.
@@vegacareless do you think ls knows shit about orgs? a gm's job isn't to coach people, his job is to keep shit in the org afloat, ofc a gm would be chosen by higher ups, what the fuck would a na lcs rank 1 18 years old know about management?
Dom is really showing his knowledge here. I'm impressed.
I agree with the take on C9 vs TSM, but I got flamed. People thought that it was a fucking clean game by TSM when it clearly wasn't. They argue that it's because of cloud soul. BUT BRO.... TSM got like 3 barons 2 elders cloud soul, and like DOM said, the game ended at lvl 1 when Vulcan ran it down. it's still a 40 minute game?!
Are teams crashing on purpose to get the import rule dropped?
Won't solve no one watching the league. They don't build personalities.
I rarely watch LCS anymore I just wait for semis and finals. It is a clown fiesta in game and out with the orgs. Players are being treated badly, incompetent management of orgs, and young talent getting gatekept or screwed over. It is just so annoying and sad to watch.
It's ironic tho. When a ORG tries to put the new players everyone complaint and start defending the players getting benched and stop watching their games. LoL Fans are not fans of ORG they are fans of players
@@RomnysGonzalez Whats ironic tho? People are pissed cause the orgs are benching the best players on the team while replacing them with sub-par players who are either hardstuck academy for years or washed LCS players who are just clinging on like just take a look at academy HALF OF THEM ARE FORMER LCS PLAYERS FROM YEARS AGO. It is VERY RARE that orgs actually try to scout new talent because orgs are lazy and would rather throw money at imports praying the team will work out. Nothing is new and exciting it is the same people being recycled. It is so dumb and tiring to watch LCS in game and the incompetency happening outside of the game. Sorry got too ranty but I am just super pissed what happened to our region and if it goes downhill orgs have no one to blame but themselves.
thank uuu
I think dude Nick Pham said academy coaches will be coaching LCS with the team I could’ve misheard doing other things while listening
Why the fuck is there ads every 5 minutes?
LS looks so tall compared to Dom because the way their webcams are positioned
The chess reference from Dgon should have been a fork
FLYQA WIN WORLDS !!!! What a performance
NA orgs took a bad trade and popped corrupting pot.
So team fan vs player fan seems very difficult for new teams. Clearly teams from the old guard like CLG TSM C9 TL (also have won something) has a much easier time getting a team fan base even Dig has some fans of the team. However is anyone out there really a GG/immortal/FQ fan? I think 100 thieves actually has made the template for new teams getting a team fan base. One invest smart in players for winning in the future. Two they have heavily invested in popular streamers and good PR Valykrae & Yassuo etc. This is what needs to be done the brand itself has personality. The player should not have the ability to take your fans from you. If he is benched for valid reasons like underperformance/Toxic DARDOCH!
I love Dominic
GG wants to keep their double digit spot in the lcs... Nice
please put this podcast on apple podcast 🙏🏼🙏🏼🙏🏼
I am a Palafox simp and like FLY but I might be the only one 😥😥😥
Yes you are but I will forever admire fans like you
@@acolytebrucelee8935 tank u sir
I was a massive Palafox fan since he got drafted had been following him, but damn he's making it so hard to be his fan this season.
facecheck getting shorter and shorter nowadays :/
Man I feel terrible for josedeodo I actually was super hyped to hear he was coming to NA and was ready to see him show his true potential in a more popular and major region. He looked like a shining star on his team at worlds and honestly I thought he was gonna do amazing here too. He is just in a terrible position IMO licorice regressed a shit ton and looks like the worst top laner, while paradox was smurf in academy last year he just hasn’t lived up to the hype and looks mediocre and Johnson just seems like he mental boomed and just doesn’t care anymore especially with the crab thing. I think Johnson is just a mad player at this point and doesn’t try to win anymore. The only time flyqueat gets anything done or atleast makes a play is purely off of Jose he’s the only proactive one and is someone who actively looks to get something done all of which it feels like the rest of his team doesn’t do. maybe I’m blind and bias but I just think Jose is much better then shown so far in the lcs and if potentially a team like team liquid might be struggling with their new jg since Santorin is injured I’m taking a chance on Jose and putting him on the squad instead of armao. Once again I could be bias and wrong but honestly I feel like Jose is a good player
Hello dgon, ls and dom!
I love the lcs: more roster moves than improvement 🙃
HAS TO BE JIZUKE
Less goooooo!
honestly if u just take full samsung white and put it on lcs id fcking watch it (just get dade of pawns back isnt up for it)
I like dgon 's sweat-shirt
Face check baby
Just in time for the last hour of my shift!
Respectfully disagree with Dom on the TSM vs C9 point. What we learned is both are good teams (in the context of NA). C9 was able to stabilize a losing game. And TSM were able to choke C9 out methodically. I really really disagree with people's assessments on when teams end the game. Ultimately no one looks back on Ali's fights and says "Ya but he should've ended this one 4 rounds sooner" They only remember he won the fight and that he was a champion. So if TSM,C9,100T win NALCS then this whole point of being "unable to end games" will be irrelevant.
Also if you're doing objective analysis. You should be looking at the difference between say TSM this week and TSM at the beginning of the split. That way you get a legitimate comparison to compare to. Not game to game. Or week to week. Improvements that are consistent can't be made that fast. Because all this ends up looking like is Hot takes like Skip Bayless.
But it does matter. If you don't win when you have the chance, the other team gets chances to beat you that shouldnt exist. Like that c9 vs tsm game where c9 whas 10k ahead at 15 minutes and they lost. Thats what it means being unable to end when you should, against better competition they will be more and more likely to lose
Dom hangs with Thorin too much and makes TSM hot takes cuz he knows it’ll pull more views around it
@@yondres but we shouldn’t be talking about “against better competition”. Because unless they win or place high in na they never get to face it. They also get to bootcamp to “learn how to”. This is why I believe na teams actually suck internationally. They spend all split shadow boxing against international competition they don’t actually learn anything. They try to achieve things before ever creating a foundation built upon their region.
@@jonlane6527 oh but im not Just talking about international competition. Take last summer playoffs as an example: ggs was 2-0 up against tsm and they couldnt close game 5 having multiple opportunities to do so, until fbi inted really hard. Then tsm won the split, when they should not have reached even semis if their opponents knew how to finish
@@yondres that’s certainly one angle to narrate that. Or you could narrate it that the veteran tsm squad found or created opportunities to come back and then reverse swept. In traditional sports they like to use the term the stage is too bright. Teams suffer from that when they aren’t quite ready to be in the big dance.
I LIKE THIS YES
Honestly my boy Licorice got dogged so hard by the boys.
Thorin Pog
Solo has some fans too :/
Dade does not play 4k games a season lmao unless he's on some secret account
dandy coaches last place lpl team
Am I the only one that thinks LS looks like he’s anxious or on something?? His eyes and movements are so spurratic? No hate just concerned
Truly the worst split ever :(
3 ads by 8 minutes??? I wanna watch this on my phone but jesus
I dont get dom saying TSM botlane won by default, they set up the brush and even if vulcan wards they have naut to hook him in. After that they split the map FORCING c9 in to playing defensive bot, then they stacked the wave called spica over en killed them. Is that not forcing an enemy into makeing a choice between to evils? Yes they should have closed it out earlier, but to say they got a free win and that they dindt do anything because a lv 1, i mean cmon. Then every game a team is only winning because they enemy team makes mistakes. C9 is also shit for that matter
dom mad cause team bad
Check yo face
stuff
SECOND HELL YEA!
Damn I'm early
Just show the account...why should you have to hide it?
Dom should coach flyquest
LS is the Ben Shapiro of LoL
lots of fast jabbering without substance lmao
All of his stuff about hiring practices just sounds like a twelve year old talking about "being an engineer and all those mean managers ruining his work"
NA has no work ethic unless it is for bag ngl :/
4th!
LS is talking about tone policing? Come on use common sense. If you want to tell a friend they need to lose wieght, you dont say "you are a fat piece of crap lose wieght. You may say "Hey i think you would be happier with a healthier lifestyle".
Ls is saying that the first phrase isn't any less true than the second one just because it is said diffefently
lock cam when moving to fights is probably because his team is calling for him to join a fight and he trusts his team so he doesn't even look. still bad overall
U still gotta know which situation u gonna arrive to tho... like u have 0 information