Your narrator sounds a lot more natural than he did originally. I appreciate it. The torque converter in that Subaru must have been red hot by the time the first test was done.
I see how much the cvt has impacted Subaru’s performance. While I never had the outback my mom has a forester (2.0L non turbo, sohc, w/LSD) (MY2000) imported from Singapore. We have never had issues going through terrain that appeared similar to what I see here. On one occasion I parked in an area where a jimny and hilux couldn’t get out of. I selected the ❄️ button and got out without a fuss. The forester felt torquey. So much so as a teen I left the car in drive... while giving someone a jump start. Youthful exuberance 🤦🏾♂️. When my mom jumped in she just put some revs on. That van leaped forward and climbed the Tercel’s bonet and fender. Despite the damage we were impressed. I wish try and tackle this terrain. Bet it’s better than the outback. Having owned a JDM 04 legacy GT and getting caught in slippery conditions uphill, watching this Outback just rev and not move is sad. Not even wheels spin on the loaded tires. It can’t supply the torque.
As much as I like CVTs they are definitely not something for off road. Off road driving requires torque as opposed to power, and CVTs are naturally limited in torque, so companies like Subaru have to be more conservative in their traction control tuning to avoid belt slipping/transmission failure.
@@tomaskroupakkfoto4132 Yes, that is right, but if the Subaru driver take more distance to gain speed maybe can climbed, here in Colombia the engine are 3.6 6 cilinder and 2.5 turbo
Subaru is fighting the very identity that got them where they are today, if I want a town daily driver there are soo many options, wrong strategy not listening to their fans at all. Plastic cladding on the new wilderness is useless if it can't perform off-road.
According to the AWD Test on Rollers channel, the Audi models wouldn't have made the hill f. This channel uses the EDL system properly and doesn't BOOT IT causing it's safety system to disable the EDL system. A proper test Nicely done by this group. Still a huge fan of Subaru and Audi Symmetrical AWD systems.
I have a '01 Volvo XC and I love this thing. Seeing it make it up that hill at all makes me happy, as I don't plan on driving on anything nearly this difficult, so I don't think I have to worry about getting stuck in anything I drive in.
Big fan of both Audi and Subaru . My first car was a 1995 Subaru legacy sedan AWD. 300,000 miles and tough winters in lake Tahoe. Now drive Audis wow wish I could be a rally driver I love having a beautiful car that can handle gritty situations
@@anotheran Not at all. Both Subaru that you mentioned have mechanical center diff with electronically controlled clutch-pack. Rav4 doesn't have a center diff. Edit: probably my bad if you meant other Subaru than these two - in that case they will be quite similar to Toyota, only thermal capacity of Subaru clutch-pack is higher. And of course traction control systems are better tuned.
One of the most ironic results was the 2001 Volvo V70XC with NO traction control and a non-computer controlled AWD system (uses a viscous coupling for the rear diff) beating the XC70 of the much more technologically advanced P3 platform xD I will say that from experience Volvo AWD/DSTC is exceptional is on snow more than anything. Perfect amount of car intervention but subtle enough that you the driver are still in control. Compare that to my experience with VW group DSTC -- far too aggressive, will basically cut ALL throttle input if you try to swing the tail out into a slide in the snow. This sounds "safe" but actually isn't -- powering out of a slide is one of the most successful techniques available. Cutting power just ensures that you continue to drift sideways off the road.
@@cesarescrignoli442 T6 is a pretty great motor. Fast car, generally routine maintenance is pretty easy. Some oil burning issues on the P3 platform, but more of the 3.2. See when it last had an oil change and check the condition/level of the oil. Also the gearbox oil will need changing if it has not been done. TF80-SC is a good gearbox but can develop shift flare with poor maintenance.
I had a 2004 V10 TDI touareg, It had center and a rear diff lock. It was a absolute joy to play with off road. Also the air ride would give a lot of ride height. I miss that car
For the Subaru, like you did with the Volvo, the 3rd option should always be to turn off TCS. That way people watching aren’t left wondering if that would have made a difference. I’ve seen this complaint on videos for years yet reviewers rarely do it
If only the tester would read Subaru manual and disable ESP in hard situations. Then it would jump up this "road" first by far. I'm not even talking about enabling x-mode, whuch makes this vehicle practically unstoppable if it doesn't sit on it's belly.
This xc70 is 2008 and beyond and i think awd is broken here because i have 2008 d5 awd is working very good not like here cant transfer power to other wheels
Actually that's a marketing legend. Audi wasn't the first 4WD in rallying (Subaru was!). Audi was winning only with RWD cars (but not in 1983 when they couldn't beat RWD Lancia). Audi didn't have any advanced AWD systems but the simplest, offroad ones. Audi won a championship twice, Subaru did it triple.
@@4x4.tests.on.rollers Might've not been the first but in the first 6 yrs of audi quattro, they won 4 championships.. with 3 in them being consecutive.. Also.. 4WD isn't AWD, but either way.. I'd argue it's easy to see which system worked better ;)
@@Seventschiko Audi won the championship just twice - 1982 & 1984. AWD/4WD/4x4 - it's just a naming, there is no formal classification. Whatever definitions you can find - they are informal so they are useless. You have to look at mechanical structure of each system - then we can discuss which is better etc.
@@4x4.tests.on.rollers it was first and revolutional, audi was road car, lancia and peugeot were prototyps - do not speak of something you do not know a shit.
ahhhh FINALLY! I have been waiting for this episode almost like for a cinema show. Lets be real, the A4 is the winner here. I can understand a 4.2 rocket can push itself but the A4 allroad with street tyres. come on. Makes me wanna go out an buy it. Great videos. Keep it up!
@@Cef3axon1 This gen A4 has a quattro ultra system which is electronically engaged 4x4 and front wheel drive under normal conditions, similar to haldex. Last gen A4 and Q5 are not having torsen systems anymore. You are welcome.
Both of you are right and wrong at the same time. The A4 in the video is petrol version, hence it is equipped with quattro ultra, but diesel cars come with torsen (permanent all wheel drive). Toresn is by far the best system but the new system is also nice as more economical as its not a permanent all wheel drive. However, unlike torsen it requires more maintenance.
Na not by any means, LR has by far the best all terrain system, when RR walked up this hill as if it was going down the shop. These cars struggled a lot in comparison.
@@Pieces93 Yeah right. LR works well off-road but is an absolute pig on the road. Drives like a tractor. You do understand the difference between an off roader and an all terrain vehicle? Nothing even comes close to quattro in road manners & off-road capability.
Please do a video comparing old and new subarus. You've only tested subarus with the 2.5 and a CVT. I'd like to see how some with different engines and transmissions do against these other crossovers and mid-size SUVs
@@SUVBattle can you test Audi Allroad C5 2.5 TDI year 2003 with manual transmission with Low range ? There is much more agressive traction control due to 570nm torque in Low Range mode
I have done literally thousands of KM in sand and off road in Subaru outbacks. I've had 3 different H6 3L outbacks with traditional automatic gearboxes. The automatic gearboxes need to be put in the right gear but are bombproof. One is still going strong with close to 400,000km on it. I avoid the newer model outbacks because of the CTV gearbox which I feel has severely impacted the sand performance of the outback. Having said that the CTV is far nicer on the road.
It was very interesting to see that some of these cars even with summer road tires could reach the top. This deep sand was a difficult terrain. Others were a big disappointment, like Subaru.
@@Zachariasinc You guys are clueless. Its not the engine....what it lacks is torque control....CVT transmission do not deliver torque well under load, especially in low end torque required in situation like this. Even with the new 2.4L turbo it still suffers the same issue with torque slip.
@archhangell clearly you didn't watch the entire video. If you did, you would have seen the Subaru make afew more attempts using momentum and finally make its way up the hill.
"Lets leave the Subaru with its legendary AWD do its grocery runs and leave the real offroad to the Quattro vehicles " is the quote I wish you said lmao
Subaru's CVT is its biggest let down. The Audis and even the Volvos would have no chance against an older (gen 1- gen 3) Outback (5mt or 4/5EAT) or a gen 4 with the 6spd manual.
The newer (current generation) Outbacks have a significantly improved AWD system, have more HP (Turbo 2.4) and an improved CVT transmission. A Wilderness Outback would fare much better.
I have a 2019 Allroad, and when you engage the Quattro Ultra in offroad mode it's amazing. I live in a part of Canada that doesn't get lots of snow removal and in real world tests the Audi is simply outstanding. With good snow tires you get anywhere you want to go.
@@Fresh-tw7ev I'm sure there is. But the Ultra is something I think is only found in Audi's. VW group use Haldex from BW on many of their products including Audi, SEAT, even Bugattis and Lambos. Are they the same? I would imagine some are others are not.
So wish I got the Allroad instead of sedan. Don't get me wrong, I love my car but now want a station wagon. New Audis don't have cd player anymore and love ripping cds into jukebox. Everyone says use Android Auto. It's not the same for easy to use MMI when driving to pick things. Hindsight is 20/20.
@@lm1314 I guess the newest don't have them. With the B&O option in my 2019 I have a "slim" CD in the glovebox along with all kinds of SD / USB inputs. I think it uses too much of the space but, everything is a compromise. I had an A4 sedan when they first came out with the v6 and I really liked it. Making a 5 hr run to Toronto from Ottawa a real pleasure. I gave up my SUV for the Allroad and I have almost the same capacity. I don't regret or miss the SUV in any way. I know what you mean. Android Auto is OK. Having to have it tethered is a pain, but I still think CDs sound better than streaming. Like you say 20/20... I'm sure you get lots of joy with the sedan too 😀
CVTs are designed for supreme smoothness and comfort and, by design, they are very bad for serious off roading. I can't believe Porsche did that bad omg!! Excellent video keep it up!
To be honest im an Subaru owner and i can vouch of how good they are off road....HOWEVER the problem with the new generation Subaru's is the "stupid" CVT gearbox. If they had atraditional gearbox (a good example is ZF-8) or even a manual version, they will perform much better off road. Nowadays Subaru much prefer to think about MPG / L per 100km rather than off road ability as they did in the past. I own a 5 speed manual Subaru Forester 2003 which will go through this challenge without any problems, as i've been through much harder off roading in it.
Put those Subaru wheels under the Audis, and they'll perform much better. This video was very beneficial for me, since despite having an A5 and knowing the Quattro, I was a little bit hesitant if Q5 will be any good in offroad conditions (soft offroad of course). Now I'm probably going to buy a Q5.
I have a 2004 Volvo XC70 and I use winter mode when I stuck in deep mud.. I use 255/45R18. Maybe winter mode could help. Thanks for the video. It's a good overview before buying a car.
I’ve got a 3.6r 270 bhp outback….I’m pretty sure that it would make it up there. The 2.5 tested has a different cvt than the 3.6 ….it’s a different animal altogether. Perhaps get a top of the line outback and give it a go.
@@YEH0I've a 2018 2.5 Outback and do this kind of tracks often, it has all to do with your off road skills,tires and technical knowledge of your car. Actually these cars aren't built for these tracks. Driving in snow is more their speciality.
Diyas, your English is improving massively and you speak very clearly. One small thing I've noticed is that you say "...the diagonal suspension" and I think what you're really meaning to say is "...the diagonal obstacle". I hope that helps and keep-up the good work; these are some of the best 4x4 tests I've seen on TH-cam. 🙂
Thanks for your feedback. We're constantly trying to improve the English translation quality. With regards to the particular "diagonal suspension" thing, it was more about positioning the vehicle with diagonally located wheels hanging rather than the obstacle itself. Unfortunately we couldn't find any proper English off-roading terms glossary plus terms differ in various countries. We will keep your correction in mind for future videos anyway, thank you very much again. P.S. check how Diyas pronounces "pothole" in early videos 😁
I think if Subaru had a traditional torque converted transmission or a manual it plus it’s new FA24F engine it would’ve performed better. Audi with 2.0T, 3.2 V6 and V8 QUATTRO did well
What do you mean? This new model has a shit gearbox. You should look on older TH-cam videos (cause there are quite a few) to see comparisons and so that it will help you to understand why Subaru is renowned for its 4WD system.
these 4wd systems are not designed to struggle like this without speed. quattro and subaru 4wd were first designed for rally and will provide the best maneuverability at higher speed
I would be interested in seeing the Subaru XV Crosstrek with a manual transmission take this hill on, to see if Subaru's system is still good without a CVT.
I have a 2021 2.0 6MT, and have succesfully gone up a similarly challenging road. I have to revv the hell out of the engine since torque is a little scarce but it goes up no problem. CVTs dont send as much power and AWD is different, plus engine cuts power to prevent damaging the transmission, while with my 6MT I'm just left with some burned-out cluch smell.
In all honesty these obstacles are way above the Subaru CVT capabilities, it will over heat and the latest Subaru's are basically made for family highway cruising. If you think I'm bashing the the brand please note our family has one and the Renault Duster 4wd we also had was way more suited to cross axle driving and rocky climbs.
@henkstols9326 they really aren't I do harder trails in my crosstrek and now my obw, never once had an issue with the cvt. So you don't know shit about the capabilities. But good try bud.
@@danieljackson-woods6225 they fantastic vehicles for families around town but cant agree that they are capable, tried mild stuff with the Forrester and the CVT is not designed for anything but maybe a gravel road that was scraped yesterday.
damn you're right I forgot the all roads have the Quattro ultra not a torsen system like my sedan version of the a4 that's impressive for Quattro ultra honestly
Lots of fine tuning and changes to xmode since 2015. I would suspect the dual xmode Subarus would do better and this would be a piece of cake for the wilderness versions
They would have done ok if the driver drove them rather than park them in a dip then trying to rev. I am on my third outback and the newer dual X-mode would have walked this. Even the older version I had on my 2019, if used with a disabled traction control, would have made a much better attempt. None of these reviews ever have traction control switched off.
Quite surprising test, at least for Volvo and Subaru. Could you, if ever want to revisit the topic of all terrain wagons in the future, to include a VW B8 Alltrack in the mix? maybe with the 2.0 bi-turbo diesel or 2.0 tsi engine, please, even if such engines are managed by a dsg gearbox? I know this is not the main focus of the channel but I am curios to see if the haldex system of the VW performs differently from the Quatro system on the A4 allrroad you have had in this test. Maybe include also even also a B7 Alltrack with a manual gearbox, or , if you can find, a B8 with manual gearbox even if such variants have lower torque. It might be interesting to see how the VW integrated all-terrain in a Passat compared to the A4 pr A6 allroads. Thanks again for your work and extensive testing over the years!
Though this is indeed an interesting video and very entertaining, I have to say that none of these cars were designed for this terrain condition. Their AWD systems are merely made for road use, snow on road mostly while entertaining certain trails. For this terrain, I believe an outright 4x4 with proper tires (which would be uncomfortable and noisy on roads) would make it easily. But, while acknowledging what this test is about; a test of the 4x4 electronic systems, one need to know the ones that pride themselves with superior 4x4 systems are the Audi and Subaru and they started blowing the marketing horns back in the 70s or 80s. It is only recent years, the Audi's 4x4 electronics actually helped them overcome this terrain slightly better than other much cheaper cars.
Was the Subaru traction contol ON or OFF? It needs to be OFF with X-mode on in these kind on situations, otherwise you wont get full power and traction!
Here's all the maintenance Outside of air and oil. Idler bearings on fan belt at about 150k KM, Radiator around 200k KM, sparkplugs every 100k-130k KM, rear wheel bearings (always back left) about every 150k KM, some windscreens , Some bushes in front suspension, (less often than I would expect given the roads I drive, drivers door latch needed adjusting. So never worked on a head gasket, a water pump, not even a gas strut or shock , never replaced any part of exhaust, no real rust (amazing considering I drive on the beach and put surfing gear in the back. I've seen Toyotas, Fords, Mitsubishis and many others rust much faster in the same conditions. I'd love to drive something else but to date they're the best fit for me. I'm also 6'3" and can stand under the boot lid without smacking my head.
I liked all the video content you put and make sure watch them soon they are available, well I am as Subaru fan and thanks to the white OB to keep the glory :). I would appreciate and equally excited to see how a newer generation OB performs (specially the wilderness line up), as that would be real competition to others in the list. Thanks for sharing such nice contents, I am sure they take a lot of effort to put it together.
Again, quattro is the answer....that powertrain is killing subaru, honestly their traction control and awd systems are pretty much perfect. They just need a bit more torque to work with...if they don't want to give up with the CVT they need a more powerful engine.... Oh and Special mention to the macan. Disappointing...
outback is really limited by CVT. Which is ok on streets, but in terrain, it is causing power losses. 2.5L in subaru is not very strong engine either. With 2.5T it could have chance.
Again, if only this blogger disabled the ESP , it would jump up this road much faster that any audi. Enable x-mode to see it almost stop ANY wheel slip at all.
your reviews are sooo good! Detailed, and you even add “before you fan boys say but!!!” Love this channel. Have you done any of these head to heads on snow?
The C5 and C6 allroads use the same system. The C6 is a very mild facelift of the C5. You put the C5 in last place behind vehicles that couldn't mechanically handle the slope, and the C6 goes in third.
Is the "Legendary Subaru Performance" legendary anywhere outside Subaru advertising? Personally I would prefer a rear and center Torsen to any electronic setup. I had it in my old 1991 Audi V8 Quattro (with manual transmission to boot...) and that car was unstoppable in snow. Being a luxury saloon, it would not make it up that hill simply due to clearance, but the drivetrain would handle it no problem. The C5 allroad I currently have is nearly as good though. The 2.7 bi-turbo is a beast of a motor. Even this "antiquated" 2001 machine made a fine showing in the test. One issue all these cars have is the torsion bars. They really work against you on a test like this.
Can you find an Outback of the 4th generation (2009-2014) with a flat six, a 5-speed AT, and a VTD awd system (same as WRX)? I suspect the result will be very difference;)
P1 is 2001 p2 is 2002 and 2003 while p3 is 2004 to 2007. P3 is supposed to be the better awd system. I have a 2003 xc70 and I love it I also put a 2inch lift in it. They are nice cars.
![ILLSLICK - KILLSHOT REMIX [FULL VERSION]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/RIK8RrqIAzE/mqdefault.jpg)
I love how committed the drivers are. They are going hard! Awesome
Let's go Quattro gang! So glad I have an a4 allroad!!
"The Subaru, using its LEGENDARY AWD, rolls back."
I can smell that burn through my screen.
It’s the cvt no one doubts that’s it’s biggest problem
The newer models are better but the cvt is an absolute shame in my onyx xt
@@jrwynn49 No one except subaru themselves. Apparently they love it so much they even phased out the manual gearbox for the WRX completely.
@@zwen3763 that’s not true. The 2022 WRX is offered with a manual
@@jrwynn49 cvt the biggest problem?
Your narrator sounds a lot more natural than he did originally. I appreciate it.
The torque converter in that Subaru must have been red hot by the time the first test was done.
It's cvt bro
you appreciate it? jesus what a dick
@@jacksonhuang2009
CVTs still have torque converters.
I see how much the cvt has impacted Subaru’s performance. While I never had the outback my mom has a forester (2.0L non turbo, sohc, w/LSD) (MY2000) imported from Singapore. We have never had issues going through terrain that appeared similar to what I see here. On one occasion I parked in an area where a jimny and hilux couldn’t get out of. I selected the ❄️ button and got out without a fuss. The forester felt torquey. So much so as a teen I left the car in drive... while giving someone a jump start. Youthful exuberance 🤦🏾♂️. When my mom jumped in she just put some revs on. That van leaped forward and climbed the Tercel’s bonet and fender. Despite the damage we were impressed. I wish try and tackle this terrain. Bet it’s better than the outback.
Having owned a JDM 04 legacy GT and getting caught in slippery conditions uphill, watching this Outback just rev and not move is sad. Not even wheels spin on the loaded tires. It can’t supply the torque.
As much as I like CVTs they are definitely not something for off road. Off road driving requires torque as opposed to power, and CVTs are naturally limited in torque, so companies like Subaru have to be more conservative in their traction control tuning to avoid belt slipping/transmission failure.
@@scott8919 spot on!!
@@tomaskroupakkfoto4132 Yes, that is right, but if the Subaru driver take more distance to gain speed maybe can climbed, here in Colombia the engine are 3.6 6 cilinder and 2.5 turbo
@@tomaskroupakkfoto4132 this is my video testing the Subaru Outback 3.6R th-cam.com/video/E3GWE4UMhq4/w-d-xo.html
Subaru is fighting the very identity that got them where they are today, if I want a town daily driver there are soo many options, wrong strategy not listening to their fans at all. Plastic cladding on the new wilderness is useless if it can't perform off-road.
According to the AWD Test on Rollers channel, the Audi models wouldn't have made the hill f. This channel uses the EDL system properly and doesn't BOOT IT causing it's safety system to disable the EDL system. A proper test Nicely done by this group. Still a huge fan of Subaru and Audi Symmetrical AWD systems.
I have a '01 Volvo XC and I love this thing. Seeing it make it up that hill at all makes me happy, as I don't plan on driving on anything nearly this difficult, so I don't think I have to worry about getting stuck in anything I drive in.
I own a 01 v70 xc and the big difference is in the tires I seen raised ones with good results and they look great
The 2001 still had the visco coupling AWD. The 07 (which, honesty looks more like a P3(08) has haldex III, 2 very different systems.
I had a 99 (P80) V70 XC with the visco coupling. I have now 2 03 and a lifted 05. Far superior than the P80 variant.
Big fan of both Audi and Subaru . My first car was a 1995 Subaru legacy sedan AWD. 300,000 miles and tough winters in lake Tahoe. Now drive Audis wow wish I could be a rally driver I love having a beautiful car that can handle gritty situations
The old volvo shocked me the most and thanks for your content. Very informative for off road lovers like myself
Not mutch sand in Sweden😂
not a haldex Volvo as it's a 2001
The problem of Subaru is in CVT, not in the awd system itself. Anyway, Outback 2.0 diesel would probably get a better result.
hey, nice to see u here! you both have awsome videos
@@mateuspereira1360 Thanks!
Any non variable torque distribution (Wrx) or non DCCD AWD (sti) Subaru is severely overrated. They’re about as good as a RAV4.
@@anotheran Not at all. Both Subaru that you mentioned have mechanical center diff with electronically controlled clutch-pack. Rav4 doesn't have a center diff.
Edit: probably my bad if you meant other Subaru than these two - in that case they will be quite similar to Toyota, only thermal capacity of Subaru clutch-pack is higher. And of course traction control systems are better tuned.
A subaru diesel would have snapped the crank before reaching the top.. :P (i owned two!)
Am glad we have shows like this so I don't have to take my Audi through those challenges
One of the most ironic results was the 2001 Volvo V70XC with NO traction control and a non-computer controlled AWD system (uses a viscous coupling for the rear diff) beating the XC70 of the much more technologically advanced P3 platform xD
I will say that from experience Volvo AWD/DSTC is exceptional is on snow more than anything. Perfect amount of car intervention but subtle enough that you the driver are still in control. Compare that to my experience with VW group DSTC -- far too aggressive, will basically cut ALL throttle input if you try to swing the tail out into a slide in the snow. This sounds "safe" but actually isn't -- powering out of a slide is one of the most successful techniques available. Cutting power just ensures that you continue to drift sideways off the road.
Yes, had a 07 p2 and the tcs was very subtle in gravel roads not like the Subaru that grab the brakes very firmly and take me off sync
Hi, I have been looking at a 2011 Volvo XC70 T6. What do you think about it?
@@cesarescrignoli442 T6 is a pretty great motor. Fast car, generally routine maintenance is pretty easy. Some oil burning issues on the P3 platform, but more of the 3.2. See when it last had an oil change and check the condition/level of the oil. Also the gearbox oil will need changing if it has not been done. TF80-SC is a good gearbox but can develop shift flare with poor maintenance.
I had a 2004 V10 TDI touareg, It had center and a rear diff lock. It was a absolute joy to play with off road. Also the air ride would give a lot of ride height. I miss that car
For the Subaru, like you did with the Volvo, the 3rd option should always be to turn off TCS. That way people watching aren’t left wondering if that would have made a difference.
I’ve seen this complaint on videos for years yet reviewers rarely do it
It's the biggest fail of all inexperienced off-road drivers - they always leave traction control on!!
Turnning off the TCS had saved me from being stuck in the deep mud. Sometime you just want to the tires to spin regardless to push through
And gear to manual mode.
A4 clearly is the best. Glad I own one 😀
If only the tester would read Subaru manual and disable ESP in hard situations. Then it would jump up this "road" first by far. I'm not even talking about enabling x-mode, whuch makes this vehicle practically unstoppable if it doesn't sit on it's belly.
Kudos to those Audi owners taking on this challenge, I'd never do that with my car.
Same here. Great car.
Audis are really nice well put together cars. Far better than Subarus
I think tires played a huge role in this as well. I’d like to see a 2005-2007 xc70 in this with the updated haldex system
Yes! Had a 07 andd it was very good
Would like to see this up against an 05-07 3.0l outback
This xc70 is 2008 and beyond and i think awd is broken here because i have 2008 d5 awd is working very good not like here cant transfer power to other wheels
That audi with low profiles tires be like
@@Kimii99maybe it is.. My 2010 xc70 DTSC working much better. And probably a bit better than my 2007 xc70.
Audi QUATTRO. It’s a reason they are legendary in rally racing…
Actually that's a marketing legend. Audi wasn't the first 4WD in rallying (Subaru was!). Audi was winning only with RWD cars (but not in 1983 when they couldn't beat RWD Lancia). Audi didn't have any advanced AWD systems but the simplest, offroad ones. Audi won a championship twice, Subaru did it triple.
@@4x4.tests.on.rollers Might've not been the first but in the first 6 yrs of audi quattro, they won 4 championships.. with 3 in them being consecutive.. Also.. 4WD isn't AWD, but either way.. I'd argue it's easy to see which system worked better ;)
@@Seventschiko Audi won the championship just twice - 1982 & 1984. AWD/4WD/4x4 - it's just a naming, there is no formal classification. Whatever definitions you can find - they are informal so they are useless. You have to look at mechanical structure of each system - then we can discuss which is better etc.
@@4x4.tests.on.rollers it was first and revolutional, audi was road car, lancia and peugeot were prototyps - do not speak of something you do not know a shit.
@@4x4.tests.on.rollers you must be stupid
ahhhh FINALLY! I have been waiting for this episode almost like for a cinema show. Lets be real, the A4 is the winner here. I can understand a 4.2 rocket can push itself but the A4 allroad with street tyres. come on. Makes me wanna go out an buy it. Great videos. Keep it up!
The audi wins because subaru has killed their awd systems with the garbage cvt
Exactly, furthermore, new gen A4 has electronic quattro rather than traditional torsen on the A6.
@@kokibr91 That's not true, A4 has torsen. Just A3, TT and Q3 has Haldex. Dont write if you dont know.
@@Cef3axon1 This gen A4 has a quattro ultra system which is electronically engaged 4x4 and front wheel drive under normal conditions, similar to haldex. Last gen A4 and Q5 are not having torsen systems anymore. You are welcome.
Both of you are right and wrong at the same time. The A4 in the video is petrol version, hence it is equipped with quattro ultra, but diesel cars come with torsen (permanent all wheel drive). Toresn is by far the best system but the new system is also nice as more economical as its not a permanent all wheel drive. However, unlike torsen it requires more maintenance.
V70xc is the GOAT. One car to do it all ❤️
Damn the QUATTRO systems are just the best 🐐
Na not by any means, LR has by far the best all terrain system, when RR walked up this hill as if it was going down the shop. These cars struggled a lot in comparison.
@@Pieces93 you're talking about suvs and he's talking about cars dipshit..
@@Pieces93 Yeah right. LR works well off-road but is an absolute pig on the road. Drives like a tractor. You do understand the difference between an off roader and an all terrain vehicle? Nothing even comes close to quattro in road manners & off-road capability.
Wondering if comparing segment of offroad;
1. V90 Cross Country : E63s Estate All Tereain : A6 Allroad
2. Urus : Cayenne GTS Coupe: RS-Q8
3. Cullinan : Bentayga
4. Escalade ESV : Navigator L : Suburban : Yukon XL Denali : Expedition Platinum
🚗🏁🚕🏁🚗🏁🚕🏁🚗🏁🚕🏁🚗🏁🚕🏁
You can't have a controlled test, when every driver is different and skill levels obviously vary drastically. This is silly.
Please do a video comparing old and new subarus. You've only tested subarus with the 2.5 and a CVT. I'd like to see how some with different engines and transmissions do against these other crossovers and mid-size SUVs
I am so thoroughly impressed by this video. Thank you for doing this!
I enjoy watching these type of videos 👍👍👍
Glad to hear it! Hope you will enjoy next one
@@SUVBattle can you test Audi Allroad C5 2.5 TDI year 2003 with manual transmission with Low range ? There is much more agressive traction control due to 570nm torque in Low Range mode
I have done literally thousands of KM in sand and off road in Subaru outbacks. I've had 3 different H6 3L outbacks with traditional automatic gearboxes. The automatic gearboxes need to be put in the right gear but are bombproof. One is still going strong with close to 400,000km on it. I avoid the newer model outbacks because of the CTV gearbox which I feel has severely impacted the sand performance of the outback. Having said that the CTV is far nicer on the road.
How many head gaskets have you replaced?
It was very interesting to see that some of these cars even with summer road tires could reach the top. This deep sand was a difficult terrain. Others were a big disappointment, like Subaru.
The problem with Subaru is any Subara with weak engine trying to conquer obstacles that require strong engines.
I missed the part where Subarus used momentum to go up so am cool with their performance
@@archhangell right?? such a trash test lmao my 05 forester has made it up shit like that
@@Zachariasinc You guys are clueless. Its not the engine....what it lacks is torque control....CVT transmission do not deliver torque well under load, especially in low end torque required in situation like this. Even with the new 2.4L turbo it still suffers the same issue with torque slip.
@archhangell clearly you didn't watch the entire video. If you did, you would have seen the Subaru make afew more attempts using momentum and finally make its way up the hill.
this is the perfect comparison between varying cars that I've been eyeing for my needs!
"Lets leave the Subaru with its legendary AWD do its grocery runs and leave the real offroad to the Quattro vehicles " is the quote I wish you said lmao
😂🔥
You are very right 👍
Obviously, legendary AWD + weak engine doesn't cut it when strong engine is also required is the take home lesson.
Subaru's CVT is its biggest let down. The Audis and even the Volvos would have no chance against an older (gen 1- gen 3) Outback (5mt or 4/5EAT) or a gen 4 with the 6spd manual.
The newer (current generation) Outbacks have a significantly improved AWD system, have more HP (Turbo 2.4) and an improved CVT transmission. A Wilderness Outback would fare much better.
I would have love you to have an A6 C7 BiTDi with its 650nm
That was a great video !
Красавчики что заделали интернациональную версию - аудитория огроменная!
I have a 2019 Allroad, and when you engage the Quattro Ultra in offroad mode it's amazing. I live in a part of Canada that doesn't get lots of snow removal and in real world tests the Audi is simply outstanding. With good snow tires you get anywhere you want to go.
Karl I have the 2019 Golf Alltrack. In wonder what similarities these two VAG products share in common?
@@Fresh-tw7ev I'm sure there is. But the Ultra is something I think is only found in Audi's. VW group use Haldex from BW on many of their products including Audi, SEAT, even Bugattis and Lambos. Are they the same? I would imagine some are others are not.
So wish I got the Allroad instead of sedan. Don't get me wrong, I love my car but now want a station wagon. New Audis don't have cd player anymore and love ripping cds into jukebox. Everyone says use Android Auto. It's not the same for easy to use MMI when driving to pick things. Hindsight is 20/20.
@@lm1314 I guess the newest don't have them. With the B&O option in my 2019 I have a "slim" CD in the glovebox along with all kinds of SD / USB inputs. I think it uses too much of the space but, everything is a compromise. I had an A4 sedan when they first came out with the v6 and I really liked it. Making a 5 hr run to Toronto from Ottawa a real pleasure. I gave up my SUV for the Allroad and I have almost the same capacity. I don't regret or miss the SUV in any way. I know what you mean. Android Auto is OK. Having to have it tethered is a pain, but I still think CDs sound better than streaming. Like you say 20/20... I'm sure you get lots of joy with the sedan too 😀
CVTs are designed for supreme smoothness and comfort and, by design, they are very bad for serious off roading.
I can't believe Porsche did that bad omg!!
Excellent video keep it up!
Honestly. I expected more from th Cayenne.
To be honest im an Subaru owner and i can vouch of how good they are off road....HOWEVER the problem with the new generation Subaru's is the "stupid" CVT gearbox. If they had atraditional gearbox (a good example is ZF-8) or even a manual version, they will perform much better off road. Nowadays Subaru much prefer to think about MPG / L per 100km rather than off road ability as they did in the past.
I own a 5 speed manual Subaru Forester 2003 which will go through this challenge without any problems, as i've been through much harder off roading in it.
Put those Subaru wheels under the Audis, and they'll perform much better. This video was very beneficial for me, since despite having an A5 and knowing the Quattro, I was a little bit hesitant if Q5 will be any good in offroad conditions (soft offroad of course). Now I'm probably going to buy a Q5.
Just bought me a A4 Allroad and it rides like a dream tio
for a correct use of the Subaru it is necessary to activate X-mode and deactivate Esp
I have a 2004 Volvo XC70 and I use winter mode when I stuck in deep mud.. I use 255/45R18. Maybe winter mode could help. Thanks for the video. It's a good overview before buying a car.
I’ve got a 3.6r 270 bhp outback….I’m pretty sure that it would make it up there. The 2.5 tested has a different cvt than the 3.6 ….it’s a different animal altogether. Perhaps get a top of the line outback and give it a go.
I've gone up muddy hills steeper than what they were driving with no issues. the 3.6r outback is no joke
@@YEH0I've a 2018 2.5 Outback and do this kind of tracks often, it has all to do with your off road skills,tires and technical knowledge of your car. Actually these cars aren't built for these tracks. Driving in snow is more their speciality.
Ochen big job bilo prodelano! Kak-budto posmotrel zarubezhnoe video, proiznoshenie cool, good luck vam, molodcy guys 😉
Diyas, your English is improving massively and you speak very clearly. One small thing I've noticed is that you say "...the diagonal suspension" and I think what you're really meaning to say is "...the diagonal obstacle". I hope that helps and keep-up the good work; these are some of the best 4x4 tests I've seen on TH-cam. 🙂
Thanks for your feedback. We're constantly trying to improve the English translation quality. With regards to the particular "diagonal suspension" thing, it was more about positioning the vehicle with diagonally located wheels hanging rather than the obstacle itself. Unfortunately we couldn't find any proper English off-roading terms glossary plus terms differ in various countries. We will keep your correction in mind for future videos anyway, thank you very much again. P.S. check how Diyas pronounces "pothole" in early videos 😁
The CVT messed up Subaru legendary performance
Cvt failed everyone also is not cvt
The Touareg with offroad pack is a beast. Loads of torque. Would like to see that one in action
All Touaregs 1st gen have center diff locks. I’m not sure why it wasn’t used in this test
Hello, Mr Diaas. Great job! I've waited for Audi SUV bottle, let me enjoy the show and comment you back.
I think if Subaru had a traditional torque converted transmission or a manual it plus it’s new FA24F engine it would’ve performed better. Audi with 2.0T, 3.2 V6 and V8 QUATTRO did well
This video literally convinced me to buy an A4 allroad for use in Colorado
How the hell have I not found this channel earlier??? This is some Great content 😲😀👍
Haha low blow for the "legendary symmetrical four wheel drive" that allows the Subaru to roll back :))))
What do you mean? This new model has a shit gearbox. You should look on older TH-cam videos (cause there are quite a few) to see comparisons and so that it will help you to understand why Subaru is renowned for its 4WD system.
these 4wd systems are not designed to struggle like this without speed. quattro and subaru 4wd were first designed for rally and will provide the best maneuverability at higher speed
@@jakobrava true. Mechanical lockers are the best for crawling.
Why use the base 2.5 liter Subaru against vehicles with turbo charged and larger engine vehicles? This was a set up from the beginning.
I would be interested in seeing the Subaru XV Crosstrek with a manual transmission take this hill on, to see if Subaru's system is still good without a CVT.
I have a 2021 2.0 6MT, and have succesfully gone up a similarly challenging road. I have to revv the hell out of the engine since torque is a little scarce but it goes up no problem. CVTs dont send as much power and AWD is different, plus engine cuts power to prevent damaging the transmission, while with my 6MT I'm just left with some burned-out cluch smell.
Should go back and redo it with the outback using momentum like you did with the Volvo. Driving a vehicle properly offroad makes all the difference
In all honesty these obstacles are way above the Subaru CVT capabilities, it will over heat and the latest Subaru's are basically made for family highway cruising. If you think I'm bashing the the brand please note our family has one and the Renault Duster 4wd we also had was way more suited to cross axle driving and rocky climbs.
@henkstols9326 they really aren't I do harder trails in my crosstrek and now my obw, never once had an issue with the cvt. So you don't know shit about the capabilities. But good try bud.
@@danieljackson-woods6225 they fantastic vehicles for families around town but cant agree that they are capable, tried mild stuff with the Forrester and the CVT is not designed for anything but maybe a gravel road that was scraped yesterday.
I have to say even as audi die hard I wasn’t expecting them to do so well 👌
Audi is great even if it's a timely 4WD quattro ultra (A4 allroad B9)
damn you're right I forgot the all roads have the Quattro ultra not a torsen system like my sedan version of the a4 that's impressive for Quattro ultra honestly
The Subaru’s should have turned off VDC and engaged L or 1st gear to get maximum torque.
Totally agree! This would have eliminated the CVT woes everyone is having. It even says this in the outback’s manual!
They let the Volvo do a full send with traction control off but not Subaru, if u know u know🤷🏽
Hi Diyas, thanks for getting back to me. You're videos are the best. I like to see the test with the last generation Montero but I can't find it.
no matter how you turn it, you can't go wrong with an quattro.
Wouldn't bet my hair with quattro used in Q2 and in Q3.
Bullshit, its because of subaru cvt
@@carholic-sz3qv Quattro systems are mechanically bulletproof and they work. What’s more to not like?
@@dogchainsaw3923 lol.... quattro system is definitely not Bulletproof sorry to disapoint you.
@@carholic-sz3qv how so?
You should test the first gen Audi Q7 it has a more agressive EDL then the rest of Audi line up.
Keep up with good work!
I wish they had a A6 C8 Allroad, from 2020-2023 in this test. I'm looking to get one !
Kindly if possible in future include P3 Volvo wagons, V60,V90 cross country models we see how they fair.
Lots of fine tuning and changes to xmode since 2015. I would suspect the dual xmode Subarus would do better and this would be a piece of cake for the wilderness versions
Doubt that
They would have done ok if the driver drove them rather than park them in a dip then trying to rev.
I am on my third outback and the newer dual X-mode would have walked this. Even the older version I had on my 2019, if used with a disabled traction control, would have made a much better attempt.
None of these reviews ever have traction control switched off.
Quite surprising test, at least for Volvo and Subaru.
Could you, if ever want to revisit the topic of all terrain wagons in the future, to include a VW B8 Alltrack in the mix? maybe with the 2.0 bi-turbo diesel or 2.0 tsi engine, please, even if such engines are managed by a dsg gearbox? I know this is not the main focus of the channel but I am curios to see if the haldex system of the VW performs differently from the Quatro system on the A4 allrroad you have had in this test. Maybe include also even also a B7 Alltrack with a manual gearbox, or , if you can find, a B8 with manual gearbox even if such variants have lower torque. It might be interesting to see how the VW integrated all-terrain in a Passat compared to the A4 pr A6 allroads.
Thanks again for your work and extensive testing over the years!
Audi A4 Allroad looked really impressive
If I was doing a test to see how these cars got on offroad, then I'd put them all in maximum offroad modes 🤷🏻♂️ cause that's what they can do.
I hope you guys can test out the Outback Wilderness X-mode 2.0. Has more horsepower and torque. Cant wait to see.
Are you sure about the 2 ltr engine in an Outback?
It's a 2.5 or a 2.4 with turbo as far as I know.
Though this is indeed an interesting video and very entertaining, I have to say that none of these cars were designed for this terrain condition. Their AWD systems are merely made for road use, snow on road mostly while entertaining certain trails. For this terrain, I believe an outright 4x4 with proper tires (which would be uncomfortable and noisy on roads) would make it easily. But, while acknowledging what this test is about; a test of the 4x4 electronic systems, one need to know the ones that pride themselves with superior 4x4 systems are the Audi and Subaru and they started blowing the marketing horns back in the 70s or 80s. It is only recent years, the Audi's 4x4 electronics actually helped them overcome this terrain slightly better than other much cheaper cars.
Was the Subaru traction contol ON or OFF? It needs to be OFF with X-mode on in these kind on situations, otherwise you wont get full power and traction!
Here's all the maintenance Outside of air and oil. Idler bearings on fan belt at about 150k KM, Radiator around 200k KM, sparkplugs every 100k-130k KM, rear wheel bearings (always back left) about every 150k KM, some windscreens , Some bushes in front suspension, (less often than I would expect given the roads I drive, drivers door latch needed adjusting. So never worked on a head gasket, a water pump, not even a gas strut or shock , never replaced any part of exhaust, no real rust (amazing considering I drive on the beach and put surfing gear in the back. I've seen Toyotas, Fords, Mitsubishis and many others rust much faster in the same conditions. I'd love to drive something else but to date they're the best fit for me. I'm also 6'3" and can stand under the boot lid without smacking my head.
I liked all the video content you put and make sure watch them soon they are available, well I am as Subaru fan and thanks to the white OB to keep the glory :). I would appreciate and equally excited to see how a newer generation OB performs (specially the wilderness line up), as that would be real competition to others in the list. Thanks for sharing such nice contents, I am sure they take a lot of effort to put it together.
There are very big differences from a 2007 to a 2015, why not use vehicles of the same year, I think the results would be different
This video shows how solid axles are such a huge benefit off the pavement
Again, quattro is the answer....that powertrain is killing subaru, honestly their traction control and awd systems are pretty much perfect. They just need a bit more torque to work with...if they don't want to give up with the CVT they need a more powerful engine....
Oh and Special mention to the macan. Disappointing...
i was so sad when the macan failed, i love that little suv
@@TVCHLORD so do i, i think is a nice preppy little SUV. just not made to lift wheels up in the air...
I loved my V60 Cross Country. Was hoping to see that here
Thank you for this comprehensive test!
Those cvts in the Subarus make the already underpowered car completely gutless.
Where is the current generation of Outback, Allroad and Cross Country? Tires also make a huge difference.
Audi Quattro forever.❤️
Why did the 2001 Audi have tires? That were basically racing tires with no tread just halfways for water. Of course, that thing wouldn't.
Makes me love my old xc70 even more 😂
Agreed! It would be interesting to see what a p80 would've done
Hey brother thanks for this awesome video
Subaru does have 3.6 liter engines too. It would be interesting to see how do they berform in this test.
Had an 03 XC70 and loved it to death, still always consider getting another one when I’m looking to get a new car
outback is really limited by CVT. Which is ok on streets, but in terrain, it is causing power losses. 2.5L in subaru is not very strong engine either. With 2.5T it could have chance.
Again, if only this blogger disabled the ESP , it would jump up this road much faster that any audi. Enable x-mode to see it almost stop ANY wheel slip at all.
@@ozzless - LOLOLOLOL ...
your reviews are sooo good! Detailed, and you even add “before you fan boys say but!!!” Love this channel. Have you done any of these head to heads on snow?
That was entertaining. Thanks! :)
The C5 and C6 allroads use the same system. The C6 is a very mild facelift of the C5. You put the C5 in last place behind vehicles that couldn't mechanically handle the slope, and the C6 goes in third.
Agree. Absolutely stupid!
My wild guess is that Subaru is not sponsoring this test like in some other channels.
Is the "Legendary Subaru Performance" legendary anywhere outside Subaru advertising? Personally I would prefer a rear and center Torsen to any electronic setup. I had it in my old 1991 Audi V8 Quattro (with manual transmission to boot...) and that car was unstoppable in snow. Being a luxury saloon, it would not make it up that hill simply due to clearance, but the drivetrain would handle it no problem. The C5 allroad I currently have is nearly as good though. The 2.7 bi-turbo is a beast of a motor. Even this "antiquated" 2001 machine made a fine showing in the test. One issue all these cars have is the torsion bars. They really work against you on a test like this.
I love your videos every video you upload it make my day thanks
Thanx for feedback bro!
@@SUVBattle you are and your videos are the best
My Touareg escape has 2 locking difs and low range from factory 😁
Thats the proper on with offroad pack yes? Beast
Real battle of SUV keep doing video sir love from india..
The Outback Gen5 had a mid life update with retuned x-mode and dual x-mode. Could you test those instead?
Amazing video... keep them coming
Thank you !!! very informative and educational.
finally audi vs subaru AWD system
Can you find an Outback of the 4th generation (2009-2014) with a flat six, a 5-speed AT, and a VTD awd system (same as WRX)? I suspect the result will be very difference;)
I think so too
The two Outbacks in this test, with a NA flat four and a CVT, might be the least capable version of Outbacks in recent years
I owned one of those. 😥 ... God how I miss it...
@SUVBattle can you find one of these and test it out!
I own 2 Subaru Outbacks; a 3.6 with a traditional transmission; and a 2.5 with a CVT. The CVT is not very good and is the weaklink.
I'm a simple man. See video from Dias, push Like
Would like to see 2006-2007 P2 XC70 as the Haldex AWD system is different to the 2001 model in this video
P1 is 2001 p2 is 2002 and 2003 while p3 is 2004 to 2007. P3 is supposed to be the better awd system. I have a 2003 xc70 and I love it I also put a 2inch lift in it. They are nice cars.
Can you make a video with small SUVs like the Suzuki Vitara?
P2 VOLVO XC70.... Momentum carried it threw ... lol ... :( please note.... sand is very hard to go through... A great video.