I always liked the original Secret Wars. When I was starting to read comics, the publisher of Marvel and DC in my country was reprinting it and calling it "the uncut version". It's funny that they'd advertise that they themselves had made several cuts to the story when it was first published because they had to publish it fast because of the toy deals - even though the monthly books were way behind. So they just cut stuff so we wouldn't have spoilers like that Rogue was going to join the X-Men. Anyway, I like the story just fine and I usually hate event comics. Maybe because it was actually quite simple to just read it and understand if. I find amusing thaf an industry that basicly everyone started reading when they were kids would be so opposed to keep bringing more kids in with things like this.
All these years later, I can still remember Doom crushing the Beyonder and delivering the single best line ever in a comic book, "On your knees, if you have knees"
I love secret wars, compelling portrayal of Doom, kicked off Magneto's redemption, has some good character moments, and epic fights. I accept that it is imperfect, but I think it was great
It... Was hated?! I can get the disliking it for starting the modern event comics, but as a story, it was fine, with some great Doom moments. Now Hickman's Secret Wars is awesome, and having a powerful cosmic leader pulling heroes from their lives is now a franchise with "Contest of Champions", the comics and the mobile game.
This is the first I heard it was hated too. I got it when it came out. It was a very fun read. Also Sasha forgot, this was the first appearance of the Beyonder.
@@blackrazer22 It was the time and expectation. Mike Zeck was (and is) one of the finest artists of his era - but he was rushed and under deadline. The plot meandered. People expected paradigm shifting changes in continuity and it did not happen to the scale as expected. And finally a Jim Shooter backlash was in the works for years and this was the place it exploded.
@@redcoltken Shooter was right, If the powers that be had kept shooter and banished the crybabies Marvel would not be using news print and waterbased ink in an effort to keep the lights turned on.
I'd been reading comics for over a decade when the first mass-battle came out, but it wasn't Secret Wars, it was "Contest of Champions", and I liked it. Then a few years later "Secret Wars" came out, and I liked it. But yeah, I feel like they've gone there too much with "events." As always thank you so very much for the video.
I remember Contest of Champions fondly. It just now occurred to me that the second book of the JLA/Avengers crossover was an expanded Contest of Champions. But then again, it's a standard ploy of the Grandmaster.
Contest of Champions had a weird flex. "Look at all these international heroes we created just for this event!" Most of whom were seldom used in any serious way since.
Contest of Champions was great even if it was only 3 issues. Only gripe for me was that the writers screwed up the team scoring calling it win for the Grandmaster rather than a tie. Had to re-read it several times to be sure I wasn't losing my mind.
I enjoyed the original Secret wars. Honestly it was cool seeing most of the heroes together. Plus they actually had some real conversation about their struggles and beliefs. Mainly I’m talking about the Mutants policing their own. And Wolverine stepping to Cap.
For a toy inspired comic, it did a great job showing off Dr. Doom to all those people who were just reading the X-Men and Spider-man at the time, and it really showed off how smart and ruthless he was. Secondly, it was great when Magneto ended up appearing with the Hero side, that kicked off a story line that has been going on for almost 40 years since.
I enjoyed secret wars for what it was. An excuse to take a cast of heros and have them fight a cast of villains. And it has some memorable moments like spidey vs the xmen and hulk holding up the mountain. All stuff I'd love to see adapted to the mcu in a secret wars movie. Which we all know they'll do.
And the beginning of the Spider-Man black suit & the Thing being able to change back and forth ( Rocky Grimm ) & She-Hulk joining the Fantastic Four & The Beyonder … yeah, I really liked the original Secret Wars story! I even got my issue 1 signed by the writer and inker at a comic con event 😊
I read Secret Wars monthly as the issues came out - (yes, I am old). It is still one of my favorites, mostly because of what it isn't - an attempt to create a new status quo, an earth shattering event that will inevitably be ignored in a year, etc. It always read that it was primarily just intended to be fun. The changes that came from it seemed simultaneously organic and to just shake things up enough to add interest and consequence without changing a character's essence. It introduced the new Spider-Woman, Titania, Spidey's black costume (e.g. Venom) and had some longer lasting events, like Colossus and Kitty Pryde's breakup, Thing leaving the Fantastic Four, etc. Still amazing to me after all these years.
I was 19 when Secret Wars came out, and already getting a little burned out on mainstream superheroes. So that definitely colored my perception of it, but I also think that it's objectively not very well-written. The Beyonder is just a plot device to get everyone together, and then he conveniently disappears at the end with nothing explained or resolved. The bits with Doctor Doom are better, and you can almost see Shooter's interest perking up in those sequences (insert your own joke about Shooter being uniquely qualified to write about a megalomaniacal dictator). If the whole series had been about Doom getting god-like power and the heroes uniting to stop him, that probably would've been pretty dope. But as it is, it takes too long to get to that point, and it's resolved too quickly, and the rest of the series is just the characters kind of shuffling around aimlessly. But I can understand how newer and less cynical readers could get caught up in the epic scope of it all. My big eye-opening "Oh wow, Marvel is one interconnected universe!" comic as a youngster was a reprint of the Reed and Sue wedding story. Which manages to do the "everybody fights everybody" bit in a lot fewer pages with a lot less padding-out.
I picked up issue one right after taking my SATs. By the time I got to college, my best friend and I were calling it "Marvel Super Heroes Public Pablum."
I loved Secret Wars. As a kid in 1985, I was not able to read every comic that came out. This series allowed me to experience some superheroes that I had no knowledge about and loved it. Now being "grown" up, several years ago, I purchased the Secret Wars Omnibus and absolutely loved it. I don't know if it was the story or the nostalgia of childhood memories. I so wish I still had those toys.
Secret Wars was one of the first comic book stories I ever read and I hold a strong nostalgia towards it. My dad would actually read me his old issues of it before bed. I think it’s a really fun story where we get to see these great characters interact in ways we didn’t really get to see before this came out. Story wise it’s nothing groundbreaking, it’s just a fun blockbuster and I don’t think there’s anything wrong with that.
I find it better to go back and read an event later. Once it's all out and done and the internet has given me a good list of what tie ins were important and which were trash haha. Then I'll take it all in
Good callback to Q-Squared. I liked Secret Wars when it came out, because it was something different (even though it was pretty basic). The first Crisis, however, blew Secret Wars away (in my eyes). Crisis had such an impact on me that I started to shift my collecting habits from mostly Marvel to mostly DC, which has remained that way for over 30 years.
Older fan here, read it as it came out. The story isn't exactly strong, as you pointed out, but it had some very strong moments. Hulk holding up a mountain (still used in discussions about Hulk's power level to this day!). Doom's respect for Captain America being so great he can't bring himself to believe Cap can't find a way to win. There were concepts introduced that had big effects at the time, like the wedge being driven between Colossus and Kitty's relationship. And concepts that are still relevant to this very day, like the introduction of the Venom symbiote and She-Hulk's long-standing feud with Titania. So even if it's not a great story, it's an important story, and everyone is iconic as hell. Modern storytelling wants to deconstruct characters, but here, everyone is being true to their classic interpretations, for better and for worse. Doom and Cap are the standouts here, with many fine moments. So it's in an interesting place as a "should read" because of it's place in the history. As opposed to Crisis on Infinite Earths, which WAS a great story, but dense, hard to follow, and some of it's greatest moments lost their impact over time, as Supergirl and Barry stayed dead for so long, they were eventually replaced by characters who were great in their own right (looking at you, Wally).
I think the only event that was done right was Age of Apocalypse back in the 90s. They literally "stopped" all of the X related books at the same time, for 4 months. During that time, they 'rebooted' the books and told a cohesive story throughout all of them. And all built to the ending of the Event. None of this one-off book that might reference the event on one line and have nothing else to do with the Event. And when it was done, the regular books restarted. Nothing like Doomsday Clock that last, what...a decade? Or one of the other numerous events that had things spoiled because they get referenced or retold in the regular book months before the Event issue comes out. I actually want the Events to chill out for a bit. They are happening so often they have no meaning, especially as they don't change diddly squat in their universes.
Age of Apocalypse had some weird dumb stuff. MOSTLY in their book about what was going on across the Atlantic Like Thor never getting his powers because Odin just never bothered to move the cane to a different cave to test him again, or just gave him his powers because he was clearly worthy with everything he was doing as Donald Blake in that universe. Fantastic 4 not launching into space could MAYBE be because of something the un-stopped Shadow-King did. For some reason Doom's CHILDHOOD was completely different even though that should have taken place BEFORE Xavier died. Wakanda go out like chumps to four guys on hover skates.
I was a kid when the original Secret Wars came out in 1984 and it was a game changer back then. You had all these heroes, toys and hype! We'd never seen anything like that. DC also had "Super Powers" with toys and all but the story wasn't as good. Now these cross-over events are over done and always promise something so "game changing" that they usually have to go back and "un-do" whatever they've done. First time watcher! Great video by the way! You keep the content moving!! Thanks for posting.
My main issue with Secret Wars is how the romance is written. The "romance" in this comic are either forced like Colossus and Zsaji or they came out of nowhere like Wasp and Magneto. You can tell that Jim Shooter doesn't care for The X-Men as they are treated with little respect in this story. Doom was written well in this event, the characters interactions were fun, the art is amazing and most of the fights were epic.
What are you talking about? One of the most badass moments was in issue 5 when the X-Men came to save the rest of the heroes from the villains. And Shooter writes it as if the X-Men are the coolest shit ever.
@@blacktionjackson7133 Shooter wrote the entire team of X-Men being beaten by Spider-Man. In 9 panels. It's embarrassing and makes them look like chumps.
@@jhornacek Imagine saying stupid shit like that in public and thinking that it makes you look good. Spider-Man didn't beat anyone. He fought them for 2 seconds after surprising them and ran away from them, and then Prof. X memory wiped him. And various writers have had Spider-Man go toe to toe with the Juggernaut and the Hulk and hold his own or come out of it on top prior to Secret Wars, so just say that you haven't read comics and leave.
@@blacktionjackson7133 So while I don't necessarily agree with he original point, I definitely remember X-Men fans being pissed that they got beat by Spider-man with relative ease. That _was_ a thing back then. So no, it's not stupid statement by Horacek. Now I won't agree that it was done because Shooter hated the X-Men, I imagine it was mandated to make Spider-man look like a bad ass, especially because the X-men shine later.
I saw the Secret Wars from the 90's Spiderman many times before reading the actual comic (Which I think I prefer). I liked the comic in a nostalgic kinda way, I'm not sure it's a great stand-alone story now that comics have completely upped their threat levels and events, but it's definitely a great time capsule.
The issue of Unbeatable Squirrel Girl where she skips the entirety of Secret Empire in the recap page is one of the most relaxing things I've ever read like, ah finally a comic not tying into this bad event that I hate.
The Harley Quinn issues where she angrily tells Lex Luthor to screw himself when he tries to involve her in the Year of the Villain event, then takes Booster Gold on a romp through past events to kill the concept of comic event itself were also fantastic, one of the most bizarrely meta things I have ever read, a fun exploration.
When it came out at the time it was sooo exciting. Especially how it played out in the other books. We had to try to guess what happened in the war as the other books were told after the war, and the heroes came back changed. Binging it all now removes that mystery and intrigue.
It did feel contrived and thus artificial, but did have some really cool moments. Doom was particularly well written but by setting everyone in a smaller artificial setting, it felt more 'connected'.... a smaller big picture, as it were.
I read Secret Wars in the weekly UK format when it was coming out and, honestly, it has aged badly but that one 'bolt from the blue' in one of the later issues was a genuine shocker. Oh how innocent we were.
I read it back in the day, month to month. The story was okay. It was fun seeing the heroes interact (it was comparatively rare to see them guest star in each other's books, particularly X-Men). What interested me the most was the fall out of the events in each of the team books. For example, Ben stayed on Battleworld, which was explored in his solo series. She-Hulk took his place on the Fantastic Four and we got to see how she fit in there. Colossus and Kitty broke up for a while in X-Men because of what happened to him while he was off planet. Spider-Man got his black costume which started all the symbiote stuff in his books.
I think that many who hate the great Jim Shooter will hate the first Secret Wars . Shooter , the master of writing huge casts , has rough edges that many ... sensitive ... comic artists found inhibiting .
@@cassiedevereaux-smith3890 Shooter's run on Legion of Super Heroes shows his skill at juggling a huge cast of characters. No slight towards his collaborators is implied or intended .
I think events would do better when they're kind of their own thing. The occasional big crossover where you can get fun mixes of characters that may be difficult otherwise. The problem with a lot though is that they do feel like a cheap push to get people to buy more comics by having them tie in and interrupt ongoing stories. Also nice to see heroclix is still going. A couple of my local shops started drying up and I got worried. Time to buy more minis!
don't even talk about it, trying to follow a single comic character or group you like is literally impossible. as every character is connected to hundred groups and they all affect each other. comic number X of what you reading ends in a way... and in comic number X+1 everything is different because of things that happened... god knows where i really believe that manga, webtoons and etc over took comics with such strength is because they are soooo much easier to follow
@@khhnator its literally a meme at this point. Comics: "You could start at batman #1 from 2011, not to be confused with batman #1 from 1940, batman #1 2016, or batman year one" Manga: "Just start at chapter/volume 1 bro."
Secret Wars came out when 13-year-old me was going through a pretty crappy time with my health. I vividly remember buying each issue in the hospital gift shop and reading and re-reading them 5X on the bus ride home. Thank you, Jim Shooter and Mike Zeck.
I LOVED the original Secret Wars - the team-ups, the buildup to Spidey’s costume, what the world did without the majority of its mightiest heroes, etc. I don’t remember it being hated at the time, but then, we didn’t have WWW or widespread online fan forums, either - if you were lucky you might find some Electronic bulletin boards that talked about comics, and that’s it.
I was in my mid 20’s when I got this monthly as it came out. I loved it! I had never seen anything as big as it up to that time having missed the Contest of Champions mini-series that came out in between my first and second sojourn into the world of comics. Yeah, it looked a bit rushed and chaotic at the end but it did leave changes behind that resonated for years afterward. I wasn’t aware that Heroclix were still being produced thanks for correcting that oversight by me. I am a big fan of your channel. Keep up the great work that you do and thank you.
I'm an old dude and have been into comics most of my life. I was actually in a down time as far as collecting went when Contest of the Champions came out. I really enjoyed it. So when Secret Wars came out I was primed for more of that "all the good guys are fighting all the bad guys" goodness. I thought the series was great and I'm surprised it garners hatred (I'll refrain from telling the kids to get off my lawn) You mentioned SWII, I have no memory of that, nor the movie Highlander 2, strange..........
Older comic fan (I guess). I read Secret Wars in 84 when it first came out. It was new and refreshing and not filled with mandatory crossovers and tie-ins. It was simple plot wise but hey it’s 35 YEARS ago. EVERYTHING was simpler.
Its a fun event to me, plus Doom is a badass so I enjoyed it. As for 2015 Secret Wars, its my favourite Marvel Event. Honestly keeping up with events, depends on if it affects the titles you are reading in my opinion.
I've tried reading Secret Wars on a couple occasions. I only got a couple of issues into.it. I started actively reading Spider-man around 1988. I do think Jim Shooter, Mike Zeck and Bob Layton have done great work in their careers. But this was not their best. There was an issue of Fantastic Four with a story titled Secret Wars 3. I think I read that issue and Infinity Gauntlet and Armageddon 2001 and a lot of Shooter era Valiant comics before I got to this one.
I loved the original Secret Wars. I was buying it month-by-month and I loved the interactions of the characters. It was also an introduction to characters I had no knowledge of like the Wrecking Crew and the Enchantress. Of course, there were things I didn't like Zasji (I'm not sure how to spell it and I'm not going to look it up), but I found most of it interesting and exciting.
I read this as it came out an or was a lot of fun. I remember the cover to issue 10 being the best image i had ever seen in comics up to that point. It was great to see everyone together, but I've never give back to read it again.
I really liked both Secret Wars, though I never thought one would need to read the first to get the second. Unless we're talking Deadpool's Secret Secret Wars but even that lays out and plays through the original nicely enough.
I loved comicbook characters since I was two years old, and had plenty of comicbooks, but finding Secret Wars in my cousin's collection is what got me INTO comicbooks, and made Dr. Doom my favorite villain.
I read Q-Squared. Other than Trelane being a Q (which just about every TOS fan believed since Encounter at Farpoint) I don't recall a single thing about it, so you know that was a quality story.
How can somebody hate Secret Wars? This was the comic event when I was a kid and started tying in so many different comics that I was either reading or interested in checking out. This was the first real big 12 issue event that I remember in comics and it was handled so masterfully. This introduced the symbiote and really intermingled top-tier characters like Iron Man and Captain America with Titania and Absorbing Man. The moment Wolverine cut off Absorbing Man's arm and he wasn't sure if it would reconnect when he transformed back to human was awesome! So much happened with this series and it really kept the characters genuine in their interactions. This series made me love and respect the talented writing and how everything was so interconnected.
I was a young teen when Secret Wars came out, and it did the job, making me buy comics I ordinarily wouldn't because the plot was woven throughout the various titles. I haven't read it since, but I remember loving the Bob Layton art and appreciating the basic concept. The writing did not always realize the potential of the story perhaps, but I did enjoy it overall.
@@Emptybee Perhaps. I did read both series more than thirty years ago. But it is my recollection that the regular titles tied their stories into the events in the first series as well. I could be mistaken of course.
@@Dougeb7 The way the first SW worked is that one month in the regular books, every issue ended with the hero(es) being drawn to an alien building in Central Park, entering it, and disappearing. The following month they all returned, saying "Wow, that was some adventure." Then SW #1 came out, and it was a year later before you found out how that adventure ended. But in all the normal books each hero(es)'s story just continued on as usual. So you didn't have to buy any normal books if you wanted to follow the story of SW, since all of that took place after SW was done.
Secret wars started coming out when I was a kid and I thought it was the coolest thing ever in the whole entire world of all time in the history of the universe ever ever ever! Looking back, I think it is fun and a good read but nothing mind blowing or life-changing. I do wish that events nowadays would just stop. Yes, please, please please please stop with the nonstop events. I never want to see another event ever again. Awesome video!
I am an older fan of comics. I have been reading and collecting comic books since 1977. I absolutely loved Marvel Superheroes Secret Wars both the first and the second limited series. I loved a lot of the big events from both DC and Marvel: Infinities: Gauntlet, War, and Crusade, Crisis on Infinite Earths, Armegedon 2001, Inferno, Zero Hour, etc. etc.
Secret Wars issue 1 was the very first Marvel comic I ever owned and read! I was probably about 12 yrs old and found the comic in a thrift store thrown in with a bunch of other children’s books. Secret Wars holds some good nostalgia for me.
I love Secret Wars. Issues 7, 8, and 9 were the very first comics I bought as a kid. The introduction of the black symbiote suit. It also introduced me to Monica Rambeau Captain Marvel, She-Hulk, Titania, Absorbing Man, and the 2nd Spider-Woman. Nostalgia is big with this one.
I love Secret Wars. I quit comics in 1983. In 88, I started to get curious about all the changes that happened to Marvel and DC while I was away. This event was one of the things I missed. A friend let me borrow it his copies and I binged them in a day. I guess it was one of the stories that got me excited again with comics. An excitement that was yet to end. The 2015 Secret Wars was cool, but so many tie-ins! It's a lot. I tend to read events that either tie into what I'm reading already or something that sounds fun. I skip a lot of them.
Hi Sasha, I Loved the Original Secret Wars, I brought monthly,& as you so rightly stated it was Amazing at the time seeing All of The Heroes Together…before that it was few & far between guest starring Hero in another’s comic, or the Marvel Team ups ( Spider-Man & Guest Hero), or Marvel Two in One ( The Thing & Guest Hero) which I Loved, I can’t really say how it stands the Test of time because I have not read it in Many Years, & I also can enjoy the more Innocence of comics at the times, I can handle the modern but do shake my head at as you say today’s comics “ Are A Lot of A Lot” Keep up the Great Work Sasha
I find events make it harder to just pick up and enjoy a comic. Decades ago when I was younger, the likelihood that I could find all the others was low, so it was a barrier. Not so bad today. I did enjoy Detective Comics for a while, maybe ten years ago, when the writer did a little standalone mystery every issue. You could just enjoy Batman doing his thug without trying to find the other parts of the story. So I think Events have a place, but it has moved towards all events all the time, and I think a middle road is better. Short stories are an art form often overlooked.
I was 12 when the first Secret Wars came out. I was a Marvel Zombie then and I'm one now. I never cared about Secret Wars. My feelings range from indifferent to 'I dont care'. I preferred the regular Marvel series, like X-Men, Spidey and Hulk.
Also, I don't care about DC comics but the concepts, ideas and legacy of Crisis On Infinite Earths makes Secret Wars look like trash. Plus it had a better writer: Marv Wolfman, who wrote for Marvel for years before he left to write New Teen Titans, Deathstroke and Crisis at DC.
It depends on what you want in your superhero comic. It's action focused, personalities are set from continuity, and the villains' motives are straightforward. Comics nowadays are the polar opposite: Mostly dramadies, topical, self-aware, and horribly paced with several issues passing before the villain is beaten in a one punch splash-page.
I do kinda feel the pressure to read events sometimes if I get excited by them. But wanting to read everything usually ends either with spending too much money or by not getting anything because it’s too hard to choose.
I loved the Secret Wars. I started buying comics in 1983 and then this dropped in 1984. It holds a special place in my heart I even liked Secret Wars II. Seeing the big super crossover of all the main books was awesome!
That weird asf moment when Spider-Man went to the same room as Thor and Hulk did to get there costumes repaired and that's where he got the symbiote but the strange part is Hulk repaired his already torn pants
This is a great topic for a Heroclix sponsor! I feel like the Beyonder every time I play Heroclix. In fact, my Heroclix collection has always been highlighted by the characters from the original Secret Wars line-up. Hey Wizkids, why not bring this toy-tie-in storyline full circle and release a classic Secret Wars Heroclix set?! I was the perfect age when the Secret Wars comics came out, and it really kickstarted me collecting comics. For me, no other "event" series has come close to this first one, though. I will quietly scoff at any haters, and continue to enjoy going back to re-read the original series and playing the battles in Heroclix. Oh, and I love your channel!
I'm old enough that I was reading Secret Wars month to month and it blew my mind. I still love it, and it's def a comic book happy place. Plus Mike Zeck's art was a revelation for me.
Secret wars was how I got into collecting marvel superheroes. While the stakes were smaller than crisis on infinite earths, I felt it handled the huge cast of characters well. Some truly iconic moments and possibly some of the best covers from that era of marvel.
I was in my 20s at the time; it was ok -Crisis was so much better at the time and remains my favorite event. I just sent my copy of SW #8 in to CGC for grading. Thanks Sasha!
I'm 46 now, I was 9 years old and read the first issue of secret wars at summer camp. I was blown away couldn't wait to tell my friends about this huge story. Over the next couple of years me and my BFF collected both one and two back issues. Not an easy task in 84-87ish before internet and before trades.i bought him the last issues for his collection for his birthday. We threw a small party after so our friends group could all take turns reading it. The irony is that event comics have turned me off to larger properties since. Always loved the x-men but the phalanx covenant broke me as a fan largely avoiding events ever since. As an adult events are an impediment not a reward. But there was a time in my youth when I would save up birthday card money and couldn't wait to try and track down one more back issue to further complete the story.
I had just started reading Marvel superhero comics midway through the series. (Up until then, it was Star Wars and GI Joe or nothing!) Issue #7 was one of my earliest superhero books, and I later found the earlier issues through those magnificent polybagged three-packs. I absolutely loved it, as it was my introduction to most of the X-Men and almost all of the villains. It will always have a special place in my heart.
This was right in my major comic collecting. Started in 1980. I have re-read this series multiple times, and still do. I was 14 when this came out, so comics were a great form of entertainment coming from a small rural town. The friday at the local drugstore was the day comics came in, and it was a glorious day
I'm in the no strong feelings camp. Older comic fan, but for me there was ALWAYS tie ins to be purchased, and that was great because we were kids who wanted more toys. The bulk of the shows of my childhood were basically 30 minute ads for toys; the rest were either older titles (Looney Tunes, Tom & Jerry) or were Anime based and there was little to no tie-in merch available at that time in the US. Comics were no different, and in the 80's if you didn't have action figures you weren't really trying. Now that I can get it all in one big slab, I may just read it. I was that kid that hated single issues because I burned through them way too fast.
The original Secret Wars rocked. Ironically, I've run special scenarios for Heroclix based on the Secret Wars battles. Some writers spun stories out of the event. Claremont used it to keep shifting Magneto towards anti-hero, Nightcrawler's crisis of faith, ending Peter and Kitty's relationship. And some interesting elements were there in between the brawling. Hawkeye and Cyclops both being kidnapped from their new brides. Thor and Enchantress almost falling in love (covered better in a flashback tie-in later in the Thor run). Spidey's costume saga. Hulk slipping back into savagery. A very nice tie-in with the Fantastic Four with Reed shaming Bruce and Octavius in the waiting room of the hospital Sue was in. The existence of Titania and her relationship with Absorbing Man. (I loved seeing the two of them fighting together against Wasp and Ant-Man during the Siege on Avenger's Mansion. I thought they were cute.) Yeah, Secret Wars II blew chunks but the first was a nice experiment that sadly later became a toxic cycle for Marvel. (If everything's a special event, then nothing's a special event.)
I loved Secret Wars! Probably for a different reason than most. I was just starting to collect comics when it came out. I got to preview a LOT of different heroes before I went and got their individual books. Secret Wars let me know who might interest me and who I'd probably want to avoid. The titles I liked changed over time, but Secret Wars let me establish a baseline.
I read Secret Wars when it came out. I enjoyed it but had the impression the story would lead to really big changes in the Marvel Universe -- and was annoyed when that didn't pan out. I also read Secret Wars II, which was worse and also had way too many tie-ins.
SW *did* lead to really big changes in the Marvel Universe: - Spider-Man got a new costume, which led to Venom, Carnage, and all the symbiotes we have now. - Kitty Pryde and Colossus broke up. This was huge in the X-Men comics, as they were the couple everyone thought would be together forever. - Julia Carpenter/Spider-Woman was introduced. She's no longer Spider-Woman but Carpenter is still around (as the new Madam Web, I believe). - The Thing remained on Battleworld with She-Hulk taking his place in the FF. This resulted in Johnny and Alicia getting involved and married, and eventually revealing she was a Skrull.
@@jhornacek Thanks for taking time to remind me of these changes. I was thinking more of huge global changes in the Marvel Universe, on the scale of Crisis. The Spider-Man costume did lead to something really big, although by the time that happened, I wasn't reading many comics anymore. I appreciate your response. Take care and stay safe.
Loved it then, love it now. It's telling that Secret Wars and Secret Wars II are among the very few Marvel collected works I own and actively sought out.
Old reader here. I thought of it at the time as another marketing ploy, not only for the toys, but also as a collector's item. Collectors were attracted to #1 issues and anniversary issues and crossover specials. Secret Wars was taking crossover to the extreme. As a story itself, it just barely held together with things going back to the way they were, except for the black Spidey costume which became Venom and a few other things.
I liked secret wars,I like older comics to see where the canons were at the time,one of my favorite moments was probably when she hulk went to the villains side because wasp was killed I remember being particularly scared at the sheer anger that she hulk was feeling
Got into comic book subscriptions because of Secret Wars and got great titles from its aftermath like: The Thing (Ben Grimm solo run), The Web Of Spider-Man (the black costume story) and Fantastic Four (with She-Hulk!). It was a good time.
I was never really into secret wars I just kind of knew what happened because of comic book history channels on TH-cam. However one of my favorite contributions to secret wars was the Deadpool was always there story that came out around the time, i think, of secret wars 2.
You've sold me on HeroClix! Just some background: - I am new to American comics and am hyper critical because I'm a librarian. - If the story and art of a title don't compare to Far Sector, Saga, or pretty much anything by Hickman, why should I read it? - I believe comics are still a boys' club. I enjoy 2015's Secret Wars and went back to read the original and found it lacking. As you mentioned, I might just be used to super teams as commonplace. I wish I could offer more of an opinion, but that's it. Thanks for your work. Your videos are professional development for me as I am still learning about comics. I will leave one question: what do you think of Spidey's black suit in Secret Wars? I struggle with this often because there are current iterations (King in Black, Silver Surfer Black, Black Knight) that highlight characters being stronger for donning a black suit. Oh, and when the symbiote separates from Parker it becomes a monster because... reasons? Venom is always bonded to a white man? Oof.
Honestly, I love Secret Wars! It's probably my favorite crossover event. I like the premise, how amazing Doom was, the introduction of the Spidey black suit, etc. I don't think anyone HAS to read it. A wiki article would give you all the information. But if you love Doom, I'd highly recommend it.
Sasha, you left out the best part of Secret Wars. In issue #3 Spider-Man defeats the entire team of X-Men! In 9 panels! They don't get one hit in on him! It's glorious!
Bought & read the series month to month when it came out. The main draw was to learn the origin of the new Spidey suit. It was obvious that it was a marketing stunt for the toys, but couldn't complain too much. It was the very first time characters like Wolverine and Dock Ock were in action figure form!
I was a fan of the original Secret Wars. She Hulk joined the Fantastic Four for a substantial amount of time, then-smart Hulk began losing his chill, the symbiote (though it took me a LONG time to like Venom), Colossus broke up with Kitty - the effects on continuity was good. Oh, also I REALLY like Titania and Volcana (and her effect on Molocule Man). The story was solid and entertaining (even if Peter Rasputin was being supremely emo before Emo was a thing).
Great video .. the koo thing about secret wars was that u had all the characters in one event that was new & different now it is the norm so no reason to go back , it's one of does things were u had to be there
When it first came out in the 80s?? Mind-blowing. Kinda a silly premise & character (the Beyonder) ...but it just kept growing and developing over the decades. It was a lot of fun. I still love it.
What?! I bought them new at the time and loved them. Spider-man handing the X-men their collective ass was a high point; and Professor X declining to read Spidey’s mind on moral grounds was a nice addition.
I never finished reading Secret Wars or Secret Wars 2. Lol never heard anyone rave about the story. It seems like a cool thing that happened. Favorite Sasha Quote: "I am looking at you pokemon"
I started really reading comics in the 90s before TPBs were a thing, so reading past stories was left to whatever you could afford in the back issue bins. So my original encounter with Secret Wars was fragmented because some issues we in the dollar bin while the milestone issues (like Spider-Man getting the symbiote) were out of financial reach for a kid with only 5 bucks to burn on comics (which, back then could get you a lot of comics) I didn't get to read the whole saga until I was in my 20s and could afford a TPB of the entire saga. It is definitely a product of its time and what made it hard to read was the recap pages every issue which are pointless in a trade, but you can't cut them out of the story. So you're pulling your hair enough when someone stops to recap the last few issues every 20 pages or so. The original SW is... fine. As a kid I loved the idea of Secret Wars II better because the Beyonder seemed so cool. That was another one I didn't read the whole thing until an adult. Look back on the sequel the adult me sees that it is a hot mess. Too many cooks, too many crossover issues, not much cohesion. Also the Al Milgrom art in the mainline book was awful and rushed. One thing that people never really visit was Secret Wars 3, which happened in the pages of Fantastic Four in the early 90s and how they go about explaining the why and how of the Beyonder and start tying together various plot threads. It's some deep cut material but fascinating. 2015 Secret Wars.. or Secret Wars IV for those keeping track at home.... was an interesting concept but suffers from the same problems SW2 had. Too much going on all at once. I also didn't like how it was billed as a celebration of the Marvel Multiverse and the representations weren't THE Age of Apocalypse, or THE Old Man Logan, but alternates of same. Also there were SO MANY iconic alternate universes they didn't even touch. Where my Earth X people at? You know what I'm talking about. I did really enjoy Deadpool's Secret Secret Wars which was a great lampooning of the original Secret Wars.
I never read it in real time but did get some of the toys.I enjoyed watching Spider-Man wiping the floor with the X-men and the scene of the Bruce Banner minded Hulk holding up that entire mountain range.
Secret wars was the first set of comics i sought to put together when i started collecting several years ago and i was so fullfilled when i got it together and ws able to read all the issues back to back, definitely a little dense but a really fun read.
I love Secret Wars. Didn't realize people hated it. As a kid, I read through all the Spider-Man comics and that was my intro to Marvel. As such, though I knew most of the heroes were, this my first introduction to many of the villains. Enchantress, Klaw, Molecule Man, Absorbing Man, Titania, Ultron -- this was the first time I heard of all of them! Though I knew about Galactus, I think it was my first exposure to him in action as well. So yeah, this book will always hold a nostalgic place for me.
Check Out HeroClix -
wizkids.com/heroclix/marvel-heroclix-avengers-fantastic-four-empyre/
can you link your Spiderman Black Costume videos?
Yep, they're in the description :)
@@CasuallyComics so they are too
I always liked the original Secret Wars. When I was starting to read comics, the publisher of Marvel and DC in my country was reprinting it and calling it "the uncut version". It's funny that they'd advertise that they themselves had made several cuts to the story when it was first published because they had to publish it fast because of the toy deals - even though the monthly books were way behind. So they just cut stuff so we wouldn't have spoilers like that Rogue was going to join the X-Men.
Anyway, I like the story just fine and I usually hate event comics. Maybe because it was actually quite simple to just read it and understand if. I find amusing thaf an industry that basicly everyone started reading when they were kids would be so opposed to keep bringing more kids in with things like this.
came here to commend you for the pokemon coasting joke. like seriously hardest laugh of my day
All these years later, I can still remember Doom crushing the Beyonder and delivering the single best line ever in a comic book, "On your knees, if you have knees"
I love secret wars, compelling portrayal of Doom, kicked off Magneto's redemption, has some good character moments, and epic fights. I accept that it is imperfect, but I think it was great
It... Was hated?! I can get the disliking it for starting the modern event comics, but as a story, it was fine, with some great Doom moments. Now Hickman's Secret Wars is awesome, and having a powerful cosmic leader pulling heroes from their lives is now a franchise with "Contest of Champions", the comics and the mobile game.
This is the first I heard it was hated too. I got it when it came out. It was a very fun read.
Also Sasha forgot, this was the first appearance of the Beyonder.
@@blackrazer22 It was the time and expectation. Mike Zeck was (and is) one of the finest artists of his era - but he was rushed and under deadline. The plot meandered. People expected paradigm shifting changes in continuity and it did not happen to the scale as expected. And finally a Jim Shooter backlash was in the works for years and this was the place it exploded.
Julia Carpenter was cool.
@@redcoltken Shooter was right, If the powers that be had kept shooter and banished the crybabies Marvel would not be using news print and waterbased ink in an effort to keep the lights turned on.
@@From-North-Jersey I admit to being a Shooter hater in my teenage years. But time has taught a hard lesson. He was very good for Marvel overall
I'd been reading comics for over a decade when the first mass-battle came out, but it wasn't Secret Wars, it was "Contest of Champions", and I liked it. Then a few years later "Secret Wars" came out, and I liked it. But yeah, I feel like they've gone there too much with "events."
As always thank you so very much for the video.
I remember Contest of Champions fondly. It just now occurred to me that the second book of the JLA/Avengers crossover was an expanded Contest of Champions. But then again, it's a standard ploy of the Grandmaster.
Contest of Champions had a weird flex. "Look at all these international heroes we created just for this event!" Most of whom were seldom used in any serious way since.
Contest of Champions was great even if it was only 3 issues. Only gripe for me was that the writers screwed up the team scoring calling it win for the Grandmaster rather than a tie. Had to re-read it several times to be sure I wasn't losing my mind.
@@Raja1938 they did resolve that issue a few years later in Avengers Annual #16 and West Coast Avengers Annual #2
@@nickperoncomedy Shamrock! The Collective Man! All of your favorites!
I enjoyed the original Secret wars. Honestly it was cool seeing most of the heroes together. Plus they actually had some real conversation about their struggles and beliefs. Mainly I’m talking about the Mutants policing their own. And Wolverine stepping to Cap.
For a toy inspired comic, it did a great job showing off Dr. Doom to all those people who were just reading the X-Men and Spider-man at the time, and it really showed off how smart and ruthless he was. Secondly, it was great when Magneto ended up appearing with the Hero side, that kicked off a story line that has been going on for almost 40 years since.
I enjoyed secret wars for what it was. An excuse to take a cast of heros and have them fight a cast of villains. And it has some memorable moments like spidey vs the xmen and hulk holding up the mountain. All stuff I'd love to see adapted to the mcu in a secret wars movie. Which we all know they'll do.
Also gave us Titania, and she and Absorbing man were/are a great couple.
And the beginning of the Spider-Man black suit
& the Thing being able to change back and forth ( Rocky Grimm )
& She-Hulk joining the Fantastic Four
& The Beyonder
… yeah, I really liked the original Secret Wars story! I even got my issue 1 signed by the writer and inker at a comic con event 😊
I read Secret Wars monthly as the issues came out - (yes, I am old). It is still one of my favorites, mostly because of what it isn't - an attempt to create a new status quo, an earth shattering event that will inevitably be ignored in a year, etc. It always read that it was primarily just intended to be fun. The changes that came from it seemed simultaneously organic and to just shake things up enough to add interest and consequence without changing a character's essence. It introduced the new Spider-Woman, Titania, Spidey's black costume (e.g. Venom) and had some longer lasting events, like Colossus and Kitty Pryde's breakup, Thing leaving the Fantastic Four, etc. Still amazing to me after all these years.
I was 19 when Secret Wars came out, and already getting a little burned out on mainstream superheroes. So that definitely colored my perception of it, but I also think that it's objectively not very well-written. The Beyonder is just a plot device to get everyone together, and then he conveniently disappears at the end with nothing explained or resolved. The bits with Doctor Doom are better, and you can almost see Shooter's interest perking up in those sequences (insert your own joke about Shooter being uniquely qualified to write about a megalomaniacal dictator). If the whole series had been about Doom getting god-like power and the heroes uniting to stop him, that probably would've been pretty dope. But as it is, it takes too long to get to that point, and it's resolved too quickly, and the rest of the series is just the characters kind of shuffling around aimlessly. But I can understand how newer and less cynical readers could get caught up in the epic scope of it all. My big eye-opening "Oh wow, Marvel is one interconnected universe!" comic as a youngster was a reprint of the Reed and Sue wedding story. Which manages to do the "everybody fights everybody" bit in a lot fewer pages with a lot less padding-out.
I picked up issue one right after taking my SATs. By the time I got to college, my best friend and I were calling it "Marvel Super Heroes Public Pablum."
I loved Secret Wars. As a kid in 1985, I was not able to read every comic that came out. This series allowed me to experience some superheroes that I had no knowledge about and loved it. Now being "grown" up, several years ago, I purchased the Secret Wars Omnibus and absolutely loved it. I don't know if it was the story or the nostalgia of childhood memories. I so wish I still had those toys.
Secret Wars was one of the first comic book stories I ever read and I hold a strong nostalgia towards it. My dad would actually read me his old issues of it before bed. I think it’s a really fun story where we get to see these great characters interact in ways we didn’t really get to see before this came out. Story wise it’s nothing groundbreaking, it’s just a fun blockbuster and I don’t think there’s anything wrong with that.
I absolutely loved Secret Wars! The series introduced me to a lot of characters in books I wasn't collecting at the time. Thanks Secret Wars:)
Collecting the action figures from the Secret Wars series got me into both comics and into action figures. Honestly, this is nostalgia for me.
Me too
I thought the art in Secret Wars looked rushed,weak and the artist didn't put a full effort into it.SEMPER-FI.
I used to love the results of the secret wars comic, but the comic itself always feels like a grab to sell toys, still a fun time
IT WAS.
I find it better to go back and read an event later. Once it's all out and done and the internet has given me a good list of what tie ins were important and which were trash haha. Then I'll take it all in
Issue 4 cover: The Hulk holds up 150 million tons, and he's not happy. Fantastic. And Molecule Man proves why he's not a joke.
Good callback to Q-Squared.
I liked Secret Wars when it came out, because it was something different (even though it was pretty basic).
The first Crisis, however, blew Secret Wars away (in my eyes). Crisis had such an impact on me that I started to shift my collecting habits from mostly Marvel to mostly DC, which has remained that way for over 30 years.
Q-Squared was orders of magnitude better.
I AGREE,Eyrrll.And the artwork was sooo much better and more dynamic!!! LOL.You can't go wrong with the great GEORGE PEREZ.LOL. SEMPER-FI.
Older fan here, read it as it came out. The story isn't exactly strong, as you pointed out, but it had some very strong moments. Hulk holding up a mountain (still used in discussions about Hulk's power level to this day!). Doom's respect for Captain America being so great he can't bring himself to believe Cap can't find a way to win. There were concepts introduced that had big effects at the time, like the wedge being driven between Colossus and Kitty's relationship. And concepts that are still relevant to this very day, like the introduction of the Venom symbiote and She-Hulk's long-standing feud with Titania. So even if it's not a great story, it's an important story, and everyone is iconic as hell. Modern storytelling wants to deconstruct characters, but here, everyone is being true to their classic interpretations, for better and for worse. Doom and Cap are the standouts here, with many fine moments. So it's in an interesting place as a "should read" because of it's place in the history. As opposed to Crisis on Infinite Earths, which WAS a great story, but dense, hard to follow, and some of it's greatest moments lost their impact over time, as Supergirl and Barry stayed dead for so long, they were eventually replaced by characters who were great in their own right (looking at you, Wally).
I read Q-Squared back in the 90's. It was one of my fave of the novels along with Vendetta, Sarek and Federation :)
I regularly reread Sarek I love that book so much!
If you have not read it try IMZADI II
Federation is AMAZING
I too read and enjoyed Q-Squared and Vendetta. SEMPER-FI.
I think the only event that was done right was Age of Apocalypse back in the 90s.
They literally "stopped" all of the X related books at the same time, for 4 months. During that time, they 'rebooted' the books and told a cohesive story throughout all of them. And all built to the ending of the Event. None of this one-off book that might reference the event on one line and have nothing else to do with the Event. And when it was done, the regular books restarted.
Nothing like Doomsday Clock that last, what...a decade? Or one of the other numerous events that had things spoiled because they get referenced or retold in the regular book months before the Event issue comes out.
I actually want the Events to chill out for a bit. They are happening so often they have no meaning, especially as they don't change diddly squat in their universes.
If you want more meaningful events, you shoul read House of X / Powers of X ^^
Age of Apocalypse had some weird dumb stuff. MOSTLY in their book about what was going on across the Atlantic Like Thor never getting his powers because Odin just never bothered to move the cane to a different cave to test him again, or just gave him his powers because he was clearly worthy with everything he was doing as Donald Blake in that universe. Fantastic 4 not launching into space could MAYBE be because of something the un-stopped Shadow-King did. For some reason Doom's CHILDHOOD was completely different even though that should have taken place BEFORE Xavier died.
Wakanda go out like chumps to four guys on hover skates.
I was a kid when the original Secret Wars came out in 1984 and it was a game changer back then. You had all these heroes, toys and hype! We'd never seen anything like that. DC also had "Super Powers" with toys and all but the story wasn't as good. Now these cross-over events are over done and always promise something so "game changing" that they usually have to go back and "un-do" whatever they've done. First time watcher! Great video by the way! You keep the content moving!! Thanks for posting.
My main issue with Secret Wars is how the romance is written. The "romance" in this comic are either forced like Colossus and Zsaji or they came out of nowhere like Wasp and Magneto. You can tell that Jim Shooter doesn't care for The X-Men as they are treated with little respect in this story. Doom was written well in this event, the characters interactions were fun, the art is amazing and most of the fights were epic.
agreed but I THINK The forced Romances were to make readers say "oh my god they dont think they are going back
What are you talking about? One of the most badass moments was in issue 5 when the X-Men came to save the rest of the heroes from the villains. And Shooter writes it as if the X-Men are the coolest shit ever.
@@blacktionjackson7133 Shooter wrote the entire team of X-Men being beaten by Spider-Man. In 9 panels. It's embarrassing and makes them look like chumps.
@@jhornacek Imagine saying stupid shit like that in public and thinking that it makes you look good. Spider-Man didn't beat anyone. He fought them for 2 seconds after surprising them and ran away from them, and then Prof. X memory wiped him. And various writers have had Spider-Man go toe to toe with the Juggernaut and the Hulk and hold his own or come out of it on top prior to Secret Wars, so just say that you haven't read comics and leave.
@@blacktionjackson7133 So while I don't necessarily agree with he original point, I definitely remember X-Men fans being pissed that they got beat by Spider-man with relative ease. That _was_ a thing back then. So no, it's not stupid statement by Horacek. Now I won't agree that it was done because Shooter hated the X-Men, I imagine it was mandated to make Spider-man look like a bad ass, especially because the X-men shine later.
I saw the Secret Wars from the 90's Spiderman many times before reading the actual comic (Which I think I prefer). I liked the comic in a nostalgic kinda way, I'm not sure it's a great stand-alone story now that comics have completely upped their threat levels and events, but it's definitely a great time capsule.
The issue of Unbeatable Squirrel Girl where she skips the entirety of Secret Empire in the recap page is one of the most relaxing things I've ever read like, ah finally a comic not tying into this bad event that I hate.
The Harley Quinn issues where she angrily tells Lex Luthor to screw himself when he tries to involve her in the Year of the Villain event, then takes Booster Gold on a romp through past events to kill the concept of comic event itself were also fantastic, one of the most bizarrely meta things I have ever read, a fun exploration.
When it came out at the time it was sooo exciting. Especially how it played out in the other books. We had to try to guess what happened in the war as the other books were told after the war, and the heroes came back changed. Binging it all now removes that mystery and intrigue.
It did feel contrived and thus artificial, but did have some really cool moments. Doom was particularly well written but by setting everyone in a smaller artificial setting, it felt more 'connected'.... a smaller big picture, as it were.
I read Secret Wars in the weekly UK format when it was coming out and, honestly, it has aged badly but that one 'bolt from the blue' in one of the later issues was a genuine shocker.
Oh how innocent we were.
I read it back in the day, month to month. The story was okay. It was fun seeing the heroes interact (it was comparatively rare to see them guest star in each other's books, particularly X-Men). What interested me the most was the fall out of the events in each of the team books. For example, Ben stayed on Battleworld, which was explored in his solo series. She-Hulk took his place on the Fantastic Four and we got to see how she fit in there. Colossus and Kitty broke up for a while in X-Men because of what happened to him while he was off planet. Spider-Man got his black costume which started all the symbiote stuff in his books.
I think that many who hate the great Jim Shooter will hate the first Secret Wars . Shooter , the master of writing huge casts , has rough edges that many ... sensitive ... comic artists found inhibiting .
Well, I think he has to share the 'master' title with Marv Wolfman. IMHO< CoiE cannot be denied. Gotta also shout out Busiek.
@@cassiedevereaux-smith3890 Shooter's run on Legion of Super Heroes shows his skill at juggling a huge cast of characters. No slight towards his collaborators is implied or intended .
I think events would do better when they're kind of their own thing. The occasional big crossover where you can get fun mixes of characters that may be difficult otherwise. The problem with a lot though is that they do feel like a cheap push to get people to buy more comics by having them tie in and interrupt ongoing stories.
Also nice to see heroclix is still going. A couple of my local shops started drying up and I got worried. Time to buy more minis!
don't even talk about it, trying to follow a single comic character or group you like is literally impossible.
as every character is connected to hundred groups and they all affect each other.
comic number X of what you reading ends in a way... and in comic number X+1 everything is different because of things that happened... god knows where
i really believe that manga, webtoons and etc over took comics with such strength is because they are soooo much easier to follow
@@khhnator its literally a meme at this point.
Comics: "You could start at batman #1 from 2011, not to be confused with batman #1 from 1940, batman #1 2016, or batman year one"
Manga: "Just start at chapter/volume 1 bro."
Secret Wars came out when 13-year-old me was going through a pretty crappy time with my health. I vividly remember buying each issue in the hospital gift shop and reading and re-reading them 5X on the bus ride home. Thank you, Jim Shooter and Mike Zeck.
I LOVED the original Secret Wars - the team-ups, the buildup to Spidey’s costume, what the world did without the majority of its mightiest heroes, etc. I don’t remember it being hated at the time, but then, we didn’t have WWW or widespread online fan forums, either - if you were lucky you might find some Electronic bulletin boards that talked about comics, and that’s it.
Only classic event I can’t get my head around and have given up on multiple times is final crisis.
I still don't understand the plot of Final Crisis lol
Secret Wars was an attempt to rip off Crisis on Infinite Earths before Crisis was released. :-P
I was in my mid 20’s when I got this monthly as it came out. I loved it! I had never seen anything as big as it up to that time having missed the Contest of Champions mini-series that came out in between my first and second sojourn into the world of comics. Yeah, it looked a bit rushed and chaotic at the end but it did leave changes behind that resonated for years afterward. I wasn’t aware that Heroclix were still being produced thanks for correcting that oversight by me. I am a big fan of your channel. Keep up the great work that you do and thank you.
I'm an old dude and have been into comics most of my life. I was actually in a down time as far as collecting went when Contest of the Champions came out. I really enjoyed it. So when Secret Wars came out I was primed for more of that "all the good guys are fighting all the bad guys" goodness. I thought the series was great and I'm surprised it garners hatred (I'll refrain from telling the kids to get off my lawn) You mentioned SWII, I have no memory of that, nor the movie Highlander 2, strange..........
Older comic fan (I guess). I read Secret Wars in 84 when it first came out. It was new and refreshing and not filled with mandatory crossovers and tie-ins. It was simple plot wise but hey it’s 35 YEARS ago. EVERYTHING was simpler.
Its a fun event to me, plus Doom is a badass so I enjoyed it. As for 2015 Secret Wars, its my favourite Marvel Event. Honestly keeping up with events, depends on if it affects the titles you are reading in my opinion.
I've tried reading Secret Wars on a couple occasions. I only got a couple of issues into.it. I started actively reading Spider-man around 1988. I do think Jim Shooter, Mike Zeck and Bob Layton have done great work in their careers. But this was not their best.
There was an issue of Fantastic Four with a story titled Secret Wars 3. I think I read that issue and Infinity Gauntlet and Armageddon 2001 and a lot of Shooter era Valiant comics before I got to this one.
I loved the original Secret Wars. I was buying it month-by-month and I loved the interactions of the characters. It was also an introduction to characters I had no knowledge of like the Wrecking Crew and the Enchantress. Of course, there were things I didn't like Zasji (I'm not sure how to spell it and I'm not going to look it up), but I found most of it interesting and exciting.
I read this as it came out an or was a lot of fun. I remember the cover to issue 10 being the best image i had ever seen in comics up to that point. It was great to see everyone together, but I've never give back to read it again.
I really liked both Secret Wars, though I never thought one would need to read the first to get the second. Unless we're talking Deadpool's Secret Secret Wars but even that lays out and plays through the original nicely enough.
Secret wars is a one n done type of deal , unlike the infinity gauntlet and it’s continued sagas…war and crusade
I loved comicbook characters since I was two years old, and had plenty of comicbooks, but finding Secret Wars in my cousin's collection is what got me INTO comicbooks, and made Dr. Doom my favorite villain.
I read Q-Squared. Other than Trelane being a Q (which just about every TOS fan believed since Encounter at Farpoint) I don't recall a single thing about it, so you know that was a quality story.
How can somebody hate Secret Wars? This was the comic event when I was a kid and started tying in so many different comics that I was either reading or interested in checking out. This was the first real big 12 issue event that I remember in comics and it was handled so masterfully. This introduced the symbiote and really intermingled top-tier characters like Iron Man and Captain America with Titania and Absorbing Man. The moment Wolverine cut off Absorbing Man's arm and he wasn't sure if it would reconnect when he transformed back to human was awesome! So much happened with this series and it really kept the characters genuine in their interactions. This series made me love and respect the talented writing and how everything was so interconnected.
I was a young teen when Secret Wars came out, and it did the job, making me buy comics I ordinarily wouldn't because the plot was woven throughout the various titles. I haven't read it since, but I remember loving the Bob Layton art and appreciating the basic concept. The writing did not always realize the potential of the story perhaps, but I did enjoy it overall.
Secret Wars was a self contained story. It didn't weave through various titles. Perhaps you're thinking of Secret Wars II? It did a lot of that.
@@Emptybee Perhaps. I did read both series more than thirty years ago. But it is my recollection that the regular titles tied their stories into the events in the first series as well. I could be mistaken of course.
@@Dougeb7 The way the first SW worked is that one month in the regular books, every issue ended with the hero(es) being drawn to an alien building in Central Park, entering it, and disappearing. The following month they all returned, saying "Wow, that was some adventure." Then SW #1 came out, and it was a year later before you found out how that adventure ended. But in all the normal books each hero(es)'s story just continued on as usual. So you didn't have to buy any normal books if you wanted to follow the story of SW, since all of that took place after SW was done.
Secret wars started coming out when I was a kid and I thought it was the coolest thing ever in the whole entire world of all time in the history of the universe ever ever ever! Looking back, I think it is fun and a good read but nothing mind blowing or life-changing. I do wish that events nowadays would just stop. Yes, please, please please please stop with the nonstop events. I never want to see another event ever again. Awesome video!
I am an older fan of comics. I have been reading and collecting comic books since 1977. I absolutely loved Marvel Superheroes Secret Wars both the first and the second limited series. I loved a lot of the big events from both DC and Marvel: Infinities: Gauntlet, War, and Crusade, Crisis on Infinite Earths, Armegedon 2001, Inferno, Zero Hour, etc. etc.
Secret Wars issue 1 was the very first Marvel comic I ever owned and read! I was probably about 12 yrs old and found the comic in a thrift store thrown in with a bunch of other children’s books. Secret Wars holds some good nostalgia for me.
I love Secret Wars. Issues 7, 8, and 9 were the very first comics I bought as a kid. The introduction of the black symbiote suit. It also introduced me to Monica Rambeau Captain Marvel, She-Hulk, Titania, Absorbing Man, and the 2nd Spider-Woman. Nostalgia is big with this one.
I love Secret Wars. I quit comics in 1983. In 88, I started to get curious about all the changes that happened to Marvel and DC while I was away. This event was one of the things I missed. A friend let me borrow it his copies and I binged them in a day. I guess it was one of the stories that got me excited again with comics. An excitement that was yet to end. The 2015 Secret Wars was cool, but so many tie-ins! It's a lot.
I tend to read events that either tie into what I'm reading already or something that sounds fun. I skip a lot of them.
Hi Sasha, I Loved the Original Secret Wars, I brought monthly,& as you so rightly stated it was Amazing at the time seeing All of The Heroes Together…before that it was few & far between guest starring Hero in another’s comic, or the Marvel Team ups ( Spider-Man & Guest Hero), or Marvel Two in One ( The Thing & Guest Hero) which I Loved, I can’t really say how it stands the Test of time because I have not read it in Many Years, & I also can enjoy the more Innocence of comics at the times, I can handle the modern but do shake my head at as you say today’s comics “ Are A Lot of A Lot” Keep up the Great Work Sasha
I find events make it harder to just pick up and enjoy a comic. Decades ago when I was younger, the likelihood that I could find all the others was low, so it was a barrier. Not so bad today. I did enjoy Detective Comics for a while, maybe ten years ago, when the writer did a little standalone mystery every issue. You could just enjoy Batman doing his thug without trying to find the other parts of the story. So I think Events have a place, but it has moved towards all events all the time, and I think a middle road is better. Short stories are an art form often overlooked.
I was 12 when the first Secret Wars came out. I was a Marvel Zombie then and I'm one now. I never cared about Secret Wars. My feelings range from indifferent to 'I dont care'. I preferred the regular Marvel series, like X-Men, Spidey and Hulk.
Also, I don't care about DC comics but the concepts, ideas and legacy of Crisis On Infinite Earths makes Secret Wars look like trash. Plus it had a better writer: Marv Wolfman, who wrote for Marvel for years before he left to write New Teen Titans, Deathstroke and Crisis at DC.
It depends on what you want in your superhero comic. It's action focused, personalities are set from continuity, and the villains' motives are straightforward. Comics nowadays are the polar opposite: Mostly dramadies, topical, self-aware, and horribly paced with several issues passing before the villain is beaten in a one punch splash-page.
I do kinda feel the pressure to read events sometimes if I get excited by them. But wanting to read everything usually ends either with spending too much money or by not getting anything because it’s too hard to choose.
I loved the Secret Wars. I started buying comics in 1983 and then this dropped in 1984. It holds a special place in my heart I even liked Secret Wars II. Seeing the big super crossover of all the main books was awesome!
That weird asf moment when Spider-Man went to the same room as Thor and Hulk did to get there costumes repaired and that's where he got the symbiote but the strange part is Hulk repaired his already torn pants
This is a great topic for a Heroclix sponsor! I feel like the Beyonder every time I play Heroclix. In fact, my Heroclix collection has always been highlighted by the characters from the original Secret Wars line-up. Hey Wizkids, why not bring this toy-tie-in storyline full circle and release a classic Secret Wars Heroclix set?! I was the perfect age when the Secret Wars comics came out, and it really kickstarted me collecting comics. For me, no other "event" series has come close to this first one, though. I will quietly scoff at any haters, and continue to enjoy going back to re-read the original series and playing the battles in Heroclix. Oh, and I love your channel!
I'm old enough that I was reading Secret Wars month to month and it blew my mind. I still love it, and it's def a comic book happy place.
Plus Mike Zeck's art was a revelation for me.
Secret wars was how I got into collecting marvel superheroes. While the stakes were smaller than crisis on infinite earths, I felt it handled the huge cast of characters well. Some truly iconic moments and possibly some of the best covers from that era of marvel.
I was in my 20s at the time; it was ok -Crisis was so much better at the time and remains my favorite event. I just sent my copy of SW #8 in to CGC for grading. Thanks Sasha!
I'm 46 now, I was 9 years old and read the first issue of secret wars at summer camp. I was blown away couldn't wait to tell my friends about this huge story. Over the next couple of years me and my BFF collected both one and two back issues. Not an easy task in 84-87ish before internet and before trades.i bought him the last issues for his collection for his birthday. We threw a small party after so our friends group could all take turns reading it. The irony is that event comics have turned me off to larger properties since. Always loved the x-men but the phalanx covenant broke me as a fan largely avoiding events ever since. As an adult events are an impediment not a reward. But there was a time in my youth when I would save up birthday card money and couldn't wait to try and track down one more back issue to further complete the story.
I had just started reading Marvel superhero comics midway through the series. (Up until then, it was Star Wars and GI Joe or nothing!) Issue #7 was one of my earliest superhero books, and I later found the earlier issues through those magnificent polybagged three-packs.
I absolutely loved it, as it was my introduction to most of the X-Men and almost all of the villains. It will always have a special place in my heart.
This was right in my major comic collecting. Started in 1980. I have re-read this series multiple times, and still do. I was 14 when this came out, so comics were a great form of entertainment coming from a small rural town. The friday at the local drugstore was the day comics came in, and it was a glorious day
I'm in the no strong feelings camp. Older comic fan, but for me there was ALWAYS tie ins to be purchased, and that was great because we were kids who wanted more toys. The bulk of the shows of my childhood were basically 30 minute ads for toys; the rest were either older titles (Looney Tunes, Tom & Jerry) or were Anime based and there was little to no tie-in merch available at that time in the US.
Comics were no different, and in the 80's if you didn't have action figures you weren't really trying.
Now that I can get it all in one big slab, I may just read it. I was that kid that hated single issues because I burned through them way too fast.
I was about seven when I read secret wars and i loved it . I even loved secret wars 2. I was their target audience and they hit the mark.
The original Secret Wars rocked. Ironically, I've run special scenarios for Heroclix based on the Secret Wars battles.
Some writers spun stories out of the event. Claremont used it to keep shifting Magneto towards anti-hero, Nightcrawler's crisis of faith, ending Peter and Kitty's relationship. And some interesting elements were there in between the brawling. Hawkeye and Cyclops both being kidnapped from their new brides. Thor and Enchantress almost falling in love (covered better in a flashback tie-in later in the Thor run). Spidey's costume saga. Hulk slipping back into savagery. A very nice tie-in with the Fantastic Four with Reed shaming Bruce and Octavius in the waiting room of the hospital Sue was in. The existence of Titania and her relationship with Absorbing Man. (I loved seeing the two of them fighting together against Wasp and Ant-Man during the Siege on Avenger's Mansion. I thought they were cute.) Yeah, Secret Wars II blew chunks but the first was a nice experiment that sadly later became a toxic cycle for Marvel. (If everything's a special event, then nothing's a special event.)
I loved Secret Wars! Probably for a different reason than most. I was just starting to collect comics when it came out. I got to preview a LOT of different heroes before I went and got their individual books. Secret Wars let me know who might interest me and who I'd probably want to avoid. The titles I liked changed over time, but Secret Wars let me establish a baseline.
I read Secret Wars when it came out. I enjoyed it but had the impression the story would lead to really big changes in the Marvel Universe -- and was annoyed when that didn't pan out. I also read Secret Wars II, which was worse and also had way too many tie-ins.
SW *did* lead to really big changes in the Marvel Universe:
- Spider-Man got a new costume, which led to Venom, Carnage, and all the symbiotes we have now.
- Kitty Pryde and Colossus broke up. This was huge in the X-Men comics, as they were the couple everyone thought would be together forever.
- Julia Carpenter/Spider-Woman was introduced. She's no longer Spider-Woman but Carpenter is still around (as the new Madam Web, I believe).
- The Thing remained on Battleworld with She-Hulk taking his place in the FF. This resulted in Johnny and Alicia getting involved and married, and eventually revealing she was a Skrull.
@@jhornacek Thanks for taking time to remind me of these changes. I was thinking more of huge global changes in the Marvel Universe, on the scale of Crisis. The Spider-Man costume did lead to something really big, although by the time that happened, I wasn't reading many comics anymore. I appreciate your response. Take care and stay safe.
@@stevenbogart169 Crisis was intended to make changes to the universe. Secret Wars was only intended to make changes to some characters.
Loved it then, love it now. It's telling that Secret Wars and Secret Wars II are among the very few Marvel collected works I own and actively sought out.
Old reader here. I thought of it at the time as another marketing ploy, not only for the toys, but also as a collector's item. Collectors were attracted to #1 issues and anniversary issues and crossover specials. Secret Wars was taking crossover to the extreme. As a story itself, it just barely held together with things going back to the way they were, except for the black Spidey costume which became Venom and a few other things.
Prior to Secret Wars, I think the biggest Marvel Crossover event was the marriage of Reed and Sue. That one was kind of a fun, one issue event.
I am a big fan of your panel-by-panel reviews, so I'm honestly game for anything.
I liked secret wars,I like older comics to see where the canons were at the time,one of my favorite moments was probably when she hulk went to the villains side because wasp was killed I remember being particularly scared at the sheer anger that she hulk was feeling
Also I love secret wars it's always been one of my all time favorites and I'm very glad that you did the deep dive on it. Thank you
Got into comic book subscriptions because of Secret Wars and got great titles from its aftermath like: The Thing (Ben Grimm solo run), The Web Of Spider-Man (the black costume story) and Fantastic Four (with She-Hulk!). It was a good time.
I was never really into secret wars I just kind of knew what happened because of comic book history channels on TH-cam. However one of my favorite contributions to secret wars was the Deadpool was always there story that came out around the time, i think, of secret wars 2.
You've sold me on HeroClix!
Just some background:
- I am new to American comics and am hyper critical because I'm a librarian.
- If the story and art of a title don't compare to Far Sector, Saga, or pretty much anything by Hickman, why should I read it?
- I believe comics are still a boys' club.
I enjoy 2015's Secret Wars and went back to read the original and found it lacking. As you mentioned, I might just be used to super teams as commonplace. I wish I could offer more of an opinion, but that's it.
Thanks for your work. Your videos are professional development for me as I am still learning about comics.
I will leave one question: what do you think of Spidey's black suit in Secret Wars?
I struggle with this often because there are current iterations (King in Black, Silver Surfer Black, Black Knight) that highlight characters being stronger for donning a black suit. Oh, and when the symbiote separates from Parker it becomes a monster because... reasons? Venom is always bonded to a white man? Oof.
Honestly, I love Secret Wars! It's probably my favorite crossover event. I like the premise, how amazing Doom was, the introduction of the Spidey black suit, etc. I don't think anyone HAS to read it. A wiki article would give you all the information. But if you love Doom, I'd highly recommend it.
Titania / Molecule man and 'Oh noes! My poor widdle Owen!" is the main memory I have from Secret Wars.
Sasha, you left out the best part of Secret Wars. In issue #3 Spider-Man defeats the entire team of X-Men! In 9 panels! They don't get one hit in on him! It's glorious!
4:29 That series did the Storylines I feel pretty well. Even the Spider Carnage Storyline was Great fun at its series's end too.
0:44 the "Bro, do you even lift" Thor action figure.
I liked it for the same reason that I liked Stan Lee’s Spider-Man run. It brought on nostalgia from watching the cartoon as a kid in the 90s
Bought the series off the rack in the 80's. Great limited series and one of the first from Marvel.
I read Secret Wars as it came out. It was frustrating and not the best, but the story had a lot of high points.
Bought & read the series month to month when it came out. The main draw was to learn the origin of the new Spidey suit. It was obvious that it was a marketing stunt for the toys, but couldn't complain too much. It was the very first time characters like Wolverine and Dock Ock were in action figure form!
I was a fan of the original Secret Wars. She Hulk joined the Fantastic Four for a substantial amount of time, then-smart Hulk began losing his chill, the symbiote (though it took me a LONG time to like Venom), Colossus broke up with Kitty - the effects on continuity was good. Oh, also I REALLY like Titania and Volcana (and her effect on Molocule Man). The story was solid and entertaining (even if Peter Rasputin was being supremely emo before Emo was a thing).
Great video .. the koo thing about secret wars was that u had all the characters in one event that was new & different now it is the norm so no reason to go back , it's one of does things were u had to be there
When it first came out in the 80s?? Mind-blowing. Kinda a silly premise & character (the Beyonder) ...but it just kept growing and developing over the decades. It was a lot of fun. I still love it.
What?! I bought them new at the time and loved them. Spider-man handing the X-men their collective ass was a high point; and Professor X declining to read Spidey’s mind on moral grounds was a nice addition.
I never finished reading Secret Wars or Secret Wars 2. Lol never heard anyone rave about the story.
It seems like a cool thing that happened.
Favorite Sasha Quote: "I am looking at you pokemon"
I started really reading comics in the 90s before TPBs were a thing, so reading past stories was left to whatever you could afford in the back issue bins. So my original encounter with Secret Wars was fragmented because some issues we in the dollar bin while the milestone issues (like Spider-Man getting the symbiote) were out of financial reach for a kid with only 5 bucks to burn on comics (which, back then could get you a lot of comics) I didn't get to read the whole saga until I was in my 20s and could afford a TPB of the entire saga.
It is definitely a product of its time and what made it hard to read was the recap pages every issue which are pointless in a trade, but you can't cut them out of the story. So you're pulling your hair enough when someone stops to recap the last few issues every 20 pages or so.
The original SW is... fine. As a kid I loved the idea of Secret Wars II better because the Beyonder seemed so cool. That was another one I didn't read the whole thing until an adult. Look back on the sequel the adult me sees that it is a hot mess. Too many cooks, too many crossover issues, not much cohesion. Also the Al Milgrom art in the mainline book was awful and rushed.
One thing that people never really visit was Secret Wars 3, which happened in the pages of Fantastic Four in the early 90s and how they go about explaining the why and how of the Beyonder and start tying together various plot threads. It's some deep cut material but fascinating.
2015 Secret Wars.. or Secret Wars IV for those keeping track at home.... was an interesting concept but suffers from the same problems SW2 had. Too much going on all at once. I also didn't like how it was billed as a celebration of the Marvel Multiverse and the representations weren't THE Age of Apocalypse, or THE Old Man Logan, but alternates of same. Also there were SO MANY iconic alternate universes they didn't even touch. Where my Earth X people at? You know what I'm talking about.
I did really enjoy Deadpool's Secret Secret Wars which was a great lampooning of the original Secret Wars.
I never read it in real time but did get some of the toys.I enjoyed watching Spider-Man wiping the floor with the X-men and the scene of the Bruce Banner minded Hulk holding up that entire mountain range.
I truly love the Toy Promotion that is Secret Wars. I liked the series when it came out and still do.
Secret wars was the first set of comics i sought to put together when i started collecting several years ago and i was so fullfilled when i got it together and ws able to read all the issues back to back, definitely a little dense but a really fun read.
I love Secret Wars. Didn't realize people hated it.
As a kid, I read through all the Spider-Man comics and that was my intro to Marvel. As such, though I knew most of the heroes were, this my first introduction to many of the villains. Enchantress, Klaw, Molecule Man, Absorbing Man, Titania, Ultron -- this was the first time I heard of all of them! Though I knew about Galactus, I think it was my first exposure to him in action as well. So yeah, this book will always hold a nostalgic place for me.