i still can't shake the feeling that this is a Man being persecuted by a Woman who couldn't let him be, it sounds odd, but it does happen. Never should a person be found guilty on such flimsy evidence. Re trial, but with some sense please!
@@ClickClack_Bam I’m sorry this happened to you. In Kit Martin’s case, the military paid Joan Harmon to falsely accuse Kit. It has a program funded by the US senate to financially reward accusers regardless of the evidence.
@@ClickClack_Bam Martin was active with a group supporting falsely accused military members. There was and is monumental political pressure to prosecute/court martial male spouses. Rank promotions depend on producing underlings for sacrifice. The prosecutors knew Joan Harmon is crazy but waited until the 11th hour to withdraw charges that would require her testimony to convict. By then, Martin had taken a plea deal that would allow him to be released and go to work, which he badly needed to do.
@@ClickClack_Bam There is info about the support group on the Kit Martin support FB group. Dr. Grande could not be bothered to look into the possibility of a politically motivated prosecution.
It recently came out that Kit Martin had hidden 2 guns (a 22 and a 45, the same two calibers that were believed to have been used in a murder) and a suppressor in a secret compartment he built beneath his stairwell at his house in North Carolina. If he's innocent, then that would be the most unfortunate coincidence in history.
@sarah this guy is not innocent. Watch dateline. He seemed to have an excuse for everything. And don’t forget he was spotted in the bushes preparing for these “activities.”
The so-called dog tag was not even authenticated. It had his first name as "Kit" which is his nickname. Also, the was a string through the dog tag for handing it around the wearer's neck. No solider would ever hang his dog tag on a string.
That’s what I can’t figure out. This was an Army Ranger. I certainly hope they aren’t this stupid. Chris had ample time to enter the residence and find missing shell casing and dog tag. I think the “fact” he left evidence proves his innocence.
@@kevinhornbuckle yeah sounds more like a loved one would have it if on a string singularly or it was prepared by someone not in the military. And I wasn’t a Major or a Ranger, but nobody has “nicknames” on the ID tags that they wear. That fact alone has me skeptical now. Sounds more like her trinket or memento, or it was made for the occasion
I saw this trial and no way he did this. Had the jury heard that Joan and her adult son were planning to plead the fifth, they wouldn’t have convicted him. There was SO much doubt in this case. The judge should have overturned the verdict. I feel bad for this man. Truly a miscarriage of justice.
Why didn't they put her in the stand to plead the fifth for individual questions? People are allowed to do all encompassing pleas? If I did something when I was 18, can I plead the fifth for the years of 1-20 just to ensure I covered everything?
@@miaknig3130 "Why didn't they put her in the stand to plead the fifth for individual questions?" What would be the point in that? "People are allowed to do all encompassing pleas?" Of course.
It always amazes me that secret documents actually have "SECRET!" written on them. This doesn't seem much of a deterrent - like someone if going to read "SECRET!" and think to themselves, "Wow, that's marked SECRET! - I'd better not read that!". Surely something like, "The Poetry of Kanye West", or similar, would prove a stronger deterrent.
Thank You for covering this case, Dr Grande. I’m of the “not guilty” camp. There’s just too much about the case that doesn’t add up. I appreciate your balanced review as always! Thank You !!
Dr. G! You did the case I wanted 🥺... I was so torn when Mr. Kit Martin was convicted; Joan is such a whack-a-doodle and a liar, which for me, comes with so much reasonable doubt. Your input is appreciated. Love you Dr. Grande and love your channel, thanks for your analysis 🥰💙🥂.
Oh holy shit I remember seeing his interview in 2016, thank you for the update on this! I definitely think he needs a retrial, I don’t really think he did it
There are so many issues with this case that definitely put many doubts into the verdict. I have so many questions. 1. Dateline also talked about the dog tag and that is it did not have his legal name written on it (Martin, Christian), instead it said Christian, Kit. It also was on a white string instead of the typical chain that dog tags come with. 2. To me it's strange that Joan had Calvin help her retrieve stuff from the house when finding the classified items ( too convenient? Did she want him specifically finding those with her?). 3. Is it typical for something to be labeled "secret" vs "confidential"? 4. Are there more pictures of the beaten step-son, other than his back? What about his face? 5. Wouldn't we think that Joan would want to testify, because it seems that her testimony would only strengthen the prosecution if Martin was such a monster? 6. The eyewitness that identified Martin near the burned car--why did it take 4 years for him to come out with that very important information? 7. Martin being an army ranger, why was he so sloppy with the crime scene? 8. What about Pam's cell phone being in Joan's possession...I don't know--definitely difficult to say that he did it beyond reasonable doubt... Then again, what would be a credible alternative to this? Who was strong enough to do all that, other than a man, especially buff man capable to lift and move a body? Will we ever know?
*Dr. Grande....* How is the progress going on your upcoming Bill Cosby video🤔? I think it's safe to say we would all be very interested in your analysis and breakdown of the facts of the case. *EXCELSIOR !!!™*
You absolutely nailed all of the facts of this case! I watched this one from start to finish and was not even thinking the jury would find Martin guilty… I was beside myself when the jury came back after nine hours saying he was guilty beyond a reasonable doubt. BS… I pray this man gets the justice he so deserves. I also pray the murderers of these three people are apprehended.
This man may very well spend the rest of his life behind bars. He had exterior cameras showing he didn't leave and he was with his family during the time of the murders, all testified they were with him. It is insane.
I followed this case for as long as I can remember and honestly the worst verdict I expected was a hung jury. I was beyond surprised when I heard guilty.
I'd never heard of this case before but by your own account I'm surprised you think he was probably guilty. There doesn't seem much evidence for that at all. People in the military are trained to keep their dog tags on all the time -- they wouldn't casually take them off just to clean something/somewhere. Furthermore, assuming he wasn't happy about being discharged, he likely would have stopped wearing them permanently by then.
They don't wear them when they aren't on duty. At least no one I knew did, based on my time in service in the 70s. They are part of your uniform, so unless you are in uniform, they aren't necessary.
@@aaronchapin9331 Well, if you wore your dog tags all the time, and you committed a murder, would you take them off, leaving them at the scene of the crime while you rearranged the crime scene, to be found, not by crime scene investigators, but by relatives of the victims? I wouldn't.
@@evelynwaugh4053 Um, wot? ...I never suggested as much. You asserted that soldiers don't wear them unless on duty. I'm simply testifying that you're wrong on that particular point.
I forgot to add this to my comment. Dr Grande would you please look at the case of Summer Wells the missing five yo from Tennessee. Her parents behavior is so odd. I know how you feel about lie detectors, I feel the same but the father of the missing baby seems to have some very major lying disorder. There is a lot to this story but I would love to hear your insight.
Yes! I too would love to hear a light analysis on the parent’s behavior as well but I strongly believe I am seeing the mom in almost a constant state of disassociation and the dad in a state of holding himself together to keep from losing it in order to try to focus on his daughter and to counter the disproportionate numbers of child predators in the immediate area, including a neighbor proximate to their property and a guy who was trying to kidnap a 12 year old boy just up the way. Tonie M Hammonds. Maroon car. Had another male with him who was released while he was jailed.
This would be a GOOD thing as we know the good Doc will not insert unnecessary info. For example, on one station it was said that Don used the "C" word relative to his daughter...just one of many spurious comments made. In addition, there are 2 different channels who appear to be "making" their channel, based off of this case...its a little more than disgusting.
@@wmdkitty yes he does. He even admitted to former detective Chris McDonough on The Interview Room that he had a “relationship” with his 5 yo step sister when he was 12. This was confirmed by the victim and 3 family members. He went to a juvenile facility when he was around 16 and when he came out of prison at 19 it started again. The victim was 12.
Hi Dr. Grande. I subscribed to you back when everyone was attacking Chris from the channel “ The Rewired Soul” and you were one of the very few people that didn’t jump on the bandwagon of hate and I really admired you for that. I wasn’t even a huge fan of his but I really appreciated the way you handled it. Anyway, I’m glad I found you then because I’ve been watching your channel ever since. Just wanted to say thanks!
Dr. Grande's analysis is extraordinarily careless and sloppy here. He takes the easy path to guilt against Martin, apparently because he did not care to put the time into reviewing the evidence. For example, Dr. Grande characterizes the Martin-Harmon relationship as "destructive." The facts are, however, that Harmon's three children all benefitted from the father role that Martin played with children who were not his. Harmon had told her son that his father was killed when he was very young. Martin believed her too. When the young man found out that his father was alive, he clearly had a strong emotional reaction to his mother having lied to him for such a long time about such an important matter. The two girls thought Christian Martin was their father. How could any rational psychologist or layperson sweep these facts under the "destructive" carpet? Dr. Grande simply repeats that Martin had motive to kill Cal Phillips. He provides no support for this argument. Cal Phillips found out from investigators that Joan Harmon had been lying to him and using him as tool of false prosecution in the court martial. He stormed into a cafe where Joan was then working and confronted her, calling her a bitch. A witness saw and heard this occur. Martin was looking forward to Cal Phillips testifying because Phillips had finally realized that Harmon had used him to plant the fake "evidence" of the military secrets. Joan Harmon had a far stronger motive to see Cal Phillips dead than did Martin. In several interviews, Martin said he didn't care for his former neighbor but held no animosity toward him. He even opined that Cal Phillips was doing him a favor by taking Joan Harmon off his hands. The affair between the two started well before Martin and Harmon split up.
Exactly and there is a lot of evidence the court/jury never got to hear. Things that prove Kit did not commit these murders. This was a travesty of justice and I hope and pray Kit is released and sues for being wrongly convicted. Kit is and has always been a kind, caring person, who goes out of his way to help people. Joan is a psychopath, who will use and kill you to get what she wants.
Harmon should stand trial too however she may have done a deal with prosecutors to avoid that. The military are far worse than the police at trying to resolve cases.
Question: Why nobody believes Martin's aliby confirmed by girlfriend who is a teacher or professor in nursing? & her kids? That girlfriend seems to be very credible.
As a criminal investigator, I'd have to see it's beyond ridiculous that he was convicted on the evidence presented. The whole thing is the definition of reasonable doubt. A dog tag? That's what an 8 year old would think to plant. And not collected by an officer... Why was it even admissable?
I watched entire trial. I did not think he was guilty. He decided to testify in his own behalf and he did not come across as likeable. Just my opinion.
After your podcast on Jodi Arias, which was simply amazing, you presented yet another fascinating case. Your message at the end of this video was very thoughtful. Even when people have the best of the intentions is always better to stay away from acrimonious relationships. Thank you for your wonderful podcast and video, you made my day off exceedingly enjoyable.❤️
Agreed! My ex deliberately tried to pull as many people as possible into our unbelievably acrimonious split. The only result was to sow dissent where none needed to be. I'm still patching up some relationships that, in retrospect, never needed to have been damaged in the first place. Since then, I've made a point of offering support to friends involved in acrimonious breakups, but not getting involved in any potentially legal ways.
Funny how he doesn't have any instances of violence before or after his relationship with JoAnn. She sounds like a Lori Daybell/Vallow/Ryan to me. No possible fucking way would he leave his dogtag there if he was guilty. That was so obviously planted. I was absolutely stunned by the jury decision on this one.
Interesting as always Dr Todd. 🧐 How would you diagnose someone who likes to wear t-shirts with lizard humanoids, and loves cactus? It's all green to me. 💚 🌵🦎🥴🦎🌵
Very good, unemotional, and unbiased assessment of this situation. Good research as well, because there were some facts I was not aware of. Legally, I agree, there was more than enough reasonable doubt to warrant an acquittal. Do I think he did it? Honestly, I don't know. I lean towards no, and theorize Joan did this with some help.
I don’t know about you but when I am engaging in super duper spy work, I label ALL of my discs, TOP SECRET, in case anyone just happens upon them. I also leave my dog tags in a crime scene because I want to make sure I leave something significant to ID me in a tripe murder. 🤗👌🏽
I think this guy was set up. The prosecution and judge wouldn’t allow the ex wife and son to be subpoenaed. Plus they had the dead guys phone month or so later, trying to unlock it. Plus finding a shell months later, so obvious a set up. Guys innocent.
My story isn’t nearly as egregious (no murder or anything even close to serious) but my ex wife did tell me, after she cheated and I found out, that she would make sure I lost my job. She followed through and it worked. The only point I’m making is that women can do this, it’s not even very uncommon. We need to re-educate and re-strengthen our societies belief in the concept of due process and the burden of proof. Our society is woefully lacking in healthy skepticism and independent thinking. Just because a lawyer, an expert witness or a government official says something does not mean it is true.
This seems to be a pretty cut and dry case. No Ranger's name is abbreviated on their tag, no ranger would leave his tag, no ranger's tag would be on a string. That is very dumb. Dumb enough that a dumb person would think it were clever. Framejob horribly executed. Allowed to continue through corrupt prosecutors.
Joan Harmon is a serious criminal who was given passes by several governmental agencies. She was not required to pay back the spousal benefits which she stole from the US government. She succeeded in getting the state of Oregon to pay her for psychologically abusing her children.
The first thing that jumped out to me was the dog tags. Who would be so stupid to bring your own dog tags to the scene of the crime and leave it on a shelf? I’m wondering was the fake dog tag dusted for prints? Also his name was printed wrong on the dog tag and you don’t put a fog tag on a flimsy rope/string! S dog tag could have been easily printed at a hardware store or Walmart. I feel bad fir the victim’s family but this trial was a sham! I pray this man gets another trial. I truly believe this is the WRONG verdict!
I am a veteran. Dog tags are issued on a chain with a clasp that is not easy to open. When they investigated the crime scenes they didn't locate the dog tag or the shell casing. A relative of the victims found these items months afterwards. This is also a chain of custody issue. And the shell casing as not of the same brand of ammo that the defendant says he purchased. The defendant also needed one of the victims to testify for the defense in his court martial. The 1 piece of physical evidence that the prosecution used against the defendant was some hairs. However, they did not tell the jury in the trial that the defendant was excluded as leaving these hairs at the scene based on the fact the mitochondria DNA was not a match. I could go further, but the information is available in the public domain. You always hope its an open and shut case and that they have brought the guilty person to justice. But I see reasons that should have raised reasonable doubts with that Jury. His x-wife and her son pleaded the 5th, and not in the court room under questioning. They should have been subpoena'd, questioned and then plead the 5th or offered immunity for their. Testimony under oath. His x-wife committed some of the worst deception towards Kit, bigamy being one of them. She also threatened to ruin his life. I pray that Kit is given a new trial post haste. There is reasonable doubt!!!
I'm in the "not guilty" camp. HOWEVER, it's been brought up that if there were any pathway to Joan, there was enough time to find it. Now, if investigators are hoping the real killers will get careless post conviction, there is also the possibility of them getting tipped to the possible holes they need to plug in their story. Still, a LOT of effort for one person to go through with the car and the cellar door at the house and the "discovery" of evidence well after the fact.
Joan's boyfriends brother is a law enforcement officer . He also is Facebook friends with the prosecutor in this case . There's a Facebook group that's loaded with information .
@@1965JLO On the surface of this guy's description, brother of the boyfriend of a person (track record redacted here) with an elevated connection to the case is buddies with the prosecutors? Nope, no conflict there. Facebook group? I'll pass.
I'm glad you covered this, I agree with your assessment. I heard about the trial on another channel, the doubt is so strong that I can't see a conviction as there is clearly reasonable doubt. Thanks for sharing!
You point out that Harmon couldn't have physically done it. True, but it seems believable to me that her boyfriend or some other person close to her could have done it. I think it was a mistake for Martin to take the stand in his defense. He came across as very bitter and superior. However, I think it is more likely that he is innocent though I wouldn't feel confident about it. I don't find a motive for him compelling and I think he would be more motivated by staying out of trouble to not do such a thing.
Thank you so much!! I appreciate you’re analyzing this case. It has me baffled. I usually have a strong opinion about each case I follow but there is so much mystery here. Thanks again. It’s the first time I’ve heard the whole story in chronological order.
If she was low enough to marry a man knowing she's already married that tells me what she's willing to do to destroy a innocent man! Like he would be stupid enough to leave his dog tags behind!
What is with this dog tag evidence? Are you sure that they didn’t also find his birth ‘Certificate on the table with a sign saying “ don’t forget me over here” ?
Mm, really seems like she did it. I was surprised by your conclusion, I think she has more motive and the right character. Especially with her history of lying, her desire to make him suffer, and the fact that man's testimony went both ways. I bet if the genders were reversed and everything else was equal, someone with her history and motive and behaviour and all those coincidences would have been thoroughly investigated.
just came across you're channel yesterday and been bingeing your videos all day while working interesting stuff could you do a video on Jon Venables at some point would be interesting to see your annalists keep up the good work regardless!
I always find it alarming when someone who should know better implies that the wish to avoid self-incrimination implies guilt (as in, "watta they got to hide??!!). Anyone forced to deal with a legal system which is easily capable of convicting just about anybody of just about anything would be wise to exercise some heavy-duty caution. The Fifth is a real right, not a thinly disguised "guilty" plea.
They weren't on trial though. It is a lot less common for a witness to go that route. Besides it is the totality of the situation, such as her having victims phone and a dozen other questionable factors. She has a history of false allegations. I could go on and on.
Yeah the black guy that testified and said he seen him drop the car off in the field. Either he seen it happen and it was someone else or he was manipulated into saying it was the defendant to help obtain a conviction.
I just watched this story on Dateline and I'm on team Kit. This woman totally framed him. Why would he kill these people and somehow leave his dog tag on the book shelf? That right there is reasonable doubt. Kit's security camera puts him at home at time of murder, Joan had the cell phone. More reasons for doubt. I feel so sad for this man. This woman is a danger to men who comes into her life. I feel bad for the next guy.
Joan did it. She sounds like a severe narcissist, maybe even leaning towards psychopathy. Other than that, I'm completely in agreement with the good Dr., especially "the phantom chicken farmer".
Perhaps someone will agree with me, I think it would help if you added a visual of each person somehow at least once so I can better understand who you're talking about. sometimes I can't keep up with who's who because i'm stupid.
Funny cause as soon as I learned that they had found his dog tag at the house, I thought, well, he didn’t do it. According to Martin, it wasn’t even a real dog tag. The name was all wrong. It was clear that those items were planted. He could’ve murdered them and someone else planted those things to get him charged faster; or someone else committed the murders and set him up. I’m leaning towards the latter. I can’t believe the jury convicted him on so little evidence.
The tons of cuts in your videos are distracting - like every other sentence. Whatever you're cutting out, you probably don't have to. You're fine in one take on your podcast vids! Don't be so hard on yourself!
It looks a lot like his ex orchestrated this and not him. Why use 2 different weapons? How did they miss the shell casing on the first search? A lot of fishy things about this case.
I appreciate your analysis and the facts are correct from what I have read and heard. I am disappointed in your respond that Harmon could not have done this due to her strength verses Martin. One thing you could explore is the emotional state of mind of Harmon and the capacity of someone with her history is capable of doing?
Either he did it and tried to get away with it by blaming his ex-wife by placing obvious evidence around (dog tags and casing) OR the wife and son did it together and framed him
I watched the whole trial. I came to same conclusion - definitely wasn't guilty beyond a reasonable doubt. But may have actually been guilty. I'm still not 100% convinced though.
I think he’s innocent. Some of that flimsy evidence was found months after the police looked in the house, and it was found by people who wanted him to go to jail. The woman he was married to really wanted to ruin him.
Not clear to me why Joan left Christian in the first place. Was it because she failed to tell him she was previously married and her marriage with Christian was not valid??
No way he did it. His "wife" is clearly narcissistic, if I've learned anything from this channel.
i still can't shake the feeling that this is a Man being persecuted by a Woman who couldn't let him be, it sounds odd, but it does happen. Never should a person be found guilty on such flimsy evidence. Re trial, but with some sense please!
Joan Harmon is a malignant narcissist who is adept at pulling the wool over the eyes of police, multiple state agencies, and lazy youtube analysts.
@@ClickClack_Bam I’m sorry this happened to you. In Kit Martin’s case, the military paid Joan Harmon to falsely accuse Kit. It has a program funded by the US senate to financially reward accusers regardless of the evidence.
@@ClickClack_Bam Martin was active with a group supporting falsely accused military members. There was and is monumental political pressure to prosecute/court martial male spouses. Rank promotions depend on producing underlings for sacrifice. The prosecutors knew Joan Harmon is crazy but waited until the 11th hour to withdraw charges that would require her testimony to convict. By then, Martin had taken a plea deal that would allow him to be released and go to work, which he badly needed to do.
@@ClickClack_Bam There is info about the support group on the Kit Martin support FB group. Dr. Grande could not be bothered to look into the possibility of a politically motivated prosecution.
@@ClickClack_Bam They are all dangerous and not worthy of trust.
This case scares me to no end. The ability to convict someone of murder with ZERO reliable evidence is beyond imagination …
It recently came out that Kit Martin had hidden 2 guns (a 22 and a 45, the same two calibers that were believed to have been used in a murder) and a suppressor in a secret compartment he built beneath his stairwell at his house in North Carolina. If he's innocent, then that would be the most unfortunate coincidence in history.
@sarah this guy is not innocent. Watch dateline. He seemed to have an excuse for everything. And don’t forget he was spotted in the bushes preparing for these “activities.”
@@peonyflowers23
I never heard about the bushes. What ?! Was he in cammo with a gun or what ? Whose bushes ?
Come on, no soldier is going to leave a “dog tag” with their name on it
The so-called dog tag was not even authenticated. It had his first name as "Kit" which is his nickname. Also, the was a string through the dog tag for handing it around the wearer's neck. No solider would ever hang his dog tag on a string.
That’s what I can’t figure out. This was an Army Ranger. I certainly hope they aren’t this stupid. Chris had ample time to enter the residence and find missing shell casing and dog tag. I think the “fact” he left evidence proves his innocence.
@@kevinhornbuckle yeah sounds more like a loved one would have it if on a string singularly or it was prepared by someone not in the military. And I wasn’t a Major or a Ranger, but nobody has “nicknames” on the ID tags that they wear. That fact alone has me skeptical now. Sounds more like her trinket or memento, or it was made for the occasion
@@Jen39x You definitely don’t become a Ranger-tabbed Major by being sloppy 🤔
@@Jen39x They don't usually let an idiot fly a 35 million dollar Chopper. They tend to screen them out along the way.
I saw this trial and no way he did this. Had the jury heard that Joan and her adult son were planning to plead the fifth, they wouldn’t have convicted him. There was SO much doubt in this case. The judge should have overturned the verdict. I feel bad for this man. Truly a miscarriage of justice.
Agree with you. 100%.
They shouldn't have convicted him if they were paying attention at all. I don't know whether he did it, but there is nowhere near enough evidence.
Much like the right to remain silent, taking the 5th can't be used in criminal trials as evidence. It's a pretty worthless right otherwise.
Why didn't they put her in the stand to plead the fifth for individual questions? People are allowed to do all encompassing pleas? If I did something when I was 18, can I plead the fifth for the years of 1-20 just to ensure I covered everything?
@@miaknig3130 "Why didn't they put her in the stand to plead the fifth for individual questions?"
What would be the point in that?
"People are allowed to do all encompassing pleas?"
Of course.
I watched that full trial...reasonable doubt was "screaming"
It always amazes me that secret documents actually have "SECRET!" written on them. This doesn't seem much of a deterrent - like someone if going to read "SECRET!" and think to themselves, "Wow, that's marked SECRET! - I'd better not read that!". Surely something like, "The Poetry of Kanye West", or similar, would prove a stronger deterrent.
A better deterrent would be, Jazz Greats.
Secret documents at least need a cover page otherwise no one would know how to handle them. You're not supposed to leave them lying around obviously.
🤣🤣🤣
Or “the best of polka”
They said "confidential" and most likely had it written on them when they were taken
Thank You for covering this case, Dr Grande. I’m of the “not guilty” camp. There’s just too much about the case that doesn’t add up. I appreciate your balanced review as always! Thank You !!
I have to side with Martin on this one. He would have shot the polygamist wife first.
That's a good point. Why punish all these peripheral people and not the main one?
He at least would have taken her out as well. I just don't think he did it.
I watched the whole trial...I dont believe he's guilty at all. And most definitely not guilty by a reasonable doubt. Love you Dr. G!
Dr. G! You did the case I wanted 🥺... I was so torn when Mr. Kit Martin was convicted; Joan is such a whack-a-doodle and a liar, which for me, comes with so much reasonable doubt. Your input is appreciated. Love you Dr. Grande and love your channel, thanks for your analysis 🥰💙🥂.
Oh holy shit I remember seeing his interview in 2016, thank you for the update on this! I definitely think he needs a retrial, I don’t really think he did it
I don't know about anyone else !....but my head almost became detached trying to wrap my brain around this.
I even watched the video twice and still was confused as who was who.
Scary how easy it is to make accusations/set someone up & ruin a life. Thanks for another breakdown of a crazy case & good advice Dr G😊💚💚
There are so many issues with this case that definitely put many doubts into the verdict. I have so many questions. 1. Dateline also talked about the dog tag and that is it did not have his legal name written on it (Martin, Christian), instead it said Christian, Kit. It also was on a white string instead of the typical chain that dog tags come with. 2. To me it's strange that Joan had Calvin help her retrieve stuff from the house when finding the classified items ( too convenient? Did she want him specifically finding those with her?). 3. Is it typical for something to be labeled "secret" vs "confidential"? 4. Are there more pictures of the beaten step-son, other than his back? What about his face? 5. Wouldn't we think that Joan would want to testify, because it seems that her testimony would only strengthen the prosecution if Martin was such a monster? 6. The eyewitness that identified Martin near the burned car--why did it take 4 years for him to come out with that very important information? 7. Martin being an army ranger, why was he so sloppy with the crime scene? 8. What about Pam's cell phone being in Joan's possession...I don't know--definitely difficult to say that he did it beyond reasonable doubt...
Then again, what would be a credible alternative to this? Who was strong enough to do all that, other than a man, especially buff man capable to lift and move a body? Will we ever know?
*Dr. Grande....*
How is the progress going on your upcoming Bill Cosby video🤔? I think it's safe to say we would all be very interested in your analysis and breakdown of the facts of the case.
*EXCELSIOR !!!™*
You absolutely nailed all of the facts of this case! I watched this one from start to finish and was not even thinking the jury would find Martin guilty… I was beside myself when the jury came back after nine hours saying he was guilty beyond a reasonable doubt. BS… I pray this man gets the justice he so deserves. I also pray the murderers of these three people are apprehended.
I've listened to this 3x and I'm still confused.
Me too, you have to write notes,😀
This man may very well spend the rest of his life behind bars. He had exterior cameras showing he didn't leave and he was with his family during the time of the murders, all testified they were with him. It is insane.
I followed this case for as long as I can remember and honestly the worst verdict I expected was a hung jury.
I was beyond surprised when I heard guilty.
I'd never heard of this case before but by your own account I'm surprised you think he was probably guilty. There doesn't seem much evidence for that at all. People in the military are trained to keep their dog tags on all the time -- they wouldn't casually take them off just to clean something/somewhere. Furthermore, assuming he wasn't happy about being discharged, he likely would have stopped wearing them permanently by then.
They don't wear them when they aren't on duty. At least no one I knew did, based on my time in service in the 70s. They are part of your uniform, so unless you are in uniform, they aren't necessary.
@@evelynwaugh4053 Always wore mine. Still do, in fact. Never know when some emergency responder might need your blood type, or identify your body.
@@aaronchapin9331 Well, if you wore your dog tags all the time, and you committed a murder, would you take them off, leaving them at the scene of the crime while you rearranged the crime scene, to be found, not by crime scene investigators, but by relatives of the victims? I wouldn't.
@@evelynwaugh4053 Um, wot? ...I never suggested as much. You asserted that soldiers don't wear them unless on duty. I'm simply testifying that you're wrong on that particular point.
@@aaronchapin9331 I was in the regular Army from 74-77, in Germany. None of us did.
I forgot to add this to my comment. Dr Grande would you please look at the case of Summer Wells the missing five yo from Tennessee. Her parents behavior is so odd. I know how you feel about lie detectors, I feel the same but the father of the missing baby seems to have some very major lying disorder. There is a lot to this story but I would love to hear your insight.
Yes! I too would love to hear a light analysis on the parent’s behavior as well but I strongly believe I am seeing the mom in almost a constant state of disassociation and the dad in a state of holding himself together to keep from losing it in order to try to focus on his daughter and to counter the disproportionate numbers of child predators in the immediate area, including a neighbor proximate to their property and a guy who was trying to kidnap a 12 year old boy just up the way. Tonie M Hammonds.
Maroon car. Had another male with him who was released while he was jailed.
@@wmdkitty no.
This would be a GOOD thing as we know the good Doc will not insert unnecessary info. For example, on one station it was said that Don used the "C" word relative to his daughter...just one of many spurious comments made. In addition, there are 2 different channels who appear to be "making" their channel, based off of this case...its a little more than disgusting.
@@wmdkitty yes he does. He even admitted to former detective Chris McDonough on The Interview Room that he had a “relationship” with his 5 yo step sister when he was 12. This was confirmed by the victim and 3 family members. He went to a juvenile facility when he was around 16 and when he came out of prison at 19 it started again. The victim was 12.
Yes PLEASE do a video on this case! If we all ask perhaps Doc will💙 his analysis would be so helpful!
The whole thing stinks to high heaven! I'm intrigued by the EXCULPATORY evidence 🤔👀 Thanks, Dr. G as usual a great topic! 💜🌵
Hi Dr. Grande. I subscribed to you back when everyone was attacking Chris from the channel “ The Rewired Soul” and you were one of the very few people that didn’t jump on the bandwagon of hate and I really admired you for that. I wasn’t even a huge fan of his but I really appreciated the way you handled it. Anyway, I’m glad I found you then because I’ve been watching your channel ever since. Just wanted to say thanks!
As well as being very smart, Dr Grande is fair and kind.
Dr. Grande's analysis is extraordinarily careless and sloppy here. He takes the easy path to guilt against Martin, apparently because he did not care to put the time into reviewing the evidence. For example, Dr. Grande characterizes the Martin-Harmon relationship as "destructive." The facts are, however, that Harmon's three children all benefitted from the father role that Martin played with children who were not his. Harmon had told her son that his father was killed when he was very young. Martin believed her too. When the young man found out that his father was alive, he clearly had a strong emotional reaction to his mother having lied to him for such a long time about such an important matter. The two girls thought Christian Martin was their father. How could any rational psychologist or layperson sweep these facts under the "destructive" carpet?
Dr. Grande simply repeats that Martin had motive to kill Cal Phillips. He provides no support for this argument. Cal Phillips found out from investigators that Joan Harmon had been lying to him and using him as tool of false prosecution in the court martial. He stormed into a cafe where Joan was then working and confronted her, calling her a bitch. A witness saw and heard this occur. Martin was looking forward to Cal Phillips testifying because Phillips had finally realized that Harmon had used him to plant the fake "evidence" of the military secrets. Joan Harmon had a far stronger motive to see Cal Phillips dead than did Martin. In several interviews, Martin said he didn't care for his former neighbor but held no animosity toward him. He even opined that Cal Phillips was doing him a favor by taking Joan Harmon off his hands. The affair between the two started well before Martin and Harmon split up.
Exactly and there is a lot of evidence the court/jury never got to hear. Things that prove Kit did not commit these murders. This was a travesty of justice and I hope and pray Kit is released and sues for being wrongly convicted. Kit is and has always been a kind, caring person, who goes out of his way to help people. Joan is a psychopath, who will use and kill you to get what she wants.
Harmon should stand trial too however she may have done a deal with prosecutors to avoid that. The military are far worse than the police at trying to resolve cases.
I agree with others that there was so much reasonable doubt it would have been hard to convict in good conscious. His defense did a great job too.
Question: Why nobody believes Martin's aliby confirmed by girlfriend who is a teacher or professor in nursing? & her kids? That girlfriend seems to be very credible.
As a criminal investigator, I'd have to see it's beyond ridiculous that he was convicted on the evidence presented. The whole thing is the definition of reasonable doubt. A dog tag? That's what an 8 year old would think to plant. And not collected by an officer... Why was it even admissable?
Could you give your thoughts on criminal profiling and just how reliable it actually is?
The Christian Martin trial was ridiculous. He was so obviously not guilty.
The verdict is reprehensible. It’s a major blow to justice and human decency.
I watched entire trial. I did not think he was guilty. He decided to testify in his own behalf and he did not come across as likeable. Just my opinion.
After your podcast on Jodi Arias, which was simply amazing, you presented yet another fascinating case.
Your message at the end of this video was very thoughtful. Even when people have the best of the intentions is always better to stay away from acrimonious relationships.
Thank you for your wonderful podcast and video, you made my day off exceedingly enjoyable.❤️
Agreed! My ex deliberately tried to pull as many people as possible into our unbelievably acrimonious split. The only result was to sow dissent where none needed to be. I'm still patching up some relationships that, in retrospect, never needed to have been damaged in the first place.
Since then, I've made a point of offering support to friends involved in acrimonious breakups, but not getting involved in any potentially legal ways.
... reasonable doubt? Yeah, I think so.
Do the Bachelorette Katie Thurston talking about Gaslighting Greg Grippo
While she was displaying textbook gaslighting
You are 100% wrong. Kit was wrongly convicted and I cannot wait till justice truly prevails and he is set free.
Funny how he doesn't have any instances of violence before or after his relationship with JoAnn. She sounds like a Lori Daybell/Vallow/Ryan to me. No possible fucking way would he leave his dogtag there if he was guilty. That was so obviously planted. I was absolutely stunned by the jury decision on this one.
That chicken factory joke clean took me out
Interesting as always Dr Todd. 🧐 How would you diagnose someone who likes to wear t-shirts with lizard humanoids, and loves cactus? It's all green to me. 💚
🌵🦎🥴🦎🌵
Just a reminder I'm not diagnosing anybody in this video; only speculating that a triple murder is not a 'Threesome' as some pundits have suggested.
Cal Phillps extramarital conduct cost him his life and cost his son his mother. It's no joking matter.
@@kevinhornbuckle Just a reminder I'm not condoning extramarital conduct that leads to murder, only speculating on conduct like this.
Joan and son did it. Joan placed all items in home. Joan is bad news.
“Or Atkins had a detachable head”. Lmfao!!
Crazy case! 🤯 glad you reviewed it 👍🏼💕💖💕
Dear Dr. Grande, so love it when you make me LOL, "or he had a detachable head”
Very good, unemotional, and unbiased assessment of this situation. Good research as well, because there were some facts I was not aware of. Legally, I agree, there was more than enough reasonable doubt to warrant an acquittal. Do I think he did it? Honestly, I don't know. I lean towards no, and theorize Joan did this with some help.
I don’t know about you but when I am engaging in super duper spy work, I label ALL of my discs, TOP SECRET, in case anyone just happens upon them.
I also leave my dog tags in a crime scene because I want to make sure I leave something significant to ID me in a tripe murder.
🤗👌🏽
I think this guy was set up. The prosecution and judge wouldn’t allow the ex wife and son to be subpoenaed. Plus they had the dead guys phone month or so later, trying to unlock it. Plus finding a shell months later, so obvious a set up. Guys innocent.
My story isn’t nearly as egregious (no murder or anything even close to serious) but my ex wife did tell me, after she cheated and I found out, that she would make sure I lost my job. She followed through and it worked. The only point I’m making is that women can do this, it’s not even very uncommon. We need to re-educate and re-strengthen our societies belief in the concept of due process and the burden of proof. Our society is woefully lacking in healthy skepticism and independent thinking. Just because a lawyer, an expert witness or a government official says something does not mean it is true.
This seems to be a pretty cut and dry case. No Ranger's name is abbreviated on their tag, no ranger would leave his tag, no ranger's tag would be on a string. That is very dumb. Dumb enough that a dumb person would think it were clever. Framejob horribly executed. Allowed to continue through corrupt prosecutors.
Dr. Grande, I wanted to hear you speculate about the activities involved in a bigamy diversion program.
Joan Harmon is a serious criminal who was given passes by several governmental agencies. She was not required to pay back the spousal benefits which she stole from the US government. She succeeded in getting the state of Oregon to pay her for psychologically abusing her children.
@@kevinhornbuckle I just thought the concept of a bigamy diversion program was funny, that's all. I have no doubt she's a lousy human.
@@internetperson9121 Joan Harmon is far worse than a lousy person.
The first thing that jumped out to me was the dog tags. Who would be so stupid to bring your own dog tags to the scene of the crime and leave it on a shelf? I’m wondering was the fake dog tag dusted for prints? Also his name was printed wrong on the dog tag and you don’t put a fog tag on a flimsy rope/string! S dog tag could have been easily printed at a hardware store or Walmart. I feel bad fir the victim’s family but this trial was a sham! I pray this man gets another trial. I truly believe this is the WRONG verdict!
I am a veteran. Dog tags are issued on a chain with a clasp that is not easy to open. When they investigated the crime scenes they didn't locate the dog tag or the shell casing. A relative of the victims found these items months afterwards. This is also a chain of custody issue. And the shell casing as not of the same brand of ammo that the defendant says he purchased. The defendant also needed one of the victims to testify for the defense in his court martial. The 1 piece of physical evidence that the prosecution used against the defendant was some hairs. However, they did not tell the jury in the trial that the defendant was excluded as leaving these hairs at the scene based on the fact the mitochondria DNA was not a match. I could go further, but the information is available in the public domain. You always hope its an open and shut case and that they have brought the guilty person to justice. But I see reasons that should have raised reasonable doubts with that Jury. His x-wife and her son pleaded the 5th, and not in the court room under questioning. They should have been subpoena'd, questioned and then plead the 5th or offered immunity for their. Testimony under oath. His x-wife committed some of the worst deception towards Kit, bigamy being one of them. She also threatened to ruin his life. I pray that Kit is given a new trial post haste. There is reasonable doubt!!!
I'm in the "not guilty" camp. HOWEVER, it's been brought up that if there were any pathway to Joan, there was enough time to find it.
Now, if investigators are hoping the real killers will get careless post conviction, there is also the possibility of them getting tipped to the possible holes they need to plug in their story. Still, a LOT of effort for one person to go through with the car and the cellar door at the house and the "discovery" of evidence well after the fact.
Joan's boyfriends brother is a law enforcement officer . He also is Facebook friends with the prosecutor in this case . There's a Facebook group that's loaded with information .
@@1965JLO On the surface of this guy's description, brother of the boyfriend of a person (track record redacted here) with an elevated connection to the case is buddies with the prosecutors? Nope, no conflict there.
Facebook group? I'll pass.
Thing is, I just don't know that they really looked at Joan hard enough.
Unless she’s covered for 🤷🏻♀️
Is it hard to believe that someone helped Joan. And what about Joan going to the phone store with the phone of the dead guy.
If this isn’t reasonable doubt…what is?
If I had to bet my life savings on who did it:
75% Joan his ex
15% Kit
10% unknown
I'm glad you covered this, I agree with your assessment. I heard about the trial on another channel, the doubt is so strong that I can't see a conviction as there is clearly reasonable doubt. Thanks for sharing!
You point out that Harmon couldn't have physically done it. True, but it seems believable to me that her boyfriend or some other person close to her could have done it.
I think it was a mistake for Martin to take the stand in his defense. He came across as very bitter and superior. However, I think it is more likely that he is innocent though I wouldn't feel confident about it. I don't find a motive for him compelling and I think he would be more motivated by staying out of trouble to not do such a thing.
He just applied for a new trial. Whether it will be successful or not is another thing only 1% is usually successful. They won’t know for months.
Judge Joe Crater's disappearance would be a great analysis..
Ooooh, yes!! My mom was obsessed with that when I was a kid! Also the Leopold & Loeb case! I'd love to see the Doc cover those!!
Thank you so much!! I appreciate you’re analyzing this case. It has me baffled. I usually have a strong opinion about each case I follow but there is so much mystery here. Thanks again. It’s the first time I’ve heard the whole story in chronological order.
If she was low enough to marry a man knowing she's already married that tells me what she's willing to do to destroy a innocent man! Like he would be stupid enough to leave his dog tags behind!
What is with this dog tag evidence? Are you sure that they didn’t also find his birth ‘Certificate on the table with a sign saying “ don’t forget me over here” ?
Mm, really seems like she did it. I was surprised by your conclusion, I think she has more motive and the right character. Especially with her history of lying, her desire to make him suffer, and the fact that man's testimony went both ways. I bet if the genders were reversed and everything else was equal, someone with her history and motive and behaviour and all those coincidences would have been thoroughly investigated.
just came across you're channel yesterday and been bingeing your videos all day while working interesting stuff could you do a video on Jon Venables at some point would be interesting to see your annalists keep up the good work regardless!
I think Joan and either her new bf or her son did it.
But yes, the people trying to “help” Joan certainly were doomed 😢
Just watched the dateline episode. He didnt do it. Dont know if Joan did. Certainly is suspect that she wont say anything but Kit is innocent.
I always find it alarming when someone who should know better implies that the wish to avoid self-incrimination implies guilt (as in, "watta they got to hide??!!). Anyone forced to deal with a legal system which is easily capable of convicting just about anybody of just about anything would be wise to exercise some heavy-duty caution. The Fifth is a real right, not a thinly disguised "guilty" plea.
Thank you
They weren't on trial though. It is a lot less common for a witness to go that route. Besides it is the totality of the situation, such as her having victims phone and a dozen other questionable factors. She has a history of false allegations. I could go on and on.
Yeah the black guy that testified and said he seen him drop the car off in the field.
Either he seen it happen and it was someone else or he was manipulated into saying it was the defendant to help obtain a conviction.
I don't like him, but do believe he is more likely innocent of this crime and the court system failed and protected the criminal over a victim.
Not guilty.
Why couldn’t J Harmon get help from her son?
Sounds like Martin got railroaded.
I just watched this story on Dateline and I'm on team Kit. This woman totally framed him. Why would he kill these people and somehow leave his dog tag on the book shelf? That right there is reasonable doubt. Kit's security camera puts him at home at time of murder, Joan had the cell phone. More reasons for doubt. I feel so sad for this man. This woman is a danger to men who comes into her life. I feel bad for the next guy.
I think he was set up. Joan couldn't do it herself, she had help....
Dr. Grande got jokes subtle jokes in all his videos, and I love it!
Evidence seems too convenient for not taking another look at all the other “ players”. No prints on the tags? I think the tags or tag was planted.
The chicken farm phantom!!!🤣🤣🤣. I just can’t! 🤣🤣🤣
If you don't want someone snooping into your disks, just write Modern Jazz on it.
This was a travesty. Thank you for covering this.
As a former fork lift truck driver, I terrorized plenty of fowl in my day. 😉
Harmon is dangerous. Praying for all involved. Our justice system scares me more and more.
Joan did it. She sounds like a severe narcissist, maybe even leaning towards psychopathy. Other than that, I'm completely in agreement with the good Dr., especially "the phantom chicken farmer".
As a reminder, Inda,oswcbhiaclt
Great video. I was wondering if you could do an analysis of Michael Ryan and the Hungerford Massacre?
Can you do the Chad Isaak quadruple murder?
Perhaps someone will agree with me, I think it would help if you added a visual of each person somehow at least once so I can better understand who you're talking about. sometimes I can't keep up with who's who because i'm stupid.
Funny cause as soon as I learned that they had found his dog tag at the house, I thought, well, he didn’t do it. According to Martin, it wasn’t even a real dog tag. The name was all wrong. It was clear that those items were planted. He could’ve murdered them and someone else planted those things to get him charged faster; or someone else committed the murders and set him up. I’m leaning towards the latter. I can’t believe the jury convicted him on so little evidence.
90 days in jail for abusing a minor and mishandling classified information? People get significantly more time just for being AWOL.
The tons of cuts in your videos are distracting - like every other sentence. Whatever you're cutting out, you probably don't have to. You're fine in one take on your podcast vids! Don't be so hard on yourself!
It looks a lot like his ex orchestrated this and not him. Why use 2 different weapons? How did they miss the shell casing on the first search? A lot of fishy things about this case.
I appreciate your analysis and the facts are correct from what I have read and heard. I am disappointed in your respond that Harmon could not have done this due to her strength verses Martin.
One thing you could explore is the emotional state of mind of Harmon and the capacity of someone with her history is capable of doing?
Either he did it and tried to get away with it by blaming his ex-wife by placing obvious evidence around (dog tags and casing) OR the wife and son did it together and framed him
I watched the whole trial. I came to same conclusion - definitely wasn't guilty beyond a reasonable doubt. But may have actually been guilty. I'm still not 100% convinced though.
I think he’s innocent. Some of that flimsy evidence was found months after the police looked in the house, and it was found by people who wanted him to go to jail. The woman he was married to really wanted to ruin him.
Would love you to make a video on South Dakota A.G. Jason Ravnsborg. How does he get off for this???
Not clear to me why Joan left Christian in the first place. Was it because she failed to tell him she was previously married and her marriage with Christian was not valid??
Christian Martin did not commit these murders! Anybody who actually watched this trial would see this is impossible.
That was insane! Great video as always, Dr. Grande.
Joan’s son is weird. He definitely helped her. Sorry I’ve never said this but Kit is not guilty.
Dear Dr. Grande, your thoughts on the case of Paris Bennett would be really interesting!
And his mother!
Dr. Grande, what are your thoughts on Mel Robbins and Impact Theory?
Request: Joseph Hall. The child who murdered his father, who was a Nazi.