Wind Proof a Vinyl Fence
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 7 ก.ย. 2024
- Bob visits a Levittown, Pennsylvania home where the woman's vinyl fence keeps blowing over, and not only over, but all over the neighborhood because the rails pull out, the fence topples over and the slats go sailing through the air.
After careful inspection Bob realized that whoever installed the fence did so without securing the rails to the posts, but worse yet, they attached the fence with concrete anchors to the top of an EP Henry wall; an EP Henry wall is not mortared together, but instead, the blocks are just stacked. Everytime the wind blows, the fence flips over and the block wall is pulled apart.
This very nice woman hired me to figure out a way to fix her problem and while I had to think outside the box, my job was to wind proof a vinyl fence, and I did just that.
Check out the video and leave a comment if you have anything to wish to add or say; I answer all comments.
Have a great day,
Be safe,
Bob
Great video. In particular, loved the view from the top of the post showing how the top rails sit and you showed how to secure them with screws to prevent them from sliding out. That was very helpful. Easy fix. Thank you.
Glad it was helpful and that you were able to take care of your fence without paying lots of money to someone like me, lol
Excellent video. I’m a female and I did the reinforcement myself exactly the way you did it. Thank you
Not sure why people giving you thumbs down, it’s a solution that worked. I will take knowledge from your video.👍🏻
The world is full of naysayers. Cut your own path and enjoy the scenery along the way. Thanks for your comment.
Cheers,
Bob
As soon as I saw the small dolly carrying one bag of concrete, I shut the video off 😂
Just found your video. Dealing with this exact problem of the rails not being secured with screws when originally installed. Thank you for sharing this easy fix! 👍🏻
UPDATE: We got hit with a hurricane and the fence is still standing strong despite large diameter trees falling all over the place. :)
Which Hurricane. Sally took out our wooden fence.
@@robertgiese4913 Bertha I believe
@T-800 Model 101 Infiltrator Unit. ha ha ha
@T-800 Model 101 Infiltrator Unit. That's hysterical.... I hearted your comment because it made me laugh! Cheers pal!
8/26/2021 - Several storms, lots of wind and the fence is still problem free.
A lot of our neighbors including us have that exact same fence. Our installers did forget to pin the top rail in one section and the fence literally fell apart. I reassembled it in a couple minutes and called the installer. He showed up, apologized and installed one screw in the top rail under a cap to secure it. Zero problems since. Some of our posts are filled with concrete to prevent high winds from moving our entire fence. It looks like that installer didn't fill any of the posts. You could see the entire length of fence moving around 9:34 in the video. Good job securing the fence that was "floating" on blocks.
a fence installer should not forget, its very important to avoid call backs.
@@BobsHomeServicesLLC Does is hurt to pour quickrete down the posts as opposed to around the post bottom like a collar? Which is optimal or both?
Nice! Just had my fence blowout from wind and the screws in the top rails look like the perfect solution!
Sorry your fence blew out but glad I was part of your solution
Thanks, Bob! I live in Iowa and have the same problem with my vinyl fence blowing out due to the top rails not being secured. Everywhere I've ever lived, they set 4X4 fence posts in quick crete. But here in the midwest, they use 2" galvanized pipe and just drive it into the dirt with no added support. As a result, the posts just flop around in the wind. I've already had to dig around several and pour in the expanding foam solution, which certainly helps, but still is not that solid. Next time I will use quick crete. I'm absolutely miffed at how this type of post installation can meet code here in the midwest. But, then again, homes here are not built to the same standards of quality as they are in the south. you get what you get i guess! Thanks, again!
I'm looking to make some pressure treated plywood squares to fit in the pole and rest on top of the rails. This should allow a good way to secure the rails and keep them from sliding either way.
I am so glad I came across your video, I’ve been having trouble with my vinyl fence on pavers for a small built-in pool. Every time the wind blows the insides blow out to my neighbors yard. They agreed to come back and fix but seeing this I’ll know what they should do. Thank you thank you thank you.
I had to take my vinyl fence down so we could have a shed delivered. I tried and tried to take the top and bottom fence rails off the post! I then took off the top cap off and discovered the self tapping screws! I was shocked they were there but knew they would hold the fence together. This was back in 2017. Great video! 😎 👍 🙏
Guess whoever installed your fence knew what they were doing. Glad your install was done properly, thanks for commenting and have a great weekend; well, upcoming weekend as today's HUMP DAY, lol.
@@BobsHomeServicesLLC Thanks to you too. You made a great video. It was installed by Home Depot Services in Central Florida. The company who did the work was Superior Fence and Rail. They do really good work. We recently got another quote to do 110 feet more of additional vinyl fencing to expand our side yard into a backyard. I'd do the work but I have been working too much overtime and weekends to get it done. It's worth it to just have a great company come out and knock it out! That's fun too. 👍 God bless!
Jeff - Sunny Central Florida 😎 🌴 ☀️ 🍊
@@onecrazywheel Cheers!
The solution to the top portion being displaced from high winds is the fix I needed.
Decent solution. I think I would have used a Hilti TE80 and drilled a 3/4" or 1" hole down through several blocks in the retaining wall. Then epoxied in a piece of rebar just short of the top stone. Filled that last 1/2" from the top with grout to match the top stone. That way, no rebar would be showing on the outside.
Honestly, I do not think that would have worked in this case only because the wind on any given day would hit upwards of 35 mph or more, and that's without a storm, and those blocks were only sitting on top of a gravel bed much like the base material for pavers (before the sand) There is absolutely nothing holding them in place. Now, had I drilled through every single block and put the cement under them that however would have worked nicely and without a visible piece of rebar, but that is far more work and far more costly; the client was looking for a the lowest cost alternative.
That would not work since they are landscaping blocks, not solid. Nothing to drill into without blowing out the sides. It should have never been installed on a wall like that, unless however you're ok with the fence falling over. His solution is ok, but it should have never been installed like that in the first place. Need to be on solid ground or a poured wall that can be core drilled.
@@allcountyfenceryan5032, totally agree.
Fundamentally one part depends on another. And at the end to the unmovable solid ground.
The fence depends on the fence's post. And the post depends on those landscaping/ concrete blocks (which looks very fragile). Assumed to be shallow concrete footings. Then the concrete footings should be based on unmoving solid ground.
@@BobsHomeServicesLLC I agree. One bag per stick of rebar. Probably would withstand anything thrown at it. If not, then likely you'd have bigger problems as well.
Fence is also a missing vertical channel which is supposed to be mounted on the inside of each post where the slats are to fit in snugly.
Are you talking about the aluminum I-beam?
This was VERY helpful! Thank you!
I just would just slide some cement or 2 part epoxy between that top brick still blowing a bit for added measure.
Good job Bob, Cheers from the UK
Hey thanks pal. Hope you’re having a great day across the pond.
Thank sir for the great problem solving techniques. I will be building this identical fence for my parents. It would be fantastic if i only have to build it once. Thanks again.
Those tips should keep you from doing it twice.
Interesting use of the rebar you can drill down inside the block and put the rebar inside where the post sits and then add concrete inside the post like a Masonary type technique.
The blocks are only stacked and the rebar would need to go through all of them and then into a hole dug below them and filled with concrete.
This would have been a very costly endeavor.
This is making me change my mind on vinyl fence. Just seeing that entire fence line bow in and out is crazy. Maybe thats the engineering behind it and actually a good thing that flexibility but dang its hard for me to watch that and spend the extra cash over wood.
The vinyl fences are nice because Vinyl is Final; it don't rot, so with a wooden fence you have to keep it maintained and stain or paint it at least every two years.
Why didn't you put an L bend at the bottom of the rebar? Once the rebar corrodes and loosens in the concrete, it will lift up with the wind.
Thanks for sharing!
Your welcome
Excellent video!
Thank you.
Rebar each the post and fill half way with concrete.
Put wedge under rebar to prevent any movement of block. Nice vid.
I dont have these problems with any of my wood fences.
Been doing decks and fences for 12 years and i dont touch these crappy paper fences.
Ive never seen one of these fences last more than 3 years before failure and then your back for repairs. In the 12 years, i havent been back to a job unless it was to build something else
The upper and lower horizontal panels need a locking clip punched in on both sides at each end of the panels that keeps the panels locked in the posts. There is a purpose made tool available to punch out the clip.
Yes they were present but not strong enough in this wind
vinyl fences are designed to flex somewhat in the wind. However, the way these posts move, I doubt they are installed in concrete OR the ground is so soft they have gradually made themselves loose. Installed Country Estate Fence for 10 years. We only had blowouts in extreme 65+ mph winds. This fence just moves too much. Something wrong.
Great video. At my mothers house in Fontana California we are about to replace a wood fence. She has a corner house and she has block wall around but that side with the wood fence is at. The house sit up in a small hill so it has a retaining wall that it already five feet tall. So we were thinking about a vinyl fencing but wasn’t sure cause we get high winds here in Fontana. But I heard you say this vinyl fences can take high winds if done properly. So I will look into it. Thank you for the video and info
Should be fine if you lock the rails in
Have you installed the fence? I also live in Fontana and have been skeptical about vinyl fencing cause Of the high winds we get.
Not how I would fix it. Exposed rebar and such. Not sure how the rebar in the cement is really going to hold when forces upon it are vertical. The rebar in the cement should have been bent in a J hook, this way it will not pull out.
Great video. Thank you
Grew up in Somerton. Now living in Georgia.
Ah yes not too far away then, but quite a hike now.
Cheers,
Bob
Excellent Trick Securing the top rails. I have the same wind issue but mostly with my gates. I'm going to do that screw trick though all the way down my fence line. My gates keep busting from the wind and the hinges pull off and crack my gates. The posts are hollow and there is nothing to hold the screws into the vinyl for the hinges or latches. It's so frustrating and expensive to replace the gates. Thanks for your video!
Your very welcome. Glad I was able to help.
@@BobsHomeServicesLLC I might look for the aluminum inserts to strengthen the posts so there is something to drill into to hold the screws for the gate hardware.
@@jlo_too2493 That’s always a win but you can also hold a block of wood inside the hollow post where the screws will go
I have a vinyl fence installed by Lowe's. Every other post they installed a metal vertical bar and on the bottom it has a horizontal bar. I live in NC and we get strong winds during hurricane season. Do these fences hold up to strong winds? TIA
The aluminum I-Beam that the vinyl post sleeve slides over is a great way to fight against harsh winds. Every situation is different and this location is always windy and holds up just fine now that I made these modifications to it. Vinyl fences do hold up in the wind when done correctly, but remember, any fence that don't allow wind to blow through it (i.e. chain link) will resist the wind and ultimately need to be stronger.
Why didn’t you put glue on that top paver then the rebar, it will make it a lot stronger. Just my opinion.
Do these types of fences need to have a little give? I notice in windy weather mine and neighbors fence move.
Are those posts even concreted into the ground and dug to a proper depth? That fence is scary looking and moving all over the place in the wind.
Great video! May I ask respectfully, as we were looking into getting a white vinyl fence, I notice a lot of discoloration on yours in some areas. Is this fence pretty old? Is it possible to keep these white with cleaning, or do they look like this even with maintenance cleaning done to them? That might be a deal breaker if they age bad.
Only solution is to rip the fence out and do it all over again. Unfortunately, nothing done will make it wind proof. 6' sections, aluminum in all the posts and rails, heavier rails, screwing in the u-channels, is the only way to build a pvc fence that can withstand high winds.
That’s not accurate as this fence is still standing with zero issues and we have even had hurricane force winds several times this year alone.
I’ve been back to this customers home several times and she always tells me how thankful she is because her neighbors are still having trouble and she does not.
She’s even recommended my service to a couple of them.
I would not want a fence company to rip my entire fence out as that would be expensive, when my lower cost service worked just fine for over a year now.
Remember there is always more than one way to do anything properly.
Cheers
Bob
@@BobsHomeServicesLLC it is accurate. Look it up. Miami-Dade requires fences must withstand up to 115 mph gusts. Some of the items mentioned must be included to meet such requirements. see for yourself. Manufactures must submit testing data and specifications to The county for approval.
@@allcountyfenceryan5032 Now the topic has shifted from (The only solution is...) to that of code in Miami-Dade. I'm simply trying to explain that there is more than one way to skin a cat, more than one correct answer, more than one persons idea that works.
Have a great day and a better weekend,
Bob
Heat the rebar? Back in the day we'd bite onto it and bend it with our hands.
Well, anything under #8 rebar. 🤣
Thank you for sharing
Hey, that's what it's all about. Glad you got something out of it.
Hi Bob, thanks for the video. New vinyl fence installed and a corner section keeps coming out when it gets really windy. Can you tell exactly what screws you are using to reinforce the horizontal rails. Do they need to be self tapping? If able, could you provide a link to Lowes or something to the correct screw?
Also, did you go through all the bottom and top rails of the entire fence and add screws? Or did you just add screws to the trouble areas as shown in the video?
Hello thank you for this video can you give me the name of the material you used to secure the two part
right, what if the wind is from the other direction? this is only half a fix. run a few 1/4" x 4" tapcons through those blocks under each post, right into the solid wall. you could even make a countersink using a 1/2" masonry bit. not too tight though or you'll crack them.
Nope. Critics, critics, everywhere. Wind never comes from other direction and even if it did that rebar don’t move. It’s been all this time and 3 hurricanes and problems pal.
lol "wind never comes from the other direction." I guarantee if the wind blows one way, it can blow the other, especially in a storm. you can't tell me I'm wrong, been doing this stuff for 30 years. four tapcons would have taken 15 minutes, worked better and wouldn't look ridiculous.
gonna be a nice rusty mess in a few months.
lol..pal.
@@Bill123058 Nope, each piece of rebar was heated and then bent, permitted to cool and sprayed with two coats of Rustolium black before a top clear coat and then allowed to dry over the weekend before being installed. These have been here since June of 2020, over a year now and they are still doing their job exactly how I intended them to work; no rust, no movement, no fence problems and three hurricanes, so I think we're all good.
Let me guess.... the posts have no galvanized pipe or 4x4s to be secured to!
Glue that brick!!!, lol. Good job.
It was more than one block LOL
Hello Im in Philadelphia close to where u did this. We just had a privacy fence installed on a 2nd floor deck and it feels like if we push or lean on the boards it would give way. I don't want to find out but this can't be normal
I would say that this fence is not suited to the wind conditions or the fence was not installed and modified to suit the wind conditions of this area!! For instance, maybe a short timber post up to the bottom hole in the post could have been installed inside of the post before concreting the hole that would help against strong winds.
The fence is suitable for windy areas however the original installer did not take the necessary steps to ensure it stayed together. To this day, nothing has happened to the fence and that area is extremely windy; in fact, we had very strong winds from that last hurricane and it stood strong.
You can't really put a timer inside of the vinyl sleeve because the rails slide into the posts. Locking the posts in with the screws (as shown in the video) has corrected the problem. As far as the part of the video showing how I used rebar to secure the fence, that also is holding up strong and staying true.
Thanks for your comment,
Bob
@@BobsHomeServicesLLC I Clearly said that a timber post can be inserted up to the bottom hole and not any further I have seen this done here on TH-cam.
@@robertbutler8004 Yes you did and I missed that part of the comment however, I do not feel that would add much rigidity to the top portion of the fence, the part that acts like the sail of a sailboat. It probably helps some, but to what degree I am uncertain. They also manufacture aluminum inserts that add strength to the vinyl posts and while some of these posts had them installed, others did not.
Bob
does this cause any issues if you live in a cold weather area? like with expansion and contraction ?
Come to Georgia
I think I would have used nail l glue on the concrete blocks
Why not just fill in the posts with sand from the top up to halfway?
so basically read the manufacturers instructions before installation
That too. I’m not certain the instructions would provide as good of a viewpoint.
I had a vinyl fence installed and the installer didn’t secure the ends with a screw or a notcher tool and a strong wind came and part of my fence came apart. I hate it it when installers cut conners, very unprofessional.
All those transitions 😂
You don't need to measure the amount of water in the concrete?
Are you asking me if I need to measure the amount of water going into the concrete mixture, then no. You can pour water into the concrete mixture and mix it up until you get the consistency you want. If you had too much water the concrete might be weak and if you don’t have enough to solidify the powder It might also be weak or not thoroughly mixed but when you used to working with concrete you can usually eyeball it.
That particular cement used needs to be mixed before pouring. It’s not the post mix that can be used as was demonstrated. But it did work for him.
Thank you I put mine up no mention of screws. Well 60mph winds pop the corner . So had to prop it up with 2x4 why wouldn't the tell u to screw it
Not really sure but I’m glad you were able to find this video and take care of your problem. Cheers!
Hi was wondering why you didn’t use a post support bracket and secure that block with silicone cement?
That entire block wall is just stacked block and was never designed to have a fence bolted to it. Someone else installed the fence and bolted it down to that decorative wall. I chose to do it this way because I felt it was the best option for a high wind area and it's been a long time since I've done it and it's still standing strong, so I guess it worked out great.
What kind of screws are they? can I use wood ones?
These are coated deck screws and you sure can use wood screws, but you should ensure they are coated for exterior use.
How much will you charge the new face like that and that’s 100 feet
Better yet glue the slats together as you build it, use 2x2 screwed in at the top of the post. Gorilla glue will glue concrete blocks to PVC posts.
I’ve never glued the slats together before but wonder if that would cause cracking since the flexibility would be diminished.
@@BobsHomeServicesLLC Put a 4" bead on at top middle and bottom of the sides, it will hold while giving the PVC enough flex to expand and contract (they hardly expand or contract its miniscule). About 6 years in southern MO. no issues. Wood block in top holds stringers. Good luck.
Probably wouldnt have hurt to put some mortar under that one block as well just to stop it wiggling so much in the wind.
Well, that would have made that one block higher than the rest and then it wouldn't match very well. To this day she hasn't had a problem with it one iota.
Thanks for commenting.,
Cheers,
Bob
Maybe...drill a 5/8" hole into the block and insert the rebar into it?
i think i like this town. i invest in pittsburgh and its very hilly. i dont like it. im going to do more research on this part of PA.
that gives a new meaning to 'put a pin in it'. :0)
Levittown area is very nice, but a better area would be Middletown Township which borders Bristol Township and has less taxes and better schools.
@@BobsHomeServicesLLC ooh, okay. thanks for the tip, bob.
@@spicynomad Yep, have a good weekend and enjoy the freedoms we have on July 4th.
@@BobsHomeServicesLLC same to you, sir. :0)
should be a screw on top when u remove cap
Should have done that on the neighbors side😂
Just use what is in hand why to rent a hilti drill if there is no much money to make
There's a thing called common sense, first of all these vinyle fences have vinyle posts its laughable... If anything each post should have a schedule 40 STEEL POST within the square vinyle posts cemented in with also using an inside bushing to remedy the space in between the vinyle & metal post.
Where can I buy this fence?
Home Depot sells it
could you not have cemented the block instead of using the re-bar????
No. These are EP Henry stacked blocks. Adding mortar would change the height of that one block and look ridiculous.
Thanks for the info because my blows apart all the time
Well hopefully it won't after you add some extra hidden fasteners.
@@BobsHomeServicesLLC Yes something so little and so cheap can make such a difference
@@michaelgiovanetti7454 That's quite true. I'm glad you found the video. Honestly, let me know how it works out for you. Is it just the screws you are employing or are you also having a problem similar to the stacked block wall?
@@BobsHomeServicesLLC And what’s funny is I live in Bensalem and you did that video in Levitown and my property backs up to the common grounds and the wind comes through there like gangbusters all the time
@@michaelgiovanetti7454 Ah, someone local, how cool. I'm sure the conditions are quite similar. It's odd that this area has wind when area's around it are calm. I'm no meteorologist, but must be something to do with a Jetstream or something similar.
Not really sure what you mean. Please text me a photo.
do what i did , remove some vinyl planks, so the wind passes through
Well that would certainly cut down on the resistance with the wind but you lose privacy.
@@BobsHomeServicesLLC only for the hurricane problem your having , who cares
it’s not permanent just for your tornado thingy
haha. put a wire to hold it. big giant hole for a tiny piece of metal. The metal is against the wall and the concrete is filling the hole, so the wire is attached to the very end of the concrete. Why not just glue the damn bricks down or cement them in place?
If I were to cement the blocks down, I would need to do that to every single block in the entire wall (even around the corner) otherwise the wall would not only appear different because one part would have mortar joints and the other part would not, but the wall with the mortar joints would now be at a different height. Each mortar joint would raise the height by at least a quarter of an inch. If each tier had that, the wall is now an inch taller causing the fence to no longer line up with the fence to the left. So.... then I would need to also do the 100 blocks on the left, making myself more work and causing the clients project to be more costly.
The hole has to be deep and also wide enough to fit the bent rebar. The strength comes from the depth, much like a trees roots.
You like to laugh with your HaHa comment as you troll the net looking for places to drop negativity. For the record I used rebar, not wire. No glue will hold those blocks together, and even landscape adhesive, formulated for blocks would not stand up to a sail attached to it; the sail being the 6ft high fence.
We just experienced hurricane Isaias and the fence is still standing strong while trees are toppling over. I would consider this a win.
I have some advice for you.
You should hire out all your jobs.
@@BobsHomeServicesLLC Oh. boy. I'm not trolling. I live in Philly, and I see people do all kinds of stuff against code.
--It just seemed like a lot of digging, etc. for the concrete to only touch the end of the wire. Will it work? Probably.
--You could use the glue adhesive on the bricks. It wouldn't change the look.
I didn’t need to see y’all digging a hole, did I?
Depends if you like holes.
Cobalt ridge
Never upon entering a new residential location should a contractor pull in the driveway. Comes across entitled and unprofessional.
Puts a screw for the rails for wind 😂😂😂😂😂😂 just makes it not slide back and forth the real thing you wanna screw is the u channel come on bobbbbbb
Vinyl fences…, garbage. Don’t get one.
Also ugly.
It's really a matter of choice. Everyone has a different opinion. If a vinyl fence is installed properly it will last many years. The biggest problem I note besides what is included in this video is the fact that most gates only have two hinges and often that's not enough if the gate is 6ft high. Also, the posts that hold the gate's hinges shouldn't be hollow vinyl sleeves, but instead, also have a aluminum rigid core installed so that the hinge screws have something strong to bite into.
Their not for everyone, but personally I do prefer them to wooden or chain-link because the chain-link don't provide the esthetic value offered by the vinyl and the privacy factor is much lower; wood as we all know requires maintenance and as we age that's the last thing we want.
Thanks for your comment,
Cheers,
Bob
@@BobsHomeServicesLLC I have a 120’ long property line with a 64’ driveway boarding my neighbor. My side had a 4’ tall 75 year old chain link and their side had a hedge running the full length. If we both maintained our sides of the hedge, everything looked quite nice. Not beautiful.., just appropriate to the neighborhood. They decided they didn’t like the hedge and would install a vinyl fence. Considerately, they asked me if I would want their installers to take down my chain link. Actually…., what choice did I have other than to agree? If not, I would be plagued with a “between the fences weeds problem” forever, that only I would be victim to. So I agreed. I’ve already let it be know to you that I don’t like these fences. I find them charmless, pedestrian, lacking character and ugly. And I don’t like it being mistakenly thought of by passers-by that it was a choice I made. That aside, what I was not prepared for was that this thing is a veritable mosquito nursery! And no. I’m not crazy. I’m a DIY competent, 54 year old man. For 18 years we’ve never had a mosquito problem in the driveway. As soon as they put up this monstrosity a few years ago, that’s when it started.
Last month the neighbor was sprinkling their back lawn. I was in my driveway and could hear the water hitting their side of the fence. Just to confirm my theory, I aimed a leaf blower at the base of the fence on my side. What do you know..?.. a huge amount of filthy brownish water back flowed out. I should have known because I’ve also been getting weeds growing out of the top of the base for quite some time as well.
I anticipate that you probably might respond with something like..,
“The installer should have drilled the bottom edge to prevent such a problem”. But of course, the product isn’t manufactured that way is it?
@@mercoid Nope, I won't respond that way. I'm intrigued by this because it's not something that I have ever heard of before. Your correct that the bottom rail does not have good drainage and all water would flow into either hollow post, keeping a moist environment; hum..... Thanks for sharing this. I do not install fences for a living, but do tend to be in situations where I need to either deal with their repair. I will keep this in mind for sure.
Bob
Im still deciding is this is better than aluminum?? Looks like is not sturdy??