I choose a .177 springer for pest and small game, which it excels at to proper ranges. Also for economy everything is less expensive. I can easily put thousands of pellets away, not to mention the pump bb guns that are also great for the pest/sg field also. Not that 22 is much more, but it is. In that case I have firearms. Do I love the hard shooting pcps- you bet I do. They are incredible engineering and plain fun to shoot at even firearm distances. I taught my kids to shoot, as I did, on bb/pellet guns and starting to get gkids to take out to learn. I believe the air rifle field has something for everybody these days and only getting better. *I was happy with fps of 400 ish w bb gun, then all the way up to 1,000fps with a spring and now my rather inexpensive springer can do 12-1400fps! And they are ALL still just a ball to shoot!!! great points and inclusion of calibers and power in your video. Thank you for the info and keep them coming my friend.
I'm a .25 man myself. I just like the extra surface area and larger avg pellet/slug mass. I enjoy my springer .22s for springer hunting, but the .25 out of a PCP is kind of my go to out past 35-40yds. A lot more forgiving and I think ethical hunting reuqires you to give yourself room for error with shots since you can't always bank on hitting hole-on-holke in the field, which the .25 is very forgiving for.
@@simonsays5979 Ya it is a lot easier and cheaper to buy .22 pellets, walmart, basspro etc will have them, never see .25 cal pellets at places like that
@@bexxISM depends on the gun/barrel but pellets I would say .25 jsb Diablo Hades, accurate and great for hunting. Great all purpose rifle Hatsan Airtact .25 as a break barrel, PCP either the Edgun Leshiy or an FX but those are $$$$
For break barrel air guns like the Beeman Mantis, 177 is best for my use. With muzzle velocity of 1,000 ft per second, laser accuracy, and 18.4 FPE, anything from hogs at close range, coyotes, medium to small game, are no problem. Accuracy is the key. 0.3" groups at 33 yards with high velocity will take care of most medium to small pests. Mine has. The 177 is just much easier to cock. No high pressure PCP or pump required. Good pellets ARE required, like RWS Superdomes. Thanks for the video.
Nice Jim, I love my 30 cal. With the Fx Maverick, you have the power wheel so you can use different settings for small game and medium game. slugs or pellets on the fly. I wish all air guns came with a power wheel. I can go in a barn shooting low power for varmints and go outside crank it up and drop a pig. It's awesome. You should do more technical videos like this.
Thanks, appreciate your continued support. I agree with you. For years I've been writing that adjustable power is the equivalent to handloading for centerfires.
Thanks brother. Your opinion is appreciated always. I love 177cal. With 16.2gr Beast I can get 33ft pounds with my Avenger. Yet turn it down to 16ft pounds for extreme high shot count and hunting squirrel/rabbits. Plus it's very cheap to operate. $11.49 for 10.5gr domed Crossman, per 500ct. 2,000 pellets shipped to my door from Pyramid Air for $50.00 This gives me alot of practice time. I shoot 200 rounds, or more any given week. Most of my hunting is in the woods, inside 50 yards. I feel the most important thing is shot placement. So trigger time allows me to know exactly where my rifle hits everytime. God bless you brother 🎯
Hi Heith, this sounds completely reasonable, that Avenger still impresses me by the way. It is my application of sometimes shooting long distance and shooting bigger quarry, that shifts my requirement. The cost is lower to keep it fed, to be sure.
@@americanairgunhunter Thank you for responding. I do have a. 25cal Puncher Breaker. I love it. But my BSAR10 SE is also 177cal. I also have the fantasy of field target competition. This also makes me like 177cal. Also my Gauntlet is 177cal. God bless you brother 🎯
A few years ago, the choice of pellets and guns was more limited, but now it seems that every popular gun comes in .25 with more expanding to .30 as well.
What an excellent breakdown! I have a 25 cal FX Impact and wasn't sure if that was going to end up too much gun for small game. Seems I made the right choice!
I just love the feeling of "tossing hammers" i get from a big hunk of lead. Even at range .30 holds very consistent, more arc at lower power but reliable.
Thanks so much for your sage wisdom. I've been focussed on .25 cal with my FX Crown over the last few years and find it's met my needs. However, more recently I've purchased a FX Impact in .25 cal, but after your video I've invested a .30 cal change kit for it. I'm hoping for similar results across pellets and slugs with .30 as the .25, especially with the Impact's larger plenum, high flow transfer ports, slug pin probes and heavier hammers that are now available. Anyway, thanks for the inspiration Jim. Best regards, Chris
Great video for your choice of small game caliber. I like to go with a 22. Today's modern PCPs can swing a very heavy 30-40 gr projectile at 900-1000 fps. I get a larger selection of ammo types in 22, and of course cost of ammo (pellets or slugs). I just get more bang for the buck in 22
I think if you go with a very heavy .22 pellet you do get better long-range performance and depending on the range, better penetration. And the price difference is true. But I still feel that the knockdown power of the .25 is better, especially on larger animals. However, your point is valid even if for my hunting applications, a .25 holds the edge.
I found very helpful. I’m just exploring the air gun universe since childhood and I don’t want to spend $200 or more several times before resting on a caliber and platform that with some homework, I can make a reasonable choice for my needs. This info was worthwhile. Thanks
25cal is the perfect balance the perverbal sweet spot. Best balance between power, cost, wind and retain more power down range punch. With game up to 35lbs for most shooters. Cost is about 20% more than 22 and less choices in pellets and slugs more so. I do some times fear a through and through and hitting something I don't own. And ammo is not avaliable everywhere. In all other categories the 25cal shine out over all others. He was spot on in this video. HATSAN has 25cal around $100 in a springer vortex piston (600fps) and springer 30cal for under $200. Not worth spending any more for springer as pcp can be had for that price. But don't count out the break barrel ease of use with the least amount of exssive equipment required to operate the gun (tanks,pumps,cartridges,) the airadvenge has a on-board pump so on less thing to have to purchase or carry for PCP. So if backpacking very doable. Next it would be a 25cal vortex piston break barrel. Real simple when traveling (pellets, gun, service/cleaning kit. ).
Well, most used, effectively, from my POV is the .22 cal. It's the one I have used with daisy or Crosman dome headed pellets. Slugs in .25 or .30 sound like strong possibility for an animal up to 80-100 pounds at 30-50 yrs based on videos from channels like AmericanAirgun Hunter.
I ditched the .177 because my scoped .22 Stoeger S-4000-E works so well. I later bought a Hatsan Model 95,Vortex .25 air rifle. In my opinion, it doesn’t outperform the Stoeger .22,, far from it, but I keep the .25 around with iron sights just for blasting armadillos.
Have you tried the Huben K1 Rifle AT .25 OR .30, It has a .35 as well I believe, or the Huben GK1 pistol .177, .22, or .25? These I believe are the most revolutionary air guns for PCP, 5000 psi with regulators that give precise power for each pellot or slug over 17 to 19 shots. Even the Pistol gets close to 90 FPE with heavier slugs with remarkable accuracy and can be adjusted between under 12 foot pounds to over 90 with consistant power for each shot.. Truly amazing engineering. Both the rifles and pistols are semi-automatic and shoot beautifully. I'd like to see you do a review on these air guns. Subbed!
He was spot on on all topics. He was not trying to down on the other tried and true calibers(.177, 22). I have let my 177 cal ammo levels get low because of lack of use. Just bought some hades first time in 22.
@@americanairgunhunter haven't found a air rifle that don't like them yet. Even the old Chinese orange wooden stock spring rifles from the 80's(B4A1) love them.
.22 is the king for small game. Its more economical than .20 .25 .30. In a pinch you can go into walmart and buy 500 .22 cphp for $7 and be in business. Supply chain issues will fubar availability of. 25 and .20 and .30 sooner or later. Cphp is awesome for vermin and hunting small game. And there is no reason not to have 20 tins of this washed and lubed laying around. Good to see your still around Echochap...
A thougherly enjoyable video. Your knowledge, experience and explanations came across very well. I'm a sub 12ft pounds shooter in the UK. Try to get a firearms licence (FAC, fire arms certificate) to be able to shoot above 12ft pounds here is almost impossible unless you own a farm or your own wood to shoot in. That's the problem of only being a small country that can easily fit into most of any one of your states.😕👍
Thanks very much, I appreciate that. It’s all relative, I lived in the Netherlands for many years (great place to live BTW) where an Airguns power was not limited, but hunting was forbidden, I’d have traded FPE for the chance to hunt in a minute :)
Those plastic tip pellets costs more but are effective on game. They penetrate about a half an inch then they start to turn and go backward. That tumbling effect makes a larger permanent would channel that makes them effective killers.
Well put jim iam in the uk were most not all air gunners use sub 12ft pound, hunting is different than in the states, because of reduced power we realy on greater feild craft, most my shooting involves bringing the game to were i want them ie at close range, takes great skill to get a woodpigeon to land in static decoys and stay still long enough to take the shot, i dont use 177 it still overpenitrates even at sub 12 foot pound, i have shot hundreds of rabbits useing 22 sub 12 foot, i dont use shot guns or rimfires any more buy choice iam 60 years old and been hunting since i was 7, grandad let me use is four ten spread shot, he taught me almost everything, thanks for your great videos and god bless, Stuart from sunny Lancashire,
Thanks for a very informative video! While I would love to have a 25 or even a 30, for my conditions I think my .22s are a superior choice, and a .177 might be even better. And that condition is: back yard pest control. Even with a fairly big yard of 3/4 acre, I still have to be very careful regarding my neighbors, and jump thru various hoops to insure their safety. Like shooting down towards the ground rather than up into the trees, along with a back stop. I could still take these precautions with a 25 or 30, but it is just that much more power to be stopped. I would be more nervous about shooting a neighbor or damaging their property than I already am. And my 22 PCP has proven to be plenty for taking out about 20 of the rascals so far, no more have been seen for a while. So it might be all I need.
I have the Hatsan Bullboss and Bully, both in .25 cal. So far, I am extremely happy with both. Bullboss with JSB Hades for up to 50 yds. Bully with JSB Exact King Heavies MK2 or NSA slugs for over 50 yds.
I'm generally using 44gr slugs in my FX Maverick .25. The greater energy at higher fps is hugely forgiving and very ethical. This is effective at 50 yards and beyond.
I’m a physics guy myself. The best reason for that hollow end of the slug is probably for 2 reasons. 1. It may create a better seal as it’s fired. Kind of like the minet ball. And to put more of the weight on the front end of the bullet, so that it will always fly front first. Same as a badminton shuttle.
I am in the UK & we have power limits unless you have a Firearms certificate. I was 18 years old at the time i already had a shotgun certificate, i had that when i was 16 years old ( where did the ''They can't own guns in the UK'' come from?) I was doing pest control for a large training college & had some rabbits i couldn't get near with a 12 gauge. I had a little success with my .22 BSA Airsporter but, i needed a bit more punch. I wouldn't of got an FAC for a 22LR so i looked for a decent air rifle. I settled for the Sheridan .20 Blue Streak, 18 ft lbs, this was in 1976, it got the job done but all that pumping!!. Now we are spoilt for choice & i don't have any worries, pick up the correct tool for the job, job done.
Right there with you on selecting the right tool for the job! I believe the reality of getting a gun in the UK is that it is pretty restrictive, takes you through a lot of bureaucratic steps, you must show need (varmint hunting, target shooting) and be a member of an approved club, but as you say it can be done. I write for Air Gunner in the UK and have gotten comments from many readers saying they don't bother with the FAC for a higher power air rifle because it's too much effort. But as you say, if you need it and can demonstrate that, you can get it.
As the .30cals. become more previlent in the marketplace, the more I have to say I prefer it for all the small, to medium game I am able to take with it, and the energy levels are continuing to get better and better as well ! Would I say the same thing if we were talking about a powder burner, of course not ! But as far as airgun application is concerned, I'm totally convinced that the .30cal. is the most effective pellet for the quickest possible dispatch of my prey, that includes anything from a squirrel, or rabbit, up to a pig, or coyote ! Straight up, the most effective pellet caliber for the job ! Had it been a few years ago, when .30cal. availability wasn't quite as previlent, then I'd have said the .25cal. But in my opinion, the bigger, and the harder hitting the better !
Love the video Jim and I definitely agree. I have been practicing with my Challenger .50 bull pup lately and have had most of the calibers in your video I also like 25 and 30 calibers for small game.
@@americanairgunhunter I like it, I haven’t had any problems with it. It’s built very well very rugged, I’ve had more expensive air rifles not built as tuff. I get good accuracy and plenty of power. We know it is heavy but most big bores are. I like that it’s not really long and that it has a six round mag. for me that was a big plus. Most big bores are single loaders. I do wish it had sling mounts and a pic rail for a bipod that came stock. I have texted back and forth with Bin Tac and what he calls a Max kit should be here next month and that is supposed to put the power in the 700 fpe range. For the price this rifle for me was well worth it.
Good vid. I don't agree with everything you said; but most. All of my PCP's are .25 and they are perfect for "me" and what I do. I have an M3 so I was thinking of going to get a .30 barrel kit. After shooting it, there is no need. A dead squirrel is a dead squirrel. For the most part accuracy is more important than cal size to me. Again, good vid man.
Here in my country .25 pellets are scarce. We use 177 and 22. For small game. We don't hunt coyotes they are restricted. I guess ranchers deal with them with firearms when Authorities are not looking. Today I tried to help a friend controlling the central American aoguti (cotuza) in his property with a .22 (polymags) with no luck. they are eating the coconut trees sprouts that he planted and leaving holes every were. Great day in the field though, I have a new apreciación of the content that you share, hours waiting to hear and see the game.
You mentioned that you get asked, "Isn't that too much gun for x?" The one caveat I'd mention regarding caliber is pass-through. My favorite YT videos are the pesting ones. Too many times I see a round go right through (usually not straight) and hit a wall, or a tin roof, or go skipping across asphalt or water on its way to who knows where! Rule #4: Be sure of your target and what's behind it. I only hope they have insurance!
I wouldn’t be using a .25 in an area where collateral damage is possible. I think a .22 with power dialed to 12 to 14 fpe is best tool for dairy farms for instance. It was people using too powerful guns and not taking care of backdrop that got all the dairy farms we used to pest at shut down.
Love it. Nothing like a good caliber debate when the weather sucks outside. We simply don't have as much fun in that regard as powder burners. For my $.02 , I will go with the 22 cal in the modern PCP. Nothing it can't kill quite dead in the small game realm and with the advent of slugs, you can reach out plenty far those prairie dogs if you are fortunate enough to live where they dwell. What is small game? Fox and down would be my definition. What say ye?
Hi Mark, it is true that slugs give the .22 a bit more reach, penetration, and knock down power and closes the margin with the .30. But then you can use the slugs in the .30 and it opens right back up. I have used the .22, .25, and .30 slugs on long range prairie dogs, but still think the larger the caliber the more firmly it anchors them, but the difference is a matter of degrees and not an order of magnitude. I'd agree with your definition of small game, but under the right conditions and picking my shots carefully, I'll also shoot coyote, bobcat, and small hogs with my .25 or .30 gun. Again, the larger calibers work better for me in this scenario. I do think that if the discipline is lacking to walk away in suboptimal shooting situations, the latter quarry should be given a pass altogether.
The .20 is a great compromise. Heavier and slightly bigger than .177 yet faster than .22 in same class springer. For short range rabbit and squirrel cant be beat.
And to think I have a sheridan air rifle.. I pump like crazy a bit and walla, were in business.. I didn't even know they made these fancy things.. lol.. It's called a model A made along time ago..Has alot of power and is accurate enough.. Happy shooting..
Thanks for another informative video! I've been thinking of selling my .22s and getting a .25. I mainly hunt squirrels, and once a year go to Montana and pest ground squirrels and barn pigeons. I often thought a .177 for inside work on pigeons and hosps, and the .25 for everything else.
I think the .25 is great for squirrels, and with the long-range shooting and tenaciousness of ground squirrels this is a great option! To be honest, while a .177 is fine for those pigeons, if one of your .22s has adjustable power and can be dialed down it could be even better.
So, he's right. Dial down a .22 and keep a .22 rifle and get a .25. If you can sell your .177 and do so. But, also keep in mind you can get .177 and .22 at any Wal-Mart. .25 not so much. You'll need to order .25 u less a local sportsman store has them in stock.
@@markmtbrider I mean there's plenty around online. But in local stores I only see .177 and . 22 at Wally World. Some .20 occasionally but never see .25 in stores. Better to order enough online early enough so you can't have it. Pellets aren't always available in higher pellet and slug varieties.
Yes. .25 is one of my favorites. I have no experience with the 30. With the 30 you can't get nearly as many pellets for the same cost as .25. I'm looking though. Jim Be Well.
No, if you compare on price the .30 will lose to the .25 which will lose to the 22, which will lose to the .177. And while I prefer the .30 in certain applications, I still think if I was going to only have one caliber it would be .25.
Been wanting a Daystate revere for a long while and was thinking along your lines. I think I'll go on up to .25 just in case I run into a little bigger game. The only drawback(if you call it that) is I'd have to order pellets instead of buying them anywhere.
It's worth it though , I have a cpl 22s great guns for squirrels, birds , chipmunk, but if you're going up to something bigger like a woodchuck the 25 is the way to go especially if you got 60 ,70, ft lb to go with it
I have the .25 avenger. I love it. Some day I'll get an FX or maybe the Skout Epoch, but so far my longest kill shot on a ground squirrel is 103 meters. I'm glad you included it in the mix (:
.25 for me. And my hatsan 125 chucks the .25 pellets out to 60-70yards very well, and I can accurately shoot 34.9gr slugs out to 25 yards. My origin pcp on the other hand is good out to 100yards easy.
Hi Roy, the PCP is easier to shoot accurately at a distance. I just received an Origin and looking forward to working my way through it! Appreciate your view and comment!
Good designed air gun ammo AIN'T gonna Hurt any. My First was the Wischo 55N in .177. from Air Rifle Headquarters back east. 500=fps rated but can Push 750+++ after break-in. Nice info. Considering a PCP for larger game. 25 caliber or larger. More Research REQUIRED. Rotsa Ruc in the field folks. FLEXIBLE use of larger caliber. Appreciate the video sir.
Kudos for giving the conclusion upfront than subsequently elaborate on it.. Typo 6:20 (.322 you mean .22). I thought .22 had the best ballistic coefficient? For long range, I think that would favor a .22 if it's heavy enough that you can give it similar power while keeping it at ideal speed. Have you played with any of the high-powered .177 with heavier ammo? Daystate make some in HP but they are comically long.
Thank you for the presentation. I'm new to the air gunning program. With rifles getting so expensive I'm looking at other methods of hunting. My state is starting to relax the laws for air gunning just a bit. So, if this works for hunting in the future of my state then I'm in. It's a lot cheaper than the ammo we are buying now. I'm in Pennsylvania. If anyone has updates to our regulations on hunting with air rifles I'd like to hear them
Very Informstive video. I bought the .25 but eishnimhad bought the .30 instead. My seneca eagle claw has a pr e tty impressive 70 fpe but even that doesn't seem enough to drop even Grey squirrels sometimes despite using barracuda hunter extreme hollowpoints if the shot isn't perfect. You would think the massive fpe and energy dump of the hollowpoint would,even if shot isnt perfect, but I've had a number drop, then get up,and run for cover. Red squirrels no problem, but the grays seem a lot tougher. Don't wanna get too graphic, but I domed one, (won't describe the damage) and it got up and ran up a tree. I think we have iron man squirrels around d us.
Amen! The .25 brings airgun hunting to the right level. It stands in place of 22lr for small game. It will knock them stiff! A woodchuck, or rockchuck if you will, is a pretty strong small game animal comparatively. A poorly placed 22 lr won’t do well. The 25 will take them down with one properly placed shot beyond 50 yards.
Just finished an article in Air Gunner magazine where I mentioned the effect of barrel length. On a couple of my big bore rifles, I cut the barrel down in steps and chrony'd along the way. I also did a step-by-step cut down on a springer a few years back, the effect on accuracy and power was the polar opposite. It would be interesting to do a formal test and could be an interesting video. Thanks for the view and comment!
.25 is the best all around caliber for small and medium size game period, I was an avid .22 cal shooter but after shooting with the .25 there’s no going back. Back then it was air efficiency that steered me away from the .25 but nowadays there’s guns that can give you 50+ shots easily at 45fpe. 177, .22 will get the job done but .25 will get it done better especially when range is an issue.
In the muzzleloading world we use 32,36 and 40 calibers in that range for small game but on the other hand it all depends on your ear rifle too and your pellet selection or slug selection
There are pest control situations where you are using an air gun because you do not want the pellet to carry for much distance. Skirted pellets inherently bleed velocity qucikly limiting range and smaller calibers or "less gun" increases that effect. .25 in particular may simply carry further than you want it to.
When I look back over my field notes from the last few years, I find that I've been consistently impressed with the .25. I can't find any notes saying," I wish I'd had another caliber".
Great info on the subject! I have .17, .22 and .25. I almost never hunt with .177 and the .22 gets most use since my biggest game is rabbit. I have taken a few coons with my .25 marauder and the damage at 30 yards was no joke
That's my preferable caliber even to me... I love 25 and 30... 177 and 22 I take it that they are good for pegions, birds.. rabbits... But when comes to jackal, caracals and steenboks , 25 and 30 cals are great
@@americanairgunhunter I take it like have seen the video if not mistaken it another one else... Yeah 25 cal and 30 are great for powerful PCP.. they aren't good with spilringers ..
A lot of talking but extremely valuable & worth while information!! Good video! I'm thinking 30 Cal with the hades pellets! I do like the Edgun & the vixen, though a mixture of the two using the stock as regulator & tank with semi auto {as with the Edgun} with a snug fitting mag & spare mags in the pistil grip & more accurate longer 400mm CZ barrel {as in the vixen} this kind of combination in my opinion would be iconic! But we can all dream.
Nice selection of Air guns Just picked up the hammer last week it was delivered I will have a chance to shoot it up in the mountains coming up Next week I just got a box of Nielsen 388’s I’m using the ready air Compresser My wildcat 30 FX is an excellent upland game hunting air gun Fast action 13 rounds it really likes the Nielsen and the FX hybrid slugs could probably get two magazines from a fill with a fire breathing tune I wish I got the sniper version Just for the bigger tank but that’s OK I’m happy with my purchase Take Care As always good hunting
i'd need a firearm license for a .25, but as long as the caliber is smaller, the muzzle energy doesn't matter. so only .177, .2 and .22 are options for me. i chose .22The drop rate mainly depends on speed, i can go supersonic with light ammo (that's too fast, it won't stabilize properly), it is less wind sensitive and sustains more energy. Pcps get more efficient with bigger diameter. an HW-100 with 40 joule in 5,5 has the same shot count as a 30 joule 4,5 gun with the same barrel length, for brits (16,1 joule restriction, i'd buy a 4,5 under that law) the energy is the same, but the 4,5 has enough pressure for 110 shots and the 5,5 for 140. If there weren't any gun laws, I'd keep my weihrauch and might buy an aug if i ever needed more impact (maybe get the terrible trigger taken care off by someone). Thx for the great video, have fun!
HI Jim I am from over the pond and shoot 177 to great affect ,but have 22 in fac. I have just got a variation for the 25, for my maverick. I have shot all three ay sub twelve and all do the job but there is no such thing as to much gun,. Especially with an airgun and completely agree with you would of tried 30 but ammo choice is a bit limited and you also get a better shoots per fill with 25 but great article, forward to your next article in the Airgunner over here atb.
Thanks, I appreciate that. Your shooting kit makes a lot of sense to me. In a legal limit gun, the .177 is a solid choice. bet your going to like the maverick in .25, an excellent hunting set up. between .25 and .30, unless there is a need to take something quite a bit larger than the average small game quarry, not a lot of sense going to .30. Glad to hear from a reader of Air Gunner! I lived in the Netherlands for many years and picking up my Air Gunner or Airgun World at the news agent was a monthly high point! And writing for them and getting to know Terry Doe and Dave Barham over the last several years has been another great experience!
I’ve hunted for over 30 years now. I’ve been a gun owner for that long. I remember shooting birds and jackrabbits with BB’s and killing them. Pellets were a huge game changer then. Moving into powder burners, my first 2 guns were a used Winchester mod 120 Ranger in 12g and a really abused Mossburg 151B, that I purtied up and still own. I’ve owned over 300 guns since. Too much gun in an air rifle, given the limitations as well as their advances is almost impossible. I’ve shot rabbits with my .30 using JSB Hades and FX Hybrids as well as hundreds of bunnies with my Mossburg or 10-22. There is FAR more meat damage with the rimfire. You also get more of the “ice picking” effect with the powder burners, and I’ve anchored squirrels and rabbits with my air rifles. So there’s advantages of both over both. I don’t want to pay for a suppressor cert, but I like dropping an animal without letting everything else I might hunt knowing that I’m there. So lately my .25 and .30 cal air rifles have become my go to for, pretty much all my small game hunting.
The .177 seemed to outperform the .22 out of the gamo magnums. The .177 more consistently penetrated black bear skull VS the .22 against whitetail skull.
35" barreled .32, a ball weighs 53gr which throttled back with a 800 psi regulator still yields over 100 ft.lbs.... and you can sling 250gr+ bullets with 4500 psi for over 544 ft/lbs (it's a timed valve) lol Second would be a 30" (.22 barrels over 30" get surprisingly expensive lol) .22 barrel on the same gun, which with a 17gr ball and 800psi yields 38 ft/lbs, or you can sling 55gr with 4500 psi for 200 ft.lbs. Otherwise, a .177 Crossman "Airmaster 77", which I've used since I was 7 to take up to Groundhog with 10.5gr dome pellets (it's my go-to for up near the house, since it's not as likely to go through a bunch of stuff). Pellets for calibers over .177 get expensive quick, and I don't see the point. For pigeons and rabbits, I use 8.5 gr balls I cast myself. I think it's like 14 and 11 ft/lbs. I might make a new air gun with a shorter valve time in .22, and retire my Crossman from hunting duty around the house (.223 balls are easier to deal with than .180) Air guns are not toys, don't do things with them you wouldn't do with a firearm of similar power.
Just watched your video, very true on all said about the larger calipers. Your video brought to mind another question that your viewers have such as the one I have. But first, I currently I have a 25 cal Benjamin Marauder. Love it, but considering going to a 25 cal Daystate Wolverine or an Air Arms S510 SX. Something with a smoother action lever. I just went thru a challenge trying to find someone here in Maine to re-certify my portable 100 cu in/ 4500 psi Air-Venturi tank. Which made me think, what about the small bottle tanks on both of these that I am considering? I hear some SCUBA places don't like to re-certify small tanks. Heck, my local fill shop won't do a re-certication Hydro Test on my carbon fiber tank since it's not a SCUBA tank. Do you have an issue with any of your models after those small tank models, knowing you have a ton of PCPs. Assuming this might be an issue and something to consider when buying a PCP with a small attached bottle?
Great job Jim. My thoughts exactly! Got rid of my .177’s and 22’s. I own a 25 cal m3 impact and 30 cal mk2 impact. If I want to save air and plink I just use the 25.4 grain jsb pellets and get tons of shots and same great accuracy. I haven’t dedicated either gun to slugs, pellets give me incredible accuracy and I’m scared to switch. I’ve killed starlings out to 115 with the 30 cal using pellets(no wind), probably maxing out with pellets at that distance. In your opinion can i keep the superior liner (better for pellets) in to shoot slugs? I don’t really want to switch to a slug liner and lose what I’ve got with pellets. Should I just get another gun and make it a designated slug gun? If so which gun/caliber should I do it with. I’ve watched most of your hunting vids, you do a great job with those! Thank you for taking the time to make these videos to help inform/educate us!!
Hello Justin, and thanks! I'd test the slugs in your standard barrel and see how they perform. I have a lot of guns with rifled barrels that switch between pellets and slugs with no problems. I haven't done a formal look with my impact, because I have a standard barrel and a barrel with a liner. I will see the FX guys at SHOT Show in a couple weeks and will ask them, and come back and post what the tell me here.
I like my gladius 25.. I like it for the longer shooting out to 50yrds.. But for squirrel,i really adopted the British way.. Found a great accurate gamo swarm .22 (the Walmart one.. But)... Set up a feeder sit.. Lol.. Turns out better for an aging body
The places I hunt the feeders don't make so much sense, but I've seen some of the action, like what #Corvid Hunter does, and it looks like a very effective method.
Excellent video, Jim! I would appreciate more like it. The only thing I'd add is the smaller calibers are quieter. My brother's .22 Impact, sending 15.89 Hades at 1000 fps is mouse fart quiet compared to mine sending 44.75 Hades at 700 fps
That's interesting, and to be honest I've never really thought about it, but it makes sense. All thing being equal with the guns, the larger caliber is expelling a larger volume of air. I'll have to check this out. Thanks for the comment!
Hey Jim I agree myself though I prefer either a 22 caliber or 25 caliber that i small game hunt with really you know bigger the caliber the pellets coast more and you get less so I have more 22cal air rifle that I small game hunt with I think the 177 cal has to much wind Drift for me thanks for the review
Thanks for the comment Don, the cost is greater for the pellets, no doubt. I think that's more of an issue for plinking and target shooting than hunting, but it is a consideration.
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I choose a .177 springer for pest and small game, which it excels at to proper ranges. Also for economy everything is less expensive. I can easily put thousands of pellets away, not to mention the pump bb guns that are also great for the pest/sg field also. Not that 22 is much more, but it is. In that case I have firearms. Do I love the hard shooting pcps- you bet I do. They are incredible engineering and plain fun to shoot at even firearm distances. I taught my kids to shoot, as I did, on bb/pellet guns and starting to get gkids to take out to learn. I believe the air rifle field has something for everybody these days and only getting better. *I was happy with fps of 400 ish w bb gun, then all the way up to 1,000fps with a spring and now my rather inexpensive springer can do 12-1400fps! And they are ALL still just a ball to shoot!!! great points and inclusion of calibers and power in your video. Thank you for the info and keep them coming my friend.
I'm a .25 man myself. I just like the extra surface area and larger avg pellet/slug mass. I enjoy my springer .22s for springer hunting, but the .25 out of a PCP is kind of my go to out past 35-40yds. A lot more forgiving and I think ethical hunting reuqires you to give yourself room for error with shots since you can't always bank on hitting hole-on-holke in the field, which the .25 is very forgiving for.
I think you're spot on!
I like the 22 because all of my guns shoot the Crosman premier 14.3 hollow point pretty accurately and consistently and I don't have to order them
@@simonsays5979 Ya it is a lot easier and cheaper to buy .22 pellets, walmart, basspro etc will have them, never see .25 cal pellets at places like that
Best all purpose 25 pellet and durable gun?
@@bexxISM depends on the gun/barrel but pellets I would say .25 jsb Diablo Hades, accurate and great for hunting. Great all purpose rifle Hatsan Airtact .25 as a break barrel, PCP either the Edgun Leshiy or an FX but those are $$$$
For break barrel air guns like the Beeman Mantis, 177 is best for my use. With muzzle velocity of 1,000 ft per second, laser accuracy, and 18.4 FPE, anything from hogs at close range, coyotes, medium to small game, are no problem. Accuracy is the key. 0.3" groups at 33 yards with high velocity will take care of most medium to small pests. Mine has. The 177 is just much easier to cock. No high pressure PCP or pump required. Good pellets ARE required, like RWS Superdomes. Thanks for the video.
Nice Jim, I love my 30 cal. With the Fx Maverick, you have the power wheel so you can use different settings for small game and medium game. slugs or pellets on the fly. I wish all air guns came with a power wheel. I can go in a barn shooting low power for varmints and go outside crank it up and drop a pig. It's awesome. You should do more technical videos like this.
Thanks, appreciate your continued support. I agree with you. For years I've been writing that adjustable power is the equivalent to handloading for centerfires.
I'm from Brazil I have a PCP custon 6.35(.25) I like it a lot it never lets me down a lot of power and precision
Thanks brother. Your opinion is appreciated always.
I love 177cal. With 16.2gr Beast I can get 33ft pounds with my Avenger. Yet turn it down to 16ft pounds for extreme high shot count and hunting squirrel/rabbits.
Plus it's very cheap to operate. $11.49 for 10.5gr domed Crossman, per 500ct.
2,000 pellets shipped to my door from Pyramid Air for $50.00 This gives me alot of practice time. I shoot 200 rounds, or more any given week.
Most of my hunting is in the woods, inside 50 yards. I feel the most important thing is shot placement. So trigger time allows me to know exactly where my rifle hits everytime.
God bless you brother 🎯
Hi Heith, this sounds completely reasonable, that Avenger still impresses me by the way. It is my application of sometimes shooting long distance and shooting bigger quarry, that shifts my requirement. The cost is lower to keep it fed, to be sure.
@@americanairgunhunter Thank you for responding. I do have a. 25cal Puncher Breaker. I love it. But my BSAR10 SE is also 177cal.
I also have the fantasy of field target competition. This also makes me like 177cal. Also my Gauntlet is 177cal.
God bless you brother 🎯
Hey can you share the settings of your Avenger
Agree with everything you said. The .25!seems to be the perfect balance for small to medium size game.
A few years ago, the choice of pellets and guns was more limited, but now it seems that every popular gun comes in .25 with more expanding to .30 as well.
What an excellent breakdown! I have a 25 cal FX Impact and wasn't sure if that was going to end up too much gun for small game. Seems I made the right choice!
I just love the feeling of "tossing hammers" i get from a big hunk of lead. Even at range .30 holds very consistent, more arc at lower power but reliable.
Thanks so much for your sage wisdom. I've been focussed on .25 cal with my FX Crown over the last few years and find it's met my needs. However, more recently I've purchased a FX Impact in .25 cal, but after your video I've invested a .30 cal change kit for it. I'm hoping for similar results across pellets and slugs with .30 as the .25, especially with the Impact's larger plenum, high flow transfer ports, slug pin probes and heavier hammers that are now available. Anyway, thanks for the inspiration Jim. Best regards, Chris
Great video for your choice of small game caliber. I like to go with a 22. Today's modern PCPs can swing a very heavy 30-40 gr projectile at 900-1000 fps. I get a larger selection of ammo types in 22, and of course cost of ammo (pellets or slugs). I just get more bang for the buck in 22
I think if you go with a very heavy .22 pellet you do get better long-range performance and depending on the range, better penetration. And the price difference is true. But I still feel that the knockdown power of the .25 is better, especially on larger animals. However, your point is valid even if for my hunting applications, a .25 holds the edge.
I agree..being able to find the right pellet for your gun is a lot easier and cheaper with a .177 and .22
I found very helpful. I’m just exploring the air gun universe since childhood and I don’t want to spend $200 or more several times before resting on a caliber and platform that with some homework, I can make a reasonable choice for my needs. This info was worthwhile. Thanks
For a first gun that I kind of recommend to everybody look at the aventuri Avenger it's a lot of gun for the price
25cal is the perfect balance the perverbal sweet spot. Best balance between power, cost, wind and retain more power down range punch. With game up to 35lbs for most shooters. Cost is about 20% more than 22 and less choices in pellets and slugs more so. I do some times fear a through and through and hitting something I don't own. And ammo is not avaliable everywhere. In all other categories the 25cal shine out over all others. He was spot on in this video. HATSAN has 25cal around $100 in a springer vortex piston (600fps) and springer 30cal for under $200. Not worth spending any more for springer as pcp can be had for that price. But don't count out the break barrel ease of use with the least amount of exssive equipment required to operate the gun (tanks,pumps,cartridges,) the airadvenge has a on-board pump so on less thing to have to purchase or carry for PCP. So if backpacking very doable. Next it would be a 25cal vortex piston break barrel. Real simple when traveling (pellets, gun, service/cleaning kit. ).
Well, most used, effectively, from my POV is the .22 cal. It's the one I have used with daisy or Crosman dome headed pellets. Slugs in .25 or .30 sound like strong possibility for an animal up to 80-100 pounds at 30-50 yrs based on videos from channels like AmericanAirgun Hunter.
Thank you for the MOST professional, intelligent & informative presentation on this subject that I have seen.
Great job … Keep up the good work!
I ditched the .177 because my scoped .22 Stoeger S-4000-E works so well. I later bought a Hatsan Model 95,Vortex .25 air rifle. In my opinion, it doesn’t outperform the Stoeger .22,, far from it, but I keep the .25 around with iron sights just for blasting armadillos.
Have you tried the Huben K1 Rifle AT .25 OR .30, It has a .35 as well I believe, or the Huben GK1 pistol .177, .22, or .25? These I believe are the most revolutionary air guns for PCP, 5000 psi with regulators that give precise power for each pellot or slug over 17 to 19 shots. Even the Pistol gets close to 90 FPE with heavier slugs with remarkable accuracy and can be adjusted between under 12 foot pounds to over 90 with consistant power for each shot.. Truly amazing engineering. Both the rifles and pistols are semi-automatic and shoot beautifully. I'd like to see you do a review on these air guns. Subbed!
He was spot on on all topics. He was not trying to down on the other tried and true calibers(.177, 22). I have let my 177 cal ammo levels get low because of lack of use. Just bought some hades first time in 22.
Thanks! Those Hades are great hunting projectiles, I use them in many guns for small game hunting these days.
@@americanairgunhunter haven't found a air rifle that don't like them yet. Even the old Chinese orange wooden stock spring rifles from the 80's(B4A1) love them.
.22 is the king for small game. Its more economical than .20 .25 .30. In a pinch you can go into walmart and buy 500 .22 cphp for $7 and be in business. Supply chain issues will fubar availability of. 25 and .20 and .30 sooner or later. Cphp is awesome for vermin and hunting small game. And there is no reason not to have 20 tins of this washed and lubed laying around. Good to see your still around Echochap...
Sure wish I could afford one of these guns. Much more safer to work with. Your videos are very educated and on point..
A thougherly enjoyable video. Your knowledge, experience and explanations came across very well.
I'm a sub 12ft pounds shooter in the UK. Try to get a firearms licence (FAC, fire arms certificate) to be able to shoot above 12ft pounds here is almost impossible unless you own a farm or your own wood to shoot in. That's the problem of only being a small country that can easily fit into most of any one of your states.😕👍
Thanks very much, I appreciate that. It’s all relative, I lived in the Netherlands for many years (great place to live BTW) where an Airguns power was not limited, but hunting was forbidden, I’d have traded FPE for the chance to hunt in a minute :)
Those plastic tip pellets costs more but are effective on game.
They penetrate about a half an inch then they start to turn and go backward. That tumbling effect makes a larger permanent would channel that makes them effective killers.
Well put jim iam in the uk were most not all air gunners use sub 12ft pound, hunting is different than in the states, because of reduced power we realy on greater feild craft, most my shooting involves bringing the game to were i want them ie at close range, takes great skill to get a woodpigeon to land in static decoys and stay still long enough to take the shot, i dont use 177 it still overpenitrates even at sub 12 foot pound, i have shot hundreds of rabbits useing 22 sub 12 foot, i dont use shot guns or rimfires any more buy choice iam 60 years old and been hunting since i was 7, grandad let me use is four ten spread shot, he taught me almost everything, thanks for your great videos and god bless, Stuart from sunny Lancashire,
Hi Stuart. Thanks for the comment. It's all about the right tool for the job. Thanks for the comment, keep dropping by!
Thanks for a very informative video! While I would love to have a 25 or even a 30, for my conditions I think my .22s are a superior choice, and a .177 might be even better. And that condition is: back yard pest control. Even with a fairly big yard of 3/4 acre, I still have to be very careful regarding my neighbors, and jump thru various hoops to insure their safety. Like shooting down towards the ground rather than up into the trees, along with a back stop. I could still take these precautions with a 25 or 30, but it is just that much more power to be stopped. I would be more nervous about shooting a neighbor or damaging their property than I already am. And my 22 PCP has proven to be plenty for taking out about 20 of the rascals so far, no more have been seen for a while. So it might be all I need.
I have the Hatsan Bullboss and Bully, both in .25 cal. So far, I am extremely happy with both. Bullboss with JSB Hades for up to 50 yds. Bully with JSB Exact King Heavies MK2 or NSA slugs for over 50 yds.
That's a nice set up. I've used that Bullboss for pigs and it did an excellent job for me.
I'm generally using 44gr slugs in my FX Maverick .25. The greater energy at higher fps is hugely forgiving and very ethical. This is effective at 50 yards and beyond.
I’m a physics guy myself. The best reason for that hollow end of the slug is probably for 2 reasons. 1. It may create a better seal as it’s fired. Kind of like the minet ball. And to put more of the weight on the front end of the bullet, so that it will always fly front first. Same as a badminton shuttle.
I am in the UK & we have power limits unless you have a Firearms certificate. I was 18 years old at the time i already had a shotgun certificate, i had that when i was 16 years old ( where did the ''They can't own guns in the UK'' come from?) I was doing pest control for a large training college & had some rabbits i couldn't get near with a 12 gauge. I had a little success with my .22 BSA Airsporter but, i needed a bit more punch. I wouldn't of got an FAC for a 22LR so i looked for a decent air rifle. I settled for the Sheridan .20 Blue Streak, 18 ft lbs, this was in 1976, it got the job done but all that pumping!!. Now we are spoilt for choice & i don't have any worries, pick up the correct tool for the job, job done.
Right there with you on selecting the right tool for the job! I believe the reality of getting a gun in the UK is that it is pretty restrictive, takes you through a lot of bureaucratic steps, you must show need (varmint hunting, target shooting) and be a member of an approved club, but as you say it can be done. I write for Air Gunner in the UK and have gotten comments from many readers saying they don't bother with the FAC for a higher power air rifle because it's too much effort. But as you say, if you need it and can demonstrate that, you can get it.
As the .30cals. become more previlent in the marketplace, the more I have to say I prefer it for all the small, to medium game I am able to take with it, and the energy levels are continuing to get better and better as well !
Would I say the same thing if we were talking about a powder burner, of course not !
But as far as airgun application is concerned, I'm totally convinced that the .30cal. is the most effective pellet for the quickest possible dispatch of my prey, that includes anything from a squirrel, or rabbit, up to a pig, or coyote !
Straight up, the most effective pellet caliber for the job !
Had it been a few years ago, when .30cal. availability wasn't quite as previlent, then I'd have said the .25cal.
But in my opinion, the bigger, and the harder hitting the better !
Aea HS .30 semi auto 🤙🏼
.25 cal is my favorite for hunting small game as well. Have a AEA HP SS, a Hatsan sortie and a Hatsan Jet all in .25 cal.
May have convinced me to keep my .25 Huben K1. Thanks for your insights!
Love the video Jim and I definitely agree. I have been practicing with my Challenger .50 bull pup lately and have had most of the calibers in your video I also like 25 and 30 calibers for small game.
AEA is making some cool guns these days, have a couple more I'll be working with soon. How do you like the Challenger?
@@americanairgunhunter I like it, I haven’t had any problems with it. It’s built very well very rugged, I’ve had more expensive air rifles not built as tuff. I get good accuracy and plenty of power. We know it is heavy but most big bores are. I like that it’s not really long and that it has a six round mag. for me that was a big plus. Most big bores are single loaders. I do wish it had sling mounts and a pic rail for a bipod that came stock. I have texted back and forth with Bin Tac and what he calls a Max kit should be here next month and that is supposed to put the power in the 700 fpe range. For the price this rifle for me was well worth it.
Great video, very informative, especially since I’m just getting started with air guns. Thanks, keep up the great work!!!!!!
Me&my wife really due like this educational pellets video thank you god bless.
Good vid. I don't agree with everything you said; but most. All of my PCP's are .25 and they are perfect for "me" and what I do. I have an M3 so I was thinking of going to get a .30 barrel kit. After shooting it, there is no need. A dead squirrel is a dead squirrel. For the most part accuracy is more important than cal size to me. Again, good vid man.
Here in my country .25 pellets are scarce. We use 177 and 22. For small game. We don't hunt coyotes they are restricted. I guess ranchers deal with them with firearms when Authorities are not looking. Today I tried to help a friend controlling the central American aoguti (cotuza) in his property with a .22 (polymags) with no luck. they are eating the coconut trees sprouts that he planted and leaving holes every were. Great day in the field though, I have a new apreciación of the content that you share, hours waiting to hear and see the game.
Agouti is one of the airgun quarry I want to hunt one of these days. Good luck in your hunts!
Very knowledgeable thank you for the info I appreciate it
You mentioned that you get asked, "Isn't that too much gun for x?" The one caveat I'd mention regarding caliber is pass-through. My favorite YT videos are the pesting ones. Too many times I see a round go right through (usually not straight) and hit a wall, or a tin roof, or go skipping across asphalt or water on its way to who knows where! Rule #4: Be sure of your target and what's behind it. I only hope they have insurance!
I wouldn’t be using a .25 in an area where collateral damage is possible. I think a .22 with power dialed to 12 to 14 fpe is best tool for dairy farms for instance. It was people using too powerful guns and not taking care of backdrop that got all the dairy farms we used to pest at shut down.
Love it. Nothing like a good caliber debate when the weather sucks outside. We simply don't have as much fun in that regard as powder burners. For my $.02 , I will go with the 22 cal in the modern PCP. Nothing it can't kill quite dead in the small game realm and with the advent of slugs, you can reach out plenty far those prairie dogs if you are fortunate enough to live where they dwell. What is small game? Fox and down would be my definition. What say ye?
Hi Mark, it is true that slugs give the .22 a bit more reach, penetration, and knock down power and closes the margin with the .30. But then you can use the slugs in the .30 and it opens right back up. I have used the .22, .25, and .30 slugs on long range prairie dogs, but still think the larger the caliber the more firmly it anchors them, but the difference is a matter of degrees and not an order of magnitude.
I'd agree with your definition of small game, but under the right conditions and picking my shots carefully, I'll also shoot coyote, bobcat, and small hogs with my .25 or .30 gun. Again, the larger calibers work better for me in this scenario. I do think that if the discipline is lacking to walk away in suboptimal shooting situations, the latter quarry should be given a pass altogether.
The .20 is a great compromise. Heavier and slightly bigger than .177 yet faster than .22 in same class springer. For short range rabbit and squirrel cant be beat.
Wtf
And to think I have a sheridan air rifle.. I pump like crazy a bit and walla, were in business.. I didn't even know they made these fancy
things.. lol.. It's called a model A made along time ago..Has alot of power and is accurate enough.. Happy shooting..
the more I watch this channel, the more I learn.
Thanks, appreciate that.
Thanks for another informative video! I've been thinking of selling my .22s and getting a .25. I mainly hunt squirrels, and once a year go to Montana and pest ground squirrels and barn pigeons. I often thought a .177 for inside work on pigeons and hosps, and the .25 for everything else.
I think the .25 is great for squirrels, and with the long-range shooting and tenaciousness of ground squirrels this is a great option! To be honest, while a .177 is fine for those pigeons, if one of your .22s has adjustable power and can be dialed down it could be even better.
So, he's right. Dial down a .22 and keep a .22 rifle and get a .25. If you can sell your .177 and do so. But, also keep in mind you can get .177 and .22 at any Wal-Mart. .25 not so much. You'll need to order .25 u less a local sportsman store has them in stock.
Better see if any ammo is around for that 25....js
@@markmtbrider I mean there's plenty around online. But in local stores I only see .177 and . 22 at Wally World. Some .20 occasionally but never see .25 in stores. Better to order enough online early enough so you can't have it. Pellets aren't always available in higher pellet and slug varieties.
You will love the 25cal.
Yes. .25 is one of my favorites. I have no experience with the 30. With the 30 you can't get nearly as many pellets for the same cost as .25. I'm looking though. Jim Be Well.
No, if you compare on price the .30 will lose to the .25 which will lose to the 22, which will lose to the .177. And while I prefer the .30 in certain applications, I still think if I was going to only have one caliber it would be .25.
@@americanairgunhunter I don't want smaller than .25 or I would be shooting the .177. Just comparing the 25 and 30.
Been wanting a Daystate revere for a long while and was thinking along your lines. I think I'll go on up to .25 just in case I run into a little bigger game. The only drawback(if you call it that) is I'd have to order pellets instead of buying them anywhere.
It's worth it though , I have a cpl 22s great guns for squirrels, birds , chipmunk, but if you're going up to something bigger like a woodchuck the 25 is the way to go especially if you got 60 ,70, ft lb to go with it
I’m also like hunting and do that too for me .22 grain 18 JSB is the best for any pcp
I have the .25 avenger. I love it. Some day I'll get an FX or maybe the Skout Epoch, but so far my longest kill shot on a ground squirrel is 103 meters. I'm glad you included it in the mix (:
The Avenger is a fine gun, I shoot mine all of the time and it does great in .25. Thanks for the view and comment!
That's awesome, my record Shot so far is a European starling at range finder verified 108 yards with my aea hp varmint .25 caliber
I'm very great with my Daisy Powerline 880 hunting with redfire pellets & BB
.25 for me. And my hatsan 125 chucks the .25 pellets out to 60-70yards very well, and I can accurately shoot 34.9gr slugs out to 25 yards. My origin pcp on the other hand is good out to 100yards easy.
Hi Roy, the PCP is easier to shoot accurately at a distance. I just received an Origin and looking forward to working my way through it! Appreciate your view and comment!
Good designed air gun ammo AIN'T gonna Hurt any. My First was the Wischo 55N in .177. from Air Rifle Headquarters back east. 500=fps rated but can Push 750+++ after break-in. Nice info. Considering a PCP for larger game. 25 caliber or larger. More Research REQUIRED. Rotsa Ruc in the field folks. FLEXIBLE use of larger caliber. Appreciate the video sir.
Thanks, let's here what you end up with if you go the .25 route.
Kudos for giving the conclusion upfront than subsequently elaborate on it.. Typo 6:20 (.322 you mean .22). I thought .22 had the best ballistic coefficient? For long range, I think that would favor a .22 if it's heavy enough that you can give it similar power while keeping it at ideal speed. Have you played with any of the high-powered .177 with heavier ammo? Daystate make some in HP but they are comically long.
.25 for me. I cast 2 different pellets and a slug, so ammo cast and availability isn't an issue.
Love your videos Jim, years of experience & wisdom imparted to others.
Thank you kindly
I've no preference,I really enjoy all of the caliber's, they all have a time and place. I will take any size, as long as I get to shoot.
I'm lucky and get to pick the gun for the job, but if I only had one would go for the .25.....but agree with you, they all have a time and place.
Thank you for the presentation. I'm new to the air gunning program. With rifles getting so expensive I'm looking at other methods of hunting. My state is starting to relax the laws for air gunning just a bit. So, if this works for hunting in the future of my state then I'm in. It's a lot cheaper than the ammo we are buying now.
I'm in Pennsylvania. If anyone has updates to our regulations on hunting with air rifles I'd like to hear them
Very Informstive video. I bought the .25 but eishnimhad bought the .30 instead. My seneca eagle claw has a pr e tty impressive 70 fpe but even that doesn't seem enough to drop even Grey squirrels sometimes despite using barracuda hunter extreme hollowpoints if the shot isn't perfect. You would think the massive fpe and energy dump of the hollowpoint would,even if shot isnt perfect, but I've had a number drop, then get up,and run for cover. Red squirrels no problem, but the grays seem a lot tougher. Don't wanna get too graphic, but I domed one, (won't describe the damage) and it got up and ran up a tree. I think we have iron man squirrels around d us.
Good job, Jim. Your theory is spot on.
Thanks James!
Amen! The .25 brings airgun hunting to the right level. It stands in place of 22lr for small game. It will knock them stiff!
A woodchuck, or rockchuck if you will, is a pretty strong small game animal comparatively. A poorly placed 22 lr won’t do well. The 25 will take them down with one properly placed shot beyond 50 yards.
Totally agree with .25, more shot count and cheaper ammo compared to .30
In the uk fac stands for fire arm certificate which you need for air guns OVER 12 ft lb.
Great video great information. Just wish you had talked about barrel length.
Just finished an article in Air Gunner magazine where I mentioned the effect of barrel length. On a couple of my big bore rifles, I cut the barrel down in steps and chrony'd along the way. I also did a step-by-step cut down on a springer a few years back, the effect on accuracy and power was the polar opposite. It would be interesting to do a formal test and could be an interesting video. Thanks for the view and comment!
.25 is the best all around caliber for small and medium size game period, I was an avid .22 cal shooter but after shooting with the .25 there’s no going back. Back then it was air efficiency that steered me away from the .25 but nowadays there’s guns that can give you 50+ shots easily at 45fpe. 177, .22 will get the job done but .25 will get it done better especially when range is an issue.
Agree!
In the muzzleloading world we use 32,36 and 40 calibers in that range for small game but on the other hand it all depends on your ear rifle too and your pellet selection or slug selection
That's a good point. I always heard that the muzzleloading squirrel gun caliber was .32 roundball.
Outstanding presentation.......... As usual.
There are pest control situations where you are using an air gun because you do not want the pellet to carry for much distance. Skirted pellets inherently bleed velocity qucikly limiting range and smaller calibers or "less gun" increases that effect. .25 in particular may simply carry further than you want it to.
Very nice video excellent information I think I learned a lot about calibers and projectory
And you made a new word.
Yes i did thats voice texting
Great info from a guy with loads of experience
Thanks Marc, glad you found it interesting!
The .25 is definitely my favorite hunting caliber. From squirrels to foxes,it will lay them down 👍
When I look back over my field notes from the last few years, I find that I've been consistently impressed with the .25. I can't find any notes saying," I wish I'd had another caliber".
@@americanairgunhunter your opinion is why I bought a .25 Marauder back in 2014
I watched it all. Great talk. 💪
Thanks, appreciate it!
Great info on the subject! I have .17, .22 and .25. I almost never hunt with .177 and the .22 gets most use since my biggest game is rabbit. I have taken a few coons with my .25 marauder and the damage at 30 yards was no joke
You're the man!!
Thanks for sharing my friend. 👍🇺🇲🤙🇺🇲✌
Hey Richard, thanks!
Really well done, video.
Lot of food for thought here.. thanks
That's my preferable caliber even to me... I love 25 and 30... 177 and 22 I take it that they are good for pegions, birds.. rabbits... But when comes to jackal, caracals and steenboks , 25 and 30 cals are great
On a trip to SA a few years ago I used my .30 and .35 with JSB pellets to take springbok and duiker..... worked a treat!
@@americanairgunhunter I take it like have seen the video if not mistaken it another one else... Yeah 25 cal and 30 are great for powerful PCP.. they aren't good with spilringers ..
Thanks , great Information Video !
Thank you for that information was berry helpful for me to buy my next rifle God bless
A lot of talking but extremely valuable & worth while information!! Good video! I'm thinking 30 Cal with the hades pellets! I do like the Edgun & the vixen, though a mixture of the two using the stock as regulator & tank with semi auto {as with the Edgun} with a snug fitting mag & spare mags in the pistil grip & more accurate longer 400mm CZ barrel {as in the vixen} this kind of combination in my opinion would be iconic! But we can all dream.
I got to shoot a Vixen.
I like it.
Nice selection of Air guns Just picked up the hammer last week it was delivered I will have a chance to shoot it up in the mountains coming up Next week I just got a box of Nielsen 388’s I’m using the ready air Compresser My wildcat 30 FX is an excellent upland game hunting air gun Fast action 13 rounds it really likes the Nielsen and the FX hybrid slugs could probably get two magazines from a fill with a fire breathing tune I wish I got the sniper version Just for the bigger tank but that’s OK I’m happy with my purchase Take Care As always good hunting
Was thinking that .22 pcp with slugs might be a choice to challenge the .25 with pellets? Better shot count but decent foot pounds and range?
i'd need a firearm license for a .25, but as long as the caliber is smaller, the muzzle energy doesn't matter. so only .177, .2 and .22 are options for me. i chose .22The drop rate mainly depends on speed, i can go supersonic with light ammo (that's too fast, it won't stabilize properly), it is less wind sensitive and sustains more energy. Pcps get more efficient with bigger diameter. an HW-100 with 40 joule in 5,5 has the same shot count as a 30 joule 4,5 gun with the same barrel length, for brits (16,1 joule restriction, i'd buy a 4,5 under that law) the energy is the same, but the 4,5 has enough pressure for 110 shots and the 5,5 for 140. If there weren't any gun laws, I'd keep my weihrauch and might buy an aug if i ever needed more impact (maybe get the terrible trigger taken care off by someone). Thx for the great video, have fun!
Excelente video, muy detallado!
Para ud del RTI ó el Fx MK2-3 en cal.30 conjuga mejor la precisión y potencia ?
Saludos cordiales desde Panamá 🇵🇦!!!
HI Jim I am from over the pond and shoot 177 to great affect ,but have 22 in fac. I have just got a variation for the 25, for my maverick. I have shot all three ay sub twelve and all do the job but there is no such thing as to much gun,. Especially with an airgun and completely agree with you would of tried 30 but ammo choice is a bit limited and you also get a better shoots per fill with 25 but great article, forward to your next article in the Airgunner over here atb.
Thanks, I appreciate that. Your shooting kit makes a lot of sense to me. In a legal limit gun, the .177 is a solid choice. bet your going to like the maverick in .25, an excellent hunting set up. between .25 and .30, unless there is a need to take something quite a bit larger than the average small game quarry, not a lot of sense going to .30.
Glad to hear from a reader of Air Gunner! I lived in the Netherlands for many years and picking up my Air Gunner or Airgun World at the news agent was a monthly high point! And writing for them and getting to know Terry Doe and Dave Barham over the last several years has been another great experience!
Bought this for my grandson with the understanding that it's to be used properly...
All valid points, but I'm a simple man, so I choose my caliber based on on my mood.
Great video Jim I also agree with everything discussed in the video, cant wait for some hog hunting videos ✌🤠
Thanks, more hog hunts in February!
I’ve hunted for over 30 years now. I’ve been a gun owner for that long. I remember shooting birds and jackrabbits with BB’s and killing them. Pellets were a huge game changer then. Moving into powder burners, my first 2 guns were a used Winchester mod 120 Ranger in 12g and a really abused Mossburg 151B, that I purtied up and still own. I’ve owned over 300 guns since. Too much gun in an air rifle, given the limitations as well as their advances is almost impossible. I’ve shot rabbits with my .30 using JSB Hades and FX Hybrids as well as hundreds of bunnies with my Mossburg or 10-22. There is FAR more meat damage with the rimfire. You also get more of the “ice picking” effect with the powder burners, and I’ve anchored squirrels and rabbits with my air rifles. So there’s advantages of both over both. I don’t want to pay for a suppressor cert, but I like dropping an animal without letting everything else I might hunt knowing that I’m there. So lately my .25 and .30 cal air rifles have become my go to for, pretty much all my small game hunting.
Thanks for sharing that experience and your opinion, it makes a lot of sense!
Thanks for the video.
The .177 seemed to outperform the .22 out of the gamo magnums.
The .177 more consistently penetrated black bear skull VS the .22 against whitetail skull.
35" barreled .32, a ball weighs 53gr which throttled back with a 800 psi regulator still yields over 100 ft.lbs.... and you can sling 250gr+ bullets with 4500 psi for over 544 ft/lbs (it's a timed valve) lol
Second would be a 30" (.22 barrels over 30" get surprisingly expensive lol) .22 barrel on the same gun, which with a 17gr ball and 800psi yields 38 ft/lbs, or you can sling 55gr with 4500 psi for 200 ft.lbs.
Otherwise, a .177 Crossman "Airmaster 77", which I've used since I was 7 to take up to Groundhog with 10.5gr dome pellets (it's my go-to for up near the house, since it's not as likely to go through a bunch of stuff). Pellets for calibers over .177 get expensive quick, and I don't see the point. For pigeons and rabbits, I use 8.5 gr balls I cast myself. I think it's like 14 and 11 ft/lbs.
I might make a new air gun with a shorter valve time in .22, and retire my Crossman from hunting duty around the house (.223 balls are easier to deal with than .180)
Air guns are not toys, don't do things with them you wouldn't do with a firearm of similar power.
Just watched your video, very true on all said about the larger calipers. Your video brought to mind another question that your viewers have such as the one I have. But first, I currently I have a 25 cal Benjamin Marauder. Love it, but considering going to a 25 cal Daystate Wolverine or an Air Arms S510 SX. Something with a smoother action lever. I just went thru a challenge trying to find someone here in Maine to re-certify my portable 100 cu in/ 4500 psi Air-Venturi tank. Which made me think, what about the small bottle tanks on both of these that I am considering? I hear some SCUBA places don't like to re-certify small tanks. Heck, my local fill shop won't do a re-certication Hydro Test on my carbon fiber tank since it's not a SCUBA tank. Do you have an issue with any of your models after those small tank models, knowing you have a ton of PCPs. Assuming this might be an issue and something to consider when buying a PCP with a small attached bottle?
I use .177 in the uk cuz a head shot is a kill and I can be more accurate due to the faster velocity
Excellent video! Thank you!
Thanks
25cal fits my needs for hunting iguanas. Just bought an AEA HP Plus in 25cal.
That is a nice combo. A .25 for iguanas is one of the applications I want to maximize velocity to kick up the power and improve penetration
I live in Puerto Rico and we have an abundance of iguanas.
Great job Jim. My thoughts exactly! Got rid of my .177’s and 22’s. I own a 25 cal m3 impact and 30 cal mk2 impact. If I want to save air and plink I just use the 25.4 grain jsb pellets and get tons of shots and same great accuracy. I haven’t dedicated either gun to slugs, pellets give me incredible accuracy and I’m scared to switch. I’ve killed starlings out to 115 with the 30 cal using pellets(no wind), probably maxing out with pellets at that distance. In your opinion can i keep the superior liner (better for pellets) in to shoot slugs? I don’t really want to switch to a slug liner and lose what I’ve got with pellets. Should I just get another gun and make it a designated slug gun? If so which gun/caliber should I do it with. I’ve watched most of your hunting vids, you do a great job with those! Thank you for taking the time to make these videos to help inform/educate us!!
Hello Justin, and thanks! I'd test the slugs in your standard barrel and see how they perform. I have a lot of guns with rifled barrels that switch between pellets and slugs with no problems. I haven't done a formal look with my impact, because I have a standard barrel and a barrel with a liner. I will see the FX guys at SHOT Show in a couple weeks and will ask them, and come back and post what the tell me here.
@@americanairgunhunter thank you I appreciate that. I know I’m missing out by not dialing a gun in with slugs
I like my gladius 25.. I like it for the longer shooting out to 50yrds..
But for squirrel,i really adopted the British way.. Found a great accurate gamo swarm .22 (the Walmart one.. But)... Set up a feeder sit.. Lol.. Turns out better for an aging body
The places I hunt the feeders don't make so much sense, but I've seen some of the action, like what #Corvid Hunter does, and it looks like a very effective method.
.177 is my choice and I’ve been hunting for a many year
Nothing wrong with .177 under the right conditions. Why do you prefer it over the other calibers you've used?
Excellent video, Jim! I would appreciate more like it. The only thing I'd add is the smaller calibers are quieter. My brother's .22 Impact, sending 15.89 Hades at 1000 fps is mouse fart quiet compared to mine sending 44.75 Hades at 700 fps
That's interesting, and to be honest I've never really thought about it, but it makes sense. All thing being equal with the guns, the larger caliber is expelling a larger volume of air. I'll have to check this out. Thanks for the comment!
Hey Jim I agree myself though I prefer either a 22 caliber or 25 caliber that i small game hunt with really you know bigger the caliber the pellets coast more and you get less so I have more 22cal air rifle that I small game hunt with I think the 177 cal has to much wind Drift for me thanks for the review
Thanks for the comment Don, the cost is greater for the pellets, no doubt. I think that's more of an issue for plinking and target shooting than hunting, but it is a consideration.
Awesome review 👍
25 I have found out works best for myself.