Atomos Recorders: Why do I Use Them?
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 5 ก.พ. 2025
- Will an Atomos Ninja Inferno or Shogun make your video footage look 10 times better? Probably not, but I have found that the Atomos recorders are great tools which make getting better footage easier, more efficient, and in some cases you really can get better footage. In this episode we cover how Atomos recorders help filmmakers.
Links to Gear Discussed and Used to Record This Session:
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Atomos Ninja Inferno (UHD up to 60 fps, HDMI input, HDR)
Amazon: geni.us/dkj1cQr
B&H: bhpho.to/2v7qjMa
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Atomos Shogun Inferno (UHD up to 60 fps, HDMI and SDI inputs, HDR)
Amazon: geni.us/8lITyu
B&H: bhpho.to/2uN7zz8
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Atomos Shogun Flame (UHD up to 30 fps, HDMI and SDI inputs, HDR)
Amazon: geni.us/N9Wc
B&H: bhpho.to/2v7fHgA
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Atomos Ninja Flame (UHD up to 30 fps, HDMI input, HDR)
Amazon: geni.us/YN8b51F
B&H: bhpho.to/2uMYZR2
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Atomos Ninja II (HD up to 30 fps, HDMI input)
Amazon: geni.us/U8g7G
B&H: bhpho.to/2kBjz0S
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G-Technology SSD Drive with Atomos Master Caddy (made for the latest gen Atomos recorders)
Amazon: geni.us/GDySUSh
B&H: bhpho.to/2vww1VV
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Panasonic GH5 Camera
Amazon: geni.us/Efb6r
B&H: bhpho.to/2oIdG7o
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Panasonic 12-35mm f/2.8 OIS Lens
Amazon: geni.us/NbS3jK4
B&H: bhpho.to/2qLWz1Q
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Olympus 45mm f/1.8 Lens
Amazon: geni.us/ZBKI
B&H: bhpho.to/2jJDVEw
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Copyright 2017 by Curtis Judd
Ethics statement: Some of the links above are Amazon.com, B&H Photo, or other affiliate links.
Really appreciate the "summary-up-front" format, Curtis. It's really helpful and I wish everyone would use that format for review videos.
+10x.film thanks, I appreciate the feedback!
The quick summary at the beginning is GREAT . I usually stick around, because I lean much .... But I wish more TH-camrs did such synopsis. √
Thanks!
Agreed!
agreed!
I couldn't agree more. Excellent.
@@curtisjudd LOVED THE SUMMARY in the beginning thank you
That's a cool rubber band trick for panning @ 8:46
Haha, yes, learned that from +RayOrtega a few years back. My pans have been a lot smoother ever since.
Yes, I noticed that and thought it was genius.
I remember that trick too a few years back. It was meant for people that couldn't afford a fluid head but I also use that on my fluid head and it works like an insurance policy for smooth pans. However, I use two rubber bands because it's happened where the single one broke on my. That eliminated the issue.
@@matrixate To pan smoothly without rubber bands then forget the pan handle and grab the base of the head and turn from there. Low to medium friction settings it works great with long lens shots.
That rubber band trick has been around since the 1700's
Subscribed for how fast and concise you are. Hard to find on TH-cam or anywhere else really
Thanks Baustin
I have a question: Canons new cameras can't shoot video in 24 fps - (e.g. the new 90D) Despite that, is an external recorder able to record in 24 fps?
Unfortunately no. The camera defines the frame rate.
I love Atomos recorders and it changed my content so much, it just looks so professional.
All these years later, we still use them at work.
@@curtisjudd great to know thanks !
Oh my goodness, I just spotted a really neat thing you did in this video. Panning shots with a rubberband?! I can't believe I've never thought about that. I've been holding my breath and straining myself over trying to get the smoothest panning shots for my B-rolls.
👍🏻
One of the Most complete reviews I've seen about the Atomos recorders, congrats! I would just like seeing more info about the flame and the 5" recorder and their differences comparing them to the Blackmagic recorder as well. Thanks
Thanks Nicolas! Thanks for the feedback. I'll see if I can get my hands on those for review.
Loved this video and your explanations, I've always wondered why I would get one of these but when you pointed out the stress that movement puts on a codec as you showed us the waterfall I was sold on the concept of using external recorders.
Thank you!
👍
Hi, Curtis! Do you plug microphone to the atomos? I used to record my audio externally but after shooting a short where I had to manually sync about 70 clips, I decided to to find more practical way to record audio synced with the video. I got Ninja V recently and now a bit disappointed with audio synchronization.It allows to set delay by frames, but I see that my camera creates about 1,6 frame delay, when on atomos I can choose only 1 or 2.
I usually record audio separately and sync in post for my personal video projects. At work we record directly into the ATOMOS recorders and don't seem to have sync issues. Sync isn't detectable by most people until it is off by 3 frames, generally. 2 is near impossible to detect for most people. 0.6 shouldn't be an issue.
Cheers Curtis. I use the smallrig cage with my atomos ninja flame. It's great value, not too heavy.
And it ads threaded mount points.
Good info, thanks for sharing that!
Thanks for pointing out the reasoning behind purchasing one, and not just the specs. Very helpful. I did notice that Atomos is great with their web site and which SSD and even cameras are supported. I was impressed to see that my Olympus personal camera was supported haha (although it makes sense, because it's clean HDMI) - oh and youre right. Those codecs are amazing for editing and totally avoids having to transcode.
Thanks Dave. Yes, their site is actually quite useful and easy to get around. I appreciate that about them. Good to hear on the Olympus support! It'll be awesome to see that ProRes or DNxHR footage from the Oly!
I appreciate your creating the content in the beginning for people on the go like myself.
👍
VERY thorough and insightful. Thanks!!
Thanks!
I've been going back and forth about purchasing the Shogun Inferno. This video really helped. I currently own the SmallHD 700 series. I was intending on using the Shogun for filming in 4K for longer periods of time then my current 64GB Cfast 2.0 cards. Not to mention SSDs are cheaper.
Good reasons to move to an external recorder for sure. Good luck!
LOVED THE SUMMARY in the beginning thank you
You bet! 👍
"and you are now dismissed" - you captured my attention so well, that threw me off :)
👍
Metal case might add a bit of weight, especially for a gimbal. Super helpful video, Curtis! God bless you, from the Saints in Southern California. :)
Yes, too much for gimbal! God bless you too!
Great video Curtis. Thanks for creating this. I have a canon c100 and I was wondering if you know where the control resides when an atomos is connected to it? Which setting overrides the other? Once I connect a shogun for example: Which has control over the exposure, frame rate, etc? Is the Atomos controlling everything or do I still need to adjust settings in the camera? How can I learn about which device controls which setting?
Hi Sean, the camera always retains control of all of its settings. The Atomos recorders are smart enough to adapt to the frame rate and resolution that is sent from the camera via HDMI. So the camera continues to control exposure and frame rate and everything else. The Atomos just lets you bring up scopes to help you make the best possible settings on the camera.
Thank you Curtis! This information is actual even 4 year later!
You're most welcome! Happy filming!
Loved the summary at the start, so clever.
Thanks!
Great information as always. Very well put together and professional which gives the viewer a lot more confidence in your views and opinions. Thank you.
Thanks Jeff!
Hey Curtis, do you feel the ninja assasin is the best option for gh4? Do you know anything comparable for less money? FYI we did go with the beachtek off your previous comments and videos, so thank you!
Thanks again!
Hi, good to hear from you again. The Ninja Inferno is the one I would consider optimized for GH4/GH5. You’re not paying extra for the SDI inputs but get the ability to record up to 60 FPS.
Curtis Judd thanks for the reply! I looked a little but didn’t find a whole lot, what would be the primary difference between the inferno and the assassin?
Thanks!
Hi, I think the assassin is one of their discontinued recorders. Probably best at this point to go with the Ninja Inferno which records as higher framerates and comes in at the same price that the assassin used to sell for (if I recall correctly).
Curtis Judd thanks as always!!
Hello Curtis,
Great job, as usual.
Quick question: I am deciding between a professional camcorder or my Sony a6500 with an Atomos Shogun 7. The purpose is to record long conferences, lectures, events, that could create heat in the equipment.
What option do you recommend me?
Thanks in advance. 🙏
Hi Jorge, I haven't worked with the a6500 but I know several of the other a5xxx and a6xxx have had issues with overheating when shooting video. I don't know whether that's just when recording with the camera and whether the Shogun 7 would solve that problem or not. Probably best to check with other a6500 owners who have experience shooting long-form video. I think the practical choice would probably be a pro camcorder which is made for things like that.
Curtis Judd Agree! Thanks a lot.
Another informative video! Great work, Curtis.
Thanks Stephen!
I have two questions :
1.in 6:49 DavinciResolve is showing real time with what's on Shotgun Inferno. How did you make connection between computer and Shotgun Inferno?
2. Do I need additional bigger sleeve between SSD (already in small sleeve) and G-Technology G-DOCK ev Solo Enclosure 2TB . I have SSD Toshiba 850 Pro 1TB .Any other suggestions?
(I just got Shotgun Inferno .)
Hi stivep1, I used the Blackmagic design Ultrastudio Mini Monitor which is a thunderbolt to SDI/HDMI output box: bhpho.to/2HXCuiW
I'm not sure I understand your second question. I mount my standard SSD drives in the included ATOMOS caddies. I think you need to take your drives out of existing enclosures to put them in the ATOMOS caddy. Good luck!
ad1. I'm buying Mini Monitor.Thanks -
In 6:49 on the display inside DavinciResolve I see synchronized View if that what's on your Inferno o the right. Where in Resolve I need to be so I can see the same view? Is there any better interface you know about?
ad2. I have my SSD in Atomos caddy. Do I need to place this caddy into another bigger caddy so than it be placed in www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1192970-REG/g_technology_0g04547_g_dock_ev_solo_enclosure.html or
I directly slide it in. ?
1) Go to DaVinci Resolve->Preferences->Video and Audio IO. You can select the Mini Monitor here and it should display to the ATOMOS.
2) I don't know what the G-Dock requires but I would guess that it has its own caddy system. I simply use the USB sled that came with my ATOMOS recorder which is compatible with the ATOMOS caddies.
Curtis, what is the handle you are using? What is your Atomos attached to? Who makes that handle? I want something similar to throw on my Canon 1Dx mark ii, so I have a flexible way to manipulate my Shogun Inferno.
Hi Serge, that's the Varavon Zeus Uni camera cage: th-cam.com/video/cAwCMkiiKd0/w-d-xo.html
You'll want to check to the specs to make sure it can expand enough to fit around the 1Dx mkII.
Curtis Judd thank you sir
Can you also make a video about the codecs you use? I just bought a Ninja V and i can't figure out how to edit with them, with what codec to record, and what codec to use for rendering. I use davinci resolve as NLE.
I use ProRes HQ. When exporting, usually that will be to H.264 or H.265 depending on where you will send your video for viewing.
Hey Curtis, thanks for answering my question more thoroughly about why to buy an Atomos recorder! Something you didn't address was the fact that, even though the Atomos can record HDR, so many clients won't be able to view HDR content. That's what ultimately caused me not to purchase it. When do you think most people will have HDR-capable TVs/monitors?
Scott Himel I would mention you need to remember that the HDR functionality is not so much in what it can record for your client, but instead how you can view your image at time of capture. To output an REC2020 HDR luminance and colour space it is up to you to process the log image in post. The HDR function simply allows you to view a vibrant contrasty image while still judging exposure properly to take advantage of the full dynamic range of your camera.
TheTechnoPilot thx for reply. Yes, I grasp all that, but why do I care about HDR exposure unless I'm going to output a REC2020 file, which I'm not? We'll be lucky if by 2020 most people have HDR. Some will, but I think that we'll need more time before your average home is HDR ready.
Now, perhaps it makes sense to record HDR for more creative flexibility in post, but the head-shot videos I do don't require that much flexibility. Someone doing more action or nature stuff could benefit from that, I suppose.
Hi Scott, I generally don't shoot my interview and talking head clips with V-Log, but much of my b-roll is shot with V-Log and that's where the Atom HDR feature becomes really helpful at exposing correctly. I'm not finishing in HDR at this point, but I definitely like to ensure that I capture the least noise (which is critical with log exposure) and the most dynamic range which I then grade to SDR.This way I avoid most clipping issues (both highlights and shadows). I'm not sure when HDR will become something that most people have access to for viewing and consuming content, but I am a lot more excited about HDR than I was about 3D or than I am about VR or 8K. There seem to be more practical, meaningful applications for HDR than for 8K from my perspective.
Excellent reflections, Curtis. Most helpful! I've learned a lot from you over the course of the last year. You've also lowered my bank account a good bit with all the tech you feature, haha!
Brilliant as always. You called out NPF batteries, what about powered by a larger V-lock battery, shoulder rig? Any concerns doing that?
Works great with my original Shogun, an Anton Bauer Gold Mount and an NPF to d-tap dummy battery made specifically for the Atomos recorders.
Thank you for being such a responsive You Tuber! I had one more question.On the recorder, you have the Atomos HDR slider, which allows you to see how the image would appear on an HDR display. But aren't we still a few years away from most people having HDR displays? So my question is: What is the point of viewing in HDR if most people have SD displays? How the image appears on the Atomos display doesn't not affect your actual exposure, does it? In other words, for most situations, wouldn't you want to display without using the HDR slider? Otherwise, you are not really seeing what most people are going to see. You are only seeing what someone might see on an HDR screen or TV.
Thanks Flying High! Yes, that is a matter of some confusion. Even if you're not planning to finish your video in HDR, knowing whether your highlights are clipped is very helpful if you plan to grade and sculpt the final look of your video for SDR viewing. This allows you to prevent blown highlights or at least make calculated decision about how much of the highlights you're willing to clip to get the look you want.
Do you have a video where you go over the setup of mix pre 6 or 10t, ghx or other prosumer camera and atomos recorder? I come from a photography background and while I understand the main components I'm still fuzzy what cords plug into what sockets between the three devices
Hi Micah, I don't have a single video with all of this, but here's one walking through how to send audio from the MixPre to a GH5: th-cam.com/video/bsUeXtxsa50/w-d-xo.html
Once you've done that, then you just run an HDMI cable from the camera to the ATOMOS recorder. Best wishes!
I love the ease of editing from the ssd!
Me too!
I appreciate the executive summary at the beginning.
Thanks Jeremy. That was a lesson learned after plenty of feedback on previous episodes. :)
You think we can get an update to this? Maybe comparing the Ninja, Shogun, and BlackMagic Video Assist?
Good idea. The interesting thing is that with the newer cameras I've been using - Pocket 6K and Canon C70 - I haven't found a need for external recorders. But the story is still pretty much the same with the newer ATOMOS and BMD recorders: For smaller cameras, this adds a big screen, some very nice exposure tools, and some good recording codecs, especially if your camera can feed raw via HDMI.
@@curtisjudd gotcha thanks!
Another great, informative video as usual.
I have a question though: If you go straight from the SSD drive in ProRes 422 to the timeline, where is your backup? Don't you need an independent copy because otherwise you'll have to use the camera disk, correct?
+Red Dog Video good point. You can edit directly from the SSD you use in the recorder but usually I offload to either another external SSD when I’m mobile or to a raid unit when I’m at my edit room. I’d only edit from the recording SSD in a pinch and make backup copies of the footage first.
Great explanation about what matters and doesn’t matter.
Thanks Eric
Very helpful video thank you quick question I think I know the answer , if I purchase a shogun inferno that can record 4k60FPS - can I hook it up to a Sony A73 that only supports up to 4k 30 but record 4K60 from the Atomos?
Hi Tishawn, no, it needs a feed from the camera in 60p to record 60p.
@@curtisjudd thank you for responding so quickly! I figured I appreciate it!! I thought I could cheat the system lol thanks!
You can do a video explaining the HDR function more in detail? How to expose correctly, etc... I have the GH5 and the Ninja Inferno and I dont get the point...
+Titomixx yes! th-cam.com/video/ZRc0tOTBWuw/w-d-xo.html
great video! I also try to connect my shogun inferno trough a black magic studio mini monitor but with no succes? how did you do that ? greetings from Amsterdam
Hi Daniel, I used an SDI cable (BNC to BNC rated for 4K). It only works with certain apps, which you probably already knew. In this case I used Resolve.
Curtis Judd today i purchased a sdi cable bnc to bnc from the brand Shape. Didnt work for me 😩😩😩
Curtis Judd also on resolve
I'm sorry. I'm not sure how to fix that but definitely suggest contacting BMD and Atomos support. Best wishes!
I've been playing with the Ninja Flame and an A7iii. Where is a good place to really learn all the details of how to work with these recorders. Is there a course online dedicated to this subject? Really enjoyed the video! Thanks!!
Thanks Michael. Unfortunately I’m not aware of an online course. Manual is pretty decent. Best wishes!
Thanks! I Didn’t even realize that they had manuals on the website. DOE!! 🤪
That should help a lot!
Does the microphone jack, like in the Ninja 5 act as a camera mic jack? If it can it would really help me simplify my shoots
Hi J.R., I believe so I but I haven't tested the Ninja V yet. will cover that when we get a copy in for review.
Very well done, as always. Thumbs up.
Thanks!
would you suggest buying an atomos e.g. ninja v external recorder for an improvement in image quality for the a7iii? or would you rather just buy an atomos shinobi external monitor only?
Hi Valentine, it depends on your workflow. If you edit on a Mac, the fact that you can record to ProRes can make editing easier. But I'm not sure you'll see a massive improvement in video quality since I believe the Sony A7iii only outputs 8 bit 4:2:0 via its HDMI port. It is really more about the file formats (ProRes) and exposure tools and larger screen.
nice video. with 1 hour filming with prores. how much is the memory if you film with ssd
I use a 240GB drive
Nice video Curtis. I've always liked the look of these recorders, I somehow thought the were built a bit tougher. I think the Small HD stuff might be a bit tougher.
Hi Hugh, thanks! They're workable and I haven't broken either of mine yet despite all the mileage they have on them. But metal like they use on the Ninja II would be nice on the newer models.
Great video and very informative .
Thank you Curtis
Thanks rk.
Great review as always!
A quick question I cannot find the answer going through the Atomos manual pdf:
Can the Atomos display a flipped image horizontally and/or vertically (like a camera rotating lcd does) ?
and if yes, can this flipped image be outputted to an external display via hdmi?
Main use, for people in front of camera having a proper view of the frame.
Hi Evan, the screen can be flipped so that it can be used upside down. I'll need to check to see whether it flips the HDMI output signal. Good question!
Hi Curtis, I use the GH5 now in 2021 and perhaps soon the GH6. I use a high powered i9 editing station PC. Will pro res also play well on that? When I use the use 10 bit intra at 400 or the 10 bit Long-GOP my machines struggles big time. Trying to decide whether to get just the monitor or monitor/recorder. I've studied with Doug Jensen and I'm heading into the world of stock footage as I took his course. Considering the GH5 now shoots in 400 10bit 422 intra I'm wondering what is best. I'm a quality pixel peeping nut. I never buy anything ever without your reviews.
I don't know the status of ProRes playback on PCs and I think it depends on the editing app you use. I thought I heard that the PC version of Premiere Pro added back full ProRes support a couple of years ago, so should be good on that front. Also depends on the PC and the video card. Laptops will generally have a harder time than a similarly spec'd desktop.
Hi Curtis ! Nice to hear your thoughts ! What do you think to pair Atomos device with Sony A7Riii ? Cheers
Hi Ben! I don’t have a Sony A7Riii to test it here, but my friend shoots with an A7Sii and ATOMOS Shogun Inferno with great results.
Yep, another excellent video. Been a subscriber for a while, and i feel that i have learnt an awful lot from your channel.
My question... As a Blackmagic Pocket Cinema Camera user, i wondered if you have tried out the BM Video Assist models, and if so how do they compare to the Atomos?I guess the 7" model is the most similar to the Inferno, but it seems that it uses SD cards only... no SSD recording, which i guess is a bit of a minus point, now that, as you say, SSD prices have come down a lot.
Any thoughts?
Hi Tim, I haven't used the BMD Video Assist. I've been quite happy with my Ursa Mini Pro and appreciate what BMD does in terms of adding features via firmware. Will have to see if I can get my hands on one of the Video Assists...
Would be nice to hear your opinion if you do. Thinking about something along these lines, Although the BMPCC does record Prores and Raw, it is limited to SD cards. and the screen is small, too!
I'd second a comparison between the 4K video assist and the Atomos used with the GH5
Hi Curtis, can I ask what the internal sound recording quality is like vs mix pre3 - still trying to decide which route to go - option1: mix pre3 and a basic monitor. I find the a6300 screen quite tiny and of course it doesn't turn 180 for self recording. Open to suggestions on the basic monitor. Option 2: just get one of these ninja inferno and use the onboard sound.
I want to make a semi permanent setup at home with mkh50 mic I previously asked you about. Many thanks again, learning alot from you videos!
Hi Luke, sadly, I did not get to test the audio inputs on this while it was on loan, the breakout cable was not part of the kit, unfortunately. My guess is that it will not compare to a MixPre, but will be pretty decent when working with a condenser microphone that does not need a lot of gain. SmallHD makes nice monitors worth considering.
Curtis Judd Curtis Judd Thanks for the info - the small HD and Atomos only have $100 between them and seem to be a lot more features with Atomos. I was thinking of Atomos ninja flame paired with my a6300 and mix pre 3 but perhaps it’s overkill? I’m making video courses and TH-cam vids. Seems otherwise the “inferno” model and no mix pre as it has the Xlr option and the flame doesn’t...
Yes, both are good options with tradeoffs. The Atomos recorders burn through batteries. I find that I like to power them with big cine batteries (Sony V-lock or Anton Bauer) so that adds a lot of expense. Another downside is the fan in the Atomos recorders which means you need to keep the monitor away from the microphone. That's where the SmallHD has an advantage - no fan and much better on small batteries. I'm not trying to suggest you go one way or the other, but wanted you to know about the less obvious up and down sides to each. Good luck!
Curtis Judd Thank you , wish I read your reply beforehand - A friend picked me up the ninja flame so didn’t get to see it beforehand. Nice intuitive interface but boy was surprised that they didn’t include any of the tiny screws to fix the ssd into the caddy nor was there a cable to connect the ssd to laptop... and yes it’s very plasticy. Shame as I’m sure the production cost of a little metal and these other bits is next to nothing!
Hi again, just wondered if theres a beginners tutorial on how to set the settings on these - seems like you need to have some serious knowledge to get good results... Thank you
Mr Judd:
Great review on the recorders. I have been shooting with a canon xf405. It does record 4K 8 bit on sd cards, but has the option of using the sdi port to output 4:2:2 10bit. What im scratching my head about is will there be a difference. There is no log option, just MP4 or HAVC. Will I see a difference between 8 bit and the ten bit, with the log option?
Hi Bill, you will see a tiny difference in a few situations. Many people test this by shooting skies and looking for banding. But one thing some people get confused about is thinking that 10-bit will extend the dynamic range of their camera (it will not).
@Johnathon Frumdehood Panasonic GH5 and GH5S? It is my understanding that they will deliver 4:2:2 10-bit via their HDMI outputs.
Hey curtis what is the attachment called that you are using from your camera to your monitor?
Friction arm?
Great and informative video.
Thanks John.
Hello excellent video I have an inferno I use it in a video clip and I have noise in the image that can cause this
Hi Diego, usually noise comes from the camera unless the HDMI cable has gone bad. Almost always it is the camera set at a very high ISO.
Thank you so much for sharing your knowledge and experiences! Big fan of your TH-cam channels and online course, and have learned a lot from you while preparing to move into doing videography in addition to my photography. Have you tried using an Atomos and MixPre together, with timecode over HDMI from the camera? I am contemplating on getting an Atomos Ninja V, and am wondering whether the timecode signal from my camera will come through to the HDMI output on the Atomos, so I can plug that into the MixPre.
Hi Michael, thanks! I borrowed the Ninja for the review so I don’t have it to confirm. I have my older Shogun and the MixPre does not receive timecode from it so I’m not sure whether it will work with the Ninja V. You might contact ATOMOS support to see if they have tested this combination. Good luck!
Curtis Judd Thanks for replying! I’ll see if Atomos support can help me.
I'm actually use a canon 60D for all my works... I'm thinking of buying a monitor recorder, but I do not know which one. Black Magic Video assist or Atomos (but i dont know which... Ninja, Blame, inferno...). Geart work with you content!! Helps me a lot :)
Hi Rick, thanks! One note, I’m not sure that the 60D is capable of sending a full resolution, clean feed via HDMI so recording and monitoring of the HDMI signal doesn’t work very well, unfortunately. The 60D is a good camera, one that I used and loved for several years. But unfortunately a little older and doesn’t support clean HDMI feeds. Good luck!
Curtis Judd Thanks for the feedback :)
Is there an SD version of this device that can record from composite video sources? I saw the ClearClick ones on amazon but I want something a little more professional. Maybe an HD one but can record from analog sources. I don't care about 4k.
There isn't from ATOMOS as far as I'm aware. Not sure about other manufacturers. Sorry about that.
Great video once again! I actually had no idea you could use an Atomos recorder as a grading monitor with Resolve. How does this work? I suppose you just connect the Mac to it via HDMI out, but then what? What do you need to do in OS X display settings and/or Resolve? It would be great if you could shed some light into how it's done.
I have a Ninja Blade, and if I were to calibrate it with an i1Display Pro, do you think the screen on it would be good enough to be used like this?
If you could make a video about this topic, would be awesome!
Yes, will cover that in an upcoming episode. It does require a Thunderbolt hardware monitoring converter from Blackmagic Design or similar. I use the BMD Ultrastudio Mini Monitor: bhpho.to/2v8EWz6 Strangely, it only works via SDI. Couldn't get the HDMI to work but I think that's a Blackmagic issue, not an Atomos issue. More to come.
Hi Curtis, great video! I can see you reply to most if not all messages I hope you have a change to reply to mine too. I am quite new to cinematography, I love cinema and currently reading for codecs, containers and more. You said “you get much better codecs”. So, if I have a cheap dslr like D5100, or better a D610 and get atomos to record 10bit 422 Chroma subsampling prores? I don’t understand if the bit depth, the Chroma subsampling and the codec is is up to the censor the camera or the recording media. If the last one is true, then we never record to our camera again and just buy an atomos. Right?
Hi, the ProRes or DNxHR codecs have a few advantages. One is that they can support greater bit depth and color information but that will not make much of a difference when the camera only feeds 8-bit 4:2:2 (like the D610). However, they can capture more information for each frame which can help when shooting action. Despite their much larger size, these codecs also play back smoothly during editing which is also very helpful. And of course the Atomos recorders have the tools to help with exposure, focus, and composition (I can see issues on a 7 in screen that I cannot see on a 2-3 in screen). I hope that helps and best wishes!
I have V-Loc Batteries for LED lighting so am curious what you're using to power the display and camera on your rig at 1:24. I've seen the Lanpart but it's $$$.
That's my frankenstein rig with includes the Zacuto DSLR base plate (which they no longer make), the Zacuto Zwiss plate II, and the Indi-Pro Tools d-tap to GH5 dummy battery adapter.
Zwiss Plate V2: bhpho.to/2Aa5I91 (will also need a battery plate for V-lock - in my case I have the Anton Bauer plate)
Indi-Pro Tools Adapter: bhpho.to/2zyzWGm
Curtis Judd thanks!
Are these Atomos recorders compatible with some old DSLRs, for instance, Canon T3i? I think this might be a good and affordable solution in order to extend the video capabilities of this camera, but I have my doubts about if it actually works.
Thanks in advance.
Hi Óscar, I don't have a T3i on hand to confirm, but my understanding is that many of the older Canon DSLRs do not output full HD and don't output a clean feed. Probably best to check the camera compatibility page at www.atomos.com/cameras or you might contact ATOMOS support to confirm. Best wishes!
Great video!!! Thanks for sharing. Does the Shogun allow you to use custom luts as well?
Thanks! Yes it does.
@@curtisjudd Awesome! Thanks.
please talk about audio connections - I have a Diety mic that will not work with the Ninja V - drag
Ok.
@@curtisjudd thank you - looking forward to it - you do such a good job
As always, great video with so much useful info. And I see that you use the old-fashioned, but always effective, rubber-band trick for panning,...NICE! ;-)
+Omar Patin haha! Yes, still a great technique for smoothing out this pans!
Without question!. I use it all the time. My tripod cases always have a spare ration of rubber bands !
I was wondering about audio on the Ninja Inferno. I saw your audio review of the Shogun that you did, but I haven't seen anyone do a review on the Ninja Inferno's audio yet and was wondering if you thought it was a good option rather than using my H4n Pro with Rode NTG4+? Thanks!
+Adam Rickman hi Adam, unfortunately the review unit did not come with the mic breakout cable so I was not able to test the Ninja's preamps. I would except about the same performance as the original Shogun which was decent sound but not particularly clean. I still use external audio recorders.
Curtis Judd I was going to assume that. Thanks so much for your reply and help!
Hey Curtis! This video prompted me to grab a Ninja Flame... Do you find these recorders to be loud... Mine always has a low fan hum that is audible in a quiet room.
Hey Peter, yes, there is definitely a fan that can be heard though I haven’t had any issues with my mics picking it up at typical working distances (5-6 feet away).
Curtis Judd thanks! Was worried I got dud :-)
I am going to coin the term "Judd Format". That's where a presenter talks just a bit fast ( Three cappuccinos ? ) and gives a brief info packed summary up front, THEN more detail in the following video. I sure hope that catches on across TH-cam. Thanks !!
Haha! Thanks John!
Great video! I particularly liked learning about the codec options and how they equate to smooth editing, even in UHD. My question would be: which Atomos, and which codec do you recommend for UHD on the older GH4? Cheers!
Hi Ben, I usually shot with the ProRes 422 codec when I was shooting the GH4. You can bump it up to HQ for super critical clips, but I almost always found 422 to be plenty.
Thanks, Curtis!
Curtis,
As always your videos provide amazing quality and useful information to me. I know may be asking a bit much, but I think someone with your expertise could really assist me in making a decision.
I have $5000 that is budgeted for the rest of 2017 for film equipment. Currently a7rii is my A-Cam and Rx10ii us my B-Cam. I mainly shoot Interviews, short form Doc, for my own channel and run & run in 4K. I'm deciding between an Ursa Mini 4.6k and an FS5. (Why you ask? I'm looking to push into higher budget work and need the pose value of a larger camera.) As I know you do a lot of work in this area have you found that shooting with smaller Mirrorless Cameras GH5 etc, DSLRs limits you or your potential clientele? I apologize if this is too much to ask.
Hi Noir Et Blanc Vie, Not too much to ask at all. To some extent yes, but only for cases where the potential askers don't know anything else about you or your work. It isn't a complete make or break kind of factor for getting jobs. In my experience, getting jobs has a lot more to do with gaining the confidence of clients and fellow filmmakers and word of mouth. Mostly relationships.
That being said, I'm quite happy with my kit which includes a GH5 and Ursa Mini Pro. I will say that shooting in raw is something I rarely do, even with the Ursa simply because for paid jobs, it usually isn't necessary and adds a fair bit of time to the post workflow. The ProRes footage, on the other hand, makes my post workflow very smooth and quick. I don't believe that is possible on the FS5 without an external recorder.
The only experience I have with the FS5 was editing some FS5 long GOP HD footage in Final Cut Pro about 18 months ago. FCPX and that codec didn't work very well together back then - lots of funky torn frames which meant I couldn't always cut where I wanted/needed. I don't know if either party has made changes to fix that but it was a rather frustrating experience. I only mention that in case you use a similar workflow and not to discourage you from buying an FS5. There are lots of happy FS5 owners out there. :)
Good luck!
Wow Curtis, thank you so so much for your thoughts. I think I'll go with the 4.6k as my workflow is very similar to yours, I shoot ProRes to my Atomos and Vid Assist 4k and well an all in one solution like the 4.6k will be great. Now I just need an extra $1000 for all the accessories LOL.
Hi Curtis, what's a great video. Thank you for the video. I use Sony A7r3 as the my main camera. Is the Atomos Ninja Inferno suit to me, or you have a better choice, base on your experience? Thanks a lot!
Hi James, yes, the Ninja Inferno is a great fit for the A7RIII. Good luck!
Dear Curtis, great review! Thank you again! I just saw another review about Sony Alpha 7 and Atomos Shogun and they were telling that you will get a different - much less quality signal - if you start the recording via the Shogun record button. They they you have to start the record on the Sony Alpha 7 to get the high quality signal.... which sounds strange to me....... Do you have any recommendations? Thank you!
Hi Till, I’m not familiar with the recent Sony alpha line. You might try their tech support for clarification on how the HDMI signal changes when you press record from the camera.
That rubber tip just made my pans better 😊 thnak you :)
Haha, yeah, that's one I believe I picked up from +RayOrtega years ago. Pretty handy idea.
It is an AWESOME IDEA!,...so useful !
Thanks for the review. Do you find the the calibration with the iOne Display Pro was effective? I'm debating over the cost of the expensive cable that Atomos sells that is required to calibrate with.
Regarding the case, yep, its a bit lightweight, but that helps cuts down on the overall weight of the product. I use a SmallRig 1788 cage for mine, as I've read that the plastic around 1/4x20 screw mount can crack. It doesn't add a lot of weight, but does offer some additional protection as well as lots of mounting points (1/4x20, 3/8" and Nato rails).
Hi Dave, the calibration seemed effective enough to ensure the colors are in the right ballpark so I can make decent decisions while shooting. On the other hand, the monitor wasn’t far off out of the box. Hard to say whether it is worth the expense of the cable. I’d probably test without first to see if you’re happy with how well the footage does in post where you can assess whether your copy is preventing you from getting the results you need.
All my camera monitors are somewhat off from the results I have in post, and I'm not certain that my Shogun Inferno is actually more accurate than my cameras. The contrast is somewhat lifted in the shadows compared to my cameras and when working in post. The lifted shadows helps see detail, but skews my perception of the image. Lowering the brightness doesn't really help, as the entire contrast moves with it and by the time the shadows look accurate the highlights are flat and lack detail. I guess what I should do is hook up the Inferno to my computer via my BlackMagic DeckLink card and see how that compares.
Good call. When I talked with some of the ATOMOS guys at NAB earlier this year, they seemed to soften on the suggestion that these monitors are up to the task of color/contrast critical grading work. My sense is that the color is decent but that the calibration process is not the same as you would expect on color critical grading monitors.
I didn't mean to imply that I'm not happy with the image quality of my Shogun Inferno, but rather to see if calibrating it will make it more accurate. I think its a great piece of kit and don't have much to complain about.
FWIW, if you were to ask a professional colorist, most would cringe at the idea of using the Inferno for critical color grading in favor of an expensive Flanders Scientific monitor. That said, I think we're quite fortunate with the monitors that are available to use for shooting, compared to what was available 5 or 6 years ago.
8:57 - Using a rubber band for a smooth pan = mind blown!!!
🤯
hi, i have video camera i.e sony FDR AX 100 , can you suggest me which model of atomos best for my camera , so i can shoot 4k in 60p . thanks
Hi Ajay, the ATOMOS Ninja V is able to record 4k UHD 60p if the Sony outputs that via its HDMI output port: bhpho.to/2GXbUoH
Useful video as always. Thanks. I've noticed some pretty nasty motion artifacts in the GH4/GH5 cameras where even moderately fast subjects will produce a strobing/smearing motion blur effect as they move across the frame. It's generally accepted that this is a codec limitation issue. Even though the GH5 400mbs All-I update may solve this, I'm still seriously considering an external recorder. Curtis, I wonder if you have noticed a clear improvement regarding this specific strobing artifact when using the Atomos.
Hi Heathcliff, I haven't done any formal tests with the GH5 and motion, but I have definitely seen such issues with other lower bit-rate footage from other cameras in the past. I'll endeavor to do that next time I find myself in a situation where I can.
Thanks Curtis. In my experience, the effect is most noticeable (certainly emotionally) when performers (actors/dancers) wipe frame - the motion effect resembles a momentary drop in frame rate, say 25fps to 15, although it has nothing to do with frame rates directly. As I said, it's probably the Long GOP codec struggling to handle movement in 4K. Pretty nasty and it can take you out of the emotional moment. Thanks again.
That makes sense and I will be interested to see how the All-I codec manages this. Should be at least somewhat more effective.
Hey Curtis, great video.
Do you still think the Ninja 2 is worth buying? They are so cheap now and I am trying to find a way to lose the recording limit and (mainly) eliminate overheating on my a6000. I have read (and thanks for confirming) it isn't anything great as a monitor but just as an external recorder do you still think it would be worth buying?
Sure, I think so.
I bought one for my D800 several months ago for the same recording limit situations (I record oral histories). It's been great! It is a crappy monitor visually but the finished video is excellent. I use the Prores LT codec with a Windows PC running Adobe Premiere CS6 and edits very smoothly.
Hi Curtis. So if you record Vlog footage through something like ProRes 4444 or HQ, how much more latitude in grading will that give you in post? I know that's a "how long is a piece of string" question, but would you say you're able to do heavy post work with a GH5 and an external ProRes recorder like this? What I love about my Ursa Mini is that I can go bananas in post and the image doesn't break apart. I'm interested in a GH5 with one of these (or BM 4k assist), but am unsure how far I can push things when needed. Thanks!
Hi Douglass, The ProRes codecs and the GH5's internal codec (currently 150Mbps) do the same in terms of color subsampling and bit depth. In my practical, subjective opinion, I'm not seeing a lot of difference there. The main difference seems to be relate more to movement in the frame and artifacting as a result of that movement. And as noted, I find the ProRes footage some much more pleasant to work with from the standpoint that it plays back quite smoothly.
From my subjective point of view, I noticed that a bigger factor in getting more color volume, which gives you more latitude to grade in post, is to ensure that your exposure is spot-on. Color volume is essentially the product of getting your exposure optimized for the log profile and capturing more color information (in this case 4:2:2, 10-bit). A big part of the reason I find the newest Atomos recorders helpful is that they have the tools to help me fine-tune the exposure to optimize color volume.
So it isn't just a matter of the codec giving us more room in post, but a combination of the codec and exposure optimizing tools which give us that additional latitude.
Now all that said, I still don't find that the GH5 and Ninja Inferno produce footage in the same league as my Ursa Mini Pro in terms of post latitude. But I do think that the combination Panasonic/Atomos is quite good for the size and money.
Thanks Curtis. I agree, nailing exposure is key. Especially for skin tones. These days when I grade, I barely touch my skin tones (apart from temperature shifting) and treat everything else around it. Over/under expose skin tones in camera, and no codec will make it easy to recover the subtleties of the flesh tones that make up a great image. Even raw.
Sounds like ProRes is just a smoother codec to work with in post (especially on Apple systems). The GH5 really does look like a great all-round second camera, but I must say I'm not in love with the sharpness of the sensor and the robotic motion-cadence. The Sony a7x series have some great points, but overall I find the image looks a bit too muddy and is subject to banding all to easily. All this is a long-winded way of me saying I'm still waiting for a great 4k DSLR to hit the market.
Totally agree on that! Same in the $4000 to $10000 space, though we're seeing a lot more options there and they're getting pretty good, but only for pro-level owner/operators.
Hi,
I have a question. Why they give me some plastic master caddies? Are these plastic caddies only for protection?
Yes, and to help them lock in a bit more securely than just the drive would on its own.
Hi, would it do any justice having a Ninja Blade on a c100 markii? I'll be picking up a ninja blade for $350 tomorrow night but I just don't want to be making a mistake.
Yes, you can record to ProRes which I prefer working with in post
Hi Curtis. We have the 30 minutes limitation with the gh4 here in Europe. Will the addition of the atomos overcome that issue?
Hi Alejandro, the ATOMOS will record for as long as you have power and drive space. You'll just need to keep the camera from going to sleep.
@@curtisjudd thank you very much. You are doing a great job with your channel.
How much latency is there between th camera and the monitor? I need near instant display on the monitor of what the camera is seeing.
Hi Jeremy, with HDMI, there is always latency with the cameras I’ve used. 4 frames is pretty common in my experience. It seems to mostly be on the camera end of the signal chain.
@Johnathon Frumdehood Agreed, for those who can afford a cine camera. Those working professionally, definitely. For those not, where time and retakes are not an issue, this is a way to get by.
Great video Curtis! Very Informative
I've been seriously considering an external recorder, as I would love to record pro res 4.2.2
Unfortunately my camera only outputs 8bit and I shoot mostly run and gun so weight is an issue
Still undecided, but great video none the less.
Thanks!
Awesome review, does it work with taping on record screen to focus the area you want? just to avoid touching the camera especially when it's on gimple, I use Canon 1DX Mii, Thanks
Hi, no focusing is still done with camera controls, not with the ATOMOS recorder.
I just got a new Atomos Ninja V and I was able to record and playback on Ninja and was able to hear the audio, so I took the Sony ssd disk out from the Atomos and plugged it on my Mac and tried to play the mov file and was not able to hear the sound, do you know what could have caused that.. Is there a way I should record in Atomos ? Thanks for your assistance
Hi Pradeep, if the sound is recorded to channels 2 or higher, it won't necessarily play back unless you import the file into a video editing app or DAW. If that doesn't solve it, may be best to contact ATOMOS support. Best wishes!
Great video, Curtis. Thanks. Not sure if you're still tracking this video / comment thread. But thought I'd give it a shot. I have a Ninja Flame working from the HDMI out on a C100, Mk II. Works great. I have a requirement for a second "just a monitor" monitor, at a different viewing angle. I bought a SmallHD Focus for that purpose. The Focus runs great direct out of the C110, M II HDMI out, but will not run when "daisy chained" through the Ninja Flame separate HDMI In/Out ports. In other words, HDMI out of the C100 to the Ninja Flame HDMI In (via one of the ATOMOS hi-end HDMI cable). And then HDMI out from the Flame to HDMI In on the Focus. I have Google'd extensively for the answer on why this doesn't work (Focus screen just fitzes like an old analog CRT TV.) I'm sure its a setting on either the Flame or the Focus, but I can't figure it out. Thoughts? Many thanks. Keep up the great work.
Hi John, that’s a situation I haven’t encountered, to be honest. I’d probably contact ATOMOS support. Good luck!
Thanks for the reply. Will do. I did contact SmallHD, thinking they could tell me what type of HDMI signal their device needed to see, but no luck. I'll go the other direction to the ATOMOS folks. All the best, John
I hope they're able to help, John. Good luck!
Spot on as usual. great insights
Thanks Njoroge!
Can this device extend record time for cameras that have 30 minutes recording limit??
Yes
I'm looking for a monitor for the DJI Ronin. I use a Canon 5D Mark 3 and I wanted to know if a Atomos would be a good choice? I want a small monitor. I dont really mind recording through the Atomos. I just want to be able to watch what im doing when filming with my 5D. I'm looking for a monitor thats under 7 inches in length.
+Filmer the SmallHD focus or one of their other small monitors are worth considering. Here’s also a less robust but much less expensive 5” monitor we reviewed: th-cam.com/video/Cel8qLVSD7Q/w-d-xo.html
Great video! I have a question .I always shoot on 24p and I'm not interested for the 50p. On my GH5 i can record 4K DCI on 4:2:2 10-bit at ALL-Intra codec. Is this codec inferior to ProRes or same ? And if is the same (my opinion is that is the same) what the need to spend 1295$ to buy atomos shogun inferno when smallHD FOCUS costs just 500$ and makes the same job?
Hi Vasilis, there are other factors as well. ProRes is a much better codec for editing - it plays back much more smoothly without needing to transcode. Also, there are several very useful exposure tools in the Atomos, also affordable SSD storage. A much larger and brighter screen is also very useful. Not everyone needs an Atomos recorder, but they provide a lot of value beyond just image quality of the codec.
Thanks for the detailed overview, it helped me a lot ! I think I'm gonna go with Atomos Ninja Inferno to pair with my GH5.
Thanks Alex! I hope you find it as useful as I have!
Hi,
I have the Fz2000 and I'm looking to buy the Ninja Inferno. The camera says it has 10bit 422 HDMI output, which is nice. But won't the 100mbps just break the image anyway since that's a lot of compression? Or is the Ninja Inferno recording some kind of clean uncompressed signal?
Thank you for the video. It cleared some things up for me. :)
Hi, the HDMI output isn't encoded into a codec when it comes out of the camera so you can use any of the high bitrate codecs in the Ninja. In short, you're good, just crank up to the biggest codec you find makes a difference on the Ninja. Good luck!
Thank you so much Curtis. Panasonic, nor any of the retailers, could give me any information on this. They said "maybe...I...I think so?". Again, thank you so much.
Hi Chris, enjoy your vids. My ninja flame is flickering whilst recording. is this just an issue with mine? or common on the atomos products
+David Paul Anthony hey David, I haven't experienced that on the Shogun or Ninja. Sounds like it might be your copy. Hopefully the Atomos guys can take care of that for you. Best wishes
so, i have a need to record college classes and was hoping to use the combination of the nikon D3300 and the Atmos ninja 2. my recordings do not have to be stellar. I just need to capture viewable video and decent sound. Are there any setting combinations that will get me at least a good video?
Yes, you'll just want to make sure the HDMI output on the D3300 is set to clean (so that none of the control information is sent to the HDMI out) and that it is set to 100% coverage (for some reason, some of the Nikon DSLRs thought it would be clever to have a setting where it only covered 95% of the full HD resolution).
I am thinking to get the Atomos Ninja V+ for my Sony A7SIII
Could be a useful tool.
This may be a stupid question, but... can the GH5 currently send a 400 mbps signal to an Atomos recorder? Or will that require the upcoming GH5 patch?
Hi Brian, not a bad question at all. The GH5 sends an HDMI signal. I'm not sure what the bitrate is in HDMI terms but then the recorder encodes the signal at high bitrates (depending on the codec/level you configure). So I have to assume that it is the equivalent of about 400Mbps.
How are you using it as an external monitor, just hooking it up to your graphics card via HDMI?
I've read that there is an issue with Sony cameras and S-Log over HDMI which is putting me off at the moment (no problems with SDI). That along with fan noise and I'd also like to see them put an actual 10bit panel in them instead of 8+2 FRC panels.
Useful vid as usual though Curtis, appreciate the time you put into this and also answering a lot of the comments you get.
Hi Jon, I'm feeding the signal from Resolve with the Blackmagic Ultrastudio Mini Monitor: bhpho.to/2v8EWz6 I used the SDI feed to my Shogun. Since the original Shogun's panel is only 8 bit, it isn't something I rely on too heavily but I am thinking of adding the Shogun Inferno or Sumo for that. (incidentally, the HDMI feed from the Ultrastudio to the Shogun and Ninja Inferno didn't work but I think that's a Blackmagic Design issue).
I'm curious about the 8+2 FRC vs true 10 bit issue. Bram Desmot from Flanders Scientific said that 8+2 FRC is just as good as true 10 bit. I'd like to learn more about that.
Yeah, it seems hard to find information regarding 8+2FRC and 10bit. One of my current monitors I've had for a couple of years is 8+2 though I'm pretty it won't support HDR content or any of the HDR standards. It doesn't have HDMI 2 either. Speaking of which the price of the Atomos HDMI 2 cables and also the calibration cable are a bit steep!
I'm not in a position to move to 4K at this time and have been considering getting a Ninja Star. I didn't know if you've used one, but my impression is that it's basically a Ninja 2 without a screen. Do you happen to know if that would be accurate?