Idk I think RDJ Doom was a great idea. It’s WAYY better than Superior Ironman. They were ALWAYS going to bring RDJ back. This is a way they can do it better.
Tbh my hope was that somehow we would get council of dooms off the council of kangs anyway, it shows how destructively powerful dooms are in a good light.
I think most people were more annoyed with HOW Kang was being used AND the cast that they were going to feature w/ the Avengers. alot o f C and D rated characters INSTEAD of relying on their Big Hitters
Not every "Big Bad" needs to be set up 5 years in advance and teased in 37 movies before they finally get their chance to shine. I'm perfectly fine with 2 or 3 Doom teases before Doomsday, a year in advance.
@WawaMarvel they definitely should've just gotten a brand new actor for Doom. This would've been a strong introduction to establish his presence and then he can stick around for years after with an already respected status
Not an original idea from me, but others have suggested Doom take the power of Loki. Loki is already established and he’s literally holding the multiverse together. Here, there’s no need to introduce another character.
Fewer new characters they introduce the better. They have too many characters with too many powers and no character development. Because that is the very definition of *bad comic book* which is what the MCU is becoming.
I think it's a possibility that deadpool could take the place of the molecule man. Think about it they have a deadpool in every universe right and almost all of them are hard to kill , aside from nice pool lol. I think that could work using pool as a bomb some how.
@GoldGrub3201 how would that work, though???? Molecule man's powers are the entire reason for the incursions in the comics, Deadpool isn't really that big of a part in the Multiverse besides the "Deadpool kills the marvel universe" comic story
Well, I love both, Jonathan Majors as Kang the Conqueror, He Who Remains, Victor Timely, Immortus, Rama Tut, Scarlet Centurion and all their variants and Robert Downey Jr as Iron Man and Doctor Doom. Also Josh Brolin as Thanos and James Spader as Ultron.
This is a good idea for a good buildup. Thanos worked because he was a great character and there was buildup and mystery to the infinity stones too. We need Doom to pop in from time to time and give weight to who he is, what he’s doing and add mystery to what’s coming. This is how The Infinity Saga worked and that can work with anything
The BIGGEST problem this Saga faces is the LACK of STORYTELLING. Yes the You basically only seen Thanos in Infinity War BUT he was talked about numerous scenes and the real story was about the Stones which were featured throughout the ENTIRE Saga. This saga there has only been minimal story telling regarding Time travel/ Multiverse. We have gotten a few Stories on the topic BUT not a understanding of what the Story is suppose to be and i am not sure that they are giving eachother enough time( meaning Movies and shows) to actually explain what is going on and what will happen. I strongly beleive if they atleast show alittle bit of Kang and his immediate Fall it will help explain ALOT and allow that Connective tissue to continue on throughout this Storied Saga
And that's the problem and I am hoping they know this and is trying to wrap this saga up the best way the can for the story and for a monetary reason. So that way going forward we can have a decent mutant saga
The introduced so many characters and tried to end the saga in fewer years compared to last one , fast tracked many shows and worst of all they had only planned about kang and nothing else that's why only loki looked great , rubbish writers who emphasized more on forced modern narratives were the main reason as well
_The BIGGEST problem this Saga faces is the LACK of STORYTELLING_ yes, but whose fault is that? It's not McFeely in the Russo's it Rick and Morty (Loveness and Waldron) and their hack writing. when you're in a whole stop digging. they aren't going to waste time and movies trying to 'fix' the broken phase 4 and 5. they will tell their own story. i say - let them, and stop trying to find a way to fix kang and tva and everybody forgot Peter never mind Flash wrote a book about him, (books magically disappear with your simple forget me spell? sure also the dead speak, cuz Palpatine Lives, and Rey is really a Skywalker now cause nothing has to make sense as along as your audience is dumb)
Fr. All marvel gotta do this summer is drop an RDJ as Victor Von Doom or as Dr. Doom post credit scene in F4: First Steps - get the people talking, then introduce again in Doomsday 10 months later
Honestly, if Doom is going to be in it (and he is), they should do a scene where Doom wipes out The Council Of Kangs. That way, one unfinished plot line is closed.
No Kang. Kang is already dead. If Loki rules the multiverse and there is no mention of Kang by the TVA - then there is no need to keep Kanging. You guys - most of you - are not facing the fact that the Russos were brought back PRECISELY BECAUSE that story failed, but you keep asking them to revisit. Just foolish. It's just like asking James Gunn to complete the story of Darkseid in the Snyderverse. lol. How much cope do you have to be on to not realize that that story - is dead.?
@@summertyme5748honestly makes zero sense, marvel spend multiple movies and series building up to Kang being the big bad and now he’s just dead with no explanation it ruins marvel’s continuity which is what we came to love about the infinity saga otherwise it makes a huge part of phase 4-5 basically pointless
They have like 4 or 5 movies coming out between now and Doomsday. Tease Doom in like 2 or 3 of those, and bada-bing bada-boom, Dooms set up. What's this issue?
Secret Wars is a Doom story, it never was about Kang. Kang story flopped. Comment in this thread are just cope: *Let’s pretend QuantumMania wasn’t a shix show.* But that doesn’t work when you lose the studios money, and embarrass everyone associated.
@@jadenrobinson1561exactly they dont got 10 years like they did to build up thanos. they need to start throwing doom some end credits at the very least so it doesnt feel like zero set up or like a one movie set up.
The casual fan doesn’t know Dr doom and his story. Even I don’t know his story besides whatever that was in the first F4 movie which I don’t even remember
@@jadenrobinson1561Exactly. Us fans know who he is and have the excitement, but to get true results and earn viewers, they need to appeal to the casual moviegoer too. Build him up and get them (and by extension, us too) invested and excited
While I will always love Avengers: The Kang Dynasty starring Jonathan Majors, who really gets me excited for his portrayal of Kang, I am also hugely fascinated by Avengers: Doomsday starring Robert Downey Jr. as Doctor Doom. Each has something unique to offer, and while I feel connected to Kang’s story, I can’t help but enjoy what Downey Jr. brings to the table as Doctor Doom. Both are must-watch movies for MCU fans.
I love Both ideas as well BUT its how the MCU was fumbling with Kang AND the cast of Heros that NOBODY WANTED OR LIKED! What Disney has been tryign to feature was the Problem. Ms marvel, Capt Marvel, and even Sam WIlson as Cap. NOBODY wanted that or atleast nobody wanted them as the Featured Cast and i think thats were things began to fall apart and after Antman Failed Because it WAS a HORRIBLE movie for Kang and others they pivoted. I personally wished they still featured Kangs Storyline b/c i was a HUGE FAN of LOKI
@ I completely understand your point. I agree that the MCU has had some issues with certain creative decisions over the past few years, especially how they handled Kang in Ant-Man and the Wasp: Quantumania. As a Loki fan, I also wished Kang had more solid development and that his story was presented in a way that truly captured his complexity. However, I think part of the problem lies in how audiences perceive new heroes. While characters like Ms. Marvel, Captain Marvel, and Sam Wilson as Cap have their detractors, there is also an audience that appreciates and connects with them, especially for what they represent in terms of diversity and new stories. I agree that both The Kang Dynasty and Doomsday have incredible potential. I hope Marvel finds a balance and manages to deliver memorable stories that enrich the universe and excite fans, whether it's with Kang, Doom, or any other character. In the end, we all want the MCU to continue surprising us.
I think doom becomes god emperor doom by stealing the beyonders powers or the watchers powers. In doomsday, we get a backstory of this version of Dr. Doom. I think after those powers are then taken away from him and givin to someone good that'll fix everything. Favorite Hero: Batman
I completely understand the concern. Doomsday and Secret Wars feels like a giant conclusion to an enjoyable but messy saga that was the Multiverse. They have a lot to set up. However, on the positive side, the MCU thrives on making things work on the fly. Thanos was a cameo, a literal Easter egg from the director of the first Avengers and Marvel had to make it work. Mind you, Thanos also had about what 5 minutes maybe less of screen time between phases 2 and 3. But Marvel sold it and infinity war and endgame were amazing. Igor is back as CEO and Kevin feige has his control again. They'll pull it off
Theory sounds good Wanda still needs to be punished for killing people though lmao if that gets treated as water under the bridge I think it’ll be a huge joke
There’s too much scatter-brained things going with the MCU’s manner to which they’re trying to make their movies make sense … I mean come on now, there’s source material in the comic books to help them! And right now with REAL origin film for Dr Doom it’s just going to be a sh.t show!!!! I hope not 🙏🏾🙏🏾🙏🏾
How bout if Doom was the person that the One Who Remains was referring to, and he was the one keeping Doom trapped in the F4 universe. Doom gets to the TVA and takes it over along with defeating Loki.
You're also making an assumption to think he will be debuted in Doomsday. Many people are speculating at least a tease, possibly even a post-credit RDJ cameo to be in Fantastic Four.
F4 have to show doom in some capacity and basically introduce him and in doomsday focus ij showing how from being villian he rose to power and become a god like veing at the end of the being has to be a long ass story focusing greatly on doom , they can cover his origin story in the flashbacks in secret wars
The only reason anyone will see this will be because we can finally get on with what we all actually wanted: X-Men, FF, a real Spider-Man (no Stark Jr) and Daredevil films. In 2019, NO ONE WANTED SHANG-CHI, DIET JLA ETERNALS, BLACK WIDOW, WONDER MAN, ETC.
I mean they already had a big bad for the multiverse saga that they were building up like Thanos that was Kang and all his variants but they decided to walk away from that
What would be cool is if Doctor Doom is an anchor being of his universe and galactus destroys it because of the fantastic four so he blames the tva , watchers and beyonder (loki) and decides to set out travelling the multiverse destroying worlds and anchor beings in order to get the tva and lokis attention and then comes to the sacred timeline with his own multiversal variants of heroes and villains that he manipulated on the way to beat everyone up, kill the anchor being of that timeline and then all worlds come colliding and doom finds his way into the tva and steals the watchers powers, then lokis powers and destroys every world universe and timeline and creates a new world in the void whivh some heroes survive and land on years later because of reed richards and his multiveral raft only to find out doom is now in charge leading to Avengers Secret Wars taking place on the void now known as battleworld
Just let the Russo Brothers write their story - and jettison as much of the phase 4 and 5 stuff as possible. I think that's what will happen anyway. Phase 4 and 5 MCU is almost as bad as Snyderverse DC. So much garbage writing and contradiction can never be solved. For example no one expects James Gunn to explain where Wonder Woman was when Zod invaded earth - or how come Martin Manhunter was 'here all the time', did nothing, but then shows up at the end of SnyderCut, fronting off like he's someone cool. It's obvious that Snyder is just desperately trying to claim more IP so he can destroy that too. lol. Same with MCU - There can never be an explanation of Janet Van Dyne hanging out with Kang for 30 years - not mentioning - then sending Scott into the Quantum to get healing particles for Ghost and not warning him. *And don't even get me started on Dr. Strange and Nerd from 199999* (it's - just - bad - writing) The whole Kang TVA story is as dead as the Snyderverse because it was horribly written makes no sense, and so can't be fixed via retcon.
That's a huge problem in this Phase, we have no direction whatsoever since Jonathan Majors aka Kang got fired. No build ups no nothing.. we the hardcore fans will watch but the casual will understand nothing. I mean we all know the new big bad will be Doom but this no buld up Phase is killing Marvel's Box Office.. I just hope it gets going soon rather than too late and out of nowhere.
I totally agree. Jonathan Majors' firing left a huge void, especially with all the potential Kang had as the central villain of the phase. There's no clear direction, and even though we know Doom is going to be the next big villain, the lack of buildup is affecting the connection with fans, especially the more casual ones. Hopefully Marvel will get their act together soon, because if they put it off until later, it's going to be hard to get people hooked like they used to. The box office is paying the price for not having a solid plot to guide everything.
unless the set up for dr doom is already happend i mean its the multiverse saga and if you pick all marvel movies next to the mcu which villain is realy a big bad dr doom he was set up in almost every fantastic 4 movie so far so maby this is the set up for him and dr doom and thanos are the big villains of super hero squad marvel wants to make super hero squad live action
If you go back to the old Fantastic Four cartoon The Watcher does interfere to warn The Fantastic Four about Galactus This could be a way they can explain how The Watcher comes to The MCU live
Why would Doom need the Watchers knowledge-base in order to learn how to travel the Multiverse when, by inventing the Space-Time Platform, he already knows how and can do this? Didn't you watch ENDGAME? Time-travel = multiversal transit in Marvel.
6:54 and this is the problem the casual fan doesn’t know anything about Dr doom, from what you’ve explained Dr doom trying to save the multiverse sounds like something a hero would do but he’s a bad guy right? This is just confusing the casual fan he’s teaming up with Dr strange who’s a hero but doom is supposed to be a bad guy??
I think it will make up a more interesting story and it won't be just good vs bad guy but more of a conflict with different opinions and I guess a lot of people like these kinds of stories more than the traditional good vs bad
@@stickwatch5163 I think people are already confused and don’t know what marvel is doing, phase 4 was supposed to be kang and now it’s switch to doom and now it’s like he’s not even really a bad guy and it’s no build up since this doomsday movie is supposed to come out like next year and nun of the movies coming besides F4 has no build up to it. The build up we have now is for kang but I’m tapped out on the mcu and don’t care about it anymore I’m just interested in spider man 4 and secret wars idc about anything else really
What you are saying about Doom is true.. but you really don't have to worry about that particular character because Robert Downey Jr will knock it out of the park. Can you play Sherlock Holmes with a perfect British accent.. and play the black man in tropic thunder and defended no black people and got an academy award nomination. I cannot wait to see his version of Doom he will probably have some sort of an accent
@TheCosmicWonder by introducing the cyclopedia of the universe be a pivotal device for doom utilized to harness the watchers powers and gain knowledge of the multiverse.
Reagood theory and makes sense I know there us a lot of leg work to be done, but I am confident they will cine uo with a good story arc in explaining it
I'm just happy for Jonathan Majors continuing on with his acting career after seeing the new trailer of his for it's impending independent film "Magazine Dreams" debut drama about body building where he looks ripped. He can continue on after this MCU mess. I'm not confident in anything that they do until they fix their storytelling issues or abstract concepts introduced on print in comic books won't translate well to screen where general audience money paying moviegoers will understand what's going on.🤦🏾♂️
You make it way more complex than it needs to be, we don’t need watchers or anything the movie is called doomsday. Think of it as his first iron man movie. 1 movie is enough. It’s Doom, if you don’t know figure it out kids. My 8 year old daughter knows who doom is.
6:55 we don't even know if or when DS3 is happneing. Cumberbatch's last interview was the first we heard any official word about it and even then he mentioned he and Marvel were just going over ideas. That seems like you just making theories and fan fiction out of nothing.
Thanos set up was horrible honestly, and now this one is even worse by far. There should be an origin film completely focused on Doom and then Avengers come in 2027 at earliest.
pretty doubtful but yes, if they are then giving Secret Wars multiple movies afterwards. With the current schedule, no way this won’t be rushed. A change is needed. My current hope is F4 has a good amount of detail on Doom.
@@mccm333: The sense of rush is created by the total failure of phase 4 and 5 to set the story up. There have been a dozen movies and shows, but they are the ones that failed to set anything up. All the stuff this forum is defending. -> The Kang story which has had one film and two series - in which he is currently: DEAD. After dying in Loki season 1 and again in Antman 3. -> Loki supposedly rules the multiverse now because Kang is dead. This makes no sense either as now there is no continuity in the story for Loki -> THE ONE FROM main TIMELINE IS ALSO -> DEAD, nor Kang who is both dead and replaced by Loki. -> Wanda - ALSO DEAD lol. After she killed herself for no reason, after killing a bunch of other people for no reason. This is another trash phase 4 5 story that led nowhere. -> Peter Parker - erased thru magic that Dr. Strange doesn’t actually have, and Sony just made up. The director Jon Watts was asked to come back and finish this story and he TURNED MARVEL AND SONY DOWN, because he knows the story is nothing but a massive collection of plot holes to enable fan service and there’s no way to continue it. -> Thor 4, Deadpool and Wolverine, Eternals - all completely broken stories, with no momentum whatsoever. All ‘fans’ can do is respond in denial as a cope and pretend that marvel should continue/finish this in fact nonexistent story, which is really nothing abut a clusterfk of plot holes.
@ yes. I thought honestly the Kang plot was gonna work well even though it was not set up great yet in the movies and loved the idea, but now they are scrambling and have very little time. Loki was the best project by far and what they needed to lean on.
Marvel probably ain’t doing this but the most insane and ONLY perfect thing they could possibly do this whole time since they screwed up and messed around so much with a weak version of Kang (who JM was killing the role by the way just terrible writing and sequence of pointless movies) which lost a lot of fans interest is actually keep a secret that the real Kang threats aka council of Kangs still be where we are heading towards (played by JM or recast) and create this smokescreen to get people paying attention to marvel by bringing in RDJ as doom for doomsday and phase him into the next big bad for secret wars using doomsday as the transition film out of Kang, complete the Kang threat storyline he’s defeated and doom takes the abilities as god emperor doom and boom you set it up for secret wars and beyond for the soft reboot
Do you need a beyonder otherwise the whole thing makes no sense.. the watchers would not do what the beyonders do .. and even if they did get involved they would not be the catalyst.. you need the beyonder and you need the molecule man at the catalyst
I know the problem without even watching this. It's you influencer that keeps saying that phases 4 and 5 are amazing. And instead of telling the truth, now here we are. 😂
Why is it marvels fault for people who dont follow marvel as a whole to have to explain away everything they could easily read 😂. It a me thing but its annoying that marvel has to spend time explaining so much that should be known or people can come to understand so a lot of stuff soesnt have to be explained
Idk I think RDJ Doom was a great idea. It’s WAYY better than Superior Ironman. They were ALWAYS going to bring RDJ back. This is a way they can do it better.
Yall are the same people that was begging for this, now the no set up is an issue? Kang should have stayed the big bad
Tbh my hope was that somehow we would get council of dooms off the council of kangs anyway, it shows how destructively powerful dooms are in a good light.
With all due respect, Kang was never big bad material.
@orlandoochoada2242 with all due respect, he definitely was. Marvel just fumbled the bag with him. Pick up a comic.
I think most people were more annoyed with HOW Kang was being used AND the cast that they were going to feature w/ the Avengers. alot o f C and D rated characters INSTEAD of relying on their Big Hitters
Not every "Big Bad" needs to be set up 5 years in advance and teased in 37 movies before they finally get their chance to shine. I'm perfectly fine with 2 or 3 Doom teases before Doomsday, a year in advance.
Denzel says 'my man'
Or the problem is picking Robert Downey jr. Everyone wants Dr doom, but yall ok with it basically being a Tony variant? Terrible
@WawaMarvel they definitely should've just gotten a brand new actor for Doom. This would've been a strong introduction to establish his presence and then he can stick around for years after with an already respected status
Not an original idea from me, but others have suggested Doom take the power of Loki. Loki is already established and he’s literally holding the multiverse together. Here, there’s no need to introduce another character.
Fewer new characters they introduce the better. They have too many characters with too many powers and no character development.
Because that is the very definition of *bad comic book* which is what the MCU is becoming.
Yea, I also think this is the best idea for them to do.
I still think the best choice is for him to fight Loki
Introducing The Molecule Man and The Beyonders would make for insane viewing.
I think so to
I think it's a possibility that deadpool could take the place of the molecule man. Think about it they have a deadpool in every universe right and almost all of them are hard to kill , aside from nice pool lol. I think that could work using pool as a bomb some how.
I pray for it. Just makes sense
@@GoldGrub3201 Not a bad call 🤙
@GoldGrub3201 how would that work, though???? Molecule man's powers are the entire reason for the incursions in the comics, Deadpool isn't really that big of a part in the Multiverse besides the "Deadpool kills the marvel universe" comic story
Well, I love both, Jonathan Majors as Kang the Conqueror, He Who Remains, Victor Timely, Immortus, Rama Tut, Scarlet Centurion and all their variants and Robert Downey Jr as Iron Man and Doctor Doom. Also Josh Brolin as Thanos and James Spader as Ultron.
This is a good idea for a good buildup. Thanos worked because he was a great character and there was buildup and mystery to the infinity stones too. We need Doom to pop in from time to time and give weight to who he is, what he’s doing and add mystery to what’s coming. This is how The Infinity Saga worked and that can work with anything
The BIGGEST problem this Saga faces is the LACK of STORYTELLING. Yes the You basically only seen Thanos in Infinity War BUT he was talked about numerous scenes and the real story was about the Stones which were featured throughout the ENTIRE Saga. This saga there has only been minimal story telling regarding Time travel/ Multiverse. We have gotten a few Stories on the topic BUT not a understanding of what the Story is suppose to be and i am not sure that they are giving eachother enough time( meaning Movies and shows) to actually explain what is going on and what will happen. I strongly beleive if they atleast show alittle bit of Kang and his immediate Fall it will help explain ALOT and allow that Connective tissue to continue on throughout this Storied Saga
Preach brother
The one and only time we have seen a hint of Doom was in Deadpool and Wolverine at the end of time.
And that's the problem and I am hoping they know this and is trying to wrap this saga up the best way the can for the story and for a monetary reason. So that way going forward we can have a decent mutant saga
The introduced so many characters and tried to end the saga in fewer years compared to last one , fast tracked many shows and worst of all they had only planned about kang and nothing else that's why only loki looked great , rubbish writers who emphasized more on forced modern narratives were the main reason as well
_The BIGGEST problem this Saga faces is the LACK of STORYTELLING_
yes, but whose fault is that? It's not McFeely in the Russo's it Rick and Morty (Loveness and Waldron) and their hack writing.
when you're in a whole stop digging.
they aren't going to waste time and movies trying to 'fix' the broken phase 4 and 5.
they will tell their own story.
i say - let them, and stop trying to find a way to fix kang and tva and everybody forgot Peter never mind Flash wrote a book about him,
(books magically disappear with your simple forget me spell? sure also the dead speak,
cuz Palpatine Lives, and Rey is really a Skywalker now cause nothing has to make sense as along as your audience is dumb)
She also absorbed the power of Captain Marvel in MoM.
And then died.
Dr doom needs no buildup
Fr. All marvel gotta do this summer is drop an RDJ as Victor Von Doom or as Dr. Doom post credit scene in F4: First Steps - get the people talking, then introduce again in Doomsday 10 months later
Honestly, if Doom is going to be in it (and he is), they should do a scene where Doom wipes out The Council Of Kangs. That way, one unfinished plot line is closed.
No Kang. Kang is already dead. If Loki rules the multiverse and there is no mention of Kang by the TVA - then there is no need to keep Kanging.
You guys - most of you - are not facing the fact that the Russos were brought back PRECISELY BECAUSE that story failed, but you keep asking them to revisit. Just foolish. It's just like asking James Gunn to complete the story of Darkseid in the Snyderverse. lol. How much cope do you have to be on to not realize that that story - is dead.?
@@summertyme5748honestly makes zero sense, marvel spend multiple movies and series building up to Kang being the big bad and now he’s just dead with no explanation it ruins marvel’s continuity which is what we came to love about the infinity saga otherwise it makes a huge part of phase 4-5 basically pointless
@@br-fitness Honestly they already are pretty damn broken. It's best to just forget and start anew with Fantastic Four.
Yes
They use kang like the molecule man in time runs out. Doom goes world to world wiping them out inadvertently starting the incursions.
Dr. Strange has done enough him and that friendly neighborhood little nerd from earth 1999999
I would bring in Micheal B Jordan as a Black Panther variant, he's after RDJ Doom for takiing out the Wakanda Royal family leaving MBJ panther as king
They have like 4 or 5 movies coming out between now and Doomsday. Tease Doom in like 2 or 3 of those, and bada-bing bada-boom, Dooms set up. What's this issue?
This is precisely why Marvel should not have panicked and bailed on Kang and then squeeze Doom in last second.
Secret Wars is a Doom story, it never was about Kang. Kang story flopped. Comment in this thread are just cope: *Let’s pretend QuantumMania wasn’t a shix show.* But that doesn’t work when you lose the studios money, and embarrass everyone associated.
Dr doom dont need a build up he's doom
"He's doom" won't explain to thousands of people why he is there or who he is. Yes, he needs a build up
@@jadenrobinson1561exactly they dont got 10 years like they did to build up thanos. they need to start throwing doom some end credits at the very least so it doesnt feel like zero set up or like a one movie set up.
The casual fan doesn’t know Dr doom and his story. Even I don’t know his story besides whatever that was in the first F4 movie which I don’t even remember
@@jadenrobinson1561Exactly. Us fans know who he is and have the excitement, but to get true results and earn viewers, they need to appeal to the casual moviegoer too. Build him up and get them (and by extension, us too) invested and excited
I don't read the comics, all I know Doom is some villain from the comics who wears a mask. He does need an introduction.
While I will always love Avengers: The Kang Dynasty starring Jonathan Majors, who really gets me excited for his portrayal of Kang, I am also hugely fascinated by Avengers: Doomsday starring Robert Downey Jr. as Doctor Doom. Each has something unique to offer, and while I feel connected to Kang’s story, I can’t help but enjoy what Downey Jr. brings to the table as Doctor Doom. Both are must-watch movies for MCU fans.
Bot ?
I love Both ideas as well BUT its how the MCU was fumbling with Kang AND the cast of Heros that NOBODY WANTED OR LIKED! What Disney has been tryign to feature was the Problem. Ms marvel, Capt Marvel, and even Sam WIlson as Cap. NOBODY wanted that or atleast nobody wanted them as the Featured Cast and i think thats were things began to fall apart and after Antman Failed Because it WAS a HORRIBLE movie for Kang and others they pivoted. I personally wished they still featured Kangs Storyline b/c i was a HUGE FAN of LOKI
@ I completely understand your point. I agree that the MCU has had some issues with certain creative decisions over the past few years, especially how they handled Kang in Ant-Man and the Wasp: Quantumania. As a Loki fan, I also wished Kang had more solid development and that his story was presented in a way that truly captured his complexity.
However, I think part of the problem lies in how audiences perceive new heroes. While characters like Ms. Marvel, Captain Marvel, and Sam Wilson as Cap have their detractors, there is also an audience that appreciates and connects with them, especially for what they represent in terms of diversity and new stories.
I agree that both The Kang Dynasty and Doomsday have incredible potential. I hope Marvel finds a balance and manages to deliver memorable stories that enrich the universe and excite fans, whether it's with Kang, Doom, or any other character. In the end, we all want the MCU to continue surprising us.
I agree, the infinity saga was built up in over 20 films and Dr Doom might show in just one film before he becomes the main villain in doomsday.
Always good stuff
🕌
I love to hear people repeat that Doom is trying to save the multiverse.. while, yes that is what he's doing he is not a hero he is not a nice guy
I think doom becomes god emperor doom by stealing the beyonders powers or the watchers powers.
In doomsday, we get a backstory of this version of Dr. Doom.
I think after those powers are then taken away from him and givin to someone good that'll fix everything.
Favorite Hero: Batman
That sounds like a really good theory to be honest I think would actually play well
I completely understand the concern. Doomsday and Secret Wars feels like a giant conclusion to an enjoyable but messy saga that was the Multiverse. They have a lot to set up.
However, on the positive side, the MCU thrives on making things work on the fly. Thanos was a cameo, a literal Easter egg from the director of the first Avengers and Marvel had to make it work. Mind you, Thanos also had about what 5 minutes maybe less of screen time between phases 2 and 3. But Marvel sold it and infinity war and endgame were amazing. Igor is back as CEO and Kevin feige has his control again. They'll pull it off
They might use flashbacks and show Doom working behind the scenes with Kang, the Celestials etc
Theory sounds good
Wanda still needs to be punished for killing people though lmao if that gets treated as water under the bridge I think it’ll be a huge joke
There’s too much scatter-brained things going with the MCU’s manner to which they’re trying to make their movies make sense … I mean come on now, there’s source material in the comic books to help them! And right now with REAL origin film for Dr Doom it’s just going to be a sh.t show!!!! I hope not 🙏🏾🙏🏾🙏🏾
How bout if Doom was the person that the One Who Remains was referring to, and he was the one keeping Doom trapped in the F4 universe. Doom gets to the TVA and takes it over along with defeating Loki.
You're also making an assumption to think he will be debuted in Doomsday. Many people are speculating at least a tease, possibly even a post-credit RDJ cameo to be in Fantastic Four.
I think the beyonders might be too much. I think he should take Loki powers and place
There's too much story to tell without Strange 3 coming before Secret Wars. Before Doomsday makes more sense but I can see it out between the 2.
They probably should bring back Jonathan Majors as Kang and find away to blend Dr. Doom and him together… 🤷🏼♂️
the beyonder is my favorite marvel villain so i hope the mcu introduce him
F4 have to show doom in some capacity and basically introduce him and in doomsday focus ij showing how from being villian he rose to power and become a god like veing at the end of the being has to be a long ass story focusing greatly on doom , they can cover his origin story in the flashbacks in secret wars
I hope after secret wars we have a other Doom with Cillian Murphy as Doom and not RDJ
The only reason anyone will see this will be because we can finally get on with what we all actually wanted: X-Men, FF, a real Spider-Man (no Stark Jr) and Daredevil films. In 2019, NO ONE WANTED SHANG-CHI, DIET JLA ETERNALS, BLACK WIDOW, WONDER MAN, ETC.
Don´t forget what they have done with thor.
Wow, talk about racist AND sexist, read a comic book man
I mean they already had a big bad for the multiverse saga that they were building up like Thanos that was Kang and all his variants but they decided to walk away from that
What would be cool is if Doctor Doom is an anchor being of his universe and galactus destroys it because of the fantastic four so he blames the tva , watchers and beyonder (loki) and decides to set out travelling the multiverse destroying worlds and anchor beings in order to get the tva and lokis attention and then comes to the sacred timeline with his own multiversal variants of heroes and villains that he manipulated on the way to beat everyone up, kill the anchor being of that timeline and then all worlds come colliding and doom finds his way into the tva and steals the watchers powers, then lokis powers and destroys every world universe and timeline and creates a new world in the void whivh some heroes survive and land on years later because of reed richards and his multiveral raft only to find out doom is now in charge leading to Avengers Secret Wars taking place on the void now known as battleworld
Just let the Russo Brothers write their story - and jettison as much of the phase 4 and 5 stuff as possible.
I think that's what will happen anyway. Phase 4 and 5 MCU is almost as bad as Snyderverse DC.
So much garbage writing and contradiction can never be solved.
For example no one expects James Gunn to explain where Wonder Woman was when Zod invaded earth - or how come Martin Manhunter was 'here all the time', did nothing, but then shows up at the end of SnyderCut, fronting off like he's someone cool. It's obvious that Snyder is just desperately trying to claim more IP so he can destroy that too. lol.
Same with MCU - There can never be an explanation of Janet Van Dyne hanging out with Kang for 30 years - not mentioning - then sending Scott into the Quantum to get healing particles for Ghost and not warning him. *And don't even get me started on Dr. Strange and Nerd from 199999* (it's - just - bad - writing)
The whole Kang TVA story is as dead as the Snyderverse because it was horribly written makes no sense, and so can't be fixed via retcon.
Abybody notice they humanized thanos. Brown eyes , sharper jawline
I can’t tell if your channel is based off just your opinion for about 10 minutes or actually facts.
hi The Cosmic Wonder
That's a huge problem in this Phase, we have no direction whatsoever since Jonathan Majors aka Kang got fired. No build ups no nothing.. we the hardcore fans will watch but the casual will understand nothing. I mean we all know the new big bad will be Doom but this no buld up Phase is killing Marvel's Box Office.. I just hope it gets going soon rather than too late and out of nowhere.
I totally agree. Jonathan Majors' firing left a huge void, especially with all the potential Kang had as the central villain of the phase. There's no clear direction, and even though we know Doom is going to be the next big villain, the lack of buildup is affecting the connection with fans, especially the more casual ones. Hopefully Marvel will get their act together soon, because if they put it off until later, it's going to be hard to get people hooked like they used to. The box office is paying the price for not having a solid plot to guide everything.
I believe we will see the watcher discover Galactus in a flash black scene
I'll say the same thing I said during Deadpool and wolverine.. where is Loki? We need Loki to save the multiverse
Hyped
unless the set up for dr doom is already happend i mean its the multiverse saga and if you pick all marvel movies next to the mcu which villain is realy a big bad dr doom he was set up in almost every fantastic 4 movie so far so maby this is the set up for him and dr doom and thanos are the big villains of super hero squad marvel wants to make super hero squad live action
Denzel Washington should’ve been the live action Watu
If you go back to the old Fantastic Four cartoon The Watcher does interfere to warn The Fantastic Four about Galactus This could be a way they can explain how The Watcher comes to The MCU live
i hope all of the mutant saga takes place on battle world, making doom the big bad of phase 7 and beyond
Why would Doom need the Watchers knowledge-base in order to learn how to travel the Multiverse when, by inventing the Space-Time Platform, he already knows how and can do this? Didn't you watch ENDGAME? Time-travel = multiversal transit in Marvel.
I don't think the watchers have reality warping abilities. It would make more sense if he stole scarlet witches power.
All Disney has to do is make a compelling character oriented story and we will do the marketing
I’m assuming Doom will be in Fantastic 4 or at least in a post credit scene.
6:54 and this is the problem the casual fan doesn’t know anything about Dr doom, from what you’ve explained Dr doom trying to save the multiverse sounds like something a hero would do but he’s a bad guy right? This is just confusing the casual fan he’s teaming up with Dr strange who’s a hero but doom is supposed to be a bad guy??
I think it will make up a more interesting story and it won't be just good vs bad guy but more of a conflict with different opinions and I guess a lot of people like these kinds of stories more than the traditional good vs bad
@@stickwatch5163 I think people are already confused and don’t know what marvel is doing, phase 4 was supposed to be kang and now it’s switch to doom and now it’s like he’s not even really a bad guy and it’s no build up since this doomsday movie is supposed to come out like next year and nun of the movies coming besides F4 has no build up to it. The build up we have now is for kang but I’m tapped out on the mcu and don’t care about it anymore I’m just interested in spider man 4 and secret wars idc about anything else really
I think it would be easier for Doom to defeat and take the powers of a Celestial .. everyone knows who Celestials are and easily explainable
Not every villain needs a five movie set up.... Ultron didn't....
What you are saying about Doom is true.. but you really don't have to worry about that particular character because Robert Downey Jr will knock it out of the park.
Can you play Sherlock Holmes with a perfect British accent.. and play the black man in tropic thunder and defended no black people and got an academy award nomination. I cannot wait to see his version of Doom he will probably have some sort of an accent
Thanos wasn't planned to be the big bad until later on the three phases. This is not an issue
I really think kangs counsel could take the place beyonders.
It’s gonna be rushed every thing. Should have kept Majors as Kang. Marvel panicked and got desperate. Marvel really did end after endgame
I'd be curious to see how Marvel puts this on a screen.
Just make doctor strange 3 as time runs out and relaease it before doomsday problem solved
I thought he would first be in The Fantastic Four which is before Secret Wars..
@TheCosmicWonder by introducing the cyclopedia of the universe be a pivotal device for doom utilized to harness the watchers powers and gain knowledge of the multiverse.
I hope Marvel will fix everything
Nah man, it's too late. Doomsday comes out next year and all the projects for this year are mostly done.
Reagood theory and makes sense I know there us a lot of leg work to be done, but I am confident they will cine uo with a good story arc in explaining it
I'm just happy for Jonathan Majors continuing on with his acting career after seeing the new trailer of his for it's impending independent film "Magazine Dreams" debut drama about body building where he looks ripped. He can continue on after this MCU mess. I'm not confident in anything that they do until they fix their storytelling issues or abstract concepts introduced on print in comic books won't translate well to screen where general audience money paying moviegoers will understand what's going on.🤦🏾♂️
You make it way more complex than it needs to be, we don’t need watchers or anything the movie is called doomsday. Think of it as his first iron man movie. 1 movie is enough. It’s Doom, if you don’t know figure it out kids. My 8 year old daughter knows who doom is.
6:55 we don't even know if or when DS3 is happneing. Cumberbatch's last interview was the first we heard any official word about it and even then he mentioned he and Marvel were just going over ideas. That seems like you just making theories and fan fiction out of nothing.
If I Can Rewrite Kang Dynasty
I think the fantastic 4 will serve as the buildup for doom
Could show how doom and iron man switched brains make that a whole movie on its own possibly
Sat morning cartoon writing.
@ comic books where the superhero’s came from
@@phillipjones4862Bad comic books, where your ideas come from. Not the good ones.
It took you this long to figure that out ?
Do you think the tv shows will start talking about him?
How Loki is involved with the story
It's only a problem for people who make it one.
Ligma😊
Yes sir ligma indeeede do
Ligma balls
Yk in the comics a lot of things weren’t built up some villains just showed up
And a lot of that stuff was really bad. I'm sorry.
@ you probably didn’t even read the comics
@ why would they make 30 comics just to introduce one villain
Hard To Find Sometimes
Thanos set up was horrible honestly, and now this one is even worse by far. There should be an origin film completely focused on Doom and then Avengers come in 2027 at earliest.
They can call the film Doomsday - with Avengers in the title to put butts in seats, and still do what you said.
pretty doubtful but yes, if they are then giving Secret Wars multiple movies afterwards. With the current schedule, no way this won’t be rushed. A change is needed. My current hope is F4 has a good amount of detail on Doom.
@@mccm333: The sense of rush is created by the total failure of phase 4 and 5 to set the story up. There have been a dozen movies and shows, but they are the ones that failed to set anything up. All the stuff this forum is defending.
-> The Kang story which has had one film and two series - in which he is currently: DEAD. After dying in Loki season 1 and again in Antman 3.
-> Loki supposedly rules the multiverse now because Kang is dead. This makes no sense either as now there is no continuity in the story for Loki -> THE ONE FROM main TIMELINE IS ALSO -> DEAD, nor Kang who is both dead and replaced by Loki.
-> Wanda - ALSO DEAD lol. After she killed herself for no reason, after killing a bunch of other people for no reason. This is another trash phase 4 5 story that led nowhere.
-> Peter Parker - erased thru magic that Dr. Strange doesn’t actually have, and Sony just made up. The director Jon Watts was asked to come back and finish this story and he TURNED MARVEL AND SONY DOWN, because he knows the story is nothing but a massive collection of plot holes to enable fan service and there’s no way to continue it.
-> Thor 4, Deadpool and Wolverine, Eternals - all completely broken stories, with no momentum whatsoever.
All ‘fans’ can do is respond in denial as a cope and pretend that marvel should continue/finish this in fact nonexistent story, which is really nothing abut a clusterfk of plot holes.
@ yes. I thought honestly the Kang plot was gonna work well even though it was not set up great yet in the movies and loved the idea, but now they are scrambling and have very little time. Loki was the best project by far and what they needed to lean on.
Marvel probably ain’t doing this but the most insane and ONLY perfect thing they could possibly do this whole time since they screwed up and messed around so much with a weak version of Kang (who JM was killing the role by the way just terrible writing and sequence of pointless movies) which lost a lot of fans interest is actually keep a secret that the real Kang threats aka council of Kangs still be where we are heading towards (played by JM or recast) and create this smokescreen to get people paying attention to marvel by bringing in RDJ as doom for doomsday and phase him into the next big bad for secret wars using doomsday as the transition film out of Kang, complete the Kang threat storyline he’s defeated and doom takes the abilities as god emperor doom and boom you set it up for secret wars and beyond for the soft reboot
Do you need a beyonder otherwise the whole thing makes no sense.. the watchers would not do what the beyonders do .. and even if they did get involved they would not be the catalyst.. you need the beyonder and you need the molecule man at the catalyst
Lots Of Things Are Happening Today
I think you are way too worried about buildup
it's impossible to fix it. Marvel f...ed it already up.
As a thing and absolute nod to the man mole man could be Stan lee???? He appears in all the films
Nice
i don’t want what if leaking into the movies i’m sorry
I know the problem without even watching this. It's you influencer that keeps saying that phases 4 and 5 are amazing. And instead of telling the truth, now here we are. 😂
Feeling like they should stay away from the multiverse. The cosmic and multiverse stories are always the weakest in my opinion
I can’t believe what im hearing
No build up. Wtf u been taking about?
Why is it marvels fault for people who dont follow marvel as a whole to have to explain away everything they could easily read 😂. It a me thing but its annoying that marvel has to spend time explaining so much that should be known or people can come to understand so a lot of stuff soesnt have to be explained
Bring back Jonathan majors as King the conqueror or let him play Dr. Doom. RDJ playing the role is not good.
You really think a woman abusing man should be left in the MCU? Cmon!
Yeah
Marvel is not cooking there microwaving
lol
I love all these couch potatoes have 0 to no skill but complaining so much instead of just enjoying the movie when it comes or not.