Many leaders are broken up by longtime collectors as legit Leaders and Voyager+. For example Dragon Megatron is a legit Leader, whereas most of the leader Triple Changers are Voyager +. The biggest giveaway besides size is the "extras" thrown in. Blitzwing has his hulk hands, Sandstorm has his cage, and Springer has a large loadout of accessories. Like the minibot deluxes are literally only different from Core by milimeters and just more accesories and engineering. Havent heard a fun fan term for "Core+".
10:16 “Red guy and blue guy.” Didn’t wanna go there, huh? Also, great video! I’ve been collecting CHUG since 2006, and I’d say you’re definitely correct that the WFC trilogy is where engineering began to take precedent over size. I was stunned when I discovered that the Siege Shockwave I had paid $50 for was smaller than my 2006 Classics Voyager Jetfire.
I'm definitely with you there. I started collecting with Classics and the size shock of Siege (plus the battle damage) had me take a back seat collecting the line that year.
Really helpful video. My son has been getting into Transformers big time lately and I saved all my Armada figures from the early 2000s, so we’ve both been playing with those and I’ve gotten into them again myself. Didn’t realize how many different series there were until a few weeks ago.
This is really helpful. As a kid I had the G1 Toys and I've been won over by the Studio 86 figures and have decided to grab them, but couldn't figure out how the Core Class Ratchet fit in with the rest.
This was super helpful! I just started getting back into transformers about a week ago and was confused why a lot of figures on shelves that looked pretty similar in size had such drastically different prices. It’s good to know that for the more expensive figures you’re generally getting a much better designed and put together figure than the cheaper ones. That will definitely help inform what I decide to buy moving forward and will help me feel more justified in spending more for nicer figures
While I already new everything covered I still very much enjoyed the video the commentary and your genuine interest in things like the commander class size is very apparent
Also: some of the smaller figures in certain classes may or may not have additional accessories to add to the parts count. Examples include Earthrise Cliffjumper (basically the ol' skool Legends with extra stuff), the aforementioned SS86-4 Hot Rod, SS86-17 Ironhide (just his guns), Siege Shockwave & Astrotrain (and most other Voyagers with extra stuff), Kingdom Rodimus Prime, Legacy Motormaster (taken on his own merits, NOT for being the skeleton of Menasor, he's about the same size as Rodimus with a worse trailer that becomes a base that would make even Earthrise Optimus & Legacy G2 Laser Optimus laugh like the Joker), etc.
What an excellent video. I’ve dipped back in again and it’s pretty wild. I’ve come for the new SS86 Bumblebee then found out they’re doing an OP as well. So I started looking back at Legacy as well. I’m actually doing it for my grandkids (when they come) but enjoy the collecting and research process. I did it for my son with Henkel, Universe and FOC. Of course I’m 45 and started out with G1 myself. I loved the show and the comics and the film and have bought all the DVDs. I presented the episodes and figures to my son like it was the 80’s and would show him an episode a day, then introduce some figures for Christmas etc. then after a year or two I showed him the movie (same impact… lol) and introduced him to more figures. I plan on doing the same with my grandkids as I love the morals of the shows and in this day and age it’s safe TV. Thank you for taking the time to explain this strange new world. Even I understand it now. Lol
Honestly, I rarely see people bring up scale in these debates. People have short memories. Back in the day, scale was a joke. Every deluxe line had a starscream, a prime, a bee, and a megs and theyd all be the same height. Or the opposite extreme where Prime just towers over everything else. The current scale is about as good as its going to get, and I certainly dont mind paying extra to get a better figure either especially when theres so many 3rd party options offering better figures.
Thank you for this! 🙏 I'm not a collector but I've been buying Transformers figures once in a while and was always confused by the various Classes 🤔 (except Titans, that one is pretty self-explanatory 😅).
I think Starscream should deserve his own size class/price point. If he’s not gonna be leader of the Decepticons, Hasbro has at least got to give him something.
Well, they gave starscream's voyager size a coronation kit, a throne and a *_leader_* pricepoint. No other mainline TFs got an included add-on cape kit, nor an included throne. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
You should make a series out of this! Explaining multiple facets of the franchise, It would be great for those who want to get into transformers, now I have a video to point to whenever a friend wants more info on size classes/price points.
I still think they need to reduce prices and completely shift the pricing system. My thought was they could split deluxe in half. Shifting deluxe back to 19 usd by cutting cost in eliminating over reliance on uni joints by reintroducing ball joints with texturing for deluxe, include minibots and core+. Drop the Voyager branding to the modern deluxe at 24-30 usd for deluxe that need uni joints, smaller voyagers, larger deluxes and deluxe+. Reintroduce Ultra as 35-40 usd for larger Voyager and Voyager+. Keep leader as is, keep core as it's. It still feels ridiculous that we are paying 24 usd for a modern deluxe when I think they could fit it into 19 usd if they cut production costs well.
Personally, I think the people that are size-queens need to understand the difference between size and engineering, but I do like the Ultra Class suggestion. Ultra Magnus is woefully out of scale because he's the hardest working toy in Transformers.
I could have used this video when I got back into collecting Transformers! Definitely took a while to figure it all out, and this video does a great job parsing it all. Totally agree that a class between Voyager and Leader is needed. If I had to guess both individual figures and an entire wave have a set budget. So, if they can stop forcing not-really-Leaders into that class maybe that can free up budget elsewhere in the wave? I haven't fully baked that thought, so maybe not lol. Those Earthspark toys don't seem half bad though. However, I do think they should be $2-3 cheaper for what you're getting. My understanding is Hasbro has a problem with getting new, younger fans into Transformers right now. The current classes and design of mainline toys seem almost entirely focused on adult collectors. I think the Earthspark line (or whatever replaces it) should have an additional higher tier as well so kids can get bigger Transformers with decent transformations and articulation while also not breaking the bank for parents.
Budget does factor heavily these days on what size a figure is based on what other characters are in the same wave. Also should be noted a lot of G1 characters were placed in price points based on the height of the character in the 84 Cartoon. Yup, those names for size classes are not relevant at all.
I've been in 3 Walmarts. over the last couple of weeks and all the regular deluxe figures(Not clearance)have been marked down or rolled back like they say to $19.99 I guess they just aren't moving.
Classes have never been about the actual height of the characters. Just look at the original Armada Megatron and Tidal Wave. They are the same class but not at all the same height. Classes are about price points, parts count, and paint applications.
Unfortunately if the rumors and 2025 listings are true, then core class is gone. Which is disappointing because i had a huge wishlist of Core Class figures: G2 Go Bots, RID Spychangers, Beast Wars Basics like Bat Optimus Primal, etc
@Soundout12 dang that is unfortunate if thats the case. Warrior class is perfectly fine toy-wise but with a $2 diff from the kids line deluxe they might as well just make it deluxe.
Where would you place SS Concept Megatron? Initially I thought he was kind of “Voyager Plus” from pictures, but after picking him up and watching your video I can see how the engineering would bum him to the leader class. (Also I understand why Motor Master is a commander with the new system, but I do wish combiner bodies/leads were at the leader price point. Commander just feels a bit much)
I think Concept Megatron can be a leader since he does have a lot of transformation tricks that allow for a ton of fan modes. Plus he has a lot of silver paint. (I'm really curious how Silverbolt will be, Menasor is basically drawn as a dude with cars slapped on it so this approach worked, but I'm not sure Superion will work the same)
As a casual collector, the naming convention for the classes is so confusing it's repulsive. I dont care what size a voyager vs a core is... I know I just want a small one or a big one... I dont give a shit to learn the lingo. And don't get me started on naming them after generations or kingdom or whatever... I dont watch the Netflix shows and again, I don't care as a causal collector. The package just needs to say something like series-3 (for the wave release)/level-2 (for the size/price point).
Sometimes I feel like I'm the only one in the world who remembers they said Siege Shockwave was Leader because the rubber used for his hose pushed him outside Voyager so they gave him some armor to make him Leader class. Because of that, I think that's actually the best example of something that could use a return to Ultra class like you said, because then they could have released it without all that armor everyone just throws away. Primal they would have to like take away his Transwarp Key and, less paint? I'm not sure what they would have to remove for him to be enough. This is still the best video on the subject on all TH-cam though.
I stopped collecting transformers after the kingdoms chapter from the war for cybertron toy line, not a fan of the plastic free packaging, I miss the earlier lines like combiner wars and power of the primes and titans returns.
The newest lines do have scale, it’s one of the main goals of the new engineering system, it’s why rodimus is smaller than grimlock, what are you talking about?
@@OogaBooga24723 I miss the better packaging the pre plastic free crap, I just miss the line that had proper packaging, and were not so darn expensive, nowadays the scale like Soundout stated is more whatever the budget they want to spend on figure that will more often then not shelf warm
@@aunk1134 what’s the problem with plastic free packaging? I mean, I know it’s for Hasbro to cut down on costs because plastic prices are more expensive than ever, but what the issue with it? I personally really like the plastic free packaging on leaders specifically because of the awesome art work we get instead of a boring plastic window. Whats the problem? On your second issue, that’s understandable, the prices are higher than ever, and figures aren’t selling as well, mostly because the G1 well is pretty much dried up and collectors are packing up shop and leaving, but I don’t really see how that’s an issue with this current line, the figures not selling isn’t the fault of the toys, it’s the fault of the marketing department.
@@OogaBooga24723 I have no problems with the art work I just miss being able to get a new toy without having to be worried someone has coughed/ sneezed/ touched with dirty hands, plus I will never be a fan of the open window, unless Hasbro can shrink it so only a small square remains not having it where with some core class figures anyone could just reach in and take them leaving behind an empty box
what is wrong with you? you think that rodimus trail just seats around doing nothing? in reality the trailer has to be this way because he needs it for the alt mode, and during robot mode the trailer doesnt integrate with him, they also made it that way so matches the scale regarless of how complex the transformation is. Your video is lacking lots of other factors.
I don't like the way Rodimus' alt mode is done on the Kingdom, nor did I like it on the G1 either. It's a weak gimmick overall because outside of Rodimus standing at the cannon, it doesn't do anything. Prime's trailer has roller, a canon, a repair bay mode and a place to fit figures inside, which I wish Rodimus was more like. The scale of the Rodimus is fine as is, but him having a car mode isn't accurate to the original design either. Not to mention, he's not cartoon based but original updated design based, which I don't mind, but I wish they made the trailer more exciting overall for the Commander price.
![Digimon The Movies Collection: Our War Game, Hurricane Touchdown Blu-Ray/New Dub Review [Soundout12]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/KtVIrGdtvQ8/mqdefault.jpg)
THANK YOU for doing this video as someone who’s only now getting back into transformers, it’s a bit confusing hearing these various names and classes.
I’m so glad it helped!
@@Soundout12 Same. Had a few as a kid. Last summer, re-introduced and collected a few. Great clip, thanks!
I'm still confused. I'm just getting what looks best to me.
Many leaders are broken up by longtime collectors as legit Leaders and Voyager+. For example Dragon Megatron is a legit Leader, whereas most of the leader Triple Changers are Voyager +. The biggest giveaway besides size is the "extras" thrown in. Blitzwing has his hulk hands, Sandstorm has his cage, and Springer has a large loadout of accessories. Like the minibot deluxes are literally only different from Core by milimeters and just more accesories and engineering. Havent heard a fun fan term for "Core+".
We could call Core+ "Scouts" to really mix things up
10:16 “Red guy and blue guy.” Didn’t wanna go there, huh?
Also, great video! I’ve been collecting CHUG since 2006, and I’d say you’re definitely correct that the WFC trilogy is where engineering began to take precedent over size. I was stunned when I discovered that the Siege Shockwave I had paid $50 for was smaller than my 2006 Classics Voyager Jetfire.
I'm definitely with you there. I started collecting with Classics and the size shock of Siege (plus the battle damage) had me take a back seat collecting the line that year.
Really helpful video. My son has been getting into Transformers big time lately and I saved all my Armada figures from the early 2000s, so we’ve both been playing with those and I’ve gotten into them again myself. Didn’t realize how many different series there were until a few weeks ago.
This is really helpful. As a kid I had the G1 Toys and I've been won over by the Studio 86 figures and have decided to grab them, but couldn't figure out how the Core Class Ratchet fit in with the rest.
This was super helpful! I just started getting back into transformers about a week ago and was confused why a lot of figures on shelves that looked pretty similar in size had such drastically different prices. It’s good to know that for the more expensive figures you’re generally getting a much better designed and put together figure than the cheaper ones. That will definitely help inform what I decide to buy moving forward and will help me feel more justified in spending more for nicer figures
I’m glad this video was such a great help!
While I already new everything covered I still very much enjoyed the video the commentary and your genuine interest in things like the commander class size is very apparent
I'm glad to hear that!
Also, the design budget is per wave. So a small deluxe leaves budget for a larger deluxe in the same wave.
Thank you for this video, when anyone complains about the current size/price classes I will point them here.
You’re welcome!
Also: some of the smaller figures in certain classes may or may not have additional accessories to add to the parts count. Examples include Earthrise Cliffjumper (basically the ol' skool Legends with extra stuff), the aforementioned SS86-4 Hot Rod, SS86-17 Ironhide (just his guns), Siege Shockwave & Astrotrain (and most other Voyagers with extra stuff), Kingdom Rodimus Prime, Legacy Motormaster (taken on his own merits, NOT for being the skeleton of Menasor, he's about the same size as Rodimus with a worse trailer that becomes a base that would make even Earthrise Optimus & Legacy G2 Laser Optimus laugh like the Joker), etc.
This video does help I been collecting since summer of legacy evolution
What an excellent video. I’ve dipped back in again and it’s pretty wild. I’ve come for the new SS86 Bumblebee then found out they’re doing an OP as well. So I started looking back at Legacy as well.
I’m actually doing it for my grandkids (when they come) but enjoy the collecting and research process. I did it for my son with Henkel, Universe and FOC. Of course I’m 45 and started out with G1 myself. I loved the show and the comics and the film and have bought all the DVDs. I presented the episodes and figures to my son like it was the 80’s and would show him an episode a day, then introduce some figures for Christmas etc. then after a year or two I showed him the movie (same impact… lol) and introduced him to more figures.
I plan on doing the same with my grandkids as I love the morals of the shows and in this day and age it’s safe TV.
Thank you for taking the time to explain this strange new world. Even I understand it now. Lol
Great video for someone like myself getting back into transformers.
Finally someone explains the class differences thank you so much!
I mean it’s pretty clear cut lol. It just depends on the price of the toy lmao
Happy to hear the video was helpful!
Honestly, I rarely see people bring up scale in these debates.
People have short memories. Back in the day, scale was a joke. Every deluxe line had a starscream, a prime, a bee, and a megs and theyd all be the same height. Or the opposite extreme where Prime just towers over everything else.
The current scale is about as good as its going to get, and I certainly dont mind paying extra to get a better figure either especially when theres so many 3rd party options offering better figures.
Thank you! I was planning on getting into Transformers but all these size classes really made it crazy confusing.
Glad it was helpful!
I remember the cyber verse ultra class figures. That was the only other time I remember them using the term “ultra class”
17:12-17:36 That was the reason I wanted to pick him up, besides the fact he looks cool.
Thank you for this! 🙏 I'm not a collector but I've been buying Transformers figures once in a while and was always confused by the various Classes 🤔 (except Titans, that one is pretty self-explanatory 😅).
I think a new price point is in order 100%. The difference in Canada between voyager and leader is a huge jump of 30-25$. A whole deluxe in difference
That's definitely too much of a jump. We need a class between
Thankyou I like deluxe the most I collect deluxe only so that the size of the character figures matches
The video I needed as I always get confused by you and the guys talking about the size classes. XD
I think Starscream should deserve his own size class/price point. If he’s not gonna be leader of the Decepticons, Hasbro has at least got to give him something.
😂😂 lol
Seeker class? 40-45$ Price point
@@Jazmission yeah. Something like that. I’m surprised that Hasbro hasn’t thought of that yet.
Ultra Class as in Ultra Chad for Starscream
Well, they gave starscream's voyager size a coronation kit, a throne and a *_leader_* pricepoint. No other mainline TFs got an included add-on cape kit, nor an included throne.
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
You should make a series out of this! Explaining multiple facets of the franchise, It would be great for those who want to get into transformers, now I have a video to point to whenever a friend wants more info on size classes/price points.
I'm glad! I will definitely look into making more videos like this to help guide people who are new to a franchise.
I still think they need to reduce prices and completely shift the pricing system. My thought was they could split deluxe in half. Shifting deluxe back to 19 usd by cutting cost in eliminating over reliance on uni joints by reintroducing ball joints with texturing for deluxe, include minibots and core+. Drop the Voyager branding to the modern deluxe at 24-30 usd for deluxe that need uni joints, smaller voyagers, larger deluxes and deluxe+. Reintroduce Ultra as 35-40 usd for larger Voyager and Voyager+. Keep leader as is, keep core as it's. It still feels ridiculous that we are paying 24 usd for a modern deluxe when I think they could fit it into 19 usd if they cut production costs well.
This video is really good Transformers figure therapy!
Personally, I think the people that are size-queens need to understand the difference between size and engineering, but I do like the Ultra Class suggestion. Ultra Magnus is woefully out of scale because he's the hardest working toy in Transformers.
I'm glad I got the studio series hotrod on sale for half price
I'm an old timer but a yet very interesting video!
Thanks been looking for this
I could have used this video when I got back into collecting Transformers! Definitely took a while to figure it all out, and this video does a great job parsing it all. Totally agree that a class between Voyager and Leader is needed. If I had to guess both individual figures and an entire wave have a set budget. So, if they can stop forcing not-really-Leaders into that class maybe that can free up budget elsewhere in the wave? I haven't fully baked that thought, so maybe not lol. Those Earthspark toys don't seem half bad though. However, I do think they should be $2-3 cheaper for what you're getting. My understanding is Hasbro has a problem with getting new, younger fans into Transformers right now. The current classes and design of mainline toys seem almost entirely focused on adult collectors. I think the Earthspark line (or whatever replaces it) should have an additional higher tier as well so kids can get bigger Transformers with decent transformations and articulation while also not breaking the bank for parents.
I definitely agree the kids line needs more classes for toys for kids
And not just larger and larger one trick pony gimmick toys
Budget does factor heavily these days on what size a figure is based on what other characters are in the same wave.
Also should be noted a lot of G1 characters were placed in price points based on the height of the character in the 84 Cartoon.
Yup, those names for size classes are not relevant at all.
I've been in 3 Walmarts. over the last couple of weeks and all the regular deluxe figures(Not clearance)have been marked down or rolled back like they say to $19.99 I guess they just aren't moving.
I wouldn't call rotb Scourge having a complex transformation, especially as a Leader class
I see what you did there…”red guy” and “blue guy”. Lol 😊
I've lived in the fandom debate trenches to know better XD
Classes have never been about the actual height of the characters. Just look at the original Armada Megatron and Tidal Wave. They are the same class but not at all the same height. Classes are about price points, parts count, and paint applications.
I love Red Guy and Blue Guy
Man, I wish transformers figures weren't so expensive at Walmart and Target.😔😔
Here in Canada their more expensive at Toys R us
thanks for video, very informative
Bro i bought Sludge and hes massive it was worth the 70 bucks on walmart.
Rodimus combines with his trailer
we really need ultra class back 100%
Unfortunately if the rumors and 2025 listings are true, then core class is gone. Which is disappointing because i had a huge wishlist of Core Class figures: G2 Go Bots, RID Spychangers, Beast Wars Basics like Bat Optimus Primal, etc
Gone too soon😔
Wait are they raising prices for Warrior Class? $15 has made sense for the difficulty/size. $18 would def be pushing it value-wise.
$18 was what the hasbro site was listing. I definitely see the fluctuation in stores
@Soundout12 dang that is unfortunate if thats the case. Warrior class is perfectly fine toy-wise but with a $2 diff from the kids line deluxe they might as well just make it deluxe.
@@Infinity_WarTorn For sure. Hasbro not fumble a kid’s line challenge: Impossible
Sandstorm should b in the lieutenant class & maybe tiger hawk
I think all the beast, wars and beast machines US cast should be core class if they want to scale with G1 transformers.
This is true
Great video
No. Warrior class is physically cheaper, more hollow and less complex than deluxe.
Will you ever do a video like this for Gunpla grades
I might. Definitely a good idea
Make unboxing for shodo phone for Samurai Sentai Shinkenger (Samuraizer for Power Rangers Samurai)
Where would you place SS Concept Megatron? Initially I thought he was kind of “Voyager Plus” from pictures, but after picking him up and watching your video I can see how the engineering would bum him to the leader class.
(Also I understand why Motor Master is a commander with the new system, but I do wish combiner bodies/leads were at the leader price point. Commander just feels a bit much)
I think Concept Megatron can be a leader since he does have a lot of transformation tricks that allow for a ton of fan modes. Plus he has a lot of silver paint.
(I'm really curious how Silverbolt will be, Menasor is basically drawn as a dude with cars slapped on it so this approach worked, but I'm not sure Superion will work the same)
@@Soundout12 I think Silverbolt will be bigger. It's due to the fact the his alt mode in real life is very big.
As a casual collector, the naming convention for the classes is so confusing it's repulsive. I dont care what size a voyager vs a core is... I know I just want a small one or a big one... I dont give a shit to learn the lingo. And don't get me started on naming them after generations or kingdom or whatever... I dont watch the Netflix shows and again, I don't care as a causal collector. The package just needs to say something like series-3 (for the wave release)/level-2 (for the size/price point).
I always wondered how the annual renaming and the size class names played for casual collectors. They really do need something simpler
Sometimes I feel like I'm the only one in the world who remembers they said Siege Shockwave was Leader because the rubber used for his hose pushed him outside Voyager so they gave him some armor to make him Leader class. Because of that, I think that's actually the best example of something that could use a return to Ultra class like you said, because then they could have released it without all that armor everyone just throws away. Primal they would have to like take away his Transwarp Key and, less paint? I'm not sure what they would have to remove for him to be enough.
This is still the best video on the subject on all TH-cam though.
The hose being a budget killer makes a lot of sense.
Thank you for the compliment!
so…. *transformers classism?*
Transformers One (2024)
I stopped collecting transformers after the kingdoms chapter from the war for cybertron toy line, not a fan of the plastic free packaging, I miss the earlier lines like combiner wars and power of the primes and titans returns.
The newest lines do have scale, it’s one of the main goals of the new engineering system, it’s why rodimus is smaller than grimlock, what are you talking about?
@@OogaBooga24723 I miss the better packaging the pre plastic free crap, I just miss the line that had proper packaging, and were not so darn expensive, nowadays the scale like Soundout stated is more whatever the budget they want to spend on figure that will more often then not shelf warm
@@aunk1134 what’s the problem with plastic free packaging? I mean, I know it’s for Hasbro to cut down on costs because plastic prices are more expensive than ever, but what the issue with it? I personally really like the plastic free packaging on leaders specifically because of the awesome art work we get instead of a boring plastic window. Whats the problem?
On your second issue, that’s understandable, the prices are higher than ever, and figures aren’t selling as well, mostly because the G1 well is pretty much dried up and collectors are packing up shop and leaving, but I don’t really see how that’s an issue with this current line, the figures not selling isn’t the fault of the toys, it’s the fault of the marketing department.
@@OogaBooga24723 I have no problems with the art work I just miss being able to get a new toy without having to be worried someone has coughed/ sneezed/ touched with dirty hands, plus I will never be a fan of the open window, unless Hasbro can shrink it so only a small square remains not having it where with some core class figures anyone could just reach in and take them leaving behind an empty box
@@aunk1134 that’s, pretty understandable in our current times, I never even thought about that to be honest.
I think the only characters that deserve the leader class price point are Optimus prime and Megatron.
what is wrong with you? you think that rodimus trail just seats around doing nothing? in reality the trailer has to be this way because he needs it for the alt mode, and during robot mode the trailer doesnt integrate with him, they also made it that way so matches the scale regarless of how complex the transformation is. Your video is lacking lots of other factors.
I don't like the way Rodimus' alt mode is done on the Kingdom, nor did I like it on the G1 either. It's a weak gimmick overall because outside of Rodimus standing at the cannon, it doesn't do anything. Prime's trailer has roller, a canon, a repair bay mode and a place to fit figures inside, which I wish Rodimus was more like. The scale of the Rodimus is fine as is, but him having a car mode isn't accurate to the original design either. Not to mention, he's not cartoon based but original updated design based, which I don't mind, but I wish they made the trailer more exciting overall for the Commander price.
Where's titan 😂
It's in there!
This video is for adult collectors because....wait wrong channel
That opitamus primral is not worth 55$ literally the same size as the voyagers