at 4:23 when the finnish police is showing his gear, the other policeman says "älä ota asetta" that's "don't draw your gun" in english, I think the older officer thought the younger one could get carried away and not realize that there would be shitstorm if he unholsters in public. In Finland the gun is considered to be the last line of defense for the police and if you draw it, the draw itself is considered as use of force, i.e if finnish police officer pulls out his gun that means his prepared to use deadly force and that action in itself is considered as use of force. Am I making any sense =D? Every draw made by police is investigated and must be justifiable so finnish police can't go "gun first, just in case" in situations, like I've seen the U.S. police do.
I noticed the same thing, I think it could be that, because it's a loaded weapon. They have probably strict rules when taking the gun out of the holster. But when the "situation" requires I think it's more like an announcement to the commanding officer that he's going to use the weapon, I think the officer should be able to draw the weapon if it's necessary to protect yourself or someone else in imminent danger. Someone correct if i'm wrong?
You Nords have literally every aspect of your society figured out and are going on the right track. You don't need anyone else's approval, least of all an Americans.
Well, nowadays your answer does not make sense, for example in Malmö (Sweden) there’s some places police and ambulance personnel don’t feel safe and do not enter, And if they do they will get rocks thrown on their cars and body
@@camillanyberg2530YOU DO HAVE OTHER VIOLENT CRIME .bUT YOU DON'T GIVE A SHIT ABOUT THOSE WHO MUST RISK THEIR LIVES TO STOP IT. DID YOU WATCH THE SAME VIDEO WE DID? BULLET AND BOMBPROOF POLICE STATION BUT ZERO IMMEDIATE PROTECTION FOR THE COPS IN THE FIELD. YOU CAN WALK DOWN THE STREET AND WALK INTO A ROBBERY OR STABBING OR IN THE CASE OF THE UK A SOLDIER GETTING BEHEADED, BUT THE RESPONDING COPS, CAN'T DO SHIT BECAUSE they're NOT ARMED.
@@camillanyberg2530 TRUE....BUT....You DONT have the DIVERSITY that we do through out your History that we do. You havent taken in HUGE WAVES of people who already are, or become Criminals. AND, LOOK...at what's happening NOW, in Sweden, for example!
There's a lot to be said in this discussion, but I just want to say that I think the thinking of the Norwegian police is "If you have a hammer, everything looks like a nail." It makes sense, since with the militarization of the police in the US, there's more & more police aggression.
clewis was going to write an comment but you wrote my thought better then I could do. Also the Police In the Nordic is philosophy as an coordinator and mediator(think thats the word) then an Law bringer. they help solve the problem before the problem becomes to big. In the US the Police is more of an Deal whit the sympthon not the problem and whit an Armed Police you agigate the problem and hide small sympthon until the plague hit. like puting an an 2X4 feet plank on an dam thats that got an 10 feet crack. you hide the symthon but not the problem.
The more weapons the police carry or use, the more weapons criminals will think they need for success. The easier the police uses their weapon, the more likely a criminal will use it. Many countries are in the spiral of violence. US but also middle America, and others around the world. Sadly it doesn't work the other way around, if police stops any form of violence today, the criminal violence will continue. It takes a fundamental change in society to return to 'normal' again. So wherever escalation can be stopped or reduced, it should be done.
I couldn't help but laugh out loud when he said "you hit like a girl" :) A huge faux pas for most Swedes, and if you look at her reaction you can tell she was thinking something along the lines of "wow, did he really just say that?".
Fredrik Svensson I wonder how he did not think that it could be interpreted as rudeness, even though I am American. I am from a very politically left family, though. Mostly socialist and Atheist.
one very big thing i noticed at around 14:03 (generally at that part) is the american cop assumes there is something worse then the crime. where the nordic police assume just some guy ran a red light. one thinks (i must keep there hands here so they do not attack) the other thinks (if they decide to attack) there is a assumption of guilt on the americans part.
@@rexuz2482 I actually live in the US and know the day to day with cops, its a pretty safe job compared to the most dangerous ones. with the exception of major cities like chicago and specific events where there is clear danger.
@@snowy-g9p Yes but why compare it to the most dangerous jobs? The Police like any other work branch have to aim towards the goal of having 0 deaths each year. Of course that won't happen but you should do everything you can the protect your employees.
@@rexuz2482 sure they need to protect there employees but cops have also the job of protecting citizems, how many times was an unarmed person killed and the cops argued they believed they where reaching for a weapon. cops have a standard they need to uphold and if they are scared little pussies who kill flippently because they are scared of everyone thats not a good society.
@Andrew_koala Some cities alone have 100 people shot every weekend. But yes. It's them who try to stop the criminals who are the ones everyone should be scared of. #brainwashed
Not to mention that, atleast in Sweden, its higher education, comparable to a bachelors degree with alot of theory, law, criminology, forensic, psychology etc. US police officers are the equivalent of security guards in Sweden in terms of education, status.
In the Netherlands we have police education ranging from 1,5 years for assisting roles to 4 years for an officer that does more intricate work than a regular officer and a couple of trajectories in-between.
This is a telling example of the difference in culture. The American cop can't understand even remotely how he can serve and protect without a gun. He seems fixated on his gun as the ultimate tool in conflict resolution. Despite my name I am an American living in America and I see first hand how the police here is completely out of control. Unarmed people get gunned down in a hail of bullets almost on a daily basis and the cops don't even get charged. Thankfully I'm white so I am less at risk than my brothers and sisters of color. Six months in a militaristic police academy, here's your gun sonny, go out and uphold the law. What could go wrong? Police academies in Scandinavia are considered institutions of higher education on the level of a bachelor's degree. If your only tool is a hammer every problem looks like a nail. It's not a cliche if it's true.
***** I do live in America. I was born here in 1959. I have probably spent more time in Norway than you have lived. I am intimately familiar with the culture in both countries. How much time have you spent in Scandinavia, or any other country for that matter? America has a culture of violence. Shoot first, ask later (if the victim survives). Violence begets violence. The numbers speak for themselves. America has the highest incarceration rate and recidivism rate in the world, and it isn't because of the Mexicans. 15% of Norway's population are of non-Norwegian ethnicity, i.e. immigrants and descendants of immigrants (lots and lots of Muslims). Drugs are prevalent and you can get any illegal substance just as easy in Oslo as you can in Los Angeles. Norway does, however, not have the 2nd Amendment (and nobody feels less free for it), a war on drugs, or a for-profit prison system. They do have universal health care, free education from preschool to university and social benefits Americans can only dream about. Per capita income is higher than America, the national budget is balanced and their state bank has more money than they know what to do with. Some call it Socialism. You do the math.
***** Why do you keep swearing and RANDOMLY SHOUTING? Just for future reference; if you want to get your point across without failing and seeming like a total moron and/or jackass, stay calm and type as if you were writing an essay. You honestly seem like the crazy one here. Just saying...
Something important which wasn't pointed out, but easy to see, is the difference in conception of the public by the American police officers, vs the Nordic police officers. It has become an inescapable fact that American police officers very much view themselves as an occupying force (especially in big cities) -- they imagine every citizen as a potential criminal; a potential enemy in the same sort of way that a soldier might be wary of the citizens in a country they have invaded. On the other hand, it seems that the Nordic police officers still think of themselves as not distinguished from the citizenry. They are citizens who have taken up a specific job, in the same way that everyone else takes up jobs. This is a perspective which encourages more empathy & imagining the other more complexly. Personally, I think our police would do well to learn from the police in the Nordic countries.
Exactly! Action provokes reaction...you treat people like shit...prepare to be getting an equal treatment. I would say in defense of US police officers that they are the victim of the everybody should own a gun policy
That's a good way of describing it. I think most of us think about our police force in the same way as ambulance workers, nurses or firefighters. We need them for our society to work, and usually we are kind to each other. You can find pictures of a female wearing a niqab, who is being hugged by a Danish police officer. Hundreds of people have pictures from Copenhell with arms around police officers. Danish police is armed, but their guns are rarely used. I can't recall the last time someone was shot by our police. They are wonderful, and very well educated.
The Nordic countries are very strong egalitarian societies, where the sense that we are all equal and in the same boat is part of our DNA and identity. The dog-eat-dog "every man for himself" mentality that dominates in the US is terribly destructive and will tear apart the fabric of society. You can't build a family or society on a foundation of greed and selfishness. The US as a whole will never get rid of this problem until they stop their ridiculous brainwashed fear of all things 'Socialism' = universal healthcare, affordable education for all, well educated police that are part of the community etc, that's not 'Communism', that's common sense and how you build a safe stress free place to live. As things are now, too many Americans live in a constant fight-or-flight mode thanks to decades of their country being run by greedy politicians and the endless hunt for a quick profit, throwing the majority under the bus. I weep for my friends and family in the US.
@Andrew_koala You may not know, but 'conception' has several different definitions in English. Some of its many definitions are "the way in which something is perceived or regarded," "a general notion; an abstract idea," and "understanding; ability to imagine." Edit: I used the word 'conception' because it more properly describes someone's abstract internal model of the world -- how they conceive of it.
One of the most important reasons for people not being killed on the spot for a wrong move in Scandinavia and in Europe in general is the attitude towards a person's life. In Europe each life is considered to be worth much more than in the US.
@@newlifenowife3522 ..Then they will take your license (and guns an so on if you have any...and the rest of your life, is a hard way back)...and yeah you will be broke if you arent a police,judge politician or a member of some club-elite.... and yeah if you take the wrong zig in your backpocket out from a bar ...with trace of cbd-thc ...it just have to be traceable. The same will happen no mathr if you get a poitive test (oh yeah it can be fixed also if you do somethibg stupid as to give them a pee-test ...guees what it can be wrong or fixed... Same will happen you will have to yes you have a drugproblem and take a 6-8month course, or they will keep your license, and yes it will be on your record (cant go to us cause they will say you are a druggie) for the rest of your life....And yes the zig can be from a cop -8infact thhere are some of hte larger cops assosiacions that have had a cooperation with PD for decades and they look up to some of them and would rather be armed at the hips at all times and "play cops and robbers out of a western"..... humans will be humans where ever they are, but.
Answer to Julie Aaris Hydén: there are a total of six episodes in this series. Three episodes are now published in their entirety on TH-cam - the links can be found in the description above. I hope to be able to publish further episodes here on TH-cam as well.
***** Your guess is as good as mine, but I'm working on making it happen. Things take time though; come up with topics, pitch them, fix funding, prepare the shootings, film, edit, and broadcast/publish... We're talking 1-2 years easily. Not to scare you off, though :) Really hoping to be able to make a second season though!
I think Peter is missing the point, that the evidence in favour for the more relaxed approach working, is that we have so few episodes. Sadly it seems Denmark may be a little worse off than the rest of Scandinavia. I've always wondered who thought that barding in, guns ready, screaming at the "suspect" was a good idea in situations where tempers are already running high, and the situation is already potentially explosive.
It is to create a feeling of shock & awe and establish control over the situation immediately. By presenting a front of overwhelming and intimidating force, the suspect is more likely to submit to law enforcement officials instead of trying to exacerbate the situation.
DantehMan That may work, if everybody are rational, and have a good idea of what is going on. Add a bit of paranoia, confusion, maybe intoxicants, and desperation, and you have the recipe for bad mistakes happening. Someone sleeping, is woken up by strangers barging in, they don't have time to rationalize that it is the police, and may come to the conclusion that they are being robbed... shots are fired, and the police empty more rounds into a _suspect_ or just an unlucky victim of a mistaken identity, than the northern European police fire in a year combined. (IIRC that has happened)
Asbjørn Grandt That is why, when these situations happen, the police always shout to identify themselves. When entering a residence or confronting someone by surprise, they are trained to always identify themselves as police. Also, police only shoot when they feel their lives or the lives of others are in danger and there is no other way to diffuse the situation. That is why the shooting of innocents is relatively rare. As for those cases like with Michael Brown and these recent unfortunate police killings, they were only fired upon when the officers at the scene felt they were about to be put in danger. As it turns out, they were not, but it is a split-second decision they were trained to make. In my initial response I was not trying to give any opinion but now I'm forced to because you gave your own and I thought to respond. The most general thing I can say about police shock & awe tactics in the US is that they are borne from incidents of police being too slow, too gentle, and giving suspects enough time to either escape or fight back, sometimes with deadly consequences. Everything Whittingham does in this episode he was trained to do because one time a cop didn't do it and was attacked and possibly killed. They don't do things because of what can happen, but because of what did happen.
detcord1 Every approach has a flaw. Do you have the magic method that will work 100% of the time perfectly? Second, obviously that isn't "likely" (>50% chance of it happening) to happen because that usually doesn't happen. More often than not, the suspect submits immediately and the police take them into custody without any violence perpetrated. Keep in mind that the shock & awe tactic is utilized not just by police in hostile situations but also by militaries and special forces all over the world. It is a tried and true tactic for taking down an enemy as quickly and, hopefully, bloodlessly as possible.
It is amazing how scared the US police force are.They are scared of every single scenario,no matter the situation.They are also giving the impression that Americans are the most volatile and dangerous people on earth.
Well they pretty much are so they are not wrong. Just the past Halloween, in 3 days(Friday-Sunday) in ONE city alone they had 105 shootings. IN 3 DAYS! That's more than my city have had in it's entire lifetime by far.
21:52- 22:13 Guns are deadly force, and deadly force is a cop's last option. If you give them a gun, let them walk around with a gun, and train them to pull their guns, it will become their first. But giving them bulletproof glass? That I gladly give them, because that's kinda hard to kill anyone with.
+Galaith100 Yea, he essentially says "How can you justify defending yourselves without harming others but you don't defend yourselves by harming others." He's totally missing the point.
+Galaith100 you words in the politicians ears. I had a relative dying in her patrol car.. .germany doesnt protect its cops, only its politicians who drive around in tanks that look like cars.
Goliath100 historically the idea of not arming the police has been tested. there are cases where criminals have shot police officers who could not defend themselves, by stopping the perpetrator. the most prominent example is in Denmark is Palle Sørensen, who killed 4 police officers. The perpetrator killed them on by one, any officer who stood in his way. we need to keep police officers safe, lile they keep us safe. en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palle_S%C3%B8rensen
+!eXplore!- The point being made was about Passive Defence being (mostly, there's a point where it just becomes paranoia) unproblematic, not that cops should have no Offensive Defence. But about offensive: Standard Norwegian Cops are better armed than Standard US Cops. The higher criteria for use also means heavier arms. And I have no problem with that, and I don't thing you have problems with that either. I actuall think that Norwegain cops should get PDW with their current demands of use.
As an American, I think US police could learn a lot from the approach of police in Norway (as well as Sweden, Finland and Iceland) - particularly about how to de-escalate situations of potential conflict, rather than raising the level of violence. Obviously there are a lot of differences between our countries (and far more guns everywhere in the US, making policing much more dangerous), but the "us vs. them" mentality is so entrenched with US police, and, as the violence and protests of the past week have exemplified, we desperately need to re-think how we educate, train, arm and deploy police so that they do not continue to brutalize civilians (especially people of color) and become feared and hated by the very people they are supposed to be serving and protecting.
there is lot of guns in Finland too, but there is no reason to use those against police, police will treat you nicely anyway and you can not get extreme long prison time, so why to make things worse? if you killed someone it is just best to call police and tell them to arrest you, stay couple years in prison and that is it.
Just like Freezed Eve said, I think a lot of the situations cant be compared just with the police force and how they enforce the law. You should take inconsideration the prison sentences in Nordics. If you have an illegal firearm with you, you don't go to prison necessarily. You get a fine and probation period, so your only "way out" is not shooting the police, you just hand them the gun and go on with your life. If you have just pouch of say marijuana, you don't go to prison either. So again, no need to get violent. I think the prison sentences atleast in Finland can be sometimes too short, considering the crime committed, but on the other hand it makes the job of police more safe. The length of prison sentence is not something that makes criminality go away, if you just look at USA, you can see that people still commit crimes, even if the sentence is 7 lifetimes in prison or something like that. I think I've seen a study where, most of the incarcerated criminals have ADHD/ADD, so they lack the possibility to make good decisions, so the long prison sentences dont really affect their behaviour.
In the US, there's an expectation that the police should do everything, from chasing criminals and up to checking up on elders who've fallen down the stairs. If there's any problem, you call 911. In the "Nordics", there's a desire to try and fix the situation from the ground up -- reduce inequality, healthcare, mental health professionals, education, jobs, stable communities, etc., so that there's less opportunity for dangerous situations to appear. It's no secret that poverty breeds move poverty and crime. Simply sending more police into disadvantaged communities won't solve any of your problems. It's a cycle of nightmare. This is a hard task for everyone, and it costs a lot of money, but it moves the police away from being a pillar of community to just one of the few dozen or so mechanisms that allow our society to function better. Or maybe I'm naive, I dunno.
@@Miksumr Finland's greatest treasure is its people, and there's not a lot of them anyway. You want to focus on keeping communities safe, stable and prosperous rather than just throwing people into jail to die.
This series is really well made and worth watching ( in my humble opinion), the subjects treated could benefit from more time. I think a one hour show would bring more depth and would not be too long. Thank you.
Well also a police education here is a bachelors degree of 3 years where they also focus a lot of psychology and de-escalating situations on top of everything else.
This is such an interesting series, I can't wait for more. As a lifelong American with relatives in Sweden, I go there at least twice a year & spend as much time as I can. Summers there are glorious, as are the women. I've never had an encounter with the police there, and seldom see them. The sound of sirens is uncommon, even is Stockholm. Where I live in Texas (suburban Dallas) the sirens are constant, the police are everywhere & are usually very nasty. The helicopters are a daily annoyance & the sound of gunfire is common. Texas also has "open Carry" laws which are truly terrifying. I myself was washing my car one day when 2 teens ran up my driveway, aimed handguns at my face & took my car. Why they didn't shoot me i'll never know. And it was only a Toyota Camry! You would think they would've stolen the Corvette next door. The police arrived & were very rude, like they couldn't be bothered. Their advice? "Get a gun and man-up. Next time kill the motherfuckers!" When I watch the news on Swedish tv, it's always shocking to me how few murders there are. In the US it's murders (mostly with guns) daily, even just local news. Most Texans LOVE their guns & consider it one of their American god given (yes, seriously) freedoms. This is freedom?
Why is this guy laughing about weapons so much? The real question is how many police have been shot? The American cop is so concerned with with his safety . Seems he is in the wrong job.
To think of the fact that the US police education range from 6 to 14 months, that's fucking crazy!! In Sweden there are psych evals and you study law, social science, psychology and so on. And it's not easy to get into the academy and you study for almost 3 years. Whenever I've encountered a Swedish cop they have been very friendly, thoughtful and took the time to listen. Once I happened to walk straight into a police chase. Their main concern was to get me to safety. They were firm, but professional. Another time I saw two policemen stopping a fight in the streets outside a pub (Friday night, of course). They assessed the situation carefully, and kept people from getting too close to the fight. One of the fighters was very violent and threatening and called out to his mates for help. The police escorted him to another street where they talked to him. They didn't touch anyone, except from, you know, separating them and making sure they wouldn't harm anyone. The most important thing: they talked. No threatening with weapons, just calm (but loud, because the brawlers were screaming) conversation. I think that's why people calmed down. If you start waving a gun around, things can escalate and people can panic. I'm happy the Swedish police carries guns, but I'm also happy that they really consider it the last resort. And that the point is to immobilise (not aiming to kill) and that they have to shoot warning shots beforehand.
Hej, i really like your program. Very interesting, this episode really shows how peace and beautiful the nordic countries are. Waiting to see more coming. :D
+K. Li Well, its getting worse every year. Mby shootings doesent happen in Umeå. But Umeå is up more in the north, Down in Malmö. goteborg. stockholm. and couple of other cities shootings and crime have been going up. In my town atleast i see the police every day, and i hear sirens every day. We had around 1-2shooting a week this summer in a town with 100k people. Also Malmö had like 8-15 Grenade attacks this year.
+K. Li Homogeneous societies tend to have less crime for some reason. There's less socio-economic contrast also. When you're "poor" you're not really that poor. And the rich aren't otherworldly rich. Everyone seems to be pretty middle class, even unemployed people living on benefits.
The question of Peter; how do you validate bulletproof glass and such efforts yet not carrying guns. The answer is simple; one is defensive & preventative. The other is tool designed to kill people at a distance. :V
True, but I think the answer is that bulletproof glass, steel sheet reinforced walls etc can’t be added instantly or without additional costs in case the circumstances change so that they they become a necessity. What comes to gun policies, the process can be redesigned instantly without extra costs if need be.
Also building is a solid object that doesn't move and everyone pretty much know where it is located. That makes it easy target and over all target in totally different way than police officer that moves around. It is common sense to protect the building in the way it is done. It is not equally common sense to arm the police officers to their teeth for normal patrolling. At least not in here.
been to helsinki quite a few times and only police interaction was when my brother and I were coming back from Estonia when they stopped 10 ppl of all colors. quick show of passport and that's it. American society as a whole needs to change.
I have such respect for the Nordic police officers who are able to do their job without the need of firing their gun at every suspect running from them. It is one of the big stones building a safe community.
well, they must be doing well in their jobs as police officers if people don't feel unsafe. I got the feeling that the LAPD officer felt like he was more prepared because he had always a gun at hand, but how is he doing his job if that gun is always in need of use?
Nicole Santos I think the most important thing is education. Information and courses in phsycology, mental illnesses, first aid, investigation, law, leadership/management.. etc.. In Norway, the education a police officer have to go through is a bachelors degree in college/academy. It's a theoretical and practical education. I think it's extremely important to trust the police. To trust that they know what they are doing, avoiding escalation in situations that can get from bad to worse. That said, the police are now carriyng guns in Norway too. The society is in development, and things change (like it always does).. we see that criminals now more than before carry weapons, and I am for that the police should be able to protect themselves - the key here is defence and not offense. I hope that even though they have a gun at hand, the ground work they learned (and keep learning in the field) will be their number one go to, before anyone pulls out a gun.
Because the amount of criminals and gang members with guns in LA are quiiiiiiite a lot higher than Mo i rana, Norway lol. In many places in the US police will be shot at by criminals just for driving past their street in a police car. Imagine if the gang members also knew that police wasn't allowed to have guns on them and therefore can't defend themselves. It would be a slaughter house.
Very interesting from many perspectives. For instance: is it more important to be clean shaven, wearing a suit and then get armed, after 6 months of education? Or studie for 2 years regarding how to approach a stranger that you do not know? I think it says a lot.
We arm our police less but at the same time we train them strictly so that become more then just sentinels with guns. when i look at Scandinavian police at large i see something that is more akin to peacekeepers. A mixture of a guardian, a diplomat and a Caretaker.
This guy seems way more friendly and level-headed than that James Conway guy from the prison episodes. Conway deliberately mocked the prisons and charged the guards with being too "liberal" throughout the episode
They should have traveled to Oslo. Would have shown more situations where the Police handles stuff without the need for weapons and it would show situations where they did bring out their weapons. In my opinion only combatants carry weapons in normal circumstance and I wouldnt like Norwegian Police to arm themselves like soldiers going to war.
As a swede I should say that the places they show are pretty remote and rural, places like Stockholm and Gothenburg (two largest cities in sweden) suffer from gang crime pretty much every week...
Many people were concerned of how safe it is for the Norwegian police officers not to have their guns on the person. Thing is: it seems to work - and be way more safe than carrying the weapon on them. Probably because it puts an emphasis on deescalation instead of escalating a situation with threats to an agressive/scared/desperate person.
The police officers in Norway normally don't wear weapons. But that's different in Sweden and maybe also in Finland and Denmark. Please notice that they are talking about different countries.
The problem with these films is that they always speak about the "Nordic countries". But there are important differences between Sweden, Denmark, Finland, Iceland and Norway, for instance about these countries' history, geography, political system, administration and welfare system. I was born in Germany in 1976 and I have lived, worked and studied in Sweden and Denmark for many years. I've been living in Sweden for 19 years.
Another problem is that these films are about seven, eight or nine years old. Today, Sweden has strong problems with gang crime, but I think not the other Nordic countries that much. That maybe has to do with the differences between these countries, even about welfare and immigration politics.
In Sweden, the welfare state doesn't have the same services anymore as it was until the 1980's or still until about the year 2005. The social differences between rich and poor people are much bigger today as they were for 20 years ago, around the year 2000. On the other hand, a lot of refugees from the Middle East (Arabic countries) came to Sweden between around 2000 and 2015, and some of these people are not integrated into Swedish society and have totally different values, coming from Islamic countries with totally different societies and cultures.
Almost every political party (seven of eight parties in the Swedish parliament) want to have harder penalties, and even prison penalties for young criminals from the age of 15. More and more people today are getting judged to longer penalties and there're to many prisoners, so that sometimes two people have to cheer for a room there. A 17 years old boy could only get visited by his parents a few times during six months.
In my opinion, most Swedish politicians are real populists and a lot of Swedish people support that. Earlier, many people discussed if longer punishments in prison really help against crime. But today, the political parties make a weekly contest about coming out with new suggestions about harder punishments and even the police is getting more and more rights, to arrest people or using water cannons. I think, Sweden, which earlier was a social-liberal orientated nation, has become a quiet conservative country.
I like Sweden and I'm a proud Swedish and German citizen, and I also like these films "Norden", but I think that people who watch them can get an unrealistic picture of Swedish society. And Denmark has always been a very conservative country.
abbath1586 Hi, thanks for watching! If we have the possibility to produce a second season of the series, then healthcare is on the shortlist as one potential theme.
John Stark If and when you do, please note that the Danish healtcare system is building new huge hospitals in the bigger cities, and so our current ones aren't a complete representation of our system :) also : thanks for a great show :)
American view the citizens as enemies. Europe has another view a friendly view, almost to a point a family view. Is what i take away from the episodes Nordic prisons and this episode
this is a 6 year old comment, but I wanted to clarify that Europe is not some homogeneous amazing country. It's an entire continent with lots of different countries and lots of different cultures. There's some shared values between a lot of European countries, but there's probably not a single value that's shared by all of Europe. The Nordics are all fairly similar, but there's differences there too.
It is strange that this American cop takes the personal safety and security as a higher standard than the public safety. Apparantly he doesn't see that when it is at the safest for everybody it will also be safe for the police. Introducing American policemethods in the Nordic countries will only make it unsafe.
22:05 Bulletproof windows isn't going to kill someone. You cant compare a window and a gun. One is a precautionary, purely defensive meassure. The other is proactive, and offensive. They both have their place but it's not a comparison you can make in that context.
Peter i guess would be surprised to know that even closer to L.A in Canada in the Province of Newfoundland ,police did not carry a firearm on their body up until 1998(it was locked in a truck of a police car)
John Stark this is a very interesting series, i love to see how various professionals from the USA react to how we nordic people handle various aspects of our societies. Thank you! Greetings from Denmark.
@@starkjo I really hope that yle will give you permission to continue this. Wouldn't mind if you would redo the episodes there already are and go a lot more deeper with the topics. I think think in this current climate that would be good way to open some discussions. Also in Finland with where we want to direct this country with many of these topics. The under 30 minutes you have now per episode just doesn't give enough time to have meaningful discussion over the topics. I'm sure there was a lot longer talks between the quests and local people than is shown here. This shows just bare surface from those and it look like the visitors are just shocked and leave without deeper understanding from the values, benefits and goals that our systems have. And with this I mainly talk about from this and the jail episodes. With the religion one I'm not sure that person who believes as conservative American do would ever be open to see equality as value as it is seen here. But yes getting more of episodes to this would be awesome.
You watch USA police reality tv. There's lots of shooting from both police and common people, lot of screaming, it's like war. Then you watch Finnish version called Poliisit, and you get to see a local police officers joking with drunk people to get them move home or having a discussion with teenagers why to become a police officer. Lots of apologizing from the part of people and police waving their hand for good night. You don't need to ask which country I prefer to live in.
I think the important part of having the police officers have to get permission to use their guns, or at least let their captains know (I wasn't entirely clear on which it was), is that it makes them stop and think about whether or not lethal force is actually necessary. Too often in the US, officers don't stop to think and just use lethal force first, rather than the non-lethal weapons available to them. Part of that is probably traceable back to the training. In the US, 6 months is the average training duration followed by an internship with a local police force (at least in my state, other states may vary depending on the laws/regulations). I rather like making them take longer training courses. Also, if they have the non-lethal methods drilled into them more, perhaps then they won't be so trigger happy. But I think in the end, the root of the problem with the police forces in the US is the culture. Police officers, particularly in the big cities, are so paranoid, and often feel like they need to shoot first because otherwise they'll be killed. It's a perception and attitude problem and I honestly have no idea a society would go about fixing that. I know in the small suburb my parents live in, the police don't feel like that ( I'm friends with several of the guys on the overnight crew), but in the big cities it seems to be a real issue. And the racial aspects don't help matters any. I'm not aware of any racial profiling in my local big city, but that doesn't mean it isn't there. After all, 98% of my state is white, and the majority of the minorities live in the nearest large city (which I just recently moved to). It's entirely possible that it's going on without my knowledge.
One has to feel sorry for the LAPD, where every encounter with any citizen can be expected to turn into a gunfight. No wonder they are uptight and trigger-happy. The situation is totally different in Norther Europe, especially the Nordic countries. The Police in Norway and Iceland go about unarmed. They HAVE fairly quick access to weapons safely locked away in their cars, and they are very rarely needed. This state of affairs is evidence of the kind of society being policed, not an indication that the police is too relaxed. After the Utoya shootings, Norwegian police were armed for a while - they soon gave it up because there were so many accidental discharges, usually when weapons were being secured at the end of a shift.
@@warbler1984 I think this goes a little too far. I would not start from the premise that if the police have a weapon, the threshold for using it is also higher. It is all about training. How the police can calm the situation and what are the practices (= consequences) of using a weapon. In Finland, the police always have a gun. And the weapon is not used any more often than in Norway. Restrictions on the carrying of a weapon (in Norway) undermine the discretion and responsibility of the individual police.
Great video(s)! I've learned a lot about the Nordic culture through these. I grew up in Ukraine and have spent the majority of my life in America. From my perspective, especially based on the comparisons made in the videos between the subjects and people in the comments, the only thing I could say it is, in my opinion, difficult to compare the two. Each culture, more specifically police in this situation, adapt differently to their environments. Though I do not agree with, for example an disproportional amount of shots fired by American vs Noridic police, I do realize that this difference cannot be compared, especially by comparing proportionately-scaled police forces to amount of shots fired. Factors such as amount of people armed, multi-culturality, and especially learning from previous events play a huge role in the varying police tactics.
In the USA guns and violence in general is seen as a good way of resolving disputes. For example many people have no qualms about shooting a burglar. This thinking leads to a lot of gun violence, people shoot each other over petty arguments or sometimes just by accident, someone comes home late at night and someone else misinterprets that as a burglar attempt and opens fire. The idea that you need a gun to protect yourself leads to an arms race and consequently a lot more people get shot.
Problem is that criminals in the US will have guns regardless if it is allowed to have them or not. If they are banned from people it will only mean that all the criminals have guns and the law abiding citizens will not and have no way to protect themselves. Some cities and areas in the US are pretty much lawless and the amount of crimes are on a level that is hard to understand for a nordic person. To live in a house in the US with your family without being allowed to arm yourself is a no no.
A year or two ago, the Iceland police fatally shot a man first time ever in its history. The police apologised even though the action was justified, and the whole nation regretted the incident. Amazing.
The American policeman uses military terms like “deployed in the field”. His mentality is that the police are soldiers in a war thus everyone is a potential suspect like the guy who ran a red light. That thought process is a HUGE part of the problem people have with the police.
I think what in fact gets lost to Peter Whittingham and maybe the American society in general is, that people in Scandinavian countries indeed live in intact communities, totally in contrast what you could say about the USA. Living in an intact community takes away the fear of your fellow citizens and largely takes away the necessity for crimes. If you live in a social environment without substantial fear for survival you are far less inclined to rob someone or some bank. But if your environment isn't capable or willing to support you when you can't do that yourself, when people become desparate, they tend to take desparate measures to ensure their survival... unethical measures.
Ralf Oltmanns You hit the nail on the head there. It is by and large the extensive Nordic welfare state that creates so much less crime and less fear of crime in Nordic societies.
+hampe hjsjdf I got mugged once when in Stockholm, I was 17 at the time. They got a hold of 20 bucks, a broken watch and half a pack of cigarettes. The riches I lost that day! From what I read in the papers I think the muggings here are more teens stealing from teens rather than adults getting stuff stolen under the threat of violence. Not saying it's only that, but a big portion of it. I guess mugging teens these days is a bit more lucrative than back when I was young though, as everyone above 12 years old has a smartphone... I don't know if my own experience has perhaps also colored my opinion on the matter.
Thanks for producing this video. I think it reminds us (in the U.S.) that there needn't be as much crime if there were more social programs for the poor, mentally ill, homeless, etc. We don't still have "mental hospitals" as we did in the distance past. Now they are called the homeless problem.
Oh, so you think they have more "social programs" for the poor, mentally ill, homeless and etc, in Scandinavia? Nope, they are about the same as the US. The difference is mentality of the people. In Scandinavia, it is cooperation, community building practices (very homogenous society), in the US it is competition, you must be better, have more, be richer, prettier, faster, stronger, more intelligent than your neighbour. In Scandinavia, there were times where your only and immediate help were your neighbours (and sometimes it still is). In the US, your neighbours don't even know who you are. There is zero need to screw over the other guy, if the other guy is your lifeline one day or another, because one hand washes the other, and both washes our backs.
The Norwegian police are good at solving situations without resorting to the use of weapons. This is because they don`t live in fear of fronting gunslingers every day, maniacs carrying weapon because "it`s their right to be armed for protection". There is a reason for the US police to open fire many, many thousand times more than the nordic countries. In 2019 the Norwegian police armed themselves 27 times a day, but only 5 criminals were injured and one died due to exchange of fire.
Because in the US compared to the Nordic countries every criminal has a gun. Criminals don't care for laws. So even in the states were it's really hard to get the permit to have a gun all the criminals still have them.
@@rexuz2482 I see the problem. I`m so lucky not to be living over there. So. Is the answer to arm the citizens even more, and give more criminals guns?
@@Eljulitus The criminals already have easy access to guns, in their early teens already so I doubt it would make things that much worse. But at least more homeowners and store owners could defend themselves and scare of criminals if they are allowed to have weapons to. In the perfect world there should be no guns at all like in the past in Scandinavia. But when you get to the point like in the US where there are so many guns already out there for the criminals to use you have to let the citizens defend themselves.
@@rexuz2482 Its just as easy to get a gun in Norway... Just sayin... Criminals here dont care for laws either, just two weeks ago there was a dude who murdered a woman by shooting her 15 or so times in broad daylight in Oslo. If you truly want to do crime and get a hold of weapons in Norway, you can. So the access to guns is guaranteed not the only reason, or even the biggest reason as to why USA got so many shootings. It has to do with your attitude (not you in particular, but some Americans) and probably the biggest reason is the poverty. Poor people see no other way out and grow up with crime to earn money in the supposedly "land of opportunity". Because we have a functional system in Norway that tries to take care of poor people its way less likely for someone to have to grow up with crime here to earn money. It becomes a life style from early on. So if USA want less shootings, fix the damn system. Right now the vast majority of Americans lives with third world country standards in a supposed "first world country". But since so many Americans are by whatever absurd reason against taxes youre not very likely to get less shootings. Its extremely obvious why USA got so much gun crimes and shootings, yet almost every American seems to ignore the real reason as to why there so much gun crime and shootings.
I'm Danish so I'm not trying to defend American police or anything here (why would I?), but it's too easy to just blame it all on them. The general population in the Nordics aren't armed. That's a big fucking difference, if you're a police officer having to stop a fight, a theft or whatever. If they see a guy in a car make a weird movement, that's quite possibly a gun. It isn't here. It's extremely unlikely that you'll ever see anyone armed unless you're our hunting in the middle of nowhere. Cops aren't nearly as 'on edge' all the time here cause they can pretty much assume they're the only one with a gun. That's one of the many downsides of having such a relaxed gun legislation in the USA. If you're going to rob a gas station or whatever, you risk them being armed. So then you bring a gun to protect yourself. Then the cops show up and they're expecting you to be armed and pull out their guns. Of course there are going to be way more shootings of criminals *and* of cops when "everyone" is armed and 'on edge' at all times. If I was interested in robbing a gas station here, I wouldn't need a weapon at all. I could just show up and since I'm likely to be bigger than whoever's behind the counter, they'll probably just hand over whatever I tell them to. If I wanna be a bit more scary I suppose I could grab a stick, a bat or whatever. So even after a robbery, the police here doesn't have to instantly be ready for being shot at or whatever.
That's not true. Norway as an example ranks in the top 10 in the world when it comes to having firearms. I think the difference is how we regulate the laws
+scarlace You know, as the one introducing a counter argument, you are the one with burden of proof. Make the damn google search yourself, you lazy git.
Eter Puralis yeah no not really, what I stated was pure fact, and you can check it up yourself. I already did, so you not wanting to check it is your own damned laziness that speaks. It's very easy to put into google: "Do Norway have a gun registry?" "What's the most sold firearms in Norway" It is not very hard. All I'm doing is promoting people to do their own research. If they cannot do even that for such a small fact check it's not worth my time, so sorry if you do not like that. But I really don't care:)
+scarlace I honestly don't give a rat's ass how easy it is. i don't eve care what you're talkingabout. You're giving "facts" without tagging your sources. no one has the slightest reason or obligation to take you on faith. That's not how it works.
I was born in Britain where the police again are not routinely armed, I once saw a police officer talk to a man who was wielding a machete totally out of control but the officer managed to calm him down and give him the weapon.I now live in Germany and have seen the police here talk to people that have been wielding weapons no shots fired, if it can happen here in Europe surely they can adopt the same approach in the U.S.
+Alba Productions This is only me speculating and I know absolutely nothing about the justice system in Britain and also very little about the american system. But from piecing together what little I do know, my conclusion is that it would be harder for the police in america to reign in a criminal on a psychological level without presenting significant threat, simply because of their fear of the treatment they will have to face afterwards.
Wow.....this guy should really try to visit Copenhell. We have police present, because it's the law, but we have needed them ONCE in 9 years. Basically they listen to music, hug people and we take pictures with them....and that's it.
Damn this comment is 9 years, but I'll reply. No we think that's long here. It's sad. Also at least from people I know, the training is almost identical to military boot camp in the way it's designed.
Did he not realise that the towns he was visiting were older than the country he comes from, what they are doing has been working for them for a long time. I notice in this and other in the series where the Americans are acting as if they are taking a position of someone older and wiser society, like some kind of messenger from the enlightened land. So coming from a law enforcement officer that thinks that smoking pot can get you 4 years, but running from the cops is a death penalty without trial is just fine, I would not trust his stance on any subject involving firearms.
I didn't see that at all. He has his own experience and training and background, and the show is specifically there to contrast. He's explaining himself. One of the problems people have is to assume the worst of people.
This poor Captain is missing the biggest point and that is attitude of the population. Americans are overwhelmingly paranoid with a massively selfish attitude. Their property, their rights etc. Plus you add a society based on revolution, the wild west and the fact that they insist on their rights to own weapons and there are so many weapons allowed in their country it is a recipe for constant tension and "road rage" on and off their roads. In Scandinavia there are lots of guns too but for hunting and some sport but no one has a militia with loads of automatic weapons and hand guns plus they value their society having a role of caring for each other. This isn't about equipment on a police officer's belt, it's societal attitudes. Look at where they are today in June of 2020.
@@NorwegianNationalist1 yes but that is nothing like the USA has with citizens armed like an army where they form their own militia and do not report to any authority
5:50 thats wrong translation, correct would be ''theyre a bit more on the offensive. and then you have the tv-series where they run around in high heels''
John, thank you so much for your week on these episodes. They've been very interesting to see the differences, even though here in the UK we have a lot more similarities. I wondered if the final two episodes were planned to be released soon?
In Sweden, it is usually considered warm if it is about +70°F or warmer. We also occasionally have really warm days that can be as warm as about +95°F, typically in July and possibly August.
Väldigt väldigt väldigt bra och intressant dokumentär serie! Skulle väldigt gärna sprida den till mina vänner i andra länder och framförallt till amerikaner. Någon information om när resten av världen kan se een?
Holy shit when the nordic cop opened the car door, if an American cop did that I would assume I was about to get the shit kicked out of me and go to jail even if I hadn't done anything lmao
![ค้าง (STILL) - GEMINI [ OFFICIAL MV ]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Ftxx3hk5vkU/mqdefault.jpg)
The Helsinki police have given me a lift home a couple of times due to being too drunk to walk. The best and cheapest taxi service in town!
happend to me aswell i norway XD
Same experience here in rural Finland 😄
Same in sweden haha. Guess we are not that different!
@@MrOrebore We are not that different, you must know that ❤
In usa you'll get arrested for public intoxication
at 4:23 when the finnish police is showing his gear, the other policeman says "älä ota asetta" that's "don't draw your gun" in english, I think the older officer thought the younger one could get carried away and not realize that there would be shitstorm if he unholsters in public.
In Finland the gun is considered to be the last line of defense for the police and if you draw it, the draw itself is considered as use of force, i.e if finnish police officer pulls out his gun that means his prepared to use deadly force and that action in itself is considered as use of force. Am I making any sense =D? Every draw made by police is investigated and must be justifiable so finnish police can't go "gun first, just in case" in situations, like I've seen the U.S. police do.
I noticed the same thing, I think it could be that, because it's a loaded weapon. They have probably strict rules when taking the gun out of the holster. But when the "situation" requires I think it's more like an announcement to the commanding officer that he's going to use the weapon, I think the officer should be able to draw the weapon if it's necessary to protect yourself or someone else in imminent danger. Someone correct if i'm wrong?
@@Miksumr that's correct. Firearms are considered as a last resort weapon, only used in an imminent, life threatening situations.
Yeah I noticed too. That is probably the reason, kind of hard to tell without the visual but I can't figure out what else it would be.
It's the same in the US, contrary to what you have interpreted from what you have seen.
@@BLARtrofimBLAR Do you really think one could realise the optics of pulling a gun out for an interview with a 6 month training?
You Nords have literally every aspect of your society figured out and are going on the right track. You don't need anyone else's approval, least of all an Americans.
Manas Surya we are not perfect as no country are but we don't have school shootings every week like in the us
Well, nowadays your answer does not make sense, for example in Malmö (Sweden) there’s some places police and ambulance personnel don’t feel safe and do not enter, And if they do they will get rocks thrown on their cars and body
@@hanskenclips6785 Mass immigration ruined Malmö. Sweden solved it horribly. I'm for immigration to an extent but Sweden overdid it.
@@camillanyberg2530YOU DO HAVE OTHER VIOLENT CRIME .bUT YOU DON'T GIVE A SHIT ABOUT THOSE WHO MUST RISK THEIR LIVES TO STOP IT. DID YOU WATCH THE SAME VIDEO WE DID? BULLET AND BOMBPROOF POLICE STATION BUT ZERO IMMEDIATE PROTECTION FOR THE COPS IN THE FIELD. YOU CAN WALK DOWN THE STREET AND WALK INTO A ROBBERY OR STABBING OR IN THE CASE OF THE UK A SOLDIER GETTING BEHEADED, BUT THE RESPONDING COPS, CAN'T DO SHIT BECAUSE they're NOT ARMED.
@@camillanyberg2530 TRUE....BUT....You DONT have the DIVERSITY that we do through out your History that we do. You havent taken in HUGE WAVES of people who already are, or become Criminals. AND, LOOK...at what's happening NOW, in Sweden, for example!
There's a lot to be said in this discussion, but I just want to say that I think the thinking of the Norwegian police is "If you have a hammer, everything looks like a nail." It makes sense, since with the militarization of the police in the US, there's more & more police aggression.
clewis was going to write an comment but you wrote my thought better then I could do.
Also the Police In the Nordic is philosophy as an coordinator and mediator(think thats the word) then an Law bringer.
they help solve the problem before the problem becomes to big. In the US the Police is more of an Deal whit the sympthon not the problem and whit an Armed Police you agigate the problem and hide small sympthon until the plague hit. like puting an an 2X4 feet plank on an dam thats that got an 10 feet crack. you hide the symthon but not the problem.
Exactly America has turn their police and sheriffs into military and it is pretty bad
I agree
The more weapons the police carry or use, the more weapons criminals will think they need for success.
The easier the police uses their weapon, the more likely a criminal will use it.
Many countries are in the spiral of violence. US but also middle America, and others around the world.
Sadly it doesn't work the other way around, if police stops any form of violence today, the criminal violence will continue. It takes a fundamental change in society to return to 'normal' again. So wherever escalation can be stopped or reduced, it should be done.
I couldn't help but laugh out loud when he said "you hit like a girl" :) A huge faux pas for most Swedes, and if you look at her reaction you can tell she was thinking something along the lines of "wow, did he really just say that?".
Fredrik Svensson I wonder how he did not think that it could be interpreted as rudeness, even though I am American. I am from a very politically left family, though. Mostly socialist and Atheist.
Thue Morse you are one of the lucky few americans who hasn't been steeped in right-wing bigotry. I tip my hat to you, sir!
It's a tease. He's sizeing her up.
He just wants her to not be shy.
she should reply;; you talk like a man !
one very big thing i noticed at around 14:03 (generally at that part) is the american cop assumes there is something worse then the crime. where the nordic police assume just some guy ran a red light.
one thinks (i must keep there hands here so they do not attack)
the other thinks (if they decide to attack)
there is a assumption of guilt on the americans part.
If you have seen how quickly a normal traffic stop in the US suddenly turns to a dead police officer you know why they have to be on the alert.
@@rexuz2482 I actually live in the US and know the day to day with cops, its a pretty safe job compared to the most dangerous ones.
with the exception of major cities like chicago and specific events where there is clear danger.
@@snowy-g9p Yes but why compare it to the most dangerous jobs?
The Police like any other work branch have to aim towards the goal of having 0 deaths each year. Of course that won't happen but you should do everything you can the protect your employees.
@@rexuz2482 sure they need to protect there employees but cops have also the job of protecting citizems, how many times was an unarmed person killed and the cops argued they believed they where reaching for a weapon.
cops have a standard they need to uphold and if they are scared little pussies who kill flippently because they are scared of everyone thats not a good society.
@Andrew_koala Some cities alone have 100 people shot every weekend. But yes. It's them who try to stop the criminals who are the ones everyone should be scared of. #brainwashed
The police education in the US seems to be very short. Was it only 6 months ?
In Norway it's 3 years !
In the U.S any clown can be a terrorist, oops I'm sorry, a police officer...
Not to mention that, atleast in Sweden, its higher education, comparable to a bachelors degree with alot of theory, law, criminology, forensic, psychology etc.
US police officers are the equivalent of security guards in Sweden in terms of education, status.
@@Twenty4Eagle Not even security guards, I call them criminals with a badge, nothing less!!
In the Netherlands we have police education ranging from 1,5 years for assisting roles to 4 years for an officer that does more intricate work than a regular officer and a couple of trajectories in-between.
@@LMvdB02 I believe 3 years is the bare minimum here in Norway
If a gun is your best weapon, then every problem seems like a target.
or another adage: "if all you have is a hammer, everything looks like a nail"...
This is a telling example of the difference in culture. The American cop can't understand even remotely how he can serve and protect without a gun. He seems fixated on his gun as the ultimate tool in conflict resolution.
Despite my name I am an American living in America and I see first hand how the police here is completely out of control. Unarmed people get gunned down in a hail of bullets almost on a daily basis and the cops don't even get charged. Thankfully I'm white so I am less at risk than my brothers and sisters of color.
Six months in a militaristic police academy, here's your gun sonny, go out and uphold the law. What could go wrong? Police academies in Scandinavia are considered institutions of higher education on the level of a bachelor's degree.
If your only tool is a hammer every problem looks like a nail. It's not a cliche if it's true.
The criminals are worse in America as well, though. Worse crimes are committed when compared to Scandinavian countries.
Swedish Royal Officer
But for what reasons ... one should think that an analysis of causality would be relevant to the development of solutions.
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I do live in America. I was born here in 1959. I have probably spent more time in Norway than you have lived. I am intimately familiar with the culture in both countries. How much time have you spent in Scandinavia, or any other country for that matter? America has a culture of violence. Shoot first, ask later (if the victim survives). Violence begets violence. The numbers speak for themselves. America has the highest incarceration rate and recidivism rate in the world, and it isn't because of the Mexicans. 15% of Norway's population are of non-Norwegian ethnicity, i.e. immigrants and descendants of immigrants (lots and lots of Muslims). Drugs are prevalent and you can get any illegal substance just as easy in Oslo as you can in Los Angeles. Norway does, however, not have the 2nd Amendment (and nobody feels less free for it), a war on drugs, or a for-profit prison system. They do have universal health care, free education from preschool to university and social benefits Americans can only dream about. Per capita income is higher than America, the national budget is balanced and their state bank has more money than they know what to do with. Some call it Socialism. You do the math.
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Lol, do you have a tummy ache or something? Maybe you ate one to many straw men? Or was it the red herrings?
***** Why do you keep swearing and RANDOMLY SHOUTING? Just for future reference; if you want to get your point across without failing and seeming like a total moron and/or jackass, stay calm and type as if you were writing an essay. You honestly seem like the crazy one here. Just saying...
Something important which wasn't pointed out, but easy to see, is the difference in conception of the public by the American police officers, vs the Nordic police officers.
It has become an inescapable fact that American police officers very much view themselves as an occupying force (especially in big cities) -- they imagine every citizen as a potential criminal; a potential enemy in the same sort of way that a soldier might be wary of the citizens in a country they have invaded.
On the other hand, it seems that the Nordic police officers still think of themselves as not distinguished from the citizenry. They are citizens who have taken up a specific job, in the same way that everyone else takes up jobs. This is a perspective which encourages more empathy & imagining the other more complexly.
Personally, I think our police would do well to learn from the police in the Nordic countries.
Very important point. Thanks.
Exactly! Action provokes reaction...you treat people like shit...prepare to be getting an equal treatment. I would say in defense of US police officers that they are the victim of the everybody should own a gun policy
That's a good way of describing it. I think most of us think about our police force in the same way as ambulance workers, nurses or firefighters. We need them for our society to work, and usually we are kind to each other. You can find pictures of a female wearing a niqab, who is being hugged by a Danish police officer. Hundreds of people have pictures from Copenhell with arms around police officers. Danish police is armed, but their guns are rarely used. I can't recall the last time someone was shot by our police.
They are wonderful, and very well educated.
The Nordic countries are very strong egalitarian societies, where the sense that we are all equal and in the same boat is part of our DNA and identity. The dog-eat-dog "every man for himself" mentality that dominates in the US is terribly destructive and will tear apart the fabric of society. You can't build a family or society on a foundation of greed and selfishness. The US as a whole will never get rid of this problem until they stop their ridiculous brainwashed fear of all things 'Socialism' = universal healthcare, affordable education for all, well educated police that are part of the community etc, that's not 'Communism', that's common sense and how you build a safe stress free place to live. As things are now, too many Americans live in a constant fight-or-flight mode thanks to decades of their country being run by greedy politicians and the endless hunt for a quick profit, throwing the majority under the bus. I weep for my friends and family in the US.
@Andrew_koala You may not know, but 'conception' has several different definitions in English.
Some of its many definitions are "the way in which something is perceived or regarded," "a general notion; an abstract idea," and "understanding; ability to imagine."
Edit: I used the word 'conception' because it more properly describes someone's abstract internal model of the world -- how they conceive of it.
One of the most important reasons for people not being killed on the spot for a wrong move in Scandinavia and in Europe in general is the attitude towards a person's life. In Europe each life is considered to be worth much more than in the US.
Dude I would be scared of the American harming me if I ran a red light...
pale rider lol , people like you produce American killer police force.
if i run a red light , i will immediately commit suicide..............in america.........;;; in norway i will invite the cop to share a joint !!
@palerider957 If you where infront of it ...I wouldnt be suprised the po ran you...and got away with it
@@newlifenowife3522 ..Then they will take your license (and guns an so on if you have any...and the rest of your life, is a hard way back)...and yeah you will be broke if you arent a police,judge politician or a member of some club-elite.... and yeah if you take the wrong zig in your backpocket out from a bar ...with trace of cbd-thc ...it just have to be traceable. The same will happen no mathr if you get a poitive test (oh yeah it can be fixed also if you do somethibg stupid as to give them a pee-test ...guees what it can be wrong or fixed... Same will happen you will have to yes you have a drugproblem and take a 6-8month course, or they will keep your license, and yes it will be on your record (cant go to us cause they will say you are a druggie) for the rest of your life....And yes the zig can be from a cop -8infact thhere are some of hte larger cops assosiacions that have had a
cooperation with PD for decades and they look up to some of them and would rather be armed at the hips at all times and "play cops and robbers out of a western"..... humans will be humans where ever they are, but.
You're so funny! Thanks for the laugh!!
Answer to Julie Aaris Hydén: there are a total of six episodes in this series. Three episodes are now published in their entirety on TH-cam - the links can be found in the description above. I hope to be able to publish further episodes here on TH-cam as well.
Any hints on the topic for the three remaining episodes?
I'm guessing education and health care systems might be two of them.
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Thanks.
Thanks very much. An enjoyable and informative series.
Do you think there will be a second series?
*****
Your guess is as good as mine, but I'm working on making it happen. Things take time though; come up with topics, pitch them, fix funding, prepare the shootings, film, edit, and broadcast/publish... We're talking 1-2 years easily. Not to scare you off, though :) Really hoping to be able to make a second season though!
I think Peter is missing the point, that the evidence in favour for the more relaxed approach working, is that we have so few episodes. Sadly it seems Denmark may be a little worse off than the rest of Scandinavia.
I've always wondered who thought that barding in, guns ready, screaming at the "suspect" was a good idea in situations where tempers are already running high, and the situation is already potentially explosive.
It is to create a feeling of shock & awe and establish control over the situation immediately. By presenting a front of overwhelming and intimidating force, the suspect is more likely to submit to law enforcement officials instead of trying to exacerbate the situation.
DantehMan
That may work, if everybody are rational, and have a good idea of what is going on.
Add a bit of paranoia, confusion, maybe intoxicants, and desperation, and you have the recipe for bad mistakes happening.
Someone sleeping, is woken up by strangers barging in, they don't have time to rationalize that it is the police, and may come to the conclusion that they are being robbed... shots are fired, and the police empty more rounds into a _suspect_ or just an unlucky victim of a mistaken identity, than the northern European police fire in a year combined. (IIRC that has happened)
Asbjørn Grandt That is why, when these situations happen, the police always shout to identify themselves. When entering a residence or confronting someone by surprise, they are trained to always identify themselves as police. Also, police only shoot when they feel their lives or the lives of others are in danger and there is no other way to diffuse the situation. That is why the shooting of innocents is relatively rare.
As for those cases like with Michael Brown and these recent unfortunate police killings, they were only fired upon when the officers at the scene felt they were about to be put in danger. As it turns out, they were not, but it is a split-second decision they were trained to make.
In my initial response I was not trying to give any opinion but now I'm forced to because you gave your own and I thought to respond. The most general thing I can say about police shock & awe tactics in the US is that they are borne from incidents of police being too slow, too gentle, and giving suspects enough time to either escape or fight back, sometimes with deadly consequences. Everything Whittingham does in this episode he was trained to do because one time a cop didn't do it and was attacked and possibly killed. They don't do things because of what can happen, but because of what did happen.
DantehMan That approach is flawed and more likely to result in the suspect being shot or injured.
detcord1 Every approach has a flaw. Do you have the magic method that will work 100% of the time perfectly?
Second, obviously that isn't "likely" (>50% chance of it happening) to happen because that usually doesn't happen. More often than not, the suspect submits immediately and the police take them into custody without any violence perpetrated.
Keep in mind that the shock & awe tactic is utilized not just by police in hostile situations but also by militaries and special forces all over the world. It is a tried and true tactic for taking down an enemy as quickly and, hopefully, bloodlessly as possible.
It is amazing how scared the US police force are.They are scared of every single scenario,no matter the situation.They are also giving the impression that Americans are the most volatile and dangerous people on earth.
We Americans live in a Darwinian nightmare of a country considering it is supposedly 'developed'.
Alex Sparks Nicely said :)
americans are not dangerous !!! just don t give them any guns.........
To be fair the police in the US have a lot more to be afraid of than Nordic counterpart.
The criminals in the US have weapons are more dangerous.
Well they pretty much are so they are not wrong. Just the past Halloween, in 3 days(Friday-Sunday) in ONE city alone they had 105 shootings. IN 3 DAYS! That's more than my city have had in it's entire lifetime by far.
21:52- 22:13 Guns are deadly force, and deadly force is a cop's last option. If you give them a gun, let them walk around with a gun, and train them to pull their guns, it will become their first. But giving them bulletproof glass? That I gladly give them, because that's kinda hard to kill anyone with.
+Galaith100 Yea, he essentially says "How can you justify defending yourselves without harming others but you don't defend yourselves by harming others." He's totally missing the point.
+Galaith100 you words in the politicians ears. I had a relative dying in her patrol car.. .germany doesnt protect its cops, only its politicians who drive around in tanks that look like cars.
Goliath100 historically the idea of not arming the police has been tested. there are cases where criminals have shot police officers who could not defend themselves, by stopping the perpetrator. the most prominent example is in Denmark is Palle Sørensen, who killed 4 police officers. The perpetrator killed them on by one, any officer who stood in his way. we need to keep police officers safe, lile they keep us safe. en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palle_S%C3%B8rensen
+!eXplore!-
The point being made was about Passive Defence being (mostly, there's a point where it just becomes paranoia) unproblematic, not that cops should have no Offensive Defence. But about offensive: Standard Norwegian Cops are better armed than Standard US Cops. The higher criteria for use also means heavier arms. And I have no problem with that, and I don't thing you have problems with that either. I actuall think that Norwegain cops should get PDW with their current demands of use.
8:48
When he started talking about fucking astrology, he pretty much lost all credibility.
As an American, I think US police could learn a lot from the approach of police in Norway (as well as Sweden, Finland and Iceland) - particularly about how to de-escalate situations of potential conflict, rather than raising the level of violence. Obviously there are a lot of differences between our countries (and far more guns everywhere in the US, making policing much more dangerous), but the "us vs. them" mentality is so entrenched with US police, and, as the violence and protests of the past week have exemplified, we desperately need to re-think how we educate, train, arm and deploy police so that they do not continue to brutalize civilians (especially people of color) and become feared and hated by the very people they are supposed to be serving and protecting.
there is lot of guns in Finland too, but there is no reason to use those against police, police will treat you nicely anyway and you can not get extreme long prison time, so why to make things worse? if you killed someone it is just best to call police and tell them to arrest you, stay couple years in prison and that is it.
Just like Freezed Eve said, I think a lot of the situations cant be compared just with the police force and how they enforce the law. You should take inconsideration the prison sentences in Nordics. If you have an illegal firearm with you, you don't go to prison necessarily. You get a fine and probation period, so your only "way out" is not shooting the police, you just hand them the gun and go on with your life. If you have just pouch of say marijuana, you don't go to prison either. So again, no need to get violent. I think the prison sentences atleast in Finland can be sometimes too short, considering the crime committed, but on the other hand it makes the job of police more safe.
The length of prison sentence is not something that makes criminality go away, if you just look at USA, you can see that people still commit crimes, even if the sentence is 7 lifetimes in prison or something like that. I think I've seen a study where, most of the incarcerated criminals have ADHD/ADD, so they lack the possibility to make good decisions, so the long prison sentences dont really affect their behaviour.
In the US, there's an expectation that the police should do everything, from chasing criminals and up to checking up on elders who've fallen down the stairs. If there's any problem, you call 911. In the "Nordics", there's a desire to try and fix the situation from the ground up -- reduce inequality, healthcare, mental health professionals, education, jobs, stable communities, etc., so that there's less opportunity for dangerous situations to appear. It's no secret that poverty breeds move poverty and crime. Simply sending more police into disadvantaged communities won't solve any of your problems. It's a cycle of nightmare.
This is a hard task for everyone, and it costs a lot of money, but it moves the police away from being a pillar of community to just one of the few dozen or so mechanisms that allow our society to function better. Or maybe I'm naive, I dunno.
@@Miksumr Finland's greatest treasure is its people, and there's not a lot of them anyway. You want to focus on keeping communities safe, stable and prosperous rather than just throwing people into jail to die.
Oh no, you can't have a beird as a US cop.
But being heavy overweight.... nah, no big deal..!
This series is really well made and worth watching ( in my humble opinion), the subjects treated could benefit from more time. I think a one hour show would bring more depth and would not be too long. Thank you.
Joseph Pavao Thanks for watching and for your suggestion!
+John Stark i agree with joseph. too short - its interestig enough to warrant for an hour per show.
Who would've thought that education, strict gun control, and job opportunities would translate to safer societies? Oh yeah, everyone except the US.
My impression is that the Nordic police have much less of a paramilitary culture than police in Canada and the US.
Well also a police education here is a bachelors degree of 3 years where they also focus a lot of psychology and de-escalating situations on top of everything else.
2:26
"Business of Law Enforcement" instead of "serving the public". That's the problem right there.
This is such an interesting series, I can't wait for more. As a lifelong American with relatives in Sweden, I go there at least twice a year & spend as much time as I can. Summers there are glorious, as are the women. I've never had an encounter with the police there, and seldom see them. The sound of sirens is uncommon, even is Stockholm. Where I live in Texas (suburban Dallas) the sirens are constant, the police are everywhere & are usually very nasty. The helicopters are a daily annoyance & the sound of gunfire is common. Texas also has "open Carry" laws which are truly terrifying. I myself was washing my car one day when 2 teens ran up my driveway, aimed handguns at my face & took my car. Why they didn't shoot me i'll never know. And it was only a Toyota Camry! You would think they would've stolen the Corvette next door. The police arrived & were very rude, like they couldn't be bothered. Their advice? "Get a gun and man-up. Next time kill the motherfuckers!" When I watch the news on Swedish tv, it's always shocking to me how few murders there are. In the US it's murders (mostly with guns) daily, even just local news. Most Texans LOVE their guns & consider it one of their American god given (yes, seriously) freedoms. This is freedom?
Why is this guy laughing about weapons so much? The real question is how many police have been shot? The American cop is so concerned with with his safety . Seems he is in the wrong job.
To think of the fact that the US police education range from 6 to 14 months, that's fucking crazy!! In Sweden there are psych evals and you study law, social science, psychology and so on. And it's not easy to get into the academy and you study for almost 3 years.
Whenever I've encountered a Swedish cop they have been very friendly, thoughtful and took the time to listen. Once I happened to walk straight into a police chase. Their main concern was to get me to safety. They were firm, but professional.
Another time I saw two policemen stopping a fight in the streets outside a pub (Friday night, of course). They assessed the situation carefully, and kept people from getting too close to the fight. One of the fighters was very violent and threatening and called out to his mates for help. The police escorted him to another street where they talked to him. They didn't touch anyone, except from, you know, separating them and making sure they wouldn't harm anyone. The most important thing: they talked. No threatening with weapons, just calm (but loud, because the brawlers were screaming) conversation. I think that's why people calmed down. If you start waving a gun around, things can escalate and people can panic. I'm happy the Swedish police carries guns, but I'm also happy that they really consider it the last resort. And that the point is to immobilise (not aiming to kill) and that they have to shoot warning shots beforehand.
Hyvä nähdä, että Yle-verolla tehdään myös laatuohjelmaa
Hej, i really like your program. Very interesting, this episode really shows how peace and beautiful the nordic countries are.
Waiting to see more coming. :D
yu-fang li Thanks for watching!
+K. Li Well, its getting worse every year. Mby shootings doesent happen in Umeå. But Umeå is up more in the north, Down in Malmö. goteborg. stockholm. and couple of other cities shootings and crime have been going up. In my town atleast i see the police every day, and i hear sirens every day. We had around 1-2shooting a week this summer in a town with 100k people. Also Malmö had like 8-15 Grenade attacks this year.
+K. Li Homogeneous societies tend to have less crime for some reason. There's less socio-economic contrast also. When you're "poor" you're not really that poor. And the rich aren't otherworldly rich. Everyone seems to be pretty middle class, even unemployed people living on benefits.
P0ntus00 hehehe. masskrock kallas det. så det går om man isolerar folk lr klumpar ihop alla världens kulturer i samma område
+K. Li finland, sweden are BLOODY VIOLENT compared to iceland ^^ cops there don't even have guns ^^ (no, i'm not from iceland) Peter Whittingham
The question of Peter; how do you validate bulletproof glass and such efforts yet not carrying guns. The answer is simple; one is defensive & preventative. The other is tool designed to kill people at a distance. :V
Yeah. Some people don't know the difference. They think attack always comes with defense and defense always with attack.
True, but I think the answer is that bulletproof glass, steel sheet reinforced walls etc can’t be added instantly or without additional costs in case the circumstances change so that they they become a necessity. What comes to gun policies, the process can be redesigned instantly without extra costs if need be.
Also building is a solid object that doesn't move and everyone pretty much know where it is located. That makes it easy target and over all target in totally different way than police officer that moves around. It is common sense to protect the building in the way it is done. It is not equally common sense to arm the police officers to their teeth for normal patrolling. At least not in here.
been to helsinki quite a few times and only police interaction was when my brother and I were coming back from Estonia when they stopped 10 ppl of all colors. quick show of passport and that's it. American society as a whole needs to change.
I have such respect for the Nordic police officers who are able to do their job without the need of firing their gun at every suspect running from them. It is one of the big stones building a safe community.
well, they must be doing well in their jobs as police officers if people don't feel unsafe.
I got the feeling that the LAPD officer felt like he was more prepared because he had always a gun at hand, but how is he doing his job if that gun is always in need of use?
Nicole Santos I think the most important thing is education. Information and courses in phsycology, mental illnesses, first aid, investigation, law, leadership/management.. etc.. In Norway, the education a police officer have to go through is a bachelors degree in college/academy. It's a theoretical and practical education. I think it's extremely important to trust the police. To trust that they know what they are doing, avoiding escalation in situations that can get from bad to worse. That said, the police are now carriyng guns in Norway too. The society is in development, and things change (like it always does).. we see that criminals now more than before carry weapons, and I am for that the police should be able to protect themselves - the key here is defence and not offense. I hope that even though they have a gun at hand, the ground work they learned (and keep learning in the field) will be their number one go to, before anyone pulls out a gun.
Because the amount of criminals and gang members with guns in LA are quiiiiiiite a lot higher than Mo i rana, Norway lol.
In many places in the US police will be shot at by criminals just for driving past their street in a police car. Imagine if the gang members also knew that police wasn't allowed to have guns on them and therefore can't defend themselves.
It would be a slaughter house.
Very interesting from many perspectives. For instance: is it more important to be clean shaven, wearing a suit and then get armed, after 6 months of education? Or studie for 2 years regarding how to approach a stranger that you do not know? I think it says a lot.
We arm our police less but at the same time we train them strictly so that become more then just sentinels with guns.
when i look at Scandinavian police at large i see something that is more akin to peacekeepers.
A mixture of a guardian, a diplomat and a Caretaker.
This guy seems way more friendly and level-headed than that James Conway guy from the prison episodes. Conway deliberately mocked the prisons and charged the guards with being too "liberal" throughout the episode
at 4:20 he says "don't take the weapon" which goes to show how serious they are about using it, you can't even showcase it in a documentary.
This is a very interesting show, thanks for posting this on the web!
Monoslay My pleasure, thanks for watching!
this is an amazing series, hope someone big picks it up and gets this more views
Another great episode! Thanks for the English subtitles.
MrSlicer2424 Thanks, I appreciate it!
They should have traveled to Oslo.
Would have shown more situations where the Police handles stuff without the need for weapons and it would show situations where they did bring out their weapons.
In my opinion only combatants carry weapons in normal circumstance and I wouldnt like Norwegian Police to arm themselves like soldiers going to war.
Lobos222 that is the problem here in the U.S. Law enforcement here have a military, war zone-type mentality.
Alex Sparks Because in the States there IS a WAR ON CRIME
The uk has unarmed police who have to call special armed units if needed
As a swede I should say that the places they show are pretty remote and rural, places like Stockholm and Gothenburg (two largest cities in sweden) suffer from gang crime pretty much every week...
L.A. still seems like a total shithole compared to any Swedish city.
Mo i Rana, my hometown!😃😃 suprised to see it in this video
Many people were concerned of how safe it is for the Norwegian police officers not to have their guns on the person. Thing is: it seems to work - and be way more safe than carrying the weapon on them. Probably because it puts an emphasis on deescalation instead of escalating a situation with threats to an agressive/scared/desperate person.
The police officers in Norway normally don't wear weapons. But that's different in Sweden and maybe also in Finland and Denmark. Please notice that they are talking about different countries.
The problem with these films is that they always speak about the "Nordic countries". But there are important differences between Sweden, Denmark, Finland, Iceland and Norway, for instance about these countries' history, geography, political system, administration and welfare system. I was born in Germany in 1976 and I have lived, worked and studied in Sweden and Denmark for many years. I've been living in Sweden for 19 years.
Another problem is that these films are about seven, eight or nine years old. Today, Sweden has strong problems with gang crime, but I think not the other Nordic countries that much. That maybe has to do with the differences between these countries, even about welfare and immigration politics.
In Sweden, the welfare state doesn't have the same services anymore as it was until the 1980's or still until about the year 2005. The social differences between rich and poor people are much bigger today as they were for 20 years ago, around the year 2000. On the other hand, a lot of refugees from the Middle East (Arabic countries) came to Sweden between around 2000 and 2015, and some of these people are not integrated into Swedish society and have totally different values, coming from Islamic countries with totally different societies and cultures.
Almost every political party (seven of eight parties in the Swedish parliament) want to have harder penalties, and even prison penalties for young criminals from the age of 15. More and more people today are getting judged to longer penalties and there're to many prisoners, so that sometimes two people have to cheer for a room there. A 17 years old boy could only get visited by his parents a few times during six months.
In my opinion, most Swedish politicians are real populists and a lot of Swedish people support that. Earlier, many people discussed if longer punishments in prison really help against crime. But today, the political parties make a weekly contest about coming out with new suggestions about harder punishments and even the police is getting more and more rights, to arrest people or using water cannons. I think, Sweden, which earlier was a social-liberal orientated nation, has become a quiet conservative country.
I like Sweden and I'm a proud Swedish and German citizen, and I also like these films "Norden", but I think that people who watch them can get an unrealistic picture of Swedish society. And Denmark has always been a very conservative country.
Can you do a mini doc about healthcare and old age? Maybe bring one American and one Canadian on the show who work in said field.
abbath1586 Hi, thanks for watching! If we have the possibility to produce a second season of the series, then healthcare is on the shortlist as one potential theme.
John Stark If and when you do, please note that the Danish healtcare system is building new huge hospitals in the bigger cities, and so our current ones aren't a complete representation of our system :) also : thanks for a great show :)
Nice program,i like how you represented scandinavia and also the LA cop seemed like a cool guy
American view the citizens as enemies.
Europe has another view a friendly view, almost to a point a family view.
Is what i take away from the episodes Nordic prisons and this episode
this is a 6 year old comment, but I wanted to clarify that Europe is not some homogeneous amazing country. It's an entire continent with lots of different countries and lots of different cultures. There's some shared values between a lot of European countries, but there's probably not a single value that's shared by all of Europe.
The Nordics are all fairly similar, but there's differences there too.
It is strange that this American cop takes the personal safety and security as a higher standard than the public safety. Apparantly he doesn't see that when it is at the safest for everybody it will also be safe for the police. Introducing American policemethods in the Nordic countries will only make it unsafe.
This shit never gets old, you can see his mind shatter when the Norwegian officer says "we don't carry gun's" he's so confused by the statment.
22:05 Bulletproof windows isn't going to kill someone. You cant compare a window and a gun. One is a precautionary, purely defensive meassure. The other is proactive, and offensive. They both have their place but it's not a comparison you can make in that context.
Peter i guess would be surprised to know that even closer to L.A in Canada in the Province of Newfoundland ,police did not carry a firearm on their body up until 1998(it was locked in a truck of a police car)
Nordic people are amazing, really educated and so civilized. big respect to you
John Stark this is a very interesting series, i love to see how various professionals from the USA react to how we nordic people handle various aspects of our societies.
Thank you!
Greetings from Denmark.
Thanks Gert for your comment, very much appreciated! We hope to make more episodes in the future!
@@starkjo I really hope that yle will give you permission to continue this. Wouldn't mind if you would redo the episodes there already are and go a lot more deeper with the topics. I think think in this current climate that would be good way to open some discussions. Also in Finland with where we want to direct this country with many of these topics. The under 30 minutes you have now per episode just doesn't give enough time to have meaningful discussion over the topics. I'm sure there was a lot longer talks between the quests and local people than is shown here. This shows just bare surface from those and it look like the visitors are just shocked and leave without deeper understanding from the values, benefits and goals that our systems have. And with this I mainly talk about from this and the jail episodes. With the religion one I'm not sure that person who believes as conservative American do would ever be open to see equality as value as it is seen here. But yes getting more of episodes to this would be awesome.
- What month were you born?
- What month? Um, April...
- Ah, OK, so you're Aryan.
well , you see,, you can t become a cop at LAPD if for example ,,, you are a virgo !!
You watch USA police reality tv. There's lots of shooting from both police and common people, lot of screaming, it's like war. Then you watch Finnish version called Poliisit, and you get to see a local police officers joking with drunk people to get them move home or having a discussion with teenagers why to become a police officer. Lots of apologizing from the part of people and police waving their hand for good night. You don't need to ask which country I prefer to live in.
Kotifilosofi THIS.
pls make more i love it when i see the looks on american's faces they cant believe what they see and hear !!! its epic!!
Thank you for uploading and subtitle the Norden series. Very interesting and enjoyable. Cheers.
Very strange. At 4:24 you can hear the superior officer tell to the other: "älä ota asetta". In English, this means "do not take a firearm".
I take walks in Helsinki at 03.00 am its all good. Helps my insomnia
Great series. Thank you very much for sharing, John
OnePage Bio My pleasure, very happy that you like it!
It would be interesting to see the Norden officers reactions if they spent a day in L.A.
The norden officers would be traumatized
It would, the problem is though that they would have to put themselves at risk without having the jurisdiction to do something about it.
I know there is a documentary about an exchange between American and German Cops, but it's in German, perhaps with some subs. It was interesting.
"Jesus Krist American cops sure do get a boner at the idea of shooting people."
Yes T.J. they would be dealing with a totally different breed of cat in LA. They would be freaked out to see what runs the streets in LA.
thanks John for writing good descriptions of each episode. They work well when sharing it on Facebook.
The officer is thinking to himself "Why can you just shoot anything you perceive as a threat?"
I think the important part of having the police officers have to get permission to use their guns, or at least let their captains know (I wasn't entirely clear on which it was), is that it makes them stop and think about whether or not lethal force is actually necessary. Too often in the US, officers don't stop to think and just use lethal force first, rather than the non-lethal weapons available to them. Part of that is probably traceable back to the training. In the US, 6 months is the average training duration followed by an internship with a local police force (at least in my state, other states may vary depending on the laws/regulations). I rather like making them take longer training courses. Also, if they have the non-lethal methods drilled into them more, perhaps then they won't be so trigger happy.
But I think in the end, the root of the problem with the police forces in the US is the culture. Police officers, particularly in the big cities, are so paranoid, and often feel like they need to shoot first because otherwise they'll be killed. It's a perception and attitude problem and I honestly have no idea a society would go about fixing that. I know in the small suburb my parents live in, the police don't feel like that ( I'm friends with several of the guys on the overnight crew), but in the big cities it seems to be a real issue. And the racial aspects don't help matters any. I'm not aware of any racial profiling in my local big city, but that doesn't mean it isn't there. After all, 98% of my state is white, and the majority of the minorities live in the nearest large city (which I just recently moved to). It's entirely possible that it's going on without my knowledge.
One has to feel sorry for the LAPD, where every encounter with any citizen can be expected to turn into a gunfight. No wonder they are uptight and trigger-happy. The situation is totally different in Norther Europe, especially the Nordic countries. The Police in Norway and Iceland go about unarmed. They HAVE fairly quick access to weapons safely locked away in their cars, and they are very rarely needed. This state of affairs is evidence of the kind of society being policed, not an indication that the police is too relaxed. After the Utoya shootings, Norwegian police were armed for a while - they soon gave it up because there were so many accidental discharges, usually when weapons were being secured at the end of a shift.
In Ireland we only have special armed units or detectives who carry weapons
@@warbler1984 I think this goes a little too far. I would not start from the premise that if the police have a weapon, the threshold for using it is also higher. It is all about training. How the police can calm the situation and what are the practices (= consequences) of using a weapon. In Finland, the police always have a gun. And the weapon is not used any more often than in Norway. Restrictions on the carrying of a weapon (in Norway) undermine the discretion and responsibility of the individual police.
Great video(s)! I've learned a lot about the Nordic culture through these. I grew up in Ukraine and have spent the majority of my life in America. From my perspective, especially based on the comparisons made in the videos between the subjects and people in the comments, the only thing I could say it is, in my opinion, difficult to compare the two. Each culture, more specifically police in this situation, adapt differently to their environments. Though I do not agree with, for example an disproportional amount of shots fired by American vs Noridic police, I do realize that this difference cannot be compared, especially by comparing proportionately-scaled police forces to amount of shots fired. Factors such as amount of people armed, multi-culturality, and especially learning from previous events play a huge role in the varying police tactics.
And in Malmö (city pop 300k) there were 109 shootings in 3013.
One system is defensive, the other is offensive.
In both senses of the word (offensive)!
Really fascinating, thanks for posting!
In the USA guns and violence in general is seen as a good way of resolving disputes. For example many people have no qualms about shooting a burglar.
This thinking leads to a lot of gun violence, people shoot each other over petty arguments or sometimes just by accident, someone comes home late at night and someone else misinterprets that as a burglar attempt and opens fire. The idea that you need a gun to protect yourself leads to an arms race and consequently a lot more people get shot.
Problem is that criminals in the US will have guns regardless if it is allowed to have them or not.
If they are banned from people it will only mean that all the criminals have guns and the law abiding citizens will not and have no way to protect themselves.
Some cities and areas in the US are pretty much lawless and the amount of crimes are on a level that is hard to understand for a nordic person.
To live in a house in the US with your family without being allowed to arm yourself is a no no.
A year or two ago, the Iceland police fatally shot a man first time ever in its history. The police apologised even though the action was justified, and the whole nation regretted the incident. Amazing.
He should come to the UK. Our police are unarmed even in the largest cities.
+Julien P I have no problem with cameras. At least those won't shot you down.
Nikolai508 UK police is a fucking joke.
The American policeman uses military terms like “deployed in the field”. His mentality is that the police are soldiers in a war thus everyone is a potential suspect like the guy who ran a red light. That thought process is a HUGE part of the problem people have with the police.
Super fedt, tak, har ledt efter en serie som den her!
NadiiDK Tack för kommentarerna! Serien kommer också att sändas av DR, men jag vet icke när.
I think what in fact gets lost to Peter Whittingham and maybe the American society in general is, that people in Scandinavian countries indeed live in intact communities, totally in contrast what you could say about the USA. Living in an intact community takes away the fear of your fellow citizens and largely takes away the necessity for crimes. If you live in a social environment without substantial fear for survival you are far less inclined to rob someone or some bank. But if your environment isn't capable or willing to support you when you can't do that yourself, when people become desparate, they tend to take desparate measures to ensure their survival... unethical measures.
Ralf Oltmanns You hit the nail on the head there. It is by and large the extensive Nordic welfare state that creates so much less crime and less fear of crime in Nordic societies.
***** Do you have data to support your comment?
+hampe hjsjdf I got mugged once when in Stockholm, I was 17 at the time. They got a hold of 20 bucks, a broken watch and half a pack of cigarettes. The riches I lost that day! From what I read in the papers I think the muggings here are more teens stealing from teens rather than adults getting stuff stolen under the threat of violence. Not saying it's only that, but a big portion of it. I guess mugging teens these days is a bit more lucrative than back when I was young though, as everyone above 12 years old has a smartphone... I don't know if my own experience has perhaps also colored my opinion on the matter.
Thanks for producing this video. I think it reminds us (in the U.S.) that there needn't be as much crime if there were more social programs for the poor, mentally ill, homeless, etc.
We don't still have "mental hospitals" as we did in the distance past. Now they are called the homeless problem.
Oh, so you think they have more "social programs" for the poor, mentally ill, homeless and etc, in Scandinavia?
Nope, they are about the same as the US. The difference is mentality of the people. In Scandinavia, it is cooperation, community building practices (very homogenous society), in the US it is competition, you must be better, have more, be richer, prettier, faster, stronger, more intelligent than your neighbour.
In Scandinavia, there were times where your only and immediate help were your neighbours (and sometimes it still is). In the US, your neighbours don't even know who you are.
There is zero need to screw over the other guy, if the other guy is your lifeline one day or another, because one hand washes the other, and both washes our backs.
I think Scandinavia is slightly better than heaven lol.
+Rooot Zeeer Not norway or sweden, But iceland sure is
+hannibal jr wtf us my ugly ass hearing xD
Yannix TR That Scandinavia is the greatest part of the world. And that Iceland is the best part of us
hannibal jr Might be true actually :D
weather sucks tho
These episodes or really this show is awesome! I would love to see them on Australian TV. But here is good enough.
The Norwegian police are good at solving situations without resorting to the use of weapons. This is because they don`t live in fear of fronting gunslingers every day, maniacs carrying weapon because "it`s their right to be armed for protection". There is a reason for the US police to open fire many, many thousand times more than the nordic countries. In 2019 the Norwegian police armed themselves 27 times a day, but only 5 criminals were injured and one died due to exchange of fire.
Because in the US compared to the Nordic countries every criminal has a gun. Criminals don't care for laws. So even in the states were it's really hard to get the permit to have a gun all the criminals still have them.
@@rexuz2482 I see the problem. I`m so lucky not to be living over there.
So. Is the answer to arm the citizens even more, and give more criminals guns?
@@Eljulitus The criminals already have easy access to guns, in their early teens already so I doubt it would make things that much worse. But at least more homeowners and store owners could defend themselves and scare of criminals if they are allowed to have weapons to.
In the perfect world there should be no guns at all like in the past in Scandinavia. But when you get to the point like in the US where there are so many guns already out there for the criminals to use you have to let the citizens defend themselves.
@@rexuz2482 Well. Since it`s already too late, then I agree with you. One must always have right to defend one self.
@@rexuz2482 Its just as easy to get a gun in Norway... Just sayin... Criminals here dont care for laws either, just two weeks ago there was a dude who murdered a woman by shooting her 15 or so times in broad daylight in Oslo. If you truly want to do crime and get a hold of weapons in Norway, you can. So the access to guns is guaranteed not the only reason, or even the biggest reason as to why USA got so many shootings. It has to do with your attitude (not you in particular, but some Americans) and probably the biggest reason is the poverty. Poor people see no other way out and grow up with crime to earn money in the supposedly "land of opportunity". Because we have a functional system in Norway that tries to take care of poor people its way less likely for someone to have to grow up with crime here to earn money. It becomes a life style from early on. So if USA want less shootings, fix the damn system. Right now the vast majority of Americans lives with third world country standards in a supposed "first world country". But since so many Americans are by whatever absurd reason against taxes youre not very likely to get less shootings. Its extremely obvious why USA got so much gun crimes and shootings, yet almost every American seems to ignore the real reason as to why there so much gun crime and shootings.
I'm Danish so I'm not trying to defend American police or anything here (why would I?), but it's too easy to just blame it all on them. The general population in the Nordics aren't armed. That's a big fucking difference, if you're a police officer having to stop a fight, a theft or whatever. If they see a guy in a car make a weird movement, that's quite possibly a gun. It isn't here. It's extremely unlikely that you'll ever see anyone armed unless you're our hunting in the middle of nowhere. Cops aren't nearly as 'on edge' all the time here cause they can pretty much assume they're the only one with a gun.
That's one of the many downsides of having such a relaxed gun legislation in the USA. If you're going to rob a gas station or whatever, you risk them being armed. So then you bring a gun to protect yourself. Then the cops show up and they're expecting you to be armed and pull out their guns. Of course there are going to be way more shootings of criminals *and* of cops when "everyone" is armed and 'on edge' at all times.
If I was interested in robbing a gas station here, I wouldn't need a weapon at all. I could just show up and since I'm likely to be bigger than whoever's behind the counter, they'll probably just hand over whatever I tell them to. If I wanna be a bit more scary I suppose I could grab a stick, a bat or whatever. So even after a robbery, the police here doesn't have to instantly be ready for being shot at or whatever.
That's not true. Norway as an example ranks in the top 10 in the world when it comes to having firearms. I think the difference is how we regulate the laws
+auggiedoggy There's this wonderfull tool called google, this contains all the knowledge that exists on this planet. Good luck:)
+scarlace You know, as the one introducing a counter argument, you are the one with burden of proof. Make the damn google search yourself, you lazy git.
Eter Puralis yeah no not really, what I stated was pure fact, and you can check it up yourself. I already did, so you not wanting to check it is your own damned laziness that speaks.
It's very easy to put into google: "Do Norway have a gun registry?" "What's the most sold firearms in Norway" It is not very hard. All I'm doing is promoting people to do their own research. If they cannot do even that for such a small fact check it's not worth my time, so sorry if you do not like that. But I really don't care:)
+scarlace I honestly don't give a rat's ass how easy it is. i don't eve care what you're talkingabout. You're giving "facts" without tagging your sources. no one has the slightest reason or obligation to take you on faith. That's not how it works.
20:40 - It's confirmed. Vampires are real.
LOL
In Finland cops can be brutal depending on situation. But mostly polite, helpful and friendly.
I was born in Britain where the police again are not routinely armed, I once saw a police officer talk to a man who was wielding a machete totally out of control but the officer managed to calm him down and give him the weapon.I now live in Germany and have seen the police here talk to people that have been wielding weapons no shots fired, if it can happen here in Europe surely they can adopt the same approach in the U.S.
+Alba Productions This is only me speculating and I know absolutely nothing about the justice system in Britain and also very little about the american system. But from piecing together what little I do know, my conclusion is that it would be harder for the police in america to reign in a criminal on a psychological level without presenting significant threat, simply because of their fear of the treatment they will have to face afterwards.
***** I think you are right there Marcus.
Wow.....this guy should really try to visit Copenhell. We have police present, because it's the law, but we have needed them ONCE in 9 years. Basically they listen to music, hug people and we take pictures with them....and that's it.
That black guy is really asking about "Arian" and "Sagittarius" nonsense with a female office?
6 mouth? It's a joke? In my country it's around 3 years.
Damn this comment is 9 years, but I'll reply. No we think that's long here. It's sad. Also at least from people I know, the training is almost identical to military boot camp in the way it's designed.
@@GoldenTV3 lol, 9 years
Finland have pretty good police
det här programmet är väldigt intressant
Did he not realise that the towns he was visiting were older than the country he comes from, what they are doing has been working for them for a long time. I notice in this and other in the series where the Americans are acting as if they are taking a position of someone older and wiser society, like some kind of messenger from the enlightened land. So coming from a law enforcement officer that thinks that smoking pot can get you 4 years, but running from the cops is a death penalty without trial is just fine, I would not trust his stance on any subject involving firearms.
+Morlanius As an American myself, a lot of Americans kinda have this "know-it-all" attitude.
I didn't see that at all. He has his own experience and training and background, and the show is specifically there to contrast. He's explaining himself. One of the problems people have is to assume the worst of people.
Great series. Watched them all! Wish you would make one in the practice of medicine. I would love to be your guest as a physician.
I would love to live in a country like Norway, their society just seems more civilized.
@14:03"The officer is okay and that's (the) important thing" - Is that the only important thing? Who was he shooting at? Why? And how's he/she/they?
This poor Captain is missing the biggest point and that is attitude of the population. Americans are overwhelmingly paranoid with a massively selfish attitude. Their property, their rights etc. Plus you add a society based on revolution, the wild west and the fact that they insist on their rights to own weapons and there are so many weapons allowed in their country it is a recipe for constant tension and "road rage" on and off their roads. In Scandinavia there are lots of guns too but for hunting and some sport but no one has a militia with loads of automatic weapons and hand guns plus they value their society having a role of caring for each other. This isn't about equipment on a police officer's belt, it's societal attitudes. Look at where they are today in June of 2020.
We actually do have militas with automatic weapons tho, it's called the Heimevern look it up.
@@NorwegianNationalist1 yes but that is nothing like the USA has with citizens armed like an army where they form their own militia and do not report to any authority
5:50 thats wrong translation, correct would be ''theyre a bit more on the offensive. and then you have the tv-series where they run around in high heels''
I love my country.
Go Norway
PuroYO Norway is awesome. I live near norwegian border in Finland.
John, thank you so much for your week on these episodes. They've been very interesting to see the differences, even though here in the UK we have a lot more similarities. I wondered if the final two episodes were planned to be released soon?
Not Karl Thanks for watching! I have no publishing deadline unfortunately, but I hope to be able to get them online 'soon'.
John Stark Thanks for the response; I look forward to them.
Funny how the American police officer is bundled up in warm clothes and the Norden police officer is like "Oh just another warm day here"
In Sweden, it is usually considered warm if it is about +70°F or warmer. We also occasionally have really warm days that can be as warm as about +95°F, typically in July and possibly August.
Väldigt väldigt väldigt bra och intressant dokumentär serie!
Skulle väldigt gärna sprida den till mina vänner i andra länder och framförallt till amerikaner. Någon information om när resten av världen kan se een?
Holy shit when the nordic cop opened the car door, if an American cop did that I would assume I was about to get the shit kicked out of me and go to jail even if I hadn't done anything lmao
Sergeant says at 4:22 Älä ota asetta which means don´t take the gun out.