Subaru's Tragic F1 Engine Nearly Powered A Koenigsegg

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  • เผยแพร่เมื่อ 8 พ.ย. 2024

ความคิดเห็น • 131

  • @drunk3n_m0nk12
    @drunk3n_m0nk12 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +29

    I've only ever really seen pictures of the engine. It's really nice to get some good background info on it. I can't help but imagine what could have been if this went differently.

  • @il-ma.le.
    @il-ma.le. 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +21

    The engine was an original project by Motori Moderni, Subaru simply jumped aboard because the flat-V displacement it used was superficially indistinguishable from their signature architecture(boxers).

  • @nevinbontrager8828
    @nevinbontrager8828 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +40

    I am fond of this engine and story, because of owing an EG33 boxer 6 equipped subaru svx! I have heard this story many times, and this was a great telling! Thank you!

    • @hugejohnson5011
      @hugejohnson5011 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +8

      Awesome car the SVX! They were a rare sight around my neck of the woods, and were close to a technological wonder as I remember. I owned a 911 back then, and used to rib my friends who had new Corvettes about a Subaru that had as much horsepower as their cars did! Fun times!

    • @corollavirus4age
      @corollavirus4age 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

      thats hot!

    • @drunk3n_m0nk12
      @drunk3n_m0nk12 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      I love my SVX. The eg33 is such an amazingly smooth engine. Total night and day difference from the built ej25 in my WRX.

    • @hugejohnson5011
      @hugejohnson5011 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      @@drunk3n_m0nk12 I'm a gearhead, and I've often wondered why more outfits hadn't adopted the boxer engine in modern times. It isn't just some kind of a gimmick, it is an engine architecture that makes sense on many different levels. I owned only one Subaru, way back; a 1986 station wagon that I bought in 1990. It really was in nice shape, as a secretary at our local MB dealer owned it since new. I loved that car! 1.8 rubber band motor, that never gave me an ounce of trouble. It was a good car.

    • @drunk3n_m0nk12
      @drunk3n_m0nk12 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      @@hugejohnson5011 They're insanely easy to work on too. I own 3 of them (92 SVX, 11 WRX, & 12 Outback) and there isn't anything on them that I can't do in my home garage with a decent set of tools.

  • @FFox98
    @FFox98 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +91

    never would have imagined Subaru was in the F1

    • @Xayuap
      @Xayuap 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

      why not?

    • @Iowa599
      @Iowa599 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +4

      Because there's no AWD.

    • @CyanRooper
      @CyanRooper 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +29

      ​​@@Iowa599Fun fact: there have actually been four wheel drive cars in F1 with a total of 8 different cars using four wheel drive in the 70+ years of Formula 1 (which would make for an interesting video):
      1) Ferguson P99 (Sir Stirling Moss said it was the best car he ever drove)
      2) BRM P67 (only took part in one race as BRM were busy with creating their H16 engine at the time. The P67 did prove successful in hillclimb racing though and it won the British hillclimb championship in 1968)
      3) Lotus 63 (though briefly before going back to rear wheel drive)
      4) Matra MS84 (it was French)
      5) McLaren M9A (only took part in one race)
      6) Lotus 56B (this car, according to Colin Chapman himself, came the closest to actually becoming the first four wheel drive car to win a race)
      7) March 2-4-0 (this was a six-wheeled car with power being sent to four rear wheels. Was tested but never raced in an actual Grand Prix)
      8) Williams FW08B (another six-wheeled car with power being sent to four rear wheels. Never raced).
      Formula 1 officially banned four wheel drive in 1982 so nobody tried to create a 4WD F1 car since. If it hadn't been banned Subaru definitely would have tried to build a 4WD F1 car using a similar system as the one used in their rally cars. Which makes me wonder if we could have had a Subaru/Mitsubishi rivalry in both F1 and the WRC 🤔

    • @Iowa599
      @Iowa599 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      @@CyanRooper that makes me picture an open-wheel car with 6" of ground clearance & knobby tires drifting a muddy corner & hitting a small ramp…
      F1+WRC

    • @CyanRooper
      @CyanRooper 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@Iowa599 I mean, we kind of already have those kinds of cars with side-by-side vehicles (SxS or SSV) like the Polaris RZR, Yamaha YXZ1000R etc.

  • @planetzebulon21
    @planetzebulon21 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +16

    Head gasket leaking, it’s a Subaru feature.

  • @hugejohnson5011
    @hugejohnson5011 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +18

    I am surprised that Motori Moderni got as far as they did with that engine program, and had no computerized engineering records. That was not common even by the standards of the day. Only in Italy could they function as such! Or, was there something else at play, such as someone pleading a lack of records, not wanting the information to be sold or shared? Hmmm.....

    • @alexjenner1108
      @alexjenner1108 10 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      Carlo Chiti made flat-12 engines when he was at Alfa Romeo. This includes the Alfa Romeo 33TT12 sports prototype championship winner from the mid 1970s, which was later converted into an formula one engine for Brabham which won a couple of races. He later changed the V angle from 180° to 60° for the Alfa Romeo 179 F1 project. It would be interesting to compare the Alfa Romeo mid 1970s flat-12 with the Motori Moderni 1989 flat-12, perhaps not a lot of differences. The power output wasn't a huge increase for 10+ years and a larger engine.

  • @wickiezulu
    @wickiezulu 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +15

    What grabs my interested with the Subaru 1235 Flat-12 is not so much the engine itself that proved lacklustre in motorsport. Rather it is the fact that Subaru, Dome or (less likely) Koenigsegg could have provided a non-German rear/mid-engine boxer-powered sportscar alternative to Porsche, which in the case of Subaru and Dome could have carved out a more accessible Japanese niche beneath Porsche with just a EJ20 Turbo engined 2-seater alone prior to the Boxster and Cayman.

    • @NicoKyunKyun
      @NicoKyunKyun 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

      porsche is not a true boxer design, they are pretty much 180° V engine, and ferrari also offered a flat 12 engine

    • @wickiezulu
      @wickiezulu 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@NicoKyunKyun Meant Porsche in relation to their road car engines, speaking of V vs boxer design it would be interesting to clear up the mystery on if the 1235 was itself a true boxer design or not.

    • @NicoKyunKyun
      @NicoKyunKyun 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@wickiezulu yeah i was talking about the 80's testarossa, i guess we'll never know about the 1235 engine

  • @fuse8052
    @fuse8052 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +9

    Subaru excels in flawed engines. Super neat video. 60 valves... 5 per cylinder is too many.

  • @pruis3144
    @pruis3144 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +13

    Sounded insane😮

  • @tim300wsm
    @tim300wsm 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +6

    Head gasket goes boom was my first thought on reading title

    • @igor-rp5mw
      @igor-rp5mw 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      You must be living in a cave. It was one model engine within few years range that had brittle graphite head gasket. That issue resolved long ago.

  • @Spectrolite1
    @Spectrolite1 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

    Another splendid video from Visio!

  • @Ramsi-Berlin
    @Ramsi-Berlin 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

    Awesome what you find out for many interesting things about engine's ❣️👌🏼
    Love from Berlin 🇩🇪
    Ramsi 😘 🙋🏻‍♂️

  • @ziggy6645
    @ziggy6645 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

    I’m amazed It didn’t blow a head gasket during all that testing

  • @dukie1616
    @dukie1616 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

    Great work as always, thank you👏

  • @bharat1366
    @bharat1366 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

    I love your channel. Its a treasure cave for auto enthusiasts. You are such an inspiration.

  • @bgd73
    @bgd73 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    subarus own math back in the day fit well with the mentality.. not their egnine, but it is interesting. their own boxer at that era was 2.62 inch stroke with a chevy 305 sized piston. Screaming lunatic ingredients..and they never let it truly run. We all got the signature tug boat thumping sound to this day instead. An interesting video is the aussie group that made 4 valve heads for the suabru EA series. Sounds like a crotch rocket motorcycle. max rpm is 5 digits.

  • @maaxm
    @maaxm 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

    When I worked for Coloni in 2008, there was an engine block sitting around in a container with car parts of that era.

  • @christianlekstrom2398
    @christianlekstrom2398 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

    Swiss carage are doing a CC12,don´t know if it´s this engine but they have the most advaced Koenigsegg service garage outside of the factory themself
    Mrjww has a video where it´s brought up...

  • @MilanStojakov
    @MilanStojakov 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    Very nice footage 👏

  • @Erebus-PCFX
    @Erebus-PCFX 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

    The sad story is Carlo Chiti ended up killing himself after the failure of Motori Moderni, alone...

  • @Tom-wl9sx
    @Tom-wl9sx 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +4

    Really interesting information. Didn't know Subaru was in the F1. 🙃

  • @jonlee580
    @jonlee580 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    We need a video on the Honda F1 engines and why they dont out them in production vehicle

  • @VelvetThunderB99
    @VelvetThunderB99 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +8

    Koenigsegg in F1 would be wild

    • @ShittyUserName
      @ShittyUserName 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +8

      It would be fine but chances of success are low, they have no money, no factory, not enough people so a brand new entry is out of question because it's too big an ask but also buhing an existing team isn't an option because that's simply too expensive

    • @CyanRooper
      @CyanRooper 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      ​@@ShittyUserNameThey did try to race in Le Mans in the GT1 class by building a car that complied with the rules at the time only for those rules to be changed thus preventing them from competing.

    • @ShittyUserName
      @ShittyUserName 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      @@CyanRooper LeMans is pocket change in comparison to F1 so I would see that as a more viable option even today, and has more marketing relevance as well

    • @gerogyzurkov2259
      @gerogyzurkov2259 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

      ​@@ShittyUserNameNo way WEC has more market relevance. F1 has more growth and more marketing. WEC has less growth.

    • @ShittyUserName
      @ShittyUserName 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      @@gerogyzurkov2259 do koenigseggs look like F1 cars? No. Can they adapt for example Jesko to hypercar rules? Yes. More market relevance does not mean bigger market

  • @MikkelL03
    @MikkelL03 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    It would have been so fucking nice if someone would make a VR(same concept some vw came up with) engine back when engine regulations were less restricted.

  • @deanharris7149
    @deanharris7149 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    Great video!

  • @zayseeu8337
    @zayseeu8337 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

    very interesting makes me still want a porsche or german MONSTER

  • @minerska3395
    @minerska3395 10 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    4:54 typical subaru engine 😂

  • @15DEAN1995
    @15DEAN1995 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    Flat 12 engines sound epic

  • @napalmholocaust9093
    @napalmholocaust9093 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +6

    Glad the subpar engine was rejected. Koenigsegg has exceeded everything Subaru is capable of.

    • @apricity69
      @apricity69 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

      How fast has a Koenigsegg lapped the Isle of Man?

    • @TinyBearTim
      @TinyBearTim หลายเดือนก่อน

      Subaru weren’t even the ones to design the engine
      And they are massive in rally

  • @xxxxghostxxxx2052
    @xxxxghostxxxx2052 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

    Subaru engine are heavier than any car maker. The EJ20 is 42lb more than 4G63T, the new BRZ engine is way heavier than K20/K24 and make less HP. They are under perform.

    • @allandriver2066
      @allandriver2066 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

      K24 is 300lbs with exhaust. EJ20 is 348lbs, but this includes all ancillaries including turbo and intercooler, so there isn't much in it.

    • @procrastinator1842
      @procrastinator1842 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

      What? How, they have no balance shaft, no counterweights...how could they be? My short block weighs about 75 lbs...

  • @waterbnb7204
    @waterbnb7204 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

    that flat 12 sounded so goddamn good 😢

  • @TheSlowDude
    @TheSlowDude 10 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    Thanks again :-)

  • @hatefunwrx
    @hatefunwrx 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

    I really hope as an engineer he continues to try to develop and perfect such a potential monster

  • @hardwaylearner
    @hardwaylearner 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +8

    Subaru has been making unreliable powerplants for ALL disciplines! 😂

    • @Kacpa2
      @Kacpa2 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      Thats not true at all. Stop spreading dumb lies based on one engine that had issues to entiriety of their output. It was EJ25 only, both na and turbo that had issues and not any other engine they ever made. EJ20 and all other versions but 2.5 were suoerbly reliable, so was EZ30 and EZ36 flat six motors. Same with FA and FB motors(except some.minor issues with newest BRZ/GR86 motor apparently not having good enough lubrication when driven extremely hard on track).
      You only ever bough 2.5L ejs in US like fools so you had it fail. If you bought ej20 and ej22 instead then you would never have those issues at all. JDM and european subarus were mostly 2.0L including everything from most pedestrian to the sporty like STi. EJ25 was also.offered and it is one thst is known as problematic, but literarily no other engine has headgasket issues or any other problems.

    • @SolaricAngel116
      @SolaricAngel116 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      Subaru is what it is.

    • @igor-rp5mw
      @igor-rp5mw 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +4

      Stock sti drivetrain holds up to 1000 hp reliably.
      Stock sti engine holds 500 hp easy for long time.
      500-650 is a question of time.
      1000 hp dyno pulls on stock sti engine? You got it. It won’t last but it makes it without blowing up.
      Name other 4 cylinder that in stock unopened long block can make 1000 hp and stock diffs, axels, gearbox. It won’t last but it makes. Hondas blow up at 600, evolutions blow up at 600 hp and gear box is another story. BBR built is proof.

    • @EchoWhiskey11
      @EchoWhiskey11 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      Hey man, you need to be careful what you say on the Internet. The Subaru Mafia will go to war for their cars.

  • @TyskenGBG
    @TyskenGBG 10 หลายเดือนก่อน

    Got a bunch of those engine blocks and other stuff 😂

  • @ImInLoveWithBulla
    @ImInLoveWithBulla 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

    Didn’t BMW/Williams mess around with not a flat, but a super shallow angle V10 in the early 2000s? It was something like 140 degrees. Along the same time they made the hideous walrus car.

  • @Commander-McBragg
    @Commander-McBragg 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    Awesome sound, though.

  • @CDN296
    @CDN296 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

    Flat 12 Koniegsegg would be something else

  • @ScaRlaK319
    @ScaRlaK319 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

    It was a flat v. In my opinion, if they make it a 10 cylinder and make it a true boxer. It would have been successful

  • @MavAuto-Pete
    @MavAuto-Pete 4 หลายเดือนก่อน

    Subaru Coloni flat 12 was heavy, slow and massively unreliable and it never even went past pre qualifying.
    Was a big shame as it sounded so nice.
    I got told from a friend who worked in the Coloni team, that and it was always a F12 not anything else.
    He mentioned that the chassis was fantastic and well set up but the engine was a great letdown.

  • @10.000subscriberswithnovideosc
    @10.000subscriberswithnovideosc 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

    Koenigsegg nearly became the swedish alfa romeo or fiat

  • @surfside75
    @surfside75 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

    Pictures show its a flat.. look at the heads.

    • @TheAllAroundMan
      @TheAllAroundMan 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

      boxer engines and 180 degree V engines differ internally

    • @VisioRacer
      @VisioRacer  11 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      Some people do not agree with this statement, but I consider any 180° Vee and boxer engines a flat design - cylinders are simply flat. The difference is the rod offset for opposing cylinders.

  • @upsidedowndog1256
    @upsidedowndog1256 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +4

    Nice bit of history. Not winning is not uncommon in F1. 2nd place is the 1st loser, but without them there would be no winners!

    • @peanutbutterpadre1519
      @peanutbutterpadre1519 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      2nd place? It couldn’t even qualify…

    • @upsidedowndog1256
      @upsidedowndog1256 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      @@peanutbutterpadre1519
      At least they tried. What have you done like that? I try all of the time to go beyond my scope. It usually works but sometimes failures are the best lessons.

    • @peanutbutterpadre1519
      @peanutbutterpadre1519 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      @@upsidedowndog1256 at least they tried? you really think the world is about participation trophies 🤦 im not a multi billion dollar company but im sure i could fail to qualify too with way less money wasted😂 idk why you would even try to compare my accomplishments to a manufacturing company contracted to do a job and failing miserably. i do swap engines though but id never use Subaru trash.

    • @upsidedowndog1256
      @upsidedowndog1256 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@peanutbutterpadre1519
      Actually I don't believe in participation trophies. My point was that MOST companies can't get a handle on many of the formulas in F1. Without a full grid there is no show and no money for anyone. Remember 6 cars running at Indianapolis? I couldn't believe my eyes. I swap aircraft engines every day. I am no fan of Subaru but at least it sounded like a real F1 car, unlike this hybrid crap with the cars farting and growling around the track! F1 fan 1973-2013.

  • @RapideWombaticus
    @RapideWombaticus 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

    What could have been...

  • @napraznicul
    @napraznicul 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

    Subaru is widely knowh by their WORST BOXER ENGINES which was EVER made on that planet. Not only as reliability, but also by performance AND mechanical operations acces. To modify an subaru engine for 800-1200bhp for more than a dyno test... you should change EVERYTHING, the block included. Better thash that garbage and install ANY other engine in the world... just to make space for it.

    • @VisioRacer
      @VisioRacer  11 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      Funny thing is that this boxer design was Motori Moderni's, Subaru only provided funding

    • @Payday5
      @Payday5 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

      aint any engines requires you to change everything to make 1000 bhp+?
      i mean why the hell would you need a 1000 hp anyway? its not reliable for daily driving

    • @napraznicul
      @napraznicul 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      @@Payday5 because it's fun (but if you drive daily a PRIUS, you are unable to understand that 🤣) One friend of my use an R8 /980bhp to transport his son to kindergarden. Is no problem in urban traffic (dsg, 20injectors, 10 meth ports, in city runs with meth off and usually using only direct port injectors)
      By the way, MOST of the serious engines are able to hold 800- 1000bhp (in fact is about torque levels) using STOCK BLOCK and STOCK CRANKSHAFT, sometimes even stock conrods. Stock heads in many many situation, only camshaft upgraded (cam profile to keep longer time valves opened, nothing very fancy)

    • @xom.
      @xom. 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      ​@@naprazniculhow much does an r8 cost compared to a subie

  • @subasurf
    @subasurf 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    Subaru making terrible engines....it's tradition.

  • @fhwolthuis
    @fhwolthuis 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

    Bertrand Gachot was a Belgian, not Dutch

    • @VisioRacer
      @VisioRacer  11 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

      Born to a French father and German mother in Luxembourg. I simply used the Lux flag next to the birth year as he is of a Belgian-French nationality

    • @fhwolthuis
      @fhwolthuis 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      @@VisioRacer ah, I see! 😀

  • @Mitutumuch
    @Mitutumuch 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

    Wieners? What? 😂😂😂😂😂
    Your welcome, you cannot unsee the intro

  • @someonecalledeulogio2280
    @someonecalledeulogio2280 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +4

    "Lastima que ese motor era mas malo que la tos"
    - victor abad

  • @ethansilva4228
    @ethansilva4228 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

    Say what now?

  • @oetic5016
    @oetic5016 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

    a ford v8 makes that car the single most mundane cookie cutter car conpared to what it could have been

  • @AmalgamationofMan
    @AmalgamationofMan 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

    Subaru never had a chance. They've never made a single reliable engine in the history of their brand. Their cars are powered by engines that were originally designed in the late 1800's. Subaru has never done anything all that innovative. Their product line is full of unreliable, anemic cars with fragile transmissions. Even their fast cars are slow.

    • @VisioRacer
      @VisioRacer  11 หลายเดือนก่อน +6

      I see we have a full-time Subaru hater in here. First of all, I suggest to watch the video before commenting, the engine was not a product of Subaru's engineering team, it was a Motori Moderni product. Subaru only provided funding to obtain an engine with their name on it. That's it.

    • @procrastinator1842
      @procrastinator1842 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      Wow. A bit of hyperbole there. Plenty of garden variety subarus from the late 90s/early 2000s still putting around the streets with 200-300000 miles on the clock.

  • @Carlos_Jzx
    @Carlos_Jzx 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

    If only ppl would put a little more though to things would realize we are getting screw for example Koenigsegg made a technology that has changed F1 forever and is so efficient that F1 doesn't even have refuel on their sport and if you wondering what that tech is call it's name is Free Valve and is amazing on extracting Power and MPG that's how ICE can move up on the evolution pole but we all know that there a forces that don't want efficient engines for the masses.🤷🏾‍♀️

  • @nickname3471
    @nickname3471 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

    This would be so much more interesting if you could understand the english spoken.

    • @planetzebulon21
      @planetzebulon21 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      Or you could just listen…

    • @VisioRacer
      @VisioRacer  11 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      Everybody else understands and if you for whatever reason don't, there are always generated closed captions, so there is not real reason to bother to complain about understanding.

    • @Alcyone850
      @Alcyone850 10 หลายเดือนก่อน

      I understood perfectly, thus I feel that it may be a hearing issue...

  • @dylanzrim3635
    @dylanzrim3635 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

    If they could re-enter with todays rules I think they’d do ok even with the ground effect. They’d sound better too

  • @aquilaaudax6033
    @aquilaaudax6033 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

    ✋🏼🇦🇺👍🏼

  • @ThePontiacgto65
    @ThePontiacgto65 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

    Not all flat engines are boxers ,he was or not? and Gachot is not an engineer but a pilot and not Dutch🇳🇱 but French 🇨🇵😉

    • @VisioRacer
      @VisioRacer  11 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Ah, yes, of course. I forgot to re-write that, sorry!

    • @ThePontiacgto65
      @ThePontiacgto65 11 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@VisioRacer For once there's a small mistake it's not a big deal And as usual, the video is interesting. 👍🏻

  • @nhaixin69
    @nhaixin69 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

    Subaru never made a good engine by history.

  • @JamesHoffa1
    @JamesHoffa1 10 หลายเดือนก่อน

    You just copied a four year old Drivetribe video and changed the title slightly. Foreign thief.