How USSR Stole Wankel For KGB
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 27 ต.ค. 2023
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“ВАЗ 2108 1.3 Ротор” by Юра Новак
• ВАЗ 2108 1.3 Ротор
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• ВАЗ 2105 на роторе от ...
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• ВОСЬМЕРКА КГБ СССР!!! ...
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“Mercedes C111” by Motorvision Deutschland
• Mercedes C111
“Traffic and cars in the Soviet Union - 1976 (translated)” by Автоэкспорт СССР
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“Волга по заказу КГБ СССР / Газ 31013 Волга” by Иван Зенкевич PRO автомобили
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• Autotest 1979 - Mazda ...
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• Ваз 2109 Ротор
“Citroën / NSU Comotor Wankel” by citrofan
• Citroën / NSU Comotor ...
“Rotary VAZ 4132 Dellorto DRLA 36” by Pavel Terent'ev
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• デミオ レンジエクステンダー ロータリーエン...
“Нашел НОВЫЙ Роторный мотор ВАЗ-413 для догонялки КГБ Милиция ВАЗ-21079 21059 Капсула времени” by Roma Urraco
• Нашел НОВЫЙ Роторный м...
“рпд 415i” by drango drangov
• рпд 415i
“рпд ваз 415” by ex7373
• рпд ваз 415
“Onbord N-ring 24/06/2018 Rotary 2105” by Pavel Terent'ev
• Onbord N-ring 24/06/20...
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• РПД - 415 - ยานยนต์และพาหนะ
I had two 1970s RX-2s and they were such sleepers. They were tiny, but came with factory 4barrel carbs. My buddy put a 13B in his Datsun 510 and made a nearly perfect little sports car. Rob Dahm has shown how reliable and powerful they can be.
There was an attempt to certify heavily modified Mazda engines for aircraft due to their many advantages, including reliability, but in the end they couldn't fight the lobbying there.
Rob wasn't the first to show that, just that you're aware of.
@@Low760 Rob's predecessors don't have huge TH-cam channels to send the viewers here to either. Doesn't mean I'm not aware of them, young man.
without turbos they are nothing special
@@andrewsmart2949And there are alternative to turbos such as oxygen separating membranes or injecting oxygen stored in some way (such as compressed or in some form of chemical storage).
my uncles friend had a rotary lada, it was the fastest car in the region, as long as it lasted.. later they had to put 1.2l inline engine there :D
Did he save the Wankel engine ?
@@Chappomusic i dont know
Ты из Эстонии?
@@rzhevsky4934 yes
He must have used to wrong oil or just simply revved it too hard. Apex seals are a thing.
Late 21059 and the 90s rotary Samaras were available for civilians to freely purchase.
The only issue was the price which was too high.
last 21059 was made in 1995, and never was available in free sale.
@@Zirrex1 USSR dissolved in 1991.
And it was.
@@Random-nf7qb где и когда можно было купить 59 машину? будьте добры…. И каким боком тут 91 год?
@@Zirrex1 ну смотрите обзор от Иван Зенкевич.
После распада СССР, ВАЗу можно было зарабатывать на что угодно. РПД не был какая-то секретная технология.
@@Random-nf7qb проблема в том что я конечно видел много всякого про наши рпд, но при этом владею таким автомобилем и знаком с другими людьми из тематики отечественных рпд поэтому не по наслышке знаю когда и сколько было произведено каких моделей, где они эксплуатировались и что с ними сейчас. 59 машины выпускались с 87 по 95 год, произведено было порядка 50 автомобилей и все они были отгружены, спецслужбам и некоторым организациям напрямую связанным с автомобильной промышленностью, например у АМО ЗИЛ было две голубых чистокровных 59х 88 года с 411 двигателем. 79 и передний привод - да безусловно продавались. Сам лично в 2001 видел в алан авто роторную 99 по цене шестнадцатиклапанной десятки с допами.
World: "Wankel engines are unreliable"
Mazda: "You're rotating it wrong"
Interesting, I heard about these before. But I thought they sourced PSA BiRotor engines for this project, never knew they developed own ones!
PSA (also Citroen) got their rotor engines from NSU.
Wankel engines are inherently unreliable
That's why Mazda abandoned Wankel engines also... The Rx-8 was one of the most terrible resale value performance car ever.
@@bumpyroad3251Meanwhile the RX-7 FD go for over $70K now 💀
@@bumpyroad3251 Mazda never abandoned the rotary engine. Check mazda news and what its president has to say about it
I guess it´s more likely that the Soviets reverse engineered the rotary engine from an NSU Ro80, a German mid-size sedan from the late sixties.
I had a 1980 RX7, terrible on fuel, no tourqe at all, but smooth and tons of fun.
Factory 4 barrel carb with manual choke and a 5 speed. The factory redline on the tach was not the top revs. There was a buzzer that would go off in the dash once the actual top revs were achieved. Still amazing engines to this day!!
yeah they were nothing special without turbos
and the user manual informed that it was a requirement to redline on each drive. recently sold my RX7 FB - light, fun and the smell of petrol. The scream of the rotary feels like 100mph then you realise that the person in the civic behind you wants to get passed as you are only doing 40
You forgot burned and leaked oil like a sieve. My father had one too, for as long as it lasted.
I've got a 12a Bridgeport 83 rx7 and it's like a go kart, way too much fun not bad on fuel in my opinion
Great little motors, but I never knew about the Soviet ones.
Cheers for another great informative video.
Very unreliable and inefficient Motors, obsolete technology
I also thought it was just Mazda that used them in the automotive industry. I've heard about motorcycles and lawn mowers with rotary engines and even seen some you tubers getting a hold of those industrial single rotary and making go-carts or drift trikes
@@kzarnold3678 Mazda was not the first NSU-Wankel licensee to begin development or production.
Mazda was restricted by the terms of its license agreement to only develop and sell engines for automobiles less than 200 hp.
@@kzarnold3678 Aircraft engine manufacturer Curtiss-Wright was the first Wankel licensee followed by motorcycle, ATV and power tool company Fichtel Sachs, and Yanmar, manufacturers of marine, tractor and power tool engines.
gotta love some Visio Racer with the morning coffee 😊
Or at diner, depending on where you live....😁
my cat loves u too! 🐱♥️♥️♥️
And another great video,i had heard that they had a go at them but didn't realize they put so much effort into it .thank you
We have not developed the automotive industry for a very long time and the quality of oil in the USSR left much to be desired. With a strong unification of vehicles, it was simply impossible to contain a rotary engine.
sry for my english, im used google translate
@@touringweapon8651the former USSR has a very interesting history !
That was a stretch. Well into the dark underside of engine strangeness. Great clip
also we had some prototypes of rotary bikes, with completely different domestically engineered engines...And read about Vostok S-565 bike...and yeah, in the 90s rotary ladas were sold in small numbers. so this was beyond KGB. It was used by kgb as a result of failure of mass production because of engine and available oils quality - but it was fine for small series usage. and this V8 is NOT a cast iron engine,it's fully aluminium
Aluminum block, aluminum sleeves, aluminum heads. it was an innovation
Vaz-311 has more hp and torque then engine displacement which is impressive.
Great stuff! Thank you!
Just came home from a drive with my RX-8 and watched your video 😄 115‘000 km no problems yet 😁
Long live the rotary!
@@VisioRacerYes! Long live the Rotary! ♻️❤
must be the fully synthetic castrol 2 stroke motorcycle oil
my rx8 had 198,000 kms on it, still going, original engine.
@@davidhusband5022i drove again and i watched wrong my RX-8 has 119‘000 km 😁 im confident to drive it much longer
Consumer cars of the GDR just used two stroke engines, the Trabant, and the more expensive Wartburg, and fitted with the same engine, the Barkas van. Small, cheap, light engines with sufficient power. In the early 80s, it was planned to replace these with Volkswagen engines. It happened just before the reunification of Germany. Production ended soon, 4 stroke versions of the cars mentioned are rare.
This channel always impresses me every time. My favourite channel by far ❤❤❤❤
Always some new and interesting information, well done 👍🙂
Thank you for your work, comrade!)) Спасибо!
Great video. very well done. cheers from South Africa
That's incredible... thank you for the video
Interesting video. Thank you.
Interesting! Ty
The 5,5 cast Iron v8 you are talking about which was in volga and chaika was all aluminium
Very, very, interesting, another great, well researched video where I learn something new every Saturday morning. I would've never guessed the Soviets would've been interested in Felix Wankel's design!
Keep up the great work.
Почему "советы" не должны были заинтересоваться разработкой Ванкеля?😅 В комментарии чувствуется сильное действие западной идеологической обработки.
@@rzhevsky4934 I was just as surprised that GM, NSU, and Mazda were interested in the concept, I wasn't singling anyone out. Why put Soviets in quotes? Russia was part of the Soviet Union at that time.
@@bobhill3941 OK, значит дело в неточности перевода...
@@rzhevsky4934 Yes it is, and that happens sometimes.
@@bobhill3941NSU invented the Wankel KKM57
Mazda licensed it from NSU now Audi
6:47 engines on gaz - 13,14 were never cast iron (aluminium heads and block)
My uncle drove such car on duty. By the rumors that was Vaz 2105, used around 1993-1995 in Minsk, Belarus.
Externally that was stock RWD Vaz with pathetic tires and aerodinamics.
He could spin wheels even on 110kph by throttling ungently.
He reached the max speed of 220kph with 4 men inside, but with only driver max speed was 160kph, because car was loosing stability and attempted to fly.
He won occasional drag races againts premium 4-5 liter Mercedes and BMW sedans of that time
The fun facts is that the Lada Samara with Rotary engine was pretended to run in Group B rally but the group B ended...
The country that by that time had developed industry and engineering. It had a history of creating any kind of engine. Sophisticated radial engines, oposite engines, all sorts of configurations of two and four-stroke engines. Jet engines of all types, from airplane engines to tank engines. There were experiments on atomic engines and hydrogen engines. Various electric motors of all colors and sizes were used in industry. Sophisticated rocket engines were being developed and built.
And then comes the concept of a simple internal combustion engine - well, no, of course they stole it, reverse-engineered it and copied it!
Что поделать, британская пропаганда...
USSR had stolen Wankel patents? For sure, you need a license for series production, but this is perhaps not so sure for prototyping.
Patents expiry date is 20 years after publication.
NSU patents of the unpractical original motor by Felix Wankel came around 1957...
Wankel RCE has enough with an 80 RON fuel.
Blessings +
No, East German company IFA became a NSU-Wankel licensee in 1965
@@sandervanderkammen9230 Well, even if DDR was under USSR surveillance, the 'Einheit' day a group of Germans, drunk with beer, assaulted the soviet political police in Dresden, Putin, in command of that police station, went out, and shot in the air with a pistol. DDR no longer existed, the political police office of Putin was illegal, this was an attack to the sovereign German Federal State, but attempt of NATO to build a puppet state in Ukraine, and seize Sebastopol, the russian Pearl Harbor, is worse.
Soviets may have purchased a Wankel license, but East Germany and soviet companies are different.
License to russians is not license to East Germans, but Lada could contract development of their Wankel license with Germans.
Statement that Wankel license was stolen is an slander, specially as no series production of Wankel seems existed in USSR.
Blessings +
@@josega6338Much in the same way Northern Ireland is not an independent country East Germany was a territory that was part of Russia under the USSR government.
@@WilhelmKarsten Northern Ireland is a part of Irish land seized by britons, UK is a nation having too many peculiarities, they had a woman as head of church, 'bishopess', banned in Saint Paul letters.
The anglican church killed more catholic, for religious reasons, several hundred, than nazis in Poland, 108, and is very dubious reason for executions in Poland was purely religious; giving help to an enemy during a war is a criminal offense everytime, everyplace.
In the conflict of Thomas Beckett with UK civilian authority, the King, in last times, the only disagreement Beckett kept was the church having the right to judge common criminal offenses by clergymen.
Stupid, and against all law principles.
Beckett was wrong.
When UK joined EU, they were forced to derogate the british rules about contracts of sailors in merchant ships, it was considered some kind of slavery.
I'd say 'Brexit' came from the desire of british industrials and traders to get rid of laws they thought reduced their competitivity, also not to give Europeans a control on them, felt as a reduction in sovereignty.
Their choice of 'solo economy' is not viable; simply, they are on their shortcut to bankruptcy, today, no way back.
Ukraine is part of Russia, that was founded there, Kiev is to Russia what Covadonga is to. Spain.
Zelenski was criminal from start, they could never win the war against Russia, with or without the KGB agent Putin in Moscow, with or without the hebrew loans to purchase weapons elsewhere, same as protection to Zyon, the US govt debt will be filled in with loans, hebrew, in a monopoly financial business situation, instead of paying US armed forces for protection, will get money from US to cover debt.
Devilish absurd!
Being fed up of being misspised, zyonists claim.
There are two serious hurdles to peace and development there: Holodomor Zelenski, he deserves execution, as Germans attempted Killing Adolf Hitler; and the temple of Lenin in Moscow.
Sebastopol is the Russian equivalent to Pearl Harbor. When Japan attacked Pearl Harbor, Hawaii was not an State in USA.
Northern Ireland is a land seized with tirany and held with despotism, Ireland will go back to the Irish for the simple reason republican catholics have more kids than lutheran unionists, in the end they'll win elections.
no stolen, but USSR bought patents
Russian civilian: "why does that black Vaz sound different than mine?"
KGB: "all Vazs sound exactly the same"
I had no idea these were ever produced in the USSR.
The cr700 motorbike gives 240 bhp. Weighs 120kg. So fast and done by Brian Crighton the genius who made those 588cc norton rotarys that raced with great success including winning the british superbike serirs around 1990
Finally a video on Soviet Wankels
"check out my engine.."
......."our engine"
When a company or country does not aquire a licencing agreement they must aquire an example product to reverse engineer. So the Soviets likely had someone purchase a Mazda rotary car or an engine from a wrecking yard. The problem with not perchasing licensing agreements you have to guess what makes it work. In this they got cheap and used cast iron rotor housings. These were heavy and did not wear well like the Mazda housings with a cast in steel.liner in the aluminium housing with a hard chrome plating. I do not think they got the apex seal material correct either.
They also tried them in a twin amphibious aircraft for a short time, but engine life was poor.
The East German company IDA was an official Wankel-NSU licensee
Small correction tho, ZMZ 5.5 V8 was cast aluminum, not iron
You forgot two Soviet Wankel motorcycles - VNII-Motoprom/Dnepr and Izh Vega.
Nothing surprises me any more with the Soviet Union. Those rotaries would have not lived long in the subzero temperatures!
Very short lived
I seem to remember a little reservoir for antifreeze something to do with cold starts?
sounds like a Yamaha 2stroke dirt bike on 4wheels and a roof!
The Soviet union IS like the Wankel engine - it's good while it's working, but then bucke up! Great video!
Of all designs to steal, they choose the rotary with all its inherit problems.
Rotary engines get significant reliability improvements if you run them with two stroke fuel.
That is completely false and a blatant lie.
Wankel engines are inherently unreliable and are less durable than reciprocating engines.
Nothing you can do will change this fact.
Howveva...I didn't know the Samara got 140bhp! Always thought it was 120. Cheers
@visioracer hey did you or anyone notice at 8:09 there is a FKN huge meter wide rotary there putting an eccentric shaft in. Literally a rotor. Meter wide.... We need info!!!!!!!!
INGERSOLL-RAND pipeline compressor engine
In the GDR MZ built an Wankel Motorbike Engine,but only as Prototyp Yo can see it in the MZ Museum Castle Augustusburg Near Chemnitz/Saxon/Germany.
East German company IFA was a official NSU-Wankel licensee
Интересно)
Helped me win a car of the day hint game in one my car groups. Said car of the day tomorrow is a rotary and isnt Japanese or German and imidiatly thought to this video and i was right lol😂
The Rotary type engine was invented in France by Felix Millet in 1892.
Western oils couldn't even do 10,000km between oil changes back then not even in regular piston engines. I don't know if the USSR had lower quality engine oil
Lepienie cegieł.
To szacunek do życia.
Tak w życiu jest.
Ślubowanie w drugiej kolejności.Dzięki Bogu.
They just make lada Riva's wheel spin monsters. Sticking genuine Webber carb's or even 40's dcoe or a single 45 shared between the 4 cilnders would of been better
My first car was a 83 rx7 wow that's one I wish I kept
What a horrible pile of junk...
Who needs torque or reliability when it sounds cool
Because most people drive real cars... not video games
Хочу сделать замечание, блок двигателя змз v8 5.5 был отлит из Алюминия не из чугуна. Единственное что там было чугунное это гильзы.
Rotary engine in a helicopter is a very funny idea
After failing with the M35 prototype car, after failing with the GS "birotor" production car, Citroen built an helicopter too, that was not allowed to fly because it was so unreliable.
Then they filled for bankruptcy XD
It's a very, very bad idea.
Wankel engines are inherently unreliable and are simply too dangerous to use in aircraft.
3:42 that's a lion. They trapped a lion in there
Yeah, lumpy and throaty 🤣
Those things would rev so hard they even tried to market a Holden Kingswood in Japan with a Wankel engine 😂 it was called the Roadmaster or something like that.
One reason why the rotary engine was horrible on gas is the combustion chamber designed, but if you converted it to propane all the propane would be burned up; they have to make a little bit bigger combustion chamber in rotor.
That is false, Wankel engines operate very poorly on gaseous fuels like Propane and hydrogen, they also lack the higher static compression ratios needed to extract the energy from gas fuel efficiently.
Please do not post false and misleading comments on a topic that you are clearly not qualified to discuss.
The optimal fuel for Wankel engines has always been gasoline.
Wankel engines are proven to be less efficient and unsuitable for alternative fuels
While i have no personal experience, an old man who lived nearby to me when i was a kid had an autocross car, a mazda rx4 sedan running on lpg/propane, it also had the 'upper cylinder lubricant' injection system from a piston engined lpg car, but he used to put two stroke oil in it instead. That already old and neglected rx4 spent every weekend thrashing around autocross tracks right up untill 2009 without the engine being rebuilt, it only got replaced with a mazda mx5 once the rx4 was worth enough money that even in its rusty, beat up but mechanically still running state, it was then worth more than a stock na mx5, so he sold it and got an na mx5.
He said the secret to its reliability was to start it in the morning and not turn it off till you were ready to put it back on the trailer in the evening. It was quite smokey when i last saw it. But it did still start relatively easily.
@@Colt45hatchback Sounds like a batty old crackpot... sounds like the silly nonsense that happens in backwards country
I used to have a RX-7 1981 with the 12A engine.. loved that car man!
But did they register the patent in Eastern Block ? No patent, no license...
DDR was Eastern block
They should bring it back. Make a rotary that uses natural gas since now they can't sell that to the EU.
4:39 12k miles rebuild sounds about right? Because the early rotary are basically like a 2 stroke engine right, they need to use premixed gas for lubrication.
WHY? the Wankel engine is obsolete technology.
Wankel engines cannot support the higher static compression ratio needed to run on Natural gas efficiently.
All Wankel engines operate using the 4-stroke principle, oil injection is superior to premixing
If only I could find one or a fiat 2.0 twin cam lol
Ха, у коллеги как раз "догоняйка" таким двигателем. Вжаривает будь здоров.
A Dorito spinning in a Peanut. Worst sounding engine ever made.
@robdahm yo bro.... Check out 8:09. Its a meter wide rotor and 5ft eccentric shaft!!!!!
I'd like to see a Rotary Diesel. Is it possible ?
I don't think the effective compression ratio required would be possible.
Rolls-Royce apparently built diesel Wankels... RR gave up on the rotary, same as all but Mazda
sure you can!
These things aren’t event reliable as petrol 😂
Wankels' compression is fundamentally limited by rotor geometry. A piston engine can have infinite compression if it wants to, but a wankel can not, and even if it could, wankels' core issue are the seals.
Good ole fashioned dorito engine
is the sound mixing always so bad, I know that sound is a big appeal, but the badly mixed audio makes the video unwatchable for me.
USSR stole wankel for KGB? Seriously?
USSR did a first flight to space.
it's capitalistic way to think than everything can be property,even idea.
no, thank you 1:58
cool :3
0:09 - in USSR there were NO powerfull cars. People drove only Lada, MOSKVICH, ZAZ and Volga. Such cars as Mercedes or Buick owned only some Soviet famous sportsmans or artists.
Like from Russia
VisioRacer you are a spy for having so much data on all types of engines 😁Maybe they also copied the Citroën M35 version and especially the twin rotor GS but the powers without turbo seem very important perhaps an exaggeration for Soviet propaganda
How could they use specs of militia-special cars for propaganda lol
Why u think kgb is not the part of japan, europe and usa?
They could have it!
A revolution? Pun intended? 😂
It Orbits..
In a distinctive planetary motion.
Dorito
2004 was no longer Soviet Union, dude.
they burn out tips and use engine oil nice vid 👍👍
16litres to 100km and a lifespan of 50,000km if you lucky
Sovjet Engineering, steal everything, then make an half arsed effort to replicate.
i wonder if eamon hurley knew about the soviet 3 and 4 rotor engines when he started making them from 12A's he had from converting NSU's to 4cyl engines,he nearly died when his rotor powered drag race motorcycle crashed
👍💪✌
Да . И Руси су усавршили ротакс мотор . Од ванкеловог мотора остала је само концепција мотора .
Сада уместо овалног цилиндра и троугластог клипа има овални клип .
Тиме су побољшани многи недостаци ванкел мотора .
Rotax GmbH. is a formerly German company (Sachs) now based in Austria..
They sabotaged themselves
Americans still.
Russians buying.
Using the word "liquidated" for a former soviet company sounds a bit too ominous for my tastes.
Я работаю в КГБ у нас такие сашины
Were they to poor to turbo them tho 😅😅😅
Just as Wankel drew it, Mazda and Autovaz produced it. Many dimensions are common on these engines, even interchangeable parts. However, Mazda went ahead and tried to solve the seals. So claim who developed the engine - wankel
Felix Wankel hated this inferior engine, the KKM57 was designed by Hanns Paschke and Walter Frode.
All 26 manufacturers licensed the KKM57 from _NSU Motornwerkes GmbH_ they all received the same data package and sample engines.
Not good…⁉️👊🔥
Until this day I had no idea the USSR had Rotary Engines. It isn't a shocker that a) they stole it and B) had issues with Apex seals and the poorer quality fuel
А что такого? Когда у нас воровали изобретения, это никому не казалось ужасным
@@rzhevsky4934 what inventions? As for stolen, when is that ever right?
@@marklittle8805 например, лампу накаливания изобрёл инженер Лодыгин в 1870 году, однако в англоязычных странах автором считается Эдисон. В России все, кто по профессии связан с электротехникой знает об изобретении Лодыгина, однако на Западе скрывают эту информацию от людей. Подобных примеров множество; большинство открытий и разработок, которые вы считаете "своими", создали люди из совершенно других стран
@@marklittle8805 France stole Concorde 😂
*Зачем КГБ такие моторы и такие автомобили❓🤔*
Les mecs ont volé Wankil pour le KGB, quelle triste époque
Чувак, советский союз первым запустил спутник на орбиту, первым запустил и приземлил животное и человека, первые фото обратной стороны луны сделал, спустил туда луноход, на Венеру дрон спустил, космическую станцию на околоземную орбиту запустил и запустил дрон на Марс. Это было государство которое могло все. 40% самолетов в небе были советского производства. Роторный двигатель делали сами. Идея ничего не стоит. Решает исполнение.
And stole Concorde to be first.
But never managed to produce toilet paper or decent cars 😂
✋🏼🇦🇺👍🏼
The general public didn't generally have cars in the USSR . in 1985 private vehicle ownership was 45 cars per 1000 people
Never knew soviets jumped on this farting boondoggle of an engine, following the madman path of Citroen (which also produced an helicopter that was so unreliable it was not allowed to fly).
Hater detected
@@KitKitChanIsaac*Rotard detected*
@@sandervanderkammen9230 Respect the rotary.
@@KitKitChanIsaac FYI: the Wankel engine is inherently unreliable, obsolete technology and the biggest failure in the history of the engine manufacturing industry
Wankel engines are so horribly unreliable that the cannot be used in any certified passenger aircraft.
I'm suprised they didn't take Felix Wankel.
sounds like a cartoon character of feline catus origin 🐱👍🏿
Felix Wankel despised this POS engine
Wankel
hehehehehehehe
Wankel