You forgot one thing, THE DIFFICULTY, to quote TH-camr Yakkocmn, you either take advantage of the wide variety of skills & demons at your disposal, or you get your shit pushed in by a skeleton
When I first played SMT I played SMT 4 completely blind, I went into Naraku going through the progression and after the Minotaur I literally thought I was going to go to hell. My shock realizing I ended up in a tower in a city, I thought this tower was the Seattle Space Neddle and that I was in Seattle.
I always thought it was interesting that Nocturne, ostensibly the "prototypical" modern SMT, aligns every single companion with Law by having them go along with Kagutsuchi. Pre-Maniax, Chaos wasn't even really an option.
I'm really enjoying your videos, I can tell you have a real talent for making them! If I could give you some constructive criticism, I think that your transitions are a bit abrupt and suffer from not narrating the titles of the segments. These factors can make the video a little disorientating. The meat of your videos is very well constructed and presented. Keep up the great work. Also I'm big fan of SMT, seeing another fan always sparks joy.
Beautifully done video. Loved the SMT series since Nocturne came out because I loved mythology so much, couldn't get enough since. If anyone is interested, please try it out
I tried this (5, specifically) after having played persona 4G and bounced off. I’m currently playing 5 Royal and love it, though it’s not perfect… But the thought of going back to SMT5 seems less than appealing. It… it’s like just running mementos from 5R forever… or to be fairer I suppose it’s like just the Palaces all string together. Indefinitely. I guess I just need more than combat for dozens of hours. Idk. Maybe I’m missing something. Maybe I did t get far enough in and something changes like twenty hours in. Idk.
SMTIV is not only my favorite mainline game but one of my favorite games of all time (also I agree Apocalypse sucked imo and it tried to fix things that weren’t broken imo even the combat)
Started my first mainline smt game so far being 5. Very good so far though I prefer p5r just because it is great all around while I've heard some negative stuff about the smt 5 story and I prefer the story of p5r though the game looks good. Pretty difficult bosses too. People are very split on this game though.
I'm going to have to respectfully disagree with you on most of the points you make here. while, yes quite a few of the gameplay elements in SMT in general are quite interesting, stuff like the Press Turn system tend to alternate between making the games it is in either too easy or downright *unbearable.* you get punished for not knowing a specific enemy's weakness beforehand, or even missing an attack- *something which you have NO CONTROL OVER* -but if you do all the necessary preparation for the fight that's been the bane of your existence for the past hour, suddenly it becomes trivially easy to the point that the enemy in question can't do *crap* against you. not to mention the relatively recent emphasis on "affinities" which greatly hinders the player's ability to really customize their teams. after all, if your demons are only really meant to use a specific element, then well, there's not really much you can do about it. I'm a bit "eh" when it comes to atmosphere and it's effect overall, so I'll concede you that point, though I personally believe-and I hope you agree-that atmosphere alone doesn't make or break a game. while SMT games usually do indeed have stories, more often than not there are not *good* stories. on average they're half-decent at best, with games like Devil Survivor and Strange Journey being exceptions that prove the rule. at it's best SMT is still filled with plotholtes, inconsistencies, and characters acting like idiots for no reason. and at worst? Devil Summoner "Soul Hackers 2" and Shin Megami Tensei IV: Apocalypse. the absolute bottom of the barrel when it comes to SMT. and when it comes to religion and the various figures from within it, usually they're not portrayed faithfully to their source material *at all.* sure there's references and a few surface-level similarities, and occasionally there are demons who somewhat closely resemble their original counterparts, but more often than not they might as well be completely different characters. God goes from an all-power all-loving benevolent Creator to a petty spiteful tin-pot dictator who isn't even all that special that *stole* the world which just came into existence on it's own, and who hates free will for no reason other than being big and bad and stupid. Satan, meanwhile, has been divided into two *separate* demons-Satan, who is usually blindly obedient to God's will (until he isn't), and Lucifer, who is often portrayed as a "tragic hero" who went against the big evil dumb head in the sky because he *cared* about people and their free will, and was punished for doing so. might I add that despite all the shit Law gets, Chaos is objectively the worst alignment for humanity? these are two of the most egregious examples, but I assure you there are many more. the amount of blatant mischaracterizations among religious figures in each game is about as high as the number of entries in each game's demonic compendium! and honestly, I find you saying that the demons in SMT are in fact 1:1 with their original versions to be just as insulting as you found Nintendo's statements regarding Paper Mario being a series that's all about paper. Neither is true. in regards to your reccomendations, well, SMT V is just bad. I'm sorry, but the "story" consists of characters either standing around spouting exposition, bashing God and the Law alignment over and over, or barebones "character interactions" between "characters" with personalities as paper-thin as any in Apocalypse. IV is one of the three SMT games that I downloaded when I decided to take a closer look at the series for myself, and it is easily the worst of the three. I might have screwed myself by going in knowing to some extent what to expect-though for some reason it wasn't nearly as much of an issue with the other two-but overall the story, gameplay, characters etc. are superior only to it's garbage-tier alternate timeline "sequel", but garbage is still garbage even if it doesn't smell as bad. I have not played Nocturne myself, so all I really have to go off of is the footage of it that I've seen, and honestly I actually think it's a good game. religion-bashing is kept to a minimum, most of the alignments are fairly balanced, the demon inaccuracies can be handwaved away by them just being Fallen Angels-or in the case of guys like the Reason Bosses, being interesting and unique enough that it doesn't really matter how inaccurate they are-and while the press turn system is doubtlessly as bone-grindingly frustrating as it is elsewhere, the whole POINT of Nocturne is that it's bone-grindingly frustrating so it doesn't really make much of a difference. anyway, for people who want to play SMT, my personal recommendations are Strange Journey, Devil Survivor (the first one), and Devil Summoner Soul Hackers (again, the first one) in regards to Strange Journey-well, redux at the very least, I haven't played the original-the game is forgiving enough in comparison to most other entries that you can actually have fun with it and usually game-overs are your own fault and not the game's. the story is actually interesting, though the constant repetition of the game's environmentalist message does get old very fast, and the various alignments are actually interesting...at least, until Alex shows up and you find out that they all end badly. oh, and Demon Source is an amazing mechanic, and the fact that the protagonist is just a soldier rather than a super special teenage whatever blessed with the powers of God and Anime is a breath of fresh air. Soul Hackers I haven't played, but I recommend based on the story *alone.* not only does it fit the times we live in super well, it's just a good story overall. and the fact that the Demons of Judeo-Christian lore are actually portrayed somewhat accurately-i.e. evil, subversive, viewing humans as beneath them-is just icing on the cake. lastly, Devil Survivor. I personally recommend Overclocked for the gameplay, but if you want to stick with quality storytelling, then the original is probably enough. aside from being airheaded idiots-especially in the extra content-the characters' personalities are interesting enough, especially by SMT standards, and there's plenty of opportunities to get to know everyone better. the gameplay itself is also amazing, and is a near-perfect blend of traditional SMT gameplay, *modern* SMT gameplay, and tactical RPGs that I am *shocked* wasn't used as a basis for a crossover with Fire Emblem. add in alignments that actually *don't* suck overall-unless you take the extra content into account-and a God who's arguably not an unbearable arsehole and instead actually gives a damn about humanity as a whole, then you've got yourself as close to a masterpiece as Atlus is physically capable of producing. ....shame that the sequel didn't live up to the legacy of it's predecessor.
@@doggifu I'd really like to see that. Other than the gameplay everything else feels not good. Other than Gaston all the characters are terrible (Nozomi being the worst) and both endings being neutral based was weird.
@@Oldschoolgamer13 Nozomi going along with the "demons bad/humans good" message everyone else has is so baffling considering she is still the queen of an entire race of demons. And it's always funny when it's brought up with Hallelujah in earshot lmao
Thing is, Shin Megami Tensei is the most superficial franchise in the history of Japanese video games. The minimalist storytelling forces you to do all the work for the game, in addition to having horrendously emotionless characters you can't ever get to care about, try as hard as you'd like. There's a reason Persona is more popular - it just exudes more passion in the writing department.
Honestly if story is bad I look at the other aspects of a game. A good story elevates a game but good gameplay is what I focus on mostly. I do prefer persona for story and character reasons but Smt5 is also good.
I’m going to assume you’re using the term “superficial” wrong; and mean that there’s a lack of overt story telling… Because there’s plenty of depth to the games in terms of the worlds, atmosphere, gameplay, etc; it just takes a more ‘hands off’ approach with communicating those things compared to other jrpgs.
@@blaze595 That's exactly why SMT feels empty, yeah. Its gameplay is good, and the atmosphere is too, but I see no incentive to play a JRPG, or any RPG/story heavy game for that matter, if its characters are robotic and unlikable. SMT is very much that, because character writing is not a series priority - rather, it's trying to be philosophical without making its characters endearing and likable which is just absurd to me. SMT characters are certainly more superficial than say, Persona's, because they only really serve to exude a specific theme without having any real personality/reason to care about them. About 9 months ago, I got into SMT through the beloved Nocturne, and really, really didn't care for its characters, despite trying so hard to do so. Everybody says SMT is "amazing" and that I should give it a try. I did, and was left disappointed.
Pretty bold decision for Altus to include baby Demi Fiend and Nahobino on the roster ngl
????
i think shin megami tensei would be better if there was a 2nd larry koopa in it
i think it would be even better if it had the protagonist from knack 1 and 2...
...i know, i'm unoriginal. you may now call me unfunny.
You forgot one thing, THE DIFFICULTY, to quote TH-camr Yakkocmn,
you either take advantage of the wide variety of skills & demons at your disposal, or you get your shit pushed in by a skeleton
I beat nuwa in smt 5 in about 3 tries and it was satisfying.
When I first played SMT I played SMT 4 completely blind, I went into Naraku going through the progression and after the Minotaur I literally thought I was going to go to hell. My shock realizing I ended up in a tower in a city, I thought this tower was the Seattle Space Neddle and that I was in Seattle.
The series should be multiplatform since SMT Noc
It should be but this Atlus we are talking about.
I noticed you didn't mention anything about SMT 1/2. What are your thoughts on those games?
12:53 YOYOGI KOEN - YOYOGI KOEN
I always thought it was interesting that Nocturne, ostensibly the "prototypical" modern SMT, aligns every single companion with Law by having them go along with Kagutsuchi.
Pre-Maniax, Chaos wasn't even really an option.
>that intro
Mario Kart would never take advantage of our innate gullibility
Nice! :) doggifu is recommending us to play a REAL Shin Megoomi Tensei game :)
I like how you started with mario kart and then said absolutely nothing about Mario kart XD
Is there a pink gold megami tensei
Pink gold yoshitsune
Great video! Love seeing the SMT love
I'm really enjoying your videos, I can tell you have a real talent for making them! If I could give you some constructive criticism, I think that your transitions are a bit abrupt and suffer from not narrating the titles of the segments. These factors can make the video a little disorientating. The meat of your videos is very well constructed and presented. Keep up the great work. Also I'm big fan of SMT, seeing another fan always sparks joy.
Beautifully done video. Loved the SMT series since Nocturne came out because I loved mythology so much, couldn't get enough since. If anyone is interested, please try it out
As a persona fan that didnt touch mainline smt YET, I wanna say that this video was awesome and needs more views.
ME FOUL SLIME!! LIKE VIDEO!!!
i just need an smt iv port to modern platforms and i can die peacefully.
SMT is peak fiction
Subscribed! More JRPG stuff please!!
It's my favorite genre so you should probably expect a lot more of it
I love this video and would subscribe but they took my wife in the divorce.
I tried this (5, specifically) after having played persona 4G and bounced off.
I’m currently playing 5 Royal and love it, though it’s not perfect…
But the thought of going back to SMT5 seems less than appealing.
It… it’s like just running mementos from 5R forever… or to be fairer I suppose it’s like just the Palaces all string together. Indefinitely.
I guess I just need more than combat for dozens of hours. Idk. Maybe I’m missing something. Maybe I did t get far enough in and something changes like twenty hours in. Idk.
I like how difficult the bosses are and you basically have 4 wildcards(3 different demons and you can customize yourself).
Mokoi.
It would be nice if all SMT(and related) games were on PS4, PS5, Switch, etc.
Gambo should be a Megaten demon.
I’ll look into buying smt 5
One word, Jakku Frosto
Love the video keep up the good work
Stop naggin me, just finished Kyuuyaku, SMT 1, 2, If... Persona 1, 2 IS, 2 ET, gimme a break!
SMTIV is not only my favorite mainline game but one of my favorite games of all time (also I agree Apocalypse sucked imo and it tried to fix things that weren’t broken imo even the combat)
Play smt4a on apocalypse difficulty. Makes the game better
A lot of the good gameplay elements in 5 came from 4a
Started my first mainline smt game so far being 5. Very good so far though I prefer p5r just because it is great all around while I've heard some negative stuff about the smt 5 story and I prefer the story of p5r though the game looks good. Pretty difficult bosses too. People are very split on this game though.
apocalypse is good tho
im playing persona 1 right now. but i sooo prefer smt.
I'm going to have to respectfully disagree with you on most of the points you make here.
while, yes quite a few of the gameplay elements in SMT in general are quite interesting,
stuff like the Press Turn system tend to alternate between making the games it is in either too easy or downright *unbearable.*
you get punished for not knowing a specific enemy's weakness beforehand, or even missing an attack- *something which you have NO CONTROL OVER* -but if you do all the necessary preparation for the fight that's been the bane of your existence for the past hour, suddenly it becomes trivially easy to the point that the enemy in question can't do *crap* against you.
not to mention the relatively recent emphasis on "affinities" which greatly hinders the player's ability to really customize their teams. after all, if your demons are only really meant to use a specific element, then well, there's not really much you can do about it.
I'm a bit "eh" when it comes to atmosphere and it's effect overall, so I'll concede you that point, though I personally believe-and I hope you agree-that atmosphere alone doesn't make or break a game.
while SMT games usually do indeed have stories, more often than not there are not *good* stories. on average they're half-decent at best, with games like Devil Survivor and Strange Journey being exceptions that prove the rule.
at it's best SMT is still filled with plotholtes, inconsistencies, and characters acting like idiots for no reason.
and at worst?
Devil Summoner "Soul Hackers 2" and Shin Megami Tensei IV: Apocalypse. the absolute bottom of the barrel when it comes to SMT.
and when it comes to religion and the various figures from within it, usually they're not portrayed faithfully to their source material *at all.* sure there's references and a few surface-level similarities, and occasionally there are demons who somewhat closely resemble their original counterparts, but more often than not they might as well be completely different characters.
God goes from an all-power all-loving benevolent Creator to a petty spiteful tin-pot dictator who isn't even all that special that *stole* the world which just came into existence on it's own, and who hates free will for no reason other than being big and bad and stupid.
Satan, meanwhile, has been divided into two *separate* demons-Satan, who is usually blindly obedient to God's will (until he isn't), and Lucifer, who is often portrayed as a "tragic hero" who went against the big evil dumb head in the sky because he *cared* about people and their free will, and was punished for doing so.
might I add that despite all the shit Law gets, Chaos is objectively the worst alignment for humanity?
these are two of the most egregious examples, but I assure you there are many more.
the amount of blatant mischaracterizations among religious figures in each game is about as high as the number of entries in each game's demonic compendium!
and honestly, I find you saying that the demons in SMT are in fact 1:1 with their original versions to be just as insulting as you found Nintendo's statements regarding Paper Mario being a series that's all about paper.
Neither is true.
in regards to your reccomendations, well,
SMT V is just bad. I'm sorry, but the "story" consists of characters either standing around spouting exposition, bashing God and the Law alignment over and over, or barebones "character interactions" between "characters" with personalities as paper-thin as any in Apocalypse.
IV is one of the three SMT games that I downloaded when I decided to take a closer look at the series for myself, and it is easily the worst of the three. I might have screwed myself by going in knowing to some extent what to expect-though for some reason it wasn't nearly as much of an issue with the other two-but overall the story, gameplay, characters etc. are superior only to it's garbage-tier alternate timeline "sequel", but garbage is still garbage even if it doesn't smell as bad.
I have not played Nocturne myself, so all I really have to go off of is the footage of it that I've seen, and honestly I actually think it's a good game. religion-bashing is kept to a minimum, most of the alignments are fairly balanced, the demon inaccuracies can be handwaved away by them just being Fallen Angels-or in the case of guys like the Reason Bosses, being interesting and unique enough that it doesn't really matter how inaccurate they are-and while the press turn system is doubtlessly as bone-grindingly frustrating as it is elsewhere, the whole POINT of Nocturne is that it's bone-grindingly frustrating so it doesn't really make much of a difference.
anyway, for people who want to play SMT, my personal recommendations are Strange Journey, Devil Survivor (the first one), and Devil Summoner Soul Hackers (again, the first one)
in regards to Strange Journey-well, redux at the very least, I haven't played the original-the game is forgiving enough in comparison to most other entries that you can actually have fun with it and usually game-overs are your own fault and not the game's. the story is actually interesting, though the constant repetition of the game's environmentalist message does get old very fast, and the various alignments are actually interesting...at least, until Alex shows up and you find out that they all end badly. oh, and Demon Source is an amazing mechanic, and the fact that the protagonist is just a soldier rather than a super special teenage whatever blessed with the powers of God and Anime is a breath of fresh air.
Soul Hackers I haven't played, but I recommend based on the story *alone.* not only does it fit the times we live in super well, it's just a good story overall. and the fact that the Demons of Judeo-Christian lore are actually portrayed somewhat accurately-i.e. evil, subversive, viewing humans as beneath them-is just icing on the cake.
lastly, Devil Survivor. I personally recommend Overclocked for the gameplay, but if you want to stick with quality storytelling, then the original is probably enough. aside from being airheaded idiots-especially in the extra content-the characters' personalities are interesting enough, especially by SMT standards, and there's plenty of opportunities to get to know everyone better. the gameplay itself is also amazing, and is a near-perfect blend of traditional SMT gameplay, *modern* SMT gameplay, and tactical RPGs that I am *shocked* wasn't used as a basis for a crossover with Fire Emblem.
add in alignments that actually *don't* suck overall-unless you take the extra content into account-and a God who's arguably not an unbearable arsehole and instead actually gives a damn about humanity as a whole, then you've got yourself as close to a masterpiece as Atlus is physically capable of producing.
....shame that the sequel didn't live up to the legacy of it's predecessor.
Hee-ho!
Pixie.
I tried SMT5, but I didn't enjoy playing it.
>Apocalypse is the worst
BASED
I wanted to side with Merkabah over everyone else in that one. And I'm a neutralfag.
A project I eventually want to get to is an hours-long video where I go scene by scene in Apocalypse to pick apart everything I hate about it
@@doggifu I'd really like to see that. Other than the gameplay everything else feels not good. Other than Gaston all the characters are terrible (Nozomi being the worst) and both endings being neutral based was weird.
@@Oldschoolgamer13 Nozomi going along with the "demons bad/humans good" message everyone else has is so baffling considering she is still the queen of an entire race of demons. And it's always funny when it's brought up with Hallelujah in earshot lmao
Apocalypse gameplay is goated though. It cannot be argued otherwise.
The only good SMT game is Jack Bros.
Nah.
Yes, play SMT, just not the dogshit SMT V
I really like it. What is wrong with it?
No you shouldn't play it...its not that good.
agree, IMHO Persona is so much better, dense with QoL and actual meaning and incentive to play
@@usuratonkaichiiAs a persona fan I really like smt5 so far. Yeah I prefer p5 for story, and daily life stuff but solid gameplay.
@@usuratonkaichii most of the qol in modern persona came from later smt games 💀
It’s overrated yeah but still good
Thing is, Shin Megami Tensei is the most superficial franchise in the history of Japanese video games. The minimalist storytelling forces you to do all the work for the game, in addition to having horrendously emotionless characters you can't ever get to care about, try as hard as you'd like. There's a reason Persona is more popular - it just exudes more passion in the writing department.
Honestly if story is bad I look at the other aspects of a game. A good story elevates a game but good gameplay is what I focus on mostly. I do prefer persona for story and character reasons but Smt5 is also good.
You say that yet fromsoft games are massively popular even moreso then persona and have a similar approach to story
I’m going to assume you’re using the term “superficial” wrong; and mean that there’s a lack of overt story telling… Because there’s plenty of depth to the games in terms of the worlds, atmosphere, gameplay, etc; it just takes a more ‘hands off’ approach with communicating those things compared to other jrpgs.
@@blaze595 That's exactly why SMT feels empty, yeah. Its gameplay is good, and the atmosphere is too, but I see no incentive to play a JRPG, or any RPG/story heavy game for that matter, if its characters are robotic and unlikable. SMT is very much that, because character writing is not a series priority - rather, it's trying to be philosophical without making its characters endearing and likable which is just absurd to me. SMT characters are certainly more superficial than say, Persona's, because they only really serve to exude a specific theme without having any real personality/reason to care about them.
About 9 months ago, I got into SMT through the beloved Nocturne, and really, really didn't care for its characters, despite trying so hard to do so. Everybody says SMT is "amazing" and that I should give it a try. I did, and was left disappointed.