How Many Sets YOU Should Do For MAXIMUM Muscle Growth (ft. Dr Mike Israetel)
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 30 พ.ค. 2024
- In this video, Pak from Stronger By Science sits down with Dr. Mike Israetel of @RenaissancePeriodization and discusses the concept of volume cycling for hypertrophy
Gain access to 28 FREE Programs:
www.strongerbyscience.com/new...
Want us to help you reach your goals?
strongerbyscience.com/coaching
References:
pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/27219...
pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/25546...
pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/37796...
pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/30153...
pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/38274...
#hypertrophy #volume
"How Many Sets YOU Should Do For MAXIMUM Muscle Growth (ft. Dr Mike Israetel)" - กีฬา
Dr. Mike’s proficient way to keep us engaged with some wild shit in between the science needs to be studied in all major universities and Fortune 500 companies because this is iconic
Big dick energy
At 44 and working out for over 20 years, I can attest to the injury factor of high volume workouts. I now realize that less is more... Getting hurt at this age will set you back for months
Yep !
I’m 47 and my joints are super beat up from years of wrestling etc
Whenever I push the volume too hard my recovery goes to hell
I feel if one has worked out enough in his life then he becomes better at less time at gym while being more accurate and productive. Also, the muscle growth would have already reached the peak and person wisely realises that there is much more to life and lets just focus on maintenance of the strength and muscle one has grown in his life, as not everybody wants or can become a body builder. Lift wisely. The comment perfectly puts up tha injury post 40 can set one back for months.
Yup, if I’m doing a 5x5 squat at 85% of my 1RM max for example then I can barely even sit on the toilet or tie my shoes I’m so sore. And at 45 it takes me a good 7 sets or so to work my way to 455 pounds because my body can’t take going from 225 to 450 like when I was 26 or so. Already pushing that volume limit by the time I hit my desired weight on a heavy day. I’ve found that doing one good set of 5 reps at a relatively high weight is good enough. Less soreness and always me to train legs more than once per week
I'll be 54 this year my body is tore up from the floor up
I’m 47 and I now do 20 reps of a weight that gives me a good burn or pump with 30-45 rest in between sets.
This clarifies my confusion I had about these high volume studies and how they aren't just "junk volume". Volume is an adaptive phenomenon where the appropriate amount is influenced by genetics, nutrition and other factors that impact recovery capability, and recent training history. So no, you don't need or want 52 god damn quad sets after you've been out of the gym for two weeks. You could conceivably work up to very high quad volume for a period of time if you kept other muscles groups at maintenance volume. However, individual response to volume does seem to vary, so high volume just isn't for everyone and even if you can handle it, it's something you work up to over time as your muscles adapt. That is my current understanding.
Ye there’s no way ur doing 52 sets a week just for quads especially with extra stuff. Defo not with just squats. I like to personally shift between high volume and high intensity. It’s like a breath of fresh air. After a good high volume phase for only a few muscles. I just take that movement. Chop all that volume and just go to failure.
How does anyone know if these studies are true? It comes down to trusting people you don’t know, remember the easy thing for someone to do is lie. So I feel everyone should just experiment with their own training and see what works for them because everyone is different.
@@steelphantom9105 there is no reason not to trust the literature - especially if you are dealing with meta-analyses. Especially in this case there is no benefit in falsifying any data. As a researcher your goal is to publish stuff. Whether your data supports or contradicts a certain hypothesis does not matter - in both cases you can put the results into a paper and/or your PhD-Thesis.
When looking at drugs and supplements - things look different. There you really have to dig into the studies to see whether the data quality is sufficient to support the claims and who's paying for the research (often the company producing that stuff).
@@steelphantom9105 that’s a very silly argument and makes zero sense in every way. Shows a non existent understanding of the scientific process and a nihilism that doesn’t know how integrity is achieved.
U can tell easily whether studies are true based on the scientist, the journal, the actual results, how it’s compared to other results, has it been peer reviewed, can it be repeated. Is there a reason for lies? Is there any conflicting interest and biases. These are all asked and measured by the scientific community. U seem to think people (at least those of the scientific mind) read it and accept it as gospel. So no, that is a very poor argument. If ur supposition is anything and everything can be a lie. While it doesn’t mean ur wrong, it does mean ur devoid of reasonable logic and problem solving.
The second half of ur point I agree with
@@steelphantom9105the studies are true. Most are just too fragile and don't have enough resilience and discipline.
You gotta love Mike.
There being a V-shred ad before this video is beyond disrespectful to Mike and Pak. How dare you, TH-cam.
TH-cam is out of pocket for that
Great video
Crippled at work. Mike literally just described my life. I’ll do less sets next week. Thanks!
Last time i checked the best volume is the most that youre able to recover from while adjusting some sort of difficulty via rest time, repetition, and/or resistance level.
Yes, but also improving your technique has also big influance. I started my chest focus meso with 7 sets (goal after two weeks of traning it usually go 4, 5 , 6 then 7) chest twice, a week. And my dips technique after two mesocycles got so much better, that i wans’t able to recover to the next workout. I had to cut volume to 5 sets. And that gave me really great gains.
I would say it's the least amount you need to continually progress. There is no need to push yourself to the absolute limit.
@adammiller9179
This is the complete opposite of optimizing your ability to progress.
exactly right... my volume requirements are much higher than most people, but it also produces outsized gains for me compared to most people... we all have genetically different work capacity and what benefits us
True, but absolute optimization honestly not the most important thing for most people and it shouldn't be.
“2 weeks in Greece with you people… I didn’t mean to say ‘you people’ … but I do mean that offensively.” 😂🤣😂
I’m glad I wasn’t drinking anything when he said that …
I'm glad you've warned me 😂😂😂
Four sets for ten to twelve reps, pyramiding up in weight, working each body part from every angle, works well for me, with 3 to 4 minute breaks for upper body and 4 to 5 minute breaks for legs beteween sets.
Great for skinny noodles
What you just desrcibed is for beginners who have never really actually trained. Anyone whos even an intermediate lifter shouldnt follow what youve just said and heres why.
Resting 3-4 minutes for upper body so let's say you do just 5 exercises for Chest in a workout (Incline Press, Flat Press, Cable Flys, Dips and Pull Overs) for example that means you've spent 45 minutes in the gym just resting and that's if your only doing 3 sets for each exercise. 3(mins) x 3(sets) = 9 x 5(exercises) = 45 mins rest (Not needed imo)
Your doing 4 sets and taking 3-4 minutes rest so your resting anywhere between 48 minutes (if you only do 4 exercises each with 4 sets each with 3 minute rests inbetween) to 1 hour just resting.
I would say shorten your rest periods! and I'd also consider 8 reps to be OK for muscle Hypertrophy as apposed to 10-12 which is still OK but with 8-12 reps you have 4 reps in which you could lift slightly more and reach True failure rather than just lifting untill you reach 10 to 12 reps
Also pyramiding only up?? Why as the workout goes on the body gets more fatigued in many cases it actually makes scientific sense to pyramid down starting heavy and ending lighter in weights.
What I would recommend based on personal expirance from training for 19 years with trial and error and also PT qualifications is training 4-5 days a week and scrapping the BRO split where we train Chest on Mondays etc, to training every muscle group x2 per week (atleast upperbody) for example such as a push pull legs split this atleast in my expirance has made the biggest changes for me.
Just finished my third meso of high volume upper body focus. 15 weeks total with 20-25 sets per upper body muscle. Definitely noticed increased growth in my arms and Delts versus previous meso’s with 10 sets per week. On the downside, the systemic fatigue is definitely noticeable, by week four or five I’m exhausted and ready for a deload. I will definitely be continuing high volume, especially on focus muscles.
"High volume", says 20-25 sets lol
but the thing is, that's not even high volume... i think i've done 30 to 40 sets a day, 6 days a week for 3 to 5 months before i noticed a systemic fatigue (which is a massive mistake by the way, you're never supposed to reach that point, always stop before that, and it's WAAAAAAAAAAAY better to stop too early and miss on some benefit, than reach that zone and start to rebuild, that takes forever and takes you BACKWARD first, colossal waste)
so...p lease don't push through that... realize that your program DOESN'T MEAN SHIT>.. you're supposed to listen to your body over some program which is the same for everyone in the world... it's just numbers on paper, it doesn't know YOU... the moment you felt that, instantly, take a whole week off, and then continue like nothing happened...
That piano playing had me looking around the room lmfao 💪🏽😳🤣
Great minds up there!!
Hey Pak, great Calvin and Hobbes tatt 💪💪
Judging by the amount and types of jokes this is probably the most relaxed Dr. Mike i've seen outside the RP channel
I took the advice from the DR and took off 2 weeks. It was super hard to stay away from the gym. But Yesterday first week back, was a sick pump!! I am 55 and hardly take time off. Joints have been telling me to take a break.
Love to see you guys have these conversations, needs to happen more often. Was an amazing pleasure to get to meet both of you in person. Only wish I could have picked your brains more!!
High volume - (5-6 RIR)
low volume - 2-3 RIR
we need a video of Volume cycling vs RIR ( basically weight you should be lifting)
I’d like to see Jordan Peters discuss his low volume philosophy with you guys
JP is an animal in the best of ways, but I don't think his approach qualifies as a philosophy. He has said on his own social media that he trains as he does just because he likes it, not because it's the best for anyone else. - Dr. Mike
So basically, workout to a comfortable rep range where you have a solid 2-3 reps left per set for roughly 2-4 sets without overloading on the weight so your body can recover adequately and as you notice a plateau go back down in terms of weight and rep range (de load) and see if you’re breaking that plateau point. If you break that plateau, maintain that and continue on until you reach a new plateau, and rinse and repeat?
I'm 51 and I settled on 10 sets per muscle per week. 3x a week full body focused on compound movements. I sprinkle in very little isolation. 13 total sets per workout. I take longer rest so about 1 hr 10 min per session.
15:30 What an Easter Egg! Props to the editor!
great
If I try to do high volume around the rest of my life, I crash and die. Maybe if I was a full time athlete... But I'm a normal human with job, commute, errands, chores, pets, friends, etc
You’re not supposed to do high volume training anyway lol. It’s an inferior way of training. 2-3 days a week and 20-30 minutes in the gym is all you need, bud.
@@BombSquad.MP4 depends on your goals, but that sounds too low imo
@@djomla9999depends on intensity.
@@BombSquad.MP4for maintenance that would be barely enough, but if you really want to gain muscle that would be way to low volume!
@@starwars007oeleWould be possible to make quite good gains but most people can't handle HIT. Much easier to make dozens of sets with half the intensity and similar or better gains but much more time wasted, too.
52 sets a week on one body group is insane! Might as well camp in the gym at that point. Good lord!
It’s easy wtf you mean
Not necessarily, if you train a muscle group twice, and you factor in warm-up sets. Definitely not something to jump into, but if you've been training for years and work your way up, it's actually not that bad.
Drop sets, reverse pyramids I can pump out 6 sets in a few minutes no rest slow strict form.
Maybe 1 set 1 rep.so 52 sets can easily achieved lol
I have trained with a lot of national and pro competitors, I have never known anyone to do this.
Dr Mike and Dorian need to have a proper sit down talk around volume. Both seem so logical in their theory and have backed it by their physique
It's good thing how everyone just casually goes to dr. Mike's house nd uses his set up
i do the periodization program where every week i decease Rir. In the beginning it's best to increase 1-2 set of either each exercise or muscle group because training with a high Rir is not as fatiguing. As the cycle get closer to 0-1 rir, i can tell how much set is needed to take out bc i'm not recovering in time. When i finish the metzel cycle, i keep the = set from the beginning of last metzel cycle, and increase volume again. Work like a charm
This is great info, but a little bit too generalized.
Some need to know information is what affects recovery ability. I'm sure things like age, diet (surplus or deficit), etc. really impacts your recovery ability to a much greater degree than people take into consideration.
As a natural lifter in my 40's, i can say, without a doubt in my mind, my recovery is by far worse than when i was in my 20's. In my 20's I could do 16-20 relatively heavy sets per week, per muscle group, go out and get hammered every night and still make significant gains.
In my 40's, no way in hell could i even consider that. I keep my diet clean, no alcohol, and far, far less volume. My recovery ability is considerably diminished.
I used to lift 5-6x per week, (bro splits) and that worked for a while, but as I got bigger and stronger, I wasn't able to recover from that much volume, which eventually led to an injury.
After almost 9 months recovering from the injury, i revamped my approach. I only lift every third day now, and i have seen more gains from this approach than the high volume approach. Also, my sets are way down. I only do, at most 8 working sets per week, usually only 6, they are however, very high intensity.
One more thing, when talking about recovery, why are we solely focusing on the muscle? There's little consideration given to tendons, and basically no consideration for the bones.
Those too need to recover.
First time I notice that cauliflower ear, rad Mike
Even though high volumes probably are superior in the short term, they could also cause high stress levels because it's not an enjoyable way to train. I think that this could offset some of its benefits. Please correct me if I'm wrong.
Dr Pak
How does decreased performance during a work out signal that the volume is no longer effective for hypertrophy?
I really thought the intro was referring to the anabolic window 😂
10:45 he was already crying for hope, from your jokes Dr. Mike 😁
Do I love learning about this shit or do I just love Mike? Guess I'll never know.
Just watched a Mike video from a year ago where he said 10 sets per muscle per session, 2 to 3 times a week. And now studies show you can do more.... So just try stuff out and see what works for you. But try with a purpose and keep track of your progress.
Απ τα lidl!!! Κλαίω!!
Dr. Mike can tell us how much volume to do on steroids.
Dr Mike's got cauliflower ear now, or have I just noticed?
He's had it for a long time from doing Jiu-jitsu. A badge of honor. 🤙🏾
@@christianw.8802how is that? Can you punch in jiu jitsu?
@@watsonkushmaster3067Your ears still can be hit. Head hitting the mat. Accidental hit while grappling. Too much pressure in a lock. Any injury causes damage
@@watsonkushmaster3067 Probably from headlocks.
@@watsonkushmaster3067 No, but you use your head to move your opponent (also for takedowns) and when someone chokes you with their arms or legs and you rip out your head that may fold your ear in weird ways.
So progressive overload
Little known fact: Ιάσων Σταθαμλάκης was the ancient Greek hero, demigod, who was the inspiration to Transporter series. He was a damn tough chariot driver and hoplite.
Etathamlakis
×=÷€$&@&!€× ? Who should unterstand this?
It's nice to see Mike not trying to be funny.
And not making pedofile jokes
Rather restrained so as not to be funny.))
This is a hilarious comment 😂
Its especially nice not to hear him making sex offender jokes
I like it when he trys to be funny. He's hilarious 😂!
How the hell does someone recover from doing 30 sets a week? How do you not tear every tendon in your body doing that many sets?
It all depends on the person. Everyone is different. I like to do a feeling set. Then 1 working set. I take four days off between workouts 🤷♂️
Me! I have 3 workouts per week, full,upper,lower. After my full day i can take 2-3 days off. If i only take 1 day off, i feel so exhausted.
Where is the line for junk volume? If benefits are being noted at upwards of 30-50 sets a week, at what point is it considered too much or “junk”?
When I last trained with a partner, we noticed my strength was higher on working sets when I did more high-rep warm-up sets, and I generally was stronger on 2nd or 3rd peak working set than my first one. When I would just do a couple low rep warmup sets, or even 10 reps, I wasn't as strong for the working sets.
For reference, I've been training consistently for 25+ years now. I'm generally at my best doing each upper muscle group 2x/week, legs once, and in total (warmup+working sets) around 20-25 per group/per workout.
But whenever Ive been forced out of gym (health issues or whatnot), I take a good 3-4 weeks easing back into my prior volume.
@@TKFOH I fall into a similar category as you. I’m an aging former college athlete, been lifting for 20+ years. I’m reaching the age where I’m seeing my recovery time slow down and my endurance slip a bit. I’ve always benefitted from hitting all body parts twice a week to week and a half. When I get more than 4 rest days, the workouts are usually shit. In light of Father Time, I have been extending some of my rest periods to the 3 day mark on a more regular basis. (I used to average 2 days of recovery between hitting the same muscle group)
That being said, I’ve always felt better and had better workouts varying from 3-5 sets in the 8-15 rep range with added accessories for each muscle group. (Usually 9-15 sets per session, two sessions a week, depending on where I am in my intensity) However, I see a lot a people talking about junk volume and over training, which, since I’m beginning to feel my age, I’m trying to be cognizant of.
@@TKFOHso is that 20-25 sets on say shoulders, 2x/week?
@@MrElectroDan Yes. Example, 5-7 sets dbell shoulder press, 3-4 sets lateral raise, 3-4 sets front raise, 3-5 sets shrugs, 3-4, sets rear delts, for 17-24 total. That includes warmup sets, and 2-3 "top"/"working" sets each exercise. Tuesday, and again on Friday. I also do back same day, around same number of sets, and walk 20-30 mins on Incline after. It's generally around 90 mins in gym total
In 25+ years consistently in the gym, I've always got best results from increased volume.
Lifting weights was ones fun 🤔🤔
Muscles are one thing. CNS exhaustion is another.
Wonder if the results of these studies would be different if we did them on pro bodybuilders on grams of shit, high dosages of gh, peptides and insulin + the food and carbs obviously.
It's weird because some of the strongest bodybuilders on YT that have been doing this for 20+- years say as long as you have one all out set per muscle group that's on a day, that's enough. So if someone does 5 sets per exercise like me, those TH-camrs say i'm only doing 5 because im not able to put all my effort into 1 hard set and literally work until total failure. To me as a newbie, it seems that more sets are better than less sets because most people are not able to have that one or two hardcore sets per muscle group that actually do enough damage to the muscle fibers.
Are you changing the weight for Those added sets? You’re getting more tired or the strength level is going down as the sets go up
Asking for a friend
you try to add 1 rep to every working set or increase weight or combination of both from week to week and if you recover fast enough you increase also number of sets.
For example if you did week 1 benchpress 225 for 9 reps set 1 and 7 reps set 2 you could try 225 for 10,8,6 next week or 230 for 9,7,5 next week.
f you barely healed before next session you trained same bodypart you keep number of sets the same.
you are also trying to keep exercise in the same rep range i.e. 5-10,10-20,20-30. if you wouldn't hit rep range in last one or two sets you just lower weight to stay in the rep range.
16-22 sets per muscle group. 12-16 reps
My thoughts about volume cycling it is great for maximum Muscle Growth or strength at sticking points. So when you get X reps but want more, you can get the reps with rest or a pause. So going to higher volume with most or are close to the weight as you can efficiently do. When going back to the lower volume can help keep the weight on.
I would think two things would come from this will allow you to keep more weight for more reps faster and two you will get the novelty effect. But I also feel that if you do it in two small of a block you may not get the effect you're going for and if your volume cycling at a high rate of regularity like planned deloads. I feel body adaptation will occur and reduce the novelty. I think it should be approached like a deload, do it went needed. for max results
Well... That was not my experience. If I keep doing more than 8-10(on a cut rnow) sets of quads I keep regressin. For reference I go until my high bar starts using too much "hip-drivre", and till failure into partials failure on leg extensions,bulg split squats. Adding sets with rest pause had led to more reps, but also less gains as I'm digging myself into a whole. Even when bulking I do not exceed 15 sets for quads because i saw my lifts go down after 6 months of higher volume (from 12 worked up to 20). Even after the deloads I was worse off than before
How do you all feel about doing 3-4 reps on the first few sets and then your major set to failure. So you are having less junk volume and more effective reps. I guess you can say it’s more of a high intensity style and low volume. Am I losing out on the volume from those first few sets without training to 2-3 reps in reserve on those sets? The way I look at it as I’m maximizing my effective reps and hitting failure anyway without all the reps that don’t count.
That's fine. I like more like 6-8 or so, but you should be saving your energy for your working weight. I'm assuming you do more than 4 reps on your working sets (5-30). Warm up sets should not be close to failure.
@@adammiller9179 thanks yeah, I’ve been doing a meadows style heavy 6-7 reps to failure or very close on the last set.
@@gary_michael_flanagan_wildlife, why aren’t you going to virtual failure every working set?
@@CornFed_3 it’s just something I started trying. Stan Efferding and John meadows use this technique. Rather than doing the first two sets to 10 and wasting a lot of effort, the idea is saving that last set to failure. Granted you could argue you are losing out on total volume so I’m not saying it’s always a good idea. I’m also mostly referring to compound movements or back could work too. For shoulders maybe not as much. Just experimenting is all
For people who lift hard, take every set to or close to functional failure, and you legitimately know what failure is, 16 sets a week of legit working sets will do the trick. No need to complicate it.i don’t think Arnold and Mentzer etc needed periodization and deloads to build thick muscle
I agree. If someone's doing 40-50 sets per week there would tend to be a good amount of junk volume if you're doing adaptive training with reps or weight. You can get close in 7 day week if you train the muscle mon-thur-sun.
1) There's a decent amount of research around 40-50 sets with better results.
2) It's logical that as an adaptive process, you improve not only in weight, but reps, sets, etc.
3) Tons of guys, eg, Arnold, Sheiko, do more than 50 sets and are among the GOATs.
@@littlethuggie 1) not if those are legit sets to or near failure. A natural bodybuilder would not be able to recover from 40 legitimate sets
2) not really logical because where would the limit be? If you lift weights all your life you would eventually be doing 200 sets a week per body part after a while. There is such a thing as maximum recoverable volume
3) they were genetic freaks on steroids
Maybe I'm just dumb, but when there's this discussion of numbers of sets, how many reps per set are they talking about? Are they sets to failure, sets of 3-5 reps, 6-8 reps, 8-10 reps, what?
Reps ranges vary depending on what you're trying to achieve. Lower reps for body building and higher reps for power lifting.
In general though Mikes always refers to anywhere between 6 - 30reps/or failure.
@@carloscastano3666 🤣
You have that backwards
Sets to failure or 1 rir
Gonna comment this before watching the video and then will reply to my comment possibly after. This is what I understand to be the right amount of volume and what I haven’t seen Dr Mike really mention on his channel. The right amount of volume is an amount that you can recover from in terms of maximum motor unit recruitment everytime you step in the gym. If you are training with volume so high that you’re still fatigued via muscle damage (which is not a good thing and is not how hypertrophy occurs) and via a lack of motor unit recruitment then you’re training with too much volume. In regards to literature, this volume cap has been seen as atmost 10 to 12 sets per muscle group PER WEEK. And that’s in gym newbies with slight variation person to person. If you do not have maximum motor unit recruitment and mechanical tension you will not stimulate muscle hypertrophy in an optimum manner. Large amounts of sets per workout reduce your motor unit recruitment and will increase fatiguing mechanisms leading to more fatigue. Most people see an “increase in progress” when upping volume because of inflammation and edema build up from an increase in muscle damage. Your muscles do not “repair micro-tears to make the muscle bigger and stronger”. Damaged muscle fibers get cleared entirely by the inflammatory and “healing” response. All of this is explained when you take a few days off, as explained by a “deload” week and you come back and feel stronger and move more weight or do more reps. Your body has removed the supra-spinal cns fatigue and is now able to recruit more motor units. There is no need for deload weeks when you train with the right amount of volume every session.
3:50 That is an INSANE amount of volume for a muscle and not recoverable at all. Dr Mike is confusing muscle fatigue adaptation and hypertrophy. Yes when your muscles build fatigue resistance from such retarded amounts of volume you will see hypertrophy. But The muscle fatigue can be skipped entirely and pure gains can be made. When you train with such high amounts of volume you cannot recover in terms of motor unit recruitment and you will not progress as fast as is possible.
5:44 your strength won’t plateau if you manage fatigue appropriately. Reduce your amount of sets, train to 1/2 RIR in a 5-10 rep range, ideally 1 RIR at 5/6 reps. And you will see exponentially more growth, redcuded soreness and increased strength consistently. If you “plateau” it means somewhere you’re accumulating too much fatigue and you cannot recruit enough motor units to lift the weight. Stop trying to medicate the illness when you can prevent the infection in the first place AKA stop trying to recover quicker or “better” when you can just not get hurt in the first place.
7:37 not necessarily exactly related but it made me think of the fact that it takes an extra 5 sets to get the same amount of hypertrophy from the first set alone but all the fatigue and muscle damage you will accumulate from those following sets if you go all the way up to 6 sets can be unrecoverable in terms of maximal motor unit recruitment and like Dr Mike said muscle damage.
8:00 if you’re in the gym for more than an hour the chance you’re doing too much volume is really high. Revise your training.
9:20 in regards to injury. You simply won’t get injured if you a) don’t do copious amounts of volume and really high reps. And b) control the weight, range of motion and warm up appropriately.
10:00 “cumulative fatigue” at the “systemic level”. What system? When you do 20 sets per muscle per week you accumulate a shite load of supra-spinal cns fatigue. Your motor cortex refuses to recruit more motorunits because the amount of fatigue mechanisms that are present from that amount of volume start to become too difficult to clear away. The reason it takes a couple weeks is because your body will first develop adaptions to reduce your susceptibility to said fatigue but this has a limit. You cannot indefinitely develop a reduction in this susceptibility or else I could train you to a point when if I kept feeding you and giving you water and oxygen you could do an indefinite amount of reps on an exercise. Simply DONT do as many sets per week, manage your fatigue by not accumulating fatiguing mechanisms in the first place and then you can continue to train without needing “deload weeks” and the chance that you will plateau will shrink to almost nothing.
10:25 why not just not do that amount of volume ever at all? It’s really interesting listening to people who think this kind of training is the way to train because you start your first weeks of a mesocycle with lower sets… you don’t fatigue as much… and you see progress… hmmmm. Then you up the sets, feel more fatigued, see what you think is progress but is just inflammation and edema build up all the way up until week 6-8 where you’re doing an insane amount of volume like 20 sets per muscle per week and you’re confused as to why you’re plateauing and always in pain. All you’re doing is damaging the muscle and reducing motor unit recruitment which reduces hypertrophy.
10:35 again, trying to treat the symptoms when you can just not catch the cold is wild. Don’t train so hard that you accumulate all this fatigue and reduce hypertrophy in the first place instead of wasting a week recovering from all the accumulated fatigue when you could’ve been training an appropriate amount close to failure and been making consistent gains.
10:45 “start this big fatigue wave” yeah because that amount of volume causes insane amounts of fatigue. So don’t train with that amount of volume because all fatigue does is reduce hypertrophy
11:50 “slowly built up your work capacity” is just developing adaptions to aid in reducing fatigue. Again, this is not infinite. It will cap out and you will develop too much fatigue to recover from and will lose out on hypertrophy with too much volume
12:30 “easily recovering”, if recovering means you feel okay and you’re not sore that doesn’t mean necessarily you’re back to maximum motor unit recruitment. You’ve developed enough (for lack of a better word) “anti-fatigue”adaptions then yes you will “feel” recovered but your motor cortex will still be inhibited by fatiguing “left overs” so to speak from too much volume.
12:40 “why not add a few sets”, because it’s not recoverable. Point blank.
16:00 in regards to the study Mike wants to see. The group that does 3 sets 3 times a week will see the most hypertrophy. The group increasing volume over the weeks will eventually when reaching enough volume have reduced hypertrophy due to an increase in fatigue whereas the first group will just continue to train while progressively overloading with weight and or reps on their exercises. If you read everything I wrote you’re a g, I advise you to look up and study the physiology of the human body if you don’t believe me and everything I’ve said. Forgive me if you read it all and are more informed on what I’ve said and can see where I may or may not have made a mistake or two I did the best off the top of my head 😭.
@@simonwheeler1941your comment is so well put together it should not be under a lone one but in the main section so more people could see, agree or debate over it.
Thumbs up
No one is reading all that shit, Karen
1-2 sets per week is enough for me. But then the intensity is as high as I can tolerate.
1-2 sets per week? My guy that's not a workout, that's a warmup 🤦
@@FirstnameLastname-yc2mt that's why you're small
@@jylongbun8790 lol. K
I would like to k Now how your ability to recovery improves as you are putting more and more stresses on your nervous system? All without drugs? I really don't believe that number of sets or more frequent training will help any natural body builder long term. Take enough time off between workout and there is to volume cycling needed and will go a long longer before bitting any kind of a stall in your progress.. If you try one working set to failure after a warm up and if you don't see results then yoh can only add more sets and add an extra set.
I am here just for Mike's jokes and methaphors
Is there carry over in muscle groups if you do 5 sets of bench does that count towards triceps
Off course mate, you use your triceps in the bench press
Only counts as .5 per set so 5 sets of bench would be 2.5 maybe 3 sets of hard triceps I think that would be a good way to count them because you don't stress them enough on their own because your using the chest and shoulders more
@franklincone4636 that number is random as hell.
Hypertrophy is about making the muscule tired, if your arms are not that tired after bench press then you need to do specific excercises to make them sufficiently tired
10
Wait what? Im confused. Afyer all that did he say train anyway you want?
Consistency is always key and finding a way that you like will help with consistency. Seems like fair advice for almost anyone.
0:18 hahahaha I want to see the full movie
0:53 me too me too. Oh wait, wrong timestamp.
@@user-ii7xc1ry3x 😏😏
Looks like Dr Mike started reading some Dr Mike Mentzer.
Less sets, reduced time in the gym, systemic fatigue. Next he’ll grow a moustache and wear specs
6:01
Dr Mike is funny but Dr Pak is hilarious
Mike is sophmoric
@@thecastle09 no you!
@@thecastle09 get it? Cause that is a sophmoric retort.
@@thecastle09 get it?
@@thecastle09 get it?
6:08 wrestlers ear.
Jacked Greek vs Israeli geek (I love them both just couldn’t let the joke go to waste lol)
There are general guidelines but bottom line is you need to figure out what works best for you. Everyone is different and will recover differently. Not to mention the natty vs gear variable.
For natties, less is more. Strength should be improving and if it's not you need to deload
Systemic fatigue sneaks up on you slowly and even with all the will in the world you will just hit a point where your strength and endurance begins to fail. You'll be able to get it back with some serious rest (take a week off) but if you're reaching that point too frequently then you should probably look at your routine and cut back on volume. Just knocking off 1 set per muscle group per session can mean you can go for much longer before needing a complete de-load to recover, in the short term it might feel like you're losing ground but over the course of a year it means you can see more progression overall. It's basically endurance racing versus a sprint, you're trading speed for distance
Well said. Your comments mirror my own experience.
yup, after 8 weeks of going HARD like actual failure when ALONE (so probably 3ish RIR) with a spotter I begin to slow down and struggle to hype up for the session. This becomes my mesocycle and then I take a week off of weightlifting and work some overtime.
@@hooktraining3966 Well i Go Hard every Day without any Meso. Im Natty train 6 days a Weak extreme Hard.
No Recover Problems. Its because i Love training.
@@davidk6269if your volume is ridiculously high to the point you're mentally checking out. Raise the weight
@@FirstnameLastname-yc2mt I think that you did not understand the comment. No one said anything about mentally checking out.
Bro in the thumbnail looks like an unkillible npc 😭
He drove an Audi !
You’re doing too much volume was something my parents would say when I listened to music in my room
Did anyone else see the bmw tattoo on his neck at 25s into the video.
Someone said to put my comment in the comments instead of as a reply to someone else so here goes:
3:50 That is an INSANE amount of volume for a muscle and not recoverable at all. Dr Mike is confusing muscle fatigue adaptation and hypertrophy. Yes when your muscles build fatigue resistance from such retarded amounts of volume you will see hypertrophy. But The muscle fatigue can be skipped entirely and pure gains can be made. When you train with such high amounts of volume you cannot recover in terms of motor unit recruitment and you will not progress as fast as is possible.
5:44 your strength won’t plateau if you manage fatigue appropriately. Reduce your amount of sets, train to 1/2 RIR in a 5-10 rep range, ideally 1 RIR at 5/6 reps. And you will see exponentially more growth, redcuded soreness and increased strength consistently. If you “plateau” it means somewhere you’re accumulating too much fatigue and you cannot recruit enough motor units to lift the weight. Stop trying to medicate the illness when you can prevent the infection in the first place AKA stop trying to recover quicker or “better” when you can just not get hurt in the first place.
7:37 not necessarily exactly related but it made me think of the fact that it takes an extra 5 sets to get the same amount of hypertrophy from the first set alone but all the fatigue and muscle damage you will accumulate from those following sets if you go all the way up to 6 sets can be unrecoverable in terms of maximal motor unit recruitment and like Dr Mike said muscle damage.
8:00 if you’re in the gym for more than an hour the chance you’re doing too much volume is really high. Revise your training.
9:20 in regards to injury. You simply won’t get injured if you a) don’t do copious amounts of volume and really high reps. And b) control the weight, range of motion and warm up appropriately.
10:00 “cumulative fatigue” at the “systemic level”. What system? When you do 20 sets per muscle per week you accumulate a shite load of supra-spinal cns fatigue. Your motor cortex refuses to recruit more motorunits because the amount of fatigue mechanisms that are present from that amount of volume start to become too difficult to clear away. The reason it takes a couple weeks is because your body will first develop adaptions to reduce your susceptibility to said fatigue but this has a limit. You cannot indefinitely develop a reduction in this susceptibility or else I could train you to a point when if I kept feeding you and giving you water and oxygen you could do an indefinite amount of reps on an exercise. Simply DONT do as many sets per week, manage your fatigue by not accumulating fatiguing mechanisms in the first place and then you can continue to train without needing “deload weeks” and the chance that you will plateau will shrink to almost nothing.
10:25 why not just not do that amount of volume ever at all? It’s really interesting listening to people who think this kind of training is the way to train because you start your first weeks of a mesocycle with lower sets… you don’t fatigue as much… and you see progress… hmmmm. Then you up the sets, feel more fatigued, see what you think is progress but is just inflammation and edema build up all the way up until week 6-8 where you’re doing an insane amount of volume like 20 sets per muscle per week and you’re confused as to why you’re plateauing and always in pain. All you’re doing is damaging the muscle and reducing motor unit recruitment which reduces hypertrophy.
10:35 again, trying to treat the symptoms when you can just not catch the cold is wild. Don’t train so hard that you accumulate all this fatigue and reduce hypertrophy in the first place instead of wasting a week recovering from all the accumulated fatigue when you could’ve been training an appropriate amount close to failure and been making consistent gains.
10:45 “start this big fatigue wave” yeah because that amount of volume causes insane amounts of fatigue. So don’t train with that amount of volume because all fatigue does is reduce hypertrophy
11:50 “slowly built up your work capacity” is just developing adaptions to aid in reducing fatigue. Again, this is not infinite. It will cap out and you will develop too much fatigue to recover from and will lose out on hypertrophy with too much volume
12:30 “easily recovering”, if recovering means you feel okay and you’re not sore that doesn’t mean necessarily you’re back to maximum motor unit recruitment. You’ve developed enough (for lack of a better word) “anti-fatigue”adaptions then yes you will “feel” recovered but your motor cortex will still be inhibited by fatiguing “left overs” so to speak from too much volume.
12:40 “why not add a few sets”, because it’s not recoverable. Point blank.
16:00 in regards to the study Mike wants to see. The group that does 3 sets 3 times a week will see the most hypertrophy. The group increasing volume over the weeks will eventually when reaching enough volume have reduced hypertrophy due to an increase in fatigue whereas the first group will just continue to train while progressively overloading with weight and or reps on their exercises. If you read everything I wrote you’re a g, I advise you to look up and study the physiology of the human body if you don’t believe me and everything I’ve said. Forgive me if you read it all and are more informed on what I’ve said and can see where I may or may not have made a mistake or two I did the best off the top of my head 😭.
"your strength won’t plateau". Such a stupid statement. I doubt you have even ever been to a gym.
Is this advice for someone natty or on roids?
On roids. If youre natty you dont need to "cycle volume".
Want big muscles? Lift the weight fast to work the larger muscle fibers. So everyone will have to drastically drop the amount of weight they are working with.
My man is finally getting some cauliflower ear :') I love you mike, so proud
well, more pronounced I should say lol
The Greek version of Jason Statham sounds pretty epic.😂😂
So what you're saying is; I'm not doing enough?
Yes. Harder than last time
έπιασα το αστείο με τον Jason Statham...
I’m 40 years old. Everything makes me sore.
Just take some test and everything will be fine. Except your joints.
@@Kikwatz Not really.
You get even more sore and old if you don't workout
For 2 months i totaly change my training .....i train each group of muscle once at 10 days .....back day 1 , rest day 2 , arms day 3 , rest day 4 , shoulders day 5 , legs day 6 , rest day 7 , chest day 8 , rest day 9....and again back day 10 etc....but i feel so much volume on my muscle and i seen growth after just 2 moths , and feel more strenght and have a good mood on my training sesion ...but i go all in on ech group....for ex , on back day ....30 sets , 15 of them beeing drop sets , negatives , focus on my mind muscle conection .... 20 of sets till failure ....so 9 days rest betwen a back workout is enough for my recovery .....cus i feel my back hurting even after 4 days from my workout ....on legs , i feel pain even after 5 days , so yeah , i am not totaly recovered .....and Dorian Yates says .....the muscle is growing after the pain is gone ...so you need 2 or 3 days rest after the pain is gone , to give the muscle time to proces the information , and to growth
Why everybody thinks there is range of set you can do to maximize gains. I think you can increase volume like number of reps or weight on the bar.
If someone stop adding reps and weight. He can add more and more sets every session. Of course 100 sets of each muscle is strange and a waste of time but if someone wants it he can get there.
Question: What sets number is best? is like: What is best weight?
Answer: It depends on the individual history of training.
Someone know how train to increase volume? Not strength, hypertrophy but volume. How we can add sets when your sets in reps looks like 10,10,8,6,3 ?
I’d take a peek at the RP book Scientific Principles of Hypertrophy Training. It is a LOT to read lol but goes into all kinds of details. Like if you wanted even more volume but would go under 3 reps in a set, could do drop sets (lowering weight) or various other techniques
Use downsets; when you believe you will fall below a certain rep threshold decrease the weight so you are able too stay in your target rep range; not that hard to be honest
Statham drove Audi
But do you add volume or weight 😉
Adding weight is technically adding volume 😉
you are going to end up doing 100 sets hahaha..i RATHER TO STAY WITH MIKE MENTZER
Overreaching explained good, bad, ugly. Please.
I've seen my best results at 70sets above that progress stalled
When you was doing this how may sets were you doing per session and how many times a week. I’m trying a higher volume approach currently but only for 40-45 sets per week
I replaced smoking with 40 sets of side delt work everyday, 2 sets per cigarette. Feels amazing. Now I'm addicted to pump.
@@onurbole7921... if this is for real, it's a vert intriguing!
@@onurbole7921😂
Ο τυπάς έκανε lidl joke στον mike israetel κλαίω
I'll raise you Dorian Yates 👍
So I guess it is rocket science
volume don't mean shit . it comes down to efficient muscle stimulation .
Man i just can't stop laughing that guy was advertising,From 8 set s yo the most twenty ,that constant tension is negative and so many more thing i am literally bored to report, and now i see him say things like 50 sets the pump the partional low range of the motion all thise that old school allready knew and guys like me see in their own body from years of training and we were getting bashed on the comments for stating things we knew from ourselves and the most decorated pros, hilarious and tragic,you tube guys are like politicians they come after 4-5 years saying almost complete the opposites than before and pretending that is the same
I would say he’s pretty sure there are outliers out there who do respond fairly well too extremely
High training volumes; for the average lifter you don’t need more than 20 sets a week in my opinion but there will always be outliers who need slightly more, slightly less or a hell of a lot more. What do you think mate
52 is the answer
One of the biggest mistakes beginners make is just doing far too much volume
Advanced lifters do this mistake too. In fact beginners can get away with doing more mistakes because they will make noob gains anyway. The more advanced you are the less margin of error you have.This is why most people after they finish they noob gains they stay intermediates for life or some get to advanced level but then make no gains and think they reached their "natural" limit. Advanced lifters often cant even handle as much volume because it becomes harder to recover.
Evidence does mean that but study can and have been manipulated due to financial gain if a hedge funder is funding something he wants that pushed at all cost to suit his agenda and the all funded by someone
Yes but it is unlikely some company will push an agenda by funding a study on whether 20 or 50 sets is ideal for hypertrophy. And this is also why there needs to be more independent studies, transparent data etc. If everything was a conspiracy then science couldn't progress, but it does. And it is important to learn how to "read" scientific studies.
I don't see what profit is to be made from telling someone to do more sets or less sets.
@@onurbole7921I am not saying it’s a conspiracy, the fact it’s labelled a conspiracy shows that science can’t evolve because of that alone
@@hooktraining3966almost everything in the industry is marketing to make money otherwise no one would bother think about it ffs
80% expert opinion, 20% mike being mike, aka shitposting
Facts. Hes jumped the shark
@@thecastle09 All of your comments have no substance.