Pre-Sales to my new book "Better Broken" now live! Thank you guys for the support! www.amazon.com/Better-Broken-Hidden-Advantage-Challenging/dp/1637743866/ref=sr_1_7?crid=3NAU9V1M5950D&keywords=better+broken&qid=1698437331&sprefix=better+broken%2Caps%2C114&sr=8-7
Hello Sean, I've just finished reading it. Excellent book, very thought provoking. Will certainly help a lot of people. Hope to read more from you in the future
I see this joke being made all the time, but the host of this "Better Broken" podcast is a Green Beret who is writing a book about his experiences, has a youtube channel and talks about being a Green Beret, now has a podcast about it. Who exactly are you judging, mate?
As an Ex Army 82nd ABN guy and retired SEAL I can say the SEAL Team AARs and debriefs are brutal. I think a lot of the issues are guys don’t want their “dirty laundry” aired in a public forum. Because most civilians watching don’t understand. SEALS would have no problem discussing issues that went wrong with each other or other SOF guys, but are uncomfortable airing it to the public. You can’t have the same discussion with civilians like you can with other SOF guys. As for SEALS being all over media… I think it goes in waves. I joined the Army in the late 80’s, every movie and every book that came out back then was about Green Berets, Rambo, the Deer Hunter, Billy Jack…. Etc… then they went through brand fatigue and when the next big war happened they put the spot light on a new organization. I believe brand fatigue is setting in on the SEALs too…. Eventually they will spotlight another SOF unit, Maybe MARSOC, Rangers…. Whatever.
Or maybe it’s because Army leadership practice better opsec? All these media coverage on seals happen because the higher ups allow it to happen and I really feel they use that as a recruitment strategy.
Good morning Sir. I haven't watched this video yet, which I'm going to, but was checking the reactions and reading yours, I was wondering: don't you think that in the 80's the movies you mentioned were not exactly accurate nor revealing the exact purpose of the Green Berets S.F. in "Rambo" for instance ?... Therefore not really divulging any real tactics and methods which could be detrimental to people still on active duty, even though these tactics and methods tend to evolve and change fairly rapidly?
Chapman was one of my heroes. Those seals were about to come out with a book and then they found out that there was a CIA drone hovering above and the whole thing was caught on tape. Then all the sudden their story switched and no book came out
John McPhee (ex CAG) was in the JSOC TOC during Takur Ghar. He says when the initial grainy footage of Chapman was first released. The SEALs were walking around boasting that that lone figure had to be Neil Robert's and that he was gonna be the first GWOT MOH. When subsequent info pointed to Chapman the DEVGRU contingent grew quiet and tried to bury it.
@@vitigaymer1053 they have neil Roberts, bent up 240, hung up in sixes locker. Not trying to put Neil Roberts down. He had no control of what happened after he was killed and he didn't go out fast...... I just can't only imagine if that happened in 2010 to 2018. The team's would of made it into a HUGE recruiting tool or if that drone wasn't overhead. Those team guys would of lied about EVERYTHING. I'm glad it showed how much of a warrior Chapman is. Lost a good 1 that day. Even the Rangers that landed in that TIC as QRF..... That is a amazing story in itself
@@bestjobieverhad9584 if Neil Roberts had used his snaplink as instructed by the crew chief (and required by his Oath) then takur Ghar would not have happened and those soldiers would not have died ☝️
@@kxkxkxkx agreed, but the shit those terrorists did to him. He did not deserve. The Rangers and those pilots had balls landing were they did. Right in the middle of everything. The sickening part is the CIA was watching the whole time and did not say a word....... They could of at least landed outside the direct fire and walked.
The simple fact is that Special Operations in general got way over glorified in the past past 20 years. The video games, movies, books, podcasts, tv shows etc.. it’s all commando porn and NSW was the leading PR stream for it. It’s time to start making the conventional joe cool and relevant again like tank crews, artillery, SIGINT, pilots, medics, Mechanics, Infantry, Doctors. Thats where the real quiet professionals were in the GWOT. None of those men and women got a tenth of the attention and publicity that SOCOM generated overbred the past 20 years.
Hey Buck! Jesus, the production value is spot on! Ya'll must have found you some good AV nerds to square your shit away. I am looking forward to some good conversations. The only thing I would suggest as your average TH-cam mid-wit is don't let the enemy dictate the pace. I get it you feel like you need to have flashy titles with words like "infuriate" in it, or some "youtube guru" tells you you need them. Don't do this shit. If it does help the views (which who knows really) it also cheapens the value of the content to me. I ain't passing along a video to a buddy of mine with the title "Former Elite Pew-pew Man Eviscerates Woke Hobo-clown!!". It might just be me, but if you present shit seriously, people will take it seriously. Yeah you might not get the traffic that a "prank" video from some youtube muppet would get, but you also ain't trying to sell eXtReMe k00Laid enErGys DrAnk! to children either. Anywho, rant over. Looking out for the show to be sure. :D
I know exactly what that guy means because I went through it myself. I posted a question in a Facebook military group asking about when did we start taking the Medal of Honor seriously in this country. I asked that because for the first 50 years of its existence, the MOH was given out like candy. During the Civil War, an entire regiment got one just for reenlisting. In the Battle of Manila Bay during the Spanish American War, several people got one just for being there. So my question was when did we start having the reverence for the MOH that we do today. Well of course people completely missed the point. And I was bombarded with dozens and dozens of people asking me why I was shitting all over the memory of those that received it. I tried to explain the point that I was making but no one wanted to listen. So finally I just said screw this and deleted it. That's one thing out of many things that I hate about social media. You will make a post about your views on a subject. You'll explain your experiences and how you came to that conclusion. But the only thing people will respond to is one single sentence that they didn't like and they will go ballistic about it. This is how "outrage culture " has spread through the internet. It seems like people are more interested in finding something to be offended by rather than the content of the post.
The more effort you put into explaining your position, the more asshats will do a one-line drive by that completely misses the point. A lot of it is just trolling, I think.
Seems like some people really enjoy the inability to grasp nuance & context, during introspection. It’s genuinely frustrating how dense some individuals are.
I had no idea about that, I know it's not the point of your post but you've given me something to do some research on. I thought it always was an award that was rarely achieved, never really looked too much into that. But to your actual point, yeah... That's the Internet social media brain thing, I have found myself doing that as well but I try not to do it. Yeah you're right, it's actually very ignorant way of processing information... And if you aren't careful you'll find yourself thinking like that in everyday life, it's part of the reason people get so ridiculous when it comes to politics, it's narrow-minded thinking.
Good post. I think it is rooted in the tribalism that seems to have taken over our American/Western society. Social media has undoubtedly inflamed that tribalism to the point we're ready to come apart at the seams over the smallest perceived infractions.
The navy seals are the green beret of the 1970s. In the 70s they hyped up the green beret in movies. Like they are doing the navy seal’s today. It’s a natural cycle.
I appreciate the sincerity and the honest way of being. It is obvious that sometimes the missions have bad moments. After all, even SF operators are human and humans make mistakes. RESPECT!
I was an Air Force company clerk stationed in Rhein Main AFB, Germany from 1981 to 1984. Around winter time 84 we did a small scale perimeter defense course with the 10th Special Forces in Bad Tolz, Germany. It was the most memorable three days ever. Those special forces guys were so cool and it was so freezing cold during patrol I would have stood up to get shot just to feel my warm blood drain down my froze body. Young and dumb what a blast. Thanks Special Forces dudes. GOD bless and protect all of ya.
This guy is on point, people need to realize that in all of these awesome spec ops stories, is that something went wrong or someone fucked up to lead to that particular situation. There need to be more cautionary tales, so people going into this profession don't have the wrong idea, and wind up finding out the hard way.
I agree, young guys know we’re signing up to go to war. We might as well have more insight as to what’s gonna come with it. If the truth makes you change your decision then your just not cut out for it. Much love Buck I can’t wait to watch this full episode , maybe get a ranger on here too 🤝
I served from 78-84. I was in special warfare- special boat units. Now known as SWCC-the boat teams. The SEALS then WERE quiet professionals. Certainly, there wasnt a full on war then and social media didnt exist. Nobody knew about SEALs or boat teams- the way it should be. Then came the gulf war, where the press were waiting onshore when SEALs slipped quietly out of the water- astonished to see the press recording them. The high vis rescues and captures put them in the public. For me, its just the SEALs time. The Green Beret and Delta were public in the 80s and 90s but the internet didnt exist. The public wanted to know more about these elite Navy warriors because the press kept on them. Unfortunately several of them decided to write books, podcasts or voice their stories. When i saw it starting i thought 'wtf- nobody should know they exist, especial team 6." Its ashame it is what it is. But we are in a different world today where media is an outlet for those who cant stay silent. ALL branches have them. Its just that the SEALs are "the newest find" and the public cant get enough. The jealousy within SF is rampant-across all branches. Its human nature, even for SF guys. Peace.
Thank You Brother. Sometimes pride hides the truth. All Branches should be proud. And remember this motto so when the day comes and it will, We remember, We are all Brothers and ,"When You call, we will be there to support" Compition is Needed to keep Us sharp. But, We all make up the spear!! That God You all guard our door.
After every Navy operation there is a "hot wash' discussing what we did right and did wrong during the mission which is an internal review. No one publicly publishes the mistakes unless their is an external review that leads to loss of confidence in the command or criminal violations or negligence. The other military services are no different. I'm surprised that you are surprised that your public criticism received backlash. Arm chair quarterbacks are never embraced or appreciated.
Although I don't always agree with all a Ward Carol's viewpoints. One of the reason I follow his channel is he always points out the success of Naval Air Warfare and the failures and what actions the Navy took to correct the problem
Hell Yes! This is exactly the truth. Supposed to be quiet professionals. In most of these OPs that’s being glorified, something went south, somebody did something wrong or more importantly there was a huge cost to it, and that never gets told in the story line because it Doesnt glorify those involved. My team of ANA and I were some of the many who had to go look for and to pick up the pieces from Operation Red Wings. I’m against the book and movie being made but like Jay states, if your going to tell a story, tell the whole story, how and why did it happen. A true AAR of the OP and What were the true costs of the actions, not just to puff up someone’s chest and glorify the actions of a few. All to many times these stories are being told to bolster a few, when it was usually a F up, and the true story and costs never get told.
i've noticed that many MOA awards were the result of one man choosing to act above and beyond to save their comrades after an intelligence, strategic/tactical, leadership, or political screw up. Often somebody had to pay with their life to get that award after somebody else screwed up.
By design, social media creates herd mentalites whether people realize it or not. I wasn't aware of his video about Chapman. From what it sounds like is the video focused solely on the shortcomings that led to the end of the fight. If that's the case, I would suggest talking about the positive points first and then going into scrutinizing what went wrong and how to mitigate those problems moving forward. The video may have had better reception as it would showcase objectivity and balance. Either way, I am glad you followed your heart. But its unfortunate people couldn't see past the glamorization of a man that fought to the end. In a way, inclinations of Chapman's MOH video became lost in translation making the video garner the wrong connotation. Thank you for sharing. RIP fellow Airman Chapman, you're the essence of what the Air Force, military and America stand for.
SEAL teams could only operate against guys in sandals they could never withstand modern war against a peer without being decimated. They've never fought without full air supremacy, and a massive technology advantage, ever.
I wasnt special forces. And when I worked with them it was in a support role. But I always thought the criticism should be or was always behind closed doors. Social media has definitely changed all that though.
Exactly guys and thank you for the job well done. I totally agree with both of you over social media sites were people aren't held accountable for there actions and words and what make me hate social media is the fact that you can enjoy the same experience as others because you have to not judge the book by the cover but try to go around the person who dont understand that you dont do that and i am talking about both special forces and civilians as well as agents who were is the whole team at who was there with you instead taking one for the team. That dont paint a picture of the whole story just like the green beret on here is saying.The whole story help understanding vs half and half. 👍👍
David Goggins was a 20 year Navy SEALs and he has nothing good to say about Navy SEALs or the SEAL community I’ve always found that extremely damning and interesting when one of your own has very little good things to say about it
People need to realize that in lone survivor, it wasn’t only those four that got hammered. SEALs took a massive loss trying to recover Marcus. The chinook that got shot down killed a lot of seals on their way to find Marcus.
Bro we gotta stop hating on people who served. I wish every vet could monetize their story because our country doesn't do enough for vets. I believe if you served in a war or had 4 years in you should never have to work again.
First time I saw Lone Survivor, I immediately recognized the mistake of releasing those shephards BEFORE establishing comms. I’m not disparaging anyone but it is critical to future mission success and modifying SOP to analyze tragic outcomes.
To be honest the entire Chapman thing is disgraceful. It's not that they left a guy that they believed was KIA behind to E&E. It's that for years Slab insisted unequivocally that Chapman was dead when they left him. Not dying. That he was dead. Slab even went as far to lie to the writers of the original book on Roberts Ridge that the Mujahideen had a blue on blue using Chapman's M-4 because he knew the drone had footage of a guy shooting the Muj with a M-4. Slab was proven wrong and he still insists he never lied about anything. It's insane. The dude got a medal for lying and leaving a man behind and to this day has never apologized.
I dont think anything good or bad should be made public regarding missions. This is between the guys in the team. Mistakes are made in every situation, and everyone gets to eat off that plate regardless of branch. They do glorify things in movies. They are movies!! They are not going to show the shortcomings because thats not what the movies want to portray.
Try critiquing yourself and your team before criticizing others. Secondly, how are stories such as the Chapman story told as positives? To me, it's a sad story. Also, there's a difference between constructive criticism and public shaming. Not to mention, 40 comments doesn't necessarily reflect the opinions of most seals.
If you ever have a question about what went wrong with any operation , just ask the Rangers, they seem to be called in to clean up and rescue the fuck ups by the whole JSOC
He has a great case. Balance is necessary. The actual cases that he sites I do jot think he paid attention to the movie or videos. Lone Survivor showed the mistakes and the decisions that lead to the failure of the mission. Seals do get a lot of press after being one of the least known units. I see Shawn Ryan and Jocko being very open and having great discussions with everyone. I tend to think mostly about the. Negative things about missions. The helo crash getting BinLaden. The amount of time make thru the house and to evacuate. Rarely do things go as planned
My Son Joined USAF for CCT. As he was qualifying, I found the John Chapman video and showed him. Not to deter him, but to show him shit goes wrong. So many vids out there with only success and all the good outcomes. It is not airing dirty laundry. It is needed to show youth full disclosure. My Son was a perfect candidate for CCT. Ranked in Olympics for Judo. Captain of wrestling team, swim team and cross country. Honor student with 6 years Civil Air Patrol. But I only had the romantic version of what special forces does. I felt it was necessary for him to see that it’s not all romantic. it did not deter him, but it gave him a better understanding of what he was volunteering for. I scoured the Internet for all aspects of special forces, with emphasis on CCT. Would have been great if he had left these videos up. Regardless of the anger it caused other special forces.
A Monday quarterback knows the game that has already happened. All SOCOM teams plan for some level of ignorance/failure in the unknown. Never a fan of operations failure but, it must be studied to prevent mistakes in future missions. To realize your own deficiency is paramount to life long success.
*These days, too many people are afraid to criticize Navy Seals. No should be above criticism. And being tough guys, Navy Seals should be big enough to take it like everyone else.*
As a 20 year Recon Marine. I had the pleasure of being in a unit (VSW) as a Dive Team Leader, that was made up of Marine Recon, Navy Seal's, Navy EOD and SWICC. All knuckle dragging alpha dogs. It amazed me, how the SEAL's can go through some of the hardest training in the world and be so stupid. It took me a while to realize, it was lack of maturity. You have 18 and 22 your old (Charlie Sheen Want to be's) As I often called them. Who once getting the chicken and fork badge, thought they where the SHIT. You can say that the age factor is common among all Special Operations Groups. But I did not see that when working with other groups, as far as age/maturity and being responsible. In other communities, in most cases they have done sometime in active service and worked their way into the Special Ops community. And there prior active service is considered as part of the selection process. In the the SEAL's, in most case's, you go to your A school, Hell Week, BUD's and then TEAM probation. I am not saying any of that is easy. I know first hand because to become a LARV diver, I had to go through 2d phase, as a 30 year old Marine (did not compete, because of a injury). With my 4 years working with SEAL's I found that in most case's E-6 and above where good to go. And in a SEAL platoon, if the E-6 and Chief where good to go, the jr's where humble and knew there place in the pecking order. Guess that was a lil off topic, I just think that during my time with the SEAL's, maturity and the culture was a big issue, As for "No Man Left Behind" That should apply to all service branches. "You Go, I Go, We Go"
I can already tell you that if this was a team made up of Recon, SEALs, EOD, SWCC it was a non combat unit. This was some second rate training opportunity that the teams very well could have sent 2 guys they wanted to get rid of for a while. Please don't say you trained with the SEALs unless you actually trained with a SEAL unit. You can say you trained with a couple of SEALs not the TEAMs. To civilians they would not know the difference. But you should know better.
Hard to sell books when people realize you’re just a human being and not a god of war. *Books written by SF dudes like buck*: talk about hardship, overcoming it, and growing from failure. *SEAL books*: i am the worlds best at everything, i am a lion and a god of war. Buy my merch! Telling the truth and having honest discussions hurts their PR.
@@andrabook8758There’s a cringy Jocko clip where calls himself a lion and plenty of others making absurd proclamations. I respect, and love SEALs - Goggins and Stew Smith are some of the people that inspired me to join the Army (family was the main inspiration). But SEALs are in a bad spot right now, the limelight seekers and trouble makers are poisoning the Teams. It reminds me of Army SF after the Vietnam War. SF responded by cleaning house, implemented an A&S, and standardized the Q-Course to weed out the bad apples. Currently, SEALs are burying their head in the sand.
This guy is great and I agree with him 100%. The Chapman/Brett Slabinski story at Takur Gar is described in detail and very critically in "Code over Country" by Matthew Cole. That might be why the SEALs were so touchy about it. Chapman's story is incredible and the Navy's desire to cover it up is disgusting.
Seriously. Even at the tip of the spear men can still be cowards and leave their brother behind. Unacceptable for our top shelf warriors. We must hold them accountable if they say they are the best
In Dan Schilling's words about Takur Ghar: - "The travesty at the end of the operation is the loss of the seven men on Takur Ghar. Those deaths- SEAL Neil Roberts, CCT John Chapman, PJ Jason Cunningham, air crewman Phil Svitak, and the three Rangers, Marc Anderson, Bradley Crose, and Matthew Commons - do not lie at the feet of Delta's Pete Blaber and AFO, but the leaders of SEAL Team Six, specifically Joe Kernan and Tim Szymanski, and their rush to push men into the battle and take over operations from Blaber." Hell, even after the battle was over. NAVY SPECWAR fought with AFSPECWAR in their research to find out if John Chapman was eligible to receive the Medal of Honor. Because if he was awarded, it would admit that SEAL TEAM 6 left a man behind. Ruining their image.
@@BTL0523 It's a good book and it's tough to read John Chapman's final moments. Because undoubtedly Chapman was heroic and looked out for his fellow soldiers, I can't help but feel anger towards ST6. The whole thing could have been avoided and John Chapman could've gone home to his daughters.
@Marteeen261. My wife listened to the ending with me on a long car ride and burst into tears hearing it. I've never served, but in my ignorant mind, I can't help but feel frustrated towards them. How can you watch someone commit a true act of heroism and not at least check for a pulse? But I've never been shot at and hopefully never will, so I try to have some sympathy for them in the situation they were put in.
Thank you for exemplifying the post-service quiet professional. My only encounter with USA SF was the 20th SF Group in Jacksonville, FL while I was stationed there. Even as Reserves, they continued, like you, to carry themselves in that context. Great, GREAT bunch of guys.
I’m a 22 year old woman and I’m training to become a U.S. Navy SEAL. I’m a civilian and I want to go enlisted. I know five other women that are training for BUD/S, one of them is in BUD/S Prep right now. What advice would you give for women that want to be SEALs? How does the SEAL community feel about women joining them? Do you think women should be allowed to become Navy SEALs? Most female SEAL candidates struggle with carrying the boats and logs, doing pull ups, having grip strength and completing the “Dirty Name” on the obstacle course. Also, a lot of female SEAL candidates break their legs or develop stress fractures. Women have smaller and thinner bones than men.
@@Anonymous18817no ones cares about the gender going in, if you have what it takes, you have what it takes. That’s what it’s about, to break you, make you quit, as long as you don’t, you’re good. Although, you are right, woman’s physical attributes, bones density, etc are often weaker then men. Don’t let that hold you back though.
@@Anonymous18817honestly, save your time. Do something else in the military. Of all spec ops, Navy Seals really have the most physically intensive training. Might suck to hear but it’s the type of training that a woman simply cannot endure. There is a 0% chance your body can perform as well as they are expecting throughout training, let alone amidst intense combat. They give yall the opportunity only to appease feminists. Not because females are capable of becoming SEALs. The standard’s the standard. It only gets harder after bud/s.
In my humble opinion That cluster F known as Roberts ridge does such a disservice to John Chapman’s story. That man was a true warrior & embodiment of what it is to be an American. Such a tragic loss but also an amazing story of courage. I can’t imagine being mortally wounded and left to fight alone against a number of heavily armed combatants. That man sent a number mf’s to hell that day and died while fighting hand to hand combat after running out of ammunition.
The good, the bad, and the ugly…fix the bad and throw out the ugly and never try that again. Problem is 90% of people today are totally ok living with both the bad and ugly
I’m a 22 year old woman and I’m training to become a U.S. Navy SEAL. I’m a civilian and I want to go enlisted. I know five other women that are training for BUD/S, one of them is in BUD/S Prep right now. What advice would you give for women that want to be SEALs? How does the SEAL community feel about women joining them? Do you think women should be allowed to become Navy SEALs? Most female SEAL candidates struggle with carrying the boats and logs, doing pull ups, having grip strength and completing the “Dirty Name” on the obstacle course. Also, a lot of female SEAL candidates break their legs or develop stress fractures. Women have smaller and thinner bones than men.
@@Anonymous18817I’m not being any type of racist or biased against women in fact I’m all for women to be able to join any regiment a male can but if they can’t compete with the men or not able to do the same training their given then I’m afraid they shouldn’t be unless they can compete the course, letting women join but only through doing lighter training or anything not mirroring the men then no, please don’t take this the wrong way as I have 3 daughters & if it came to them joining then I’d tell them the same, we can’t have rules for 1 & rules for another
@@Anonymous18817I think you should repost this as a comment instead of replying to IronMikeDyson1979’s comment; you’ll probably get more responses. From reading your post, I think you should concentrate on upper body strength. You can probably build up bone density through heavy weight training. Good luck with your endeavor; kick ass!
Lone Survivor has always really bugged me for this reason- the inserted team pitched a crappy CONOP with a ton of holes and then broke 1/3 of Rogers Rules for Ranging and a bunch of lessons learned from Vietnam (like don't insert directly on your RZ). But if you bring that up in any forum online, you get a mix of SEALs and their fan boys shouting you down and calling you stupid.
You are not wrong and I ask myself if we were as sloppy in 1983 too. Then I think about all the issues in Grenada, complex operations with poor Intel etc. 1batt Ranger 83-84.
@@BlyGuy not the book or movie version no, because in the captured video footage (insurgents had 2 cameras running through that fight), both of the "goat herders" are seen to have been scouts for the main body of pro-Taliban fighters. They followed the really obvious foot spore all the way up the mountain to the hide site from the air assault rope that was haphazardly ditched in a bush.
@@tmmccormick86 few questions. What is an air assault rope (like a fast rope?), why did they have this rope and most importantly, why did they have to stash it somewhere versus carrying it with them? I've long felt Murphy, Dietz, Luttrell and Axelson were simply spotted or discovered by the Taliban and never believed the goat herders story. I'm no operator, but had that been me in the Hindu Kush and goat herders stumbled on my position, I'm tying them up and having them come with me, not letting them f*ck off to do as they want. If they become belligerent and start endangering me and my men, I'm quietly putting them to sleep permanently In your opinion, was this just bad planning and leadership by Murphy? He was the team leader. I actually saw the Taliban video depicting the aftermath showing Murphy's, Dietz's and Axelson's bodies for the first time around a week ago. Really sad and completely avoidable, but that's war.
@BlyGuy yes, the fast rope is the one I was referring to. It's supposed to be campflaged when dropped from the helicopter; flying off with it dangling isn't ideal, and it's a super heavy 2 or 3 inch diameter rope, so carrying it on foot isn't practical. It's most commonly buried, but the key is that it has to be hidden and they failed at that. As for the "biggest sin," I think I could agree with a generally poor plan. They didn't coordinate with adjacent units, didn't have an adequate comms plan, didn't have an adequate number of team members, didn't inform the Special Operations Task Force of their mission, didn't request dedicated CAS.... the list of planning failures is extensive. I don't necessarily like Monday morning quarterbacking, but they were supposed to be SOF operators at the top of their game and they made an ungodly number of mistakes.
As someone who's a life long history student, I agree that it's important to talk about all aspects of an event. However mundane, boring, or heroic, the good, the bad, and the ugly, should be told.
I think everyone is entitled to their own story. The true story is on paper but there's nothing wrong with someone telling the good side the same as this guy is aloud to talk about the bad side. Everyone tells their story differently some people fucus on the positive some people focus on negative and then there is always the real story in the middle. Unless it's a documentary I don't see a problem with anybody trying to capitalize on something they themselves lived through. Some people see the glass as half-empty some see half-full neither one are wrong.
Honesty is refreshing and needed. Mistakes are made and learned from. If you hide them then those mistakes are forgotten and will be made again costing lives.
The average age of SEALs is a lot younger than SF, and almost none of them have prior tactical experience before going into that career field. So, the issues they have with maturity and tactical blunders makes sense, but generally they are good dudes. I was a direct support guy that worked with SF, SEALs and the Rangers. The only negative experience I ever had was with SF... in combat, with them doing dumb shit tactically. Afterwards, they all thought they did a kick ass job and I only later realized that 8 of them were in combat for the first time when the CJSOTF commander flew in to give them their CIBs. It was a pretty minor TIC, but I felt like we could have taken more casualties because of the dumb decisions they were making, IMO. I found out YEARS later that one of the medics got a valor award. I was like WTF. I had a friend that was KIA on an SF op, that was pretty much entirely the det commander's fault, but none of that came out in public. SF is definitely a more tactically proficient organization when it comes to infantry type shit and land combat, mission planning... probably anything but swimming, but I think they are horrible at policing their own guys. Most of the crazy disciplinary stuff that happens in SF never sees the light of day in public. The SEAL fuckups were just way higher profile and well known. SF is a much bigger organization, and I'd guess that per capita they have less blunders, but they are probably a lot better at keeping it quiet. SEALs will want to write a fucking book. I'd also see SF getting just as butthurt, if not more, if any mistakes of theirs were publicized.
A SF guy was asked to explain the difference between Seals and SF, and he gave the best answer I have heard. He said that the difference is a SF guy comes from ab infantry background and progresses from there to Ranger/Airborne/etc. Seals do not come from that level of background experience and that is the biggest difference. When you look at the mistakes, they have made it is because of being experienced in all aspects of warfighting.
Thanks for mentioning Chappy.... The SEALS didn't want to admit they left a man behind. I believe it was the fog of war and an innocent mistake. They should have checked but they didn't. Slabinski screwed up. You are right, the AAR is a teaching tool to better the warrior and improve future ops.The fact that the Navy tried to stop the MOH for Chappy tells you a lot about the issues at DEVGRU.
It’s the Officers of these organizations that are playing politics with the MOH. It’s not the NCOs or the operators themselves that would block a MOH. None of those guys care about a medal or even have the powers or authorized to block a medal. This had to do with promotions and branding that Officers benefit from when their organization win significant accolades. It doesn’t have anything to do with DEVGRU.
@@joesgotya9930 You are correct about the operators... But in this case the senior leadership in DevGru was involved. They didn't want the team to look bad. Shit happens inn war, they were worried about their reputation. I realize Slabinski and the rest of the team guys had nothing to do with the MOH blocking that occurred.
@@robertsettle2590 I am trying to give the benefit of doubt since I wasn't there. I think this was messed up from the word go. This mission should have been scrubbed before Roberts fell out of the helo. I met Chappy years ago before I got out. I am trying to be a better man then I was when I heard they left him sitting on top of the mountain without checking him and leaving him to die. I went through major stages of anger about it especially when the Navy made Slabinski a hero for that complete debacle. I could have chosen my words better but this is such an embarrassment to the SOF community it is hard to put into words. There have been many investigations into DEVGRU about questionable behavior and actions both on and off the battlefield. Sadly the investigations are internal so nothing is ever said/done. Hopefully they can right the ship now that the rotations have slowed down.
@@afsoccommandoslab lied and took credit for Chapmans actions. He never thought that the footage would get out, which is why the seal community/higher ups tried to stonewall the MOH for Chapman.
I am in no way SOF, but I agree. Looking at our screw-ups and dissecting them is how we learn. Learning from our mistakes makes us better and stronger as both an individual and as a team.
We all served, we should always and i mean always be able to call eachother out if shits jacked up. As long as its coming from a place of love and not someone being high and mighty. Its pretty damn easy to tell the difference too. No matter how high a level you are, mistakes happen, accepting them is a challenge.
i think the issue is when they're saying they want to tell the raw truth and then totally undermine themselves in the next second by cherry picking the facts they want to portray and discuss. That's not useful to anyone for anything. Like what was happening with the whole Gallagher controversy thingy.
@@FRANK45CASTLE i'm so glad you do. Now tell me which magical phrase do I need to use so that military people and veterans understand that mind-altering substances + fog of war = MORE fog of war = BAD! ... bc my attempts at explaining this concept so far don't seem to be landing. (and yes this is a problem apparently for literally anyone in the military community and a lot of the vets in government too... somehow this equation is just not being understood)
@@FRANK45CASTLE i feel like I'm in a bizarre alternate reality, where everyone decide to 100% suspect logic and they're now officially their own "bad idea fairies"...
Yeah man, good stuff. I commented on Jay’s channel regarding operation anaconda. We lost 3 Ranger brothers during that. We have it in our creed to never leave a fallen comrade to fall in to the hands of the enemy. The truth hurts sometimes. Nothing against the Seals…some bad mo-fos…especially the ones that don’t talk about everything having to do with them being Seals.
I knew a retired CCT. He had some very strong opinions about SEALs in regards to MSGT Chapman. Glad you brought it up. There’s supposed to be a movie about MSGT Chapman and Battle of Robert’s Ridge coming out soon. I’m very interested to see how they depict what the SEALs did there.
The reality is that most of us in the SF & SOF Communities know what's up, and what likely went wrong with certain Operations. We talk about it amongst ourselves so we can learn from the mistakes. Often I hear SEALs getting really defensive about any one of us pointing out issues with Ops that involve them. Makes you wonder how much they actually learn from their own mistakes if they can't even acknowledge them. Smart Operators and their Teams never stop learning. Shout out to 3rd Group, I have a good friend there who helped set up their Spec Warfare Planning Detachment, who's aim is to apply what they've learned from both good and bad ops. Seems the SEALs could use one of those.
Honestly no body outside of Navspec really has a foot to stand on if they chose to criticize a special operations unit individually or as a whole. Unless they were directly involved with them. Thus guys critique has more to do about the seal perception on social media rather than negative outcomes of an operation. So it's natural that seals would get defensive when someone is out here trying to clout chase on a new you tube channel like this dude is. Ironically it's funny that you shout out 3rd group given their recent issues with Drugs and trafficking minors. So if we are going to hold dudes in other units Accountable let's have that discussion then. I bet this guy won't even bring up that shit show that's going on at Bragg with his old unit. You know what they day about people who throw stones that live in glass houses.
Rest assured, the TEAMS are just fine. Learn from mistakes, just like you. There are just a lot fewer mistakes to learn from.... and usually the lessons learned dont get published to TH-cam. BZ
@@jonnieboyization a lot fewer mistakes.. Sure. Speaking of publications, do they teach personal publicity, book writing skills, and movie script writing at BUDS?
I'm sorry but Jay is BSing here. To premise I'm not US SOF, I'm former Australian SF and was fortunate enough to serve on exchange with 3SFG. Jay's initial video criticised the SEALs for having a culture of "leaving guys behind". He made claims in the video that SEALs are essentially self-serving and don't have the backs of their team mates. The entire video was an Operator ranting about a personal issue with SEALs disguised as "I'm just being impartial and calling out what I see". Jay even admitted in a later video that he wasn't aware of the details behind those operations, meaning he opened his mouth and went on an emotional rant without all the information. He's since removed the video and is making all sorts of misleading claims about it to cover his ass. I'm not a fan of Jay and I'm not a fan of SEALs but I can understand why so many SEALs had an issue with this one. Jay is at best misleading in his claims here and at worse completely BSing. What he said wasn't calling out what he saw in an impartial "AAR" manner, it was a personal, emotional rant about an entire community with little fact or basis.
On my last deployment to Afghanistan the seals did leave a guy behind. Credit to that dude that got left. He E&E all the way back to base by himself at night. Our guys just happened to run into him and picked him up not far from base. Took him back to base. I never pressed to find out the details. I figured their chain of command would handle it. I felt bad for the guy.
@@randymerrill4877 I find that difficult to believe... for anybody to be knowingly left behind alive, without any follow up on a military operation is basically impossible. Even in the operations Jay mentions that didn't happen. Operation Red Wings they made several attempts, the first they lost a CH-47 full of guys and the second they had guys heat CASing pushing up ridiculous, hardcore terrain. They weren't "abandoned". Takur Ghar occurred *because* the SEALs were going back for one of their guys who fell from the chopper after an RPG strike. The second they touched down Chapman, who was support staff attached to the team not a shooter, charged off on his own without notifying the team, at night and under fire no less. The TL saw Chapman fall after being struck by fire in a gunfight, they then took more casualties and were combat ineffective so retreated a few hundred metres off the X. They believed Chapman was dead (with good reason) and didn't abandon the situation anyway, they withdrew and called QRF which was the right call in that scenario. Never heard of somebody on operation being left behind and having to E&E solo back to base without any formal process involved, not in real-life anyway. For SEALs (or anybody for that matter) to simply RTB and forget about the suspiciously missing guy is pretty far-fetched.
As a USN aircrewman who crossed paths with SEALs at SERE and Air Wing training in Fallon, Nevada, I can say the professionals I served with in the 1980s have succumbed to a "Gone Hollywood" mentality unbecoming a Spec Ops group. In my interactions with fellow aviators from the Cold War, they too acknowledge the disappointing and unfortunate Behavioral change in current/former members of the Teams.
As an Em then Officer in SF this stuff, good and bad needs to be reviewed. Not necessarily in public but amongst our own units. Rarely does an operation go so smoothly that there is no negative in the after action review. Only by putting the screw-ups out there, do you get better. The complexities are so great that some screw up or incident is inevitable. We in SF have always been know as the Quiet Professionals because we don't publicize our many operations worldwide. We do need to analyze our actions, both good and bad, but we need to continue as always to keep them in our own house. Media may be good for the SEALs but never for our SF!!!
No, it needs to go public. The public needs to know that the military the worship more than God has weird male on male sexual hazing going on. If you operate in secret, you're probably a bad person.
No he ran his mouth and badmouthed SEALs. He absolutely did. I’m an army guy and I was mad. So I know SEALs didn’t like it. It’s real easy to criticize an op sitting in chair or in a briefing room. But when you’re on an op and it goes south you do the best you can to mitigate it.
I agree. Instead on staying on the operation itself which he doesn't have all the facts, he trashed the SEAL community and leaving people behind. He knew his mouth overplayed his hands that he walked it backed in a later video. He messed up. He knows it.
The man is right to a degree, 100%, as a ex Brit veteran you have to touch on subjects that are brutal and don't wanna be heard but that's how you get better. SEALS sometimes have a reputation that they are superhuman gods and in the community however they probably get behind that hype and that rubs up other units the wrong way and of course those units gonna say something like "oh remember that operation...that one you screwed up on?" It happens I've been there. However, airing it out in public probably isn't the best way to do it. Respect man
Thank you for having this conversation. I enjoy both your channels and have learned a lot from both of you. One issue that has bothered me for a long time involves what Chris Kyle wrote in his book, American Sniper, and how the SEAL community reacted to Jesse Ventura taking issue with what was written about him. I've listened to both sides of the story. I wasn't there, so I will never know for certain, but I do believe Jesse Ventura. It doesn't change the way I feel about Chris Kyle's service and his accomplishments, or the SEAL community. But when I heard Marcus Luttrell attack Jesse Ventura on a FOX news interview, that really bothered me. I like and respect Marcus, but I felt he was wrong. The entire community turned on Jesse, not because they cared about the truth, but because they liked Kyle more than they liked Ventura and they thought Kyle's reputation was being damaged. This kind of tribal behavior really bothers me because it is reflected in the American culture at large. People are willing to defend their own side 'no matter what', even when a member of their side was in the wrong. Again, thank you both for having these kinds of conversations and being so open about your experiences. Thank you for your service.
What are the reasons for SEALS to fight? They cannot simply tell you because there is no conveyance that can accurately describe the meaning of how they feel and why they fight. The “art” is war. Valor, chaos, destruction, and death. SEALS act accordingly…
Buck and Jay, good to see together and not via zoom interviews. We all know many operations have a bit of Hope & Luck, and when they dont stay together things can get gnarly or deadly. Ego drives a lot of missions to failure. Some missions just dont make sense even though we can say they must be done. Yeah but not with minimum people. Much love to all of the community. Respect All Fear None 💯
Shoutout to both of you guys for making these videos and talking about the hard shit. You can't better and improve if you consistently focus just on what you did good. Okay great, we did great. What can we do better? Break everything down. If people can't handle basic constructive criticism, then there's something wrong with them.
I agree with the Team Sgt. With one difference. Just because a man is from a different branch or unit, at this point does not mean he cannot pull from the many mission’s in which some, partial or complete mission failure occurred. It how lessons learned are passed on in hopes our son’s do not make the same ones. It only requires maturity and desire to better out forces at all levels in preparedness. The maturity and professionalism needed in such men is still lacking in some men who have not grown past ego and pride and self awareness. This is about something bigger in my opinion. I appreciate such honest talks. I would add that if you read “Alone at Dawn” you can see exactly the point being made in this video. And also make up your own mind as to the relevance of such talks 🇺🇸
That any of these things are publicized still rubs me wrong. As a former Army dude from the Cold War. Also understand that the times have changed. In how operational details are classified and disseminated. Too many glory hounds coming from all of the different SOF components. There are many views in this topic. That are generating constructive conversations such as this one. Thanks for the awesome content👍
Pre-Sales to my new book "Better Broken" now live! Thank you guys for the support!
www.amazon.com/Better-Broken-Hidden-Advantage-Challenging/dp/1637743866/ref=sr_1_7?crid=3NAU9V1M5950D&keywords=better+broken&qid=1698437331&sprefix=better+broken%2Caps%2C114&sr=8-7
Hello Sean, I've just finished reading it. Excellent book, very thought provoking. Will certainly help a lot of people. Hope to read more from you in the future
A Navy SEAL walks into a bar.
Then he writes a book about it.
And drives everybody out
LoL
@@xys7536 Then brags about it to everyone and your mom.
Made me 😂😂😂😂😂
I see this joke being made all the time, but the host of this "Better Broken" podcast is a Green Beret who is writing a book about his experiences, has a youtube channel and talks about being a Green Beret, now has a podcast about it. Who exactly are you judging, mate?
As an Ex Army 82nd ABN guy and retired SEAL I can say the SEAL Team AARs and debriefs are brutal. I think a lot of the issues are guys don’t want their “dirty laundry” aired in a public forum. Because most civilians watching don’t understand. SEALS would have no problem discussing issues that went wrong with each other or other SOF guys, but are uncomfortable airing it to the public. You can’t have the same discussion with civilians like you can with other SOF guys.
As for SEALS being all over media… I think it goes in waves. I joined the Army in the late 80’s, every movie and every book that came out back then was about Green Berets, Rambo, the Deer Hunter, Billy Jack…. Etc… then they went through brand fatigue and when the next big war happened they put the spot light on a new organization. I believe brand fatigue is setting in on the SEALs too…. Eventually they will spotlight another SOF unit, Maybe MARSOC, Rangers…. Whatever.
Or maybe it’s because Army leadership practice better opsec? All these media coverage on seals happen because the higher ups allow it to happen and I really feel they use that as a recruitment strategy.
Good morning Sir. I haven't watched this video yet, which I'm going to, but was checking the reactions and reading yours, I was wondering: don't you think that in the 80's the movies you mentioned were not exactly accurate nor revealing the exact purpose of the Green Berets S.F. in "Rambo" for instance ?... Therefore not really divulging any real tactics and methods which could be detrimental to people still on active duty, even though these tactics and methods tend to evolve and change fairly rapidly?
Yo I was in 2/504...All the Way!
Airborne all the Way!
@@urik7793 Strike Hold! Lol I was in the 4/325 AIR
Chapman was one of my heroes. Those seals were about to come out with a book and then they found out that there was a CIA drone hovering above and the whole thing was caught on tape. Then all the sudden their story switched and no book came out
John McPhee (ex CAG) was in the JSOC TOC during Takur Ghar. He says when the initial grainy footage of Chapman was first released.
The SEALs were walking around boasting that that lone figure had to be Neil Robert's and that he was gonna be the first GWOT MOH.
When subsequent info pointed to Chapman the DEVGRU contingent grew quiet and tried to bury it.
@@vitigaymer1053 they have neil Roberts, bent up 240, hung up in sixes locker. Not trying to put Neil Roberts down. He had no control of what happened after he was killed and he didn't go out fast...... I just can't only imagine if that happened in 2010 to 2018. The team's would of made it into a HUGE recruiting tool or if that drone wasn't overhead. Those team guys would of lied about EVERYTHING. I'm glad it showed how much of a warrior Chapman is. Lost a good 1 that day. Even the Rangers that landed in that TIC as QRF..... That is a amazing story in itself
@@bestjobieverhad9584 if Neil Roberts had used his snaplink as instructed by the crew chief (and required by his Oath) then takur Ghar would not have happened and those soldiers would not have died ☝️
@@kxkxkxkx agreed, but the shit those terrorists did to him. He did not deserve. The Rangers and those pilots had balls landing were they did. Right in the middle of everything. The sickening part is the CIA was watching the whole time and did not say a word....... They could of at least landed outside the direct fire and walked.
@@vitigaymer1053 did he? Was it on a podcast?
The simple fact is that Special Operations in general got way over glorified in the past past 20 years. The video games, movies, books, podcasts, tv shows etc.. it’s all commando porn and NSW was the leading PR stream for it. It’s time to start making the conventional joe cool and relevant again like tank crews, artillery, SIGINT, pilots, medics, Mechanics, Infantry, Doctors. Thats where the real quiet professionals were in the GWOT. None of those men and women got a tenth of the attention and publicity that SOCOM generated overbred the past 20 years.
Guys this is a new show... every comment and like is a game changer! we can't get more guests without your support... Buck
Great content! Sure would be nice to have a link to the video under discussion tho 🙏
Why'd it just end?? Haha
Seriously, SEAL reveal or it didn’t happen
Hey Buck! Jesus, the production value is spot on! Ya'll must have found you some good AV nerds to square your shit away. I am looking forward to some good conversations. The only thing I would suggest as your average TH-cam mid-wit is don't let the enemy dictate the pace. I get it you feel like you need to have flashy titles with words like "infuriate" in it, or some "youtube guru" tells you you need them. Don't do this shit. If it does help the views (which who knows really) it also cheapens the value of the content to me. I ain't passing along a video to a buddy of mine with the title "Former Elite Pew-pew Man Eviscerates Woke Hobo-clown!!". It might just be me, but if you present shit seriously, people will take it seriously. Yeah you might not get the traffic that a "prank" video from some youtube muppet would get, but you also ain't trying to sell eXtReMe k00Laid enErGys DrAnk! to children either. Anywho, rant over. Looking out for the show to be sure. :D
hahahaha, I totally thought this would be you pi$$ing them off for not liking a certain movie! LMAO!
I know exactly what that guy means because I went through it myself. I posted a question in a Facebook military group asking about when did we start taking the Medal of Honor seriously in this country. I asked that because for the first 50 years of its existence, the MOH was given out like candy. During the Civil War, an entire regiment got one just for reenlisting. In the Battle of Manila Bay during the Spanish American War, several people got one just for being there. So my question was when did we start having the reverence for the MOH that we do today.
Well of course people completely missed the point. And I was bombarded with dozens and dozens of people asking me why I was shitting all over the memory of those that received it. I tried to explain the point that I was making but no one wanted to listen. So finally I just said screw this and deleted it.
That's one thing out of many things that I hate about social media. You will make a post about your views on a subject. You'll explain your experiences and how you came to that conclusion. But the only thing people will respond to is one single sentence that they didn't like and they will go ballistic about it. This is how "outrage culture " has spread through the internet. It seems like people are more interested in finding something to be offended by rather than the content of the post.
The more effort you put into explaining your position, the more asshats will do a one-line drive by that completely misses the point. A lot of it is just trolling, I think.
Seems like some people really enjoy the inability to grasp nuance & context, during introspection. It’s genuinely frustrating how dense some individuals are.
I had no idea about that, I know it's not the point of your post but you've given me something to do some research on. I thought it always was an award that was rarely achieved, never really looked too much into that. But to your actual point, yeah... That's the Internet social media brain thing, I have found myself doing that as well but I try not to do it. Yeah you're right, it's actually very ignorant way of processing information... And if you aren't careful you'll find yourself thinking like that in everyday life, it's part of the reason people get so ridiculous when it comes to politics, it's narrow-minded thinking.
That is a very good question. People these days have no reading comprehension I suppose.
Good post. I think it is rooted in the tribalism that seems to have taken over our American/Western society. Social media has undoubtedly inflamed that tribalism to the point we're ready to come apart at the seams over the smallest perceived infractions.
The navy seals are the green beret of the 1970s. In the 70s they hyped up the green beret in movies. Like they are doing the navy seal’s today. It’s a natural cycle.
I appreciate the sincerity and the honest way of being. It is obvious that sometimes the missions have bad moments. After all, even SF operators are human and humans make mistakes. RESPECT!
I was an Air Force company clerk stationed in Rhein Main AFB, Germany from 1981 to 1984. Around winter time 84 we did a small scale perimeter defense course with the 10th Special Forces in Bad Tolz, Germany. It was the most memorable three days ever. Those special forces guys were so cool and it was so freezing cold during patrol I would have stood up to get shot just to feel my warm blood drain down my froze body. Young and dumb what a blast. Thanks Special Forces dudes. GOD bless and protect all of ya.
This guy is on point, people need to realize that in all of these awesome spec ops stories, is that something went wrong or someone fucked up to lead to that particular situation. There need to be more cautionary tales, so people going into this profession don't have the wrong idea, and wind up finding out the hard way.
If its not worth it when people start to argue about it then why do it in the first place?
I agree, young guys know we’re signing up to go to war. We might as well have more insight as to what’s gonna come with it. If the truth makes you change your decision then your just not cut out for it. Much love Buck I can’t wait to watch this full episode , maybe get a ranger on here too 🤝
I served from 78-84. I was in special warfare- special boat units. Now known as SWCC-the boat teams. The SEALS then WERE quiet professionals. Certainly, there wasnt a full on war then and social media didnt exist. Nobody knew about SEALs or boat teams- the way it should be.
Then came the gulf war, where the press were waiting onshore when SEALs slipped quietly out of the water- astonished to see the press recording them. The high vis rescues and captures put them in the public.
For me, its just the SEALs time. The Green Beret and Delta were public in the 80s and 90s but the internet didnt exist. The public wanted to know more about these elite Navy warriors because the press kept on them. Unfortunately several of them decided to write books, podcasts or voice their stories. When i saw it starting i thought 'wtf- nobody should know they exist, especial team 6." Its ashame it is what it is. But we are in a different world today where media is an outlet for those who cant stay silent. ALL branches have them. Its just that the SEALs are "the newest find" and the public cant get enough. The jealousy within SF is rampant-across all branches. Its human nature, even for SF guys. Peace.
Thank You Brother. Sometimes pride hides the truth. All Branches should be proud. And remember this motto so when the day comes and it will, We remember, We are all Brothers and ,"When You call, we will be there to support" Compition is Needed to keep Us sharp. But, We all make up the spear!! That God You all guard our door.
After every Navy operation there is a "hot wash' discussing what we did right and did wrong during the mission which is an internal review. No one publicly publishes the mistakes unless their is an external review that leads to loss of confidence in the command or criminal violations or negligence. The other military services are no different. I'm surprised that you are surprised that your public criticism received backlash. Arm chair quarterbacks are never embraced or appreciated.
Although I don't always agree with all a Ward Carol's viewpoints. One of the reason I follow his channel is he always points out the success of Naval Air Warfare and the failures and what actions the Navy took to correct the problem
He is absolutely right.
Great video! Thankyou for your service!
Hell Yes! This is exactly the truth. Supposed to be quiet professionals. In most of these OPs that’s being glorified, something went south, somebody did something wrong or more importantly there was a huge cost to it, and that never gets told in the story line because it Doesnt glorify those involved.
My team of ANA and I were some of the many who had to go look for and to pick up the pieces from Operation Red Wings. I’m against the book and movie being made but like Jay states, if your going to tell a story, tell the whole story, how and why did it happen. A true AAR of the OP and What were the true costs of the actions, not just to puff up someone’s chest and glorify the actions of a few. All to many times these stories are being told to bolster a few, when it was usually a F up, and the true story and costs never get told.
i've noticed that many MOA awards were the result of one man choosing to act above and beyond to save their comrades after an intelligence, strategic/tactical, leadership, or political screw up. Often somebody had to pay with their life to get that award after somebody else screwed up.
Is it a good idea to air operational dirty laundry in a public forum?
Another great podcast about SF issues
By design, social media creates herd mentalites whether people realize it or not. I wasn't aware of his video about Chapman. From what it sounds like is the video focused solely on the shortcomings that led to the end of the fight. If that's the case, I would suggest talking about the positive points first and then going into scrutinizing what went wrong and how to mitigate those problems moving forward. The video may have had better reception as it would showcase objectivity and balance. Either way, I am glad you followed your heart. But its unfortunate people couldn't see past the glamorization of a man that fought to the end. In a way, inclinations of Chapman's MOH video became lost in translation making the video garner the wrong connotation. Thank you for sharing. RIP fellow Airman Chapman, you're the essence of what the Air Force, military and America stand for.
SEAL teams could only operate against guys in sandals they could never withstand modern war against a peer without being decimated. They've never fought without full air supremacy, and a massive technology advantage, ever.
Yeah, but how did they get rolled up on in their hide site? That is a huge learning point for future warriors running recon ops.
OUTSTANDING!
I wasnt special forces. And when I worked with them it was in a support role. But I always thought the criticism should be or was always behind closed doors. Social media has definitely changed all that though.
If a SEAL didn't write a book about it, did it really happen? 😂
I know it's a joke but weren't those guys in Ramadi with you? I'd think you'd respect them more idk.
Exactly guys and thank you for the job well done. I totally agree with both of you over social media sites were people aren't held accountable for there actions and words and what make me hate social media is the fact that you can enjoy the same experience as others because you have to not judge the book by the cover but try to go around the person who dont understand that you dont do that and i am talking about both special forces and civilians as well as agents who were is the whole team at who was there with you instead taking one for the team. That dont paint a picture of the whole story just like the green beret on here is saying.The whole story help understanding vs half and half. 👍👍
David Goggins was a 20 year Navy SEALs and he has nothing good to say about Navy SEALs or the SEAL community
I’ve always found that extremely damning and interesting when one of your own has very little good things to say about it
People need to realize that in lone survivor, it wasn’t only those four that got hammered. SEALs took a massive loss trying to recover Marcus. The chinook that got shot down killed a lot of seals on their way to find Marcus.
8 Taliban killed a whole SEAL platoon... Pretty shocking imho
Interesting, lots of great books coming out soon. Waiting for a friend of mine who is waiting for DOD to clear it.
You should judge your own, let the Navy judge their own s#**.
That Marcus Luttrell drone video is gonna go missing before any of us can see it you watch and see.
I’ve watched his videos before, guy has a lot of conviction. Talks about legit shit.
Bro we gotta stop hating on people who served. I wish every vet could monetize their story because our country doesn't do enough for vets. I believe if you served in a war or had 4 years in you should never have to work again.
Marines are still the best force we have hands down .
Facts man, If there gonna brag about shit all over the internet then someone needs to fact check the shit
That's one way of looking at it.
No one is perfect, not one mission goes down perfect, there's always need for improvement thats just the nature of the beast
This guy was legendary in 3rd Group 3133 was a tough ODA I was the 3230 AOB Mechanic in 14
First time I saw Lone Survivor, I immediately recognized the mistake of releasing those shephards BEFORE establishing comms. I’m not disparaging anyone but it is critical to future mission success and modifying SOP to analyze tragic outcomes.
There are no shepherds
To be honest the entire Chapman thing is disgraceful. It's not that they left a guy that they believed was KIA behind to E&E. It's that for years Slab insisted unequivocally that Chapman was dead when they left him. Not dying. That he was dead. Slab even went as far to lie to the writers of the original book on Roberts Ridge that the Mujahideen had a blue on blue using Chapman's M-4 because he knew the drone had footage of a guy shooting the Muj with a M-4. Slab was proven wrong and he still insists he never lied about anything. It's insane. The dude got a medal for lying and leaving a man behind and to this day has never apologized.
SEALS tried to F John Chapman. Insisted on getting their own MOH. The video showed the truth.
I dont think anything good or bad should be made public regarding missions. This is between the guys in the team. Mistakes are made in every situation, and everyone gets to eat off that plate regardless of branch. They do glorify things in movies. They are movies!! They are not going to show the shortcomings because thats not what the movies want to portray.
Try critiquing yourself and your team before criticizing others. Secondly, how are stories such as the Chapman story told as positives? To me, it's a sad story. Also, there's a difference between constructive criticism and public shaming. Not to mention, 40 comments doesn't necessarily reflect the opinions of most seals.
Did you not pay attention to the video?
@@KingRonaldo-uf1hvI swear people skip the whole video, just to bitch their point across. I’ve learned long ago You can’t debate with people like that
Hotwash is not comfortable.
The truth
You going down range on yer own
Ain’t nobody coming, it’s up to us
If you ever have a question about what went wrong with any operation , just ask the Rangers, they seem to be called in to clean up and rescue the fuck ups by the whole JSOC
You got to admit the only reason that seal got the MOH is because Chapman did
I agree completely! Always be honest and strive to get better. RLTW
Sounds like he has a personal issue minding his own business
3 words - Life is tough ... 100 paid firefighters per year die ......suck it up
As a bunny operator: get that info out there man, f their feelings.
The Real Housewives of Special Forces 🥴😅
So what went wrong in those missions?
He has a great case. Balance is necessary. The actual cases that he sites I do jot think he paid attention to the movie or videos. Lone Survivor showed the mistakes and the decisions that lead to the failure of the mission. Seals do get a lot of press after being one of the least known units. I see Shawn Ryan and Jocko being very open and having great discussions with everyone. I tend to think mostly about the. Negative things about missions. The helo crash getting BinLaden. The amount of time make thru the house and to evacuate. Rarely do things go as planned
My Son Joined USAF for CCT. As he was qualifying, I found the John Chapman video and showed him. Not to deter him, but to show him shit goes wrong. So many vids out there with only success and all the good outcomes. It is not airing dirty laundry. It is needed to show youth full disclosure. My Son was a perfect candidate for CCT. Ranked in Olympics for Judo. Captain of wrestling team, swim team and cross country. Honor student with 6 years Civil Air Patrol. But I only had the romantic version of what special forces does. I felt it was necessary for him to see that it’s not all romantic. it did not deter him, but it gave him a better understanding of what he was volunteering for. I scoured the Internet for all aspects of special forces, with emphasis on CCT. Would have been great if he had left these videos up. Regardless of the anger it caused other special forces.
Dude you said they should show what went wrong!? Loan surviver didnt show the wrong of the mission?
A wise man learns more from his mistakes than his victories.
A Monday quarterback knows the game that has already happened. All SOCOM teams plan for some level of ignorance/failure in the unknown. Never a fan of operations failure but, it must be studied to prevent mistakes in future missions.
To realize your own deficiency is paramount to life long success.
An even wiser man learns from the mistakes of others
*These days, too many people are afraid to criticize Navy Seals. No should be above criticism. And being tough guys, Navy Seals should be big enough to take it like everyone else.*
even seals in an interview said theres a problem within the culture with some seals
People with unjustly high status are usually most sensitive about it ☝️
Not really discussed is that the majority of SEALs *are quiet professionals.
Why is it always seals? I never see any other groups in the SOF community criticize other groups. They always criticize the seals why is that
@@DaPizFondrenJealousy
As a 20 year Recon Marine. I had the pleasure of being in a unit (VSW) as a Dive Team Leader, that was made up of Marine Recon, Navy Seal's, Navy EOD and SWICC. All knuckle dragging alpha dogs. It amazed me, how the SEAL's can go through some of the hardest training in the world and be so stupid. It took me a while to realize, it was lack of maturity. You have 18 and 22 your old (Charlie Sheen Want to be's) As I often called them. Who once getting the chicken and fork badge, thought they where the SHIT. You can say that the age factor is common among all Special Operations Groups. But I did not see that when working with other groups, as far as age/maturity and being responsible. In other communities, in most cases they have done sometime in active service and worked their way into the Special Ops community. And there prior active service is considered as part of the selection process. In the the SEAL's, in most case's, you go to your A school, Hell Week, BUD's and then TEAM probation. I am not saying any of that is easy. I know first hand because to become a LARV diver, I had to go through 2d phase, as a 30 year old Marine (did not compete, because of a injury).
With my 4 years working with SEAL's I found that in most case's E-6 and above where good to go. And in a SEAL platoon, if the E-6 and Chief where good to go, the jr's where humble and knew there place in the pecking order.
Guess that was a lil off topic, I just think that during my time with the SEAL's, maturity and the culture was a big issue,
As for "No Man Left Behind" That should apply to all service branches. "You Go, I Go, We Go"
What is VSW and LARV?
I can already tell you that if this was a team made up of Recon, SEALs, EOD, SWCC it was a non combat unit. This was some second rate training opportunity that the teams very well could have sent 2 guys they wanted to get rid of for a while. Please don't say you trained with the SEALs unless you actually trained with a SEAL unit. You can say you trained with a couple of SEALs not the TEAMs. To civilians they would not know the difference. But you should know better.
Hard to sell books when people realize you’re just a human being and not a god of war.
*Books written by SF dudes like buck*: talk about hardship, overcoming it, and growing from failure.
*SEAL books*: i am the worlds best at everything, i am a lion and a god of war. Buy my merch!
Telling the truth and having honest discussions hurts their PR.
....I am sorry, but why are you not a ''god of war"? can you like explain that part to me, please.... i'm struggling to understand it.
@@andrabook8758There’s a cringy Jocko clip where calls himself a lion and plenty of others making absurd proclamations. I respect, and love SEALs - Goggins and Stew Smith are some of the people that inspired me to join the Army (family was the main inspiration).
But SEALs are in a bad spot right now, the limelight seekers and trouble makers are poisoning the Teams. It reminds me of Army SF after the Vietnam War. SF responded by cleaning house, implemented an A&S, and standardized the Q-Course to weed out the bad apples.
Currently, SEALs are burying their head in the sand.
I mean they get to say that right
This guy is great and I agree with him 100%. The Chapman/Brett Slabinski story at Takur Gar is described in detail and very critically in "Code over Country" by Matthew Cole. That might be why the SEALs were so touchy about it. Chapman's story is incredible and the Navy's desire to cover it up is disgusting.
Damn, I just found out about the teams actions on this. Gross. The trident loves to devalue itself.
Well hopefully the Movie comes out soon enough and does Chappy justice!
Seriously. Even at the tip of the spear men can still be cowards and leave their brother behind. Unacceptable for our top shelf warriors. We must hold them accountable if they say they are the best
That book is eye opening and shoe tge cancer in the dam neck guys
Real question is why didnt he rise out of water when you introduced him? Seal reveal!!!
bro i was thinking about that for the thumb with Abel lmao
@@FNGACADEMYthat would have been funny as shit!
Lol
Yeah, you could've at least provided a bucket of water or something.
😂😂
In Dan Schilling's words about Takur Ghar:
- "The travesty at the end of the operation is the loss of the seven men on Takur Ghar. Those deaths- SEAL Neil Roberts, CCT John Chapman, PJ Jason Cunningham, air crewman Phil Svitak, and the three Rangers, Marc Anderson, Bradley Crose, and Matthew Commons - do not lie at the feet of Delta's Pete Blaber and AFO, but the leaders of SEAL Team Six, specifically Joe Kernan and Tim Szymanski, and their rush to push men into the battle and take over operations from Blaber."
Hell, even after the battle was over. NAVY SPECWAR fought with AFSPECWAR in their research to find out if John Chapman was eligible to receive the Medal of Honor. Because if he was awarded, it would admit that SEAL TEAM 6 left a man behind. Ruining their image.
I just finished Alone at Dawn. Amazing but incredibly heart breaking book.
@@BTL0523that book is tough!
@@BTL0523 It's a good book and it's tough to read John Chapman's final moments. Because undoubtedly Chapman was heroic and looked out for his fellow soldiers, I can't help but feel anger towards ST6. The whole thing could have been avoided and John Chapman could've gone home to his daughters.
@Marteeen261. My wife listened to the ending with me on a long car ride and burst into tears hearing it. I've never served, but in my ignorant mind, I can't help but feel frustrated towards them. How can you watch someone commit a true act of heroism and not at least check for a pulse? But I've never been shot at and hopefully never will, so I try to have some sympathy for them in the situation they were put in.
Thanks for bringing this up, after reading Alone at Dawn, it really changed my opinion about Navy SEALS.
Awesome sit down with one of the most down to earth dude on social media. Thanks for the invite Buck..
Thank you for exemplifying the post-service quiet professional. My only encounter with USA SF was the 20th SF Group in Jacksonville, FL while I was stationed there. Even as Reserves, they continued, like you, to carry themselves in that context. Great, GREAT bunch of guys.
I’m a 22 year old woman and I’m training to become a U.S. Navy SEAL. I’m a civilian and I want to go enlisted. I know five other women that are training for BUD/S, one of them is in BUD/S Prep right now.
What advice would you give for women that want to be SEALs? How does the SEAL community feel about women joining them? Do you think women should be allowed to become Navy SEALs?
Most female SEAL candidates struggle with carrying the boats and logs, doing pull ups, having grip strength and completing the “Dirty Name” on the obstacle course.
Also, a lot of female SEAL candidates break their legs or develop stress fractures. Women have smaller and thinner bones than men.
@@Anonymous18817no ones cares about the gender going in, if you have what it takes, you have what it takes. That’s what it’s about, to break you, make you quit, as long as you don’t, you’re good. Although, you are right, woman’s physical attributes, bones density, etc are often weaker then men. Don’t let that hold you back though.
@@Anonymous18817obviously of course, meet the standards, be able to carry heavy dude when he’s down, injured, to safety just like he would you.
@@Anonymous18817honestly, save your time. Do something else in the military. Of all spec ops, Navy Seals really have the most physically intensive training. Might suck to hear but it’s the type of training that a woman simply cannot endure. There is a 0% chance your body can perform as well as they are expecting throughout training, let alone amidst intense combat. They give yall the opportunity only to appease feminists. Not because females are capable of becoming SEALs. The standard’s the standard. It only gets harder after bud/s.
In my humble opinion That cluster F known as Roberts ridge does such a disservice to John Chapman’s story. That man was a true warrior & embodiment of what it is to be an American. Such a tragic loss but also an amazing story of courage. I can’t imagine being mortally wounded and left to fight alone against a number of heavily armed combatants. That man sent a number mf’s to hell that day and died while fighting hand to hand combat after running out of ammunition.
Shout out to Jay, too many people focus on the good results and make videos or movies while hiding not discussing serious issues.
The good, the bad, and the ugly…fix the bad and throw out the ugly and never try that again. Problem is 90% of people today are totally ok living with both the bad and ugly
I’m a 22 year old woman and I’m training to become a U.S. Navy SEAL. I’m a civilian and I want to go enlisted. I know five other women that are training for BUD/S, one of them is in BUD/S Prep right now.
What advice would you give for women that want to be SEALs? How does the SEAL community feel about women joining them? Do you think women should be allowed to become Navy SEALs?
Most female SEAL candidates struggle with carrying the boats and logs, doing pull ups, having grip strength and completing the “Dirty Name” on the obstacle course.
Also, a lot of female SEAL candidates break their legs or develop stress fractures. Women have smaller and thinner bones than men.
@@Anonymous18817I’m not being any type of racist or biased against women in fact I’m all for women to be able to join any regiment a male can but if they can’t compete with the men or not able to do the same training their given then I’m afraid they shouldn’t be unless they can compete the course, letting women join but only through doing lighter training or anything not mirroring the men then no, please don’t take this the wrong way as I have 3 daughters & if it came to them joining then I’d tell them the same, we can’t have rules for 1 & rules for another
@@Anonymous18817sorry I meant to finish saying good luck & would love to hear you being the 1st one to complete it, all the best of luck 🤞
@@Anonymous18817I think you should repost this as a comment instead of replying to IronMikeDyson1979’s comment; you’ll probably get more responses.
From reading your post, I think you should concentrate on upper body strength. You can probably build up bone density through heavy weight training. Good luck with your endeavor; kick ass!
Lone Survivor has always really bugged me for this reason- the inserted team pitched a crappy CONOP with a ton of holes and then broke 1/3 of Rogers Rules for Ranging and a bunch of lessons learned from Vietnam (like don't insert directly on your RZ). But if you bring that up in any forum online, you get a mix of SEALs and their fan boys shouting you down and calling you stupid.
You are not wrong and I ask myself if we were as sloppy in 1983 too. Then I think about all the issues in Grenada, complex operations with poor Intel etc. 1batt Ranger 83-84.
Do you believe the goat herders part?
@@BlyGuy not the book or movie version no, because in the captured video footage (insurgents had 2 cameras running through that fight), both of the "goat herders" are seen to have been scouts for the main body of pro-Taliban fighters. They followed the really obvious foot spore all the way up the mountain to the hide site from the air assault rope that was haphazardly ditched in a bush.
@@tmmccormick86 few questions. What is an air assault rope (like a fast rope?), why did they have this rope and most importantly, why did they have to stash it somewhere versus carrying it with them?
I've long felt Murphy, Dietz, Luttrell and Axelson were simply spotted or discovered by the Taliban and never believed the goat herders story. I'm no operator, but had that been me in the Hindu Kush and goat herders stumbled on my position, I'm tying them up and having them come with me, not letting them f*ck off to do as they want. If they become belligerent and start endangering me and my men, I'm quietly putting them to sleep permanently
In your opinion, was this just bad planning and leadership by Murphy? He was the team leader.
I actually saw the Taliban video depicting the aftermath showing Murphy's, Dietz's and Axelson's bodies for the first time around a week ago. Really sad and completely avoidable, but that's war.
@BlyGuy yes, the fast rope is the one I was referring to. It's supposed to be campflaged when dropped from the helicopter; flying off with it dangling isn't ideal, and it's a super heavy 2 or 3 inch diameter rope, so carrying it on foot isn't practical. It's most commonly buried, but the key is that it has to be hidden and they failed at that.
As for the "biggest sin," I think I could agree with a generally poor plan. They didn't coordinate with adjacent units, didn't have an adequate comms plan, didn't have an adequate number of team members, didn't inform the Special Operations Task Force of their mission, didn't request dedicated CAS.... the list of planning failures is extensive.
I don't necessarily like Monday morning quarterbacking, but they were supposed to be SOF operators at the top of their game and they made an ungodly number of mistakes.
As someone who's a life long history student, I agree that it's important to talk about all aspects of an event. However mundane, boring, or heroic, the good, the bad, and the ugly, should be told.
great point
I'm a big believer in the Harry Truman quote, The only thing new in this world is the history that you don't know.
I think everyone is entitled to their own story. The true story is on paper but there's nothing wrong with someone telling the good side the same as this guy is aloud to talk about the bad side.
Everyone tells their story differently some people fucus on the positive some people focus on negative and then there is always the real story in the middle. Unless it's a documentary I don't see a problem with anybody trying to capitalize on something they themselves lived through. Some people see the glass as half-empty some see half-full neither one are wrong.
That would make it a documentary and not a movie
Honesty is refreshing and needed. Mistakes are made and learned from. If you hide them then those mistakes are forgotten and will be made again costing lives.
❤❤ Well said... Show the good with the bad💯
The average age of SEALs is a lot younger than SF, and almost none of them have prior tactical experience before going into that career field. So, the issues they have with maturity and tactical blunders makes sense, but generally they are good dudes. I was a direct support guy that worked with SF, SEALs and the Rangers. The only negative experience I ever had was with SF... in combat, with them doing dumb shit tactically. Afterwards, they all thought they did a kick ass job and I only later realized that 8 of them were in combat for the first time when the CJSOTF commander flew in to give them their CIBs. It was a pretty minor TIC, but I felt like we could have taken more casualties because of the dumb decisions they were making, IMO. I found out YEARS later that one of the medics got a valor award. I was like WTF. I had a friend that was KIA on an SF op, that was pretty much entirely the det commander's fault, but none of that came out in public.
SF is definitely a more tactically proficient organization when it comes to infantry type shit and land combat, mission planning... probably anything but swimming, but I think they are horrible at policing their own guys. Most of the crazy disciplinary stuff that happens in SF never sees the light of day in public. The SEAL fuckups were just way higher profile and well known. SF is a much bigger organization, and I'd guess that per capita they have less blunders, but they are probably a lot better at keeping it quiet. SEALs will want to write a fucking book.
I'd also see SF getting just as butthurt, if not more, if any mistakes of theirs were publicized.
I literally got pissed when it ended. Thought TH-cam stopped it.
Look forward to seeing the full discussion.
appreciate the support!
@@FNGACADEMY where is the rest of it? O_o?
@@andrabook8758 th-cam.com/video/J6ApcYVbAf4/w-d-xo.htmlsi=anwZq3HjjOJgtW_d
A SF guy was asked to explain the difference between Seals and SF, and he gave the best answer I have heard. He said that the difference is a SF guy comes from ab infantry background and progresses from there to Ranger/Airborne/etc. Seals do not come from that level of background experience and that is the biggest difference. When you look at the mistakes, they have made it is because of being experienced in all aspects of warfighting.
There is a reason service guys are different and don’t always fit in. The world is a cruel Place to an honest man
Amen. There is a little or no place for honesty in the military.
Sadly @@johndeluna692
@@johndeluna692ain’t that the truth! Just look at what they did to Logan Melgar!
Thanks for mentioning Chappy.... The SEALS didn't want to admit they left a man behind. I believe it was the fog of war and an innocent mistake. They should have checked but they didn't. Slabinski screwed up. You are right, the AAR is a teaching tool to better the warrior and improve future ops.The fact that the Navy tried to stop the MOH for Chappy tells you a lot about the issues at DEVGRU.
It’s the Officers of these organizations that are playing politics with the MOH. It’s not the NCOs or the operators themselves that would block a MOH. None of those guys care about a medal or even have the powers or authorized to block a medal. This had to do with promotions and branding that Officers benefit from when their organization win significant accolades. It doesn’t have anything to do with DEVGRU.
@@joesgotya9930 You are correct about the operators... But in this case the senior leadership in DevGru was involved. They didn't want the team to look bad. Shit happens inn war, they were worried about their reputation. I realize Slabinski and the rest of the team guys had nothing to do with the MOH blocking that occurred.
@@afsoccommandothere was absolutely nothing innocent about this major fuckup MATE!!!
@@robertsettle2590 I am trying to give the benefit of doubt since I wasn't there. I think this was messed up from the word go. This mission should have been scrubbed before Roberts fell out of the helo. I met Chappy years ago before I got out. I am trying to be a better man then I was when I heard they left him sitting on top of the mountain without checking him and leaving him to die. I went through major stages of anger about it especially when the Navy made Slabinski a hero for that complete debacle. I could have chosen my words better but this is such an embarrassment to the SOF community it is hard to put into words. There have been many investigations into DEVGRU about questionable behavior and actions both on and off the battlefield. Sadly the investigations are internal so nothing is ever said/done. Hopefully they can right the ship now that the rotations have slowed down.
@@afsoccommandoslab lied and took credit for Chapmans actions. He never thought that the footage would get out, which is why the seal community/higher ups tried to stonewall the MOH for Chapman.
I am in no way SOF, but I agree. Looking at our screw-ups and dissecting them is how we learn. Learning from our mistakes makes us better and stronger as both an individual and as a team.
We all served, we should always and i mean always be able to call eachother out if shits jacked up. As long as its coming from a place of love and not someone being high and mighty. Its pretty damn easy to tell the difference too. No matter how high a level you are, mistakes happen, accepting them is a challenge.
i think the issue is when they're saying they want to tell the raw truth and then totally undermine themselves in the next second by cherry picking the facts they want to portray and discuss. That's not useful to anyone for anything. Like what was happening with the whole Gallagher controversy thingy.
@andrabook8758 I hear ya, it's a tricky situation.
@@FRANK45CASTLE i'm so glad you do. Now tell me which magical phrase do I need to use so that military people and veterans understand that mind-altering substances + fog of war = MORE fog of war = BAD! ... bc my attempts at explaining this concept so far don't seem to be landing.
(and yes this is a problem apparently for literally anyone in the military community and a lot of the vets in government too... somehow this equation is just not being understood)
@@FRANK45CASTLE i feel like I'm in a bizarre alternate reality, where everyone decide to 100% suspect logic and they're now officially their own "bad idea fairies"...
Yeah man, good stuff. I commented on Jay’s channel regarding operation anaconda. We lost 3 Ranger brothers during that. We have it in our creed to never leave a fallen comrade to fall in to the hands of the enemy. The truth hurts sometimes. Nothing against the Seals…some bad mo-fos…especially the ones that don’t talk about everything having to do with them being Seals.
I knew a retired CCT. He had some very strong opinions about SEALs in regards to MSGT Chapman. Glad you brought it up. There’s supposed to be a movie about MSGT Chapman and Battle of Robert’s Ridge coming out soon. I’m very interested to see how they depict what the SEALs did there.
I am looking forward to seeing your whole interview with Jay. I appreciate all you both are doing to keep bringing quality candidates to the Regiment.
The reality is that most of us in the SF & SOF Communities know what's up, and what likely went wrong with certain Operations. We talk about it amongst ourselves so we can learn from the mistakes. Often I hear SEALs getting really defensive about any one of us pointing out issues with Ops that involve them. Makes you wonder how much they actually learn from their own mistakes if they can't even acknowledge them. Smart Operators and their Teams never stop learning. Shout out to 3rd Group, I have a good friend there who helped set up their Spec Warfare Planning Detachment, who's aim is to apply what they've learned from both good and bad ops. Seems the SEALs could use one of those.
Honestly no body outside of Navspec really has a foot to stand on if they chose to criticize a special operations unit individually or as a whole. Unless they were directly involved with them. Thus guys critique has more to do about the seal perception on social media rather than negative outcomes of an operation. So it's natural that seals would get defensive when someone is out here trying to clout chase on a new you tube channel like this dude is. Ironically it's funny that you shout out 3rd group given their recent issues with Drugs and trafficking minors. So if we are going to hold dudes in other units Accountable let's have that discussion then. I bet this guy won't even bring up that shit show that's going on at Bragg with his old unit. You know what they day about people who throw stones that live in glass houses.
@@arighteousname5882 just imagine if all of Socom worked together 😆
Rest assured, the TEAMS are just fine. Learn from mistakes, just like you. There are just a lot fewer mistakes to learn from.... and usually the lessons learned dont get published to TH-cam. BZ
@@arighteousname5882 thanks for proving my point.
@@jonnieboyization a lot fewer mistakes.. Sure. Speaking of publications, do they teach personal publicity, book writing skills, and movie script writing at BUDS?
I'm sorry but Jay is BSing here. To premise I'm not US SOF, I'm former Australian SF and was fortunate enough to serve on exchange with 3SFG.
Jay's initial video criticised the SEALs for having a culture of "leaving guys behind". He made claims in the video that SEALs are essentially self-serving and don't have the backs of their team mates. The entire video was an Operator ranting about a personal issue with SEALs disguised as "I'm just being impartial and calling out what I see".
Jay even admitted in a later video that he wasn't aware of the details behind those operations, meaning he opened his mouth and went on an emotional rant without all the information. He's since removed the video and is making all sorts of misleading claims about it to cover his ass.
I'm not a fan of Jay and I'm not a fan of SEALs but I can understand why so many SEALs had an issue with this one. Jay is at best misleading in his claims here and at worse completely BSing. What he said wasn't calling out what he saw in an impartial "AAR" manner, it was a personal, emotional rant about an entire community with little fact or basis.
On my last deployment to Afghanistan the seals did leave a guy behind. Credit to that dude that got left. He E&E all the way back to base by himself at night. Our guys just happened to run into him and picked him up not far from base. Took him back to base. I never pressed to find out the details. I figured their chain of command would handle it. I felt bad for the guy.
@@randymerrill4877 I find that difficult to believe... for anybody to be knowingly left behind alive, without any follow up on a military operation is basically impossible. Even in the operations Jay mentions that didn't happen.
Operation Red Wings they made several attempts, the first they lost a CH-47 full of guys and the second they had guys heat CASing pushing up ridiculous, hardcore terrain. They weren't "abandoned".
Takur Ghar occurred *because* the SEALs were going back for one of their guys who fell from the chopper after an RPG strike. The second they touched down Chapman, who was support staff attached to the team not a shooter, charged off on his own without notifying the team, at night and under fire no less. The TL saw Chapman fall after being struck by fire in a gunfight, they then took more casualties and were combat ineffective so retreated a few hundred metres off the X. They believed Chapman was dead (with good reason) and didn't abandon the situation anyway, they withdrew and called QRF which was the right call in that scenario.
Never heard of somebody on operation being left behind and having to E&E solo back to base without any formal process involved, not in real-life anyway. For SEALs (or anybody for that matter) to simply RTB and forget about the suspiciously missing guy is pretty far-fetched.
As a USN aircrewman who crossed paths with SEALs at SERE and Air Wing training in Fallon, Nevada, I can say the professionals I served with in the 1980s have succumbed to a "Gone Hollywood" mentality unbecoming a Spec Ops group. In my interactions with fellow aviators from the Cold War, they too acknowledge the disappointing and unfortunate Behavioral change in current/former members of the Teams.
I’m a chief instructor here at Coronado. Trust me i see it everyday from these new young boys. Smh it’s annoying
@@bruhmanflightI blame Hollywood
Blame Hollywood and video games
Being held accountable in today's world barely exists anymore , everybody's so sensitive
As an Em then Officer in SF this stuff, good and bad needs to be reviewed. Not necessarily in public but amongst our own units. Rarely does an operation go so smoothly that there is no negative in the after action review. Only by putting the screw-ups out there, do you get better. The complexities are so great that some screw up or incident is inevitable. We in SF have always been know as the Quiet Professionals because we don't publicize our many operations worldwide. We do need to analyze our actions, both good and bad, but we need to continue as always to keep them in our own house. Media may be good for the SEALs but never for our SF!!!
No, it needs to go public. The public needs to know that the military the worship more than God has weird male on male sexual hazing going on. If you operate in secret, you're probably a bad person.
No he ran his mouth and badmouthed SEALs. He absolutely did. I’m an army guy and I was mad. So I know SEALs didn’t like it. It’s real easy to criticize an op sitting in chair or in a briefing room. But when you’re on an op and it goes south you do the best you can to mitigate it.
I agree. Instead on staying on the operation itself which he doesn't have all the facts, he trashed the SEAL community and leaving people behind. He knew his mouth overplayed his hands that he walked it backed in a later video. He messed up. He knows it.
The man is right to a degree, 100%, as a ex Brit veteran you have to touch on subjects that are brutal and don't wanna be heard but that's how you get better. SEALS sometimes have a reputation that they are superhuman gods and in the community however they probably get behind that hype and that rubs up other units the wrong way and of course those units gonna say something like "oh remember that operation...that one you screwed up on?" It happens I've been there.
However, airing it out in public probably isn't the best way to do it. Respect man
This is a collaboration that I’m glad to see. Thank you guys for working together for this project.
Thank you for having this conversation. I enjoy both your channels and have learned a lot from both of you. One issue that has bothered me for a long time involves what Chris Kyle wrote in his book, American Sniper, and how the SEAL community reacted to Jesse Ventura taking issue with what was written about him. I've listened to both sides of the story. I wasn't there, so I will never know for certain, but I do believe Jesse Ventura. It doesn't change the way I feel about Chris Kyle's service and his accomplishments, or the SEAL community. But when I heard Marcus Luttrell attack Jesse Ventura on a FOX news interview, that really bothered me. I like and respect Marcus, but I felt he was wrong. The entire community turned on Jesse, not because they cared about the truth, but because they liked Kyle more than they liked Ventura and they thought Kyle's reputation was being damaged. This kind of tribal behavior really bothers me because it is reflected in the American culture at large. People are willing to defend their own side 'no matter what', even when a member of their side was in the wrong. Again, thank you both for having these kinds of conversations and being so open about your experiences. Thank you for your service.
I’m Ukrainian SOF operator. Love your videos.
Stay safe, brother!
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What are the reasons for SEALS to fight? They cannot simply tell you because there is no conveyance that can accurately describe the meaning of how they feel and why they fight. The “art” is war. Valor, chaos, destruction, and death. SEALS act accordingly…
Buck and Jay, good to see together and not via zoom interviews.
We all know many operations have a bit of Hope & Luck, and when they dont stay together things can get gnarly or deadly. Ego drives a lot of missions to failure. Some missions just dont make sense even though we can say they must be done. Yeah but not with minimum people.
Much love to all of the community.
Respect All Fear None 💯
Shoutout to both of you guys for making these videos and talking about the hard shit. You can't better and improve if you consistently focus just on what you did good. Okay great, we did great. What can we do better? Break everything down. If people can't handle basic constructive criticism, then there's something wrong with them.
Sounds like someone is jealous of the SEALS getting all the attention.
They are.
I agree with the Team Sgt. With one difference. Just because a man is from a different branch or unit, at this point does not mean he cannot pull from the many mission’s in which some, partial or complete mission failure occurred.
It how lessons learned are passed on in hopes our son’s do not make the same ones.
It only requires maturity and desire to better out forces at all levels in preparedness. The maturity and professionalism needed in such men is still lacking in some men who have not grown past ego and pride and self awareness. This is about something bigger in my opinion. I appreciate such honest talks.
I would add that if you read “Alone at Dawn” you can see exactly the point being made in this video. And also make up your own mind as to the relevance of such talks
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That any of these things are publicized still rubs me wrong. As a former Army dude from the Cold War.
Also understand that the times have changed. In how operational details are classified and disseminated.
Too many glory hounds coming from all of the different SOF
components. There are many views in this topic. That are generating constructive conversations such as this one.
Thanks for the awesome content👍
Outstanding.. It's good you are telling the whole story. It's ALL about accountability and doing the right thing..