I always find it funny when people say autistic people have no empathy. Like, for gods sake, I get upset if my stuffed animals are squished together or moved from their spots
@@Forestnymph205 For me, it is paralyzing, and it causes my reaction to be delayed. It's like I can immediately, and without much pondering, see what is going on with other people's emotional states. It's a lot, and I shut down because of it.
@@Forestnymph205 So true. I can't go to antique or thrift stores without an overwhelming feeling of sadness for the items left behind. Toys, tools, spoons..it doesn't matter what. Then, I can't help but wonder about the people's lives, possibly gone at that point, and how they must be missed. (Note: I find myself drawing parallels to my own life as a kid with my grandparents, and thinking of the items I was surrounded by. Events trigger emotions that trigger memories triggering more emotions. It's inescapable). The levels of emotion that just happen during random shopping trips...... Forget about browsing the clearance aisle. 🙁
I have a plushie that I received as a gift when I graduated PRESCHOOL and when I cut the tag off because there was almost nothing left of it, my heart was pounding and my hands were shaking. If i lost that little guy, it would literally be life altering
@@LilChuunosuke Gods I can relate, not spesifically on the tag part (for me it always felt like they were less of an item and more like a friend when they had their tag cut of) but YES. I have 37 little friends all sitting above my bed all with names and different relationships with each other. These have not changed since I got them. One dog in particular I have had since I was two years old and have slept with almost every night for decades. I can't imagine what I would do if I lost her
"Joe Rogan, former satanist and sellout political commenter for some suspicious group, says that an autist would explode him using a grenade if there were no repercussions". Yes, he is right. 😀
@@kingofnoobs9728 - This is a lacking. We always chose what matters to us and Joe shows that Autistic people and their existence does not matter to him unless they are in a position of power and Authority, in which his only worry is their qualifications and emotional abilities. I know that Joe understands and feels empathy. He lacks it for Autistic people.
Same also. Took me years and years to realize this was going on. Typically blamed myself when i finally had to "ghost" people. Idk how devastating the impact on my physical and mental health was until recently.
@Benjamin-y5b-d4x riiiight. Well at least we know how to spell the word in question. It's empathy, not apathy, you goofy troll. Apathy means the opposite. A self-report maybe? A Freudian slip perhaps?
I know what you mean. I don't expect people to know but I do expect people not to talk about it when they haven't so much as Googled for a few minutes!
To be fair, I had a SPIN in psychology from age 12 to 41 without even knowing whether I was “a bit Aspie” or “a bit autistic”, but figured I was one of those but whatever… 😬
The fact that autistic people have explained time and time again 'no, we do not lack empathy' and neurotypical people just keep saying that we don't is so, so dehumanising. As if we're not alienated enough! :(
@@ryno_8848Yes. Perhaps it’s because they don’t understand that we don’t always express our emotions in our facial expressions and body language, they default to what they would be feeling if they were to be doing the same and assume we are not feeling anything.
I believe what they mean is “They don’t show the same outward signs of feeling upset in the same situations where I feel upset.”. In other words, they can’t TELL that we experience empathy. Not sure how to address this, as they are also used to lying and being lied to in order to pretend to be better people than they and others around them are. 🫤
In my opinion, the fact that Oppenheimer had a deep regret for his invention and became a fierce critic of nuclear weapons showed that he was deeply emphatic, and cared deeply about people and the humanily as a whole.
I'm an autist myself and honestly, there are times where I get frozen due to 'over empathy' if that's a thing. I really wish these damaging stereotypes would die.
oh its a thing. i get so overwhelmed by feeling the uncontrolled emotions others blast into the environment that i shut down and stop exhibiting emotions at all just for some relief, the appearance of which is probably where the stereotype comes from.
Honestly, while the majority of autistics I've spoken to struggle with hyper empathy, I've spoken to a few autistics who *do* struggle with empathy, especially affective empathy, but they do compensate for it with sympathy and compassion, logically analyzing the emotions of their loved ones, digging in their mind for memories of similar experiences and previously recieved instructions for how to respond to those types of emotional responses. Even those autistics, in my experience, put more effort into being kind to others than many NTs do. They do their best to compensate for their different neurology to be kind. Wheras I find when NTs struggle to feel empathy to another person, they place fault on that individual instead of putting in that extra effort to bridge the gap. If it doesn't come easy to them, they assume there is a reason why.
Saying autistic people don’t have empathy is straight up bullying, so it is very ironic of them! Bullies put no effort into empathy, yet autistics generally do - and in spades like you say!
I'm newly diagnosed with AuDHD (female, 50) just wanted to express how wonderfully you explain these things. I'm at a stage where I'm absorbing as much helpful information as I can, there's a lot of catching up to do. 😅 Thanks very much for all you do!
Welcome to the officially diagnosed over 50 club. It's becoming less and less exclusive with each one of us that get discovered. I was diagnosed a few months ago. I am 56.
@@carriemeredith Welcome!! I am only slightly ahead of you by a few months, with my AuDHD diagnosis (and I'll be 53 in a few weeks). There is so much to learn, so much that clicks as we reflect on our lives and past experiences, and hopefully we will have better roads ahead! ❤️
I'm a formerly "gifted" female who burnt out young just going through a break up with my also likely ASC partner and will be turning 50 this year. I only recently understood that I have been masking. It's nice to understand that I'm not as morally deficient as the NT world has projected on me despite trying. so. darn. hard... I've really been enjoying this channel and having a place to just chill out and feel understood for a moment as I get through these particular days. Nice to see other ladies out here having some epiphanies too. Warmth to all us ND GenX ladies finding ourselves!!
Welcome to the club! We are so happy to have you here with us. I'm glad you've finally found the answers to your struggles. If you ever have questions or need help on your journey, don't hesitate to reach out. ❤
I’m able to empathise with Joe Rogan. I don’t agree with the viewpoints he has but being trauma informed helps in understanding why he is the way he is. I believe there are multiple facets that affect his personality and points of view and most of them have been out of his own control. Ultimately, no child is born with bad intent, these things happen along they way (and should not). So… I do empathise with him in a sense. This does not mean I agree with his viewpoints.
Autism isn't a lack of empathy. It's shutting down emotions due to hyper empathy. The reason you can't keep eye contact is because you can feel what others do, and it's overwhelming.
Autism is having a different neurotransmitter map. It could mean little to no empathy, overwhelmingly high levels of empathy, expressing it differently, or completely unaffected empathy. However, the complexity of empathy means that autism will affect it in some way.
@theironfox2756 Autism is just lack of neuronal pruning combined with genes that are usually linked to genius, so you forge more efficient neuronal pathways. Lack of neuronal pruning turns a blessing into a disability.
Empathy is an emotion, how can you feel empathy if your emotions are surpressed, what you said doesnt make sense. Someone in self preservation is only thinking of themselves
Absolutely! If someone is being overly reactive and emotionally charged, i get easily overwhelmed and i shut down due to alexithymia- which I can see how would be viewed as no empathy from an outsider. What you witness is only the surface response, not the reason. It's overwhelm without added context for the outside observer. If empathy is impossible for someone, the masking would not be a thing for them, either.
When the Elizabeth Fritzl case hit the news I didn't get a good nights sleep for about 3 weeks. I just kept imagining what she went through and cried night after night. I really stopped functioning through those 3 weeks, it was there at the back of my mind all day, took over my mind when I was trying to get to sleep and when I slept I dreamt about it. Like I always do in these kinds of cases, I also try to imagine what I would have done in the same situation. (Is this where people say autistic people bring things back to them?). I tried imagining ways she/I could have escaped, even in my sleep. Same thing with the Idaho college students' murder case. I have learned to stay away from real life crime stories, my emotions swamp my life and make it impossible for me to function normally. I stopped going on Facebook completely when my feed was inundated with animal cruelty images; they know I love animals and so feed me those stories/images. The people trying to raise money think the best way to get money to help their cause is to show graphic images of animals cruelty. That doesn't work with me; it just makes me sad and angry, especially with the people trying to force the imagery on me to raise money - once I see the image, I can't unsee it. I remember one morning a particular graphic image was stuck in my mind and I cried all the way to work. I refuse to give money to people who fundraise in this way. I find TH-cam does this to some extent (the first ads in this very video where of animals suffering) but it's not as bad as Facebook and I zone out until I can press the 'skip' button on those ads.
I was working in healthcare for 10 years before I was diagnosed. I very much feel hyperempathy, however I had to learn how to show it to who I since learned were the majority of people, allistics. I recall receiving feedback in my first hospital rotation that I was not showing empathy. I was nearly kicked out of the program! The clinical instructor also suggested that I have some sort of mental problems and that she was impressed at my ability to not get mad at her, as she had had that happen before (shocking, I know). Add onto that I was having so many executive functioning struggles and was not bonding with the majority of my classmates. In that rotation, we were required to drive together. Only one solitary student ever wanted to drive with me. We still keep in touch. I have tried to continue my education with post-graduate programs. At this point I have two unfinished programs that I really want to complete, but the reality is that the educational system has a long way to go to understand how different we are AND that it is okay to be how we are! I may need to have a lighter patient load now that I spend the majority of my time caring for my neurodivergent children, one of which has higher support needs than me, and because hyperempathy is so draining, but the patient population that I have served very much benefits from having someone like me in my role and that is the work that I find rewarding (in addition to hobbies). Fantastic work debunking misinformation Mike 👍🏼
One of the hardest things for me in reading the diagnostic report from my assessment was that the neuropsychologist that diagnosed me said I did not show emotion on my face, and that I reported far more empathy than I was showing. This is common for autistics. I have a theory. We are feeling things so deeply, processing those emotions, that all of our energy goes into that processing. It makes us look like we are blank on the surface, when underneath we're feeling things far more than allistics do. It is why perhaps some of us have meltdowns, because people do not see what we're feeling on the surface and by the time we can express it we're exploding. It appears like our meltdowns come out of nowhere, there's no warning. But that's just because we aren't showing what we feel. I don't think it is autistic people have have trouble with empathy. I think it is allistic people who do not pick up on how we feel, if we do not mirror emotion the way that they believe we should feel it then it is assumed we don't feel at all. I think back on my mom, who I suspect was autistic. She was assumed to be aloof by everyone. Hard to know, did not show emotion. But I could always tell how she was feeling. I never saw her as having no emotions. For me her face was full of emotion. I also can tell what other people are feeling, and I try to attend to them, though. I am very empathetic to others, but they haven't ways gave that gift back to me.
@@karenholmes6565+ It’s because neurotypicals only care about presentation. There’s a reason why so many project after adopting sociopathic tendencies.
@@karenholmes6565 The key to understanding neurotypical behaviour is to be aware that the bigger part of nonverbal communication four us is happening subconsciously. We are generally not aware of the little mirroring dance we do and also not of how first impressions of people are shaped by how well our opposite figure performs in this dance. This stuff is learned at an age where even language aquisition is a mere parroting process. It doesn't usually involve active thinking. So yes, we do not get you, and unless you point out your personal "manual" to us, we cannot perceive how you feel. Not just because you fall out of our frame of reference, but because we generally aren't even aware that we have a frame of reference we judge your atypical reactions by. We just feel you are odd.
@@Volkbrecht Most of my deficits are not with social communication. The doctor who diagnosed me said that people who are as high masking as I am blend in very well. She only picked up on it because she specializes in diagnosing high masking adult women. I have a couple of degrees. I've often been put in leadership positions, spoken at conferences, designed research groups, etc etc. I come off as someone who is a perfectionist, people never really get to know me. I don't think anyone has ever described me as "odd". There are probably people that you know that are autistic and they are unaware of their autism. i was 56 before I figured it out. And most of my awareness comes from the symptoms I have had since early childhood. There are three different domains of symptoms associated with a diagnosis of autism. Sensory issues, repetitive movement and routines, and social deficits. Most of my problems are with sensory issues. But I have symptoms in all three domains. We get misdiagnosed with PTSD, borderline personality disorder, chronic fatigue syndrome, autoimmune disease, bipolar. Sometimes we have these conditions on top of autism. I am going through a lot of trouble to write this to you because autism is such an individual experience. And we are really misunderstood. I think you should listen to us instead of assuming you have a handle on who we are because I can assure you that you really don't.
It's not the lack of comprehension from most people that gets me, it's the very detailed and thorough fantasy and confidence that they know what they're talking about when they're just talking out of their ass in a crowded elevator that's locked shut. Worse is that they really do think they're right and that their poor treatment is justified and needs to become even more hostile and sociopathic.
I've always experienced that it's sometimes hard to determine when non autistics are feeling affective empathy and can never tell whether or not their attempts of showing cognitive empathy is genuine or not since it's often seems forced as if it's all an act. Sometimes they seem to pretend to show cognitive empathy to just gaslight you instead when you don't respond the way they want you to respond. "If you don't adress the issue the way I consider is the correct way, it serves you right for feeling the way you are".
I think part of the problem stems from the meaning of empathy in psychology and in casual conversation. In psychology it mostly refers to perceiving another's state of mind. In casual conversation we often take empathy to also mean sympathy and compassion. There's strong empirical evidence that autistics have deficits in perceiving another's state of mind (see the Sally-Anne test), but no evidence that we lack compassion. When you feel overwhelming "empathy", that is actually sympathy. When you help that is compassion. Normal empathy includes perceiving the distress of a homeless person and ignoring that person.
I've been told - post diagnosis - that I couldn't be autistic because I have empathy. When I brought up the diagnosis the response was that they must have been wrong (because of course the random layman knows more than the expert informed by research...). Ironically, this same person has comnented that I would do better in relationships if I could just act more like "normal" people - engage in small talk, talk about football, just "chill out", etc.
Claiming someone has no empathy is the least empathic thing you can do. How does that even work I cant spin my mind around it. Its like neurotypicals look for signs of empathy in body and facial language, while its all inner workings, feelings and thoughs, which often are overwelming.
Yes, that is exactly what we do, because perception is generally how you tell things are there, autist or not. And let me ask the question the other way round: how would you even be capable of having any emphatic reaction if you couldn't somehow see or hear your fellow human expressing their emotion?
Same my friend was going through a horrible time and afterwards I was completely drained and felt a great sadness and fear for him. It took me a week or two to recover because I still felt it after we talked about it.
i have this delayed processing in very overwhelming situations (which i dont mind and im aware of in the moment) and in emotionally hurtful ones (unaware of it and often very confused). I would also consider not-knowing-what-you-actually-want in social situations part of that delayed processing
This sounds like alexithymia. Have you looked into that? It’s where you can’t recognise/describe what emotions you are feeling in the moment, but they will gradually percolate into consciousness over time. I have this. In one way it can be protective, but it also leads to struggling with confusion.
@@tracik1277 yes i have, thank you! I dont have a final answer on that topic, but right now, i feel like I can identify my feelings and bodily needs but just not too well in stressfull Moments. I do not struggle with realising i need to eat, Drink or go to the bathroom (but i ignore it Sometimes:D).
Thanks again Mike for another brilliant video🙂. I have been called som really mean and harmfull things by a family member around this subject. After I found out I vas autistic and then got my diagnosis, I am able to stand ups for my self and say against them and educate :)
THIS! Empathy, monotropism, different processing and expression Is life-changing content for both autistic people and friends/family/carers/partners! Keep up the good work Mike! I'd also like to highlight the point of autistic people not reciprocating empathetic response because we might be focusing on something else and it takes quite a while to transition and spend some effort on empathetic display in the way others can understand, despite the raw data might have been perceived instantly. My baby was just born not even 2 weeks ago and my feelings have been all over the place, this new autistic dad is having is brain wires crossed.
I have so much empathy that it's nearly incompacitating. I cry over dead animals on the road, children starving, people being murdered. I even feel sorry for unwanted items at goodwill. Why else would we be social justice fighters?
they claim we are not empathic because they cannot comprehend the true empathy we have. it's the same thing were people who know less about a subject are more confident about it than people who do know alot because their lack of knowledge prevents them from understanding how little they know.
Mike, a video about autistic love languages would be so timely! My wife and I were just talking last night about the differences we have in how affection is shown and perceived and the difficulties that each of us have.
I zone out constantly, dissociate often, meltdowns, breakdowns and other emotions are supressed until its safe to come back and feel stuff.. I often get "robotic" as you say, when a situation happens where i have to react, survival mode even, i do what is needed of me no matter how i feel and shove the feelings away untill later.
I have extensive experience with troubleshooting dissassociation. I have lived a life full of violent episodes (where I was the victim 99% of the time to be clear) trained in martial arts, had a few brushes with death, saw others die around me... my reaction has been to switch to a dissassociative utilitarian personality to deal with the urgent situation, then go back to myself after. That alternate version of me doesn't feel anxiety, hesitation or fear, it's all about goal-oriented tasks. Surprisingly it can also be quite adept socially, often defusing tension with humor. It's the after though, adrenaline shakes, dry heaving and tiredness... it kinda feels like sumoning a god and becoming its avatar only to burn out after.
I think it's fair to bring up that about 50% of us experience Alexithymia which CAN include low affective empathy and coldness as some of it's common traits. Of course not all, or even most Autistics are cold... but it's common enough I think it's worth taking seriously when they display concerns. That said, coldness isn't going to cause us to launch bombs with less caution... it's just likely going to result in a more utilitarian ethics.
@@Autistic_AFI experience alexithymia to varying degrees in different situations. I’d like to point out that it doesn’t mean you don’t feel, it means you don’t feel until later, so it’s a processing issue. I’m realising that in complex emotional scenarios, it can take me about 3 weeks to fully experience all the emotions pertinent to an event, and each emotion will ‘drop’ sequentially to be experienced and assessed separately. By which time it’s usually too late to explain myself or address the issue.
Studies have shown that neurotypicals are less efficient at conveying information verbally with other neurotypicals as autistics are with other autistics. Neurotypicals and autistics only somewhat comprehend one another, however.
From an autistic perspective it often feels like non autistic people lack empathy. In fact, it seems most autistic people are quite altruistic, putting the needs of others before their own, trying very hard not to upset other people, far more often and more strongly so than non autistic people do, and then the non autistic people don't even seem te realize this is happening, and/or often even taking advantage of it.
We’re a world of givers and takers. They just don’t want to admit they’d be the taker. “Maturing as a neurotypical means becoming selfless, maturing as an autistic person means becoming selfish.”
My husband is autistic. When i tell him about being sexually assaulted as a child, he is horrified that someone would do that to a child. When i tell allistic people, i get asked what i did to deserve it. Tell me autistic people don't have empathy and you'd be telling a lie.
There are many autistic people who relate to and fit the low-empathy stereotype of autism, and they are a decent chunk from how they've spoken out, but it's still not majority or even half, if observations are accurate. Many relate to having too much empathy. Some days the empathy is very much "I feel what you're feeling too much, so I'm now going to shut down to avoid the sad vibes you are soaking me with." or "You're so happy and sunshine-y that I am instantly in a good mood, thank you." Some days I am very much tired and burnt out and no longer have the capacity to FEEL empathy or care about certain things. I can still show compassion, consideration, and kindness despite not FEELING the empathy. The way I still remember key differences between empathy and similar things are: Empathy: I FEEL what you are feeling. Sympathy: I can understand how you feel, and/or have experienced that feeling. Compassion/warmth: I have no idea what you're going through, but I love you and I'm here for you and I care. Edit: oh yeah, meant to say, Joe makes it sound like he's describing a NARCISSISTIC SOCIOPATH and not an autistic person. autistic people may also have narcissistic personality disorder or may be a sociopath as well, but they are /separate/ disorders.
When I was growing up people kept trying to teach me empathy and I was confused because I already understood. Then I realized they were the ones without empathy.
It’s crazy to me that we need to teach other human beings about what empathy really is. What a crock. Edit: I hope your NT friend expressed concern for you behind the scenes bc it sounded, to me, like that would have been humiliating.
And yet here we are. I really dislike it when folks who have researchers/teams share misinformation about autism (especially when it's not even contraversial).
I think autistic people can really struggle with boundaries in terms of charity work, whether voluntary or paid, as the culture essentially encourages people to give all they can in terms of time, headspace and energy, and particularly in smaller charities. Although I've enjoyed the work in many ways, both voluntary and paid positions have caused me to burn out *really* easily. A great video - and I'm glad Rogan hardly features in it as I absolutely cannot stand the man! 😩
I have one issue with the double empathy problem: autism is an spectrum, and the problem is framed as if all neurotypicals communicated in one way and all authistic comunicated in another way. What if someone has sensory processing disorder and dysgraphia but communicates exactly as a neurotypical person? would that person be less skillful to interpret the other autistic persons?
Affective empathy. Thank You for making this video!!!! OMG you are spot on. I struggle constantly with utter exhaustion (ZPM depleted status) after absorbing my patients' stress and anxieties. So they go "ahhh I feel so much better, you totally get it, doc" and there I am on the precipice of burnout, needing to watch kittens on TH-cam until I fall asleep. Oh and BTW, medical doctor here with ADHD (on meds, need them!) and late diagnosed autism (reluctantly and after several burnouts). I am empathic (my patients know I care). Hence my autism was dismissed by clever psychiatrists in the past. Thank you loads for speaking about this.
I have autism, and I’m on the High empathy side of the spectrum. I have so much empathy that I struggle to express it, I’m compassionate and I try my best to be understanding. I feel empathy for not just humans, but animals, and plants too. Heck, years ago the pine tree that has been planted in front of my house since it was built got cut down, and I morned the tree, because it felt like a part of the house. When my cat died, I cried. I don’t understand why neurotypicals think we’re cold, heartless, robots. We have empathy, we just have so much of it that we struggle to express it.
*Some* autists may give the *impression* that they lack in individual empathy, but it is usually just that - an impression. But in my experience, autists can also have a "big picture empathy" that most neurotypical people (and certainly Joe Rogan) can barely conceive of.
hyperempathy is definitely something i struggle with...if i do too much empathizing it can actually result in me feeling resentful and annoyed with people for having negative emotions. people interpret that as a lack of empathy and in a way it is, but it happens when im not taking care of myself or setting boundaries. show me a neurotypical person whos never failed to empathize with someone, especially with the double empathy thing.
I am so like this. I am very easily grossed out, can't stand the sight of blood. But when a child is injured, I go into a mode where I am extremely competent and quickly deal with the situation. Only later, I break down, shaking all over and sobbing. Thanks for this, I thought it was just me.
I spent decades giving so much of myself that I’m permanently burnt out. It wasn’t worth it. When you’re used up, they throw you away. Guard yourself, be kind, have compassion, but guard yourself.
We really can have such a high degree of empathy at times others can't even understand it. A friend has a cute little dog, and everyone loves to pick him up. I never pick him up. People might assume I don't like the dog. Actually, I am trying to establish trust with him by not swooping in and depriving him of his sense of agency. There are loads of things like this that happen where I am acting differently from how people expect, and it can easily lead to misunderstandings.
That is the main issue with everything... society has a perspective because of what [false] information that they have been fed. I don't know how we really fix that because most people aren't looking for the truth on these things.
Thank you so much for explaining hyperempathy and emotional empathy. I've been finding out a lot about empathy lately, and this helps me put into terms the things I've been going through. In the last year or so I've experienced hyperempathy more times and more strongly than the entire rest of my life, and I've found it a strange mix of draining and encouraging.
and on another point no one is thinking about: why would you need empathy to be upset about the use of nuclear bombs? Even the most self centered person probably understands the idea of “destroy the world? but I live there!”
If you dig a little deeper, you would find out that "Empathy" is very misunderstood concept and that you are fighting with someone that don't understand what he said. Empathy - "the ability to understand and share the feelings of another." Nothing stop a person for torturing someone, even while they share and understand how it feels... Empathy is just the ability to look at a snail and KNOW if you step on it that would not be a nice experience for the snail. Knowing that the snail is not going to be happy because someone steps on it, is not the same as deciding if you should step on it or not. It doesn't even prevent anyone normal from not stepping on the snail at all. (Just as I know posting this comment isn't going to make your day) What stop us from stepping on the snail is a completely different concept. If I can "dehumanize" the snail (as we naturally do as humans), most people will be able to step on the snail and only be bothered about what it does to our shoes, not what it did to the snail. Same brain structure is used by dehumanizing other humans, so you can harm them. If I can twist my mindset to say make someone evil, then it's okay for me to harm them, even while my empathy still tell me they won't like it, because now the goal is to make them not like it, because they DESERVES to not like it, so I can twist doing bad things to them as being a good thing.
Yes a video about autistic love language please. I also have the delayed emotions, in crisis I will just act (and very well, a lot lot more efficiently than I usually do), then later, I will totally break down and cry. So you're not alone ^^
Your points about going into "go-and-fix" mode hit the nail on the head, and i never thought about it. I am a firefighter and have recently been diagnosed at age 26, and now the department i work for is trying to get rid of me since finding out about this diagnosis, rhe kicker is, i have always been seen as someone who is really good at what i do, and i ascribe this to the set of charactaristic the autism has given me. Calm in stressfull situations since i know what i have ro do, great at reminding protocols but can divert from them if need be, remembering routes in and out of buildings, and not to mention the broad knowledgebase i have in so much subjects😂😅 Its crazy to me how someone in a office just reads the word autistic and just decides that everything i have proven to be must not be true, these stereotypes are indeed very harmfull
Yes yes, the non autistic label us as narcissistic sociopaths becuase understanding what you have 'othered' is too much to ask for. Guess I'll watch the video now, then the podcast Joe said this in, and still have people tell me I didn't understand.
Empathy, definitely a misunderstood emotion by may people. Thank you for taking the time to explain this... this video should be rolled out for all in the film and TV industry, help change the views of Autistic Empathy. Excellent video as ever Mike! Kitties say hi all. 😊
Myself, and ither that I know/other autistic people in my family are all Hyper empathetic. Its honestly so exhausting. I wish I could give it to some of the NTs who are obviously lacking empathy. Of just... Critical thinking skills and the ability to use google... Wait wait wait.. Oppenheimer was sociopathic?? At least according to the movie. There was a whole section where he was struggling with the the images of what happend... What the *government* did. Not what he did. Hes a scientist, he did his job. And it was used in horrible ways.. and he seemed to emotionally struggle with it. He also struggled over death? Wtf 😂 Also, im right there with you. I also go into troubleshooting mode... And I don't think people tend to appreciate it 😅 But thats also... Ine of the ways I express that I care? Its unfortunate
Great video...I'm "automatically" (lol) inclined to address everything you have just said in complete agreement, but will limit my comment to one example . (For Joe Rogan, in case he's reading this - I wouldn't want to blow his mind with the knowledge of my capacity to feel). Someone once said that a parent is (or may be) only as happy as her saddest child. As a late diagnosed autistic mother myself, I now feel that in my bones. Just using my daughters as my example; if I know, or even FEEL, that they are sad, anxious, confused, angry, or maybe acting sketchy for some reason, it affects me deeply. If I had been lucky enough to be in a great mood, then sense something is off with them, whether they tell me or not, my emotions tank, my plans change, and I often can't function normally. I end up riding their waves and helping them through when they need me. I was never a helicopter Mom, don't misunderstand, it's simply that their feelings will always override my own. Mind you, they are adults!! That's just the tip of my autistic iceberg regarding my ability to experience my, and others' emotions. So, Joe can shove my battery pack up his....!!!
Can’t really blame Rogan, even though I don’t particularly like his lack of critical thinking. Not long ago, this hypothesis was pretty much accepted among autism researchers.
Strange... the most emotional sensitive people i know are autistic. I am autistic, i got no problems to identify emotions in others. To even look through their "masks" and see the underlying emotions. Where is actually struggle is, how to react to it without "running" em over. I mean, if i react directly, i might jump into a comfort zone of someone else without beeing welcome in it. I might have no right to give an advice about their feelings uninvited.
The times I've quickly taken control of a situation and prevented extra harm due to everything but logic and ability to completely focus have kicked in in an emergency... And the times I've gotten crap afterwards for being "a cold herring" as we say here. Example: I was 18 and we were out with our scout group, checking out some spots for next Summer's competition. It was mid-January, and the temp was around -20°C and snow was up to knees or higher. So, it was 4 of us 18 year olds, and two who were closer to 30 (other was our scout group leader, and the other was one of the most experienced outdoorsmen in our whole troop. We had progressed about 2-3 km when our group leaders realized he forgot his spare film roll to base camp (it was late 90's, when cameras used actual film). It was important to get our job done, so he told the rest of us to wait and sprinted off back where we came from. So we waited to close for an hour there, and then we came to the conclusion that things were not right. The other older person told us to back track into base camp and hold tight. He went ahead and left the unnecessary gear with us. So we hauled the stuff on our backs, and made our way back to camp. Two of the guys started panicking that our group leader was going to freeze to death, and that we need to run to the closest farmhouse to call for help. I told them that it wouldn't achieve anything because he hadn't been lost long enough (I'm a son of a fireman, you see), and we would be much more useful prepping the camp ready to warm people up externally and internally (this is the crisis-mode going), as all the running and exercise must've made both older guys sweaty and that'd turn cold pretty fast. The two flapping guys raged at me and sprinted off along the road (thankfully). So it was me and my best friend. I started looking for first aid stuff to prep, and told my friend to check the ashes of last night's large-ish bonfire (,we had slept out,) for embers. When I got back with the first aid kit, he had found a few hot embers, so I used them to quickly start a new fire and put some water to boil with coffee, tea and juice to mix with it, which ever they'd prefer. Just as the water started to boil both the older guys emerged from the forest. Our group leader was supported by the other. Both were cold af. Our group leader had tried to make a fire, but at that point was so chiled, the only thing he managed, was to cut his numb fingers trying to make tinder. So my friend gave them hot beverages as they sat down by the fire, and I treated the wounds. The other two guys came back almost an hour later and told the emergency services had told them that they'd need to wait for two more hours. It really damaged my friendship with them. For some weird reason, they said my behaviour made me unreliable if they'd need help at some point in the future (and that I was a cold uncaring herring). I just logged it under "trauma-related behaviour", so I had no issue with them. I just... I don't get it.
@@angustheterrible3149 then you can't put yourself in the animals situation. it is totally wrong. just because we have done it for years, does not mean it is ok. But it's ok that you feel or think that way. many people lack compassion for animals unfourtantally. people torture animals for food. it's murder and there is no such thing as humane slaughter. it's wrong.
Yessssssssssssss sometimes I wanna be in a social group and just be there without necessarily engaging in conversation. I feel a part of what’s going on and probably enjoy myself very much without necessarily looking like I’m paying my attention at all. It really bothers me when people feel the need to try to draw me in to the action 😖 and I find myself having to mask so that they’re not uncomfortable. (I understand that if I’m staring off and have a blank facial expression, they may think I’m upset - esp because I’m not always like that.) But it’s so hard. Sometimes I just wanna be quiet. And I don’t feel comfortable explaining it, because I don’t have an official autism diagnosis 😩 and I’m so functional they would never believe me.
Yea, during the delayed processsing session, I do dissociate a lot. There becomes a weird “video game” or POV perspective of my own experience. It feels a lot more like I’m a pilot moving things around continuously, like I’m an engineer just trying to brute force my way through a situation and t trying to “fix” whatever needs “solving” and I’ll frame things In my mind a that way. That section about “piloting meat bags” really resonated with me
Sam Harris has done the same thing a few times. In an otherwise pretty spot on critique of Ayn Rand, Harris refers to Objectivism as "autism rebranded" and, in another article, says that pure utilitarian ethics lead to "the sort of body count ethics only someone with aspergers syndrome could adopt"
@Autistic_AF I emailed him challenging his use of lazy stereotypes, but never got a response. It's ironic because a lot of the stereotypes of autistic people are pretty similar to stereotypes of atheists.
8:05 one thing kind of wacky I can recount my childhood and this delayed emotional response is something I do, but not that delayed, and it didnt always happen. In fact I can recall the exact day it started, I was in a situation where I was sure I was going to break down right then and there... but it didnt happen. It didnt even feel hard to keep it in. I felt "fine" in the sense that I wasnt having a breakdown. Low and behold as soon as I get home from school it all breaks loose. And it hasnt always been that way, particularly if im already at home, but since it has been the case that I can maintain self control for break downs when in public. And then I of course, let myself let it all out soon as I can.
for me, i have to carefully stay away from certain types of news stories. suicides, plane accidents, child deaths....i can't take it and it will put me down for a solid week unless i do something with it [usually by creating a short story or the like] i've always found it strange that other people were able to talk about those stories, declare, "that's so sad," but then get on with their day even if they knew the details. in turn, people will sometimes think i'm not caring because i'll shut down talking about those stories once i've learned a certain amount of details or i start to sense that i won't be able to handle the emotional burden much longer. this was an excellent video, thanks! i'm sure we all want to hear about penguin pebbling 'cause penguins are awesome! :)
I like the definition of empathy where it's the ability to appropriately balance recognizing yourself in the other's experience and keeping a distance to respect their experience is different than yours. For example, a person might not have sensory issues themselves, and will find it harder to relate to someone having sensory issues, but, everyone has a moment in their lives where they are subjected to distressing sensory experiences. Empathy would be using the similar experience to relate, without projecting your own experience on the other, recognizing that their experience is different even if there are similarities. That's the gist of it, I read this concept of empathy in Collen's (2023) paper, titled "Towards a Clear and Fair Conceptualization of Empathy"
As someone who grew up in more than one culture, a lot of these issues come up in cross-cultural encounters. I would say that for any person, jumping to conclusions about the reasons for someone's demeanor or behavior is not a good idea. It happens. I do it myself. But it's helpful to be able to catch ourselves - either on our own or if someone openly points out our assumption - and take more time to understand the perspective of others. I think this is a problem across many societies when exposed to norms and behaviors they are less (or not at all) familiar with. I don't think that neurotypical people are automatically rude, or that autistic people are automatically polite, so I don't want to generalize in the reverse direction as a compensation. But mutual consideration is a good starting point in any human interaction.
Great assessment of a very frustrating misconception too many obviously still have. I relate very much to the idea of taking on the feelings of others. I don't even have to know them personally. I feel it in watching or reading something, or being in the same room, and it just becomes a part of me. However therein, the quietness tends to set in as I process it all. I feel as if always in a state of process, actually.
Yes! I have piloted my meat suit - in a couple of life saving crisis, and bad accidents. One time, I had jumped up, got a clean tea towel to bind my friends wound, grabbed my keys, and turned around to find no one else had moved. They were frozen with their mouths open.
Wow. Once, I somehow leaped across the length of a room to save a toddler from reaching for a boiling hot cup of coffee on the edge of a table. I just lifted to cup up out the way and it spilled down my arm, but I must have had so much adrenaline it didn’t hurt or scald me even though it should have done. The woman whose child it was said “Gosh you’re fast!” But I have no idea how I did it. One second I was sitting down, the next I was on the other side of the room. It was like I did it in one leap.
When I first watched the movie Zathura at eight years old, I started crying because a pillow got shot by a meteorite which caused it to make a squeaking sound, and I thought that meant that it was crying before it died horribly.
5:05 YES! I have too much compassionate empathy that I also ended up dysfunctional. I was so worried about climate change and stuff that I felt insane guilt whenever using "too much water at the shower and since I already had difficulties in this area it was impossible to function
Practical knowledge of algorithms: The case of BreadTube, Cotter (2022) This article discusses what I might describe as a mass synchonised monotropism, holding a specific emotional grouping of compassion and empathy to cultivate the youtube algorithm to select for those emotions. It was a strange time, I held it for 5 years feeling like I was possessed and really needed to do it. It was about the time that article was produced I was able relax...the whole time it felt like an emotional superposition of extreme rage and a desire not to let it overwhelm the good left. My amygdala feels spent, ended up taking a redundancy from my chemist role not long after.
We have low empathy, not zero empathy, we can be rude and struggle to understand other people and ignore certain minor social norms, but we care for others.
For my part, I have a terrible problem with social activists filling the empty blanks of my autism with the presumptions of their activism. I'm a 69 year-old retired software engineer, heterosexual, cissexual, white male. Activists are often on a mission to "ferret out, expose, and confront bigotry," but I miss the non-verbal part of their probing and appear to ignore them. Then, via "confirmation bias," they start filling the blanks of my autism with what they see as "confirmations of deep-seated bigotry."
Is there an extreme opposite of monotropism? I often can't focus properly on something unless I'm also focusing on something else as well. This leads to some pretty insane multi tasking. Like simultaneously watching TV playing a game and reading all at once.
I think people so often confuse emotional empathy with cognitive empathy. The struggle or even lack of cognitive empathy is fairly prevalent in autistic people. When individuals hear "lack empathy" their first connection they make to that is "they don't know what other's are feeling and do not care" and it's simply not true obviously. Cognitive empathy is different from emotional empathy. Often times, autistic people will display an increase in emotional empathy. Personally, I can't stand to see a child lose their toys or see people who've had their teeth knocked out. I will and have cried at both of these. Which in itself is considered "not normal". Now, what is actually meant and is far more accurate, is that autistic people will often struggle more with cognitive empathy. The understanding of WHY someone feels the way they do. My mom said that as a child I hated upsetting people and while I might have understood that I upset them, I rarely understood why. Even now, I struggle immensely with understanding why certain things I do might hurt someone. Not because I don't care. I just can't make that connection. And that is a struggle with cognitive empathy. It does not mean a lack or even so much as an irregularity in emotional empathy, which I find sad that so many seem to struggle to comprehend.
I always find it funny when people say autistic people have no empathy. Like, for gods sake, I get upset if my stuffed animals are squished together or moved from their spots
@@Forestnymph205 YES!! 😢 🧡🧡
@@Forestnymph205 For me, it is paralyzing, and it causes my reaction to be delayed. It's like I can immediately, and without much pondering, see what is going on with other people's emotional states. It's a lot, and I shut down because of it.
@@Forestnymph205 So true. I can't go to antique or thrift stores without an overwhelming feeling of sadness for the items left behind. Toys, tools, spoons..it doesn't matter what. Then, I can't help but wonder about the people's lives, possibly gone at that point, and how they must be missed. (Note: I find myself drawing parallels to my own life as a kid with my grandparents, and thinking of the items I was surrounded by. Events trigger emotions that trigger memories triggering more emotions. It's inescapable). The levels of emotion that just happen during random shopping trips...... Forget about browsing the clearance aisle. 🙁
I have a plushie that I received as a gift when I graduated PRESCHOOL and when I cut the tag off because there was almost nothing left of it, my heart was pounding and my hands were shaking.
If i lost that little guy, it would literally be life altering
@@LilChuunosuke Gods I can relate, not spesifically on the tag part (for me it always felt like they were less of an item and more like a friend when they had their tag cut of) but YES. I have 37 little friends all sitting above my bed all with names and different relationships with each other. These have not changed since I got them. One dog in particular I have had since I was two years old and have slept with almost every night for decades. I can't imagine what I would do if I lost her
Saying autistic people don’t have empathy shows a distinct lack of empathy. Oh the irony.
"Joe Rogan, former satanist and sellout political commenter for some suspicious group, says that an autist would explode him using a grenade if there were no repercussions". Yes, he is right. 😀
Aye, it's like a game of Hot Potato.
@@harrietwindebank6051 I'd say it shows more of a distinct lack of research done into the subject on his part
@@kingofnoobs9728 - This is a lacking.
We always chose what matters to us and Joe shows that Autistic people and their existence does not matter to him unless they are in a position of power and Authority, in which his only worry is their qualifications and emotional abilities.
I know that Joe understands and feels empathy.
He lacks it for Autistic people.
@@harrietwindebank6051 came here to say exactly that
i have wayyyy too much empathy in reality - so much so that i often get overwhelmed by others
🧡
@kalonakitu same. Sometimes it derailes my whole week.
Me too.
Same also. Took me years and years to realize this was going on. Typically blamed myself when i finally had to "ghost" people. Idk how devastating the impact on my physical and mental health was until recently.
@Benjamin-y5b-d4x riiiight. Well at least we know how to spell the word in question. It's empathy, not apathy, you goofy troll. Apathy means the opposite. A self-report maybe? A Freudian slip perhaps?
I get really put off by people who don't even know the basic definition of Autism... 😖
I know what you mean. I don't expect people to know but I do expect people not to talk about it when they haven't so much as Googled for a few minutes!
@@Autistic_AFOr can’t remember what they claimed to have read a month ago.
@@AspieADog Absolutely. I hear you. ❤️
To be fair, I had a SPIN in psychology from age 12 to 41 without even knowing whether I was “a bit Aspie” or “a bit autistic”, but figured I was one of those but whatever… 😬
How come? Do you know the basic definition of borderline personality disorder?
The fact that autistic people have explained time and time again 'no, we do not lack empathy' and neurotypical people just keep saying that we don't is so, so dehumanising. As if we're not alienated enough! :(
It's really rude :(
If anything, it’s just them self projecting a lot of NT’s lack empathy.
@@Autistic_AFit’s not just rude it’s insulting.
@@ryno_8848Yes. Perhaps it’s because they don’t understand that we don’t always express our emotions in our facial expressions and body language, they default to what they would be feeling if they were to be doing the same and assume we are not feeling anything.
I believe what they mean is “They don’t show the same outward signs of feeling upset in the same situations where I feel upset.”. In other words, they can’t TELL that we experience empathy. Not sure how to address this, as they are also used to lying and being lied to in order to pretend to be better people than they and others around them are. 🫤
In my opinion, the fact that Oppenheimer had a deep regret for his invention and became a fierce critic of nuclear weapons showed that he was deeply emphatic, and cared deeply about people and the humanily as a whole.
I'm an autist myself and honestly, there are times where I get frozen due to 'over empathy' if that's a thing. I really wish these damaging stereotypes would die.
oh its a thing. i get so overwhelmed by feeling the uncontrolled emotions others blast into the environment that i shut down and stop exhibiting emotions at all just for some relief, the appearance of which is probably where the stereotype comes from.
Me literally constantly. I need to move out of the city because my empathy is going haywire here
I noticed people can filter and buffer the emotions of others.
People with autism don't really have that and get overloaded.
As an autist myself I don't care what normies think. I am fine with them being afraid, if it means they will leave me alone.
Honestly, while the majority of autistics I've spoken to struggle with hyper empathy, I've spoken to a few autistics who *do* struggle with empathy, especially affective empathy, but they do compensate for it with sympathy and compassion, logically analyzing the emotions of their loved ones, digging in their mind for memories of similar experiences and previously recieved instructions for how to respond to those types of emotional responses.
Even those autistics, in my experience, put more effort into being kind to others than many NTs do. They do their best to compensate for their different neurology to be kind. Wheras I find when NTs struggle to feel empathy to another person, they place fault on that individual instead of putting in that extra effort to bridge the gap. If it doesn't come easy to them, they assume there is a reason why.
Saying autistic people don’t have empathy is straight up bullying, so it is very ironic of them!
Bullies put no effort into empathy, yet autistics generally do - and in spades like you say!
I'm newly diagnosed with AuDHD (female, 50) just wanted to express how wonderfully you explain these things. I'm at a stage where I'm absorbing as much helpful information as I can, there's a lot of catching up to do. 😅 Thanks very much for all you do!
Welcome to the officially diagnosed over 50 club. It's becoming less and less exclusive with each one of us that get discovered. I was diagnosed a few months ago. I am 56.
@@carriemeredith Welcome!! I am only slightly ahead of you by a few months, with my AuDHD diagnosis (and I'll be 53 in a few weeks). There is so much to learn, so much that clicks as we reflect on our lives and past experiences, and hopefully we will have better roads ahead! ❤️
I'm a formerly "gifted" female who burnt out young just going through a break up with my also likely ASC partner and will be turning 50 this year. I only recently understood that I have been masking. It's nice to understand that I'm not as morally deficient as the NT world has projected on me despite trying. so. darn. hard... I've really been enjoying this channel and having a place to just chill out and feel understood for a moment as I get through these particular days. Nice to see other ladies out here having some epiphanies too. Warmth to all us ND GenX ladies finding ourselves!!
Welcome to the club! We are so happy to have you here with us. I'm glad you've finally found the answers to your struggles.
If you ever have questions or need help on your journey, don't hesitate to reach out. ❤
@@carriemeredith Hi and welcome to the club! I got my autism dx aged 45 and ADHD dx aged 50. 👋
The irony is I don't empathize with Joe.
It’s Joe who lacks empathy
I’m able to empathise with Joe Rogan. I don’t agree with the viewpoints he has but being trauma informed helps in understanding why he is the way he is. I believe there are multiple facets that affect his personality and points of view and most of them have been out of his own control.
Ultimately, no child is born with bad intent, these things happen along they way (and should not).
So… I do empathise with him in a sense.
This does not mean I agree with his viewpoints.
Joe Rogan lacks empathy!
I'm glad he hasn't got a boom button! 😅
Autism isn't a lack of empathy. It's shutting down emotions due to hyper empathy.
The reason you can't keep eye contact is because you can feel what others do, and it's overwhelming.
It's overwhelming. I can't look into people's eyes confortably... it is easy to look away while talking.
This is an astute observation 🧐
Autism is having a different neurotransmitter map. It could mean little to no empathy, overwhelmingly high levels of empathy, expressing it differently, or completely unaffected empathy. However, the complexity of empathy means that autism will affect it in some way.
@theironfox2756 Autism is just lack of neuronal pruning combined with genes that are usually linked to genius, so you forge more efficient neuronal pathways.
Lack of neuronal pruning turns a blessing into a disability.
Empathy is an emotion, how can you feel empathy if your emotions are surpressed, what you said doesnt make sense. Someone in self preservation is only thinking of themselves
Absolutely! If someone is being overly reactive and emotionally charged, i get easily overwhelmed and i shut down due to alexithymia- which I can see how would be viewed as no empathy from an outsider. What you witness is only the surface response, not the reason. It's overwhelm without added context for the outside observer. If empathy is impossible for someone, the masking would not be a thing for them, either.
When the Elizabeth Fritzl case hit the news I didn't get a good nights sleep for about 3 weeks. I just kept imagining what she went through and cried night after night. I really stopped functioning through those 3 weeks, it was there at the back of my mind all day, took over my mind when I was trying to get to sleep and when I slept I dreamt about it. Like I always do in these kinds of cases, I also try to imagine what I would have done in the same situation. (Is this where people say autistic people bring things back to them?). I tried imagining ways she/I could have escaped, even in my sleep. Same thing with the Idaho college students' murder case. I have learned to stay away from real life crime stories, my emotions swamp my life and make it impossible for me to function normally.
I stopped going on Facebook completely when my feed was inundated with animal cruelty images; they know I love animals and so feed me those stories/images. The people trying to raise money think the best way to get money to help their cause is to show graphic images of animals cruelty. That doesn't work with me; it just makes me sad and angry, especially with the people trying to force the imagery on me to raise money - once I see the image, I can't unsee it. I remember one morning a particular graphic image was stuck in my mind and I cried all the way to work. I refuse to give money to people who fundraise in this way. I find TH-cam does this to some extent (the first ads in this very video where of animals suffering) but it's not as bad as Facebook and I zone out until I can press the 'skip' button on those ads.
I was working in healthcare for 10 years before I was diagnosed. I very much feel hyperempathy, however I had to learn how to show it to who I since learned were the majority of people, allistics. I recall receiving feedback in my first hospital rotation that I was not showing empathy. I was nearly kicked out of the program! The clinical instructor also suggested that I have some sort of mental problems and that she was impressed at my ability to not get mad at her, as she had had that happen before (shocking, I know). Add onto that I was having so many executive functioning struggles and was not bonding with the majority of my classmates. In that rotation, we were required to drive together. Only one solitary student ever wanted to drive with me. We still keep in touch. I have tried to continue my education with post-graduate programs. At this point I have two unfinished programs that I really want to complete, but the reality is that the educational system has a long way to go to understand how different we are AND that it is okay to be how we are! I may need to have a lighter patient load now that I spend the majority of my time caring for my neurodivergent children, one of which has higher support needs than me, and because hyperempathy is so draining, but the patient population that I have served very much benefits from having someone like me in my role and that is the work that I find rewarding (in addition to hobbies). Fantastic work debunking misinformation Mike 👍🏼
One of the hardest things for me in reading the diagnostic report from my assessment was that the neuropsychologist that diagnosed me said I did not show emotion on my face, and that I reported far more empathy than I was showing. This is common for autistics. I have a theory. We are feeling things so deeply, processing those emotions, that all of our energy goes into that processing. It makes us look like we are blank on the surface, when underneath we're feeling things far more than allistics do. It is why perhaps some of us have meltdowns, because people do not see what we're feeling on the surface and by the time we can express it we're exploding. It appears like our meltdowns come out of nowhere, there's no warning. But that's just because we aren't showing what we feel. I don't think it is autistic people have have trouble with empathy. I think it is allistic people who do not pick up on how we feel, if we do not mirror emotion the way that they believe we should feel it then it is assumed we don't feel at all.
I think back on my mom, who I suspect was autistic. She was assumed to be aloof by everyone. Hard to know, did not show emotion. But I could always tell how she was feeling. I never saw her as having no emotions. For me her face was full of emotion. I also can tell what other people are feeling, and I try to attend to them, though. I am very empathetic to others, but they haven't ways gave that gift back to me.
@@karenholmes6565+
It’s because neurotypicals only care about presentation. There’s a reason why so many project after adopting sociopathic tendencies.
You are not a commodity. NTs suck at understanding anything but their own bubble. They often only care and believe you when it matters to them.
@@karenholmes6565 The key to understanding neurotypical behaviour is to be aware that the bigger part of nonverbal communication four us is happening subconsciously. We are generally not aware of the little mirroring dance we do and also not of how first impressions of people are shaped by how well our opposite figure performs in this dance. This stuff is learned at an age where even language aquisition is a mere parroting process. It doesn't usually involve active thinking.
So yes, we do not get you, and unless you point out your personal "manual" to us, we cannot perceive how you feel. Not just because you fall out of our frame of reference, but because we generally aren't even aware that we have a frame of reference we judge your atypical reactions by. We just feel you are odd.
@@Volkbrecht Most of my deficits are not with social communication. The doctor who diagnosed me said that people who are as high masking as I am blend in very well. She only picked up on it because she specializes in diagnosing high masking adult women. I have a couple of degrees. I've often been put in leadership positions, spoken at conferences, designed research groups, etc etc. I come off as someone who is a perfectionist, people never really get to know me. I don't think anyone has ever described me as "odd".
There are probably people that you know that are autistic and they are unaware of their autism. i was 56 before I figured it out. And most of my awareness comes from the symptoms I have had since early childhood. There are three different domains of symptoms associated with a diagnosis of autism. Sensory issues, repetitive movement and routines, and social deficits. Most of my problems are with sensory issues. But I have symptoms in all three domains. We get misdiagnosed with PTSD, borderline personality disorder, chronic fatigue syndrome, autoimmune disease, bipolar. Sometimes we have these conditions on top of autism.
I am going through a lot of trouble to write this to you because autism is such an individual experience. And we are really misunderstood. I think you should listen to us instead of assuming you have a handle on who we are because I can assure you that you really don't.
It's not the lack of comprehension from most people that gets me, it's the very detailed and thorough fantasy and confidence that they know what they're talking about when they're just talking out of their ass in a crowded elevator that's locked shut. Worse is that they really do think they're right and that their poor treatment is justified and needs to become even more hostile and sociopathic.
100%
I've always experienced that it's sometimes hard to determine when non autistics are feeling affective empathy and can never tell whether or not their attempts of showing cognitive empathy is genuine or not since it's often seems forced as if it's all an act.
Sometimes they seem to pretend to show cognitive empathy to just gaslight you instead when you don't respond the way they want you to respond. "If you don't adress the issue the way I consider is the correct way, it serves you right for feeling the way you are".
I think part of the problem stems from the meaning of empathy in psychology and in casual conversation. In psychology it mostly refers to perceiving another's state of mind. In casual conversation we often take empathy to also mean sympathy and compassion. There's strong empirical evidence that autistics have deficits in perceiving another's state of mind (see the Sally-Anne test), but no evidence that we lack compassion.
When you feel overwhelming "empathy", that is actually sympathy.
When you help that is compassion.
Normal empathy includes perceiving the distress of a homeless person and ignoring that person.
I've been told - post diagnosis - that I couldn't be autistic because I have empathy. When I brought up the diagnosis the response was that they must have been wrong (because of course the random layman knows more than the expert informed by research...).
Ironically, this same person has comnented that I would do better in relationships if I could just act more like "normal" people - engage in small talk, talk about football, just "chill out", etc.
Nina made me the 'super autism' medals I'm wearing! Gotta be worth a like for that! 🎖🎖🎖 😂 🧡
👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍💙💙💙
@@Autistic_AF a fellow veteran of the Sperg Wars. 🫡
Claiming someone has no empathy is the least empathic thing you can do. How does that even work I cant spin my mind around it.
Its like neurotypicals look for signs of empathy in body and facial language, while its all inner workings, feelings and thoughs, which often are overwelming.
Well said!
Yes, that is exactly what we do, because perception is generally how you tell things are there, autist or not. And let me ask the question the other way round: how would you even be capable of having any emphatic reaction if you couldn't somehow see or hear your fellow human expressing their emotion?
Same my friend was going through a horrible time and afterwards I was completely drained and felt a great sadness and fear for him. It took me a week or two to recover because I still felt it after we talked about it.
i have this delayed processing in very overwhelming situations (which i dont mind and im aware of in the moment) and in emotionally hurtful ones (unaware of it and often very confused). I would also consider not-knowing-what-you-actually-want in social situations part of that delayed processing
This sounds like alexithymia. Have you looked into that? It’s where you can’t recognise/describe what emotions you are feeling in the moment, but they will gradually percolate into consciousness over time. I have this. In one way it can be protective, but it also leads to struggling with confusion.
@@tracik1277 yes i have, thank you! I dont have a final answer on that topic, but right now, i feel like I can identify my feelings and bodily needs but just not too well in stressfull Moments. I do not struggle with realising i need to eat, Drink or go to the bathroom (but i ignore it Sometimes:D).
Joe Rogan lacks empathy 🤣
I'd add another comment, but this one sums up my feelings quite well.
I couldn't possibly say!
* actually, I could say. ;)
He also lacks humor, talent, and knowledge 😅
@@Autistic_AF Some colleagues of mine have been on his show and he comes across as a clueless moron most of the time.
That's because his mind is so open, his brain fell out
Thanks again Mike for another brilliant video🙂. I have been called som really mean and harmfull things by a family member around this subject. After I found out I vas autistic and then got my diagnosis, I am able to stand ups for my self and say against them and educate :)
THIS! Empathy, monotropism, different processing and expression Is life-changing content for both autistic people and friends/family/carers/partners! Keep up the good work Mike!
I'd also like to highlight the point of autistic people not reciprocating empathetic response because we might be focusing on something else and it takes quite a while to transition and spend some effort on empathetic display in the way others can understand, despite the raw data might have been perceived instantly.
My baby was just born not even 2 weeks ago and my feelings have been all over the place, this new autistic dad is having is brain wires crossed.
Congratulations on your new family member! ☺️🧡🧡🎂
@@Autistic_AF thank you Mike
I have so much empathy that it's nearly incompacitating. I cry over dead animals on the road, children starving, people being murdered. I even feel sorry for unwanted items at goodwill. Why else would we be social justice fighters?
they claim we are not empathic because they cannot comprehend the true empathy we have. it's the same thing were people who know less about a subject are more confident about it than people who do know alot because their lack of knowledge prevents them from understanding how little they know.
Mike, a video about autistic love languages would be so timely! My wife and I were just talking last night about the differences we have in how affection is shown and perceived and the difficulties that each of us have.
@@ZSchrink Working on it! Was there anything in particular that you were talking about that you’d like to see in the video content? 🧡
I zone out constantly, dissociate often, meltdowns, breakdowns and other emotions are supressed until its safe to come back and feel stuff..
I often get "robotic" as you say, when a situation happens where i have to react, survival mode even, i do what is needed of me no matter how i feel and shove the feelings away untill later.
I have extensive experience with troubleshooting dissassociation. I have lived a life full of violent episodes (where I was the victim 99% of the time to be clear) trained in martial arts, had a few brushes with death, saw others die around me... my reaction has been to switch to a dissassociative utilitarian personality to deal with the urgent situation, then go back to myself after. That alternate version of me doesn't feel anxiety, hesitation or fear, it's all about goal-oriented tasks. Surprisingly it can also be quite adept socially, often defusing tension with humor. It's the after though, adrenaline shakes, dry heaving and tiredness... it kinda feels like sumoning a god and becoming its avatar only to burn out after.
I think it's fair to bring up that about 50% of us experience Alexithymia which CAN include low affective empathy and coldness as some of it's common traits. Of course not all, or even most Autistics are cold... but it's common enough I think it's worth taking seriously when they display concerns. That said, coldness isn't going to cause us to launch bombs with less caution... it's just likely going to result in a more utilitarian ethics.
Yes! This is absolutely true. I wish I had raised this as eloquently as you have, in my video. Thanks for making a solid point.
@@Autistic_AFI experience alexithymia to varying degrees in different situations. I’d like to point out that it doesn’t mean you don’t feel, it means you don’t feel until later, so it’s a processing issue. I’m realising that in complex emotional scenarios, it can take me about 3 weeks to fully experience all the emotions pertinent to an event, and each emotion will ‘drop’ sequentially to be experienced and assessed separately. By which time it’s usually too late to explain myself or address the issue.
Studies have shown that neurotypicals are less efficient at conveying information verbally with other neurotypicals as autistics are with other autistics. Neurotypicals and autistics only somewhat comprehend one another, however.
So you would nuke us?
@@karlscher5170 yes
Do you know the name of this study? I'd love to read it
@@karlscher5170definitely.
From an autistic perspective it often feels like non autistic people lack empathy. In fact, it seems most autistic people are quite altruistic, putting the needs of others before their own, trying very hard not to upset other people, far more often and more strongly so than non autistic people do, and then the non autistic people don't even seem te realize this is happening, and/or often even taking advantage of it.
We’re a world of givers and takers. They just don’t want to admit they’d be the taker.
“Maturing as a neurotypical means becoming selfless, maturing as an autistic person means becoming selfish.”
@@ElMoonLite TRUE
My husband is autistic. When i tell him about being sexually assaulted as a child, he is horrified that someone would do that to a child.
When i tell allistic people, i get asked what i did to deserve it.
Tell me autistic people don't have empathy and you'd be telling a lie.
There are many autistic people who relate to and fit the low-empathy stereotype of autism, and they are a decent chunk from how they've spoken out, but it's still not majority or even half, if observations are accurate. Many relate to having too much empathy.
Some days the empathy is very much "I feel what you're feeling too much, so I'm now going to shut down to avoid the sad vibes you are soaking me with." or "You're so happy and sunshine-y that I am instantly in a good mood, thank you."
Some days I am very much tired and burnt out and no longer have the capacity to FEEL empathy or care about certain things. I can still show compassion, consideration, and kindness despite not FEELING the empathy.
The way I still remember key differences between empathy and similar things are:
Empathy: I FEEL what you are feeling.
Sympathy: I can understand how you feel, and/or have experienced that feeling.
Compassion/warmth: I have no idea what you're going through, but I love you and I'm here for you and I care.
Edit: oh yeah, meant to say, Joe makes it sound like he's describing a NARCISSISTIC SOCIOPATH and not an autistic person. autistic people may also have narcissistic personality disorder or may be a sociopath as well, but they are /separate/ disorders.
When I was growing up people kept trying to teach me empathy and I was confused because I already understood. Then I realized they were the ones without empathy.
It’s crazy to me that we need to teach other human beings about what empathy really is. What a crock.
Edit: I hope your NT friend expressed concern for you behind the scenes bc it sounded, to me, like that would have been humiliating.
And yet here we are. I really dislike it when folks who have researchers/teams share misinformation about autism (especially when it's not even contraversial).
@@Autistic_AFI love your channel. Thank you for actively working on not only your behalf but out of care for us too-what empathy! ❤
I think autistic people can really struggle with boundaries in terms of charity work, whether voluntary or paid, as the culture essentially encourages people to give all they can in terms of time, headspace and energy, and particularly in smaller charities. Although I've enjoyed the work in many ways, both voluntary and paid positions have caused me to burn out *really* easily.
A great video - and I'm glad Rogan hardly features in it as I absolutely cannot stand the man! 😩
I have one issue with the double empathy problem: autism is an spectrum, and the problem is framed as if all neurotypicals communicated in one way and all authistic comunicated in another way. What if someone has sensory processing disorder and dysgraphia but communicates exactly as a neurotypical person? would that person be less skillful to interpret the other autistic persons?
Affective empathy. Thank You for making this video!!!!
OMG you are spot on.
I struggle constantly with utter exhaustion (ZPM depleted status) after absorbing my patients' stress and anxieties. So they go "ahhh I feel so much better, you totally get it, doc" and there I am on the precipice of burnout, needing to watch kittens on TH-cam until I fall asleep.
Oh and BTW, medical doctor here with ADHD (on meds, need them!) and late diagnosed autism (reluctantly and after several burnouts).
I am empathic (my patients know I care).
Hence my autism was dismissed by clever psychiatrists in the past.
Thank you loads for speaking about this.
I have autism, and I’m on the High empathy side of the spectrum. I have so much empathy that I struggle to express it, I’m compassionate and I try my best to be understanding. I feel empathy for not just humans, but animals, and plants too. Heck, years ago the pine tree that has been planted in front of my house since it was built got cut down, and I morned the tree, because it felt like a part of the house. When my cat died, I cried. I don’t understand why neurotypicals think we’re cold, heartless, robots. We have empathy, we just have so much of it that we struggle to express it.
*Some* autists may give the *impression* that they lack in individual empathy, but it is usually just that - an impression. But in my experience, autists can also have a "big picture empathy" that most neurotypical people (and certainly Joe Rogan) can barely conceive of.
hyperempathy is definitely something i struggle with...if i do too much empathizing it can actually result in me feeling resentful and annoyed with people for having negative emotions. people interpret that as a lack of empathy and in a way it is, but it happens when im not taking care of myself or setting boundaries. show me a neurotypical person whos never failed to empathize with someone, especially with the double empathy thing.
I am so like this. I am very easily grossed out, can't stand the sight of blood. But when a child is injured, I go into a mode where I am extremely competent and quickly deal with the situation. Only later, I break down, shaking all over and sobbing. Thanks for this, I thought it was just me.
I spent decades giving so much of myself that I’m permanently burnt out. It wasn’t worth it. When you’re used up, they throw you away. Guard yourself, be kind, have compassion, but guard yourself.
Im autistic and very empathetic and wear my heart on my sleeve. Everyone knows what im feeling and i show it. It actually sucks
We really can have such a high degree of empathy at times others can't even understand it. A friend has a cute little dog, and everyone loves to pick him up. I never pick him up. People might assume I don't like the dog. Actually, I am trying to establish trust with him by not swooping in and depriving him of his sense of agency. There are loads of things like this that happen where I am acting differently from how people expect, and it can easily lead to misunderstandings.
It's not that we lack empathy. It's just really hard to empathize with someone like Joe Rogan. But that has nothing to do with our autism tbh.
That is the main issue with everything... society has a perspective because of what [false] information that they have been fed. I don't know how we really fix that because most people aren't looking for the truth on these things.
I definitely have empathy. I feel all my feelings and everyone else's. I wish I could turn it off.
Thank you so much for explaining hyperempathy and emotional empathy. I've been finding out a lot about empathy lately, and this helps me put into terms the things I've been going through. In the last year or so I've experienced hyperempathy more times and more strongly than the entire rest of my life, and I've found it a strange mix of draining and encouraging.
and on another point no one is thinking about: why would you need empathy to be upset about the use of nuclear bombs? Even the most self centered person probably understands the idea of “destroy the world? but I live there!”
If you dig a little deeper, you would find out that "Empathy" is very misunderstood concept and that you are fighting with someone that don't understand what he said.
Empathy - "the ability to understand and share the feelings of another." Nothing stop a person for torturing someone, even while they share and understand how it feels...
Empathy is just the ability to look at a snail and KNOW if you step on it that would not be a nice experience for the snail. Knowing that the snail is not going to be happy because someone steps on it, is not the same as deciding if you should step on it or not. It doesn't even prevent anyone normal from not stepping on the snail at all. (Just as I know posting this comment isn't going to make your day)
What stop us from stepping on the snail is a completely different concept. If I can "dehumanize" the snail (as we naturally do as humans), most people will be able to step on the snail and only be bothered about what it does to our shoes, not what it did to the snail. Same brain structure is used by dehumanizing other humans, so you can harm them. If I can twist my mindset to say make someone evil, then it's okay for me to harm them, even while my empathy still tell me they won't like it, because now the goal is to make them not like it, because they DESERVES to not like it, so I can twist doing bad things to them as being a good thing.
Yes a video about autistic love language please. I also have the delayed emotions, in crisis I will just act (and very well, a lot lot more efficiently than I usually do), then later, I will totally break down and cry. So you're not alone ^^
Yes I delay and can act while other are panicking . This delayed processing also bored bullies so much they'd just leave me alone.
Your points about going into "go-and-fix" mode hit the nail on the head, and i never thought about it.
I am a firefighter and have recently been diagnosed at age 26, and now the department i work for is trying to get rid of me since finding out about this diagnosis, rhe kicker is, i have always been seen as someone who is really good at what i do, and i ascribe this to the set of charactaristic the autism has given me. Calm in stressfull situations since i know what i have ro do, great at reminding protocols but can divert from them if need be, remembering routes in and out of buildings, and not to mention the broad knowledgebase i have in so much subjects😂😅
Its crazy to me how someone in a office just reads the word autistic and just decides that everything i have proven to be must not be true, these stereotypes are indeed very harmfull
Yes yes, the non autistic label us as narcissistic sociopaths becuase understanding what you have 'othered' is too much to ask for. Guess I'll watch the video now, then the podcast Joe said this in, and still have people tell me I didn't understand.
Joe Rogan is so disappointing. Thanks for covering this. 💜
Joe rogan frustrates me with the crew size he as he should know better and not say something that easily debunckable.
doesn't matter the size of your crew when they only say "yah Joe you're so rite" because they correctly realize he's "famous" and they aren't
Empathy, definitely a misunderstood emotion by may people. Thank you for taking the time to explain this... this video should be rolled out for all in the film and TV industry, help change the views of Autistic Empathy. Excellent video as ever Mike! Kitties say hi all. 😊
Myself, and ither that I know/other autistic people in my family are all Hyper empathetic. Its honestly so exhausting. I wish I could give it to some of the NTs who are obviously lacking empathy. Of just... Critical thinking skills and the ability to use google...
Wait wait wait.. Oppenheimer was sociopathic??
At least according to the movie. There was a whole section where he was struggling with the the images of what happend... What the *government* did. Not what he did. Hes a scientist, he did his job. And it was used in horrible ways.. and he seemed to emotionally struggle with it. He also struggled over death? Wtf 😂
Also, im right there with you. I also go into troubleshooting mode... And I don't think people tend to appreciate it 😅
But thats also... Ine of the ways I express that I care?
Its unfortunate
Great video...I'm "automatically" (lol) inclined to address everything you have just said in complete agreement, but will limit my comment to one example . (For Joe Rogan, in case he's reading this - I wouldn't want to blow his mind with the knowledge of my capacity to feel). Someone once said that a parent is (or may be) only as happy as her saddest child. As a late diagnosed autistic mother myself, I now feel that in my bones. Just using my daughters as my example; if I know, or even FEEL, that they are sad, anxious, confused, angry, or maybe acting sketchy for some reason, it affects me deeply. If I had been lucky enough to be in a great mood, then sense something is off with them, whether they tell me or not, my emotions tank, my plans change, and I often can't function normally. I end up riding their waves and helping them through when they need me. I was never a helicopter Mom, don't misunderstand, it's simply that their feelings will always override my own. Mind you, they are adults!!
That's just the tip of my autistic iceberg regarding my ability to experience my, and others' emotions. So, Joe can shove my battery pack up his....!!!
I relate to this experience totally.
Can’t really blame Rogan, even though I don’t particularly like his lack of critical thinking. Not long ago, this hypothesis was pretty much accepted among autism researchers.
Thank you for debunking false perceptions and educating!
Strange... the most emotional sensitive people i know are autistic. I am autistic, i got no problems to identify emotions in others. To even look through their "masks" and see the underlying emotions.
Where is actually struggle is, how to react to it without "running" em over. I mean, if i react directly, i might jump into a comfort zone of someone else without beeing welcome in it. I might have no right to give an advice about their feelings uninvited.
The troubleshooting mode and delayed emotional processing is so accurate
The times I've quickly taken control of a situation and prevented extra harm due to everything but logic and ability to completely focus have kicked in in an emergency... And the times I've gotten crap afterwards for being "a cold herring" as we say here.
Example: I was 18 and we were out with our scout group, checking out some spots for next Summer's competition. It was mid-January, and the temp was around -20°C and snow was up to knees or higher. So, it was 4 of us 18 year olds, and two who were closer to 30 (other was our scout group leader, and the other was one of the most experienced outdoorsmen in our whole troop. We had progressed about 2-3 km when our group leaders realized he forgot his spare film roll to base camp (it was late 90's, when cameras used actual film). It was important to get our job done, so he told the rest of us to wait and sprinted off back where we came from. So we waited to close for an hour there, and then we came to the conclusion that things were not right.
The other older person told us to back track into base camp and hold tight. He went ahead and left the unnecessary gear with us. So we hauled the stuff on our backs, and made our way back to camp. Two of the guys started panicking that our group leader was going to freeze to death, and that we need to run to the closest farmhouse to call for help. I told them that it wouldn't achieve anything because he hadn't been lost long enough (I'm a son of a fireman, you see), and we would be much more useful prepping the camp ready to warm people up externally and internally (this is the crisis-mode going), as all the running and exercise must've made both older guys sweaty and that'd turn cold pretty fast. The two flapping guys raged at me and sprinted off along the road (thankfully). So it was me and my best friend. I started looking for first aid stuff to prep, and told my friend to check the ashes of last night's large-ish bonfire (,we had slept out,) for embers. When I got back with the first aid kit, he had found a few hot embers, so I used them to quickly start a new fire and put some water to boil with coffee, tea and juice to mix with it, which ever they'd prefer.
Just as the water started to boil both the older guys emerged from the forest. Our group leader was supported by the other. Both were cold af. Our group leader had tried to make a fire, but at that point was so chiled, the only thing he managed, was to cut his numb fingers trying to make tinder. So my friend gave them hot beverages as they sat down by the fire, and I treated the wounds. The other two guys came back almost an hour later and told the emergency services had told them that they'd need to wait for two more hours. It really damaged my friendship with them. For some weird reason, they said my behaviour made me unreliable if they'd need help at some point in the future (and that I was a cold uncaring herring). I just logged it under "trauma-related behaviour", so I had no issue with them.
I just... I don't get it.
I'm autistic and vegan because I know it's wrong to eat animals and this Joe talks about lacking empathy and he's a damn hunter!!
@@celinahuezo5518 They talk about this in that episode. 🌱 🦌 🧡
Okra is a sad movie, you are right that you're waiting to you ready to watch it.
It isn't wrong to eat animals.
@@angustheterrible3149 then you can't put yourself in the animals situation. it is totally wrong. just because we have done it for years, does not mean it is ok. But it's ok that you feel or think that way. many people lack compassion for animals unfourtantally. people torture animals for food. it's murder and there is no such thing as humane slaughter. it's wrong.
Yessssssssssssss sometimes I wanna be in a social group and just be there without necessarily engaging in conversation. I feel a part of what’s going on and probably enjoy myself very much without necessarily looking like I’m paying my attention at all. It really bothers me when people feel the need to try to draw me in to the action 😖 and I find myself having to mask so that they’re not uncomfortable. (I understand that if I’m staring off and have a blank facial expression, they may think I’m upset - esp because I’m not always like that.) But it’s so hard. Sometimes I just wanna be quiet. And I don’t feel comfortable explaining it, because I don’t have an official autism diagnosis 😩 and I’m so functional they would never believe me.
Yea, during the delayed processsing session, I do dissociate a lot. There becomes a weird “video game” or POV perspective of my own experience. It feels a lot more like I’m a pilot moving things around continuously, like I’m an engineer just trying to brute force my way through a situation and t trying to “fix” whatever needs “solving” and I’ll frame things In my mind a that way.
That section about “piloting meat bags” really resonated with me
Sam Harris has done the same thing a few times. In an otherwise pretty spot on critique of Ayn Rand, Harris refers to Objectivism as "autism rebranded" and, in another article, says that pure utilitarian ethics lead to "the sort of body count ethics only someone with aspergers syndrome could adopt"
Sam Harris too? 😖😖
@Autistic_AF I emailed him challenging his use of lazy stereotypes, but never got a response. It's ironic because a lot of the stereotypes of autistic people are pretty similar to stereotypes of atheists.
8:05 one thing kind of wacky I can recount my childhood and this delayed emotional response is something I do, but not that delayed, and it didnt always happen. In fact I can recall the exact day it started, I was in a situation where I was sure I was going to break down right then and there... but it didnt happen. It didnt even feel hard to keep it in. I felt "fine" in the sense that I wasnt having a breakdown. Low and behold as soon as I get home from school it all breaks loose. And it hasnt always been that way, particularly if im already at home, but since it has been the case that I can maintain self control for break downs when in public. And then I of course, let myself let it all out soon as I can.
Thank you for reworking these important topics with new references/angles/styles!
for me, i have to carefully stay away from certain types of news stories. suicides, plane accidents, child deaths....i can't take it and it will put me down for a solid week unless i do something with it [usually by creating a short story or the like] i've always found it strange that other people were able to talk about those stories, declare, "that's so sad," but then get on with their day even if they knew the details. in turn, people will sometimes think i'm not caring because i'll shut down talking about those stories once i've learned a certain amount of details or i start to sense that i won't be able to handle the emotional burden much longer. this was an excellent video, thanks! i'm sure we all want to hear about penguin pebbling 'cause penguins are awesome! :)
Brilliant video, Mike.
It's not that we lack empathy, it's that we don't express it well. That's me, at least.
"Joe Rogan thinks..."
Citation needed.
😂
I like the definition of empathy where it's the ability to appropriately balance recognizing yourself in the other's experience and keeping a distance to respect their experience is different than yours. For example, a person might not have sensory issues themselves, and will find it harder to relate to someone having sensory issues, but, everyone has a moment in their lives where they are subjected to distressing sensory experiences. Empathy would be using the similar experience to relate, without projecting your own experience on the other, recognizing that their experience is different even if there are similarities.
That's the gist of it, I read this concept of empathy in Collen's (2023) paper, titled "Towards a Clear and Fair Conceptualization of Empathy"
As someone who grew up in more than one culture, a lot of these issues come up in cross-cultural encounters. I would say that for any person, jumping to conclusions about the reasons for someone's demeanor or behavior is not a good idea. It happens. I do it myself. But it's helpful to be able to catch ourselves - either on our own or if someone openly points out our assumption - and take more time to understand the perspective of others. I think this is a problem across many societies when exposed to norms and behaviors they are less (or not at all) familiar with. I don't think that neurotypical people are automatically rude, or that autistic people are automatically polite, so I don't want to generalize in the reverse direction as a compensation. But mutual consideration is a good starting point in any human interaction.
Great assessment of a very frustrating misconception too many obviously still have. I relate very much to the idea of taking on the feelings of others. I don't even have to know them personally. I feel it in watching or reading something, or being in the same room, and it just becomes a part of me. However therein, the quietness tends to set in as I process it all. I feel as if always in a state of process, actually.
Yes! I have piloted my meat suit - in a couple of life saving crisis, and bad accidents. One time, I had jumped up, got a clean tea towel to bind my friends wound, grabbed my keys, and turned around to find no one else had moved. They were frozen with their mouths open.
Exactly!!! 🧡
Wow. Once, I somehow leaped across the length of a room to save a toddler from reaching for a boiling hot cup of coffee on the edge of a table. I just lifted to cup up out the way and it spilled down my arm, but I must have had so much adrenaline it didn’t hurt or scald me even though it should have done. The woman whose child it was said “Gosh you’re fast!” But I have no idea how I did it. One second I was sitting down, the next I was on the other side of the room. It was like I did it in one leap.
Incidents like this make me wonder if physics is even real lol
7:25 YES, every time there is some sort of emergency I have the clearest mind
This is one of those misconceptions about autism that really boils my piss!
You must have empathy to get peacock cuddles!
🦚 🧡
you describe it perfectly
Thanks for being here! 🧡
I don't know if I'm autistic or just have ADD, but I have many of these same responses.
That clear headed state in emergency! Is it to do with autism?! I always thought it’s so difficult to explain that!
Yes, it does! It's one of the few advantages we have 😀
Fiction can drain me emotionally tooooooooo. I have often wondered what’s wrong with me.
When I first watched the movie Zathura at eight years old, I started crying because a pillow got shot by a meteorite which caused it to make a squeaking sound, and I thought that meant that it was crying before it died horribly.
People frequently confuse empathy, with sympathy. Empathy is overrated.
5:05 YES! I have too much compassionate empathy that I also ended up dysfunctional. I was so worried about climate change and stuff that I felt insane guilt whenever using "too much water at the shower and since I already had difficulties in this area it was impossible to function
I'm autistic and I have so much empathy I can't even see injuries without feeling them on my body, as well as being hugely emotionally sensitive...
Practical knowledge of algorithms: The case of BreadTube, Cotter (2022)
This article discusses what I might describe as a mass synchonised monotropism, holding a specific emotional grouping of compassion and empathy to cultivate the youtube algorithm to select for those emotions.
It was a strange time, I held it for 5 years feeling like I was possessed and really needed to do it. It was about the time that article was produced I was able relax...the whole time it felt like an emotional superposition of extreme rage and a desire not to let it overwhelm the good left.
My amygdala feels spent, ended up taking a redundancy from my chemist role not long after.
They think of us like robots
This how MOST people think about autism....it is a stigma and makes job interviews and meeting strangers VERY difficult without masking
As much time as I have spent in hospitals there are many autistic folks helping people, and solid under pressure and very good at what they do
0:20 THE PUZZLE PIECE PINS…
We have low empathy, not zero empathy, we can be rude and struggle to understand other people and ignore certain minor social norms, but we care for others.
For my part, I have a terrible problem with social activists filling the empty blanks of my autism with the presumptions of their activism. I'm a 69 year-old retired software engineer, heterosexual, cissexual, white male. Activists are often on a mission to "ferret out, expose, and confront bigotry," but I miss the non-verbal part of their probing and appear to ignore them. Then, via "confirmation bias," they start filling the blanks of my autism with what they see as "confirmations of deep-seated bigotry."
Thank you! ☺️
Is there an extreme opposite of monotropism? I often can't focus properly on something unless I'm also focusing on something else as well. This leads to some pretty insane multi tasking. Like simultaneously watching TV playing a game and reading all at once.
I think people so often confuse emotional empathy with cognitive empathy. The struggle or even lack of cognitive empathy is fairly prevalent in autistic people. When individuals hear "lack empathy" their first connection they make to that is "they don't know what other's are feeling and do not care" and it's simply not true obviously. Cognitive empathy is different from emotional empathy. Often times, autistic people will display an increase in emotional empathy. Personally, I can't stand to see a child lose their toys or see people who've had their teeth knocked out. I will and have cried at both of these. Which in itself is considered "not normal". Now, what is actually meant and is far more accurate, is that autistic people will often struggle more with cognitive empathy. The understanding of WHY someone feels the way they do. My mom said that as a child I hated upsetting people and while I might have understood that I upset them, I rarely understood why. Even now, I struggle immensely with understanding why certain things I do might hurt someone. Not because I don't care. I just can't make that connection. And that is a struggle with cognitive empathy. It does not mean a lack or even so much as an irregularity in emotional empathy, which I find sad that so many seem to struggle to comprehend.