Who else wants to see David use his engineering skills to destroy a drum set and make his own wacky design of a kit and play all his weird cymbals and gear with it?
That cowbell groove with the Foot-Nik was DOPE AF. You found a Sabian TRIPLE HAT?!?! Amazeballs! David: "What could be more awkward than me playing double pedal? 🤔hmmm, TRIPLE pedal..." The Vruk looked painful, like someone falling down a rock covered hill...
The Tri-hat is pretty cool. Just one of those Sabian oddities from a golden age when they were constantly innovating and experimenting. They were the ones pushing the envelope back before Meinl kinda started to take that mantle. The Max stax was one of if not the first stack that was intended to be used as such, they were also the first to purposely put large holes in a cymbal to change the the sound.
do you remember those hand held mini hi hats sabian used to make? I've never seen one for sale but it was afantastic idea, a pair of 5 or 6 inch hi hats on a hand held trigger
Dude I hope you see this I love your content so much, I started playing drums for school this year and watching your videos is now a sort of meditation for me I hope you continue on like that ❤
you should do a whole video on that triple hi hat and as many cymbal swap combos on it that you can come up with. i saw dom famularo in clinic promoting these when they came out, and all i could think was how cool it would be to put a 18 sabian jia chinese on the bottom. the cymbal choice isn't as much out of date as it is just not very good. so much potential. they should have made a cable version too, as they're just a little too whacky to have as a main set.
As a sidenote, for us older drummers, who don’t have the flexibility in our Achilles’ heel anymore, the VRUK is a great piece of gear for under your heel. Picked up that tip from Steven Adler!
I've actually never seen or heard of the triple hats. Pretty cool concept. I do know a pro drummer from my area named Jeramie Kling use a vruk before. Not sure if he's still using it though.
You’re content is superb, in a sea of mediocracy you stand out as one of the most innovative and creative TH-camrs out there, you should try out some weird muffling techniques and gadgets, maybe some weird sticks too, keep on rocking🤘
Dont forget the Mapex janus combination double bass pedal hi hat stand. Slave pedal could be swiveled back and forth from the hi hat stand to slave side pedal.
ive been binging old rdavidr fix my snare and vintage/cheap drumset restorations for the past week… I NEED MORE just bought a blackrolite on reverb and am very excited to work on it love the vids!
To note on that Tri-pedal... the "white pads" are to face the head. 🙃 I think, if you had a double base drum and set it up on the left foot, and put a single on the right, you could use the right as normal, and then go heavy when applying the left.
The Gibraltar ultra-adjust was also an interesting pedal. A more adjustable hi hat stand with remote styling. They disappeared pretty quickly though since they were just in between markets enough to not have a market.
@@JasonMcLemore yeah they did take a bit to get adjusted right, or maybe I got lucky. Worked well for a double bass kit to get the base of the stand and the hi-hat where you need it. either way remote hats work better anyways.
I think the last one you are supossed to play it the way I do heel toe (which I do wrong I think) you hit with the toe, and then let the ball of your feet fall flat, like the whole foot, no need to put the foot up and hit whith toes, idk how to explain it I think I would be very good with the dualist and that last one due to how my feet are (which prevents me from playing normally), but I can't buy them sadly
Not the one you demo'd in the video, but the other heel-toe pedal you mentioned before the dualist pedals, I think would actually work incredibly well as a single pedal by blocking the normal pedal so it can't move and only using the heel pedal. I honestly think I'd have much more power and accuracy playing that way, just being able to keep the front of my foot planted and just dropping my heel down, kinda like how people shake their legs. Your top possible speed/bpm would go down as a result of not being able to do like heel-toe, but that's something I'd trade off tbh, and it's not like you'd be ridiculously slow either.
Can you do one on weird snares. There are some notables that would be interesting: Arbiter - Flats Duplex - Spirit of St. Louis Duplex - perforated shell Taye - adjustable depth SJC and Luka drums both did ones that were graduated sizes from top to bottom Turbine snares Spacer snares There are so many it could be several parts
I been loving the reviews on weird drums and such. But I am starting to miss all the crazy builds you used to have. I am just wondering when the next crazy drum build is gonna come? Don't worry if there isn't any coming soon. I was just wondering.
You should experiment with various cymbals on that triple hi-hat. See if you can make a better sound and what interesting weirdness you can come up with.
I remember that wacky triple hihat. And remember it having a very obscene price too, like $600 in 90-00s dollars.. is anyone old enough to remember a i think it was Gibraltar rack/riser system that pitched you, and your kit like 30⁰ backwards supposedly taking pressure off of your joints giving more speed and power
Are you thinking of Bob Gatzen's DrumFrame? That was an interesting idea, but seemed a bit too impractical for most gigging drummers. I believe Tony Royster Jr. used one (and possibly was an endorser) for a while.
I really like the VRUK Drum master. I have a pair and I used them on a CD I recorded and got some really fast playing done with them. Sure, Mr Vruk has a humble website, but his product is really well made and works great if you take a little time to adjust to it. I got used to it in WAY less than three months.
The sabian triple Hi hat stand could have a similar issue to my vintage hi hat with exposed springs stand. If you over tighten the bottom part of the stand it will seize up the stand.
OMG...that triple hat stand i've been trying to find for decades. lol I saw it at a music store in LA once when I was a kid and thought it was so amazing. Now I know what it's called lol
Hey David you should do a q/a type video, like where you answer questions about like you r weirdest encounter with reverb listing or something like that
Dude, you have missed the Soho (or Stable) PD-333 which is a single pedal unit, but with a heel pedal AND 2 beaters. Used it many times once I got the hang of it to extensively play double bass metal style.
So about the heel toe method. I was in middle school band and I was playing around on the kit, I don't know how I got the heel toe method down quick. For me it just happened one day and I was like "wow I found out something new" not knowing it was common knowledge among more professional musicians 😅
I wonder if an air cylinder like in hatchback cars would work better for the catapult than the spring. The problem would be finding one the right size.
Those are neat. I had a Mapex Janus double pedal and transmission hi-hat all-in-one thing. It was neat. Pedals were super sluggish, and it's substantially more cumbersome in transport. It didn't add anything, but rather subtracted a footboard. I ended up selling it because I needed the money for other gear, otherwise I'd still have it for funsies. There was a Gemini 241 (two for one, get it?) double single at a local music store when I was a kid. I think it came out slightly before the Dualist. The heel plate was the drive for the left beater. A salesman at the store bet me $20 that I couldn't play it because I was some dumb young kid and none of the kids could figure it out. I sat down and played it. He was mad that I played heel down, which is required to play the pedal. I told him to keep his money and stop being a jerk as my payment. If you want to play it as a single pedal, then play heel up. If you want to play it as a double pedal, then play heel down.
I haven't been into a music store in 25 years. My last purchase when I was playing was a Mapex Janus, which had a single pedal for engaging the hihat and double pedal. it had some vertical plates on the left and right sides of the pedal that allowed the drummer to kick the pedal to the sides to engage either hihat or bass playing. Is this still a thing?
David the triple pedal is cool in theory, but sounded to not my tastes in you bass drum. Can you try it on tighter less dead sounding drum for us? More of that slick metal sound :)
That vox telstar drum kit doesn't sound good to me. At first I thought how did you melt your bass drum until I looked it up. My issue is the skin sounds loose. At the end you have a normal bass drum and it sounds way better.
You, Sir,have definately found a special Niche in the drum video world!!! Love your Vids, But, I have to say, YOU'VE got some decent licks. keep it up.great stuff
I still have several Ghost pedals and they were my go-to since the 80's and they are still very fast, smooth, and quiet. Have you done any videos on these? I admit I have not searched your channel to see.
I was kind of hoping one of the items featured in this video would be the Mapex Janus combination hi-hat/double pedal. I've never seen one in real life, much less played one, and I haven't seen one anywhere since the initial ad campaign ran in Modern Drummer and then disappeared. I've always been curious whether they were simply unappreciated, or just a poor concept that died.
Got to play a Janus in a store once. The transition from hi-hat to kick, or the other way around, was not very smooth. There was quite a bit of friction, despite the bearing mechanism, probably to prevent the pedal from inadvertently moving laterally during playing. You could also feel a noticeable "thunk" when the mechanism popped into place on either side... I can't remember if the "thunk" was audible. In order to make the switch, you couldn't have ANY downward pressure on the pedal, but you still had to keep your foot in contact with the footboard in order to press against the vertical tabs that helped move the pedal sideways. Finding the proper foot position and motion to make efficient changes would have taken some practice.
Hahaha, I remember when those Sabian Tri Hats came out... probably about 25 years ago now, I think they came out right about the same time as the Portnoy Max Stax... this is the first time I've ever actually seen/heard someone play the triple hats!
Portnoy uses the tri hats in the song "as I am". In the live at budokan dvd, you can see him play it during the part of the song where he's playing the snare rim.
I remember them too, right around 1998 the guys at my local music store had it display just because it was so laughable. I don't know if they ever even sold one.
Which pedal would you add to your kit?
CHOPS Shirt back in stock! www.bonfire.com/chops-rdavidr/
tripple hi hat pedeal for sure i loved that especially the little airy hat ontop
The Sca-Taylor for sure, there is nothing else like it on the market. True innovation!
Although that trihat pedal is very interesting indeed
That double cowbell was 🔥🔥🔥
I'd love to hear a tambourine on that hi-hat. I would love to shake on the upstroke
I would add the deluxe, spray painted gas pedal.
Who else wants to see David use his engineering skills to destroy a drum set and make his own wacky design of a kit and play all his weird cymbals and gear with it?
Me
Me
Me
Me
Me!
Okay, that cowbell beat at 2:00 was SICK!
Yahh so cool
needs more cowbell
Bruce Dickinson has a fever and needs more cowbell
Damn. Never knew I needed a Foot-Nik and a old cowbell so badly.😂 That truly was 10/10 though. 👏
Do you know where you can buy them from?
finally the cure for the fever.
put it at 2x speed
@@Jril39 I tried looking into them but there’s almost nothing on them 😭
The only time I’ve ever wanted a cowbell
That cowbell groove with the Foot-Nik was DOPE AF.
You found a Sabian TRIPLE HAT?!?! Amazeballs!
David: "What could be more awkward than me playing double pedal? 🤔hmmm, TRIPLE pedal..."
The Vruk looked painful, like someone falling down a rock covered hill...
Now that you’ve challenged El estepario playing the triple pedal i want him making an extreme and weird drum tools video series
Estepario has a video out with him playing a duallist triple, and doing it astonishingly well. (There's a surprise 😂)
He crushed it by the way. Never anger a drum god...😅
The Tri-hat is pretty cool. Just one of those Sabian oddities from a golden age when they were constantly innovating and experimenting. They were the ones pushing the envelope back before Meinl kinda started to take that mantle. The Max stax was one of if not the first stack that was intended to be used as such, they were also the first to purposely put large holes in a cymbal to change the the sound.
do you remember those hand held mini hi hats sabian used to make? I've never seen one for sale but it was afantastic idea, a pair of 5 or 6 inch hi hats on a hand held trigger
I love my 14” Sabian AA Sizzle hats, it has rivets and holes in the bottom cymbal
@@GOLDSMITHEXILEHand Hats! Yes! I always wanted a pair, but I doubt I’d ever play them 😂
Dude I hope you see this I love your content so much, I started playing drums for school this year and watching your videos is now a sort of meditation for me I hope you continue on like that ❤
I have to say it- that steampunk- looking metal double pedal hitting the cowbell was EPIC. That is so ugly / funky that it's cool- and sounded great!
Sabian missed a real opportunity to call it the Tri-Hat
Watching you try to play the triple pedal feels like one of those nightmares where I want to run but I start floating just enough to not go anywhere.
you should do a whole video on that triple hi hat and as many cymbal swap combos on it that you can come up with. i saw dom famularo in clinic promoting these when they came out, and all i could think was how cool it would be to put a 18 sabian jia chinese on the bottom. the cymbal choice isn't as much out of date as it is just not very good. so much potential. they should have made a cable version too, as they're just a little too whacky to have as a main set.
This^. The possibilities ABOUND with 3 cymbals.
As a sidenote, for us older drummers, who don’t have the flexibility in our Achilles’ heel anymore, the VRUK is a great piece of gear for under your heel. Picked up that tip from Steven Adler!
Dude that Foot Nik groove was tasty as heck 🤤
Glad you liked the double piddle pedal that you bought from me. THE FOOT-NIK-cheers
okay the cowbell double pedal thing was SICK
If a normal open hi hat is loud how loud will this be 4:39
El Estepario has just put up his triple duallist video, he heard you!
Duuuuuuude! That cowbell double thing at the start was killer. Loved the beat too 🎉
i like how the title says bass drum pedals and literally in the thumnail is a hi-hat pedal
1:59 This is awesome. Somebody needs to get this into production.
I gave up on learning the drums about a year ago, but after watching your videos, I wanna get back into it.
do it bro it’s so fun
Spotted a tama bell brass in the video
not quite haha
I've actually never seen or heard of the triple hats. Pretty cool concept. I do know a pro drummer from my area named Jeramie Kling use a vruk before. Not sure if he's still using it though.
Fun fact, Portnoy used one as his x-hat for a while!
You’re content is superb, in a sea of mediocracy you stand out as one of the most innovative and creative TH-camrs out there, you should try out some weird muffling techniques and gadgets, maybe some weird sticks too, keep on rocking🤘
The Vruk was so cool in 2005. Drummers back then were super into them, and it set multiple world records for bass pedal speed.
I'd love to get some, too bad they're not made anymore.
Lamp rod matches roto Tom center thread also!
You can make a bell stack out of the frame bases!
The sonor giant step twin effect pedal actually works. Unfortunately it was discontinued. You should find one of those.
I was starting to wonder if I was the only one who remembered that pedal or dreamed it haha
@@jumpup88 Thomas Lang made that pedal famous as seen on his first instructional DVD.
Dont forget the Mapex janus combination double bass pedal hi hat stand. Slave pedal could be swiveled back and forth from the hi hat stand to slave side pedal.
That first one in context is actually cool asf
rdavidr u are probably one of the most fun drummers i watch and i have taken lots of inspiration from u
that double cowbell pedal is awesome!! And I also want that triple hihat thingy!!
I love how your first instinct with the triple pedals was a quint groove because why not
That Sabian stand is a WIN!
9:44 I love the music you chose for your work adding the third beater! 😜
ive been binging old rdavidr fix my snare and vintage/cheap drumset restorations for the past week… I NEED MORE
just bought a blackrolite on reverb and am very excited to work on it
love the vids!
9:59 that pedal doesn't miss a beat 😅
OMG FINALY A VID ON THIS IVE WANTED A ON THE DULLIST FOR SO LONG THX SM DAVID
To note on that Tri-pedal... the "white pads" are to face the head. 🙃
I think, if you had a double base drum and set it up on the left foot, and put a single on the right, you could use the right as normal, and then go heavy when applying the left.
it's a double-headed beater. the plastic side probably provides more attack than the felt side 🙃
that double cowbell was transcending
Couldn’t help but notice the handmade knife and 2x72 grinder in this vid. That’s awesome!
I think Sonor had a heel toe pedal, it was called Giant step or giant beat, should def review it Dave
I play Giant Step Twin Effect pedals, I LOVE them.
yo that triple hihat sound when its loosened reminds me of an upside down china crash, i love that slosh
you know estepario is going to make the triple sound like he created it! hes too GOOD!!!!
I use the D3 as a utility. Traditional double pedal grooves I use both feet, and use the single/double option for effects and creative groove ideas.
ok but why is your bass drum deformed
If you’re a drummer you are a moron.
Pretty it's made that way becuase of the sound
I could be wrong, but Isn't it an old peavey?
I found out it's from a Vox Telstar kit
It melted
The Gibraltar ultra-adjust was also an interesting pedal. A more adjustable hi hat stand with remote styling. They disappeared pretty quickly though since they were just in between markets enough to not have a market.
I have one of those Gibraltar ultra adjust hi hat stands in a closet right now. It always had a weird laggy feel.
@@JasonMcLemore yeah they did take a bit to get adjusted right, or maybe I got lucky. Worked well for a double bass kit to get the base of the stand and the hi-hat where you need it. either way remote hats work better anyways.
I think the last one you are supossed to play it the way I do heel toe (which I do wrong I think) you hit with the toe, and then let the ball of your feet fall flat, like the whole foot, no need to put the foot up and hit whith toes, idk how to explain it
I think I would be very good with the dualist and that last one due to how my feet are (which prevents me from playing normally), but I can't buy them sadly
Not the one you demo'd in the video, but the other heel-toe pedal you mentioned before the dualist pedals, I think would actually work incredibly well as a single pedal by blocking the normal pedal so it can't move and only using the heel pedal. I honestly think I'd have much more power and accuracy playing that way, just being able to keep the front of my foot planted and just dropping my heel down, kinda like how people shake their legs. Your top possible speed/bpm would go down as a result of not being able to do like heel-toe, but that's something I'd trade off tbh, and it's not like you'd be ridiculously slow either.
That was fantastic. Everything about this episode was spot on.
That cowbell pedal groove is hot.
David does blast beats with a triple pedal. 2023 is officially awesome!
Now after seeing that bass drum, you gotta make a video titled “Buying the weirdest bass drums EVER”
You should try to find one of those Mapex Janus HiHat/Double pedals. I only ever saw the ad.
The problem with the Duallist D4 is that it needs a lot of setup. If you don't step correctly, neither beater gets to hit the head.
listening on my phone, the duelist section just sounded like RIDE RIDE RIDE RIDE while I watched the beaters whack away
Can you do one on weird snares. There are some notables that would be interesting:
Arbiter - Flats
Duplex - Spirit of St. Louis
Duplex - perforated shell
Taye - adjustable depth
SJC and Luka drums both did ones that were graduated sizes from top to bottom
Turbine snares
Spacer snares
There are so many it could be several parts
I been loving the reviews on weird drums and such. But I am starting to miss all the crazy builds you used to have. I am just wondering when the next crazy drum build is gonna come? Don't worry if there isn't any coming soon. I was just wondering.
I’m in love with how that 10” top hat sounds on its own
Bro that cowbell beat at 1:48 👌👌
Also that bass drum is shaped different
I love your videos❤ over the past couple of weeks I have binge watched all your videos!☺️
You should be able to replace the spring on the Gibraltar Catapult pedal with a stronger one.
Dang, was hoping you'd review that Drumnetics magnetic/springless bass drum pedal that appeared in the world for a hot minute like 10 years ago.
They are still going
You should experiment with various cymbals on that triple hi-hat. See if you can make a better sound and what interesting weirdness you can come up with.
What a cool video! All drum and percussion enthusiasts around the world should be subscribed here!
I remember that wacky triple hihat. And remember it having a very obscene price too, like $600 in 90-00s dollars.. is anyone old enough to remember a i think it was Gibraltar rack/riser system that pitched you, and your kit like 30⁰ backwards supposedly taking pressure off of your joints giving more speed and power
Are you thinking of Bob Gatzen's DrumFrame? That was an interesting idea, but seemed a bit too impractical for most gigging drummers. I believe Tony Royster Jr. used one (and possibly was an endorser) for a while.
@SeanD313 that's exactly it! I assumed it was a Gibraltar thing. GG!
600$ for 3 cymbals and a stand is about right, even in 90's dollars.
My Rogers kit from the '70's had that dual sided beater like the Dualist.
11:05 He has just launch a video with the triple pedal... Nailed it as a god!
Thank you for curing my fever at 1:50
I really like the VRUK Drum master. I have a pair and I used them on a CD I recorded and got some really fast playing done with them. Sure, Mr Vruk has a humble website, but his product is really well made and works great if you take a little time to adjust to it. I got used to it in WAY less than three months.
The sabian triple Hi hat stand could have a similar issue to my vintage hi hat with exposed springs stand. If you over tighten the bottom part of the stand it will seize up the stand.
OMG...that triple hat stand i've been trying to find for decades. lol I saw it at a music store in LA once when I was a kid and thought it was so amazing. Now I know what it's called lol
Always happy seeing the Telstar getting some love
yes... slauchie sounding triple hi-hat at maximum velocity sounds like the magic to me.
Hey David you should do a q/a type video, like where you answer questions about like you r weirdest encounter with reverb listing or something like that
Dude, you have missed the Soho (or Stable) PD-333 which is a single pedal unit, but with a heel pedal AND 2 beaters. Used it many times once I got the hang of it to extensively play double bass metal style.
Ok I unironically love that triple high hat section
I play a Mapex Janus system where the hi hat pedal swivels into a second bass drum pedal, you should check it out.
Rdavidr is one of my favorite drummer that doesn't double bass drum.
So about the heel toe method. I was in middle school band and I was playing around on the kit, I don't know how I got the heel toe method down quick. For me it just happened one day and I was like "wow I found out something new" not knowing it was common knowledge among more professional musicians 😅
Missed the Sleishman Twin Pedal, which looks really weird.
I wonder if an air cylinder like in hatchback cars would work better for the catapult than the spring. The problem would be finding one the right size.
Ludwig Speed King is my favorite. The pedal is fast and simple.
Squeak king
Ludwig ghost pedal has got to be the smoothest pedal I’ve ever played.
@@timm1139 hope to try it out.
Where did this guy get a Scataylor drum pedal? Did he buy it at the hardware store?
Those are neat.
I had a Mapex Janus double pedal and transmission hi-hat all-in-one thing. It was neat. Pedals were super sluggish, and it's substantially more cumbersome in transport. It didn't add anything, but rather subtracted a footboard. I ended up selling it because I needed the money for other gear, otherwise I'd still have it for funsies.
There was a Gemini 241 (two for one, get it?) double single at a local music store when I was a kid. I think it came out slightly before the Dualist. The heel plate was the drive for the left beater. A salesman at the store bet me $20 that I couldn't play it because I was some dumb young kid and none of the kids could figure it out. I sat down and played it. He was mad that I played heel down, which is required to play the pedal. I told him to keep his money and stop being a jerk as my payment. If you want to play it as a single pedal, then play heel up. If you want to play it as a double pedal, then play heel down.
Amazing as always, loved the footnik beat!! Clean AF
I haven't been into a music store in 25 years. My last purchase when I was playing was a Mapex Janus, which had a single pedal for engaging the hihat and double pedal. it had some vertical plates on the left and right sides of the pedal that allowed the drummer to kick the pedal to the sides to engage either hihat or bass playing. Is this still a thing?
I'd be curious to see the triple head beater with a kit with triggers.
You can try stronger spring for gibraltar pedal i think..
or rubber band, it may retract faster (?)
Every time I see your Kick Drum, I feel like I’m having and Acid flashback.
There's so many pedals, you could do a video only about dual pedals like Lazer pedals, Sonor Giant Step and so on
David the triple pedal is cool in theory, but sounded to not my tastes in you bass drum. Can you try it on tighter less dead sounding drum for us? More of that slick metal sound :)
That vox telstar drum kit doesn't sound good to me. At first I thought how did you melt your bass drum until I looked it up. My issue is the skin sounds loose. At the end you have a normal bass drum and it sounds way better.
You, Sir,have definately found a special Niche in the drum video world!!! Love your Vids, But, I have to say, YOU'VE got some decent licks. keep it up.great stuff
I think it would be interesting if you looked at a drum set by farmer foot drums, they are drum sets that you play with only your feet.
Pretty sure they're meant for string players to be able to accompany themselves, I'd still love to watch David try and play one though lol
WHAT a cool channel and those HATS!!! Friggin awesome 🤘🤘
I still have several Ghost pedals and they were my go-to since the 80's and they are still very fast, smooth, and quiet. Have you done any videos on these? I admit I have not searched your channel to see.
You should pull out some of your weirder Hat stacks on the trip hat. See what linda funky noises you can get it to make.
I was kind of hoping one of the items featured in this video would be the Mapex Janus combination hi-hat/double pedal. I've never seen one in real life, much less played one, and I haven't seen one anywhere since the initial ad campaign ran in Modern Drummer and then disappeared. I've always been curious whether they were simply unappreciated, or just a poor concept that died.
I think DW made a combo hihat/double pedal at one point too
Got to play a Janus in a store once. The transition from hi-hat to kick, or the other way around, was not very smooth.
There was quite a bit of friction, despite the bearing mechanism, probably to prevent the pedal from inadvertently moving laterally during playing. You could also feel a noticeable "thunk" when the mechanism popped into place on either side... I can't remember if the "thunk" was audible. In order to make the switch, you couldn't have ANY downward pressure on the pedal, but you still had to keep your foot in contact with the footboard in order to press against the vertical tabs that helped move the pedal sideways. Finding the proper foot position and motion to make efficient changes would have taken some practice.
Hahaha, I remember when those Sabian Tri Hats came out... probably about 25 years ago now, I think they came out right about the same time as the Portnoy Max Stax... this is the first time I've ever actually seen/heard someone play the triple hats!
Portnoy uses the tri hats in the song "as I am". In the live at budokan dvd, you can see him play it during the part of the song where he's playing the snare rim.
I remember them too, right around 1998 the guys at my local music store had it display just because it was so laughable. I don't know if they ever even sold one.
I want to see your go on DIY Octobans. I'm in the middle of it after months of searching for pipe.