"Floor Framing" Build Show Build: Boston Ep. 5
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 22 ม.ค. 2023
- Floor framing seems like an easy topic, but the details are endless! From air sealing to structural support, there are many details to explore. On this episode of Build Show Build: Boston, Steve and Big Red will dive into these topics and give you an understanding of the decision making process.
Check out some of these mentioned products:
Roseburg RFPI®-Joists: www.roseburg.com/engineered-w...
Roseburg RigidLam LVL: www.roseburg.com/product/rigi...
Warmboard Comfort System: www.warmboard.com/
Simpson Strong-Tie MIU Medium Face-Mount I-Joist Hanger: bit.ly/Simpson-Strong-Tie
Sascho Lexel: www.sashco.com/products/lexel/
Learn more about LDS Construction: www.builtbylds.com/
Learn more about M. King Contracting Co.: www.mking-contracting.com/
Huge thanks to our sponsors for this series!
Allura Fiber Cement Siding: allurausa.com/
Mitsubishi Electric Trane US: www.mitsubishicomfort.com/res...
Roseburg: bit.ly/Roseburg-x-The-Build-Show
SchücoUSA: www.schueco.com/us/home-owners
Warmboard: www.warmboard.com/
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My goal in life is to own a home designed with as much thought as you put into your homes. Loving this series thanks for bringing us along.
Thank you very much for joining in the discussion
@Matt Mitchell ... +1 .. Agreed. You beat me to the punch ... Excellence at work!
I read the entire Ryan’s th-cam.com/users/postUgkxGqOCINHE0Z0E5gxzSdNi9NWGugRY5Hm2 Plans and was able to make a shed plan. Using Ryan’s Shed Plans alone, the shed itself is great. Where I wish I knew more is with respect to ground preparation and foundations. Maybe that's beyond the scope of Ryan’s Shed Plans.
This guy Steven is an encyclopedia 💯
I have over 30 years of working some of the very best minds in the industry - seems a little rubbed off......Thank you for the kind words
I love learning about all of this stuff. It’s a shame that most of us will never be able to live in a well built home.
I really like these long form, information dense sessions with Steve! Thanks for putting this together and making the knowledge available to those of us on the other side of the internet.
your welcome - thanks for joining in
Great stuff. Steve is well versed and rehearsed. I sure do wish there had been a BuildShow when I was 22...
This series is fantastic. I love learning things outside my wheelhouse.
GREAT!!!! please tell ALL your friends.....and Thank You
Steve, with all the building industry fluff and sales pitched based "information" being targeted to newbie owners, it's very refreshing to have a licensed professional give a deep dive full of experience and science.
Thank you - very much appreciated!!! Yeah, I'm gonna go out on a limb and state, "I'm not much of a fluffy guy" lol
This is one of the best videos produced getting into the weeds of residential framing. Its all in the details and I love it.
Thank you for the kind words - I agree
Framing right is an art!
My house built in 1990 has an 1" white styrofoam panels outside of the housewrap, covered then by ceder siding. Underneath, there is nothing stopping bugs and rodents from wanting to come up through the styrofoam! Thanks to Build show Network, I know what we need to have done to correct this issue once we get our budget together to replace the siding.
Same here in Atlantic East Canada, on Prince Edward Island. Parents had this build in n1983 and I see rodents getting into the rigid foam that is covered by cedar siding! They have managed to crawl into the home now. It is now my task to correct this and make sure the extension I am planning to build will not let rodents do this on that section. 🙃🇨🇦
Wow! What an amazing informative video! I'm learning so much through these video series that you're doing! Thank you to Steve and to Matt Risinger for putting on shows like these! All the guys & girls (Julie) who contribute to this video and sharing knowledge with the rest of us. Amazing work! Can't wait to see the rest of it!
Thank you
really enjoy your detail discussions, as an architect I like both in the field and drawing views
Thank you sir - I find the dual explanation provides a good spectrum of understanding
very good
We always learn so much from a Steve Baczek episode. I like to see all the details and nuances. That Warmboard sure seems to be the Cadillac of heating systems.
Thank you buddy for the kind words...... Yes, Warmboard is certainly a very fine choice!!
Thanks for bringing us along the journey and getting deep into the details as always. Even for a longer video I feel like you definitely didn't gloss over some of the important considerations.
Thank you for joining
Great series. Thanks for the education. Jayman...
Thanks for joining in
Thanks for this great episode. I really appreciate Steve's deep dive insights and technical explanations!
Thank you sir - appreciate you joining in
Well done, Steve!
As soon as I saw that dropped flooring for the shower in the background earlier in the video I was hoping you'd discuss it. Thank you for not disappointing!
Welcome - thanks for joining
Hands down my favorite series right now!!! LOVE in information
THank you for joining us buddy
I'm retired after spending 40+ years as a rebar fabricator primarily in commercial. We did however do a large majority of custom homes in the Dallas area. It is amazing how many 15K SF - 30K SF homes are being built in our area. I was VP of estimating, detailing and sales and worked with many folks from varied backgrounds. I enjoyed this video and the thought that you put into explaining floor framing. One is never too old to learn. LVL has been a game changer. Subscribed!
Thank you for joining in ........enjoy your retirement and take in those BuildShow videos......
@@stevenbaczekarchitect9431 Absolutely!
@@scottperry2541 do you know anyone in Dallas that does ICF custom homes?
Framers seem pretty good
Agreed
a wonderful house
Good job, Matt, on the PBS show about building better
Matt and Steve. It would be nice if you also talked about the cons of using TJI floor joists. There are serious hazards when you start comparing them to solid sawn lumber in scenarios when there is fire involvement. There are still very serious risks with home fires and time to get out of home is severely shortened when using engineered products like TJI and LVL. Sawn lumber lasts 3x longer under fire conditions. Also, the impact of a single failed TJI due to fire has far more substantial overall impacts on the structural integrity than that of sawn lumber like a 2x10. Homes are people's biggest investments and while fires are not extremely common they are real concerns that should be accounted for when building a home. The same way we account for other disasters such as tornados and floods. The time to evacuate is substantially less just based on the petroleum based furnishings in our homes of today. Then the risk goes way up when you factor in the engineered lumber.
I’m loving this series! So interesting!
Thank you for joining
Great stuff.
First time I saw engineered I beam was framing in 1977 Norfolk Nebraska. Tey came in on a rail car and we cut them to 60' length on site.
WOW slightly before my time
This is great! Kevin is a great speaker
Thank you for sharing so much of your trade with us. Really amazing information.
Thank you
Great group of professionals.
Thank you
This was such a good video, we typically do floor frame plans as well and it amazes me how many do not.
Thank you
Matt King is got the life
You must know him lol
This warm board is a nice product. As long as your house isn't too huge, it's probably not too expensive. It's a great way to get the comfort of radiant floor heat without the complexity of a typical system.
It is a fantastic system
Thanks for the great content!
Great series guys!
Thank you
Great video 👍
Thank you - much appreciated
I absolutely love this. Thank you
Thank you for joining in
Gonna use WarmBoard for my Barno project ! Glad I watched this series.
Great choice - Warmboard is top shelf
@@stevenbaczekarchitect9431 Much respect.... seems like ever since I started watching BUILD, Matt has talked about your work. You make it look easy. You should be proud of yourself.
@@eugeniustheodidactus8890 Thank you very much for the kind words
1. Its much easier to premount the floor joist hangers before putting up the joist. You mark up the rim boards, nail in the hangers than slide in the joists. You also need to install squash blocks on TJIs joists so the hangers have wood to nail into from top to the bottom of the hanger.
2. Joist twisting is the prime issue with long joists not the sagging or bowing of the joists. In TJIs the top and bottom flangs is to stiffen the vertical center so it does twist of bend under load.
3. Its would have been easier to pour the basement floor slab before installing the first floors since the pump truck has access everywhere from the top.
4. Better to install subflooring like advancetech, first than install Warmboard S. While standard warmboard is 1 1/8 it has about 7/8" routed out groves for the Pex. Warmboard R can be installed after all the walls are up which is helpful if you need to make some interior wall adjustments. An alternative to Warmboard is Ecowarm which has a alum spreader, but is easier to work with during install instead of Warmboard's heavy alum. sheeting.
5. Putting warmboard in the basement is probably a mistake. Better to use an insulated slab and install the PEX in the concrete. Issue is that if you ever a a leak in the basement (ie busted pipe, washing machine overflow, etc), its going to warm the warmboard panels.
6. Instead of using Wood for the Zip-R use composite deck boards since they will not ever rot. You have to rip the composite deck boards using a table saw. You can also prime the outside of the rim boards with paint as layer of protection. I like to mix in borac salt (insectide) into the primer for added protection against termites and carpenter ants. Better to use standard Zip and use rigid foam panels instead of the Zip-R since it can be a really pain to nail the ZIP-R to the wall studs, especially when your butt joining two ZIP sheathings on the same Wall stud.
firefighters hate these engineered floor beams....
You hear that all the time, but they have been around for years, we are about 3 generations removed of firefighters from the move from solid sawn to EWP's
@@stevenbaczekarchitect9431 well theirs a reason new homes go up in flames faster then old ones
@@randomrazr I would argue that, my hous with all that dried wood would go up in a minute
@@stevenbaczekarchitect9431 old growth wood takes alot longer to burn then engineered wood . theirs a reason the escape time has dropped for house fires
this guy knows his shit. very impressive!
Thanks for joining in - much appreciated
GREAT VIDEO !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Thank you for joining in
So much Knowledge, thank you for the lessons.
Thank you for joining in
Good info. Your rule of thumb looks somewhat optimistic for span length especially for the joist systems. I find at 20', the most economical joist depth is 14". You can go shallower but the joist has heavy duty flanges and you get more bounce. Some joist suppliers don't recommend the blocking/bridging due to potential squeaks.
Even with D.Fir, I don't span more then 14'6" with 2x10. There is just too much bounce even with bridging and 3/4" ply.
I agree with you, I was quoting the code in these instances
I like the idea of adding the pressure treated wood under the foam as its own independent block. I do worry with the suggested alternative method of the 2x8 pressure treated mud plate as an overhang to set the Zip R9 on we just created a bridge for water coming down the ZIP to bridge across the mud plate where we did not use Lexel between the mud plates. It seems having the "Rodent Block" be separate would give us a place to weep water.
I feel like every Houston home should be built like this 🙌 flood friendly home.....for 7 feet anyway
Or homeowners insurance can just keep paying to repeat the same insane process
Like Sachco also but using 10oz tubes on that foundation was painful. A sausage gun is a tool I kicked myself for not buying sooner once I bought a case of material. A roll product would be even better though. It would allow them to guarantee a seal at that point since it would have a fixed amount that could be tested and get a EC-XXXX.
Steve, yes, I remember Matt talking about the detail you have about the double plate, with one being a PT closest to the concrete foundation and that lower double plate being wider to create a "ledge" for the zip R sheathing. I have added this detail to discuss with the design person for this thick wall, air tight extension hoping to be ready for next year to put up. I was planning on another "winter coat" layer of rock wool board 80, to be an additional 2 inches. Steve, what would you recommend to have on the bottom of this product? I saw on the internet a metal U shaped trough that could be made and the U shaped was metal mesh design to prevent rodents from crawling into it. Like you said, for rodents possibly a nesting spot, even though rockwool product alleges that rodents do not like to nest in it and exoskeleton of insects get ripped off if they burrow in rockwool. Thoughts on this Steve? Yes, I saw Matts vids on this additional RWB addition. Around the windows gets to be more time consuming to buck out further the window sill. Belt and suspenders eh! Patience and building science collaborating. Cheers from East Canada, Atlantic Prince Edward Island☺🇨🇦👍
.. Our In-Floor Hydronic system NG fired has 3 inches of concrete with PEX-ALU-PEX imbedded. The system's concrete component provides a flywheel of warmth. Our Vail, Colorado home was never better since the hydronic system install in year 2000 by Denver's Advanced Hydronic LLC ..Efficiency is the name of the game.
I have both. Inslab downstairs and. Warmboard upstairs. Problem with flywheels the take a lot of energy to get going and then a long time to slow down.
Took all day to get the downstairs to get up to temperature. My house has r30 walls and r65 ceilings. Upstairs was warm in a couple of hours. I have ambient thermostats. Upstairs with warmboard stays within + or - 1 degree of the setting on ambient thermostats. Downstairs Inslab overshoots the thermostats + or - 4-5 degrees.
Haha, yes! FRAMING is exciting!
Always is - hope all is well - please tell the Mrs. I said hello
@Steven Baczek Architect Will Do Brother!
👍👍💪💪 clarity!
The structural wall section from Ep. 4 and this architectural wall section differ in which mud sill is held down by the anchor bolts. It's quite important that when they built it the structural was followed because you are only overlapping the sheathing with the upper sill. If you were to bolt the lower sill and only attach the sheathing to the upper sill you wouldn't get the sheer value of the sheathing holding the framing to the foundation.
Yes I need to clarify detail. The framers install a 3"x3"x1/4" washer flush to top of top plate - see 52:15
I really like what you are doing just are you not worried about using a liquid based heating mat throughout the house in conjunction with engineered wood framing? If it gets wet and degrades the structure of the wood would it not essentially be a potentially catastrophic failure waiting to happen?
It would be awesome to do a show to talk about the difference in cost of building a Matt Risinger 'building science' home vs a regular type custom home construction.
70 feet of open space, would make a sweet indoor range.
🙏
Very cool, thanks for sharing. I wonder if its ok to just run the Zip-r flush with the footer, run the sill plates inside that 1 7/8, and just set the joists on top of that (obviously the joist would be shorter overall, but still. Doing that and taping from the surface of the zip R to the surface of the concrete would make one clean flat surface.
No No No, we have done moisture tests on that detail and the lower 2' is twice the moisture content as the board above - I find that detail dangerous, except for maybe Phoenix
Matt, Ive been following you for quite some time but this was great, great, great!!!! Thanks
That was a good starting presentation on the various under floor beams. However, you did not mention trusses. It would be nice to see how they compare with LVL, solid wood and I joists.
Great detailed video, really enjoyed the engineered floor framing products discussion.
Btw you mentioned moving t electricity from fossil fuels, but electricity is primarily created using fossil fuels so not sure of the point.
Our electricity here is site generated.....watch Episodes 1-3?
Mine is generated by 10,080 watts of solar. House is all electric. Geothermal heating and cooling. Domestic hot water provided by a water jacket on the compressor. So gets heated whether it's generating hot water for the heated floors or cold water for the chilled water fan coils. I've had zero bills 5 years running.
I'm impressed by this product and company. I wonder if you can have unchanneled boards for storage areas, under appliances and cabinets etc.
Yes they have blank panels they send for those areas
Do these I-joist require web stiffeners/squash blocks at bearing locations?
Also what is your method for preventing termite damage? I ask because you don’t call for termite shield under the mud plates.
Was gonna give you a hard time as you were reading off the part number of the joist hangers - you started with "MIUxxxxx" and I instantly thought you had inadvertently used a MiTek hanger but claimed it as a Simpson! But no that's the right Simpson #, my bad to jump to conclusions. :( Another awesome and entertaining post Steve, thanks for sharing. UnBuildIt!
I try to do my homework - the MIU series is the larger capacity hangers
THANK YOU! question. floor trusses be used the same way? thank you for all you do and all your knowledge thank you God Bless you!
Yes, we didn't have enough time to address them - typically they are roughly the same strength as I Joists
Great series you guy's are doing. Really appreciate your time. Question about the basement. What is the thinking behind not putting the radiant tubing in the slab and going with Warmboard R. Is it only because of a finished wood floor?
Thanks
Yes, and the engineers preferred the panel over the slab for more consistent/quicker delivery
Matt - (If you read these a week after posting)
A product I came across recently - "ballistic nailscrews" by UFO - for all categories of "nailing" jobs....
- not a newproduct, but one I have never seen, and was wondering if a thought experiment existed - yes I have seen spiral and ribbed/ring shank nails - they have existed for a long time even in Australia..
Have you seen these, are they of benefit - in your industry, or a gimmick not worth the cost???
(Increased holding vs nails, fasterplacement - compared to collated screws, removable and adjustable like a regular screw..
Just curious... could be an interesting video- even an experiment, pros / cons...
그러면 차라리 그냥 스틸로 지으면 안돼나요? H-beam + c형강
Steve, great series! I'm a nerd so this is right up my alley. I do have a question... Can you explain the use of drop beams in some locations and flush beams in others? Why would a flush beam NOT be the right option? In the case of a basement, it would seem to always give a better ceiling height.
Flush beams are slightly mor labor intensive to framers because of precise cuts and the joist hanger requirements. Dropped beams , the joists simply sit on. I use dropped beams when a wall aligns or they are in open / unfinished basements
Thank you for the kind words
I grew up in a 1960s home with hydronic floor heating embedded in the slab. It was awesome to walk bare foot in the winter! However, that system was very slow to respond to temperature change. It is intriguing to see that there is a modern version that is responsive. The only drawback is cooling. I am assuming a separate system will need to be installed for cooling and ventilation. Based on what I see so far I am guessing Cadillac ERV and mini splits?
We will be installing a Zehender and a ducted Heat Pump AC system
I love the idea of the Zehnder system. However, when I looked at the cost and the challenge of running the tubing to virtually every room in a 7000 sqft home I chickened out and compromised using a more standard ERV. Now I have Zehnder envy!
@@petersallay5221 yes, it needs to be integrated into the design "not applied to"
100 pound 4 x 8 sheet would be roughly 3 pounds per square foot
iT WAS A TEST TO LISTENERS, YOU PASSED - GREAT JOB!!!
Point me direction to buy an engineered LVL ridge beam large enough to span 52' supporting only a 4/12 pitch standard garage roof. Nebraska ...rarely more than 12" snow on the roof. Don't want a post support in the middle. Garage is 22' wide. Don't want trusses. Ball park, what size estimate?
The beam required for that would need to be a built up truss, or the like, most likely steel. A solution we have done in the past is to used 2 0r 3 built up girder trusses to pick up the load intermittently..... 52' is a challenge
For floor joist I prefer LVL they are stronger with almost zero flex, wider nailing surface and most importantly contain more mass so should there be a home fire they don’t burn through as quickly or easily as engineered I beam style.
“A 24-foot span for an I-joist that can go 20-feet…” Can you elaborate on the engineering judgement used to make this decision as “OKAY”? Can you elaborate on what is meant by comfort level / comfort range?
24' span rating for the joist, installed on a 20' span - the enhanched strength offers stiffness and damping which in turn provides enhanced comfort
@@stevenbaczekarchitect9431 Thanks for the clarification!!!
@@damianokon6209 Thank you for joining the discussion
I know this video was posted a year ago but are we missing an episode or something? EP4 has concrete walls for the basement then EP5 starts out and all the floor joists are already installed. Would love to have seen much more detail about that.
Also a question about warm board and thermal bridging, do they cut back the aluminum plates at the exterior walls to prevent the aluminum from bridging heat to the exterior of the house?
No, and we talk about it in the video
QUESTION: Do you ever use subfloor adhesive between the floor joist and floor panels to stiffen and quiet the floors? (I heard her mention floor adhesive at around 30 min but I don't see it being done by the framers on this site) We've all seen squeaky floors in old houses but I've seen it in some new construction too so whenever I can I've been using adhesive.
Yes sir - it was used on every joist/every panel here. At 20:43 the gent furthest to the left is applying adhesive
@@stevenbaczekarchitect9431 thanks
For the reply and your great instructional videos
Question about 17:48, isn't that warm board not lined up properly?
There is always a few places to router in new loops - where panels get cut for length. Hence the install package and templates
Steve: I heard somewhere that using radiant heat flooring in houses with high insulation values is counter-productive. The hypothesis is that the house never cools down enough to really cause the radiant floor to warm up sufficiently. Your thoughts on this? Love the series, getting lots of ideas from this and Jake's Building on a Island series for our retirement home.
I have it in very efficient homes, the basic premise of a radiant floor is warming the surface for the luxury of a comfortable conduction - hence the luxury. The system is temperature based, the radiant sytem's only knowledge better performance is lower temp and circ time........and it is Wade on the Island Project
@@stevenbaczekarchitect9431 Thanks for the response and yeah I realized later that I listed the wrong builder, ooops.
I have super efficient house design. And super insulated. I have 3400sqft infloor. 1000sqft upstairs is warmboard. The floor may not always be warm. But it is never cold. Even when it's -20f outside. And I keep the ambient thermostats set at 68°. I can walk around naked. Warm feet no cold spots. Lol.
@@danmccoy6164 Thanks for the feedback. So, you have a mix of warmboard and some other sort of radiant heat? My wife is very susceptible to the cold and I just want to make sure that whatever we design she will be comfortable.
@@Bob_Betker
Yes I have inslab downstairs. And warmboard upstairs. Warmboard is far superior. Everyone always said inslab is the way to go. I have ambient thermostats. No infloor sensors. The inslab over shoots the temperature set on the thermostats 4-5 degrees in either direction. My warmboard is 1 degree either direction from the temperature set on the thermostats.
Engineered wood is nice but the cost is enormous! The spanning distance is still dependant like an I/W steel beam.
I'm not sure if you have sizes like a steel I beam can offer.
Supports added to a basement is fine with me. It's always cold and damp and offers you arthritis! Things made out of chip board should be A LOT cheaper! You build high end homes and 99% out there cannot afford this much less the 2 bys used.
These homes are like electric cars, there are entities who want to take advantage of rare elements and artificially jack up costs.. I feel that if you could make batteries out of sand then it would be a rare compound.
Thanks for joining in - very much appreciated
What a fantastic show full of great information.
Just wondering would you consider changing to the metric system. Inches and feet seems like it’s from Jurassic park
Why, nothing in our system is metric here?
Even with the imperfections of solid lumber I would still rather use it than glued engineered stuff. I’m just a homeowner that’s built 3 of my own homes and just don’t like the glued products
Beauty of America is we get to make our own choices....
@@stevenbaczekarchitect9431 not always . You must not be from USA. We have code that specifically says what can and cannot be used on many products and installations. We are FAR from being able to decide what WE want to use . Beyond code we have ordinances and tons of other hoops to jump through depending on the county or area that you build in. …
@@dtm7909 We work all over the country, and we use trusses and I joists very frequently and have never been told we can't
@@stevenbaczekarchitect9431 wasn’t necessarily being specific to your glue products . I as a homeowner builder have been told I can’t do a lot of things by my local inspector . I don’t build on your scale , I’ve only built 3 homes in 22 years time . In my county we can’t just do what we want .
@@dtm7909 Understood - thanks for joining us
Question to Julie: - if you provide modifications templates and allows rostering new channels for pipe. Question- how you sorted you aluminum destroy? How now channel is covering?
Can warmboard be used with that Advantech foaming adhesive? purple I think.
yes, backside is virtually the same
Does it bug anyone else that lumber in the US doesn't seem to live up to the name? A 2x4 is not 2 inches by 4 inches... just... why? In my country, a 150mm (roughly 6 inches) wooden post is 150mm by 150mm or very, very close to that. This makes it so that if I wanted to build a house out of stacked wooden beams, I'd buy exactly as many beams as is required according to the dimensions specified on the lumber and the wall height instead of having to calculate how many extra to get due to the material received being 20% smaller than what it says on the box.
iT IS A LITTLE AGGRAVATING, BUT AFTER 30 YEARS i HAVE THE NUMBERS IN MY HEAD
Does anyone have experience with I joists and fire? I seem to remember a few articles discussing this topic and special installation requirements to increase fire safety. Obviously the benefit of more stable and stronger product is there, just wondering if a compromise in safety is a factor.
They burn, and the webs are thin, via code you cannot leave them exposed.......I have heard years of concern, but very few articles of an actual failure
Jank, they have the same char rating as dimensional lumber. There was a lot of unprofessional B.S. put out by fire departments that was straight up false, my father was a firefighter so I know how to build fire safe. The only thing is that because they are stronger you have to use less so it takes less time for it to completely burn.
I’ve seen first hand numerous times how wooden I beam joists handle fire compared to dimensional lumber. The simple fact is the osb web will fail much quicker under fire load. There’s pros and cons to each but in terms of fire safety dimensional lumber is better in my experience and opinion.
@@AndrewH91 I joist have the same charge rating as dimensional lumber. Period. Fact.
It has a waaaay better fire rating if you put drywall over the web.
The "I ve seen" crowd can line up and put all the money they have in a trust account and I'll match it. We'll walk into a ASTM testing facility and watch the rest. I walk out with your money.
It's stronger for a set mass than lumber. Performs better. And every house has a pile of drywall scrap in the trash you can use at no cost to boost the fire rating if that's your thing.
Facts
@@sparksmcgee6641 I guess real world experiences mean nothing to sterile lab tests right? You’re really going to argue with people who operate on both types of roofing construction under fire conditions?
Furthermore there’s several homes in my housing development with sagging floor joist, can you guess which kind? Wooden I.
“Pure aluminum alloy” 😂😂
I'm assuming that is good? Thanks for joining in
@@stevenbaczekarchitect9431 There is no such thing as a pure alloy. That’s why it’s funny. Cheers
so steve what di you spec ?
L360 or even more in those floors ?
To the most restrictive load L/480 at least
Amazing attention to detail. Is ICF considered for full houses? Seems it would meet a lot of your criteria for this house without so much engineered wood. Full insulation at rim joist, perfect straightness and strength instead of lvl studs, continuous insulation, air tight without even trying.
ICF is hyped way beyond it's abilities by salespeople. And your "perfect straightness comment referring to ICF must be a mistype. WAY better products out there that cost way less and are easier to use.
@@sparksmcgee6641have you used ICF before? Walls should be as straight as steel strongbacks. Can’t imagine LVL studs with I assume a continuous foam exterior on top of zip r would be less expensive way to go especially done as meticulous as Steve would want it to be done
@@BriceSorg first concrete wall I poured was 12" thick and 20' high. I did it on my house. ICF is so far behind basic standard building practices it's laughable. Walked a multi family ICF with all the money they needed and the site manager walked me through what it looked like a week after the developers was on the news vomiting out the same "the construction world doesn't understand this technology blah blah blah" without a doubt THE WORST multi family job I had seen. A lumber framing job off as far as it was would never pass an inspection. It would have to be torn down. Thicker ICF allowed being out multiple inches. The most experienced ICF crew from the manufacturer was used. I don't think they went bankrupt but it was close. Ended up pre selling a bunch of units from the hype at $350sf then after the last theid didn't sell for 9 months in a bomming market they dumped the units for 60% of the presale price and disappeared. Raped the 15 or so people who bought the hype. The HOA couldn't get maintenance done because they would get bids and swear no one knew how wonderful ICF was and would get 10 more over a few years until they realized it was shit and they couldn't maintain it. Most of the units walked a we at from them in the 08 downturn. The building was in a booming area of downtown Denver. Never slowed down in that area during 08. I owned a house 50 feet from the project. Watch it all from and center for years. Good enough for ya???? 25 years in construction building Spec houses in Colorado. Top tier houses for 2 decades. Want Bret Hull if you want to know what top tier is.
@@sparksmcgee6641 12” thick 20’ is a beefy wall my guy. What was it for? I understand people may do a shit job but I don’t think that should represent the product. I poured my 3500 sqft personal house first floor yesterday and was off maybe an 1/8 at most at 10-12 feet with 4 guys 55 yards finishing 17 windows 5 doors. Wet set truss brackets with 20,000+ pounds uplift rating. To me it’s a no brainer. I’m not even a concrete guy I mainly do siding, replacement windows, exterior trims and we have seen so much terrible work from boom before 08 on spec as well as custom homes. No window flashings no apron flashings no care taken. One spec company actually flashed j channel underneath j channel in windows causing rot underneath every one. If anything , terrible building practices with water which should be #1 priority effect ICF way less. EPS and concrete? Automatically solves for water and air infiltrations. Cheap house wrap for suspenders. I have seen Brent Hulls work and it is fantastic. But who can afford that? And no offense most of his beautiful mill work is in the inside and could be done in any ICF house. Not saying it’s the best for everybody or every job but made sense for me and I haven’t regretted it.
What about galvanic corrosion between the aluminum of the panels and the steel of the fasteners?
It's not in an electrolyte solution or being energized with current. No problem I could see
@@evanciambrone9373 doesn't take much moisture to get something going between dissimilar metals, but I guess the location in the floor system would make that a non-issue without a leak that would carry it's own issues.
Maybe this is too obvious but, WTF is the difference (other than thickness) between LVL and freaking plywood?.
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Something I love (as a homeowner who want's to design his own home) is that Warmboard will look at your plans and send you the flooring panels you need to fit your floor plan. That way you don't need to worry (as much) about an errant nail or screw punching a hole though your heating system when the interior walls are being framed.
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Is there any reason (other than money of course) why the home owner didn't go with ICF for the construction? That would be _MY_ dream home at least. With a geothermal based liquid to liquid heat-pump system to maintain temperature inside.
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Steve, one thing I like about your episodes is, you don't talk over and interrupt your guests like someone else has a tendency to do.
Depending on the product it's stronger. Engennered products have many levels of strength. Pretty much the same process but a diffent product. I've made custom LVL's on site using 1 1/8" structural ply. Worked great, 14ft L X 2 1/4" wand over 24" h if I remember right, 3-4 sheets so a beam for under $200 at the time.
@@sparksmcgee6641 Part of what generated my original comment was looking at the cross section of the Roseburg beam. I've made "LVL" beams myself to span more than what I could get from a "Big Box" at the time. Yes, they would make an inspector faint, but they're still holding up 🤣
Thanks for joining. 1. Lvl's might have a different recipe in their binder to make them a little stronger, and more consistent given their duty. Warmboard is "Top Shelf". We looked at ICF and wanted to do it, financially it was a no brainer. Thank you for the kind words, and for joining in
Can't wait
How much more labor % cost is it with your contractor with a standard subfloor vs warmboard? Even better if you can compare it between the first time they had to use it on a job vs now and being comfortable with it.
Framer told me it was about the same, first time maybe added 5%.......Warmboard is great about being out here during layout
Doing the electric heat pump was a mistake. If the power goes out, so does your heat. And your power is most likely going to go out in the winter when you need your heat most. Hope they wise up and put in a propane boiler and generator for those frosty Boston nights.
The house is Zero Energy , with a battery backup/storage system, being managed by a smart panel system...
Maybe in the future someone will make a video of a project that has both 🤔
My current house has batteries as well and when the power went out recently, the gas-powered furnaces ran just fine, along with lights, internet, etc. The key is to load manage when those things happen. In an area where there are typically days-long outages, load management is key without some fossil fuel-based generator. The array on this house, plus the battery capacity will be large enough to provide the needed power for days, again shutting off what is not needed. A long pole with a foam brush helps clean the solar panels when there is snow.
I live in Wisconsin. Is in the negatives most of the winter at night. I have solar. But no backup batteries yet. I have had a few outages. For a few hours. Here and there. I do have an lp generator. But haven't had to use it yet. My house is super efficient. And super insulated. Will be getting an electric car for the backup battery. The one I want will be $39,500. Loaded up the way I want it. With 66k battery.
3 tesla power walls. $49,000 installed. Have to be installed by authorized by tesla installer. To get warranty. Less than 40k battery total.
The 66k battery will run my entire house for 4 days. Without any solar. My roof is steep enough that the first sunny day it melts and slides off. Just had a week of highs in the negatives. Took 2 sunny days for them to clear off .
Would be nice to have true two story example to speak to stair framing and walls above.
as a contactor I love them as a firefighter I hate them
I do not see anyone gluing down that subfloor.....Is there a reason ? TIA
20:50 the gent is applying glue??
Do they make PT versions of this engineered lumber?
There are treated versions out there
Would sistering make a difference in the vibration?
It is one of the ways you can combat it
Anybody else scream "where's your hard hat and safety glasses...and at least some over the ankle boots!" There. I feel better now. 😵💫...and high visibility vest, too! >whew
He definitely should have had a hard hat on when he was in the basement and the framers were working above. Sneakers are not ideal for a job site, either, with the potential to step on nails and other sharp things.