This Recumbent Superbike Is Faster Than Your Road Bike! Here's Why...
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 19 มิ.ย. 2024
- This bike is rapid! What's making it so fast? Luckily, we have Hank on the ground to check out the Cruzbike! This recumbent superbike is a work of art. Join us in this video as we take you through this unusual bike's high-end spec. Is this the future of cycling?
00:00 Intro
00:57 Meet the Cruzbike
02:37 Why is it so aero?
04:03 The bike specs
05:35 The history of recumbents
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![เก่งแต่ลับหลัง (FINSTA) - ส้ม มารี (Zom Marie) Ft. Punch 4EVE [Official Teaser]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Fvt0Wz1hfGY/mqdefault.jpg)
Is this the future of cycling? Let us know in the comments 💬
I've been cycling for 38 years, if this is the future of cycling then Iam out ....
Finally you got a respectable bike an this channel, again. 😏😜
In Germany I've seen more recombent-trikes, during the last years (you get more stablility, but still can ride fast and look cool). Recombent-Bicyles are still rare.
I do love my HP-Velotechnik "Streetmachine", on long rides it's really comfortable and because of the higher riding position (for a recombent), I have a good overview in traffic. Being able to ride narrow paths was also a big reason for a recombent bicycle, instead of a trike.
Riding to the grocery store doesn't feel right, though. The distance is too short.
Going uphill is also less fun. It's just a little bit too difficult, standing up and putting some wight in the pedals. 😅 I really do recommend a SPD-system or similar, so you can at least push *and* pull the pedals.
Recombent bikes have a lot of advantages, but I don't think that they will replace the upride bikes, at least for casual cyclist, which doesn't have problems with backpain or with their shoulders.
Mountain- or gravelbikes can also not be replaced by recombentbikes.
Anyway, I do recommend to trie out a recombent, if you get the chance to. Once you learned to keep your balance and go for a short testride, there is a very high chance, it will put a big smile on your face. 😊
Recumbent bikes are roughly the same age as safety bikes aka double diamond upright ones, so not predicting much brighter future for recumbents in the future either. Also UCI has banned recumbents from bicycle racing so no exposure to the masses from racing scene. They're usually also more expensive than basic bike shaped objects from supermarkets or such retail outlets. Also climbing isn't recumbents strength, so if you're not living in Netherlands or such flat land areas, you'll face frustration soon going uphill at walking pace. Another thing is balancing a two wheel recumbent while lying on your back takes much more concentration than sitting upright, trikes and quads are easier in that respect, but they require more space and can easily flip on high speed cornering. If popularity of cycling will increase in general, there will likely be more recumbents, but really hard to see them gaining mass popularity as relaxed as the riding position is or how much aero dynamic advantage there is on flat and downhills. Use of fairings or riding complete velomobiles offer even more aero advantage, but hardly make the recumbents any more appealing to the larger crowds for higher price and general, well, awkwardness.
For me personally recumbents are the present and the future. I am so happy, that I decided to try recumbents right when I wanted to ride bicycles a bit more. I was thinking of a gravel bike for a compromise speed and comfort, but recumbents actually have the much better compromise and can have lots of both.
Sadly the numbers are growing only slowly. Velomobiles seemed to be growing quite a bit, but the current financial situation has stopped many from entering that expensive sector. There is a great, well priced new offering with the Bülk 4 More, though. I'll keep trying to make recumbents and velomobiles more well known, because they have so many great advantages. Not only, but especially for folks who can't ride more common bikes anymore.
@@cyclingnut2122 Ever gave it a try? 🤔🙂
If Ironman triathletes find out about this, its going to be wild
They are banned.
@@sitoudien9816 A few have opened their doors to recumbents in California.
@@sitoudien9816 Yes, any why would they ban recumbents if they were not actually faster? If they were slower, no one would ride one, even if they were legal. Triathlon was initially heralded as the ultimate recreational and inclusive sport, but yet its governing body had zero reservation in banning recumbents. Only now, with the sport shrinking as so many boomer triathletes age out, are some race organizers starting to accept recumbents as a way to keep older athletes in the game.
They are much harder to steer.
@@thecodemachine Implementation dependent. My various uprights are steered mostly by leaning over. My recumbent is steered mostly by leaning over...
Bikes tend to steer where you look. On a TT bike in optimum aero position where one looks is pretty much down at the road just beyond the front wheel, while on something like Hank has here it's where he's going, and that makes control significantly easier.
I've been around recumbents for over 40 years now. Like many engineering students, I was interested in the IHPVA movement back in the early 80s when HPVs were really coming alive. In the early 2000s, I bought a full carbon recumbent to help me train for an Ironman. I found that TT bike position was straining my neck and causing a disc in my neck to become inflamed, so I did most of my training on the recumbent. It was also a lot of fun punishing my club mates on weekend rides too. In the last few years, I have built my own ultralight (18 lb) full carbon (rear drive) recumbent that is similar in layout to a Cruxz bike with a 40 inch wheelbase and two 700C wheels. I find that it climbs quite well. Then secret for generating power is getting the riders hip angle to be the same as an upright. I use it mostly for our local TTs and it definitely helps me keep my average speed well above 40 kph. A feat at age 60 I can no longer achieve on my traditional TT bike.
thanks for the comment and your personal experience with recumbents!
That is amazing that you got the weight down to 18 pounds. Did you find a way to triangulate the loads? How is the stiffness under high pedal torque? I put a carbon fiber front fairing on a 2018 Cruzbike V20 and find that the top speeds are around 10% better but at the cost of an extra 10 pounds which make starts off lights and hill climbing more difficult so the effort was kind of a wash. Thanks for the power generating tip. My next bike project will be similar to yours in keeping weight down. I may include a fairing but the hard part is what you have done already.
@@williamwightman8409 The secret to building a sub 1000 gram recumbent frame is in the carbon fibre engineering. Note, the bike industry is still using the fairly primitive bladder moulding technique owing to production constraints. It works well but is far from ideal. To really optimize the mechanical properties of carbon fibre, you need to cure it under tension. Pultrusions are the best example of this that are commercially available. To create my frame material, I built a draw bench that allows me to cure two sheets of uni made from 6K carbon tow under about 1000 lb of tension. The bench looks like a table top 30 inches wide and 48 inches long. It lengthens using three internal screw jacks. To make two sheet of cured carbon, I wrap a continuous filament of dry 6K tow over both faces of the table from end to end using several hundred wraps of tow, and then apply tension using the screw jacks. Wet resin is applied with peel ply and a breather, and the entire table top is put into a vacuum bag for curing. After trimming off the ends, this yields two sheets of exceptionally stiff and strong uni directional carbon that is about 0.0011 inches thick. I cut the sheets into 1 and 2 inch wide strips and use them with other non-structural materials over a male mould to ensure the inside surfaces of the parts are pristine with no resin lines or other defects. This whole process is far more labour intensive than anything you will find in industry, but it it optimizes frame strength, stiffness and weight. If you are only building one or two frames, it's the way to go. Hope this helps and best of luck with your frame building adventures :)
Interesting - Carbent Raven?? Dana has done some builds roughly that light...
Thanks Hank and GCN. I now own 4 different recumbents including a Cruzbike. I thought I was going to have to give up bike riding altogether after neck surgery. I bought my first recumbent in 2017. It was a challenge to get used to but on the 2nd day of owning that first one, I road in a 60 mile event. I couldn’t believe it when I was done, I had no pain anywhere. I was hooked. Keep up the recumbent content. 👍
I’ve had this bike for a couple of months, a few trade offs, but overall, no comparison - absolutely love it. (40+ year cyclist)
Yes, we have a steady stream of bike companies going bust as they desperately try to flog the latest wildly over-priced marginal gain, yet they remain blind to the market potential of recumbents for the aging boomer population. I suspect the real challenge for most of the industry is that they simply don't have the resources or talent to engineer a good recumbent. When you consider the millions of hours of collective engineering that has gone into the traditional upright bike frame since the 1870s, I guess I don't blame them. The good news is that so much of engineering and technology has become democratized in the last 10 years, it is only a matter of time before the collective efforts of the hobbyist community will solve this problem. I think we are getting closer now to having the optimum rider position and frame layout.
Recumbents have been honed since the 1890s. It is a business problem to stay afloat manufacturing recumbents on mass scale when the buyers are not there. UCI threw a spanner in the works banning bents from racing in the 1930s so visibility is low and people are brain washed to seeing only diamond frames.
That's awesome! How do you find riding this bike on the road?
@@gcntechmuch easier on my body with a slightly lower w/kg and a faster pace. The bike encourages you to ride longer every time you go out.
I don't claim to be an expert, but Hank's position on the bike doesn't seem right. Most notably, his knees are too bent at the bottom of the pedal stroke. He might have better steering control if his arms were straighter. Also, it must be very uncomfortable riding with his neck bent so far forward. The TH-cam video at the following link shows a rider with a position that seems much better. th-cam.com/video/KCnKiDV6YwM/w-d-xo.html
exactly my points in a comment at his TT race video with this bike
I was looking for this comment. He is a bit jammed up on the bike and will have a tired neck if he does not fix his neck rest position. You should be able to relax fully while coasting when set up properly.
Agreed on all counts, which is odd because these guys always fit their road bikes so carefully.
That bike is way too small for him. A proper fitting one will have the rider much more stretched out and as a result, even more aero!
@@nt2883 There are no "sizes" to Cruzbikes and the seat is fixed, but the steering can be (and here, should have been) greatly lengthened. That pushes the pedals forward which would have stretched him out ... but it would also push the pedals downward and presumably reducing aero. For an example, Tim from Bent Revolution is 6'-8" ... watch his review of the Cruzbike S40 and you'll see what I mean. His pedals are waaaay forward and down. Everything has pluses and minuses.
I put over 8,000 miles on a previous generation Cruzbike V20 over the course of two years. Everything from time trials to fast centuries to commuting. It's an excellent bike!
commuting-wise, how is a recumbent? I'm a bit apprehensive since it's hard to check your rear and the lower profile makes you harder to see
I didn't have any trouble. I always use a mirror on recumbents because you can't turn around to see behind you. As to visibility, a V20 (or other highracers) don't sit that much lower than a regular bike.
'Bent v. upright. Always a trade off. With an upright you can rock the bike, dance on the pedals, grtr ability to move around on the saddle. On a bent you're pretty much stuck in the same position w/ exception of sliding down and up depending on grade of climbing or descent.
@@PrescottHome would you say that a recumbent is more suited for "city riding" and less capable on hilly rides or in situations where you need to be more agile?
Sounds like you had some fun! Isn't it great when you find your perfect bike?
You should have mentioned that because it's too fast it was oulawed for racing in 1934 by the UCI (like many other cool stuff) which is why you don't see that many around...
It's ridiculous. The point of invention is to push the tech forward, not stop its advancement.
Yes, the banning in 1934, after it had been officially accepted/approved, is among the most political decisions ever made in sport. If more cyclists today knew the full story, they would be far more appalled than what the UCI did to the Flying Scotsman in the 1990s. The UCI is definitely the main enemy of the very sport they pretend represent.
The thing was that Francis Faure, who took the hour record on a Mochet Velocar recumbent in 1934, was considered a bit second division and they didn't want the top record held by someone they felt not the best athlete.
Personally I'd have said "well, here's a better bike for the job, any athlete can ride it and set a bigger distance", but this is the international governing body of cycle racing we're talking about so of course they banned recumbents by defining them out of existence as bikes 🙄
@@davidhunternyc1 The reason why road bikes are more or less interchangeable (at any given price level, at least) is rules that make it so that it's athletes racing one another on even equipment, so from that perspective there's a reason not to mix 'bents and uprights...
But banning 'bents altogether as not bikes was ridiculous. Motor racing and sailing have classes where everyone has the same thing and where everyone has some degree of free rein to experiment, same cycling didn't follow a similar path.
@@pjclinch00 Exactly. Why isn't there a division in the Tour de France for recumbents? The course is there. It's set up. Let the riders ride. I bet the world would be revetted watching recumbents struggle up those hills and flying down afterwards.
I owned two Cruzbikes in the past including an earlier version of the bike in the video. It was very fast. But I found it did not climb well on steep grades AND the rear wheel was very easily disturbed by the smallest of road debris.
What made me sell the fast Cruzbike was a near accident I had while descending a steep grade at 35 mph - 40 mph. The rear tire hit a small rock and almost came out from under me. I was barely able to regain control of the bike. I had a similar thing happen going 10 - 12 mph over a modest sized speed bump in my own neighborhood when I almost lost control again. I sold the faster of the two shortly after these incidents and donated the slower bike.
It takes a few rides to get used to the pedal stroke and even after months of riding, taking off from a red light produces a short duration of left/right weaving. On the flats, they are very comfortable to ride and you get virtually no neck or seat pain!
Have you ever thought about the M5 CHR? I have one, it doesn't exhibit the issues you mentioned, and is arguably just as fast as the Cruzbike V20C. Personally, I always leaned toward the M5 CHR because of the handling, the learning curve, and the twitchiness so many people seem to mention with the V20. The M5 CHR is just such an easy bike to ride in comparison...in my opinion. Just something to consider. And I'm not at all dinking Cruzbike. For those that master the handling, it is an incredible bike. It is still on my bucket list to possibly own one and see if I can master it, but something tells me I would still go back to the M5 CHR. Who knows. :)
interesting.... I have broken a rib and a collar bone by going over the front of my road bike... but i have not broken any bones yet on the vendetta as i don't have to fall so far. Personally i think its superior
@@onederment Same here. It is really hard to flip a V20.
I sold these at a bike shop. They take time to master and Cruzbikes say to take several days at least to get confident. I managed to get around the parking lot. It's like learning to ride a bike all over again. Having the cranks directly attached to the steering totally changes what happens when you put down power.
Hank just loves to jump on and get on with it!
Yeah to me that is what separates Cruzbikes from other recumbents is the way you're able to put the power into the bike that you can't on other recumbents.
Maybe you can help with an opinion about Hanks leg extension on that bike, it seems like he's really close to the pedals. Is that true, or is that the proper way to position on this sort of bike?
@@zincfive Nah, Hank needs quite a bit of fit help to get the most out of that V20. Additionally, His V20 is fast now, but with better wheels, a better fit, bars turned down a tad, a tailbox behind his head, and a seat that doesn't curve up putting his head up too high would make him significantly more efficient. As was mentioned in the video Hank needs 240 watts for 40kph. I need only 200 watts for 40kph on my V20, and some of the shorter and smaller V20 riders need as little as 180 watts for 40kph. Most recumbent riders use 160mm cranks, some are even shorter than that. But Hank needs to adjust the boom so his bottom bracket is a bit further out so he isn't curled up so much.
I live in South Denver Colorado USA. We had a famous bi-weekly somewhat hilly crit-like ride called the Meridian ride. This one dude on a recumbent, housed by a yellow bubble used to show up. I laughed at him at first, until he just rode away from all of us. That's aerodynamics!!
all the more impressive considering the high elevation
@@cha1rtech ?
@@PrescottHome figured the higher elevation and less dense air would be relatively more beneficial to the upright bikes
Hahahah this bikes are rapid! 💨
@@PrescottHome nope
I’m paralyzed and use a handcycle. Similar pros and cons. I can’t keep up with the able bodies on the climbs, but I make all that time back on the decent.
Have both. Use my regular bike with my friends on Group rides. But nothing beats my recumbent bike when I want to do 100+ mile ride just by myself. Super comfortable and this brand actually allows you to use your upper body on hills, which is not an option on other brands. That’s because it’s design.
Thanks for the video, I very much appreciate the broader view of the cycling world.
We love all kinds of cycling 🙌
The Cruzbike History is quiet interesting. Originally came from an add on kit to transform a Y frame into a Front Wheel drive Bicycle.
I have one of Cruzbike's early full bike, the Freerider. The Parker Family have made big advances in Front Wheel Recumbents, to what you see today.
I have . A Rans SWB 20" rear wheel drive; Dahon 20" folding converted to 26" FWD ; Cruzbike Freerider 26" ; Homebuilt LWB RWD on 700c and 2 Racing 16" Trikes.
Always like your content. Greetings from Durban, South Africa.
There should be a bike race with the only rule being the bicycle has to be human powered. The track will be half off road dirt and half on road pavement
On "Roads" there are Human Powered Vehicle races
Mid August is the World Championship in England for example
I was gonna say that those races exist, but I only know them on closed tarmac. Mixed terrain would be interesting. I inly know of brevets and RTFs (no idea if they are called the same in English), but those aren't races and not easily spectated.
I've done some single track and bad agricultural paths. In a recumbent you need a bit more adaptation to be fast in that. Bike choice might be very different from race to race, depending on the mix of the track and of course from rider to rider. Gives more depth to the race tactics.
Eeeek! That sounds tough! Have you looked into the lifetime gp? They may have a few rules but it's great to see mixed discipline racing 💨 👉th-cam.com/video/A7MfI3-F5eA/w-d-xo.html
I'm using a recumbent for my 16km commute, way faster than any of my upright bikes, saving about 5 to 10 minutes. 2 wheeled recumbents peaked in popularity around 2010 and a good used one can be had for cheap, picked up a very clean Bacchetta Corsa a couple of years ago for $700
that is a serious time saving!
In Australia, I cannot find any used. Cant even find new 😂
@@superwag634 plenty here in the US,, guessing the shipping to Australia would be far too expensive
I wonder how these things act over bumpier roads, especially with those narrow road tyres. On a normal bike, you can stand up, allowing your legs to act as a natural suspension. With this, wouldn't all the impact just go straight through your back?
i ride a cruzbike s40. You definitely feel the bumps of the road more than an upright bike.
You are correct. But the large seat helps spread out the impact forces. And many recumbent riders run wider tires. Some have active suspension systems, but of course that adds weight, complexity and cost. If you ride regularly on poor roads, recumbents might not be the ideal type of bike.
Cool, got a Cruzbike too, but a little less reclined, the S40! Love it!
👍
Thanks @gcn for your recumbent coverage. As a rider and racer of recumbents and penny farthings it’s great to see these niches getting explored. Hope you’ll be at the BHPC worlds in in August? Get the fit of the Vendetta sorted for Hank and he’d be very fast!
Now that would be cool to attend the BHPC Worlds!
If you guys are serious about attending the Worlds talk to Hank we've already sent him a briefing sheet. Love to see you there, Barney, Race Director.
I had a go on the back of a tandem recumbent about 25 years ago. With your back supported you can put so much power down whilst still feeling like you're relaxing in a comfy chair. It makes more use of your glutes, which seems sensible. Always wanted a recumbent...
The amount of glutes utilized depends on the geometry (and pedaling style). It mostly differs between models in the seat angle and the bottom bracket hight.
Could this bike be the one that tempts you over? 👀
@@gcntech noo, I don't like the crank being mounted on the forks. Plus I have to buy bikes and stuff for my daughter
I recently bought and started learning on a Cruzbike Silvio which is very similar to the V20. Im coming from the usual upright road and gravel bikes. There is certainly a learning curve and after about 25 road miles in car free areas, im getting enough confidence to maybe deal with cars. But climbing is over 6% is my limit and it takes more time, maybe a year or more, before people are doing real climbs.
you could mount a helmet shape object around the front chain ring, reducing even more drag, so you don't have the hassle of a complete closed bike
I always thought that because the recumbent takes maximum advantage of the glutes, the gluteus maximus, medius and minimus, the power output for a particular individual is potentially always higher on a recumbent than an upright.
If it wasn’t so expensive, I’d buy it and add to my collection of 7 bikes
I think Classified hubs would work perfectly for this setup. Won't have to figure out a way to mount a front derailleur, but still have that 2x system.
good idea!
This was my thought as well, looking closer at the bike.
I'm a "window shopping" fan of that hub. I'm in the narket to build myself a new wheelset (hopefully by the new year), and have given serious thought to that hub.
Hank, are the pedals and seat positioned in the correct distance? It seems that your pedaling motion is not efficient.
I love your recumbent vids. These in an aero shell(w battery?:) are well and truly the future of transportation in descently flat parts of the world. Great video
Currently the Podbike Frikar has quite a few people interested. It's an enclosed ebike. Not fast and really relying on the motor (doesn't even have a chain or belt, you just pedal an electric generator). More of a bike are Quadvelo and Pedilio, but these are also not fast and sporty. Most velomobiles can also be retrofitted with a motor at the cranks, though. Currently there is a new model, that is fast and sporty like the expensive ones but is one of the "cheap" ones. It's the Bülk 4 More. Still 6000€…
They climb hills well unassisted and the best riders tackle mountains. Battery assist is great for mortals.
I got my Easy Racers Tour Easy recumbent over 30 years ago. It was great for commuting in Louisiana where it was flat. The bags I had on the rack were behind me and added little drag. I once used it for a ride from South Carolina to Pennsylvania and was able to do consecutive 200 mile days with the panniers carrying my gear. It does not do as well on steeper hills but is geared to make them just take a little patience. As for the future of cycling, I think they are a part of the past, present and future just like many other bicycle types.
Great video !
Nice bike as well !
I’ve built 4 LWB Recumbents
All made from recycled bikes
See on my TH-cam channel
Recumbents are the most comfortable
Keep up the good work !!
some trikes are very fast too and do not have the learning curve and terrible low speed manoeuvring capabilities of fast two wheeled recumbents. they are incredibly nimble and fun. the greenspeed aero is the fastest production trike. its not as fast as this cruzbike but probably competitive with a time trial bike. i do not think the cruzbike is a good example of a recumbent bike either, due to the moving bottom bracket, which just adds to the already steep learning curve. power wise, there is a myth recumbents are down in watts. because of the open position, back rest and handles, you can really lay down the power on a trike, far more than a sitting cyclist can, and probably more than a standing one. as to trikes being 'invisible' to cars, that rubbish too. nothing is more noticable than a recumbent trike or bike, because humans notice unusual things. they stand out like a neon glowing sore thumb. forget a ferrari. if you want attention, ride a trike. super powerful lights are a must though. and an airzound certainly helps educate dopey or inattentive carwankers, oops i mean motorists lol
Instead of the Cruz bike, the M5 lowracer is a much better representative of fast recumbents.
I think Highracers are the beat representative matching road bikes. So Bachetta CA, Metabike Mystique, M5 CHR, Schlitter Freestyle, Cruzbike V20.
For lowracer Morciglio M1 and Velokraft are the best reps
Yes the Velokraft and M5 high racers have been used to great success for unfaired hour record attempts and still handle real road riding very well
@@VYBEKAT The reason I thought of a low racer when I saw this video, was because he highlighted the advantage of lower wind resistance. That's much lower on a lowracer than on a highracer.
I have raced many times against racers of a similar level to me, who are on an M5 CHR. It is comparable to the V20 on the flats, but gets left behind on the hills. They also have heel-strike issues, and I noticed their chain kept getting bumped by the front tire in turns. The V20c doesn't have those problems. It also seems the M5 CHR is out of production. I have also raced against many low racers. They do well on a track, but get left behind in road racing on rough roads, hills, etc. You don't see low racers or M5s setting any records at Bike Sebring, Texas Time Trials, or the Hoodoo 500.
Ceteris paribus, it's the rider/racer that makes for velocity.
The main advantage of a recumbent is comfort. It doesn’t matter how detailed a bike fit or wonderful the saddle it doesn’t come close to a recumbent. Get one with 3 wheels and it’s even more relaxed, no fear of falling off! I’m quicker on a carbon roadie overall, but my rides don’t have medal ceremonies at the end so why give a ***k? You get a great view forward and with mirrors a great view backwards without straining. Stick a streamer fairing on in the winter and cold rides get warm. Always in a aero position no contortions needed. When people ask me why a recumbent I usually say when heading to the pool on holiday do you look for a sun lounger or a fence post to sit on? It’s that big a difference.
I think the three wheelers are more fun as they are stable and much lower to the ground. You feel like you going twice the speed you are. You will beat every every bike from a standstill at the traffic lights. It's glorious seeing the shock on their faces. In the right conditions I'll hit 50km/h. And I'm in my late fifties and not hugely fit. And I have nasty injuries that mean I can't ride a conventional bicycle. It really is the most fun of all.
Shout out to ICE Trikes in England, one of the top four respected manufacturers in the world. They do the Aston Martin version of recumbent trikes, and the best customer service of any organization I've ever dealt with. No I'm not affiliated.
If you've not ridden a recumbent, you have deprived your bicycle life of a lot of satisfaction and speed.
The Cruz bike is also not the best representative for the 2 wheel recumbent. A M5 lowracer would have been a better showcase for people that don't know anything about the recumbent.
@lise1255 I agree, the M5 lowracer should definitely be the quicker bike, but I guess it is also a bit harder to manage riding on it. The smaller distance of the rider's CG to the ground makes it more difficult to hold the right balance. Anyway, the low racer would have been interesting, but so is the Birk Komet as well. The Birk with its nice fairing will be noticeably faster than the M5 and the Crizbike.
They have had a lowracer in another video already. I am happy, they show a bit of diversity with such a different bike this time. Also the Cruzbike patented drive train design™ specifically markets to the road bike crowd AND there was probably some sponsoring or something involved. 😉
I don't see, why a lowracer would be any better a demo piece for a newbie, anyway. Only advantage is you can rest your hand in the ground and start with both feet on the pedals. It's not more easy to stand still or to start and stop or to control or to see something, nor is it any faster. It's just a different look and feel that you might prefer or might not.
@@johannesobernoeder1156 i disagree with the balance on a low racer vs. a Cruz bike. It's also less dangerous the closer you are to the ground. Regarding the Birk, the velo-mobile is a completely different category. I think the idea behind the video was to show a different take on bikes, not alternative transportation as such. I ride various recumbents, - mostly trikes in my age (old), and I am a big advocate for either crank forward bikes or real recumbents of various types.
I think the pedals need to be moved forward a few inches. Looks like he's not able to fully extend his legs when he's pedaling.
Interesting content. Thanks. 👍
The fact that it’s front wheel drive is the most interesting part for me. Most of the recumbents I’ve seen use a ridiculous long chain to get the power to the rear wheel.
It's cool isn't it! We love seeing new cutting edge tech like this 🤯
I've had a Cruzbike Q45 for a few years . There was a learning curve to master the new skill. Being a unicyclist was no help with this development. I just had to put in the hours on parking lots and recreational trails before I was ready to mix with traffic. I the sun exposure pattern is different. I'm still working out how best to stay dry in a steady rain.
Interesting...
Many years ago I had a LWB recumbent with under seat steering,it had plenty of cons but it was a bit of fun. I would have a newer recumbent like a Azub or bacchetta but my MTB's take all my money 😅
awesome mate, now let's see on the trails and hit a few jumps! 😝
There are a couple reasons why this is better for the roads we have today.
part of comfortable cycling requires lowering your face to the road/top tube ie. taking your eyes off of what’s in front of you and riding blind, but with the road conditions being what they are, narrow, bumpy and rough, doing this is risky
the second reason is that it’s a little more comfortable for the ass.
We could ask Apple to solve blind riding in part of its ar suite in its upcoming ar glasses with a camera mounted on the helmet that is activated when you lower you face so that you can see where you going and don’t crash, but it’s unlikely to be rolled out well.
Hi Hank. Yes I'm very recumbent keen. I have a late 90s steel recumbent (13kg) which obviously does not benefit from all the latest gear. The main benefit, for an ordinary rider like me, is the no neck pain, no saddle pain easy to look around riding position. It is a great ride except I find hill starts tricky, probably because of the weight, though with a rolling start I have found the Llandogo leg breaker (I think thats what Si call it) ok.
How do you adjust for leg length with this one?
If you do more like this then you'll certainly get more views from me.
His bike fit is horrible. (Probably to make it easier to ride without sufficient practice.) Other than that it's a nice bike. I have one as well. Want to replace as many of my other recumbents with MBB* style, as possible.
*) "Moving Bottom Bracket". That direkt front drive, where the bottom bracket moves with the steering. Takes some getting used to, but can be well controlled with feet only, with enough practise. Also has that nice crisp feel, you upright riders know and great engagement of arms and core. Also less complex than rear wheel driven recumbents. Great for All wheel drive with a hub motor, as well. 😉
I was thinking he wasn't getting nearly enough leg extension. The boom tube is adjustable for this purpose, isn't it? I've had a couple of Bacchetta high-racer 'bents since 2009 and have put around 50k miles on them. The Carbon Aero is a good option for a TT. Recumbents have pluses and minuses, like every bike. For someone who doesn't spend a lot of time on a 'bent, Hank performed quite well!
You know, sail boat racing has changed and gone the way of the catamaran. Much faster. There are still traditional boat races, but the America's Cup? Oh wow! You'd think the powers that be could acknowledge advances in cycling.
Yeah cruzbike!! They do zwift racing w that bike as well
Make it an e-bike, put a shell around the front side and use a pneumatic lever so you can change position from upright to laying down.
how do you climb a mountain with that?
That's their downfall. Note- racetracks don't have mountains on them. Had they done this comparison on a moderately hilly route it'd be much closer.
They actually climb very well, generally considered better than other recumbents. The only issue is that you can only spin - no getting up out of the saddle.
Jason Perez did win a hilly amateur race series, the Triple Crown in California in 2016 on a Cruzbike V20. So I think the person on the bike also matters, and there are so much less strong riders interested in bents.
Cruzbike makes an S40 model with a higher seat angle that's a little better (imo) for climbing than their V20s. But then you lose some of the aerodynamics on flats. I've got an older Cruzbike that I use on rail trails, but I'm thinking about getting an S40 for a lot of the rolling country hill roads near me
@@taufikabidin412 damn what a monster! climbing on that makes your body tilt in a very backward way (in my imagination)
I rode recumbents for several years before moving back to a wonderful Roubaix in 2009. I’ll never go back to ‘bent. Sure, there’s a drag benefit, but climbing is a miserable business and gravel would be outright terrifying. I’m confident that on my Emonda, even at age 68, I could out-climb riders 20 years younger on recumbents. A properly fitted Emonda-Checkpoint combination handles all of my road needs.
i also commented / asked under your TT video with this bike. it seems the frame is too short for you, your knees look to much bent, in both positions, are there ways to change position, like you would do with an upright bike? also i wonder how it feels to drive the front wheel, last but not least the neck bent like this, chin at ryou chest, does not look comfortable
not sure if i would want to ride it on the road. lower visibility and more difficult to see your surroundings. also, not sure how well it turns compared to a road bike. would be fun to try on a bike trail.
Actually you see better than on most bikes if you are not in a peloton. Only totally upright granny bikes match how well you see. The limiting factor is the field of vision of your eyes because you look at the horizon unlike the front wheel of most uprights.
This would do better with other than STI levers.
The last time I spoke with Cruzbike, they had no UK importer. Has this now changed? If so, I have been after one of these for a long time.
The closest dealer to you would be in Guererard, France, just east of Paris.
How do they handle? Are they as twitchy/agile as youd like a race bike to be?
Where do i find these "sprace grade" tubes he's on about?
The only thing I would be concerned about (for us over 50 folks) is hitting bumps/potholes etc... without the ability to absorb the shock with my legs. Would love to give one a try.
Back in 2017 or so I test rode one of these, an earlier model obviously. Putting power into the same wheel used for steering made it VERY difficult to track straight and maneuver.
Check my most recent upload. I go through these very narrow gates at over 50kph on my V20, showing it is very stable.
How do you adjust this kind of bike to your height? Is there the possibility to slide the crankset further?
They are adjustable and suit small and tall people.
Well, this video was like giving candy to a baby and then snatching away at the last second. Chh.
never a truer word spoken!
@@gcntech Don't forget to fix your leg and headrest position for your TTs.
How does it steer? Do you swing the whole handlebar left and right, or do you rotate it on the stem/ thingy? Looks like it'd foul your knees if you had to turn sharply.
You're kind of doing both. because your knees are in front of the handle bars and it's a moving bottom bracket, you CAN turn pretty sharply but it takes some different turning techniques and practice. It really takes time to get comfortable and proficient handling Cruzbikes, but it's well worth the effort (imo). I love these bikes!
Same way you steer a "normal" bike: lean it over and the steering geometry does the rest. As with a road bike the fork doesn't have to move far unless you're going slowly, which isn't what this is for...
@@pjclinch00 If I'm going uphill, I'm likely to be going very slow!
Hank, your legs are bent quite a lot. Is that better in that riding position or is the adjustment difficult or is it just your personal preference?
to be honest, Hank didn't set it up perfectly! It is quite a different feel and setup at first - we need him back out on the Cruzbike after a fitting session!
"SMILEEEEEEE!!!" cit.
So… when you steer, does the pressure through the pedals go out of balance because the drive is on the steering wheel? How does that feel?
Learning curve. But with a small effort you can build `muscle memory'.
I want to try it for quite a while.
Im probably missing something here, but how how are you supposed to take slow switchback corners without your knees having to bend left to right? On a normal recumbent this isnt a problem but with the pedals basicaly mounted to the front wheel this seems... difficult?
This is a high racer, why not try a low racer, there was an older English all carbon bike called the Wind Cheetah not in production any more that was at the time one of the fastest bikes ever clocked. I think the front wheel is a 20" and the rear wheel is a full sized wheel so you get proper drive level, but much less CDA. Also, you are not as high off the ground the slow starts may not feel as tippy. As I went back to try and find a link it turns out to have been a trike and not a low racer
#AskGCNTech Hi techsters and Hank, could you tell us a bit about specific training, practice and bike fit on recumbents / in velomobiles? In the videos there always seem to be issues with lack of control, lack of full power and lack of proper fit or even right shoes and pedals.
Maybe that could even be it's own video with more depth and actual users experience? You must find someone in the office, who would be interested to see what it takes to really get into recumbent riding, not just hop on (and fall off) for a day of shooting?
best wishes
You need to get personal with those who are experienced with recumbent bike fit. many just fiddle alone to get it right because your body undergo changes the longer you are on the bent.
How did you measure the Cx=0.12? Looks impressive, but doubtful, sorry.
The center of gravity seems to be too high, can it be lower?
Also, for decreasing drag, wheels could be with solid flat side, I believe.
"Sprace" grade aluminum (5:08)? It must be really special stuff.
Would these have any place in touring to get more distance in per day, or would their advantage immediately disappear as soon as you try to attach baggage to them?
Great for touring, many go to three wheel recumbents to load up heavy. Plenty of TH-cam vids of touring recumbents, if I’m doing anything over 30 miles I just pick the recumbent, you can go as far as you have energy, no back, neck, arse etc pain to halt the journey. I can ride a diamond further than 30miles, that’s the distance I start questioning why? when I have more comfortable machines at home.😀
Nice bike, but I doubt it is as fast (given a constant input power) as a 'low-racer' recumbent (i.e. Jester, Taifun, or especially the Velokraft NoCom. I'm not being biased, it's just that you can't argue with aerodynamics.
The lowracers are faster and more suited to roads with no motorized vehicles. These highracer bikes are safe on the road being more visible and are good for packing heavy for paved trekking, especially the S40. On long rides you can relax more and will not have the butt, hand, or neck strain found on upright road bikes.
@@williamwightman8409 What you say is true. I have a low-racer - got yelled at a lot by pedestrians (& police - who cited me for not having a flag - said drivers couldn't see me). Also, riding the bike at slow city speeds with stopping and starting at intersections I found to be somewhat suicidal. Incredibly unstable at low speeds, and at high speeds it will go into a 'gyroscopic wheel wobble' if you try to steer by moving the handlebars without leaning the bike into the turn at the same time.
But hell, it is fun to blow past roadies on their training rides - some of them sprint up to catch me, but since you can't draft a low-racer, they soon tire out and drop back.
On the other hand, they can turn a street corner without falling over 🙂.
So, you win some, you lose some.
This must be tricky at very slow speeds, where the drivetrain pivots with the bars. Knees don't bend that direction! That might be worse than toe overlap.
It is a matter of getting used to. All recumbents have a learning curve these have more than most.
Curious whether your legs should have extended further. Looks weird to me.
Yes! His bottom bracket was very close and his seat extremely short. Probably both to make it easier to ride with insufficient practice.
The recumbent bike is nowhere near as fast as me when I'm wearing my new trainers. I whoosh and wwwhish dead dead fast.
I've ridden one. They are fast on flats and downhills, but not as fast uphill. And I generally didn't like the steering / feel of (lost) balance while on the bike. Maybe it takes some getting used to but it didn't feel as stable, and I don't think it handles as well when confronted with mixed terrain, sharp curves etc. It's ideal for e.g. flat country commuting (like in the Netherlands), with few stops / traffic lights / hazardeous crossings.
Actually it is more stable in curves in general. Maybe not ultra low speed ultra tight angles, but everything else, very much. It just takes a lot of getting used to. It has a lower center of gravity than a traditional bike, an with proper tyres/riding technique, they are, for the same rider, faster. Think of it as riding a big enduro motorcycle, where in some cases it is more beneficial to lean your body to the outside of the curve, the bike into the curve. I find in that setup this bike flies.
Disclaimer: I didn't ride the v20, but I own both the q45 and s40 which is very similar to the v20. Riden 8000km in 5 years on both, would have been much more if it were not for health issues. Love these bikes! Any sort of incline where it is not asphalt they are shit, everything else I prefer it to a diamond frame.
you need to train this position. I took me 500km to be familiar with the steering. My muscles needed 2000km to get used to the recumbent position. Difference in Poweroutput: I measured multiple times with an SRM in the 00-Years : Difference is below 5%, maybe about 3% . But an exact result was not possible. Wheels and Tires had different sizes, recumbents have a weight disadvantage and you need a person which is well trained on both bikes.
How are front-wheel driven recumbents on steep climbs?
@@kidsafeThey need tacky rubber that is wide. Spinning pedaling at 19 degrees with 37-622 Vittoria Voyager Hyper is fine.
@@kidsafe less power output so a bit slow and not much of an aero advantage. + you can't dance on the pedals. So for me that's not very comfortable, but as I said, I've ridden it once or twice (owner was a friend), so I don't have long-term experience.
Where's shadowstand?!
Not compatible, sorry. 😅
CdA = Cd times frontal area
the CdA quoted for the Cruzbike seems optimistic, an earlier version (Cruzbike Vendetta) had an estimated CdA of 0.185
I've conquered the 5000km Race Across America four times-twice on a recumbent, twice on a conventional bike. Let me be unequivocal: the recumbent platform is not just marginally better; it is dramatically faster and infinitely more comfortable.
Met a lot of recumbent bike riders in RAGBRAI, some have back problems so they can only ride recumbents with comfort now.
One of the main problems is that they always had to bomb downhills or otherwise they would lose a lot of momentum going uphill. So regular riders often have to be on the lookout for those recumbents, and give them right of way which is a hindrance in a large event with many types of different bike speeds like RAGBRAI.
Another issue is that some might ride tricycle recumbents, so those can stay upright even if the bike is at a stop. Therefore they can ride at slower speeds, while chatting with their buddy also on a recumbent, thus taking half the road for themselves. And the only way to pass those groups of riders is swerving around them, often crossing the middle of the road where there might be road hazards (like speed bumps or even gaps in the roads that can grab your front wheel).
Plus, if someone were to crash into a recumbent, the recumbent rider would probably not be affected (since they're riding a tricycle low on the ground), while the 2 wheel road bike rider would fly over handlebars.
As cool as this is if I’m buying a recumbent it has to be a velomobile. They just seem super nice.
They have great advantages and great disadvantages. I would rather have only an unfaired recumbent than an upright bike and a velomobile. (Luckily I can have all of them 🤣)
Why you haven't chose a hillier road to compare this bike with TT or regular aero bike?
It's great for speed, good for travels too on plain lands, and quite bad for everything else. I hate riding on flats, and it's full of mountains around me, so it's definitely not my kind of bike. Kinda like aeros.
I use recumbents for everything. My 10min commute, trips through a larger city, exploring different kinds of roads and paths, long road rides, holidays. I should get my handy on an upright bike to compare on steep uphills and rough terrain, but I am not missing anything. Of course this model from the video is a race machine, lika a TT bike, it's not an all-purpose-bike. But it's supposed to be quite goot uphill, unless the road gets too slippery, because you do lose some traction on the front wheel drive, when you tilt back. I recommend an oval chain ring in the right orientation for a smoother torque curve. No harsh spikes in the need for traction.
@@PsyKeks yes you can use it for almost everything, like you can go around in city with a single fix (no brake), like someone does, but it's not where they have sense. The main problem of recumbents is weight and stability at low speed. And with the front tractions, it's a big problem. I like to climb on steep roads, some moderate gravel too, and with this kind of bike you can't.
@@PsyKeks Spin to win on front wheel drive. When I had an MBB made with a Cruz Bike conversion kit I did not have slips on 19 degree uphill with 37-622 Vittoria Voyager Hyper. The rubber is super tacky. It attracts dust so it needs regular wiping. Starts in mild up hills do spin on asphalt. Not easy on unpaved surfaces!
@@MicheleGardiniOn asphalt I did not have the tire slip on 19 degree up hills with 37-622 Vittoria Voyager Hyper. Super tacky rubber.
@@JanneRasanen2 it works on asphalt, if it's dry and not so cracked. On moderate degrees, even on paved roads. Not on gravel, and not on wet asphalt. I can agree it's not usual to ride in this condition, but I don't need a bike with such limitations. I like to climb, and on rough roads too. It would be different if I would have problems from position. Because the greatest advantage of recumbents, and it's sad that they didn't talk about it, is the more relaxed position for the spine. If you have spinal problems, it's a game changer.
Is that a stick propping up the bike for the first couple minutes?
The bike would be so much cooler with a slightly angled downward flat bar
the optimal hand position is next to the legs, for strength and aerodynamics. You can of course change the bars however you like. I put a Surly Corner Bar on mine, with separated MBT shifter and brake levers.
Difference between traditional wide handlebars and tiller handlebars. Here's an example of a super aero tiller and narrow inverted bullhorn bars with levers. (This bike also has a very reclined hardshell carbon seat). th-cam.com/video/fS7SDxbx_co/w-d-xo.html
yep recumbents are a real benefit. have a cat trike 700 so fast!!!
How it fits to different body types??
Bottom bracket can be adjusted in distance (was way too close here). Because at higher distance the BB comes low, you can also purchase longer chain stays to bring the feet higher again. Handle bar can be shifted front-aft as much as you could want. Hight depends on BB position and a "curved slider" can be purchased to lower them. This is the upgraded seat, that can be changed in length and neck rest can be adjusted freely.
I am 1,85m (6'1) and was about 85-95kg, when I last rode my V20c. I got the longest chain stays. I like the high BB position, but the bars come a bit too low. I might get that fixed with shorter cranks (BB can move away and handles can move away, still clearing thighs) Original, non adjustable seat without raised shoulder was fine, but original, barely adjustable neck support wasn't for me. I needed the upgraded, more freely adjustable neck support. (Now I have a different seat, only because I wanted to mount a tail box, and it has raised shoulders. I can now ride quite a bit without neck support. Will add a cushion for my head to the tail box, though.)
@@PsyKeks thank you. But they should have shown that in the video.
so, and what is the total weight?
Do test a python recumbent as well... It'll be a fun video... :)
At least your drive train is out of the road spray in winter, far less cleaning and wear! Not sure if your hands wouldn’t get tired holding your arms up, as opposed to your arms supporting your body on a normal bike.
Two great observations. Your hands/arms can get tired, but nothing like the wear and tear on your arms/hands necessary to hold your upper body on a traditional bike
Solution: th-cam.com/video/fS7SDxbx_co/w-d-xo.html
@@BikesAndBanjos I guess, especially heavier riders like me will have less problems with ulnar nerve palsy. I've lost my ability to hold a beer one handed for days after back to back long rides, it sucks, and can be pretty limiting
@@zincfive I hear ya... I'm a bigger guy and I play stringed instruments. After long rides on traditional bikes my hands were going numb and I was having difficulty playing music
I wonder if climbing is easier or more difficult due to body position
My take: depends on the steepness of the climb. I sit up more (less recline) on steep hills.
Im curious about why it has aero bars?
You mean `drop' bars. If I had one I'd consider this: (tiller with mini-bullhorn with shift and brake levers) th-cam.com/video/fS7SDxbx_co/w-d-xo.html
Perhaps the cycling Illuminati’s greatest (in an infamous way) move was banning these from regular racing.
They are so frustrating climbing though. I own one
When come the gravel Version of this ?
It's called the Q 45. Fugly!
How to jump curbs or dodge traffic on one of these? You can't even dismount without stopping, this is dangerous to ride in the city.
Would like to see this in a really steep climb
that reminds us of a video we once made... th-cam.com/video/lD53YiygVhA/w-d-xo.htmlsi=c28LNUj2eOMCbJmv 😂
it seems to me you will end with neck pain...... why not adjust it before use it?
I went with my Son to pick up his new carbon diamond frame bike. The company makes top draw bikes. I was talking with one of the company owners. In a nutshell he said if it wasn’t for UCI rules bikes would be completely different. 70% of the aero is the rider, you only get to tweak 30%. So I wonder why if your riding isn’t dictated
by rules, why restrict yourself to them. Maybe without uci rules bikes would be different, more efficient even if not recumbent. All the high street sells is bikes crippled by traditionalists and their racing rules. I’d say don’t go with the herd mentality and pick what works best for you.
can this recumbent bike climb and descend mountains? can it ever be built lighter than a road bike?
Can it ever be built lighter than a road bike? probably not. I think the larger seat ultimately makes it difficult to compete with super lightweight road bikes. But it can definitely climb and descend mountains. You do lose some speed on Cruzbikes on steeper ascents, but the physiology of the moving bottom bracket and front wheel drive train make it possible to use more upper body power on a Cruzbike than compared with most other recumbents.
many recumbent riders say that descending on them is incredible!
@@gcntechSome need brake chutes down a mountain to not heat kill the brake rotors. Especially with velomobiles. They just pack the chute in after descending. They have time they are ahead of everyone including the cars.
Jason Perez climbing on a Cruzbike V20
th-cam.com/video/yNeZdt_BQsg/w-d-xo.htmlfeature=shared
Hahaha what a montage 😅 1:45
5:08 what is “sprace grade aluminium”