Should You Buy an ADV or a Traditional Touring Bike? (discussion)
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 1 มิ.ย. 2024
- #motorcycle #adv #touringmotorcycle #advrider
Let's cover 8 main differences between ADV's and touring or sport-touring bikes. Are ADV's really better? If not, why are they seemingly taking over?
00:00 Intro
02:34 Price
03:15 Weight
03:52 Comfort
04:43 Pillions/Passenger
05:35 Luggage
06:25 Tech
07:01 Versatility
07:49 Seat Height
08:54 Your Thoughts?
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I decided long ago that Adv let’s me go anywhere. But my luxury touring lets me go very far very comfortably. The two don’t cross. So I have both.
Best of Both Worlds!!
That’s what I did. Africa Twin for exploring, Goldwing B for relaxed Touring
Flex 💪🏻!
There's an Australia youtuber, can't remember name, and he just has his Norden 701 trucked to where he wants to explore, then flies to that location.
@@lukeadv lol Norden 701 for adventure. 747 for comfort…. Dude for the win!
I'm an "older" rider.. age 67, started riding at 55. After riding cruisers for the past 12 years, I got my first ADV this year, the CB500X. In no small way, influenced by your reviews my friend. It's light, upright, easy to lift,plenty enough power, not intimidating, and I can finally do trails, dirt and gravel without fear. Most importantly it's FUN !! What a revelation! A whole new world of possibilities have opened up for me. I'm taking off-road lessons, and completed 5000 miles of touring (yeah,I'm retired) in the first 2 months of riding. I am Never going back to low & heavy v-twin. So to your question,I suppose there will be a diminishing number of the old school Harley-conscious image riders,as they age out of riding (have you even seen the greying at Sturgis, Laconia, poker runs, etc?). Younger riders won't even give that scene a second look. I don't blame them. The future is ADV. And you're in the right place at Big Rock Moto to take a leadership position in this transformation. Thanks for everything you do!
Thank you so much for your perspective as a long time cruiser rider and how you have enjoyed the Honda CB500x.
@@kevinb2844
- in south-eastern U.S. 60% of motorcycles are cruisers, so not everyone is switching to ADV;
- at Black Bike Week you will never see ADV
th-cam.com/video/k2Oc2GQGlAg/w-d-xo.html
Also 67, started riding 3 years ago.... on my 2nd Harley touring, but getting tired of sitting low and making noise. Demoed the Triumph Tiger 1200GT, the BMW 1250RT, and soon the BMW GS. Also, I think the seating position of the Harley might contribute to low back pain which I never had until starting riding.
One thing I noticed when I first switched from a cruiser to an adventure bike was how well it navigated obstacles in the road. Whether there is trash in the road like grass, oil or tire snakes or if you run off the road the adventure bike tends to be much more adept to handling obstacles. For that reason I believe adventure bikes are safer.
agree with you on that one. went off the road on a sharp curve when a blue jay hit my chest and then in my face, went off on wet grass with my KTM 390 Adventure with Dunlop TrailMax Mission tires, between the tires and traction control had no problem finishing the curve and then slowing down to get back on the pavement which was 2-3" higher than the grass.
i` Agree 100%➕Light Lbs HeLp.
Agreed, My KLR handles pot holes and unforeseen obstacles quite well.
Agreed. I had a hairy, gravely moment in the Alps on my ATAS. It never faulted. Great bike.
amazing point! agreed
I rode my 2016 Africa Twin from California to South Dakota in 2020. I sold it to get a 2019 Goldwing non tour DCT. I rode my Goldwing on the same trip this year(June 2022). Both trips were pavement. From my experience the Goldwing outshined the Africa Twin by far on said trip. I’m 6’2” and rode solo.
For me it was a simple call, I used to tour on a GSX-R 600 (yes I know…).
I pointed that thing up way too many gravel roads, rough tracks and other places that it really didn’t work.
Hence the “upgrade” to a V-Strom, can go big kms on road, then go “ooh what’s up there” and have a fighting chance of finding out.
I guess this is kind of a personal choice, but over time I’ve leant more towards gravel, back roads and I guess ‘slower’ riding, so a V-Strom makes more sense _for me_.
Totally agree, a naked bike would be easier to ride than a sport tourer on gravel roads but it's still a handful. Since switching to a small ADV, I've had tons of fun going down gravel roads, dirt tracks, riding on beach sand, places I would have avoided on a naked bike or sportbike.
I consider ADVs to be large naked bikes with flatter, wider bars, less steep steering angle, and better wind protection.
@@fallinginthed33p Some naked bikes like the Royal Enfield 500 bullet are great on gravel and dirt roads. as were a lot of the older bikes form the pre 60's and going in to the 70's. But later started things like wider tires some witch were more for the track than the road. But now you pretty well have to go to a ADV or a true Duel Sport. ( by true Duel Sport are bikes that are very good off road and very good on road like the DR650 ) Me I want all 3 in my stable a good light weight ADV a true duel sport and a 90 % off road 10 % on road. All put a huge smile on my face.
I love my V-Strom, and don't see myself ever riding anything different as my main bike.
I'm 45, and have been on 2 wheels since I was able to walk (very little exaggeration here). I've been through various phases in my life, which means I have ridden and enjoyed all types of bikes. In my most recent years though I believe I have settled on the adventure bike as the do everything machine. I no longer need to put my butt up in the air and do triple digit speed, I no longer need to go on hill climbs with my dirt bikes and dual sports and impress anybody, and I no longer intend on putting a thousand miles on in a day. So for me the all around winner is definitely the adventure bike. But to each his own, if it is two wheels, you are having a good time. 😁
As a 2019 Goldwing owner I’m convinced I bought the perfect bike for me. At 66 years old I’m a little reluctant to obtain the skills to become proficient at trail riding. Adventure bikes like the GS and Africa twin are super cool though and when I see one decked out with luggage I think to myself “should I have bought one of those instead?”. Then I crank up my XM radio ,turn on the heated seat and grips, put it in cruise control, put the wind screen all the way up and think to myself “ I’m good “ .
I had an RT, then switched to a GSA but went back to an RT after 2 years. The RT fit my riding style better and I almost never go off road. For the solo long distance high speed riding I tend to do, the RT is perfect.
Best to keep the weight down low RT vs GS if one never plans to take it off road.
Worked my up to an Electraglide Ultra Ltd and toured Britain frequently, loved it. Got taken out by a car driver and wrote it off😥
Bought the 1200 Triumph Trophy SE, a fraction of the weight, super comfy, all the tech, loved it, great economy too, as my Son was coming up the 'bike tree' he got a Suzuki 650 VStrom XT and with a view to exploring Trails and even Norway, I swapped my Triumph (best bike I should never have sold) for a 2011 BMW 1200 GSA (I'd avoided getting one previously as everyone seemed to have one) when I bought one I found out why😁
Super comfy (with a Sargant seat), take the hard luggage off you have near sports bike performance and handling secure lockable luggage and great weather protection.
Good off road too.
But....as the years move on, Son moves away, the touring is now solo and if you have ever tried to lift up a laden GS that has sunk into the campsite overnight, you'll realise it is not a one man job and the 2011 is the biggestand tallest of all the Advs.
Still want the Adventure bike upright comfy seating position, weather protection and go anywhere ability, but now want, both feet on the floor, especially laden , fuel economy, lighter weight, so now we are looking at mid range adventure bikes.
Love the 659 VStrom but found the rear suspension too hard, love the Triumph and BMW mid rangers to but the one that makes me smile alot...2021 Honda CB500X with Givi hard luggage.
Solo riding, touring, going to the shop or luggage off trail bashing, great bike and more than adequate for UK speed limits.
Great conversational video, thank you 👍😁
Oh, the Honda CB500X! That is the bike I want to get to replace my Yamaha Super Tenere, which I've only had a year. The Tenere is great on the highway and twisties and good on the little dirt I've had it on. But it's a beast to move around in my garage, as it's top heavy and I'm tired of struggling with it. I transitioned from riding cruisers to the Tenere as I wanted a bike capable of taking me off the highway a bit. I like the upright riding position of the Tenere. But I have heard so many positive things about the CB500X that it will be my next bike. I am looking forward to having fun with it!
@@nancyfithian4984 I've got one, it's a great bike. Super efficient, I get about 300 miles/ 500km range.
1 Person job to lift any bike while camping, just Jimmy a log under, then canter lever up, or rig a pulley system; (always carry a tow line)/ Best way to winch yourself out of anywhere!. Never be stuck, just because you think you are stuck!
@@macdragon76 Have you ever used/tried one of your practical options yourself?
I have a 2020 Goldwing Tour and in my opinion it is simply unmatched on the highway for long distance touring. Recently I purchased a 2022 CB500X and I must admit that this little bike has impressed me. I find that when I grab my gear to ride, more times than not, it’s on the CB500X. I can’t deny that more than a few times over the last couple months I’ve considered selling the Goldwing and getting a larger, more tour worthy ADV bike. Time will tell, but having sort of the best of both worlds is working for me now.
I think you're spot on Ian. I went from a Concours14, to an Africa Twin, to an R1200RT, and now to a Tenere 700. I prefer the ergos of an adventure bike, as well as the taller stance. The taller stance provides a better vantage point to see those around me while I'm riding, and also have a more commanding presence so others can see me, similar to the SUV analogy you used.
Let me tell you guys one thing: an ADV (a „travel-enduro“ as we call it in German speaking countries)rides A LOT better on street as you woudl imagine. I just compared the retro naked XSR 700 to the Tenere 700 (same engine) and it‘s incredible how you can go almost as sporty on the risd as the naked.
So…the 10 to 20% a sport tourer does better in several occasions (passenger comfort and high speed comfort) is just nit worth it to skip the amazing enduros like Africa twin, Tenere 700, KTM Super Adventure
agree
In my country, it is understood that it is an age thing: more mototcyclists these days are 50+ years old and comfort is king as you get older.
Keeping your back and knees straight becomes far more important as you get older, so the upright adv bikes are great and also give you better visibility ahead which is always a bonus as you age.
so true.. same for suvs... laughed at them when I was younger, then got sick of diving down to get in and out of a sedan... lol.. now i "get it" 😆
I’m 25 and love my triumph scrambler 1200xe. It’s superior to other motorcycles, perfect amount of power and looks awesome.
great points
@@IanTheEarlobe Try a 500km trip in fall, you will change your mind. I have a r9t.
@@duosable Oh you mean Autumn.
I loved my FJR and put nearly 50,000 miles on it before switching to a GS and although I miss the power I wouldn't go back. Here in the mountains with access to miles of fire road, trails and the BDR's in the Western states the GS is the right choice. My wife likes the GS much better than the FJR with it's higher passenger seat height. She now can look over rather than around me and with the top box fitted she finds it a lot more comfortable.
I bought a used bike (2006) to test the waters and other than the servo-pump for the boosted ABS it's a bike I can do all the work on. While TFT displays, electronic riding modes and all the hi-tech that's on new bikes is no doubt nice, it's all stuff the owner can't do a thing with. When you have a mechanical in the back country it's reassuring to be able to pull out the tool kit and have a fighting chance of doing something about it.
I really enjoy your reviews for their attention to detail and thoroughness. For me a rider that lives in a brutally hot climate (Central Texas) for a big part of the year, one glaring omission from your reviews and all others is the amount of heat a bike throws off on the rider. It’s not just engine size that determines this but it’s about the way the manufacturer has designed the wind management to deflect the heat. I’ve owned and ridden well over 100 motorcycles in my time riding so I believe I am very qualified to comment on this.
Where’s the comment? Lots of reviews mention engine heat b
I bought my GS in 2016 I was 68 and I am 74 now. I have numerous pieces of metal holding me together. I was looking for something fun to ride on the street and highways that was comfortable and didn't weigh 800 lbs. Off roading is in my past and I think the GS is a great road bike.
Consider a large scooter like the BMW C400 GT. Lots fun and very easy to ride. Unless you want to do serious long distance rides then take a touring bike.
Yes. But given your situation; wouldn't that bike make more sense if it was lowered a little; had more of a on road suspension, and that way you wouldn't have to make compromises to go off road when you never go off road.
I got my F650GS Dakar mostly because of my height. With 1.90m I sit very uncomfortably on most naked bikes and on all sports bikes. And then I fell in Love with Adv Bikes because of their versatility and the ability to go anywhere. You can easily keep up with everyone else in the twisties, you can get groceries thanks to the Luggage, you can go on vacation thanks to the comfortable seat and soft suspension,… its just great. And like I said, the ability to go anywhere. And with that I don’t want to pretend I ride 90% off road and blast through single trails or something like that. Just the simple fact that you ride on any road condition. One of my main routes goes around a mountain and next to huge lake. It is a very beautify view every single time and I often go there to relax. But the road is very damged from bad weather. So you have a lot of potholes and pieces where the road has been repaired sloppily and so on. This is no Problem at all for an Adv Bike. But I went there once with a naked bike I was repairing for a friend and it was just unbearable.
I recently picked up a gs Dakar. It replaced an mt07. Gs is just as fun in the twisties, yet so much more comfortable and all round capable.
Comfort is also very much something you get used to. I am 1.90 as well and drive an Aprilia Falco, which is not all out sports ergonomics, but it is not far off. After some getting used to, i am very comfortable except for city riding. On the highway, there is no pressure on my wrists at all, i can just put the tips of my fingers on the handlebars.
Traded my 2018 HD RG-Ultra for a 2022 Pan America. Weight, power, off-road ability were key delineators and the Pan Am was simply more fun to ride.
#yammienoob did a great comparison with the HD Pan-America and the Husqvarna 501. Awesome bike!
i want to ride one , have had 1200GS-BMW & 2 KTM Super adventures ect , if you think that PanAmerica has off road ability try the KTM890/Husqvarna901 package !! that PKG is next level good , for real next level weight vs power and low center of gravity ect.. nothing ive ridden is even close to comparable including a heavy modified Tenere' 700 & Africa twin and my own well set up 1090r
I was making the choice between a sport-touring and ADV bike myself a few weeks ago. After having done a test ride on an ADV bike once, and having taken it off-road I was sure I wanted an ADV bike.
However, if I had no desire to go offroad, I think I would have gone for sport-touring. It has a lot more feeling in the corners, better wind protection, looks better (personal opinion ofc) and is cheaper for how much they offer.
I feel like a mid-sized adventure bike is the best Swiss Army knife in motorcycles right now. Something with 70-100hp and between 400-500lbs. You can really do almost anything with a bike like that. They have enough on road performance where they aren’t boring or slow, and they can be pretty capable off-road. If you can only have one bike and want it to be able to do a lot of different things, I feel it’s the way to go.
VERY true
how would a mid-size perform on a long trip, two up loaded with luggage?
Yep, my new do-it-all motorcycle - Vstrom 650 - enough power, not too heavy, not too dear, super comfortable 👍
KTM 890 Adventure or Norden 901.
I wanted to love the Goldwing, but I kept reaching for the T7. It’s just more fun to ride an ADV bike. I actually traded my Goldwing for a Tracer GT9.
Good choice! I migrated to the Africa Twin but a tracer gt9 would have been a more refined choice.
@@jondotcom8706 I bought a late model V-Strom 650, and had I been a little better off financially, I would have gone straight for a Tracer 900. Delicious engine, and Yamaha quality go together like peanut butter and jelly.
If I were to do it differently then
my current 012
Yamaha Super Tenere,,
I would definitely have taken the Yamaha Tracer9 GT. The triple engine is brilliant😍👍.
@@PaydayGabeBCNV heck ya. I like my big twin, but wish it had a smooth, high- revving triple or 4- cylinder. A little pricey to swap at this point, but TBD!
Yeah, I've got the same except my Tracer MT09 is the first model 2015 and the T7 is recent. The triple and the twin are beautiful motors pared to lovely motorcycles.
Looking through the comments, the most obvious trait is what numbers geeks call "selection bias". This channel is Big Rock Moto and has been for a long time concerned with ADV-type bikes to a very large extent, almost completely. The recent appearances of road bikes like the Hayabusa and Gold Wing is a nice broadening that I'm enjoying.
In our neck of the woods, well, there are none too many woods, and very few places to take a bike into any sort of dirty place legally. So doing even modest trail riding requires some fair effort just to get there. So there's that.
Then, of course, I have my own tendencies and biases that have developed over the years- 55 now, and running towards 3/4 million miles of road riding.
Early on, I found that traveling, as I like to call it, was my favorite part of motorcycling. Barely turned 18, I launched on an expedition to our state capital for a three-day weekend and got bitten hard by what you might call the touring bug. The tale of that trip would make a long story in itself, but as I slogged home in a torrential downpour up the new Interstate 55, my BSA's paper-element air filter had rotated and inhaled enough rainwater to swell the paper shut. By the time I got home, the thing could hardly make 35mph. In the dark, in the rain, with Lucas lighting.
So I've had six-cylinder Wings of both sizes, but counted my "main" bikes as my favorites. The Wings were specifically intended to accommodate my spouse, and frankly, I've never ridden anything more capable of taking a passenger more safely. I've long insisted Wings are the one bike designed from the ground up to take a passenger, and the ease with which these spectacular machines do that is literally amazing.
But I don't do Wings anymore, despite my enormous respect for them, as two things have changed: my current spouse began her own riding career, and I've aged to the point where the 900-pounder is beginning to get a bit uncomfortable to handle around the garage. So I went to the FJR1300, my current "traveling" bike for the last five years or so.
But I've also done a couple of ADV-style bikes (including those the Missus had), an NC700XD, a late-model Versys 650LT, and my own, just-for-the-heck-of-it, V-Strom 650.
I like riding almost anything motorcycle and enjoyed each of those bikes, but none could replace an FJR for traveling purposes.
Yet going lighter to accommodate age (past 70), my "main" bike is nowadays a VFR800 with raised handlebars, a larger windshield, and full Givi hard cases. If I need to do 600 miles, it's just barely enough, and beyond that the FJR is a far better answer.
But ADV-style bikes? Nah, the weather protection is inadequate for the vagaries of Mother Nature's less-happy moments, and the seating is normally less-suited to long days.
And don't even get me started on the seat height issue. No, there's plenty of engineering talent out there that could design a capable Africa Twin-like bike with a normal-person seat height.
I even lowered my V-Strom, but then, given the non-existence of dirt for me, it's a road bike with Michelin Road 5 tires and all.
It's a nifty little bike, and someday it may be all this elderly gent can handle, but for now, a fifty-mile burst on the infamous Illinois Tri-State Tollway is enough to kill most any affection it engenders when there's an FJR parked next to it in the garage.
"Technology"? I'll spare you the "when I was a kid" thing, but I did a demo ride on a new Yamaha Tracer 9GT and the instrument panel was possibly the worst I've ever seen on a two-wheeled machine. By the time you found what you thought you wanted, you were already being prepped for the airlift after running off into a tree.
Incidentally, I also have had good, long demo rides on the Africa Twin DCT, and though it might make the basis for a decent road bike after a lot of work and money. Except it was slower than mud.
On my radar are bikes more like the Ninja 1000, which would supplant the VFR and go several notches better. Again, raise the handlebars, bigger screen, and let's go do West Virginia.
Plus I need to mention getting to do 1100 miles on the Versys 1000, which comes pretty darn close to being a good road bike. Lowered an inch, a good saddle (the one I rode had a Corbin that must have been designed for me), and a Madstad windshield conversion... we might be talking something here.
So there's the perspective of a much more open-road oriented old-timer. It's complicated!
Love the channel, sir, keep up the excellent work.
When my 1989 FJ1200 was getting old, I replaced it with a 2005 FJR1300, which is a good touring bike, but the extra 120lb removed the fun, so I got a V-Strom 1000 for the canyons and round town. I liked the riding position and put up with its faults. After 70,000m I replaced it with a 2015 Multistrada 1200S which had so many faults, was a money pit and basically I couldn't trust it, that I offed it after 8,000m. Eventually I got a 1290SAS which I consider a great bike. It is as light and quick as the Multistrada without the endless problems. Compared to the FJR it is simply more fun. For longer trips the wind protection of the FJR may be a factor, but against that, I prefer the more upright riding position of adventure bikes (I'm 74). To give the FJR its due, it is so reliable and needs so little attention that I would only sell it if I had a medical issue and couldn't ride.
I really like how adv bikes look and the upright rider position with good wind protection. However, I am not interested to go off road, so I prefer a road focused suspension with an adventure look. My choice is nc750x.
I also bought a NC750X after my Goldwing 1800...and I adore him...
I really like your discussion style for various reasons! Thank you for your informative videos.
I ride to have fun. 80 or even 60 km/h on gravel or forest road is so much more exhilarating than 100 or 120 km/h on pavement. No speed traps on gravel, no line-ups, way smaller risk of serious injury (due to lower speed = lower kinetic energy). I am too old to race off-road, but still too young to get bored on asphalt.
I own a 2021 Goldwing DCT and agree with some of your points but not others. I'm 6ft 1 and find the Wing much roomier than the AT (ridden my friends AT often). I LOVE the relaxed position of the Wing after riding for 3 weeks\12 hours per day. This is where buffeting, engine vibes can really take away the enjoyment of the ride........the Wing has neither. The one main complaint I have with the Wing is the rear suspension (front is amazing) isn't nearly as good at handling small stutter bumps as most adventure bikes. Although, some adventure bikes I've tested where pretty harsh on small bumps as well. I ride a dual sport bike on the trails for weeks at a time and love it, but the Wing is my mile muncher. I love your channel and you unbiased reviews.
You're really good at picking up points that people might be curious about.
Good conversation starter, and I could talk for a long time about it LOL. I'm 70 years old, and I've been riding for 57 years. IMO, the best riding position is having your weight on 3 points, butt/feet/hands-arms. Your feet should be almost under you. Cruiser and Touring types seem to place 80% on your butt. Not good for 8 hour days. I also tried a trunk/top box once. The wind pushes it around too much for me. Weight should be low, like bags to keep good balance. I also never had a (music)radio. Just too distracting. Heavy bikes are also a lot of "work". Great for straight open road, but they don't handle as well and are harder to ride in twisties, and/or slow riding (parking lots?) I thought the Honda ST1100/1300 was good. I'd like to try an Africa w/ a 16 or 17 aluminum front wheel. Also a Kawasaki 'retro' 900 w/a 'Vetter" fairing, if I could find one. That fairing was one of the best I ever rode behind! I also had a Suzuki G1000 w/shaft drive I liked, and all 8 BMW Boxers! LOL JMHOs Peace --gary
Really appreciate how well you explain such complicated stuff. Thanks, man!
Yes!!!
You just justified a brand new AT.
Had no clue I was gonna pull the trigger today and drop 15k.
I’m a dead man-
But I’m not complaining.
Awesome review, and THANKS. I have been riding a cruiser for a decade plus, but am I am leaning toward the adventure bike now. (I enjoyed watching the racer go past at 4:15... wicked!)
Great video. I have a Concours 14 and I'm really thinking about getting an Africa Twin. Love your videos Ian!
The main reason I want an Adv is for inner city curb hopping and getting better camp sites
4 years ago I spent a ton of time researching and figured a sport-tourer was best for me, so I got a FJR1300. That bike was amazing but, over time, I found myself wanting (and doing) more off-pavement riding. A month ago I finally traded it in for a Africa Twin as I feel that's best for me today. I don't really regret getting the FJR at all, nor do I regret replacing it with the AT. Preferences change. Who knows what I'll want in 5 years but first I have a ton of logging roads to explore. 😊
I have been debating this for quite some time. Thank you for these information.
It’s great that you include the numbers in the metric system as well. Appreciate it.
you seem to cover every question i have just getting into biking, great videos!
I have owned 2 GoldWings and loved them, own a GSA1250 Adventure now and it is as comfortable as the GoldWing yet I get to go off-road also. I feel as though I have doubled my use and capabilities of the motorcycle. I have logged 900+ mile days on the GoldWing and GSA 1250 and can say I actually felt more fresh on the GSA.
Wish I could get a test ride on the GS. I have always liked that bike.
ah crap.... I thought were gonna say that ;). I can't get that GSA out of my head!
Sorry forgot to say a great up load and very very informative My comment was not meant to be a negative one just an old rider with not a lot of money trying to get the best ride to see me out so to speak Hope that makes sense and does not offend !!
Very well presented! I can see the trend in vehicles you describe.
Hello 👋 Ian from Greece!! You know I’ll watch your videos anywhere I may be in the world😃😃 And again another great video !!
Enjoy your videos and perspective on riding. I agree with everything you've said. I have a cruiser (Victory Cross Country Tour) and an ADV bike (Triumph Tiger 900 Rally Pro). Both are excellent bikes, in my opinion, very easy to ride and very dependable. But they have very different missions, for sure. I enjoy riding both bikes very much - just depends on where and who I'm riding with. Also have a KLX300, but I never ride it, so it's going to be sold. Keep up the good work!
Best motorcycle content on the net! You always address the things that actually matter to average riders. Appreciate you, cheers!
Great topic. Never really thought of it till you talked about it. Adv bikes are definitely all around and I'm noticing more of them all the time. I briefly considered a adv bike this past spring but my wife likes to ride and all the points you bring up are the same ones that turned me to a 1250rt. Adv bikes have their place but I never see them ever taking over the market. Gettysburg bike week just finished up a few weeks ago and it was probably 99.9% touring bikes with a sprinkle of sport and adv bikes. It also says something when harley jumps into the adventure market when they've always been focused on touring and street bikes.
bought my BMW GSA 1200 2015 second hand because i like the look of it, it turns out its super comfortable, has height and therefore road presence . I've done a few low level tours in the united kingdom and Ireland areas and always got off the bike at the end of the day felling OK.
I found i have no problem in the twisty roads if the need takes me with enough lean to take away the chicken strips.
having said that I've had sports bikes and naked street machines and i love them all. we as bikers pour to much scorn on each other for the type of bikes we ride i feel , love all the bikes even the honda plastic you hire on holiday.
love the content , keep it coming
Quite by accident i rode a bmw r1200RS with bar risers and a touring windshield. Pure heaven for solo touring. Purchased it in Denver and rode it back to NJ. Next a short trip to the Dragon. Have been on the adv bikes and the tall stance is a bit much. Also have an RT and the mass is unsettling at slow speeds as well. I'm only 5'9" and 158. Was on an African twin for a week, way better than the GS I rented the year prior. That thing is a monster! Perhaps at the end of the day, a bike should just fit the rider. I wanted many bikes after reading reviews and when i test road them, they were awful. Marketing gets us all..
spot on
Great video as always. I have owned both adventure bikes and tourers. I have enjoyed both. Basically it depends on your mission or how you are going to ride your bike. I switched from a 1200 GSA to a K1800GT when I met my wife so that she could ride with me. She got hooked and now rides her own 310R. Looking at upgrading her bike to a 750GS while I’m debating between an 850GSA and 1250GSA. We love to ride on trails and disperse camp and live in NV.
Great discussion! I moved from the old R90/6 BMW to an ATAS as it had many of the same qualities; not too big, very versatile and a great touring bike. It was also $10k cheaper than a GS. I still remember how hard it was to ride rutted dirt roads on the R90 with euro bars 😂
Thanks for another informative video Ian please keep up the great work! I want a new AT DCT soo bad but my wife has suddenly peaked an interest in riding with me now and that goldwing is so slick looking now!
Great video ! Good discussion in the comments as well. The large touring bikes are all capable at what they do. For me it’s the weight. Getting around small mountain towns can bring on challenges to these brutes. Years ago I had a Yamaha FJR and encountered several uncomfortable situations. 800 plus pounds is some serious weight. I agree that the adv segment is growing very fast. However, when I ride the Blue Ridge Parkway I see predominantly Harleys. Since we are so close to Asheville, Knoxville, Greenville and Charlotte. I don’t see that changing very much. I love my GS as it does everything I ask it to. Best!
I've just sold my Yamaha Ténéré 700 and gone back to a naked bike with 17" wheels, and I couldn't be happier. The biggest downside to an adventure bike that I found was the high centre of gravity. You feel like you could drop the bike at anytime, and once it goes past that centre balance point, it's hitting the deck! They take some getting use to, and they're big, heavy bikes. I'm 6' 2", and my Yamaha Ténéré 700 had a 875mm (34.45") seat height, and it was a bit of a handful at times, especially on uneven or slippy ground. My advice before parting with your hard-earned cash, is don't be taken in by all the hype about adventure bikes. Ask yourself, what do I require a bike for? If you're not going off-road, do you really even need an adventure bike in the first place, a tourer might be the better option. If you do want an adventure bike, then personally, I'd take a look at something like the BMW R 1250 GS. That has 19" front wheel, and a lower centre of gravity because of the two-cylinder boxer engine. It's a cracking bike, but they are expensive.
Hello Ian. I'm 71 and new to riding anything motorized on 2 wheels. After months of evaluating reviews including some of your videos and many others I ordered and received the BMW R1250 2022 GSA 40 year anniversary. I hope to take some longer trips on that one once my caregiving commitments come to an end. I also have acquired the modern Vespa 300 GTS, BMW C400 GT and a used BMW G310 2018 for learning how to shift back in March. Being still 6' 7" tall , 260 LBS I find the GSA a great fit with a couple of adjustments. I love the scooters for zipping around town here in Illinois. I find that my interest in other types of bikes has not abated with the acquisition of these 4 so I relate to some of your comments in many of your videos I've consumed over the months. Thanks for doing these and doing them so well!
My decision was since motorcycling to me means "freedom" I favored versatility over all (well, after price to be fair). I didnt want to feel like my bike prevented me from riding somewhere I came across and I'd take the lack of comfort as the trade off. If i wanted to be comfortable I'd take a four wheeled method of transportation instead. Great video!
i think you are spot on in your arguments here. i have a tiger 1200 explorer and have taken my girl on it. she doesnt like that it is so tall. i dont take it offroad either. i could have a touring bike lika a fjr1300 instead but i think im going to go for a smaller adventure bike instead. im very tempted to get a honda cb500x but im gonna check out the v-strom 650 first. i tried the tiger 660 but thats a very road oriented motorcycle with alot of sporty feeling. it felt to me that it was just constantly hunting for more revs and more speed. it was boring to go slow and the whole assembly for the front that is holding the windscreen had alot of flex. going faster at dual carriageway made it rock back and forth. it felt cheap in that regard. blinker button had no tactile feel whatsoever. engine gave off alot of heat. best display on the market in my opinion. it was crystal clear even in direct sunlight. maybe i got carried away here but my point is that a tourng bike doesnt have to be large or low. i just a saw a kymco scooter on my countrys equivalent to craigslist that had 60,000 miles on the clock. turns out some people put more miles on their scooters in a week than some adventure tourers do in an entire year. everything is possible if you have the will for it.
worst thing though if you are considering changing your adventure bike for a tourer is that you might only have adventure styled gear which would make those absolete and you would have to buy new gear. this happened to me when i changed my sportbike for a tiger 1200. now riding around in full leather gear on my tiger 1200xc.
sorry for the monoloque haha.
Very good comparison, your video content is great!
Another great video Ian..myself personally I grew riding dirt/dual sports..I have ridden some cruises and just don't like the seating position.. I currently have a 2020 wr250r and I am awaiting my 2022 tenere 700 to show up at my local dealership..
If comments are the best indicator of great content, then you are Rocking it Big Rock Moto!!! Excellent job keeping your content interesting!😊
You said it perfectly in the intro. It's your bike, do what you want with it. I agree to the handling aspect too. Dirtbikes have alway been funy, easy and comfortable to ride. One thing I love about my AT is that im riding a big dirt bike on the street. It's a blast, comfortable, with tons of power. To each his own, but personally, the ADVs make all around sense.
Hi Ian.
Without wanting to go off-road in a mad way, the ADV certainly allows you to go somewhat off the black top. even the tire selection can suit your riding style.
I have a SUV & I have an ADV. both for the same reasons that you mentioned.
Good point. ADVs and SUVs have some things in common. Before, off road bikes were very specific, and quite bad on the pavement. Technology has made it possible to have these vehicles still be very good off road, and much much better on road. Now it is possible to have just one bike for everything. At least for an average rider.
On the other hand, not long ago SUVs were actually what a ADV represents today. A rugged vehicle with off road pedigree, but with better on road manners. The range rovers, land cruisers and g-class from the 90s come to mind. Nowdays they are just higher and heavier on road vehicles without any off road capabilities, higher running costs and worse handling (compared to the same price "traditional" body style). Are ADVs going to end like actual SUVs? Just a big bike for the looks but without any of the ruggedness? Time will tell.
All those cars you mentioned still have the same or if not more off road capabilities. Its just that nowadays people see them as lifestyle cars. Same as the Ford F150 Raptor and the Ranger Raptor.
Great channel!! Thanks for the effort!
Do you think you can share some easy dirt road for beginners to try out off-roading in Southern California?
I love my V-Strom, but I'm keeping my Sprint ST as well. For one thing, the Sprint is long paid for, so it only costs me a couple hundred dollars extra a year in registration, insurance, and maintenance to keep it. But if I know I will be staying on pavement my entire trip, the Sprint is preferred bike. The V-Strom with the longer suspension and bigger front wheel just feels sluggish to turn in comparison, and I do enjoy the extra wind protection on the Sprint. Features, comfort, luggage are all comparable between them for me. Of course if there's any chance I might leave the pavement, the V-Strom becomes the obvious choice. It's also the more comfortable passenger seat for my wife, but that's more of a design flaw in the Sprint than an ADV vs Sport Touring issue. I will never know what Triumph was thinking putting the passenger seat so high and behind the rear axle on a touring bike, but I forgive it because it's otherwise such an amazing machine.
Great video. When you hit your mid life crisis an ADV makes a lot of sense. Nice upright ergonomics, smooth linear power, fantastic bike on road with the bonus of some optional dirt capabilities. Why limit yourself to road only, when an ADV can take you to more places. Australia has 9 million km of road and 6 million of the 9 million km are dirt so makes a lot of sense. The best National Parks always seem to have a bit of dirt for the last 10 to 50 km. Cheers
Great channel. Americans are in love with projecting an outdoorsy lifestyle. Image is king. My favorite bike of all time was my midnight blue 2003 K1200GT. AMAZING. Heavy. Solid. Almost nimble. My next bike is going to be a 2008-12 1200GS purchased from a low milage IMAGE owner who bought it for commuting while projecting that rough enduro lifestyle - with, of course - Michelin Pilots.
100% accurate review. Have had both bikes and concluded the same! Well done
Thank you for your very informative and well shot video. You point at a question that I’ve been asking myself for some time, too. I think ADV bikes are obviously a must if you’re planning to leave the hardback. I for myself live in Europe (Belgium) and it’s so good as completely prohibited to venture with a motorbike off the tarmac. The same goes for a lot of European countries where we don’t have the luxury of your wide open spaces in the States or in Australia. On the other hand we have some great roads (albeit also a lot of traffic). I’ve been actually “swimming” against the trend as I have recently traded my GS for a different kind of motorcycle. You compare ADV bikes with traditional touring bikes and you mention some specimen (Goldwing, FJR, Concours) all of which have one thing in common, they are heavy bikes. There’s nonetheless a different and very overlooked category of bikes that I find are very well suited for riders like myself who like to ride “sporty”, never do off-road are not too tall or big and take their motorcycles on trips: In Europe we call them “sport-tourers” or “sport-touring bikes”, I traded my GS for a Kawasaki Ninja 1000sx and I cannot recommend that bike warmly enough, it’s smooth, comfortable, easy to ride but when pushed it’s soo fast. Ride safely
I agree! I just purchased a 1000sx here in the States and love it for the mix of sport and comfort for long touring.
I went the DR650 route after buying, then selling my vfr1200x. I considered the super 10, AT, etc… but the reality was the DR did everything I wanted my ADV bike to do. I also bought a very cheap, Kawasaki Voyager 1200. Now I’m getting to cut the fat out of my collection. I highly recommend getting a heavy touring bike (goldwing) and pairing it with a light dual-sport. (Crf300, klx300, dr650,drz400 etc) it’s been a great combo for me
Hi guys. I have just circumnavigated my country Australia on a 2008 BMW 1200 GS .
I traded my BMW S 1000R for the GS specially for the trip for all the reasons in the video, even though my trip due mostly to being alone and time constraints was on tarmac what I found surprising was the capability of the GS on the road : comfortable on the straight roads appropriately good on twisty roads. On dirt roads, even though I have limited off road experience it was confidence inspiring. The versatility and just pain usability of this bike is why I am sure the worlds riders seem to love them. Like most people I would love a garage full of different bikes, but if I can only have 1 the GS is it. Hence I am now oozing to trade it for a later model one.
Cheers Art
I now ride a Honda NC750X DCT which I've had for 3 years, following 6 years with the earlier NC700X manual transmission. The NC has an Adventure appearance but with 17" wheels front and rear and limited suspension travel it is not really an off-road machine. However, its seating position, relationship to the footpegs and handlebars makes it very comfortable for me (aged 74 years, 5'11 - 181cm height). I've done only 9000 miles on it and cannot really justify anything bigger or more expensive. For 7 years I owned a Honda ST1100 and then an ST1300, great bikes with good luggage carrying capacity. I ride solo so the NC 750X's performance is perfectly adequate. Among my riding groups, (in the UK) the BMW 1250GS is taking over from the RT but a couple of members have recently bought DCT Goldwings, with which they're very happy. I have to say that I've dropped, whilst stationary, my NC750 twice in the last two years eand the Givi crash bars prevented anything worse than a slight scuff!.
Love the NC, I wish DCT was available on more bikes. It’s fantastic.
Versatility is my reason for getting my BMW R1250GS Adventure. Be able to travel over many road conditions made it the best choice for me. Having the ability to carry stuff in removable panniers was appealing to me. The robustness and sophisticated rider aids made it an easy choice.
You should experience both!
Two totally different journeys.
I've done two cross-USA and back again trips in two years. One on Tiger 1200 XRx. One on BMW K1200LT. Totally different journeys!
With the Tiger, when I saw gravel, I thought, "Yes!". With the K1200LT, when I saw gravel, I thought, "Oh, $#%!!". The big K1200LT made my trip across much shorter in miles/day. I could simply stay on it longer and go faster. The curves were sooooo much fun on the K1200LT. Not that curves are boring on the road-biased Tiger, mind you! But the gravel roads and remoteness I experienced on the Tiger are some of the most powerful memories for me.
I think everyone should experience both platforms. It's a big world out here. Come see it! I have been creating videos of the two trips on my channel for all to see.
I used to ride a BMW K 1100RS, which most people would call a Sportstourer. Although I was quite happy overall, I realized at some point that I tended to avoid eg the old parts of towns that I was visiting as I did not feel like going over cobblestone. (I live in Europe.) Far too uncomfortable. I also often had to turn around, whenever I encountered dirt tracks or forest roads. So I changed to an ADV bike - and never looked back.
So much more fun, so much more comfortable, so much easier to ride. Sitting position, steering and suspension made all the difference. I never had as much fun riding a motorbike, and that after 30 years of owning one!
I have a 2018 Goldwing manual. Now looking to add the Africa Twin Adventure ES DCT.... for the opportunity to ride off road. Keep up the good work!
Ian,
Great Video, and a lot of valid points. Well done. Liked the bit you added in at the end, which leads me to believe there might be an ATAS video coming soon.
That mosko pico tank bag looks like it fits perfectly.
Ok… what’s telegram?
@bigrockmoto, msg sent.
up until the last couple of years I only rode upright sport touring motorcycles. They were fast enough, gave excellent handling and comfort. I now own a mild adv bike a gen 1 wee strom, it is very similar in comfort (if not better than my sports tourers) similar performance and handling (especially with good after market suspension) is lighter and easier to maintain(no all encompassing fairing that needs to be removed before anything substantial can be done).
I started on a cruiser. I went to an ADV because it seems more comfortable to me, it's also a lot more maneuverable. I also live out in the country where dirt roads and washout is common, so the ADV comes in handy. I'm looking into ADV camping too. Still have my cruiser, but I definitely use the ADV more often.
I have had both of those bikes and I stayed with the Goldwing DCT 2019.
It all came down to comfort, the Goldwing is just the perfect bike for me.
The Africa Twin was fun but it was really too big and heavy for off-road... I tried it, but because it's so big I was afraid of dumping it and smashing something expensive to fix.
Great Video Ian. I was riding my Triumph Tiger 800XCA solo and I loved it. I took it on and off road thru Arizona, Colorado, Utah, Nevada and California for years. However, I had my share of drops because I am only about 68 inches tall and was never able to flat foot both of my feet which is a horrible feeling in uneven terrain. Additionally, I never felt comfortable riding two up on the Tiger because I could not flat foot it and would certainly tip over with a high center of gravity bike. I sat on the new Tiger 1200GT and it was the same story. Therefore, I just bought a 2022 Honda Goldwing Tour model and I absolutely LOVE IT!!! Very low CG, very powerful with a lot of tech and handles superbly. Very confident riding two up. For me, it was difficult to leave the wonderful ADV Bikes but it was the correct choice to get the sporty Goldwing. PS... if I was to get another ADV bike, I think I might go with the Harley Davidson Pan America because of its ride height adjustment and potential low seat height. I still would NOT ride two up on my ADV bike unless its shorter distances on road.
We live in SoCal near you. As you know, it's desert, mountain, highway, gravel, sand, twistes... the idea of this bike is versatility. But yes I get it, many will buy it simply for looks
I've owned 2 motorcycles, a 1994 ZX6 and a 2004 CRF250R, and I loved them both for different reasons. The 94 ZX6 was more of a sport touring than an true sport/racing bike, and I logged thousands of miles on it, including a 3-day stint from Monterey, CA to central TX. My CRF I rode off-road because I became tired of fearing for my life on my ZX6 on the highways here in Maryland where I currently live. Unfortunately, that bike was stolen, so I've been bikeless for about 10 years.
I'm looking for a new bike, and one of my current passions is backpacking. I was looking at a dual sport to use as a moto camping bike, but unfortunately in the Mid-Atlantic, long road rides are required before getting to even forest roads. I stumbled across your channel as well as others and found a fondness for ADV bikes and now I'm on the waiting list for a CB500X. I wanted something small that wouldn't break the bank on upfront and insurance costs, but something that would handle highway stints just long enough to get me to back roads and some limited off-road use.
So for me, the ADV is to use around town and make it to a few trails for riding and camping. One thing of note: coming from an ultralight backpacking background, the options available for even "smaller" luggage options for adventure bikes seems downright spacious!
I don't personally think ADV bikes will push out sport tourers, there are plenty that still prefer the feel of sport touring over ADV. Remember when we though SuperMoto would take over the dual sport world?
The seating position of the adventure bikes is like the good old days. Upright with your feet under you where they belong. Plus you tower over the road where you can see and be seen. They are still sporty enough to handle twisties while being comfortable enough to get there and back.
The answer is clearly multiple bikes if you have the space & budget. Good report. My GS cost as much as a new Goldwing BTW.
Your analysis is spot on. I knew when I got into motorcycles I wanted versatility. I started with a 250 Rally dual sport, then moved up to an Africa Twin. The AT has made me a much better rider on the Rally off road. I want a Gold Wing and a 450RL. A stable. A Honda stable. Lol.
For comfortable relaxed riding and low maintenance I'll take a regular touring bike. I've had ADV bikes and dual sports, but dont like always having to lean at stops due to my relatively short inseam. Lol, plus I hate chain maintenance!
Great comparison video. The answer is - both! I had that Gold Wing as a second bike, trying to see if I could make it my primary bike. I could not. I stayed with HD and went back to a Road Glide Limited as my primary touring bike and it is an awesome road bike, but having started riding in the dirt at around 13, the desire to take that hard packed dirt or gravel road was still there. Would never do that on a giant shiny RGL, so after looking for a long time added the 1250 GSA. I am very lucky to have both, and they are completely different bikes for different jobs. Don’t know if I could pick one over the other.
How about getting a Pan America to replace both?
@@fallinginthed33p No thanks. I looked at the PA and it held no appeal to me at all, except for price. I suppose if there was one to replace both, it would be the GSA - plenty road worthy and more capable off road than I'll ever be!
@@Hogdriver88 great to see a Harley rider objectively deciding what is best for you, brand/style loyalty aside. I wish the world was full of people so rational. Cheers!
@@JonOrchard Thanks Jon. I have zero brand loyalty - I ride it if it works for me. If it doesn't work, I get rid of it. If it has issues - and they all do - I call them out regardless of brand. Now all that said, it is a bucket list thing for me to ride a GS/GSA all through the UK, Germany, northern Italy... and it MUST be on the BMW - Harley would not do at all!
I really like your Chanel and enjoy your reviews and information videos!!! Cherss from Uruguay!! 🇺🇾🇺🇾🇺🇾
Thank you for your informative videos. Yes, ADV bikes in my opinion offer the best of all worlds, Comfort for long distances, gravel roads are no problem. Sitting higher up improves the view of traffic and possible hazards up ahead for early warning evasive moves. I love my V Strom 1000, TtransAlp 700 and 650GS. I would only consider a touring bike if my wife was going to accompany me on tours.
very knowledgable well put review
Great video, I appreciate how you break everything down. I myself am struggling between having a large ADV bike or a HD bagger touring bike for solo camping adventures (99% on-road). I am not really planning on dirt riding as I would have to drive hours to find anything like that, but it would probably end up on dirt roads and some grass. I know I can only have one though as I only have one space at my condo.
ADV of course try V strom 1000 from 2014 -
I like the video!
I’d add that the touring or sports touring class will never go away, because they do a lot of “road things” better than an adv.
I have an adv, because they make sense, but if I could suddenly stop going to work and have weeks and weeks to travel… it would be hard to beat the Goldwing, K16, street glide, RT, etc
"Versatility" is spot on for me. I like traveling long multi week trips, but not ready to give up gravel and forestry two track in Canadian Rockies. So ADV is still my style and love my Africa Twin :-) Great content, cheers :-)
Again an excellent brief. I concur with these statements. Going fwd with you ask for comments, I also see two factors that benefit to adventure bikes these last 20 years : 1. The high increase in pressure on speed limitations, which pulls bikers away from sports bikes, and incidentally benefits to other bike categories o/w advs; 2. The progressive dégradation of road quality due to the diminution of government and local public budgets, benefits to more suitable bikes (from my few visiting in the US including California, it seems to me this may apply oversea too).
Now what the future is made of? Can't say it makes me happy, but it looks like there's a wave for non-petrol vehicules (electric, hydrogen...)
A just love your reviews mate. A think u are wonderful at wot u do. Love from Scotland 👌👍💚
I went from a ‘19 GL1800 Tour DCT to a ‘21 Africa Twin Adventure Sport DCT. Why? Two reasons, first want to do the roads less traveled again. Second, something you may not of thought about, cost and ease of maintenance. It’s a lot easier to work on the AT then the GW. So I can do most of the work myself.
Great video again! I wonder how do they compare on road?
I think you've hit the nail on the head with the car -> SUV analogy... I really don't care at all what other people ride but the thing that has really irked me about so many people switching from Sport Tourers to Adventure bikes is the fact that manufacturers have stopped making sport tourers because of it!
Kawasaki stopped selling the Concours in Europe several years ago; Yamaha recently discontinued the FJR; Triumph's Tiger Sport has been quietly dropped by Triumph; Honda's VFR never got updated to Euro 5
TBH, relatively few manufacturers currently offer a sport tourer (although sport touring is making a comeback in a more upright form, with the Yamaha Tracer selling very well and I'd expect Suzuki's GSX to do the same).
I currently ride a 2019 Goldwing DCT Tour and I think the answer is both. I'm going to add an Adventure bike of some kind in the next couple of years. My Goldwing really knocks down the miles but sometimes, there's that dirt or gravel road that calls to me too. I grew up riding on the dirt so that still has great appeal to me even 50 years later.
I have a 21' GSA and this year bought a 22' K1600 GT....now after three months...I realized - the Touring bike is not for me...So I ordered a new 23' GSA Trophy and trading the K16 in on it when it get's here in Sept/Oct...and yes I will have two GSA's...as much as I have put me 21' GSA thru - I will now have a back up...haha!!!....what I have seen...the 35-55 crowd going ADV...then once past the 55-60yr old mark....folks start heading back as the height and off-road riding declines.....not all but a majority....nice job explaining the differences!!!!
The motorcycle industry is designing and delivering to meet demand based on riders' desires. Let's look at the life-cycle (no pun intended) of a typical motorcyclist, keeping in mind that the average age of an American motorcyclist has climbed into the 40s or even 50s. As a young "baby boomer" rider, I bought a bike I could afford: a pre-owned UJM (universal Japanese motorcycle). It was light, had acceptable performance, would go almost anywhere, and more and more aftermarket accessories were available. Gradually I rode newer faster, bigger bikes that could comfortably accommodate a passenger, maybe a wife. So, I rode a big, powerful, comfortable (especially for pillion), touring bike, both ElectraGlide and Concours - all over the US and also Spain. Now, as a senior rider, my wife rides in the comfort of air conditioning, weather protection, and lots of luggage. That's right: it's an SUV. And, as a senior, still addicted to motoring, I'm back to the versatility and endless aftermarket of what is the modern equivalent of a UJM - the adventure bike. There's NEVER before been a time in motorcycling with more choices, versatility, and technology than NOW. IMHO, I probably represent a typical motorcyclist, and, therefore, the market points to adventure bikes. So let's ride!