Titanic Movie Mistakes: What They Got Wrong
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 19 พ.ค. 2024
- Titanic is a film that we talk about in glowing terms on this channel - but it isn't without its errors! Some smaller errors are thanks to changes in more recent developments and historical studies - but others, like mischaracterizations and factual errors are more serious, from Bruce Ismay being caricatured as a villain to Titanic's rudder being falsely represented as being too small. Today we'll explore some of the errors in the movie Titanic and set the record straight.
Oceanliner Designs explores the design, construction, engineering and operation of history’s greatest vessels- from Titanic to Queen Mary and from the Empress of Ireland to the Lusitania. Join maritime researcher and illustrator Michael Brady as he tells the stories behind some of history's most famous ocean liners and machines!
0:00 Intro
1:24 Minor Errors
5:01 Titanic's Rudder
9:03 Ismay The Villain
13:32 Murdoch the Shooter
16:05 Andrews' End
#titanic #movie #history #sinking #disaster #documentary #bts #hollywood #story #maritime - บันเทิง
Do you have a favourite moment from the 1997 film Titanic? For me it's when the bridge drops below the ocean's surface, gives me chills every time!
Thanks to our good friends at Titanic Honor and Glory as always for their stunning animation work! You can find their work here:
www.titanichg.com/
For me, it's when the titanic splits in half
wow, you got me thinking for a while lol. I think my favorite scene is when Captain Smith is in the submerged bridge and the glass breaks. It gives me chills
for me its the final plunge scene of the stern going straight up and so high in the air. just gives you the scale of how big the ship is
The Nearer My God To Thee Sequence Moves Me Every Time
Mike, what's your thoughts on the new film "Unsinkable"?
Have you seen the trailer or heard about this one? 🚢
I think that Cameron has since said that he regrets portraying Murdoch the way he did, and that he would have chosen a different solution, if he could make the movie again. So that's at least something.
would be nice if he spent some of his fortune to reshoot a few of these scenes for a 20th anniversary re-release or something, to address all those very small-minded portrayals of historical persons. he could also include cuts from his documentary as part of this re-release, heck he might even earn more from the box-office.
@@alveolate Given that it's been 27 years since the film was released, and that everyone in it has aged considerably since then, the result would be a CGI abomination. We have enough of those already.
Probably has something to do with the libel settlement he had to pay to the Murdoch family. Given the level of research and attention to detail he’s known for, there’s no way he didn’t know what he was doing with Murdoch or Ismay.
Sure. After he was sued by the family and had to pay out.
If it is Cameron, he might do it again. 🤣
William Murdoch was perhaps the biggest hero on the night of he sinking. If you watch "Ghosts of the Abyss" they show a life boat davit in it's upright position about to be reloaded. This is where Murdoch was about to connect one last boat to load up and send off, but ran out of time. In my opinion this is a monument of heroism to William Murdoch for his dedication and sacrifice, for performing his duty to saving the most lives regardless of class or social standing to the vary end.
yes and he could have jumped on the last boat but he didnt, i dont know if i could do some like that just to save one more stranger instead of miself.
I agree, Murdoch was a generous man, a real hero. Officer Murdoch saved my great grandfather’s life by ordering him and 6 other crewmen onto an under filled cutter lifeboat on the starboard side, instead of lowering it with merely 5 passengers. He was a true seafaring man if there ever was one and I hated seeing him portrayed as a pistol toting thug.
@@donnix1192wow that’s amazing! What was your great grandfathers name?!
@@MrColonelCool Albert Horswill, just google him-there is an entire page about him on encyclopedia titanica
I've always believed his intention was for Moody to take the collapsible boat. He probably wasn't thinking of himself, but there's no way he would have let that boy die if he could help it.
My grandfather is a retired tug boat captain, he could easily point out the errors in the ship design and operation. This would always bother my grandmother because she just wanted to watch the movie without a lesson on ships.
🤣💜😂
I lived with a wonderful view of the Mississippi River in New Orleans years ago. I knew a tugboat captain who actually brought those huge ships and barges, etc. into the port. Those captains were very much respected and had jobs that were almost impossible to obtain. Hats off to your grandfather!!! I’m sure that he was a most interesting man, and by the way, a real man!!
@@bettycattk5298 Thank you and he was
I gotcha. 😉👍 Had a Navy buddy who was like that. Very intelligent, probably genius level, and at least in HIS mind could critique just about anything. In a documentary, maybe I can see doing that. I do some myself, but like you said, many people just wanna see the movie for entertainment without the technical analysis. For some reason, people who are geniuses or close to it completely miss things like that. It’s not “logical” to them, I guess. 🤔🙄 The narrator here sounds like he’s defending Holland & Wolfe rather than objectively looking at what most experts on this subject consider obvious errors. For one, and I’m looking at this as a Navy veteran myself, the
compartmentalization of the ship only went up to E Deck, I believe it was. Above that, the water could flow freely bow to stern. And I believe that’s really what sank the Titanic. In addition to the statement “Not even God himself could sink her.” Using a slightly different application of the old WWII warning to civilians, military members, etc, “Loose lips sink ships.” Looks like that proved true, unfortunately, with the Titanic. 🚢
Hardy har har
5:01 - Right as you finished saying, "What I'm not going to excuse is this", an ad played. Perfect timing. (EDIT: I don't care about the ads)
Omg same
Same
TH-camrs have the ability to preselect the time codes for ads. This was likely deliberate and I love it 😂
“What I’m not going to excuse, is this” ritz crackers apparently
I have TH-cam premium so I have no idea haha that’s so funny
The vice-president of 20th Century Fox Scott Neeson went to the small town of Dalbeattie, near Dumfries, to deliver a personal apology to the 80-year-old nephew of William Murdoch, first officer of the Titanic, for the way he was portrayed in the movie.
Yeah then donated $5k to the charity set up in Murdochs name…5k of the 100 of millions they made….
@@1990drewman You say that like its a bad thing.. The whole movie wasn't about the one dude.. The whole movie wasn't about vilifying him.. IF the whole movie was about making Murdoch look bad and the movie revolved around him and tarnished the reality then yea only giving 5k seems terrible, but seeing as how Murdoch was supposed to kind of represent all of the officers on deck, which many many movies do that btw, where they use one character to represent a large number of people. Giving 5k isn't a bad thing. He didn't have to give anything.
Also when you put into consideration the costs of making the movie, payments that need to be handed out to everyone who took part in the movie, from the set producers, cameramen, props teams, actors and actresses, and everything else, they didn't have close to 100 million left over, and they still need to make a lot of money to make the next "block buster" hit.
5k is a nice apology.
Ah so Mr Murdoch had a brother or sister? I'm glad they apologized
@@1990drewman $5,000 of which they were under no obligation to give. They could have gave NOTHING. Learn gratitude.
@@HarrisonGoldfarb Learn about portraying someone honestly, not with BS written by writers just to get the $$$.......Bet you would be ungrateful if you got ignored here.
I admire the intellectual honesty of our host. He loves the movie AND YET accept and denounces its flaws. I appreciate this a lot.
That’s a very fair and valid way of saying that, a laudable example
But he inexcusably omits any reference to the unforgettable omission of the Californian and the annoying wrong (American/yankee) hymntune of "Nearer My God To Thee" (instead of using the correct British hymntune).
The hymn playing at the end is endlessly up for debate. Did Cameron get it right? Did the musical get it right with "Autumn"? Was it something else entirely? The truth can only be known with a time machine.
It bugs me how captain Smith was portrayed as being in a daze and wondering around. While I’m sure at points he was in shock. He was very active in the sinking and overseeing the evacuation, trying to call boats back. I think the movie should have shown that more.
That was too perfect, you said "What I'm not going to excuse, is this" and an add for Dolmio pasta sauce started playing; I won't excuse that sauce either.
It was an ad for driving high speed cars when I watched it.
I didn’t get an ad. 😅
Bruce Ismay's grave is in a cemetery around a mile from my home. On the 100th anniversary of Titanic's sinking, I visited his grave, [placed a hand on it and murmured, "It wasn't your fault." It's important to not let media distort history. Ismay's life after Titanic was terribly sad. No doubt he may have been racked with guilt and his health faded away.
Do you also visit the drowned women and children's graves that might have been saved had he not taken a seat from them as well?
@@benjalucian1515Presumably, you mean the women and children around the forward starboard collapsible boats who didn’t exist.
@@benjalucian1515he didnt take a seat from anyone. There were no more women and children about or willing to get in when he boarded Collpsible C
@@sabrinastratton1991 *he didnt take a seat from anyone. There were no more women and children about* Such BS. Did he even try to find more women and children? Nope. Such a coward. 1500 people went down. Don't even try to tell me he couldn't find any one else. It was 20 minutes before the ship went down. People were all over the place, panicking.
@@benjalucian1515since collapsible C was one of the last boats to leave (2nd last to be exact) just before final plunge, it was not a good idea to stall the launch, keep the passengers waiting, and go further aft where everyone has gone and bring more only to risk those in the collapsible C. You can't simply waste time. That's one of the reasons first few boats were launched half full. So many were reluctant to leave and you can't just keep waiting.
An old childhood friend of mine is a descendant of First Officer Murdoch. We went to see the film together in Edinburgh when it was first out in the cinema. I remember how hurt he was by the portrayal of Murdoch. So yes, the family were/are angry about it. They're also deeply hurt by it. It's always seemed to me an unnecessary and callous addition to a story that was already a gripping one.
I understand that his family would be upset about the dramatic liberties. But even the movie never treated the Murdoch character as less than sympathetic and understandable.
The thing that always gets me is Cameron's anti-English agenda. Now I know the ship was British but was it really true that all loveable or humane characters were American, Irish, Welsh, Scottish or Italian and the English, to a man, were all whirly-eyed, unfeeling, martinets gratutitously gunning down foreigners?
[Edit: "Evil villians clarified as "English" rather than "British" in true Hollywood tradition.]
I agree. Nitpicking: Wales is part of Britain, I think you just mean English.
@@alanbinks6106 Aren't Ireland, Scotland and Wales part of the UK?
James Cameron has admitted he made a huge mistake. He and select crew went to Scotland and met with some of Murdock’s descendants to apologize and honour him
I think if they needed a character to act as Murdoch acts in the movie, to show that drama, they should have invented a fictional officer. Not maligned a real person.
It’s simply horrible that this hero was portrayed in such a cowardly and inept. His family should be compensated and James Cameron should be held accountable and make a public apology to Murdoch himself his family and the public.
@@brightstarlit - those scenes should be cut from every digital version and new release of the film. They don't drive the story telling in any direction, so they are pretty redundant and could easily be cut - at least out of respect for the family.
@TheHopperUK, Generally speaking, I'd agree with doing that. However, it's one thing to have fictional passengers play significant roles in the movie, quite another to create a non-existent officer who actually served aboard Titanic, particularly one who did something so drastic.
Was it really necessary for the drama to have passengers shown being FATALLY shot in the chaos? Wouldn't it have been sufficient to simply have had a number of warning shots depicted, or at most, a passenger intentionally winged, as a deterrent, instead?
@@mitchellmelkin4078 Yeah, I think we agree pretty much. Anything would be better than what they did.
I think the most egregious error was that they didn't name the reverend seen leading prayers on the deck as the ship is going down. His name was Robert Bateman, and he was was my great, great grandfather. He went down with the ship.
for real?? you must be proud of your ancestry.
Wow ❤
stop lying
Yes, for sure, and your sister is lady Diana. stop
Have you heard the story of John Harper’s last convert?
I actually really rather like how Thomas Andrews went out in the film.
In the film, Andrews is almost like a living representation of the ship herself. When he apologized to Rose, I had always thought it was such an odd line. This was not his fault at all. We all know this. And then it hit me recently. It's not just the shipbuilder apologizing it's the ship herself.
So him being resigned to his fate isn't so much him giving up. At least, that's not how I interpreted it. To me, even before looking into his life and what he was like and how he actually acted that night...to me this was James Cameron telling us that this isn't just how Andrews felt, but the ship. There was only so much he could do and we DO see him try his best. He told people in the hallways to get up top. He shouts at Lightoller for launching the boats half full. And I know that sounds silly in personifying the ship herself, but with how Andrews is in the film, there is credible evidence that's what Cameron was going for when he had Andrews say "I'm sorry I didn't build you a stronger ship, young Rose."
Just like the ship herself is resigned to her fate, so is Andrews. Just like Andrews she did the best she could. The fact that she lasted long far longer than he himself predicted is a testament to her designers and builders.
Ya
I like what you said. I didn’t think of that this way.
I will always remember what you said about him and the ship next time I watch it.
Which will be tonight probably.
👍🌹🌹🌹🌹🌹
@TheRibottoStudios
Very nice interpretation of the film....I agree , it does well to tell you the ship is sorry for these events and the great loss that was to be, through Thomas.
That's a take on the action I never thought of but it sure is a better or nice way to see it. 👍
Like you, I never saw this as in any way an indictment of Andrews' character, rather the opposite - he had already done so much, and everyone has that point somewhere where their minds close down, and they go into shock, but I like your reading of this scene very much.
VERY astute of you! Titanic was a good ship, she stayed alive as long as she could, staying afloat longer than Mr. Andrews thought she would.
I also thought it was a very respectable representation of Andrews. He'd built a good ship. He'd done nothing wrong...
Let's not forget the film's downplaying of Molly Brown's heroism, and taking no notice of the equal-or-greater deeds of the Countess of Rothes.
Tell me more.
Same here and few times I brought that up I get crapped on...ffs.
@@iamhungey12345 Exactly: too many trolls doing the talking, and not enough real participants. (That’s why I ignore so many obvious attempts at baiting.)
They also didn’t show a lot of lightoller’s actions either which was a bummer
@@SnobbyBird_ That was probably better for him, since he doesn't come across as very likeable from the historic accounts of the event. He literally condemned men to drown who could have been saved, without using anyone else's seat in the lifeboat.
"The rudder was too small"
That brings to mind a story that my dad told me. He was a leutenant engineer, working in the engine rooms of three ships during the war - they were all sunk - so he knew quite a lot about ships and heavy mechanics, and he told me about a film he saw in the days of black and white movies, in which one ship was being towed by another across the ocean, but in a plot twist, they didn't want it to arrive too quickly (some sort of shennanigans going on), so the ship's engineer dived over the stern with a shifting spanner, removed the propeller, turned it around (so that it would drive the ship backwards!), and bolted it back on. My dad laughed about that movie for years afterwards.
For any reader not understanding how ridiculous this is, a ship's propeller weighs many tons, and it takea a LOT more than a car spanner to get it off. Also, if you put it on backwards, it still drives the ship forwards, though a little less efficiently.
Dad's ship was lying astern of the SS Fort Stikine in Bombay harbour, when it blew up. A fire exploded its amunition cargo and sank most of the ships in the harbour - my dad's among them - Search TH-cam for "Bombay explosion 1944" - it was one of the biggest explosions of WWII. My dad spent a bit of time in hospital after that, and as he came out, many of his shipmates, who had been in town when it happened, were joining another ship, and he tried hard to go with them, but he still had some recuperation ahead of him and permission was not granted - which was lucky for him, because that ship went down with all hands. It was lucky for me as well, because I was born just after the war - one of the first of the boomers - and I wouldn't have been. It was lucky for my daughters and grandchildren also - but I guess everybody on earth could trace similar coincidences.
How could a rudder, a piece of equipment for steering, reverse a ship by installing it backwards? that's like making a car go into reverse by installing it's steering wheel backwards.
@@zombiedoggie2732 I don't know. I've never heard of a rudder being installed backwards. It wouldn't be possible, and even if it was, it wouldn't make the ship go backwards! Where did you get that from?
@@DownhillAllTheWay OOPS my bad, I misread propeller as rudder. Whoops on me!
@@zombiedoggie2732Yup - that's what I thought. I was just pulling your plonker - but to be fair, the spelling is similar! 😉
James Cameron actually did a lot of research before, during and even after making the film, 20 years later he even made a documentary disproving some of his theories he used in the movie. His version of the Titanic is my favourite due to the sheer amount of research and love put into the project. Even though not everything is accurate, he took many creative liberties that added to the movie's plot (such as creating Jack and Rose) and did his best to portray what was known and believed at the time. He really did work hard on the film and I believe if it weren't for how successful his version of the movie is, people won't forget the Titanic and her victims any time soon. Great job on the video!
At 9:15 I totally 100% agree with you here Mike. J Bruce Ismay was nearly always badly portrayed in most Titanic movies/dramas. Always made out to be the wicked villain of story. Far from the truth. Poor man, his life was ruined. He helped a lot of people get into the lifeboats. He was rushing around on deck, trying to find women and children of all classes to get into the boats.
Other than the few days in which he shut himself in a stateroom aboard Carpathia, the poor man never had the chance to grieve for his friends, his ship, his passengers and his men. He had to immediately begin fighting back and defending his actions, all due to Hearst’s personal hatred and his penchant for yellow journalism.
One thing that gets on my nerves is that a lot of people act like Ismay personally decided that the Titanic didn’t need more lifeboats. I know Mike had debunked that in other videos and pointed out that having more lifeboats wouldn’t have helped (because there wouldn’t have been time to launch them) something that I found when I went down a bit of a rabbit hole was that the White Star Line’s plans for how to outfit Titanic and Olympic were reviewed by the Merchant Shipping Advisory Committee which had been set up to advise the Board of Trade on adjusting regulations regarding lifeboats. While at least one member of the committee felt that both ships should probably carry more boats all ten still signed off and their decision was upheld by the Board of Trade. Titanic and Olympic carried the number of lifeboats that they did because they weren’t required to carry more, and they weren’t required to carry more because with the limits of technology and prevailing wisdom of the day it wasn’t clear that carrying more was necessary. It wasn’t because the White Star Line was worried the decks would be too crowded.
@@juliadagnall5816 As a team could launch 2 lifeboats in 15ish minutes and Titanic had 2 teams dedicated to the lifeboats yeah more lifeboats onboard are unlikely to have saved many additional lives considering the last 2 lifeboats were still being launched shortly before the final plunge. As part of the filming for the 1997 movie Cameron had teams actually learn to launch lifeboats as they were launched on the Titanic and they had a similar launch time. The 20 lifeboats Titanic carried was actually more than the 16 required at the time. Because of the dangers of lifeboats on open seas at the time they were used primarily to ferry people from one ship to another. It's a sad situation but a sinking like Titanic was just waiting to happen due to the rapidly changing technology that was making traditional ship designs and procedures outdated.
I think people have a natural tendency to scapegoat individuals. It can be hard to accept the lack of fault and consider that a set of people did what they thought was best and nature proved us wrong. It’s a lot easier to believe that we had the power to see the future and certain people failed. It was quite possibly reasonable to state that titanic was unsinkable in the face of any of the modalities of issue we had seen in living memory at the time insofar as they designed the ship to fix all the problems they knew about. It’s also quite reasonable to assert the quantity of lifeboats was sufficient because in all previous examples at the time it would have been. The idea of a ship like that going down in that way on an entirely calm night was simply unforeseen, the same as people hadn’t fathomed the Apollo 1 fire could have occurred on a completely unfueled “dress rehearsal.” I believe the way they summarized the Apollo 1 fire at the time was that the accident was “a failure of imagination,” which I think is quite germane to this accident as well.
@@jcohasset23 We know not all the lifeboats Titanic did have got properly used. :/
Also that's an issue with the "women and children first" thing... a life boat with JUST women and children.... is not necessarily... safe. It was a different shipwreck, but they had the men and women and children in separate boats.... guess who didn't make it? That was heart wrenching... if they hadn't separated them everyone might have lived.
I wouldn't be surprised if Murdoch said to Ismay something along the lines of "Mr. Ismay, I think it's time to go, sir."
I believe in some versions Ismay was practically ordered into the boat by one of the officers. Let the guy rest in peace; he certainly never pushed away a woman or child to take their seat, but entered a boat with more space available when it was about to launch and there were no other passengers around. Should he have chosen to die just on a matter of principle? His testimony was valuable at the inquiry; we would know less about the sinking if he had not been around to witness.
Also, Ismay and passenger William Ernest Carter entered Collapsible C together, as there were no other women in the immediate vicinity of the boat, yet Carter didn't face the same backlash.
Knowing what we do about the real Murdoch, I personally believe something to this effect was said. Ismay was no sailor
@@lehighguy Carter didn't piss Hearst off.
And Ismay had been of great help to him.
While I live in Argentina, a first cousin of mine, now in her mid-nineties, was born in Belfast and used to live just down the road from some long-time friends, the Andrews family. While I have spoken to her of my fascination about the mythical Titanic story, she brought me down to earth about it, noting that first and foremost it was a great tragedy, and in particular, a terrible loss to the Andrews. I very much appreciated your research for this episode, setting the record straight about those real people. Still, in spite of the inaccuracies, I think the film is marvelous and I always regret my Dad (born 1905) never got to see it, as he would have loved the reconstruction of an epoch he kind of got to know, having crossed by boat a number of times between Buenos Aires and the UK, including when he volunteered for WWII. Every time I chance upon the film on TV, I get hooked and see it through to the end!
Great analysis!. Looking forward to Bruce Ismay’s. Fun fact: Bruce Ismay’s Connemara residence is still present to this day, and is in fact a hotel. Preserved almost exactly as it was when he was still living in it. He actually died there. It’s called “Costelloe Lodge”. And the interior design resembles that of the White Star’s. Mr. Ismay’s fate was tragic. He really believed in his company. He didn’t deserve being portrayed as a villain.
The overall characterisation of the British crew was rather negative and inaccurate, but Smith in particular got the short end of the stick in 97. He’s shown as a quite passive character on the whole, and during the sinking shown as being in a daze, which quite a few segments of testimony conflict with. ANTR did better by showing shock at the revelation from Andrews she would sink, immediately followed by quiet resignation, then jumping into action with stoic resolve to do what was possible to save as many as possible. I found it fascinating when I learnt a while back that the ‘Murdoch starboard, Lightoller port’ trope is a bit of an oversimplification, with some crossing over of officers from one side to the other lowering boats, with Wilde and Smith himself taking charge of lowering and getting several of them away.
I agree with you re Captain Smith. In particular, the scene in the movie on the bridge on the 14th prior to striking the iceberg when he orders Murdoch to maintain speed and heading despite Murdoch's concerns over ice is misleading. As I understand, reports suggested that he advised Murdoch that if there was even a slight change in visibility, they would need to slow down. Deleting this critical sentence, in my view, made Smith look like he simply disregarded the ice warnings.
@@michaelwood3305 We know Smith advised Lightoller around half past 9pm, from Lightoller's British inquiry testimony: 'If it does come on in the slightest degree hazy we shall have to go very slow. If it becomes at all doubtful let me know at once; I will be just inside.' Because all the officers already knew that in their training, reiterating that shows that Smith was aware of potential problems. Lightoller passed on those instructions to Murdoch upon the change of watch (and Smith may have done so himself as well). It is only with hindsight that Smith could be considered reckless.
@@michaelwood3305the film needed weak characters and it found it in Cap'n Smith and Ismay..
@@michaelwood3305 Jack Phillips got a Marconi Radio Call from Cyril Evans that the SS Californian was parked for the Night due to Icebergs, Phillips didn't heed the Warning because he was overworked and tired. He Told Evans "Shut Up. I'm Busy". In which Evans Responded by shutting down his Equipment for the Night. Had Phillips been sober, he would have pay attention and sent the message to Captain Smith to Stop for the Night. But we can't blame Phillips. He was YOUNG. Only 25 years old. And Marconi was a relatively NEW Field and Business.
Phillips was STILL a Young Hero. He kept Radioing for Help and found the Carpathia.
Apparently the characterisation of the British crew was bc of Cameron's previous experience with them. Apparently while doing production on Aliens, it had to stop bc he made a huge fuss about people taking a lunch break which is mandatory in the UK. The entire crew walked out bc he wouldn't let them have it and they returned only after he apologised but he was a carton of sour milk afterwards and expressed his anti-british sentiment in Titanic. My friend told me this while we were discussing directors being shoddy with breaks and having extremely weird rules when it came to being on set so take it with a grain of salt
I just finished my Bachelor degree in film and television, and my Bachelor thesis was about if James Cameron was using filmic aesthetics to make Bruce Ismay a villain in the film, despite historical facts arguing this. I came to the same conclusions as you, and I enjoyed this video extra much because of my recent research on the topic. Keep making the excellent videos you always make, and thank you for your quality content!
Ahh... Film and television. Or propaganda and brainwashing as it is also called. Great waste of time, you did pay for it yourself i hope...
My condolences to your wasted time and money.
@@RuminatingWizardWhat have you achieved with your life, then?
@@RuminatingWizardin nice countries university education is free :P
I have a degree in film and radio television from the 1980s. Read my comments earlier. The things Cameron chose to do made the film better and that's what he was doing. Not teaching a history lesson.
For those that dont know Mike Brady, this "nitpick" video is the equivalent to him rolling up his sleeves to get into a boxing ring.
This is hardcore Mike Brady we are seeing in this video. We love the vids Mike
Mike Brady? Like the Brady Bunch?
@@kevincobble934 In every video on this channel, including this video, the narrator says "Hello this is your friend Mike Brady from Oceanliner Designs". It is really obvious who Mike Brady is.
@@Mark_Bridges Someone's not paying attention in class are they 😂😂
Thanks. This is my first video of his because I love the Titanic, along with other historic tragedies of the world.:)
I would expect nothing less from our friend Mike Brady
The Titanic disaster film 'A night to remember' (1958) is also worth a watch, it's currently on TH-cam.
I've always hated how Ismay is treated. The "problem" is that the real story of the titanic doesn't have a villain (unless you count the iceberg I guess) and that just doesn't make an interesting story to some people. I wish you had mentioned that the insufficient lifeboats wasn't his fault, they had *more* lifeboats than legally required. They were supposed to be used to ferry passengers to safety and return for more, not a "drop everyone onboard in and leave them adrift for hours".
Oh don’t worry! In his Ismay video (posted 3 hours ago actually!) he definitely goes into the lifeboat Misconception/Myth.
Yeah, a lot of people judge the Titanic story with modern-day sensibilities. They forget that planes became a primary transport for passengers decades later. Ships were the primary way to transport people from country to country during that time. It was relatively easy to find another ship crossing a similar path as you. That is why lifeboats could be served as transports from one ship to another. Nowadays, ships are rarer to find, so if you get lost, it could be deadly.
There is another entire villian of the titanic but it is an outlier of the titanic stuff in history books. So many evil people involved.....
No villains, but sailing 22knots in a pitch black ice berg field did not show very sound judgement. Foolhardy, to say the least…
I understand how Ismay was called a 'coward' in 1912. 1500 people in the care of his White Star Line drowned in the frigid waters of the North Atlantic, while he escaped. He wasn't blameless. Still, I do not think he deserves to be tagged as a 'coward' or 'villain. There were approximately 400 empty seats in the 19 successfully launched lifeboats. Ismay didn't get into one of the first lifeboats to be launched, he got into one of the last. The seat would have gone EMPTY, had Ismay not got in. During his testimony, Ismay was asked how he happened to get into lifeboat. He stated that the boat was there, being lowered, there was room, and he instinctively stepped into it.
As a musician, I am always plugged into the soundtrack. There is a point in the sinking after a particularly meaningful event (the musicians stop?) when the focus of the movie pulls back from persons and their conversations to the acceleration and finality of the sinking - the water starts breaking through doors, furniture starts sliding across floors, people start getting sucked through windows, the stern starts going up. This sequence begins with a ringing note on the chimes leading into a quasi hymn being sung in the background. Gets me everytime.
Also the cut at the end when the ship has gone under but you can see the stern with "Titanic" on it falling away through the water.
The moment when the musicians break and seem like they're going to try to get off the ship, and the one guy starts Nearer My God To Thee, I just sob.
The soundtrack is what has me hooked to the movie. I literally feel the music and emotions. I’m no musician nor can I understand the subject but my hearing is my best sense and very sensitive along with my imaginative neurodivergent mind helps me appreciate music above any other media. It moves me. I use some of the softer tracks to fall asleep too and my mind drifts. I’ll experience images of drifting down to the ocean floor and swimming through the wreckage. It’s calming.
I love the music as Titanic leaves Southampton. James Horner, may he rest in peace. Was a brilliant composer. Legends of the Fall, is another score of his that I love. Epic.
@lb5134 It's believed that the actual tune was "Autumn" which is very similar and apparently prompted someone already away in a lifeboat to start singing the actual hymn.
Still heartbreaking though.
You always know James Horner is getting serious when he pulls out that smithing anvil. Whether Khan is about to set off Genesis, Bishop is late with the dropship, Fabrizio picked the wrong direction to swim in, or the Grinch has simply overloaded his sleigh-you know the time for slow dialogue scenes is over when that anvil comes out.
Great video - and in defence of Cameron his "Romeo & Juliet on a boat" is an entertainment, not a documentary. As one critic observed, Cameron was "faithful to the detail, but promiscuous with the facts." In my view one of his most egregious inventions was "Third Class Passengers locked below decks". They weren't. Many assembled on the open well deck in front of the stairs up to Second Class where there was a low gate - Cameron actually filmed Jack going through this to visit Rose, but it didn't make it into the final edit. The "Bostwick" gates shown in the film didn't exist in passenger spaces - the ship was designed and built as Three Class from inception, so you wouldn't want to have gates you opened and closed. On the Officers, Lightoller is unfairly characterised as an "Upper Class RP speaking twit" when in fact he was a working class Westcountryman. Finally, try telling any of the Protestant Harland & Wolff ship builders in Belfast that this was an "Irish ship" and see how many teeth you've got left! Harland & Wolff was notoriously anti-Catholic and the builders viewed themselves as fiercely British. Titanic was a random tragedy which for a film needed "goodies" (Americans & immigrants) and "Baddies" (Brits). In some ways Cameron was even more Anti-British than the Nazi Titanic, which was more "anti-capitalist" in line with National Socialism. Great film, iffy history.
Exactly.
You've explained and cleared Murdoch and Ismay's behaviour so clearly. Thanks, Mike. An excellent video as always.
In fairness to the bit with Thomas Andrews, the film does at least show him helping out in the evacuations and making sure people have lifebelts on, he even says to one of the ship's maids, "Put a lifebelt on, Miss Trudy. Set a good example." Or something to that effect. Although admittedly it is before he seems resigned in the smoking room before adjusting the clock's time. Feels like it breaks even to say the least. As for Murdoch, Cameron has since expressed regrets on the choices he made, so at least it shows he's learning. As Bob Ross once said, "As long as you're learning, you're not failing."
he should've apologised for ismay
@@denverbritto5606 Who? James Cameron or Thomas Andrews? I'm guessing Cameron, and I would agree, but I don't wanna assume anything.
@@KTChamberlain yes, I meant Cameron. I listened to the Rest is History episodes on the Titanic recently and they do a great job describing Ismay's tragic life, I had no idea what parts of the film were accurate before listening.
The only 'mistake' I really dislike is Cameron's apparent hatred towards the crew. He portrayed everyone, and the owner, as incompetent. It really bothers me.
And 1st Class Men.
@@Tornado1994 Audiences need someone to hate. Real life stories are dramatized to make content more interesting. There were no real "villains" in the true story, so Cameron decided to paint the 1st classers as haughty aristocrats, and the crew as incompetent.
Karens love to complain about servicemen and those in charge, so it was easy to sell that to a general audience.
@@nahor88 Cameron is a Hack and a Hypocritical Moron.
That is true, and part of the reason why I found A Night to Remember by Roy Ward Baker as a good film to balance it out, as it focuses on the historical events as told by survivor's testimony, as opposed to being used as a setting for a fictional period drama.
It focuses mostly on Charles Lightoller, as he was the seniormost officer to survive the sinking, but also largely on other members of the crew; Captain Smith and Murdoch were heroic to the end, and Andrews and Ismay were presented in a more neutral manner as opposed to being ignorant, bumbling venture capitalists.
@@Hirundo-demersalis it's an excellent film.
I can remember the day I saw this film; I might have been a tad too young to have seen some of the elements in this film as a seven-year-old. As you say, it is something historical and should be accurately depicted. But to this day, nearly 27 years later, I still find myself in awe of the detail and care taken when producing such a big picture. I enjoy your videos; like you say, they are a way of digging up the facts and learning new facts, and I thank you for that.
Costanza: "So that lady, she was just a liar wasn't she."
Seinfled: "And a bit of a tramp if you ask me."
If I hate one thing about that film, it's the way Ismay is portrayed. Thanks for pointing it out. Justice for Ismay!
He was not the cowardly moustache twirling villain as depicted in cinema.
Unfortunately, every disaster movie needs its villain. Thanks to Hearst, Ismay is the one who always gets picked.
@@jamesbrown4092 Hearst is the biggest a-hole and a true definition of a villain.
It's good to know he never twirled his mustache.
It has been pretty much proven that Murdoch was allowing men into the boats if there were no more women and children around. I don't care who you are, but if you're on a sinking ship that doesn't have enough spots for everyone and the man n change says "anyone else?" or words to that effect... I'm "anyone else"ing my ass into the nearest lifeboat.
Possibly the "1912" segments of the film should be regarded as just visualizing how Old Rose remembered and told about things near the end of her life, and not necessarily how things "really happened". So if she, for instance, felt that the Titanic reached an angle of 45 degrees before the break-up, that is what the movie shows, even though she would not have been in a place where she could see the angle clearly and it was actually much less than 45 degrees. She was not there for Murdoch's demise, so what the movie shows may just be how she imagined his end based on some story she heard later, accurate or not. Even the fact that that the historical characters look only partially like their photographs can be explained by Rose hardly remembering their exact appearance 84 years later.
Thats an interesting perspective - Ive never considered that before.....
I really like this! Makes total sense. Especially when old Rose first starts describing the day Titanic sailed off. How the camera goes from a closeup of her and fades into her memories. I had never considered that we're looking at memories not historical reenactment exactly.
@@SAROne-pl5zh Which would also explain calling Margret Brown, Molly, in 1912 Magret Brown was known as and would have introduced herself as Maggie. The nickname Molly came from later headlines because she wouldn't shut up about the white star lined incompetence, and did help families recoup losses. It earned her the nickname "The unsinkable Molly Brown" which they used in the broadway musical and movie with Debbie Reynolds.
Side note her husband had only discovered silver at that point (which made them wealthy) but would later also find gold on his Colorado property. Also the tux she would have loaned the fictional Jack, had he been real, would have been her sons, as his corpse was in the hold on the way back to the states for his burial.
Ah the artistic license to forgive all issues 😂. Regardless of explanation I agree that expecting perfection from Cameron while he had to actually make a movie is unreasonable.
I've thought this too. Rose describes an officer taking their own life, she doesn't know who but she read the papers afterwards that named Murdoch. So we see Murdoch, because that's who she pictured
I love how the film added reflective lights on the ship’s smokestacks. A very aesthetic and beautiful touch 💙
2:31 the pause and zoom … thank you Lewis. Really got me 😂
About the hull breaking; I distinctly remember a documentary where they investigated this with Cameron present and he jokingly said something like "I hope you're wrong because otherwise I'm going to have to re-shoot this scene".
imagine cameron redoing the entire movie just to be more accurate. he absolutely would do that...
There is a National Geographic documentary by James Cameron on Disney+ where they investigate a whole bunch of errors made with the film.
th-cam.com/video/1jXHFEy-ibc/w-d-xo.htmlsi=_UmDqnU_CTLveW-f
Of course prior to her wreck being found, she was generally shown as going down complete despite eye witnesses disputing that.
@@matthewbarabas3052 That would be a pain in the ass tbh.
So, so refreshing to hear that a Titanic enthusiast also loves the movie! It seems to be a polarizing topic, which is totally fair. But as someone who has held a lifelong interest in this point of history and who also loves the movies (and acknowledges its flaws), this was a great breakdown. I'll refer people to this video whenever they ask about discrepancies in the film lol. Great video as always!
Thank you so much for shedding so much light on a dark moment. I appreciate your attention to details & historical accuracy. I enjoy your videos greatly. Thank you.
Another fantastic video Mike. Your work has so much credibility due to your diligence and integrity. Please keep up the good work my friend.
Another good and factual video.
But I'm still waiting for you to address the elephant in the room. Namely the depiction of passengers being locked behind bostwick gates when Titanic only had gates to separate the classes, not prevent people from reaching their respective decks.
Good point. Guess it was just another slight at the British (Well, the English ones) lovingly deployed by Hollywood.
@@patagualianmostly7437They slandered the British upper class in this movie more than in the 1943 propaganda movie.
Imagine getting locked up and 🌊 iz slowly coming up to drown you.
I'm a Navy Veteran, and despite getting horribly seasick on boats and ships, I love movies about boats and ships. Go figure. Love your breakdown and attention to detail for those who aren't ship-savvy. Looking forward to checking out more of your videos.
You are in illustrious company, Nelson for one also suffered from it.
Did you see Das Boot ? Dir cut? 🇩🇪 or Crimson Tide? ⚓️
This is the third video I’ve watched from you today and your knowledge is astounding. As a history buff and a lover of the movie Titanic, your channel was a great find!
Mr. Braidy, new subscriber here.
Been seeing your videos pop up in my suggested videos, and have been enjoying your production quality and attention to detail.
I recall when Ballard discovered the wreck in 1985, I was about 7 at the time. Never forgot that and started my wild fascination with the ship and the tragedy.
I've learned a great deal more about the history through your videos, wonderful dives into the actual accounts and everything. I also like the kinder view on Ismay, while he has been criminalized by historys key players, there is a human side to the industrialist we know as Bruce Ismay. I appreciate you taking some of the blame and heat off of him, it's only too common we try and find all the blame and fault on one man, for everything but, we truly don't know enough about most of those involved of these moments of history, so long ago.
Thank you for your great channel, I truly enjoy it.
The fictional character of Rose on Titanic was probably the biggest villain 🤣. Spends the whole movie having an affair with some homeless guy, blows smoke into her mothers face at the tea table, has sex in someone else's car with said homeless guy (syphilis, gonorrhoea anyone.....??), has a table at the end full of photos showing just herself - no kids, grandkids, husband, granddaughter Lizzie who helps her so much - nope, just herself, and then tops it all off by throwing a priceless diamond into the ocean that could have lifted half of the planet out of poverty if donated.
Ismay & Murdoch could have massacred the entire ship with zombie knives and still be saints in comparison to that character 🤣🤣
All 3 of Cameron's Characters are VILLIANS. Jack and Rose are Figments of his Imagination that DON'T even show,speak or Have Mannerisms from 1912. They both are written like Mid 90s Teen Lovers: The 1990s. Like they traveled in Time to 1912. Cameron clearly did NO research on Post Victorian Mannerisms and Lingo. NONE. The "Middle Finger" did NOT exist in 1912. "Nickelodeons". Nickelodeons were completely experimental and Test Marketed. They were never approved for Nationwide use because they never made it past Test Marketing. Swearing was VERY uncommon and extremely derogatory and saying "God's name in Vain" would have resulted in BOTH of them being thrown in the Brig.
The way Jack was depicted as 3rd Class Passenger was B.S. NO 3rd Class was Allowed ANYWHERE past their Floor. There were NO exceptions. Jack would have NEVER corresponded with Rose or her Friends,Family Whatever because he would have been FORBIDDEN from it.
The Car Scene? Cheap Schmaltz. They would have NEVER found their way in a Storage Hall because it would be Completely Locked away.
I'd like to personally conclude in the Same way that SNL Did, that The 1997 Titanic film is basically a Figment of the Old Lady's Imagination. She made the WHOLE thing up in her Senile, Dementia Ridden Mind. She certainly NEVER rode or got onboard the RMS Titanic(She didn't even have a DAMN British Accent for God Sakes.), Got TONS of Anachronisms Wrong, was Inaccurate in almost EVERYTHING, Clearly Exaggerated the POV of Other Characters(How the HELL would she know or be Allowed down into the 3rd Class Deck?) and Probably was off her Meds if she couldn't even Remember KEY Titanic Survivors and only ones she probably read about in A Night To Remember by Walter Lord and In the Fictional Musical "The Unsinkable Molly Brown" Despite the Fact that Margaret Brown's Family has stated that "Molly" was NEVER her nickname and the fact she SWORE she saw First Officer Chief William McMaster Murdoch kill himself despite the Fact that NOBODY none of the Titanic Survivors EVER said or stated that he killed himself and pretty much ALL of them Say they Saw him get swept by a Wave as as he was trying to Unload a Collapsible.
Totally agree
@@Tornado1994 After I found out about the "Molly" thing, I refused to call Margret that in respect of her memory. But to be fair to the audience, if they wrote her accurate to the time, it'd loose allot of people. It would of felt forgein to them. Although I admit, I'd love to see it rewritten with the mannerism's of the time, and compare the slang differences to the 90's one.
That is something to ponder on, Rose is kind of scuzzy
You are a genius! 😂
It is always interesting to see more about the Titanic. I have a family concern it this unfortunate incident.
In 1912 my grandmother was an unborn baby at the time of the sinking but her cousin was a young man called Wallace Hartley who was the Bandmaster of the ship. The band stayed aboard playing music to try to alleviate what must have been a very distressing time for all on board.
Sadly they perished.
Edit. Perhaps I should add that I was at school with a great -grandson of Captain Smith.
As soon as you said.
:what I can't forgive, is this" an advert for Dolmio sauce began to play. Perfect timing.
Im so happy you brought up Murdoch, I have always felt that it was just flat out wrong how they portrayed him. He absolutely was a hero that night. On a side note, love your channel.
Mike, you’re my favorite you tuber…..the way you respect your content and respect your audience. Your channel is truly a relaxing joy to watch. Keep it up!
I think ANTR, despite lacking some of the obvious knowledge about the break up, made a better job at presenting the real life characters than the 1997 film. It seems like they made a greater effort.
I discovered ocean liner designs a few months ago, completely hooked the content is always so interesting and brilliantly researched, the presentation is very professional and engaging. Thanks for your fascinating videos.
I was disappointed that Cameron decided to fictionlize the Love story but went to incredible detail to be accurate down to the Napkins and silverware. There were over 2 thousand Love stories he could have dramatized instead of creating the Fictional Jack & Rose
ESPECIALLY the REAL Jack "Jack Thayer Jr" and The REAL Rose "Rose Potter Earnshaw".
I hated how Rose was portrayed, imposing late 1990s manners and slang onto a 1910s woman. Though there was plenty of illicit love, her dialogue was as banal as a hallmark movie. Rebellion like smoking, or affairs, sure, but no well bred woman of the time would have flipped the bird to anyone, not used vulgar language. It would have been more covert.
The scandalous love story of John Jacob Astor IV who recently married a teenager, who was carrying his child, would have been better to recreate a human interest factor. He perished, but saved her life.
Thank you so much for the accurate potrayal of Murdock and Ismay. My son and I find the Titanic history fascinating for many years. We love your channel!
"What I'm not going to excuse is this." points, and ad for Buick Elantra appears. Sorry, I know you have no control over the ads, but the timing was so well timed. There is never too much information from Mike Brady and the Titanic Honor and Glory cohort.
I got an ad for pet insurance at the exact same point 😂
I use brave browser, I had forgotten about getting ad's on youtube. It stops them all!. Vid starts - watch vid - vid ends. done.
Very informative! Thank you, Mike! I will stay tuned for your other videos for sure!
Whenever I’m feeling a little down, I just put on a video from Oceanliner Designs. I find that my friend Mike Brady’s voice is comforting.
Thank you so much for this video, Mike! I'm a Titanic nerd (not at the rivet-counting level you are, though!) and I care a lot about historical accuracy in films. I completely agree with you about the responsibility Hollywood has to present historical people and situations relatively accurately. I, like you, find certain exaggerations and conglomerations to be fine. The lead female character in "Chernobyl" was a comlomgeration of hundreds of scientists, and this helped the show give them credit.
I was STUNNED to see that 1911 Ismay quote! That changes everything. No type-A strong-willed leader says things like, "If the Captain and X and Y person agree to do it a certain way, I won't stand in their way."
Character assassination like this and what happened to Murdoch should make us more upset than it does, I think because we don't adequately sympathize with what it would be like to BE the person whose legacy is forever ruined because of a Hollywood writer or director.
Another great piece from you, Mike. Detailed enough without nitpicky. Absolutely agree about the Titanic film getting people into the historical event. I was in upper primary school when the movie came out. I was obsessed! Haha
Favourite scene I froth over each time is the 'take her to sea Mr Murdoch' engines, water splashing, officers.. the lot!
Great price? Absolute bargain I say!
B-plugs
Just found this channel and it’s great! Really well produced all the episodes I’ve seen so far!
I really enjoyed Your view on the Titanic, gave a lot of insight into the history of what happened in 1912. I was amazed and impressed by Your perspective, definitely 2 thumbs up.
I think the film actually did a lot to renew interest in the Titanic, both in pop culture (obviously) but scientifically as well. You mentioned a study that was done to figure out at what angle the ship broke apart, and I don't know if that study would have been done if it weren't for the movie, and the discussions it sparked
I was applauding through most of this; you've summed up a lot of my thoughts on this film.
The portrayal of Murdoch was very problematic, however in the context of Hollywood I can see how it happened. James himself admits he let his screenwriter self get carried away and push the historian down.
Murdoch was extremely capable, you probably know this story, but many reading may not. He actually saved the S.S. Arabic from a collision 5 years earlier. He identified a ship in fog, calculated the trajectories, and pushed the helmsman aside to counterman a direct order to turn, having worked out they'd hit if they did so. Witnesses say they missed by feet; no doubt this incident ran through Murdoch's mind that night. I would believe that Murdoch had seen the iceberg at the same time if not before the bell was rung.
Frederick Fleet's own testimony supports this; he said the ship was already turning while he was waiting for the bridge crew to answer the telephone. Given what you've told us about the response time of the ship, this could only have happened if the turn order had already been carried out.
As you said, they *almost,* had it 😢
Regarding the shooting scene, as much as I dislike the results of this scene to the legacy of Murdoch, it's probably one of the most powerful to me in terms of the acting. Ewan Stewart did an incredible job showing exactly those big emotions that people would have felt that night.
The helplessness of the situation, his desperation to save as many as he could, the totally human instinctive reaction to the sudden movement in his peripheral vision. And the fact he does it without a single word spoken was just 👌. We see the spectrum of emotions play across Murdoch's face, the devastation, the realisation of everything that's happening and then the resolve once he's made up his mind he's going to do it.
Absolute tear-jerker moment for me and it stayed with me for a long time after that first viewing of the film at age 14.
A cute historical fact- most people interpret the scene of Jack & Rose being seen by Murdoch as cute window dressing.
I believe the inclusion of Murdoch smiling at the two is a nod to the fact that he met his own wife on a voyage between Sydney & Liverpool in 1903. He's smiling because he knows how it feels.
Great video as always, Mike!
This was really nice e to read thank you
@@MonsterJuiced you're welcome. I really love this portrayal, and many people never realise the deeper significance it has.
My daughter-in-law told me about this channel. I super enjoyed this episode and joined to see others about the Titanic saga. Thanks!😊
I absolutely appreciate your in-depth, no fluff approach. My new favorite historian!
Thank you for adding more accurate information about the sinking of the Titanic than what we frequently get in movies. I really like the movie Titanic. To me it was a lot like it must have appeared to all those shocked and mostly confused passengers. It’s often a convergence of misfortunes and I never bought the idea that Bruce Ismay was the movie-requisite evil guy. My son and I really enjoy the truths you tell about ships and ship sinking. And thank you for defending Murdoch. In other histories he did not go around shooting people, although I know such an occurrence might be required. One of my favorite parts was the all too brief look at the steam engines reversing. They must have been gigantic. My family were steam engine people since the time they were invented and I have a lovely working wood model of an upright that my father made. It runs on pressurized air. The metal twin to it was gifted to his close friend. Papa would have enjoyed the movie Titanic if I could have gotten him to sit still that long. March 4 would have been his 100th birthday. Thank you so much for the truths you tell about shipwrecks. They are historical and too important to be sullied with falsehoods.
Oceanliner designs, i would like to thank you for giving us true information. Im wanting to become a maritime historian when i leave school and you have helped me so much. Thank you.
Another great video thanks. I’ve gone down a big rabbit hole recently with your tales of shipwrecks and Titanic in particular.
That new intro is soooo perfect!! 😍 Majestic, cinematic - both my filmmaker and musician sides love it!!
Always great content ! Mike as a fellow Ozzie,
I feel you would be the perfect content creator to look into two of Australia’s greatest Maritime mysteries , the disappearance of the Patanela , and the disappearance of the crew of the Kaz 2 that could be some great content mate. Sorry I realize this comment is off topic. I just feel you could really do both stories justice.
Did you ever notice that overall "Titanic" has the same plot as "George of the Jungle"? Curly-haired beauty is being pushed by her mother into marrying a cad. While the beauty is on a voyage with the cad, a poor but handsome rogue saves her from death. He takes her on a journey to seldom-seen places, dances with her, and introduces her to cool new friends. The cad nearly kills the rogue, but the beauty saves his life. In the end, the beauty, clad in an elegant white gown, is united with the rogue, clad in his simple garb, while people from both their worlds look on and applaud.
Well, they say there are only 5 basic plots in the world. George & Titanic must be one of them.
Yup. Cameron is a Hack.
Aren’t we all?
This is a great channel for maritime history! Love the segments on the Titanic.
A major reason, if not the greatest reason, for Ismay not pushing Smith to get into port a full day early has to do with traffic. Just like airport gates today, there were only so many berths available for big liners. If Titanic had shown up a day early there would have been no place for her to berth and would have had to sit out in the harbor for a day, sort of the equivalent of waiting on the tarmac for a gate to clear, if your plane gets in a little early.
I recall when the movie came out that Cameron said he made an effort to include all of the myths about Titanic. He was conciously aware of the fact that he was presenting myth as fact to make the movie more enjoyable for the audience. I have always watched it with that in mind and take the information presented in the movie as good story telling and research any part that I am interested in for myself. Unfortunately not everyone does that and will take a Hollywood movie as an accurate description of a historical event.
My Hatred of the Cameron film is based entirely on the Fact that he took WAY too many Liberties just to make sure his Film Made Nearly Billions. He didn't CARE about Accuracy, Anachronisms, Story or History. He DIDN'T have to make up Characters. Jack Thayer and Olive "Rose" Earnshaw were REAL Survivors and he coulda made an "Apocryphal" Story Arc of 17 Year old 1st Class Passenger Jack and 22 Year old Divorcee 2nd Classer Rose corresponding and ultimately have a brief Love affair on the RMS Titanic. Thayer was VERY intelligent, VERY Handsome for his time, and was turning 18 at the time and Earnshaw was a YOUNG, Single, Tomboy Divorcee and 1st and 2nd Class Passengers WERE allowed to Correspond with each other and allowed free access to Each Decks. It was the 3rd Class who were Discriminated and Segregated. Also, Cameron could have Portrayed Lawrence Beesley as their Friend(Cal is a DEAD Ringer for Professor Beesley and that Ain't no coincidence) with the Film being about how ALL 3 Survivors saw the suffering of the victims and how they all collaborated together to tell Congress what they saw.
Apocryphal Storytelling Works. It allows Suspension of Disbelief because its on the line of the "We don't know if that's how it really happened, it probably did that way, it coulda, but we can't say for absolute sure" This Worked for Braveheart,Ray, La Bamba, Mask, how in the HELL did James Cameron not get or Understand that?
Cameron's Titanic isn't Apocryphal. Its Romeo and Juliet Fanfiction that uses the RMS Titanic as a Backdrop. And it wouldn't bother me so much had he NOT ripped off and stole the Likeness of Thayer,Earnshaw and Beesley for his Three Fictional Characters.
About Andrews in the smoking room - it makes the most sense he did not die in there. Same with Smith in the wheelhouse. Look at how human beings behave (or all creatures really) especially in the face of death. I can’t believe anyone would willingly stay below deck to drown in a flooding room, in the smoking room or the wheelhouse or otherwise. Actual drowning with no escape is a horrific fear for most people. The human brain will always cling to the smallest bit of hope that they could make it out alive, therefore they will always position their physical locations in the best possible position to their survival. If they can’t survive, they will always try to make their end as easy as possible while delaying it as long as they possible can. If their options are to stay inside a sinking ship to drown or to leap gently into the water and go from there, they are going to jump into the water and go from there. Get from the next moment to the next. Hope that a lifeboat is coming back for you or that a piece of floating debris will present itself, while making themselves as comfortable as they can in preparation for their end. It’s just natural.
Thank you Mr. Brady, I thoroughly enjoy your videos, as you tell us the facts and history and in this video and more accurate personal details of these historic people I escape back to April in 1912 and imagine how it would have been, how these people responded to this tragedy. I became interested in the Titanic when I was around 11 years old in 1965, I came across the book, A Night to Remember and was enthralled with the sinking of this great ship, it was the first I'd heard of the Titanic and from that point on I found as much information that was available from the public libraries. The story was absolutely fascinating to me and I watched the movie from that book as soon as it came available. There was no internet or DVDs or VHS tapes back then, you just had to wait until it came on the air again. Well, thank you again Michael, I look forward to your next video. My interests of the Titanic will never diminish and I'm happy to see any all videos of the Titanic you will create. Take care.
Fantastic presentation! Just subbed. Looking forward to exploring more of your content, good sir. Well done.
I think it would’ve been really neat to see some sort of depiction of Joseph LaRoche, Titanic’s only black passenger, who was an engineer and second class passenger, traveling with his wife and daughters. Perhaps he needs his own biopic, as it probably would’ve been too challenging to show a short cameo of him in this already four hour film.
Very fair and insightful analysis and criticisms from our friend, Mr. Mike Brady. And, informative, educational and entertaining, as always. Thank you for the consistently excellent and original content.
As a huge Titanic movie fan, this video was absolutely PERFECT! Your channel is a true gem 💜
For me, the thing I didn't like in the '97 movie is how they portrayed the Titanic-crew as incompetent. The more I have learned about the disaster, the more impressed I'm with their actions on that fateful night.
Considering you are new to this ship and *Bam* it's sinking out under you. Alot of stress to keep calm that night!
The Capt was on his last main ship 🚢 voyage after a 50yr + career. I highly doubt Smith was inept or unable to run the large ship.
@@DavidLLambertmobile yes. he had quite a career. Captain Smith also captained the Olympic. So the Titanic wouldn't be that much different.
There is enough evidence to indicate that some officer shot themselves. I tend to agree with Walter Lord that it was Chief Officer Wilde who did so and accept Lightoller's explanation of what happened to Murdoch.
It was Wilde. 16 Year Old Survivor Edith Haisman testified she Saw Wilde kill himself and that He shouted "I've got a good mind to shoot someone".
This is the first video of yours I have watched. It was excellent. Your voice is pleasant to listen to, your outfit and the background went well with the content, and of course it was very informative. Titanic is in my top five movies. Three of the others are also 90s movies. As the 1990s was the decade for epic, dramatic, theatrical masterpieces.
This is great ...since moving from London to Southampton I have really got in to this, seeing the houses where crew lived within the city ...This is so interesting and amazing....thank you.
When Rose and Jack got in the lift,,,,she gave the middle finger...........That would not have been done in 1914...........
What about in 1912?
Murdoch: *dies an actual hero saving people*
Ismay: *Everyone runs to comments to defend him- who saved himself.*
Accounts of a passenger said that a ships officer (possible Murdoch) ordered ismay to enter the boat as there wasn’t anyone there. Ismay also convinced many woman and children to board a lifeboat early in the sinking,
Please watch some more accurate documentaries! Lord and lady Duff Gordon actually paid an officer to launch a lifeboat with only like 20-30 people in it once they were were in it. That's something they don't show in the movie.
@@rebeccablackburn9487 what? The Gordon’s didn’t pay any officer to launch the boat, it was launched since most of the passengers went aft and not many wanted to leave the comfort of the actual ship itself. Then Murdoch ordered some crew members to board then lowered, no way 1st officer Murdoch would a bribe.
@@Aperson-qv9rd I never said it was officer Murdoch who accepted the bribe. Please stop basing everything you know about Titanic from the movie. It's fiction built around a historic event.
As always, another great video. Thanks for everything you do. It's wonderful!
I'm sorry you're going through such a difficult time. Thank you for brightening up our day - informative and entertaining video.
My biggest complaint about "Titanic" is the plagiarized scenes from the film "A Night to Remember" ...
But again, a night to remember used scenes from the Nazi titanic
yeah, it was nice that they included the standard shots: "plates fall off the shelves," "furniture slides across the floor," but with all the creative people involved, I can't think but that they could have come up with some new shots, e.g., safes in the pursors office going underwater, ... fires in the kitchens being put out....
The biggest mistake was writing jack and rose
B-plot
Agreed. The love story made no sense.
I watch Titanic for the reality, not jack and rose lol
It’s a romantic subplot to hang the greater story of the ship’s sinking on. It’s basically immaterial and could be replaced by any of the other major or even some of the minor characters’ journeys’ while still retaining the greater spirit of Titanic’s story.
Thanks for doing this. I have two personal Titanic connections - born in Belfast where she was built - on 1st Sep 1985, the very day she was discovered by Ballard on the ocean floor. So the ship has always fascinated me and the Cameron movie is my favourite picture.
I visited the Murdoch memorial plaque in Dalbeattie, Scotland. I understand Twentieth Century Fox did apologize to Murdoch's family for the way he was portrayed.
So glad you cleared up the misconception about Ismay.
Have you ever seen the Nazi version of the Titanic movie. VERY interesting!!!!!!!
"a rivet counter" - what a wonderful expression. I posit that you are quite about humanity. Your passion for the people of ship's crews is obvious to me and a huge draw for me to watch your work. 🥰
Thank you very much for the video. One thing that I never believed is that famous scene where DiCaprio hugs Winslet and her says "i'm flying!", both of them are in the very edge of the bow castle. I guess that area was forbidden for passengers.
I'm glad you told that bit of history (lost history?) about Ismay. For one, I didn't personally, know it, and for two, it sheds a different light on him and the situation. Part of the reason, I think, why he's thought of as a villain is because of the prevailing attitude at the time. Ismay survived, but a lot of people probably thought he had no business trying to survive. After all, he was the president of WSL at the time and, therefore, responsible for Titanic and all those lives. How dare he not go down with that ship when Captain Smith and Thomas Andrews did? I think that was the prevailing attitude.
Another fascinating story! Thank you Mike and crew.
Very interesting. I look forward to seeing the video about Bruce Ismay. Thank you. I love the very first sight of Titanic in the movie
i applaud you for making this video and highlighting the fact that real people´s characters need to be honestly depicted, especially as it is (unfortunately) from Hollywood films that most people take their information.
This is why I love historical based films! Titanic was one of the films as a kid that made me want to better understand the events of history and I still love the events of Titanic to this day!! Thank you for so many amazing videos!