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@@JackFoxtrotEDMLet's stop pretending that devs have zero input into the direction of a game. So yeah, they are partly to blame. The direction of this series was horrendous.
@@JackFoxtrotEDM You never see anyone ever come forward in these scenarios and hold themselves accountable, all they ever do is pass the buck. They can all share the blame.
Volition really wanted to ignore fan’s complaints, mock them on twitter, and follow through with their awful decisions….and where did it lead them? To shutting down. 😂
The game's legacy has already ended when the story "concluded" with Saints Row IV and Gat Outta Hell. It ended on a wacky high note. Just wished they went and made something else of a similar vein but not "Saints Row" so it would've not had an expectation put on it amongst other things.
@@jmagic1986Yes, it’s definitely dead, but maybe not forever, resurrection is always a possibility, even for franchises that fizzled out in some of the most pathetic fashion. The revival of Dead Space with the release of the Dead Space Remake in January is a perfect example, THE perfect example, there’s always hope, even if it takes an entire decade or so like Dead Space did, only around 1 month short of 10 year in between the release of Dead Space 3 and the remake. Someday in 2032 or something, Gameranx might make a Friday weekly video in which they announce another reboot of Saints Row, with this reboot much better and selling far better as a result, thus actually properly rebooting the beloved stupidity simulator we all once adored with our friends.
Hate to see it happen to a series I once loved, but thats what happens when you become hostile to your player base and refuse to acknowledge your game's massive and numerous shortcomings.
Honestly, the series ended with 4. It wasn't a masterpiece or anything, but it completed the..."evolution" of the franchise from a GTA-wannabe to a satire of videogames as a whole.
The biggest casualty of this closure is that it spells the end of Mike Watson's legacy. Developer of the SR2 mod Gentlemen of the Row, he was brought on board by Volition to remaster the SR2 PC port but tragically died of cancer before it could be completed. Knowing his death was coming he set in place contingencies for its continued development. However the death of Volition inevitably means that this project will never see the light of day. RIP IdolNinja, Volition didn't deserve you. Their "solemn vow" to finish your work was as hollow as the reboot that killed the dream.
Wow… Kinda wish I didn’t learn about this, because that *stings.* A fan so dedicated to their modding work that the studio brought them on to make it official, only for the fan to die and have the studio fall not long after. Hopefully a dev that worked on the port releases whatever they had to the public so that modders can once again possibly finish the work.
@@Nick-ue7iwNo, it was confirmed that Volition started work on it after finishing the last dlc for the reboot. Now that Volition is gone Deep Silver the publisher that held on to the property rights to Saints Row is getting cold feet about making the patch because it won't make money.
This was not surprising at all. Volition only have themselves to blame, but they never will. The way they treated their fans like crap was their ultimate downfall.
Yep. Just like that Battlefield V exec who mocked the criticisms and was later fired when people didn't buy the game. It's wild people can be so arrogant to potential consumers.
All the C-Suite assholes and team leads who made the calls on the Saints Row reboot are going to protect each other and secure future decision making jobs in the industry.
The devs who worked there weren't to blame actually, it's the corporate leadership making bad / cynical decisions and handling communication. Embracer just punished hundreds of hard working developers, probably while rewarding the people who were really to blame for the game's outcome.
Yo they should've never released it in the first place. Not in it's current form. Seems like there was no quality control testing at all. The publisher should not have approved it and given it the go ahead either.
The big problem in the industry is that video games are being run by business people who have no clue and understanding about video-game entertainment. They probably have never played a video game in their lives. They're in the wrong business.
They have been around a long time and made a lot better games then just saints row, It's genuinely sad to see a company fall so far. They are a example of what happens when you shun your own fans
@diomedes7971 I prefer red faction out of their games then any other personally, but yeah i know the team has been shook up quite a few times these years but I think you would be surprised how many actually have been there all this time, people change.
Let me just correct you real quick. It's hard to feel bad for the modern Volition, the ones that made the new Saints Row and mocked their fans, but it was a 30 year old company and they weren't always like this. They made amazing games back then so it kinda sucks to see them go out of business because the new teams were idiots.
Because it wasn’t them it was deep silver masquerading as them and ruining they’re games like how the reboot was supposed to be about games but deep silver hated the idea they refused to let them do it and follow they’re instructions
They should’ve listened to their fans instead of insulting them. Plain and simple. Their response to early criticism was “don’t like it, don’t buy it” then act shocked when that’s exactly what happened. You get what you deserve.
I don’t think it’s a coincidence that the “don’t like it, don’t buy it” approach that is appearing with so many failing games is coinciding with the embarrassing “millennial writing” trend that has taken root recently, which is also present in Saints Row. The same self-infatuated condescending attitude that plagues the writing of these games has also passed into the marketing for it as well. The amount of ego here is unreal.
They literally ended the 4th with a time machine. That literally wrote itself a soft reboot going back to roots. Like the boss could've been like naw we're goofy now, we lost our way, imma use the time machine to go back to when we lost of way and make sure don't stray again
@@d00gz_ I mean Fromsoft has been designing their games with that "don't like it, don't buy it" approach for a long time, and look where they are now. The games that failed are just poorly made, plain and simple. If a dev team knew what they are doing they get to do whatever they want without ever listening to the fans.
You are delusional. From soft just makes game. They dont mock you, dont insult. Here is a game, play it. You want easier difficulty? Here lvlups and magic. And summons, and coop so you can go aft and let the game win itself. Filthy casuals and media boost their ego by pretending that souls games are hard. as simple as that. In reality even assasins creed or witcher 3 are harder than souls. @@None38389
They listened to Embracer. They expected to make money. This isn't JUST on Volition here. Embracer knew all along what was happening, they approved of all of it.
@@Half-Vampire yep, they scream asking products to be changed, but they don't actually consume them haha it's a fun thing to see in such a disgrace wasteland
@jacksmith6015The business of ripping people off with Microtransactions only works with games popular amongst casuals such as GTA, COD, and FIFA etc. Still remember when Sony tried to make Gran Turismo 7 a grind fest with low payouts and extremely long grinding in order to make people opt for Microtransactions and it became the most review bombed game on metacritic in history as there are barely enough casuals who play GT who'll tolerate that nonsense. Long time GT fans took a stand against Sony that day and Polyphony were forced to fix the payouts. Just one example.
@jacksmith6015 ea have a base of morons hooked into their sports franchises. Steam reviews may be bad but the biggest customer base for these piles of shit are consolers.
As the large media companies begin to realize that ESG scores can't make up for the loss of entire audiences, we may start to see, slowly, a return to movies and games that people actually want to see and play.
"You just don't know that you want it yet" - Volition Twitter Seriously, they made exactly what they wanted, ignoring all the criticism, feedback, warnings, and single handedly killed the franchise. They get what they deserve.
@@JeronimoStilton14 Even if it had ZERO bugs on release the game would have done just as bad. Even if the Publisher had pushed back the release another year or two as that doesn't change the fact the developers weren't listening to anyone but themselves. The game is objectively bad and the developers didn't listen to criticism. See KibethSE's quote. They really treated feedback like that.
@@fluffyomega6809 They got tons of feedback pre-launch that the game was absolutely gonna flop because it was alienating the franchise's fanbase but instead of taking that intoa ccount they actively mocked the fanbase, which lead to them not even giving the game a shot. Basically a repeat of the DmC debaccle.
@@visitante-pc5zc They totally gave a middle finger to fans and made a diferent game to pander to a people that basically does not play games, and the game is full of out of touch "Hello fellow kids!" energy
@@visitante-pc5zc reasons why is gaming company he explaining in video few reasons. 1: Golem, how badly was built and how much physics crashed so hard, even thou studio made apology but wasnt enough save them so shut down. 2: Forsaken, very bad writing, main character is bland as plywood wasnt even funny so they got shutdown. 3: The "New" Saints Row, Saints Row was the most highly respected game series was parody of GTA which you can get all 5 of saints row games were Volitions best series, till they made this Saints Row basicly destoryed everything Saints Row it was its identity so tarnished that legacy so now ended with shutdown.
With things like this going on and yet some game developers still wouldn't listen to the gamers/consumers 🤦♀🤦♀🤦♀ (Like yes we may not be right all the time but when the majority of us are expressing the same concerns on a game, game developers should probably listen and fix it instead of being in denial)
@@namesii1880unfortunately there's an increasingly smaller base supporting their fans. Rockstar and Take Two are at most 3 years away from just going against their fans, CDPR got a good slap across the face and looks like they came back to fans... Idk if there's any other huge gaming company loyal to the fan base.
It's a shame what happened to Daedalic. They weren't a bad studio but I think they stepped far too out of their 'comfort zone'. They were great at making 2d Puzzle adventure games. Probably shouldn't have tried to tackle such a big project
Often times, a studio doesn't deserve to be shut down because of unrealistic expectations placed upon them by their owner/publisher that they had no hope of meeting. In this case, however, the studio ABSOLUTELY deserved it.
Yup IGN is a joke and proves it every year. EDIT: after checking it looks like they gave SR a 7.3 in one review and a 6 in another. Could've sworn they rated it higher
This one is actually on the devs at Volition. Fans made it known every possible way since the first trailer dropped for Saints Row that they didn't like what they saw: TH-cam dislikes, Twitter, Reddit, etc. They said they, and I quote, "won't back down," and called the fans of the original Saints games "terrorists". The developers said they believed in the product they're developing (seriously, they said product, not game) and were adamant that once the game came out and once the game releases "fans will see what they've done and appreciate it." Everything the developers said themselves in interviews and social media points the finger directly at them. I know Yong likes to stick up for the working developer, but this looks to be at least mostly on Volition themselves, not Embracer.
Thank you. All the talk in this video of "Embracer this" and "Embracer that", and I'm just over here like... Uhh Hello? He caveats it with "I'd like to see if it was an Embracer failing or a Volition failing" and then proceeds to shit over Embracer the whole video. Barely a nod toward any wrong doing by Volition at all. Crazy.
@@hammerstriker5208Yong tends to lean more to the Progressive Left side of things. So he probably thought unironically that the haters really were just "the chuds". TH-camrs like YellowFlash called them out tho, unlike Yong.
@diomedes7971 same. And yes, Yong should've been more transparent with the context of Volition's behavior, instead of just being anti corpo, as if Volition did nothing wrong.
@@thedarkknightman6150the IP is in the hand of Deep Silver and they are under Embracer Group. So my guess is the IP (saints row) will be put on ice until Deep Silver find a new studio and gets the green light from Embracer Group
It’s crazy to thing this could be Larian right now had Bg3 not turned into a huge success. This just goes to show how important it is for game developers to know their target audience and deliver a product they can be proud of.
It’ll never happen to gaming companies like Larian. They listen to their fans too much that no matter if the game isn’t an ace like Baldurs Gate, real gaming fans will support them regardless.
Same goes to Fromsoft too, which is the only legendary game studios left after the legacy of Sakurai's Sora Ltd (studio/developer of both Kirby and Sumer Smash Bros)
@@ewjiml Larian currently seems to have vision. They make games inside that vision. Some might not fully agree with it (like certain level of wackiness), but they keep true to it and make good enough products. And the vision is not oppose to majority of customers. Which means yeah some people don't like it, but you cannot ever please everyone on Internet.
Not really about delivering a product they can be proud of but setting aside their arrogance and listening to fans when they say "sounds good, but this specific thing (or in this case, nearly the entire thing) is dogshit"
Volition could have taken the bullet and be like "A'ight, we fucked up. We tried do be hip with the kids and we went into the wrong direction with the reboot." But they chose to our right insult fans who didn't like the game and now they will never be able to make a game again.
It was basically over from the point when the first trailers came out unless they were going to go back to the drawing board rewrite the story, massively delaying the game and risking bigger losses. The miscalculation was the whole concept of the rebooted Saints crew and there wasn’t a lot they could do from there
We warned them 😞. We literally told them we didn’t like what they were doing and they ignored us. Even went as far as to mock us fans and double down. I’ve loved Saints Row since childhood and it’s sad seeing one of my 🐐’s going out like a Charmander in the rain. Maybe I’ll get the reboot once it goes down to $10 but Volition will be missed for the memories they’ve given us.
Hopefully the series gets acquired by a studio that actually gives a s**t and does the series right by listening to fans and focuses on making a high quality game.
Not really the game devs but the executives/people making the "due date" calls/limitations. If given the proper time and equipment, skilled/experienced devs can truly create a masterpiece. The ultimate problem is companies wanting to shove out as much content as possible to maximize profits while also undercutting their devs and throwing them under the bus once their unfinished/unpolished games fail and they refuse to take the blame for what disasters they caused.
Good, its shitty for the people who lost jobs but more of this needs to happen so devs/publishers realise their customers are gamers and not the twitterati
the majority of these horrible choices come from the ceo's and shitty top brass not the individual dev's the people at fault probs all got a multimillion dollar paycheck before being let go. the devs who lost there jobs are most certainly not at fault.
@@limyarplane1991How do we know that for sure? It doesn't make sense to assume that the developers have zero input in the direction of a game. They take at least some fault. This game is trash through and through.
Game studios: We’re making a pro agenda game. Gamers: Oh ok cool, enjoy the sales Game releases: sales are rock bottom Game studio: where are the numbers??? Gamers: morning the loss of the old guard because of stupid decision. This cycle rhymes with itself all through recent years and it is not any easier hearing that head up the ass is still an ever present tactic for game development when it’s a huge investment that can kill giants on failure.
I like it this way. In the past, the super companies could hide their pride and blindness behind trends. Now we finally have a trend that steadily puts them out of their misery.
Embracer is nowhere near EA level (very few companies are) EA is just hated for being anti-consumer and insanely greedy. That's the trend so embracer will naturally follow but no one's as bad as EA's iron fist of monteziation.
Yes and no, don't know the exact number (can't be arsed to look them up) but I guess the reboot team had at least 500 developers, from artists to programmers, you can't blame all of them when most of them were just doing their jobs and even when they knew the game was a massive clown show they just didn't had a word in the production. If a movie sucks do you blame the cameraman? The catering assistant? The particle supervisor? No, you don't, you balme producers and directors. Same thing here, the people at the helm are the responsibles.
2024 Developer Guide Step 1: Stop catering to "modern audiences" that don't spend money on your product Step 2: Cater to original fan base Step 3: ??? Step 4: Keep your job
People need to remember that Volition already shut down once, this us not the same team that made the original games. They are the puppeteers put in place by Embracer to animate Volition's body.
it's hard to feel sorry for Volition seeing how they reacted when fans pointed out the reboot didn't look good. But it's REALLY hard to feel sorry for them when they lied to the community about continuing IdolNinja's work on the SR2 patch. IdolNinja poured his heart and soul into his mods for SR2 and SR3, got hired by Volition and was working on a much needed patch for SR2 in his free time before cancer took him. Volition said they'd honor his memory and finish that patch and they never did.
Its scary to think how running with bad ideas in the industry lately is killing off entire studios. Like obviously its not a blameless situation, everybody signed off on the shitty writing and design, but its still scary how failure is being punished harder and harder lately. Edit: I'm not defending this game in the slightest, I hate it as much as the next guy. I'm just saying I hope this doesn't happen to a dev/game that doesn't deserve to be shut down and killed because it ran with a lackluster concept.
Dude, if you worked on this sh!te, then I'm pretty sure you already interviewed multiple new jobs before it came out. I doubt anyone had any pride in what they made.
Why shouldn't it be? If I'm forking out $100M and you put out a game that doesn't even make $6M why should I keep funding you and paying your employees?
If you want your fans to give you $70, make something they want to buy. Abandoning your current customer base to chase a new customer base is risky. Sometimes it pays off, sometimes this happens. I'm very sad the studio shut down. I liked a lot of their older games. However my choices are 1) they shut down or 2) they don't make good games anymore. Damned if you do, damned if you don't. Best of luck to all involved.
Honestly, was Volition really Volition anymore? 30 years is a long time, and honestly, its just a few hundred people in the skinsuit of what was Volition. Everyone of value and had made that company one of the best had moved on to greener pastures long before Saints Row the New.
@@scrittle And then instead of making another Saints Row game they made Agents of Mayhem because they decided that what people really wanted was a lame hero shooter instead of more Saints Row. Literally they said that they saw more people cosplaying as Chaundi and Johnny Gatt than the Boss and decided that people not cosplaying as the completely customizable character that had no default appearance somehow meant players didn't like them.
@@Macrochenia& then they added no ragdoll physics to deaths , weak easter eggs , no past references, they used epic games models so it looks like Fortnite shoots like agents of mayhem
Just remember, everything that Volition did with the reboot had Embracer's blessing. And when Embracer's demands didn't pan out they killed Volition. They are NOT innocent in this. They may be even the perpetrator. Embracer is the one who gave Volition the money and some of the mandates for the game. Let's remember that.
Source? I'm not saying you're lying but I had never heard about any mandates from Embracer. All I have to go on here is Volition's history before Embracer, which was already bad.
The biggest issues people should realize in the industry is, that too many companies put all their eggs into one basket. if it fails. it's all gone and destroyed. I think that the core issue with the latest Saint's Row is just the lack of understanding of the community. they delivered a game no one wanted, and the direction was all wrong. edit: I would seriously pay money for a new Legacy of Kain game
They decided to make a reboot with millenial stereotypes as "humor" which cant blame them for wanting to reboot (given 4 started off with earth getting blown up) but they really should have tried to bring back the old writers, maybe atleast consult one of the old heads that left for the direction they should go. Literally they probably didnt need to even work on graphics, they could have kept the cartoony saints row 3 and 4 style and not tried to lie about it in trailers and just made a "new" game with way more features, maybe improved the customization rather than scaling it down, removed all of the main characters of this reboot and started off with johnny gat talking your character into leading a gang or some shit. hell maybe a saints row 3 remake if they wanted to improve graphics, not really change anything story wise and just polish some mechanics, add more content, not hired whoever they hired to write for the reboot and id buy it.
That's a good lesson for game studios. You don't fight your customers and call them terrorists and expect things to go well. Honestly that's a very well deserved downfall. I don't feel sorry for them.
@@kcadventures1454 Not 'Consumer', customer. 'Pay money, consume product, move to more/next product' is what they want people to do, there's more to the market and life than that.
@@thedarkknightman6150 Nobody lol. Maybe in the far FAR future it can come back but besides that, Only saints row content you'll be seeing from now is mods, fangames perhaps, and the previous entries.
This is what happens when Yong just reads headlines without really understanding what happened. Embracer wasn't the problem here, Volition was. The devs were actively hostile to the fanbase on social media and the fans responded. Yong really missing the core of the story by standing up for a company that deserved to go bust.
So yong is being a clown who instead of blaming to correct people who wants to blame some exces and say the devs were great lmao actual crackhead status
It's like that when you not only push back against but insult, and tell them not to buy it because you are not a true fan because you don't like the way the franchise is going. That they are going to do well. Developers, and entertainment makers seem to be living under a rock because they keep shoveling this garbage out towards a specific audience but even they're not buying it
Focus groups means spending money on things that aren't cash grab games and MTX. What executive will greenlight that? These corpos are a living embodiment of the "No take, only throw" meme. They only want to reach the result without care of what *should* come before.
Honestly, good to see. This is a good example of what happens when you don't release a finished product and promise roadmaps. Sad that Gat, Shaundi, Pierce and everyone else will never see a continuation of their story, however absurd it might be
gat out of hell already gave them some closure. if the heaven hell shenanigans seems to absurd, then you can pretend saints row 4 ending where they defeat zinyak and take his spaceship+time machine to rule the stars is their definite happy ending.
@@kukuhimanputraraharja8084I was hoping that if they got the ending where they found a new planet they could maybe do something like oh your invading Zinyak planet and there’s multiple rival factions against each other and you have to take it over like the original gang style without super powers. Sure it’ll be futuristic and stuff but at least it’ll kinda go back to gang warfare just with different species
@@SoraTerumi244 ended with a freaking time machine. We could have had saints in the wild west, saints in the medieval wars/times, etc etc, but instead they chose to reboot 🤦♀️
@@SoraTerumi24zinyak's entire zin people already immediately accept the saints as their new ruler though when the saints killed zinyak on live broadcast to the entire galaxy or something. i mean, the saints basically already ruled the entire galaxy and any timelines though with zinyak's super time travelling ship. thats the true closure for the saint's story imo.
Imagine working your butt off making a game and some idiots who also worked on it start telling off the customers. Then you lose your job. Those people should be responsible for your pay and benefits.
What are you the Joker? There's a reason the word 'fan' stems from 'fanatic'. Yes this was a clear case of the developers ignoring everything that made the old Saints Row games good, but let's not pretend that fanbases aren't capable of some pretty idiotic behavior too.
AAA companies these days are so disconnected from what gamers really want, it’s unbelievable… back in the day the games that were made, were clearly made for gamers, by gamers… now a days… it’s all about profit margins, and it’s so obvious why they are failing to everyone, but themselves.
Agreed. What sucks about Saint's Tow is that if it had had a good writer who'd have been able to put a modern spin on the motivations of the characters in a more coherent way it could've been good. Instead it felt too much like they just ran a checklist of whatever they wanted to throw in the game without even seeing if that made a proper, well "ensemble". Hell the Saints were founded in the OG games because the head honcho saw the city torn apart by crime and abandoned by law and wanted to clean all that up and make the city a nice place again. Doing a modern spin of that with the whole "we're young but crushed by debt" spiel would have been perfectly doable but alas...
Not even just profit margins. They give idealogically driven devs too much control to shape and write their products however they want. Lot of these industries hire very similar kind of people that do not resonate with most normal people and audiences.
@@brenolk4642 exactly. In these instances i like to bring up a thought experiment I like to call "the Shit of Theseus". Take an ancient Greek trireme. Over time, the planks rot and break, and you replace them with whiny crybullies, and you gradually reshape the ship into a giant toilet. When all the planks are replaced, and the ship no longer resembles it's original form, is it still the same ship?
I think this happened because of Embracer losing that 2 billion dollar deal. I mean, that happening right before their earnings call being announced? They only really closed any studios after that happened. I'm betting they would've given Volition another chance is they hadn't been hit by such a massive loss and their stock dropping. But I'm also betting they would've kept a closer eye on Volition making more games to make sure they didn't screw up again.
usually the publishers are painted as the bad guys who interfere the creative process of developers but this is one of many cases where the publisher should have taken action instead of allowing the dev to let loose also this is totally deserving
The Saint’s Row remake stepped into the pitfall that I’m terrified the KOTOR remake is eventually going to step in. The studio had the blue print of a beloved trilogy and instead of bringing it up to speed visually and retroactively polishing some QoL issues here and there (like Dead Space and the RE remakes) they tried to reinvent the wheel. The hard part has already been done for you. This shit is not hard.
That's if KOTOR gets a remake at all, afaik last we heard they quietly 'unannounced' it and now it's kind of hovering in limbo. Considering it was said they want to bring KOTOR 'in line with the current canon', I might honestly prefer it stay in the EU. Not to mention that the Revan novel was... less than stellar, especially with what they did to The Exile, and then there's what they did to Revan in the MMO... The more I think about it, the more I simply wouldn't trust them to remake it. I suppose best case scenario, we'd get to see the characters in modern day graphics? The glimpse of Revan we got in that teaser was pretty neat.
Lesson 1: don't insult the fanbase that you rely on to make your game profitable. Lesson 2, don't make a buggy, poorly-written mess of a game while simlultaneously insulting the fanbase that you rely on to make your game profitable.
@@supersonic20091 Lesson 3: Never push politics unless it's relevant and makes sense inworld to the story and if you have communistic beliefs then you don't belong in the gaming industry.
When you make a game for non-existent "mOdErN aUdIenCe", this is what you get. 100% deserved.. Anyone who worked on Saints Row, needs to change their career. Game Development obviously isn't for them.
Honestly they were on a downward slope for almost a decade and haven’t had a hit since 2015 so it’s nothing short of a miracle they lasted as long as they did.
yeah not gonna lie, volition had one hell of an identity crisis with an unhealthy serving of tunnel vision. 3 was alright but everythimg after felt like a tech demo
@@timvoorhees8102 Hell even with 3, something felt off to me. The pacing was at a breakneck speed and they were trying WAY too hard with the exaggerated humor but it really jumped the shark in 4 to the point they couldn't do anything else except either go to hell or do a reboot. So it's astounding they did both, lol. Saint's Row beyond the first two had an identity crisis much like Red Faction Guerilla but it seems like the Reboot is what finally delivered the killing blow and dried up the last of their reserves.
@@flippedoutkyrii i agree about 3, it was passable mainly because the dialog was amusing. 4 just felt like.....hand holdy? i remeber distinctly the reason i didnt like it was for yhe fact the just hated letting you go on a rampage. those minibosses at full stars to wipe out your wanted level was unavoidable and exhausting. if they are going to give me freaking superpowers lemme go on a Saints Row rampage ffs lmao If i may be so bold as to say, the reboot would have been "passable" if the story would just pick a lane. The god awful writting and anti-coherency was its biggest downfall
@@timvoorhees8102 I'd wager even with a legit back-to-it's-roots narrative like the First two Saint's Row entries, the open world would still be lifeless and the gameplay would still be a slog. It just isn't fun to play as healing requires extended kill animations and even the best guns feel like a chore on even lackey mooks. The only positive for me would be the story at that point and just a bandaid on the overall issue at hand. There was far more wrong with the Reboot then just the writing and the story, and those two were serious detriments to the game as they already were.
Most companies are also smart enough not to outright insult their entire customer base and then tell them the product isn't for them. Volition is the definition of the meme of the person sticking the stick in the spokes of the bike wheel, flipping over and still being utterly perplexed that their ass is now sitting on the ground with skinned up knees.
So many times we see a company try to fix what wasn't broken only to destroy everything in the process. Its like attempting to add bricks to a jenga tower via trying to jam them into an already occupied space and wondering why the whole thing inevitably falls over.
Imagine how bad of a response Volition's executive producer gave to Embracer during their post-mortem meeting for Saints Row... absolute tragedy for a franchise that was given a chance to revive itself.
They got what they deserve. Maybe next time they'll listen to fans instead of insulting them. We the consumers have the power. These devs and companies need to learn. Especially in this case when the Saints Row Reboot was announced..the fans told them that this didn't look good. We told them. We warned them. Instead of taking that criticism they just ignored it and insulted us. And now look. I have zero sympathy. They messed around and found out. Hopefully other devs and companies will take note. This is what happens when you betray your hardcore fanbase.
This is what happens when you don't consider a storyline that people who are fans would enjoy despite it being a reboot. On top of that, actually not taking in criticism and talking back to fans on Twitter, only to release a buggy cringefest. Saints Row will be missed. Yet another beloved IP a company has that will sit in the dark forever.
5:47 The story is very plainly obvious, Volition was a shell of the company that gave fans SR2. The developer was committed to remaining disconnected from reality, Embracer was just enabling this for way too long
It's not even a new story, that's what always gets me. The exact same thing happened with companies like Bungie and Bioware. But people never learn. When the Dragon Age 4 release date gets announced, there will be a wave of "OMG NEW BIOWARE GAME". But is it a new Bioware game? Is it _really?_ Is it a new Bioware game in the same sense that Baldur's Gate 2 was a new Bioware game? What about Knights of the Old Republic? Mass Effect 1? Fuck no lol. The Volition people actually liked was "shut down" over a decade ago, this was just a group of people puppeteering its rotting corpse.
@@yewtewbstew547 It's bit different because Volition went out of their way to make a bad product, but companies like Bioware basically had to submit to their publisher's executive orders. It's still very true that most of these classic studios are essentially different studios now because barely any original staff remains. Idk why this made me think Saints Row 2022 probably would have been a hit Sleeping Dogs sequel Lol
The reboot was a travesty indeed, but damn man volition has been around for a good bit and im sad that the studio is gone hopefully they can transfer the ip to another company.
They have no one but themselves to blame. Saints Row fans had been letting them know what they wanted in a new Saints Row game for years and they chose to ignore that.
As sad as it is to see Volition shut down like this it is at the end of the day the natural order of how things should be, the fact that companies like EA, Blizzard, Activision and so on can do decades of damage to themselves and there respective communities and still keep trodding ahead is and should be considered an anomaly and cause for concern.
Well, they have a lot of "fat". They can have one flop, two, three, and still have billions left, and come back to cash cows to milk some more money. So yeah, not that surprising.
What did they expect was going to happen!? They deserved it for insulting the fans and refusing to grow up and acknowledge they screwed up. These are not the same devs who made the 2 original Saints row games. We all knew that the reboot was doomed from the start ever since the first trailer.
I guess that's what happens when you take a franchise and reboot it for "Modern Audiences," huh? Can't say I'm too saddened by it, although I'm sure it sucks for the people who worked at the studio. Let it serve as a cautionary tale for studios to the kind of content they might _EMBRACE_ .
Remember when DXFromYT predicted on Twitter that the reboot was going to be a financial success and that Volition wouldn’t go belly up? AND that anyone critical of it was a “Fake Fan” using that one clip of Homelander from The Boys looking on his phone?
A pity. Volition did some great stuff. Descent, Freespace, Saints Row 2 through 4... It really sucks that one bad game can kill the whole studio. Granted, Agents of Mayhem wasn't that great, but not allowing them to at least try and bounce back is damn harsh.
This studio could have made a medieval comedy game or even continued the franchise with a fifth game. It's sad these bad decisions to favor audiences who don't care about games like this. 😮💨
Nah Saints needed a reboot but fans wanted a back-to-roots sort of reboot. Actual gang stuff not the 'made to appeal to modern audience' bs. They needed to actually expand on the criminal empire building aspect instead of just....SR3 but with a combat overhaul. They were going in the right direction with the Ventures but there needed to be more to it than just some activities. I feel it should've dipped more into a gang simulator.
Volition has only themselves to blame. That said, it is sad to see them destroy themselves. They created some of my favorite games - Saints Row (mostly 1 and 2, not so much the later games), and Red Faction: Guerrilla were monumental parts of my gaming life.
@@kobra6660 If they rebooted red faction it would literally be a game where the main character is an agender POC with autism who has to fight against Elon Musk on Mars to bring about a communist regime.
Sometimes you have to take Ol’ Yeller behind the woodshed. I’m going to remember Volition the way they used to be, not the developer that had contempt for their fans.
Volition has had such a longstanding history in gaming that it's hard to see them getting shut down. Embracer needs to do better as a publisher at nurturing their game studios and fostering their long term health.
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Yong out
. Right back at you
that’s what i’m saying fr
.
The devs went on social media to openly mock fans who criticized the awful direction they took with the reboot. Trash took itself out.
Yup. I have no sympathy.
Aint trash unlike all you gliaters
@@chestercharlie6750shut yo “Oh nobody likes video games anymore” head ass up
@@JackFoxtrotEDMLet's stop pretending that devs have zero input into the direction of a game. So yeah, they are partly to blame. The direction of this series was horrendous.
@@JackFoxtrotEDM You never see anyone ever come forward in these scenarios and hold themselves accountable, all they ever do is pass the buck. They can all share the blame.
Volition really wanted to ignore fan’s complaints, mock them on twitter, and follow through with their awful decisions….and where did it lead them? To shutting down. 😂
Probably gonna be one of the most infamous fuck around and find out in gaming industy
If only that would happen to COD
To unemployment. The lowest player officially has a higher standard than them now. 😂
And community manager called fans terrorist. Not making that one up it actually happen
@@Skateandcreate9CoD has a community of addicts, no matter what they do they won't fall for the same reason drugs will be always popular.
So this is how the Saints' legacy ends: not with a bang, but with a whimper.
If only there was some way they could have possibly seen this coming
As a future developer, I hope I'll be a director of the remake of original Saint Row. I hope so
I remember that Killbane quote. I really hate to admit that he was right.
The game's legacy has already ended when the story "concluded" with Saints Row IV and Gat Outta Hell. It ended on a wacky high note. Just wished they went and made something else of a similar vein but not "Saints Row" so it would've not had an expectation put on it amongst other things.
@@jmagic1986Yes, it’s definitely dead, but maybe not forever, resurrection is always a possibility, even for franchises that fizzled out in some of the most pathetic fashion.
The revival of Dead Space with the release of the Dead Space Remake in January is a perfect example, THE perfect example, there’s always hope, even if it takes an entire decade or so like Dead Space did, only around 1 month short of 10 year in between the release of Dead Space 3 and the remake.
Someday in 2032 or something, Gameranx might make a Friday weekly video in which they announce another reboot of Saints Row, with this reboot much better and selling far better as a result, thus actually properly rebooting the beloved stupidity simulator we all once adored with our friends.
@@bookofrhymes225 No worries because I'm on part of indie side
Hate to see it happen to a series I once loved, but thats what happens when you become hostile to your player base and refuse to acknowledge your game's massive and numerous shortcomings.
yep 100% agree.
Honestly, the series ended with 4. It wasn't a masterpiece or anything, but it completed the..."evolution" of the franchise from a GTA-wannabe to a satire of videogames as a whole.
When tf did they become "hostile to their playerbase"?
They’ve always been mid games. The first one was great. 😊
@@Jormyyy They subjected us to this game. That's hostile enough for me.
The fun part of all of this is that none of the people involved will ever admit of any fault whatsoever.
And there are people thinking it's a good Idea to add this garbage to Ps Plus...
"Am I so out of touch?
No, it's the gamers who are wrong."
@@Serahpin Embracer better generalised a whole company again 😂
They'll double down
🎯🎯🎯
I can only imagine what passionate, real developers from all those pre 2010s studios could have made with that kind of budget.
All they had to do was follow the formula of the original Saints Row games. All they had to do was follow the damn train, CJ.
The biggest casualty of this closure is that it spells the end of Mike Watson's legacy.
Developer of the SR2 mod Gentlemen of the Row, he was brought on board by Volition to remaster the SR2 PC port but tragically died of cancer before it could be completed. Knowing his death was coming he set in place contingencies for its continued development.
However the death of Volition inevitably means that this project will never see the light of day.
RIP IdolNinja, Volition didn't deserve you. Their "solemn vow" to finish your work was as hollow as the reboot that killed the dream.
Idol ninja is a G god bless
Wow… Kinda wish I didn’t learn about this, because that *stings.* A fan so dedicated to their modding work that the studio brought them on to make it official, only for the fan to die and have the studio fall not long after. Hopefully a dev that worked on the port releases whatever they had to the public so that modders can once again possibly finish the work.
Such a sad story ending. Hopefully something comes out somehow.
Volition killed that years ago. It's MORE likely kelu well see it now then when volition was around.
@@Nick-ue7iwNo, it was confirmed that Volition started work on it after finishing the last dlc for the reboot.
Now that Volition is gone Deep Silver the publisher that held on to the property rights to Saints Row is getting cold feet about making the patch because it won't make money.
This was not surprising at all. Volition only have themselves to blame, but they never will. The way they treated their fans like crap was their ultimate downfall.
Yep. Just like that Battlefield V exec who mocked the criticisms and was later fired when people didn't buy the game. It's wild people can be so arrogant to potential consumers.
All the C-Suite assholes and team leads who made the calls on the Saints Row reboot are going to protect each other and secure future decision making jobs in the industry.
The devs who worked there weren't to blame actually, it's the corporate leadership making bad / cynical decisions and handling communication. Embracer just punished hundreds of hard working developers, probably while rewarding the people who were really to blame for the game's outcome.
Yo they should've never released it in the first place. Not in it's current form. Seems like there was no quality control testing at all. The publisher should not have approved it and given it the go ahead either.
The big problem in the industry is that video games are being run by business people who have no clue and understanding about video-game entertainment. They probably have never played a video game in their lives. They're in the wrong business.
It's kinda hard to feel bad for them especially how they were disrespecting fans like that.
Agreed. Because I sure as hell don't. And I hope to see more of it in fact.
They have been around a long time and made a lot better games then just saints row, It's genuinely sad to see a company fall so far. They are a example of what happens when you shun your own fans
@diomedes7971 I prefer red faction out of their games then any other personally, but yeah i know the team has been shook up quite a few times these years but I think you would be surprised how many actually have been there all this time, people change.
Let me just correct you real quick. It's hard to feel bad for the modern Volition, the ones that made the new Saints Row and mocked their fans, but it was a 30 year old company and they weren't always like this. They made amazing games back then so it kinda sucks to see them go out of business because the new teams were idiots.
Because it wasn’t them it was deep silver masquerading as them and ruining they’re games like how the reboot was supposed to be about games but deep silver hated the idea they refused to let them do it and follow they’re instructions
They should’ve listened to their fans instead of insulting them. Plain and simple. Their response to early criticism was “don’t like it, don’t buy it” then act shocked when that’s exactly what happened. You get what you deserve.
I don’t think it’s a coincidence that the “don’t like it, don’t buy it” approach that is appearing with so many failing games is coinciding with the embarrassing “millennial writing” trend that has taken root recently, which is also present in Saints Row. The same self-infatuated condescending attitude that plagues the writing of these games has also passed into the marketing for it as well.
The amount of ego here is unreal.
They literally ended the 4th with a time machine. That literally wrote itself a soft reboot going back to roots. Like the boss could've been like naw we're goofy now, we lost our way, imma use the time machine to go back to when we lost of way and make sure don't stray again
They also called us fans of the original trilogy terrorists... What a nice approach to pr
@@d00gz_ I mean Fromsoft has been designing their games with that "don't like it, don't buy it" approach for a long time, and look where they are now. The games that failed are just poorly made, plain and simple. If a dev team knew what they are doing they get to do whatever they want without ever listening to the fans.
You are delusional. From soft just makes game. They dont mock you, dont insult. Here is a game, play it. You want easier difficulty? Here lvlups and magic. And summons, and coop so you can go aft and let the game win itself. Filthy casuals and media boost their ego by pretending that souls games are hard. as simple as that. In reality even assasins creed or witcher 3 are harder than souls. @@None38389
What were the developers expecting when they released this game
Profit
Purple
Buckets of ducats. The "modern" audience they were chasing is such a massive and wealthy one, you see.
Capitalism
They listened to Embracer. They expected to make money. This isn't JUST on Volition here. Embracer knew all along what was happening, they approved of all of it.
Devs: "This game isn't for you, chuds!"
Fans: "Fine"
Devs: "WTF why aren't you buying our game?!"
Echoes EA's "If you don't like it, don't buy it"
I guess there are not many "modern audience" out there lol
@@Half-Vampire Nope. They just whine, shit, screech, and guilt trip the loudest.
even if the story did change, the game's horribly buggy state and the stale gameplay will kill it eventually.
@@Half-Vampire yep, they scream asking products to be changed, but they don't actually consume them haha it's a fun thing to see in such a disgrace wasteland
Thats just how it goes, when you act like you dont need the fans, this is your fate.
A prime example of F.A.F.O.
@jacksmith6015The business of ripping people off with Microtransactions only works with games popular amongst casuals such as GTA, COD, and FIFA etc. Still remember when Sony tried to make Gran Turismo 7 a grind fest with low payouts and extremely long grinding in order to make people opt for Microtransactions and it became the most review bombed game on metacritic in history as there are barely enough casuals who play GT who'll tolerate that nonsense. Long time GT fans took a stand against Sony that day and Polyphony were forced to fix the payouts. Just one example.
@jacksmith6015 ea have a base of morons hooked into their sports franchises. Steam reviews may be bad but the biggest customer base for these piles of shit are consolers.
As the large media companies begin to realize that ESG scores can't make up for the loss of entire audiences, we may start to see, slowly, a return to movies and games that people actually want to see and play.
This is the best take. I hope for a future where quality and fan management get priority over ESG again.
Studios are hopefully noticing that people are refusing to play their terrible quality games anymore
I doubt it, the main reason why they can have that bloated of a budget is due to the ESG score.
It won't. If a CEO can win a 20x bonus he will take the risk.
So who's going to take care of saints row now?
SR Fans: "We don't like this game!"
Volition: "Am I so out of touch? No it's the fans who are wrong."
The new people heading volition who probably never touched the other games probably to blame
"You just don't know that you want it yet" - Volition Twitter
Seriously, they made exactly what they wanted, ignoring all the criticism, feedback, warnings, and single handedly killed the franchise.
They get what they deserve.
And they got a massive budget to do it. This one isn’t on the publisher.
@@mx2000well it is on the publisher they should’ve fired them instead of giving them 100 million dollars
@@mx2000lots of money doesn’t mean timelines weren’t tight, producers use two currencies
@@JeronimoStilton14 Even if it had ZERO bugs on release the game would have done just as bad. Even if the Publisher had pushed back the release another year or two as that doesn't change the fact the developers weren't listening to anyone but themselves. The game is objectively bad and the developers didn't listen to criticism. See KibethSE's quote. They really treated feedback like that.
Damn straight.
How could they fail with all the sales from the "modern audience" ?
The conversion rate of "Internet likes" to actual money is just very bad as of lately.
Exactly. Where is this "modern audience" that everyone keeps raving about?
They probably pirate it anyway
Volition did this to themselves, not the “terrorists” they kept mocking and insulting. Well, guess what, Volition - “Terrorists” Wins! 🤣
this really need the CS "terrorist win" sound.
@@KoeSeer followed by the bomb exploding sound cause none of the volition staff diffused the situation.
Oxbxdhdhdhienxbfjd awesome reference
@@varnix1006 Oh yes! 🤣
Would like but it's at 69
Edit: nevermind 😅
They did this to themselves
Agreed
Im lost what did they do so bad?
@@fluffyomega6809made a bad game 🤷♂️
@@fluffyomega6809 They got tons of feedback pre-launch that the game was absolutely gonna flop because it was alienating the franchise's fanbase but instead of taking that intoa ccount they actively mocked the fanbase, which lead to them not even giving the game a shot.
Basically a repeat of the DmC debaccle.
I'm glad I waited for the reviews.
Wow. What a surprise. No one could have predicted this.
Definitely those geniuses from Deep Silver and Embracer 😂
Can you explain why? I'm new to gaming. Are those companies badly managed?
Yeah! No one!
What a shocker!
@@visitante-pc5zc They totally gave a middle finger to fans and made a diferent game to pander to a people that basically does not play games, and the game is full of out of touch "Hello fellow kids!" energy
@@visitante-pc5zc reasons why is gaming company he explaining in video few reasons.
1: Golem, how badly was built and how much physics crashed so hard, even thou studio made apology but wasnt enough save them so shut down.
2: Forsaken, very bad writing, main character is bland as plywood wasnt even funny so they got shutdown.
3: The "New" Saints Row, Saints Row was the most highly respected game series was parody of GTA which you can get all 5 of saints row games were Volitions best series, till they made this Saints Row basicly destoryed everything Saints Row it was its identity so tarnished that legacy so now ended with shutdown.
There were devs who openly called the fans terrorists. No love lost here.
Volition: We've been driven by a passion for our community and always worked to deliver joy, surprise, and delight
Also Volition: hAtErs gOnNa hAtE
Yeah thats a big lie. They despise their fans.
With things like this going on and yet some game developers still wouldn't listen to the gamers/consumers 🤦♀🤦♀🤦♀
(Like yes we may not be right all the time but when the majority of us are expressing the same concerns on a game, game developers should probably listen and fix it instead of being in denial)
@@taags A very common thing with modern games and TV. Which is wild.
@@namesii1880unfortunately there's an increasingly smaller base supporting their fans. Rockstar and Take Two are at most 3 years away from just going against their fans, CDPR got a good slap across the face and looks like they came back to fans... Idk if there's any other huge gaming company loyal to the fan base.
@@Andrewbaysura1 Blizzard is another one of those Companies that shits on their fans, it won't be long until people are gonna drop them...
Volition had plenty of warnings right from the first Trailer drop. They kind of had this coming which is very sad to say as a Saints 1,2 and 3 fan..
It's a shame what happened to Daedalic. They weren't a bad studio but I think they stepped far too out of their 'comfort zone'. They were great at making 2d Puzzle adventure games. Probably shouldn't have tried to tackle such a big project
We will (Never) get Harvey & Edna 3
I liked Blackguards and Night of the Rabbit. I dlreally do think it's a shame.
This is how Volition ends. Not with a bang, but a whimper.
@@kobra6660Nah, Saints Row 3 was already out by then, and that already had the rot in its core.
Darn, I hear they had a really good ESG score.
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
Wait a minute... so your telling me... video games only need to appeal to game journalist... and not the people who buy it?
Often times, a studio doesn't deserve to be shut down because of unrealistic expectations placed upon them by their owner/publisher that they had no hope of meeting. In this case, however, the studio ABSOLUTELY deserved it.
I guess insulting potential customers didn't work
Whaaaaaaat? It doesnt? Are you sure? lol
Friendly reminder IGN gave Saints Row a 8 and Starfield a 7.
Yup IGN is a joke and proves it every year. EDIT: after checking it looks like they gave SR a 7.3 in one review and a 6 in another. Could've sworn they rated it higher
Thats because IGN rating is bought
Gameinformer would make ya think saints row was worth picking up.
IGN = Oxymoron
This is why ign is never to be trusted and anyone who uses them are morons unfortunately.
Who knew that alienating your entire fanbase would back fire?
This one is actually on the devs at Volition. Fans made it known every possible way since the first trailer dropped for Saints Row that they didn't like what they saw: TH-cam dislikes, Twitter, Reddit, etc. They said they, and I quote, "won't back down," and called the fans of the original Saints games "terrorists". The developers said they believed in the product they're developing (seriously, they said product, not game) and were adamant that once the game came out and once the game releases "fans will see what they've done and appreciate it." Everything the developers said themselves in interviews and social media points the finger directly at them. I know Yong likes to stick up for the working developer, but this looks to be at least mostly on Volition themselves, not Embracer.
Thank you. All the talk in this video of "Embracer this" and "Embracer that", and I'm just over here like... Uhh Hello?
He caveats it with "I'd like to see if it was an Embracer failing or a Volition failing" and then proceeds to shit over Embracer the whole video. Barely a nod toward any wrong doing by Volition at all. Crazy.
@@hammerstriker5208Yong tends to lean more to the Progressive Left side of things. So he probably thought unironically that the haters really were just "the chuds". TH-camrs like YellowFlash called them out tho, unlike Yong.
@diomedes7971 same. And yes, Yong should've been more transparent with the context of Volition's behavior, instead of just being anti corpo, as if Volition did nothing wrong.
You can’t spell Volition without an L
Basically getting idiot left Wing activists to make a game after hi jacking it
Congratulations Volition, you played yourself. Particularly by your embarrassing social media beef
So who's going to take care of saints row now??
@@thedarkknightman6150the IP is in the hand of Deep Silver and they are under Embracer Group. So my guess is the IP (saints row) will be put on ice until Deep Silver find a new studio and gets the green light from Embracer Group
@@thedarkknightman6150iIts done unless somebody buys it if it can be bought. You should buy it😅
@@thedarkknightman6150depends on whither the ip gets sold or shelved.
It’s crazy to thing this could be Larian right now had Bg3 not turned into a huge success. This just goes to show how important it is for game developers to know their target audience and deliver a product they can be proud of.
It’ll never happen to gaming companies like Larian. They listen to their fans too much that no matter if the game isn’t an ace like Baldurs Gate, real gaming fans will support them regardless.
Same goes to Fromsoft too, which is the only legendary game studios left after the legacy of Sakurai's Sora Ltd (studio/developer of both Kirby and Sumer Smash Bros)
@@ewjiml Larian currently seems to have vision. They make games inside that vision. Some might not fully agree with it (like certain level of wackiness), but they keep true to it and make good enough products.
And the vision is not oppose to majority of customers. Which means yeah some people don't like it, but you cannot ever please everyone on Internet.
Actually this just shows how important it is not to sell your studio to pieces of shit like embracer group, or to do business deals with Saudi Arabia.
Not really about delivering a product they can be proud of but setting aside their arrogance and listening to fans when they say "sounds good, but this specific thing (or in this case, nearly the entire thing) is dogshit"
Volition could have taken the bullet and be like
"A'ight, we fucked up. We tried do be hip with the kids and we went into the wrong direction with the reboot."
But they chose to our right insult fans who didn't like the game and now they will never be able to make a game again.
It was basically over from the point when the first trailers came out unless they were going to go back to the drawing board rewrite the story, massively delaying the game and risking bigger losses. The miscalculation was the whole concept of the rebooted Saints crew and there wasn’t a lot they could do from there
@@TheJadedJamesit was flawed at inception.
This was on the dev's this time.
Devs on twitter: "Deal with it"
**Studio shutdown**
Fans: "Deal with it"
Karma's a b****
Ironic
DevS would imply all of them.
@@_Cetarial not in all cases
"Devs" implies multiple, goofy. Devs is plural. You're the only one implying all of them. @@_Cetarial
We warned them 😞. We literally told them we didn’t like what they were doing and they ignored us. Even went as far as to mock us fans and double down.
I’ve loved Saints Row since childhood and it’s sad seeing one of my 🐐’s going out like a Charmander in the rain. Maybe I’ll get the reboot once it goes down to $10 but Volition will be missed for the memories they’ve given us.
Hopefully the series gets acquired by a studio that actually gives a s**t and does the series right by listening to fans and focuses on making a high quality game.
@@Antares-rt5ub That’s all we can do. All we can do is hope, brother
Volition will be missed, the pr team in charge of saints row will not.
Its sad, but man this is a wake up call to game devs.
Not really the game devs but the executives/people making the "due date" calls/limitations. If given the proper time and equipment, skilled/experienced devs can truly create a masterpiece. The ultimate problem is companies wanting to shove out as much content as possible to maximize profits while also undercutting their devs and throwing them under the bus once their unfinished/unpolished games fail and they refuse to take the blame for what disasters they caused.
Yeah not make a fortnite clone
Nothing will change.
Won't be a wake up call until ea files for bankruptcy 😂
Saint's Row isn't even a huge franchise like Call of Duty or GTA, nothing will change.
Good, its shitty for the people who lost jobs but more of this needs to happen so devs/publishers realise their customers are gamers and not the twitterati
the majority of these horrible choices come from the ceo's and shitty top brass not the individual dev's the people at fault probs all got a multimillion dollar paycheck before being let go. the devs who lost there jobs are most certainly not at fault.
@@limyarplane1991finally someone that actually gets it
@@limyarplane1991 I agree, meant Devs as in the decision makers and not individual staff who probably work hard and have idiots ruin it
@@limyarplane1991How do we know that for sure? It doesn't make sense to assume that the developers have zero input in the direction of a game. They take at least some fault. This game is trash through and through.
They wanted Saints Row 2.5, Deep Silver wanted zoomers
Game studios: We’re making a pro agenda game.
Gamers: Oh ok cool, enjoy the sales
Game releases: sales are rock bottom
Game studio: where are the numbers???
Gamers: morning the loss of the old guard because of stupid decision.
This cycle rhymes with itself all through recent years and it is not any easier hearing that head up the ass is still an ever present tactic for game development when it’s a huge investment that can kill giants on failure.
I like it this way. In the past, the super companies could hide their pride and blindness behind trends. Now we finally have a trend that steadily puts them out of their misery.
Sometimes you have to stop blaming the EA's and Embracer's of life and start talking a look at the developers themselves
Yes!!
True, in this case and Bioware they do let them make their own decisions generally and allows them to run their own management to their destruction.
Yes, developers are also at fault
Embracer is nowhere near EA level (very few companies are) EA is just hated for being anti-consumer and insanely greedy. That's the trend so embracer will naturally follow but no one's as bad as EA's iron fist of monteziation.
Yes and no, don't know the exact number (can't be arsed to look them up) but I guess the reboot team had at least 500 developers, from artists to programmers, you can't blame all of them when most of them were just doing their jobs and even when they knew the game was a massive clown show they just didn't had a word in the production. If a movie sucks do you blame the cameraman? The catering assistant? The particle supervisor? No, you don't, you balme producers and directors. Same thing here, the people at the helm are the responsibles.
2024 Developer Guide
Step 1: Stop catering to "modern audiences" that don't spend money on your product
Step 2: Cater to original fan base
Step 3: ???
Step 4: Keep your job
Ahem Battlefield2042
But then Kotaku will give you a 3/10! The horror!
Step 5: Profit!
Japanese/indie devas: noticed
Step 6: Smoke crack and reboot the series
People need to remember that Volition already shut down once, this us not the same team that made the original games.
They are the puppeteers put in place by Embracer to animate Volition's body.
Have the OG developers had anything to say?
it's hard to feel sorry for Volition seeing how they reacted when fans pointed out the reboot didn't look good.
But it's REALLY hard to feel sorry for them when they lied to the community about continuing IdolNinja's work on the SR2 patch. IdolNinja poured his heart and soul into his mods for SR2 and SR3, got hired by Volition and was working on a much needed patch for SR2 in his free time before cancer took him. Volition said they'd honor his memory and finish that patch and they never did.
Bro, god dammit that´s really sad, poor guy, they just left him in the dust. Glad the studio got shut down.
This is why you dont pick juvenile fights with your customers.
It's like pissing off the people responsible for them keeping their jobs with demand is a bad idea.
Its scary to think how running with bad ideas in the industry lately is killing off entire studios. Like obviously its not a blameless situation, everybody signed off on the shitty writing and design, but its still scary how failure is being punished harder and harder lately.
Edit: I'm not defending this game in the slightest, I hate it as much as the next guy. I'm just saying I hope this doesn't happen to a dev/game that doesn't deserve to be shut down and killed because it ran with a lackluster concept.
Dude, if you worked on this sh!te, then I'm pretty sure you already interviewed multiple new jobs before it came out. I doubt anyone had any pride in what they made.
Punished harder? Lmao these idiots did it to themselves by starting a fight with there customers and ultimately that’s why the studio died yaayyyy
Why shouldn't it be? If I'm forking out $100M and you put out a game that doesn't even make $6M why should I keep funding you and paying your employees?
If you want your fans to give you $70, make something they want to buy. Abandoning your current customer base to chase a new customer base is risky. Sometimes it pays off, sometimes this happens.
I'm very sad the studio shut down. I liked a lot of their older games. However my choices are 1) they shut down or 2) they don't make good games anymore. Damned if you do, damned if you don't. Best of luck to all involved.
Honestly, was Volition really Volition anymore? 30 years is a long time, and honestly, its just a few hundred people in the skinsuit of what was Volition. Everyone of value and had made that company one of the best had moved on to greener pastures long before Saints Row the New.
@@scrittle And then instead of making another Saints Row game they made Agents of Mayhem because they decided that what people really wanted was a lame hero shooter instead of more Saints Row. Literally they said that they saw more people cosplaying as Chaundi and Johnny Gatt than the Boss and decided that people not cosplaying as the completely customizable character that had no default appearance somehow meant players didn't like them.
@@Macrochenia& then they added no ragdoll physics to deaths , weak easter eggs , no past references, they used epic games models so it looks like Fortnite shoots like agents of mayhem
@@timedraven117this right here. Was probably filled with all these new gen idiots on the left. The devs from the 90s and 2000s were so much better
Just remember, everything that Volition did with the reboot had Embracer's blessing. And when Embracer's demands didn't pan out they killed Volition. They are NOT innocent in this. They may be even the perpetrator. Embracer is the one who gave Volition the money and some of the mandates for the game. Let's remember that.
Source? I'm not saying you're lying but I had never heard about any mandates from Embracer. All I have to go on here is Volition's history before Embracer, which was already bad.
You could also say that Volition was forced to EMBRACE their downfall.
There were no Mandates from Embracer, they did have Embracer's blessing. They actually just let them cook.
From what I heard the whole team was in for it, so all are accountable.
BUT it was developers vison that Developers made and how they Told fans " Haters gonna hate" aka GO f yourselfs we do what we want!
The biggest issues people should realize in the industry is,
that too many companies put all their eggs into one basket.
if it fails. it's all gone and destroyed.
I think that the core issue with the latest Saint's Row is just the lack of understanding of the community. they delivered a game no one wanted, and the direction was all wrong.
edit: I would seriously pay money for a new Legacy of Kain game
It wasn't a lack of understanding. It was a decision not to care about their understanding.
They decided to make a reboot with millenial stereotypes as "humor" which cant blame them for wanting to reboot (given 4 started off with earth getting blown up) but they really should have tried to bring back the old writers, maybe atleast consult one of the old heads that left for the direction they should go.
Literally they probably didnt need to even work on graphics, they could have kept the cartoony saints row 3 and 4 style and not tried to lie about it in trailers and just made a "new" game with way more features, maybe improved the customization rather than scaling it down, removed all of the main characters of this reboot and started off with johnny gat talking your character into leading a gang or some shit. hell maybe a saints row 3 remake if they wanted to improve graphics, not really change anything story wise and just polish some mechanics, add more content, not hired whoever they hired to write for the reboot and id buy it.
3d or 2d Kane? 3d Kane with a mixture of Sands of Time trilogy and DnD mechanics would be great
They should have an overwhelming sense of pride and accomplishment for making such a quality gem.
They were so proud they shut down the studio and are giving it away for free this month on PS+! I don't know how much more you are asking for?
@@Rekhan4242who's asking for what?
@@Rekhan4242I mean, I’ll take a public apology followed by a public execution.
Yeah well based pfp so I agree
@@JayImahara He's being sarcastic like you did, I'm surprised you didn't even notice.
WOOOOOSH.
Every game studio that shuts down after ignoring and mocking the fans fills my heart with joy.
lol how many other times has this happened specifically?
@@thestellareliteFeminist Frequency's studio shut down like a month ago. They never even got their game out after taking people's crowdfunds.
I don't feel joy because innocent folks got fired
@@zelohendricks51 Those "innocent folks" should have spoken up and then left before the ship sunk.
@@zelohendricks51But I do. They got what they deserved, clowns.
The people at Volition who made the great products we remember are long gone by now guys. So don’t feel too bad about the shut down.
It’s okay, we don’t 😂
Hopefully Sonic Team gets shut down as well.
That's a good lesson for game studios. You don't fight your customers and call them terrorists and expect things to go well.
Honestly that's a very well deserved downfall. I don't feel sorry for them.
Companies are finally starting to find out that the consumer is what keeps you in business not trends.
@@kcadventures1454 Not 'Consumer', customer. 'Pay money, consume product, move to more/next product' is what they want people to do, there's more to the market and life than that.
Given the writing quality we saw from Volition both in the reboot and social media I wouldn't want them making public statements anymore either.
Saints Row Reboot's "Boss": "I just killed an entire studio with my freaking mind!"
As the Saints Row Reboot marketing so adequately put it with such amazing dialogue
"Haters gonna hate" - Voltion, giving the bird and flopping hard.
So who's going to take care of saints row now
@@thedarkknightman6150 Nobody lol. Maybe in the far FAR future it can come back but besides that, Only saints row content you'll be seeing from now is mods, fangames perhaps, and the previous entries.
oh. ok.@@ultimate8948
The devs really thought they created A+ game just to be shut down
They checked every box. I bet a lot of them left with a Pikachu face :O because they thought they did good
And that is the problem. Volition was so busy checking all the boxes that they forgot to make a good game. @@saschaberger3212
Truly the moment Volition became Shutdownberg
This is what happens when Yong just reads headlines without really understanding what happened. Embracer wasn't the problem here, Volition was. The devs were actively hostile to the fanbase on social media and the fans responded. Yong really missing the core of the story by standing up for a company that deserved to go bust.
Yea screw them. Either that he's intentionally not bringing that stuff up so stay safe. He was all their own fault with hiring those devs and writers
So yong is being a clown who instead of blaming to correct people who wants to blame some exces and say the devs were great lmao actual crackhead status
It's like that when you not only push back against but insult, and tell them not to buy it because you are not a true fan because you don't like the way the franchise is going. That they are going to do well. Developers, and entertainment makers seem to be living under a rock because they keep shoveling this garbage out towards a specific audience but even they're not buying it
Developers need to ask what gamers want instead of telling them... why are focus groups not a thing anymore?
Thats racist or something.
Because the investors running the show don't want what consumers do
Legitimately one issue recently with focus groups is that they get them from specific areas, like silicon Valley
Focus groups are what caused this horse shit game
Focus groups means spending money on things that aren't cash grab games and MTX. What executive will greenlight that?
These corpos are a living embodiment of the "No take, only throw" meme. They only want to reach the result without care of what *should* come before.
Had to feel sorry for a company that hates you for wanting good old fashioned , harmless fun.
Honestly, good to see. This is a good example of what happens when you don't release a finished product and promise roadmaps. Sad that Gat, Shaundi, Pierce and everyone else will never see a continuation of their story, however absurd it might be
gat out of hell already gave them some closure. if the heaven hell shenanigans seems to absurd, then you can pretend saints row 4 ending where they defeat zinyak and take his spaceship+time machine to rule the stars is their definite happy ending.
@@kukuhimanputraraharja8084I was hoping that if they got the ending where they found a new planet they could maybe do something like oh your invading Zinyak planet and there’s multiple rival factions against each other and you have to take it over like the original gang style without super powers. Sure it’ll be futuristic and stuff but at least it’ll kinda go back to gang warfare just with different species
@@SoraTerumi244 ended with a freaking time machine. We could have had saints in the wild west, saints in the medieval wars/times, etc etc, but instead they chose to reboot 🤦♀️
@@SoraTerumi24zinyak's entire zin people already immediately accept the saints as their new ruler though when the saints killed zinyak on live broadcast to the entire galaxy or something. i mean, the saints basically already ruled the entire galaxy and any timelines though with zinyak's super time travelling ship. thats the true closure for the saint's story imo.
Saints Row 3 is the finale to the franchise IMO, anything else after is bullshit.
Their tweets mocking fans aged like fine wine.
Imagine working your butt off making a game and some idiots who also worked on it start telling off the customers. Then you lose your job. Those people should be responsible for your pay and benefits.
When the credits of your game features your subreddit’s mods, you know that’s a bad thing lmao
That’s…sad
Wait did that seriously happen lmfao no way
@@AConquerorsVendetta It’s in the Special Thanks section at the very end of the credits.
When you don’t listen to fans, you get what you deserve.
What are you the Joker? There's a reason the word 'fan' stems from 'fanatic'. Yes this was a clear case of the developers ignoring everything that made the old Saints Row games good, but let's not pretend that fanbases aren't capable of some pretty idiotic behavior too.
@@metaloverlord7465You get what you deserve
@@corvus8638 Yes thank you for regurgitating the line like a parrot
@@metaloverlord7465You get what you deserve
@@metaloverlord7465you get what you deserve
This is why you don’t pander to certain agendas when making a game. Just make it fun. Ignore the current-day shit.
Volition: No, follow it on a false hope of success until Death set us apart🤪
AAA companies these days are so disconnected from what gamers really want, it’s unbelievable… back in the day the games that were made, were clearly made for gamers, by gamers… now a days… it’s all about profit margins, and it’s so obvious why they are failing to everyone, but themselves.
Agreed. What sucks about Saint's Tow is that if it had had a good writer who'd have been able to put a modern spin on the motivations of the characters in a more coherent way it could've been good. Instead it felt too much like they just ran a checklist of whatever they wanted to throw in the game without even seeing if that made a proper, well "ensemble".
Hell the Saints were founded in the OG games because the head honcho saw the city torn apart by crime and abandoned by law and wanted to clean all that up and make the city a nice place again. Doing a modern spin of that with the whole "we're young but crushed by debt" spiel would have been perfectly doable but alas...
This is what happens to every company as it gets large enough: levels of management multiply until coherent decision making is virtually impossible.
Not even just profit margins. They give idealogically driven devs too much control to shape and write their products however they want. Lot of these industries hire very similar kind of people that do not resonate with most normal people and audiences.
Saints Row 1-4 had a place in my heart, it’s so sad to see Volition shut down :(
Agree
Also Daedalic, I liked the Deponia series
I just finished Saints Row 4 again a few weeks ago. This is expected, but still devastating.
The Volition that is, is not the Volition that was…
@@brenolk4642 exactly. In these instances i like to bring up a thought experiment I like to call "the Shit of Theseus". Take an ancient Greek trireme. Over time, the planks rot and break, and you replace them with whiny crybullies, and you gradually reshape the ship into a giant toilet. When all the planks are replaced, and the ship no longer resembles it's original form, is it still the same ship?
I think this happened because of Embracer losing that 2 billion dollar deal. I mean, that happening right before their earnings call being announced? They only really closed any studios after that happened. I'm betting they would've given Volition another chance is they hadn't been hit by such a massive loss and their stock dropping. But I'm also betting they would've kept a closer eye on Volition making more games to make sure they didn't screw up again.
ForWoken was bound to burn in a fiery death spiral. Cringe character, dialogue and buggy play!
the company didn't hire by talent but by what people are, you can not make a quality product, without quality talent
usually the publishers are painted as the bad guys who interfere the creative process of developers
but this is one of many cases where the publisher should have taken action instead of allowing the dev to let loose
also this is totally deserving
The Saint’s Row remake stepped into the pitfall that I’m terrified the KOTOR remake is eventually going to step in.
The studio had the blue print of a beloved trilogy and instead of bringing it up to speed visually and retroactively polishing some QoL issues here and there (like Dead Space and the RE remakes) they tried to reinvent the wheel. The hard part has already been done for you. This shit is not hard.
That's if KOTOR gets a remake at all, afaik last we heard they quietly 'unannounced' it and now it's kind of hovering in limbo. Considering it was said they want to bring KOTOR 'in line with the current canon', I might honestly prefer it stay in the EU. Not to mention that the Revan novel was... less than stellar, especially with what they did to The Exile, and then there's what they did to Revan in the MMO... The more I think about it, the more I simply wouldn't trust them to remake it. I suppose best case scenario, we'd get to see the characters in modern day graphics? The glimpse of Revan we got in that teaser was pretty neat.
reinventing the wheel is nothing wrong, as long as its good
the problem here is ego
It wasn't a remake. It was just a game in the same genre that used the same title.
It was a reboot, not a remake...
This is good. Its not like the devs will be out of a job forever. They will move to other studios and hopefully take the lessons learned with them.
Lesson 1: don't insult the fanbase that you rely on to make your game profitable. Lesson 2, don't make a buggy, poorly-written mess of a game while simlultaneously insulting the fanbase that you rely on to make your game profitable.
@@supersonic20091 Lesson 3: Never push politics unless it's relevant and makes sense inworld to the story and if you have communistic beliefs then you don't belong in the gaming industry.
Hopefully the writers won’t get new jobs
@@grayfox6518A developer can have communist beliefs and still work
@@supersonic20091Lesson 3: The customer is always right.
When you make a game for non-existent "mOdErN aUdIenCe", this is what you get. 100% deserved.. Anyone who worked on Saints Row, needs to change their career. Game Development obviously isn't for them.
When the game is so bad, it shuts down the company, im honestly not surprised
Well, Embracer was using it as an investment so shutting down is what happens when your profits aren't "Above expectations".
@@linusgustafsson2629
Or even hitting below "minimum worst case"
Honestly they were on a downward slope for almost a decade and haven’t had a hit since 2015 so it’s nothing short of a miracle they lasted as long as they did.
yeah not gonna lie, volition had one hell of an identity crisis with an unhealthy serving of tunnel vision.
3 was alright but everythimg after felt like a tech demo
@@timvoorhees8102 Hell even with 3, something felt off to me. The pacing was at a breakneck speed and they were trying WAY too hard with the exaggerated humor but it really jumped the shark in 4 to the point they couldn't do anything else except either go to hell or do a reboot.
So it's astounding they did both, lol.
Saint's Row beyond the first two had an identity crisis much like Red Faction Guerilla but it seems like the Reboot is what finally delivered the killing blow and dried up the last of their reserves.
@@flippedoutkyrii i agree about 3, it was passable mainly because the dialog was amusing.
4 just felt like.....hand holdy? i remeber distinctly the reason i didnt like it was for yhe fact the just hated letting you go on a rampage. those minibosses at full stars to wipe out your wanted level was unavoidable and exhausting. if they are going to give me freaking superpowers lemme go on a Saints Row rampage ffs lmao
If i may be so bold as to say, the reboot would have been "passable" if the story would just pick a lane. The god awful writting and anti-coherency was its biggest downfall
@@timvoorhees8102 I'd wager even with a legit back-to-it's-roots narrative like the First two Saint's Row entries, the open world would still be lifeless and the gameplay would still be a slog. It just isn't fun to play as healing requires extended kill animations and even the best guns feel like a chore on even lackey mooks. The only positive for me would be the story at that point and just a bandaid on the overall issue at hand.
There was far more wrong with the Reboot then just the writing and the story, and those two were serious detriments to the game as they already were.
Some companies can get away with treating their fans badly. This was not one of these companies.
Most companies are also smart enough not to outright insult their entire customer base and then tell them the product isn't for them. Volition is the definition of the meme of the person sticking the stick in the spokes of the bike wheel, flipping over and still being utterly perplexed that their ass is now sitting on the ground with skinned up knees.
So many times we see a company try to fix what wasn't broken only to destroy everything in the process. Its like attempting to add bricks to a jenga tower via trying to jam them into an already occupied space and wondering why the whole thing inevitably falls over.
Imagine how bad of a response Volition's executive producer gave to Embracer during their post-mortem meeting for Saints Row... absolute tragedy for a franchise that was given a chance to revive itself.
They got what they deserve. Maybe next time they'll listen to fans instead of insulting them. We the consumers have the power. These devs and companies need to learn. Especially in this case when the Saints Row Reboot was announced..the fans told them that this didn't look good. We told them. We warned them. Instead of taking that criticism they just ignored it and insulted us. And now look. I have zero sympathy. They messed around and found out. Hopefully other devs and companies will take note. This is what happens when you betray your hardcore fanbase.
What do you mean next time? 😆
@@Verxx-sc2tl yeah true. Lol
This is what happens when you don't consider a storyline that people who are fans would enjoy despite it being a reboot. On top of that, actually not taking in criticism and talking back to fans on Twitter, only to release a buggy cringefest. Saints Row will be missed. Yet another beloved IP a company has that will sit in the dark forever.
They could have remade the first game of the series in a more modern way, with shout outs cameos and references to the following games
100th like
5:47 The story is very plainly obvious, Volition was a shell of the company that gave fans SR2. The developer was committed to remaining disconnected from reality, Embracer was just enabling this for way too long
It's not even a new story, that's what always gets me. The exact same thing happened with companies like Bungie and Bioware. But people never learn. When the Dragon Age 4 release date gets announced, there will be a wave of "OMG NEW BIOWARE GAME". But is it a new Bioware game? Is it _really?_ Is it a new Bioware game in the same sense that Baldur's Gate 2 was a new Bioware game? What about Knights of the Old Republic? Mass Effect 1? Fuck no lol.
The Volition people actually liked was "shut down" over a decade ago, this was just a group of people puppeteering its rotting corpse.
@@yewtewbstew547 It's bit different because Volition went out of their way to make a bad product, but companies like Bioware basically had to submit to their publisher's executive orders. It's still very true that most of these classic studios are essentially different studios now because barely any original staff remains.
Idk why this made me think Saints Row 2022 probably would have been a hit Sleeping Dogs sequel Lol
@@yewtewbstew547KoToR is such a good series. I still make a run through them once a year.
@@D3athL1vinthe devs who made all the great mass effect games and DAO left after/before DA2 came out.
@@4aw50fGold God I hope Embracer freed up some space for it after axing Volition
The reboot was a travesty indeed, but damn man volition has been around for a good bit and im sad that the studio is gone hopefully they can transfer the ip to another company.
Remember when the studio said they were "standing firm" with their decision to bash the fanbase?
Pepperidge farm remembers
They have no one but themselves to blame. Saints Row fans had been letting them know what they wanted in a new Saints Row game for years and they chose to ignore that.
I loved the first saints row it was different with outrageous characters and just really fun not to mention parts of it were hilarious
May other studios use Volition as an example of what not to do.
Given the general state of the gaming industry, I very much doubt that they will.
As sad as it is to see Volition shut down like this it is at the end of the day the natural order of how things should be, the fact that companies like EA, Blizzard, Activision and so on can do decades of damage to themselves and there respective communities and still keep trodding ahead is and should be considered an anomaly and cause for concern.
Good riddance
Well, they have a lot of "fat". They can have one flop, two, three, and still have billions left, and come back to cash cows to milk some more money. So yeah, not that surprising.
What did they expect was going to happen!? They deserved it for insulting the fans and refusing to grow up and acknowledge they screwed up. These are not the same devs who made the 2 original Saints row games. We all knew that the reboot was doomed from the start ever since the first trailer.
I guess that's what happens when you take a franchise and reboot it for "Modern Audiences," huh? Can't say I'm too saddened by it, although I'm sure it sucks for the people who worked at the studio. Let it serve as a cautionary tale for studios to the kind of content they might _EMBRACE_ .
Remember when DXFromYT predicted on Twitter that the reboot was going to be a financial success and that Volition wouldn’t go belly up? AND that anyone critical of it was a “Fake Fan” using that one clip of Homelander from The Boys looking on his phone?
I wonder what his reaction will be now that Volition is no more?
A pity. Volition did some great stuff. Descent, Freespace, Saints Row 2 through 4... It really sucks that one bad game can kill the whole studio. Granted, Agents of Mayhem wasn't that great, but not allowing them to at least try and bounce back is damn harsh.
For once a justified studio shutdown
This studio could have made a medieval comedy game or even continued the franchise with a fifth game. It's sad these bad decisions to favor audiences who don't care about games like this. 😮💨
Nah Saints needed a reboot but fans wanted a back-to-roots sort of reboot. Actual gang stuff not the 'made to appeal to modern audience' bs. They needed to actually expand on the criminal empire building aspect instead of just....SR3 but with a combat overhaul. They were going in the right direction with the Ventures but there needed to be more to it than just some activities. I feel it should've dipped more into a gang simulator.
medieval saints row sounds like a lot of fun^^ crazy characters all meeting in some fucked up tavern and doing crazy heists and stuff could be awesome
@@RaxusXeronos 100% agree
Hopefully other studios take note, LISTEN TO YOUR FANS.
Volition has only themselves to blame. That said, it is sad to see them destroy themselves. They created some of my favorite games - Saints Row (mostly 1 and 2, not so much the later games), and Red Faction: Guerrilla were monumental parts of my gaming life.
@@kobra6660 They still could. Embracer owns the IP, not Volition.
@@kobra6660 If they rebooted red faction it would literally be a game where the main character is an agender POC with autism who has to fight against Elon Musk on Mars to bring about a communist regime.
3 was so-so, 4 and gat out of hell was complete whack and nonsense.
Sometimes you have to take Ol’ Yeller behind the woodshed. I’m going to remember Volition the way they used to be, not the developer that had contempt for their fans.
Good. Let them shutdown.