@@EthanCarey-p8k We'll see. The HX 370 has 12 cores. The Z2E is supposed to drop that down to 8 cores and allocate more power to the GPU which is a better split for gaming. I'll be sticking with AMD for now since their drivers are better for older games. Intel's still struggling a bit with DX9 games performance and compatibility although their driver stack is better than AMD's in the sense that you don't need special drivers for the mobile part unlike the Z1Extreme APUs.
It's definitely better over the original but the Z1 Extreme in the Ally X is fairly old now and the new Z2 is expected at the Consumer Electronics Show next week. Only if Intel could have had this launch instead of the original Claw several months ago. I wouldn't rush into buying this until we can see what else is coming out soon.
Considering it's competing with an AMD Z1 Extreme, which is ~20 months old at this point, it's a bit embarrassing IMO that they didn't gap AMD by a larger margin.
@@RiftWarth Not what I'm assuming at all. There will always be something around the corner to take the performance/value crowns. When the Z2 drops and those handhelds start hitting shelves I'd love to see an Intel product that competes with it. I just don't expect Intel has anything chambered already for the imminent Z2 launch. As of this moment and at our current prices, I'm not ready to sing Intel's praises for matching and marginally beating a 20 month old product.
Two things to remember regarding battery life and performance: 1) Claw has 8" screen 2) Claw renders all tested games at 1200p Hats down. Bravo Intel, Bravo MSI!
Thanks for including benchmarks with context. I usually skip benchmarks in your videos because they're presented in isolation and they just become dimensionless numbers for me since i don't have benchmark numbers memorized from one video to another. Also, i might be the minority, but if you list the frame generation benchmarks with the others, that's awesome. It's good to see the max possibilities on these devices.
@@maverickvgc4220 HX 370 efficiency isn't good enough for a handheld and its GPU performance isn't actually too improved relative to the Z1E due to insufficient memory bandwidth. Z1E is nearly 2 years old but AMD doesn't actually have any update that is much of an improvement.
@@rgbplague7834that. From what I have seen, the "z2 extreme" might come equipped with a 890m, a gpu that does like only 10-15% more than the 780m from the z1 extreme at 20w. It really shine at much higher wattage (40w), so idk what it will look like on an handheld
@@maverickvgc4220 Lunar Lake is modular, while the Z1 extreme/Phoenix isn't, which along raises power draw on lunar lake, and still it's more efficient. It's also on the base N3 process node, which is smaller, but less efficient than N4P. And the HX370 would give you no more than 1 hour of battery life. Also in laptops and mini PCs GPU-wise Lunar Lake at 28W beats the HX370 at 35W on average, considering intel still needs to improve driver performance in some games.
@@yahyandanusa7834 Me and you both. The rog ally x is 3rd best now following the msi 8 and the new legion go. When it drops to 9th or tenth then I say it’s time to upgrade.
@@Ghost_rider_x98 You're confusing the Legion 2 with the lower specced Legion 2 Go. The Legion Go 2 will have a 74Whr battery. Maybe not 80, but still more than enough.
I'm interested in seeing this as well. What I saw of the Onexfly F1 Pro on another video it looked like it could eat any other handhelds lunch and was thinking of saving for it, but the price was also 500+ higher depending on which one you bought! And if it isn't significantly more powerful than these two I may just lean towards this new MSI Claw!
@@emeraqtruthseek4221I was in the same position but I got the ally x. I love it. But I’ll probably op for the x1 mini in the future of the X1 but I’m going to wait for them to update the controllers and screen cause I know they can do it they’re just choosing not to do it. What offended me was the updated version of the X1 with them adding the HX370 and called it a “pro” while adding nothing new. At least the onexfly pro a few updates like the Oled
@@Dante7Even Which version of XeSS are you using? Which game? XeSS struggled initially, but was drastically improved with newer versions. If you're playing a game that's stuck on 1.0. I'd get it. I highly recommend manually updating the DLL to XeSS 1.3, makes a massive improvement on my Legion Go
@@ThatRandomJew In poe 2 for example , the visual can be good , but the perfomance no. FSR improved a lot in last update , giving visual and performance improvements. Compared to Xess, with FSR you can get between 5-8 more fps in 30W. I tested all possible configurations on my Z1E, including the latest improvements
When you look at the Cyberpunk benchmarks it's clear the AI 8 can do a lot better. I think it just comes down to Intel tuning their drivers. That may or may not happen on this iteration of handhelds but the performance is clearly there, if just left untapped. AMD has been at it for two decades, Intel about 2 years so. Would love to see Intel get some wins here as it's just good for the consumer to have competition. Hope they can get their drivers up to snuff to utilize the performance that is clearly lurking there.
Not only does the Intel iGPU generally beat the Ally X, the real XESS on the Ally X is just light years ahead of FSR. FSR looks bad at 4K, but at 1080p it's disgusting. XESS still looks good at 1080p, just like DLSS. Not only that, the new Battlemage GPU in Claw supports hardware Frame Gen, so it will only age even better as XEFG is added to more games.
@@TalonsTech I mean, they're AMD so already have that, but no, that isn't required "or DOA", don't be so dramatic. I used to play games natively on my Steam Deck. A casual 100% performance increase and I'm sure I'll be fine still natively.
For me, Handheld gaming has always been about the portability, so the smaller form factor while also packing enough punch will always be it for me, so Rog Ally anyday; i was already thinking of getting that anyway... And yes, part of the reason i prefer smaller form factor is because these are realistically not 1080p or 1200p machines, and i'm very fine with playing at 900p or even 768p as long as the screen is small.
Agreed and tbh a handheld half the size of the ally x with the same amount of power is really the dream. Like GPD but less expensive. Maybe in 5 years.
Great videos, thanks for your work :) for me at 17 watts the comparison is incorrect but in favor of asus, for 2 reasons the first being that lunar lake has the ram directly soldered to the processors so the ram is included in the tdp of 17w, it consumes 2w more nothing for the ram, while the z1 extreme actually consumes 19w with the ram because the 2w of the ram are not taken into account in the tdp of 17w so it would be necessary to test lunar lake at 19 watts to be equal tdp level, same principles at 30watt. The 8 ai + is in 1200×1920p and not in 1080×1920p which reduces the performances by 5 to 10% being a higher resolution, we must take all that into account to make a very objective opinion, especially since the intel drivers will continue to improve over time!
FSR is open source and would work on the claw as well. That would be the correct way to do a test where that is available instead of fsr on one and a different scaler like intels on the other. Then all variables are removed and we get to see which cpu performs better.
I don’t understand why these manufacturers don’t implement specific optimizations for gaming mode. Both devices suffer from excessive CPU power consumption while the iGPU frequency is too low. In a 30W Cyberpunk 2077 test, MSI's iGPU could only reach 1.6GHz, which is 20% lower than its rated 1.95GHz, yet the CPU was running at its maximum frequency. The ROG Ally had a similar issue at launch, though they later added a manual toggle to disable Turbo Boost in the console settings. Based on ETA’s test results, it seems that only GPD has managed proper tuning. Under a 15W load, their HX370 maintained a low CPU frequency of just 1.8GHz, allocating most of the power to the iGPU. I believe MSI and ASUS need to optimize their power regulation systems.
A Steam Deck at 15W still pulls more FPS per Watt that any of these Windows handhelds. Unfortunately many of these companies slap the hardware in a case and call it a day…
@@dynamiszmx How better though? 15W is how much the Deck pulls on full horses, if you can't produce 60FPS instead of 30FPS at 15W in pretty much every situation it's not good value IMO, because you end up paying more than double the price anyway. New chips are better but are not game changers, handheld PCs need to be treated like consoles otherwise all the value gets lost pretty quickly. I bet Valve will be the only one releasing once again a custom APU with modifications done in order to optimize performance/consumption. Just to remind, the Deck uses Zen2 and RDNA2 architectures which for today' standards are ancient...but still it keeps being a great value proposition under 500$. It's pretty much the only handeld that has aged gracefully. That's what I mean when I say that many companies just slap a new chip in a case and call it a day.
@@or1on89 Yes, the new Lunar Lake chip outperforms the Steam Deck even at just 10 watts. The HX 370 is slightly less efficient at lower wattages but still delivers about 30% better performance than the older Z1 Extreme at 15 watts. This is purely about gaming power, not price. Steam deck is good but a little old and overpriced now.
These comparisons are the best for deciding on a handheld on your personal preferences. You have a great base now and it would be great to have a nice overview table with all these handhelds (especially those which are being announced on CES 2025). A simple nice table with all the facts for display, ram, battery and so on, but maybe also a column for benchmarks and gaming performance. For your videos it would be much more helpful to have more side-by-side comparisons. All the details you are talking about are great! Go on ETA!
I got the ally and ally x. Waiting for the z2 chip. Upgraded my ally x with a 8tb ssd and 1.5tb sd card. Got 100 games installed and still got 5tb left. Absolutely awesome.
@@alexgibson7960 what ssd you are using? The stock Micron one does get warm even that thing is not so fast. Want to install a 2TB ssd Samsung 990 Pro from my laptop
Legit question (don't mean to come across as rude), how do you justify buying these devices ? 😂 I always consider them but then put it off as I don't believe I'll make as much use of them to warrant the cost
I feel not having vrr screen is my biggest reason to not switch I never thought gaming before 60 was viable until i used the vrr screen on the rog ally x
Noticed the Claw seems to use significantly more Ram on every game you tested, basically 20gb on every game which was 4-6gb more than the Ally most of the time.
@@Patrick-y4d1zthat's not how it works , something's not right about these benchmarks. Either the claws are incredibly unoptimized or the games settings on the claw are different. The claws cpu is performa better then the z1 extreme and I also noticed on one of the benchmarks the GPU was running at 80%. Sometimes I feel like these videos favor AMD and the ally.
@@acdoob Yeah I play games at 4k max settings on my PC and not many sit at 20gb Ram usage, for some reason all of these seemed to hover around there. Either way it will outperform the Ally more significantly after some driver updates I would imagine.
@@acdoob That is exactly how it works. Hell, I have 64GB of RAM in my PC and Windows likes to casually use 16GB of it becauses it can. That doesn't mean that it can't run with 8GB though.
We need this type of competition. I think it's very smart on Intel to segway to more efficient chips for handhelds, I feel that's the future. Loving the steam deck and looking forward for an upgrade but I'll wait for something much better than ally x
@@Patrick-y4d1zI just saw a video from another channel showcasing that, I think it was retro game corps. OG Xbox and Xbox 360 did poorly but it's because they don't have their chipset yet and the software is a little out of date. PS3 emulation ran buttery smooth.
@@funny_animalandia That's what some people were saying before the last update a few days ago, we gained more than 10% performance in some games with the new drivers. If you compare it to the Steam Deck, you'll see how optimized a device can be.
Finally someone that doesn't benchmark at 720p LOW. If im buying a 1080p device I'm going to game at 1080 or 900p tops. 720p just looks rubbish. Thanks ETAP
I pre-ordered the CLAW. Going to be my first handheld... well since a PSP back in the day. I feel the performance is finally there for fps and battery life.
@@onlytheneeded412 1 - Native absolutely can be run on these handhelds. 2- I still want to see native because that is the performance of the APU, not the upscaling technology. I need to know the actual performance, not the upscaling ability as this isn't present in all games.
@@Patrick-y4d1zYeah we’ll just have to wait until more benchmarks are out. Some games I want to use Quality upscaling at 1920x1200. Others I want to run with no upscaling at 1440x900.
The MSI redeemed itself from the first Claw blunder, but I feel the price is too high for the new flagship Claw. In my opinion, the ROG Ally X is still a very capable handheld gaming device, and I would expect a price drop to negate the benefits of the USD 899 MSI Claw 8 AI.
I have the first ally. Hoped for a bigger boost in performance with the new intel chip. Than hoping the amd z2 extreme devices will make a jump in performance
2 big heavy hitters the standard going forward for any handheld will be 80watrs if MSI optimize the Previous version and I find it at a decent price I’ll buy it if not I’ll wait tell middle 2025 to upgrade from the OG ROG Z1
I really have to wait for next gen. I'm happy with my Steam Deck and expect the Claw 8 Ai+ to come down in price, however the next gen devices should be worth the wait. The only concern is going to be the price. If we can get a device at the $600-$700 range that would be best. Otherwise I might be looking at laptops instead.
Hello man, I'm a big fan from South Africa and i just want to say love the content. I also have a request : Could you test the the Samsung A55 and the Pock X6 pro, i want to uprade from the Vivo Y01, as you can imagine this a big uprage witch i don't wanna mess up. Love from SA❤ 🇿🇦
I'll be rocking my 780m handheld until the gen after this. Not enough of an improvement to warrant a whole new device. But good for those who dont have one yet, as its just a bit better.
Well i upgraded to the x from the z1e ally. And I love the x, it's been absolutely wonderful. That being said, I am glad there is an intel from msi winning. For me though, I'll wait for the ally x 2 or whatever before upgrading. It seems every two weeks there is a new handheld with slightly better specs. Maybe we will finally see a system with a dedicated gpu dock option from asus or msi at a reasonable price.
Just curious. If Ally X were to disable SMT/Hyperthreading would it be possible to increase its score? 30W is not enough to fully utilize both the CPU & GPU to max so maybe disabling SMT would boost it? I mean, it boosted my steam deck but I heard ROG Ally is more power starved so maybe it gets more boost? If you look at 7:03 iGPU clock here is only 1700Mhz whereas the max is at 2700Mhz. Meanwhile the Claw 8 is almost at 100% usage at 1400Mhz.
I’m just not sold on the ARC stuff I have a feeling they’ll have compatibility issues like they did on the GPU market. Just bought my Ally X when best buy had it for holiday sale and coming from a steam deck LCD it was a solid upgrade.
going to wait for the next lot of handhelds I think, very impressed with the msi claw 8 ai and it look awesome but wanting a white handheld so maybe ally 2 or whatever they call it or perhaps if we got a new steamdeck in 2025 that would be cool
Frankly it's better for everyone involved that Intel is competing more in the handheld and just the gaming space in generally. Hopefully they don't falter anytime soon. I already have the Lenovo Legion Go and don't plan on upgrading for a while unless one of the manufacturers do a really good trade in program, but it does make me excited that this market is being taken seriously among PC manufacturers and chip makers.
What im getting from all these MSI claw 8ai reviews is that with upscaling technology the claw is superior but at native resolution with no upscaling they're pretty much equal..
I’m rocking the original ally and I wish Msi would have gone small instead of bigger. Intels Lunar lake 258v does so well at low tdp. Never the less what a great time to buy a hand held
Although I love the Deck Oled, and considering the LGo2 wont come out for a while, I’m more than likely going to pick up an open box claw 8. I think the performance is impressive and I like what intel is doing with Xess. Plus I’m tired of these 7” screens.
Man even tho i dont have the msi claw 8 ai or the rog ally x but i have the rog ally extreme and the Lenovo legion Go they cant do ray tracing but the msi claw 8 ai does so which it is 10x better
imo the claw is genuinely the better device and is actually a good option for high end pc handheld gameplay. the steam deck is still way cheaper if you don't want to spend high quality windows handheld prices, or if you'd rather get something used, but if you want the best of the best the claw is pretty much it, and it's using the newest chips so I don't think ces is really gonna dethrone it or anything like that
Z1E is the first AMD's APU for Handhelds/MiniPCs and even so Intels AI 8 is not doing it too good with faster and more RAM, newer CPU. Will see when Z2E comes out.
What about the claw 7 ai? Is it say to say itlk be the same performance as its bigger counterpart. Ive always like the look of the original claw. It just needed a better chipset and that what the 7ai does. Any reviews on that one?
@@radicalturkey exactly but sadly it'll not be released sooner maybe at the emd of this year So i'm stuck what to choose since i like bigger screens a lot Did you see acer's new blaze 11 inch handheld coming out too 😂
You made a mistake by setting "balanced" mode to both FSR and XeSS. A few months ago, Intel changed native resolution used in "balanced" from 635p to 540p XeSS Balanced = 540p FSR Balanced = 635p XeSS Performance = 469p FSR Performance = 540p
Kind of a random question but would you recommend the Nuc 12 Serpent Canyon as a htpc? Mostly for jrpgs but I guess some AAA gaming would be nice as well. It would be used on a 4K oled tv, thanks.
ETA PRIME please make more videos about comparing the asus rog ally x and msi claw 8 ai + Thanks for this video and previous video❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️💯💯💯💯💯💯💯💯💯🤙🤙🤙🤙🤙🤙🌹🌹🌹🌹
There are newer AMD APUs on the market, than the Ally X contains. So I see not a fair comparison, until new handheld-generations pops up, maybe around CES not sure.
About the sd card? i saw linus open the claw and i think i saw it under a heatsink whats your thought about it? Can you confirm it and is it ok since rog ally has a sd problem?
I bought the rog ally and it’s nice when I found an opportunity I couldn’t pass I got the first MSI claw and I’ve loved that console more than the rog ally I currently play god of war ragnarok, Diablo 4, and black myth wukong with some switch games as well I look forward to getting the MSI claw 8ai+ or even the 7ai+ since I like the black more I will not be going to the rog ally x MSI claw nailed there handheld
Now time to wait for AMD next week . Im waiting for Lenovo 2 , 8.8 inch oled but no vrr . All depend of the power on the Z2 Extreme for my next choice because the screen on the msi is a really good choice.
I'm really interested in how they're going to price the remaining 155H claw stock. I'd really like to pick that up for like 200-300 dollars and mess around with it
Congrats MSI for stubbornly sticking to Intel long enough for them to finally come good.
only long enough for AMD to announce the Z2 Extreme at CES next week...
@@CHA0SBLEEDS Too be fair Lunar Lake is almost 6 months old already so its not a bad score
@@CHA0SBLEEDSwe already know how it's going to perform...slightly better performance (particularly at high tdp) and slightly less efficiency.
@@CHA0SBLEEDSperformance the same at lower wattage so meh
@@EthanCarey-p8k We'll see. The HX 370 has 12 cores. The Z2E is supposed to drop that down to 8 cores and allocate more power to the GPU which is a better split for gaming. I'll be sticking with AMD for now since their drivers are better for older games. Intel's still struggling a bit with DX9 games performance and compatibility although their driver stack is better than AMD's in the sense that you don't need special drivers for the mobile part unlike the Z1Extreme APUs.
I never expected Intel to have such a great come back.
It's definitely better over the original but the Z1 Extreme in the Ally X is fairly old now and the new Z2 is expected at the Consumer Electronics Show next week. Only if Intel could have had this launch instead of the original Claw several months ago. I wouldn't rush into buying this until we can see what else is coming out soon.
Considering it's competing with an AMD Z1 Extreme, which is ~20 months old at this point, it's a bit embarrassing IMO that they didn't gap AMD by a larger margin.
@@spartanviTrue but you are assuming Intel is just going to sit still and not announce something to compete against the Z2 soon after.
@@RiftWarth You mean next year? and even if they had a PRO version they would have supply issues knowing Intel ...
@@RiftWarth Not what I'm assuming at all. There will always be something around the corner to take the performance/value crowns. When the Z2 drops and those handhelds start hitting shelves I'd love to see an Intel product that competes with it. I just don't expect Intel has anything chambered already for the imminent Z2 launch.
As of this moment and at our current prices, I'm not ready to sing Intel's praises for matching and marginally beating a 20 month old product.
Two things to remember regarding battery life and performance:
1) Claw has 8" screen
2) Claw renders all tested games at 1200p
Hats down. Bravo Intel, Bravo MSI!
Thanks for including benchmarks with context. I usually skip benchmarks in your videos because they're presented in isolation and they just become dimensionless numbers for me since i don't have benchmark numbers memorized from one video to another.
Also, i might be the minority, but if you list the frame generation benchmarks with the others, that's awesome. It's good to see the max possibilities on these devices.
I never thought Intel would manage to compete against AMD in the handheld department...
I mean, it's not that hard to trade blows with a 2 years old CPU.
Let's compare it to something running and HX 370
@@maverickvgc4220 HX 370 efficiency isn't good enough for a handheld and its GPU performance isn't actually too improved relative to the Z1E due to insufficient memory bandwidth.
Z1E is nearly 2 years old but AMD doesn't actually have any update that is much of an improvement.
@@rgbplague7834that. From what I have seen, the "z2 extreme" might come equipped with a 890m, a gpu that does like only 10-15% more than the 780m from the z1 extreme at 20w. It really shine at much higher wattage (40w), so idk what it will look like on an handheld
@@maverickvgc4220 Lunar Lake is modular, while the Z1 extreme/Phoenix isn't, which along raises power draw on lunar lake, and still it's more efficient. It's also on the base N3 process node, which is smaller, but less efficient than N4P.
And the HX370 would give you no more than 1 hour of battery life. Also in laptops and mini PCs GPU-wise Lunar Lake at 28W beats the HX370 at 35W on average, considering intel still needs to improve driver performance in some games.
@@rgbplague7834 z2e got announced like a week ago, but that was after your comment
Keeping my rog ally x for the foreseeable future till the Z3 chip or whatever it's going to be called after Z2 releases at CES
Legion Go 2 is inbound!
@@yahyandanusa7834 Me and you both. The rog ally x is 3rd best now following the msi 8 and the new legion go. When it drops to 9th or tenth then I say it’s time to upgrade.
@@estyhugo legion 2 is a joke it has only 55whr battery
@@Ghost_rider_x98 You're confusing the Legion 2 with the lower specced Legion 2 Go. The Legion Go 2 will have a 74Whr battery. Maybe not 80, but still more than enough.
@megaloth1955 okk i will buy the legion go 2
And now we need the same duel between MSI Claw vs OneXfly F1 Pro, this duel is pretty much warranted.
Yeah that’s a better match up
I'm interested in seeing this as well. What I saw of the Onexfly F1 Pro on another video it looked like it could eat any other handhelds lunch and was thinking of saving for it, but the price was also 500+ higher depending on which one you bought! And if it isn't significantly more powerful than these two I may just lean towards this new MSI Claw!
@@emeraqtruthseek4221 that is my thought exactly. Or we can just wait for Z2 extreme
@@emeraqtruthseek4221I was in the same position but I got the ally x. I love it. But I’ll probably op for the x1 mini in the future of the X1 but I’m going to wait for them to update the controllers and screen cause I know they can do it they’re just choosing not to do it. What offended me was the updated version of the X1 with them adding the HX370 and called it a “pro” while adding nothing new. At least the onexfly pro a few updates like the Oled
(Small Typo.) The Screen info on the Claw 8 is showing as 1080p and not 1200p in the comparison chart.
You must be new here. There is at least one typo in every ETA video. It's basically an Easter egg at this point!
didnt he blur that
Judging from my phone...neither is worth the upgrade until the next Ally. I have the OG and waiting patiently for Ally 2
Rog ally z1e user so far I have no issues I w8 gta 6 how will run then maybe update so yea w8 for next ally
Same
Same for me
8:20 XeSS on the Claw 8 looks much better than FSR on the Ally X
@@Patrick73787 you can use xess on amd gpu and fsr on intel arc
XeSS looks better than FSR even on non-Intel devices.
It had a rough start but it hit back hard, about as much as Battlemage has
@@ThatRandomJew totally not , Xess is horrible in Rog ally
@@Dante7Even Which version of XeSS are you using? Which game?
XeSS struggled initially, but was drastically improved with newer versions. If you're playing a game that's stuck on 1.0. I'd get it. I highly recommend manually updating the DLL to XeSS 1.3, makes a massive improvement on my Legion Go
@@ThatRandomJew In poe 2 for example , the visual can be good , but the perfomance no. FSR improved a lot in last update , giving visual and performance improvements. Compared to Xess, with FSR you can get between 5-8 more fps in 30W. I tested all possible configurations on my Z1E, including the latest improvements
Exactly the video I was waiting for 👍👍
When you look at the Cyberpunk benchmarks it's clear the AI 8 can do a lot better. I think it just comes down to Intel tuning their drivers. That may or may not happen on this iteration of handhelds but the performance is clearly there, if just left untapped. AMD has been at it for two decades, Intel about 2 years so.
Would love to see Intel get some wins here as it's just good for the consumer to have competition. Hope they can get their drivers up to snuff to utilize the performance that is clearly lurking there.
Not only does the Intel iGPU generally beat the Ally X, the real XESS on the Ally X is just light years ahead of FSR. FSR looks bad at 4K, but at 1080p it's disgusting. XESS still looks good at 1080p, just like DLSS. Not only that, the new Battlemage GPU in Claw supports hardware Frame Gen, so it will only age even better as XEFG is added to more games.
It beats the Ally X in several aspects.
But I'm waiting for the new handhelds to be shown off in January.
@@Patrick-y4d1z For sure, but unless they add in hardware upscaling/Frame Gen into those other handhelds, then they're DOA.
@@TalonsTech
I mean, they're AMD so already have that, but no, that isn't required "or DOA", don't be so dramatic.
I used to play games natively on my Steam Deck. A casual 100% performance increase and I'm sure I'll be fine still natively.
If they are less than the 900 fucking dollars, they're anything but doa. MSI will struggle to sell this,
For me, Handheld gaming has always been about the portability, so the smaller form factor while also packing enough punch will always be it for me, so Rog Ally anyday; i was already thinking of getting that anyway... And yes, part of the reason i prefer smaller form factor is because these are realistically not 1080p or 1200p machines, and i'm very fine with playing at 900p or even 768p as long as the screen is small.
Agreed and tbh a handheld half the size of the ally x with the same amount of power is really the dream. Like GPD but less expensive. Maybe in 5 years.
@@derekmiles767 what ally you going to buy?
@@derekmiles767 what ally you going to buy?
They should make a portable battery like vision pro to reduce the size and weight. 1 cable under wont effect much.
But they release MSI Claw 7 ai + with the same Gpu but different battery life and screen size
God, those bezels/borders on the Ally X screen are so thoroughly intrusive and obnoxiously large...
@@Dr.D00p i dont notice while gaming
Great videos, thanks for your work :) for me at 17 watts the comparison is incorrect but in favor of asus, for 2 reasons the first being that lunar lake has the ram directly soldered to the processors so the ram is included in the tdp of 17w, it consumes 2w more nothing for the ram, while the z1 extreme actually consumes 19w with the ram because the 2w of the ram are not taken into account in the tdp of 17w so it would be necessary to test lunar lake at 19 watts to be equal tdp level, same principles at 30watt.
The 8 ai + is in 1200×1920p and not in 1080×1920p which reduces the performances by 5 to 10% being a higher resolution, we must take all that into account to make a very objective opinion, especially since the intel drivers will continue to improve over time!
The handheld wars is definitely in full swing
We just need to see what the xbox handheld will be like and its operating system
FSR is open source and would work on the claw as well. That would be the correct way to do a test where that is available instead of fsr on one and a different scaler like intels on the other. Then all variables are removed and we get to see which cpu performs better.
I don’t understand why these manufacturers don’t implement specific optimizations for gaming mode. Both devices suffer from excessive CPU power consumption while the iGPU frequency is too low. In a 30W Cyberpunk 2077 test, MSI's iGPU could only reach 1.6GHz, which is 20% lower than its rated 1.95GHz, yet the CPU was running at its maximum frequency. The ROG Ally had a similar issue at launch, though they later added a manual toggle to disable Turbo Boost in the console settings.
Based on ETA’s test results, it seems that only GPD has managed proper tuning. Under a 15W load, their HX370 maintained a low CPU frequency of just 1.8GHz, allocating most of the power to the iGPU. I believe MSI and ASUS need to optimize their power regulation systems.
A Steam Deck at 15W still pulls more FPS per Watt that any of these Windows handhelds. Unfortunately many of these companies slap the hardware in a case and call it a day…
@or1on89 not anymore, the new intel and the new hx370 all performs better than steam deck now.
@@dynamiszmx How better though? 15W is how much the Deck pulls on full horses, if you can't produce 60FPS instead of 30FPS at 15W in pretty much every situation it's not good value IMO, because you end up paying more than double the price anyway.
New chips are better but are not game changers, handheld PCs need to be treated like consoles otherwise all the value gets lost pretty quickly. I bet Valve will be the only one releasing once again a custom APU with modifications done in order to optimize performance/consumption. Just to remind, the Deck uses Zen2 and RDNA2 architectures which for today' standards are ancient...but still it keeps being a great value proposition under 500$. It's pretty much the only handeld that has aged gracefully.
That's what I mean when I say that many companies just slap a new chip in a case and call it a day.
@@or1on89 Yes, the new Lunar Lake chip outperforms the Steam Deck even at just 10 watts. The HX 370 is slightly less efficient at lower wattages but still delivers about 30% better performance than the older Z1 Extreme at 15 watts. This is purely about gaming power, not price. Steam deck is good but a little old and overpriced now.
@ If that’s the case then it’s good…it means that a Steam Deck 2 is on the horizon
These comparisons are the best for deciding on a handheld on your personal preferences. You have a great base now and it would be great to have a nice overview table with all these handhelds (especially those which are being announced on CES 2025). A simple nice table with all the facts for display, ram, battery and so on, but maybe also a column for benchmarks and gaming performance.
For your videos it would be much more helpful to have more side-by-side comparisons. All the details you are talking about are great! Go on ETA!
I got the ally and ally x. Waiting for the z2 chip. Upgraded my ally x with a 8tb ssd and 1.5tb sd card. Got 100 games installed and still got 5tb left. Absolutely awesome.
@@alexgibson7960 what ssd you are using? The stock Micron one does get warm even that thing is not so fast.
Want to install a 2TB ssd Samsung 990 Pro from my laptop
Lol, you're insane.
Legit question (don't mean to come across as rude), how do you justify buying these devices ? 😂 I always consider them but then put it off as I don't believe I'll make as much use of them to warrant the cost
@@Patrick73787I thought stupid but crazy sounds better 😅
I don’t have time to play even 2 games but my man here with 100 games. Bro living his dream life here.
The ally X is a great mid life refresh that came out mid 2024 ! But this claw isn’t gonna scratch the ally 2 & thats the real competition in 2025
Stick to the video😭
I just got an ally z1 extreme for $300. So this makes me hyped that my $300 handheld competes with something that costs over 2x more!
OG ally is the best value
Would prefer to see comparisons with no scaling just so we can see the raw performance. FSR and XESS might be using different base resolutions.
Love the channel bro!
I feel not having vrr screen is my biggest reason to not switch
I never thought gaming before 60 was viable until i used the vrr screen on the rog ally x
There is vrr in msi claw 8ai+
The Claw 8 has VRR screen
@KingSlendy i dont know. Yeah vrr is great and it should be standard on handheld pc
Noticed the Claw seems to use significantly more Ram on every game you tested, basically 20gb on every game which was 4-6gb more than the Ally most of the time.
Probably because it had an extra 8GB RAM to use and was running at higher FPS.
@@Patrick-y4d1z It was pretty close in most games and it's not like the Ally was using all of it's ram.
@@Patrick-y4d1zthat's not how it works , something's not right about these benchmarks. Either the claws are incredibly unoptimized or the games settings on the claw are different. The claws cpu is performa better then the z1 extreme and I also noticed on one of the benchmarks the GPU was running at 80%. Sometimes I feel like these videos favor AMD and the ally.
@@acdoob Yeah I play games at 4k max settings on my PC and not many sit at 20gb Ram usage, for some reason all of these seemed to hover around there. Either way it will outperform the Ally more significantly after some driver updates I would imagine.
@@acdoob
That is exactly how it works. Hell, I have 64GB of RAM in my PC and Windows likes to casually use 16GB of it becauses it can. That doesn't mean that it can't run with 8GB though.
We need this type of competition. I think it's very smart on Intel to segway to more efficient chips for handhelds, I feel that's the future. Loving the steam deck and looking forward for an upgrade but I'll wait for something much better than ally x
Yep looks like if u have an Ally X there absolutely no reason to get the Claw. It could hang or be ahead in terms of performance and battery life.
How's the OG Xbox, Xbox 360, and PS3 emulation on the Claw 8 AI+?
It will probably be better at all emulation as Intel CPUs tend to do better than AMD for that function.
@@Patrick-y4d1zI just saw a video from another channel showcasing that, I think it was retro game corps. OG Xbox and Xbox 360 did poorly but it's because they don't have their chipset yet and the software is a little out of date. PS3 emulation ran buttery smooth.
I saw this in 128 inch projector screen and XeSS is massively better than FSR that's first thing I noticed it's like high vs low settings
MSI claw with new drivers will be better.....and better
@@funny_animalandia Everyone will be better with more optimization, it has become normal to launch poorly optimized hardware
@Dante7Even but the ally x has like 8 months on the market. Can't be more polished
@@funny_animalandia That's what some people were saying before the last update a few days ago, we gained more than 10% performance in some games with the new drivers. If you compare it to the Steam Deck, you'll see how optimized a device can be.
As long as intel is affordable and maintains this performance, I'm getting it.
Can you do a similar comparison between the claw 8 and the onexfly with the new Ryzen chip?
This is a very beautiful review! Love the graphics and detailed game setting & tdp!❤
Finally someone that doesn't benchmark at 720p LOW. If im buying a 1080p device I'm going to game at 1080 or 900p tops. 720p just looks rubbish. Thanks ETAP
The ROG is $799 ETA
$100 for bigger screen double the ram
not that bad deal TBH
and as new intel is really efficient it's a no brainer now
@@itsmilan4069 For sure, just wanted to point out the mistake in his comparison
@@anthonyandino9414 ah typical ETA messing up again 😂
Yeah precisely $799 for 1TB and $899 for 2TB
I know, I was thinking that they ramp up the price, lol. I've been using the Ally X since day one, a pretty good device so far
I think Windows should make Gnome style DE for these handhelds. Might make the desktop interface more sausage finger friendly.
I pre-ordered the CLAW. Going to be my first handheld... well since a PSP back in the day. I feel the performance is finally there for fps and battery life.
Love this guy my favorite channel
so what do you wanna to pick : msi claw 8 ai , rog ally x , or lenovo legion go 2
Just wait for ROG ALLY X2
Do u know when ally 2 coming out? thx
This summer most likely
Or Ally X3, or X4, or X5...
Wow FSR looks like a blurry mess compared to Xess. Very obvious to see in the Cyberpunk benchmark.
I would personally want to see native performance only.
@Patrick-y4d1z You really ain't going to tell the difference between balance and quality settings on a handheld
@@Patrick-y4d1z native can't really be ran on these handhelds, they are heavily subsidized by frame generation and/or FSR or the like.
@@onlytheneeded412
1 - Native absolutely can be run on these handhelds.
2- I still want to see native because that is the performance of the APU, not the upscaling technology. I need to know the actual performance, not the upscaling ability as this isn't present in all games.
@@Patrick-y4d1zYeah we’ll just have to wait until more benchmarks are out. Some games I want to use Quality upscaling at 1920x1200. Others I want to run with no upscaling at 1440x900.
The MSI redeemed itself from the first Claw blunder, but I feel the price is too high for the new flagship Claw. In my opinion, the ROG Ally X is still a very capable handheld gaming device, and I would expect a price drop to negate the benefits of the USD 899 MSI Claw 8 AI.
Ironically I was looking at comparisons yesterday. Might upgrade this yr.
I’d wait and see until we hear about Rog Ally 2
Just wondering are you running Winodws 10 or 11 on these?
Ally X with a 8” screen would be great
@@marksmith566 i agree
I have the first ally. Hoped for a bigger boost in performance with the new intel chip. Than hoping the amd z2 extreme devices will make a jump in performance
2 big heavy hitters the standard going forward for any handheld will be 80watrs if MSI optimize the Previous version and I find it at a decent price I’ll buy it if not I’ll wait tell middle 2025 to upgrade from the OG ROG Z1
the thing is that the msi claw 8 ai plus seems to be super quiet, which is a big plus
The MSI is really reminding me of the Sega game gear for some reason.
I'm looking for a handheld that can run Star Citizen. How is the fps on Star Citizen with these 2 handhelds?
I really have to wait for next gen. I'm happy with my Steam Deck and expect the Claw 8 Ai+ to come down in price, however the next gen devices should be worth the wait. The only concern is going to be the price. If we can get a device at the $600-$700 range that would be best. Otherwise I might be looking at laptops instead.
Affiliate link has incorrect price. The listing linked is priced at $1399
How is $100 difference the same price point?
Hello man, I'm a big fan from South Africa and i just want to say love the content. I also have a request : Could you test the the Samsung A55 and the Pock X6 pro, i want to uprade from the Vivo Y01, as you can imagine this a big uprage witch i don't wanna mess up. Love from SA❤ 🇿🇦
I'll be rocking my 780m handheld until the gen after this. Not enough of an improvement to warrant a whole new device. But good for those who dont have one yet, as its just a bit better.
I wonder why 1200p was blurred out
Good review.
Well i upgraded to the x from the z1e ally. And I love the x, it's been absolutely wonderful.
That being said, I am glad there is an intel from msi winning. For me though, I'll wait for the ally x 2 or whatever before upgrading. It seems every two weeks there is a new handheld with slightly better specs.
Maybe we will finally see a system with a dedicated gpu dock option from asus or msi at a reasonable price.
Just curious. If Ally X were to disable SMT/Hyperthreading would it be possible to increase its score? 30W is not enough to fully utilize both the CPU & GPU to max so maybe disabling SMT would boost it?
I mean, it boosted my steam deck but I heard ROG Ally is more power starved so maybe it gets more boost?
If you look at 7:03 iGPU clock here is only 1700Mhz whereas the max is at 2700Mhz.
Meanwhile the Claw 8 is almost at 100% usage at 1400Mhz.
I’m just not sold on the ARC stuff I have a feeling they’ll have compatibility issues like they did on the GPU market. Just bought my Ally X when best buy had it for holiday sale and coming from a steam deck LCD it was a solid upgrade.
going to wait for the next lot of handhelds I think, very impressed with the msi claw 8 ai and it look awesome but wanting a white handheld so maybe ally 2 or whatever they call it or perhaps if we got a new steamdeck in 2025 that would be cool
Frankly it's better for everyone involved that Intel is competing more in the handheld and just the gaming space in generally. Hopefully they don't falter anytime soon. I already have the Lenovo Legion Go and don't plan on upgrading for a while unless one of the manufacturers do a really good trade in program, but it does make me excited that this market is being taken seriously among PC manufacturers and chip makers.
What im getting from all these MSI claw 8ai reviews is that with upscaling technology the claw is superior but at native resolution with no upscaling they're pretty much equal..
Please do emulation testing, older games and 15W
Still need to resolve Intel compatibility problems and lower power efficiency.
Already bought the MCON? 👀
Nice. I bet the Legion Go 5 and the Ally X 5 will be better.
Wonderful when will modders add more ram to the ally x like the og ally?
It's not needed but better to have it once the ally x ages.
I’m rocking the original ally and I wish Msi would have gone small instead of bigger. Intels Lunar lake 258v does so well at low tdp. Never the less what a great time to buy a hand held
Although I love the Deck Oled, and considering the LGo2 wont come out for a while, I’m more than likely going to pick up an open box claw 8. I think the performance is impressive and I like what intel is doing with Xess. Plus I’m tired of these 7” screens.
I was laughing because according to the data, Arthur Morgan's hat, costs the Rog Ally 3 FPS in performance!
I’m so curious to know how the MSI handles Escape from Tarkov. Seen a few videos with the ally X but nothing on the claw
You should compared it with 890m
Any potential for Bazzite to come to MSI Claw 8 AI+?
Man even tho i dont have the msi claw 8 ai or the rog ally x but i have the rog ally extreme and the Lenovo legion Go they cant do ray tracing but the msi claw 8 ai does so which it is 10x better
@@DarkMike12345. Rog ally extreme definitely supports ray tracing
imo the claw is genuinely the better device and is actually a good option for high end pc handheld gameplay. the steam deck is still way cheaper if you don't want to spend high quality windows handheld prices, or if you'd rather get something used, but if you want the best of the best the claw is pretty much it, and it's using the newest chips so I don't think ces is really gonna dethrone it or anything like that
OG ally user here waiting for ally 2.❤❤
Z1E is the first AMD's APU for Handhelds/MiniPCs and even so Intels AI 8 is not doing it too good with faster and more RAM, newer CPU.
Will see when Z2E comes out.
What about the claw 7 ai? Is it say to say itlk be the same performance as its bigger counterpart. Ive always like the look of the original claw. It just needed a better chipset and that what the 7ai does. Any reviews on that one?
@@podkse claw 7 is dogshit bro , leave it alone
@AveleronCouatl I'm talking about the revised claw. The new 7" claw gets the new chip too.
Legion go 2 FTW. The ability to remove controllers and use kickstand plus 8.8 screen will destroy these.
@@radicalturkey exactly but sadly it'll not be released sooner maybe at the emd of this year
So i'm stuck what to choose since i like bigger screens a lot
Did you see acer's new blaze 11 inch handheld coming out too 😂
Claw 7 but with Claw 8 design and battery. If you need bigger screen, just plug it to your TV.
Battery life is more important for mobile gaming.
You made a mistake by setting "balanced" mode to both FSR and XeSS. A few months ago, Intel changed native resolution used in "balanced" from 635p to 540p
XeSS Balanced = 540p
FSR Balanced = 635p
XeSS Performance = 469p
FSR Performance = 540p
Anyone else find the RGB rings to be massively obnoxious as far as aesthetic design goes?
Would be pretty cool to have RGB light bars somewhere on the devices instead
please make a video comparing the new $499 Legion Go S w/ Steam OS vs. OLED Steam Deck
Please include the OneXFly F1 Pro for the comparison.
I know it isn't really the intended use case, but is the MSI Claw 8 AI basically silent/no fan for casual tablet use (web browsing, streaming video)?
When do RDNA4 APU's arrive? I think then these devices would become really good enough for me to consider.
Kind of a random question but would you recommend the Nuc 12 Serpent Canyon as a htpc? Mostly for jrpgs but I guess some AAA gaming would be nice as well. It would be used on a 4K oled tv, thanks.
ETA PRIME please make more videos about comparing the asus rog ally x and msi claw 8 ai +
Thanks for this video and previous video❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️💯💯💯💯💯💯💯💯💯🤙🤙🤙🤙🤙🤙🌹🌹🌹🌹
Ally X 2 with a 120hz OLED 16:10 screen and one of the new AMD chips would be the perfect device for me.
There are newer AMD APUs on the market, than the Ally X contains. So I see not a fair comparison, until new handheld-generations pops up, maybe around CES not sure.
I don't like the grey color
About the sd card? i saw linus open the claw and i think i saw it under a heatsink whats your thought about it? Can you confirm it and is it ok since rog ally has a sd problem?
I bought the rog ally and it’s nice when I found an opportunity I couldn’t pass I got the first MSI claw and I’ve loved that console more than the rog ally I currently play god of war ragnarok, Diablo 4, and black myth wukong with some switch games as well I look forward to getting the MSI claw 8ai+ or even the 7ai+ since I like the black more I will not be going to the rog ally x MSI claw nailed there handheld
Which one plays PS3/360 ISO's better?
Idk about the Claw but my x plays 360/ps3 great upscaled and and all that good stuff . Really cleans up the older games for sure
Either should be fine snice I am guessing the emulator uses Vulkan backend
Now time to wait for AMD next week . Im waiting for Lenovo 2 , 8.8 inch oled but no vrr . All depend of the power on the Z2 Extreme for my next choice because the screen on the msi is a really good choice.
I'm really interested in how they're going to price the remaining 155H claw stock. I'd really like to pick that up for like 200-300 dollars and mess around with it
I'd be in for one at $200 - $250
Do your affiliate links for keys still work? The site just tried to load....
which has better comfort/QC?
7" vs 8" battery life same?)