CNC PCB - high quality with the budget 3018 CNC
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 3 พ.ค. 2024
- We are showing you to that you can make your own high quality PCB with a CNC.
In this video we show you the full capabilities of the 3018 CNC.
If you would rather see a full step by step guide (tutorial) for how you can create your own PCBs in FlatCam see this video: • FlatCAM PCB CNC Full T...
This video only give a quick overview of milling of the copper layer, drilling the holes for the PIN headers as well as cut out the board.
Link to the 3018 CNC (Affiliate)
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Banggood (3018) - www.banggood.com/custlink/3mD...
Banggood (3018 Pro) - www.banggood.com/custlink/v3v...
AliExpress (3018) - s.click.aliexpress.com/e/_rQDu10
Alternative KIT, but different driverboard.
GearBest (3018 KIT) - www.gearbest.com/cutting-tool...
We use EasyEDA, FlatCAM and Candle (Grbl / Gerbel control) - all free software. But still, with free soft ware and a budget CNC we are able to make extremely high quality PCB designs.
This CNC can compete with Wegstr and the Bantam Tools Desktop PCB Mill.
Make your own custom PCB (Printed Circuit Board) at home.
In this video we use a simple V carve bit. There are special bits you can buy, but for most circuits, a V bit will do.
Hope you enjoy the video! - วิทยาศาสตร์และเทคโนโลยี
For a full step by step guide (tutorial) for how you can create your own PCBs in FlatCam see this video: th-cam.com/video/--Cb11heuHc/w-d-xo.html
That was pretty intense intro to just go “Hi there, I’m Mike and I’m Chris” lol
Hehe… yeah… 😎🥸
Warning the 3018 I have when the Z axis is pushing down bends (stacks up error in Z) by 4.5mm, I'm sure the others do also. As the Z Axis with spindle motor is made of plastic.
I made a PCB and even with -3mm on the Z axis (PCB was 1.2mm) for drill holes did not all go fully through. This has to be arround -5mm to work every time. with 6mm tool travel.
Note : I found by spraying WD40 onto the PCB while the PCB tracks are being cut with 30deg V cutter, works well with no copper drag on tracks sides or pad ripping.
Which I see a lot of on TH-cam with CNC milling, It also stops dust going all over the place and cools/ lubricates the tool.
My FlatCAM track settings (mm):
Cut Z -0.1
Travel Z 3.0
Feed Rate 20.0 This is still slow in Easel (Which I found better than Candel as its simple)
Multi-Depth Ticked (enabled)
Tool dia 0.254 The secound pass will make this a bit bigger but that should stop any thin un-cut copper gaps shorting.
Depth/pass 0.05 e.g. 2 passes per track (0.1mm) this fixes slight height issues,.With good quality flat plywood on stage, without need of copper height setting. PCB held by double sided tabe. I used so me extra tape (Kapton) around edges which stops WD40 going under the PCB. However after long sessions this tape un-glues from the WD40
Note: On each fresh track plunge a short press of WD40 from its straw cools the cutter, paper towel to remove excess floods.
3018 still wakes the dead, when cutting around track pads when cutter rotation is opposing directions.
85mm x 30mm PCB with not too many tracks takes 53mins, maybe this is slow but works every time - no broken tools and razor sharp tracks..
I made my through hole pads at 3mm with 1mm dia through holes, this fix's drill centers even with 3018 drill shaft wobbel.
Note: 2.54mm center dil pads can never have tracks going through!, For me CNC tracks of less than 1.5mm are hit and miss.
As adjacent tracks can steal tracks copper together with spindle wobbel, this kind of stuff does not show up on your PCB artwork.
When cutting out the PCB the with 3mm end mill , To start cuting into my wood surface this had to -8.5mm even if the pcb is 1.2mm thick!
If you have this machine "you will" have to upgrade the spindle motor and the Z Axis carrage, you can also upgrade the Y axis base.
However even with the cost of these upgrades, you still have a machine better than other entry level CNC's costing a lot more.
I would give my FlatCAM settings for my routed end mill cutouts, but I have to run 3 diffrent cut outs- still a bit trial and error due to 3018 Z axis issues.
First cuts the copper as the Z head bends -3mm Cut Z approx , 2nd cuts into about half the glass fibre (1.2mm FR4) -5mm Cut Z approx
and Final -8.5mm that just pushes through into my plywood . I have to do this to confirm board is cut out (Oh and 4 x 4mm tags). as I can not risk moving the PCB to confirm.
The feed rates are around 30.00 (first pass) then 40.00 and finaly 80.00
Th 3018 laser is a bit hobby ended also, with only the ability to cut 2mm ply. Which I cut out a few name signs. (Not realy any use to me)
The good thing is the laser does not suffer with Z axis bending.
Note; For Altuim users you will have to run your Gerber's into gerbv.exe then export as new gerber. FlatCAM will crash or refuse to use your Altuim Gerber?
My thoughts..... Will I do more CNC PCB's?
It is quicker with chemicals and get finner and more complex track detail. (See videos from Big Clive on TH-cam as he uses UV film, if you have not done this.)
However I would use 3018 with new spindel motor and metal Z axis for drilling PCB's and board cut outs....if my neighbours can put up with the noise....
My Wife thinks the 3018 is excellent value, at least thats what I tell her...............
Hi David!
Unless you have come across a place that sells the 3018 with really, really bad 3D printed parts it would be most likely the z axis stepper motor is broken. Try to remove the stepper motor and push and pull on the shaft - does it have a lot of give? Replacing it should be less than $10. If your CNC is still under warranty I would reach out to the company that sold it.
Where did you buy yours from?
We have 2 from banggood, and I know of about 3 more used by fellow makers - all running just fine.
So, in our experience, the 3018 CNC is still great. So I hope the problem with yours is simply the stepper motor.
Thanks for sharing your results! I'm considering purchasing a small mill for pcb's. It's tough to know which ones are better considering all the choices on Amazon.
Several years later and we are still using the same machine from Banggood!
I have now almost ready mine cnc router for high resolution incl microstepping. Now I need to learn where the home position is and how to do that, I have endswitches for all axis.
Most beginners will tell the cnc3018 sucks (I did that as well). But after reviewing all screws, and experimenting with parameters and different milling cutters, while also lowering speeds (50mm and 4000rpm), it started giving me better results. I like it now.
I'm a beginner, and I have to say that the cheap chinese 3018 cnc is pretty sweet. There is room for improvement no doubt but it's all you might need.
Yeah! I had to spend some hours but finally got to mill pcbs! I'm so happy right now.
I needed this video, thanks for the effort you put in to making it.
I have a project coming up where I need to create a number of PCBs with the same circuitry.
Are you using Tungsten Carbide 2 Flutes Ball Nose End Mills to drill the holes in the PCB?
Nice video, keep it up, thank you :)
Any info on the feeds and speeds settings used?
Looks awesome. What mills and drills did you use ?
What does the motor spindle look like? Does it have a flat edge on it?
Great video series. How do you probe the pcb for flatness?
they apply a voltage to the mill and the pcb, when the endmill touches the end, they canmeasure the current
techydiy has a Genmitsu 3020 video showing how there's a standard procedure in the tools to probe the height on a grid and make a map that can be applied when cutting.
Hi, how are you my English is pity but I wanted to know what program the EJE Z poll was done with.
Excellent video.
Thanks Rtcw! The Z probing was done within Candle (grbl control) to create a height map :-)
Thank You
Can I use FlatCam with the CNC 3018 PRO?
Regarding wegstr, I there a way to remove the rest of the copper from the surface just like wegstr did after milling the router they did another run to remove the excess copper
it's very nice video, but i have some question how do you auto-leveling on pcb? Cloud you teach or make some video for that please.
Hi!
What software are you using?
The hight map / leveing functions will depend on the CAM (CNC Software) you are using.
Is the 3018 CNC PRO not better and more accurate at making and drilling the PCB?
Hi fellas, nice video. I got the 3018 Pro too and have already modified it with a brushless 500 W spindle, but my results are far away from yours. It looks like my cnc doesnt really mill, more likely the copper layer gets pushed to the edge. Do you recommend a good pcb copper board or you are just use the common ones?
Hi! That sounds strange. At what depth are you milling? We use 0.1 mm.
Also, check that there is no slack in the z-axis!
Are you using a v-carve bit? Check that the tip is not broken :-)
I have a 3018cnc but I'm still gathering information before trying to mill my first pcb. Your video was of great help. I just wanted to ask what type of bits you use for milling - v-bit or something else? Tool diameter and angle? What depth of cut, how many passes and what feedrate did you utilize?
I've also been milling PCBs recently, been using 0.1mm v-bits which seem to work well
www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B00HC98K2C Picked up these ones
Do not skip bed leveling, it's essential. Actually I've been developing a small script to pre-level gcode files before milling, which is a bit more accurate than the built in grbl leveling. Gonna post that on github soon
How did you change your pcb design to make the copper lines thicker and for the router to only cut the outline.
I made my circuit in fritzing but it needs editing in order to work. My cnc wants to remove all extra copper and not just a contour and I want to make the end points thicker to solder with ease. Any tips?
Yes, use FlatCam :-)
We have a video on exactly this th-cam.com/video/--Cb11heuHc/w-d-xo.html
Hope it helps :-)
So you don't need to put anything under the PCB when milling?
How on earth did you manage to get this nice of a quality on the 3018? I have one myself but I didn't get the quality necessary to create usable pcb's. Very well done!
Thank you!
It took some tries and experiments to get to the final results. But not milling to deep, good probing of the board and making sure there is no slack on any of the axis should give very clean results. There are some additional tips on our FlatCam video. Like, we only mill 0.1 mm deep.
@@DIYTECHBROS So no modifications to the machine? I have the idea that my spindle or collet for that matter isn't completely center, so the tool is always off center and vibrating. I will however try it again, I am probing right now. I did see an option in flatcam to select the angle of the tool, so it can calculate the depth when the desired width is given, but to be honest I don't really get the new gui of the tool. I should do a little bit more research. Right now I will try a 0.1mm depth of cut with a 30 tool!
@@basvisscher934 Did you get better results with the .1mm depth? (just curious)
@@ZebroLebro yes, and i figured out that the bed probing has to be enabled with a checkbox that is disabled by default. Now i get useable results
@@basvisscher934 Do you think I should get a higher end CNC machine if I want to create PCBs ? I don't know if I should take the time to tinker with the 3018 to get better results or if just pouring in 50-100$ would not be easier
Hi, what kind of support for hold the pcb in place do you use ?
Just about anything will keep it in place. We just had some left over aluminum brackets. Currently working on a new video on this topic. Hopefully we will cover support/holders in that video :-)
Hi!
Thanks for this video!
I’m thinking about buying this machine precisely for making PCBs. Could you please inform me on what tools (drill and mill bit) you used?
Also, I have access to Eagle for making the design. Do you have any experience on whether or not it is easy to use together with Eagle as opposed to easyEDA?
Hi Emanuel! In this video (also for the very thin lines we made in the "extreme test") we used a simple V Carving bit 0-2 mm 30 degrees. I think they were $5 for 10 at Banggood. One bit has lasted 30 small PCBs and is still sharp. We cut at 0.11 mm depth.
And when it comes to Eagle, it is an excellent piece of software. We just prefer EasyEDA and FlatCAM as they are just so easy to use. And of we want to order the PCBs, we can just push a button. But, if you already are comfortable with Eagle and have invested in the add on's you need, I would stick with what you know.
Happy milling, and please share your results with us on Twitter :-)
@Gustavo Voltani von Atzingen yes i would be grate full of the setting you used as having issue with my machine. Does look really good well done
@@DIYTECHBROS Great video. What drill bits did you use? It appears to have a large shank compared to most small drill bits.
where are the connections for probing? I see where the aligator clips are. Do you connect the drill bit to the pcb board?
Hi! Probing is done though pin A5 and GND.
Connect one pin to the PCB, and the other to the drill bit.
See this site for more: github.com/grbl/grbl/wiki/Connecting-Grbl
One more question: Is GRBL Control (Candle) software included with the machine? Does this software has some feature like Flip or Mirror to do the 2 sides of the PCB?
Yes, GRBL control is included. But, it is also free online so you can download it directly :-)
For making PCBs see our FlatCam video. GRBL control is not a CAD, so it is mainly for running gerber commands.
We are currently working on a new video for doing double sided PCBs.
@@DIYTECHBROS Thanks for the information. I've seen the FlatCam Video from you guys. And it's great to know that you're working on a new video for doing double sided PCBs. I'll watch this video too.
Question: Can the 3018 CNC pro machine do a double sided (double layer) PCB?
No problem at all :-)
Excellent.How can I add silk Screen?
Hi! We did a video about that :-) th-cam.com/video/bLP-gzqJ-r4/w-d-xo.html
Wegstr disliked this video
+Video Account Hehehehe 🤣
Because its too costly 🤣
Haha
What software handled the probing? Did GRBL do the probing automatically/is it a GRBL configuration?
In both GRBL ctrl and Candle (the new version) you have a function called Height Map :-)
@@DIYTECHBROS thanks!
Nice and cheap machine...👍
Far out look at the runout (wobble) on that spindle!!! That answers my questions about how terrible it is.
Goo job! Other guys trying to get a pcb on 3018 is going too deep on Z ! copper board usually have 0.035mm thick copper layer, no need to go too deep!
Exactly!
Hi sir I'm buy cnc 3018 pro I need Mobile pcb specific IC grinding can u please Help me I need .nc format Layout
I hate to ask, but my need is for PBC work and some light plastic cutting and drilling. The CNC 3018 Pro looks like it would do the basic work, but a laser and etch still seems to produce superior PCBs. The Ortur seems to do a good job, and has a 15 watt (aka 4.5 watt) laser available that focuses down to a very small spot. So my questions: Can I put the Ortur laser on the CNC 3018 Pro? And what power laser would you guess would be adequate to cut the spray on coating (not the copper itself, of course)? Speed is NOT an issue. Precision and repeatability IS, however, very important. Suggestions, anyone?
Hi!
Once you are comfortable and gain experience with your CNC it will have the ability to deliver best result in terms of details.
We have a video on making PCBs with the Ortur as as well. And, sure, you can make or buy an adapter to mount it to the 3018.
But if you want a dust free result the laser approach is good.
Don't worry about cutting the copper. A diode laser like this have no chance. Most engraving lasers will be able to burn the paint. Just run it slower.
@@DIYTECHBROS So you are saying even the lower power 5W (volt-amp) laser will cut the paint adequately? Good to know. [And speed is NOT an issue.] What about the lower power laser v. the higher 15 or 20 watt lasers. Will they produce the same spot size? Or will the lower power laser diode produce a smaller spot size.
One other thing I haven't seen any information about. Every PCB video either cuts the PCB copper with the router, or it ablates the resist and etches. Lots of talk about the problem with router edges in the copper, or how small variances in height impact trace width due to the V-shaped blades most folks use. Has anyone tried "route and etch"? That is, use the fine-tipped router blade to just cut through the resist (but not through the copper), and then etch. Seems like that might produce a much finer trace with improved accuracy (and little or no backlash).
Thanks...
Simply put, the laser outputs energy / heat. If that heat is enough to burn wood, a thin layer of paint will burn off as well. It takes more time with lower power. Choosing a dark an matt paint will help.
You overcome the variance in the thickness of the PCB by probing different points across the PCB to create a height map. So milling + etching becomes redundant.
I prefer milling for creating the most accurate PCB!
I use M140 (2W) laser to cut spray paint.
First of all, great video. But most important: where can i buy it online?
Hi JC! You can buy the CNC from Banggood: www.banggood.com/custlink/DDGDekWEgI (Affiliate link). Thank you for your comment!
DIY TECH BROS Any chance of an in-depth tutorial? Like a step-by-step for newbies like me!
Hi JC! We have received more requests on this topic - so we are going to make a full guide about it :-)
What is the price ?
For Your experience, what's the minimum spacing between route? Is possible to realize PCB with SMD components?
Hi!
It must be a minimum of you bit.
I like to try to fit in one extra isolation track with 10% overlap for each track.
So a good minimum would be 10% + bit width + 10%
For a 0.2 bit 30 degrees 1 mm down the width of the bit is about 0.25 mm.
10% of 0.25 is 0.025
0.025 + 0.25 + 0.025 = 0.3mm
And, yes, a PCB for SMD components can be milled. In fact it's what we are doing in this video :-)
@@DIYTECHBROSThanks I will try
Music makes it sound like the must see movie of the year
Hehe... that's what's happen when you have two brothers that have no idea how to edit videos :-p
@@DIYTECHBROS I was expecting the circuit board to turn into liquid metal and start hunting Sarah Connor :)
Good video though, just got a small 3018 CNC and hoping to do a few small simple circuits.
Hehe :-) Congratulations on your new 3018!
I have this cnc but when i do engraving the pcb, i get a problem the bit is not completely straight with the Z axis it kinda move and make shaking i don't know this is the problem with ER11 or what can any body help
When milling pcb you need fine precision and with a wobbling or not straight bit you loose that precision. What we always do is placing a mobile phone on the CNC, and with the camera app we zoom in on the bit and on the screen we mark the tip of the bit with a whiteboard marker. Then carefully rotate the bitt to verify that the tip is on the same place and not moving. If it moves, try to remount the bit a few times.
@@DIYTECHBROS I found the problem was with er11 collet chock it was not perfectly placed, Now the problem is solved
Anybody who takes a basic 3018 straight out of the box and expects to use it without any upgrades or modifications is asking for gold at the end of the rainbow.......the basic machine is made very much down to a price and suitable upgrades that make it sing will double the price but well worth it.
Is the dust from the PCB cancerous? Can be pretty fine too? Precautions around dust extraction here?
It's definitely something you wouldn't want to be breathing on a regular basis; PCBs are usually made from epoxy + fiberglass. It's not asbestos bad, but it's still advisable to get some filtering or wearing a mask during use.
Cutting bit is not rotating straight, or is the collet that also doesn't seem good.
Hi! Yes, the collet looks strange, and looks even worse on camera than it does in real life. But the bit it self is fairly straight, as you also can see from the results :-)
Did I miss how you got the red mask on the board? :)
Excellent question, as always Balu :-) we are waiting for a new product (for us) for comparing it to regular uv paint. When it is in, and we are done testing it we will make a video on the topic!
Its called pcb mask you find it on ebay in different colors red green blue etc
What a coincident :-) we are working on the final parts of that video as we speak! It will be out on about 7 hours!
I subbed waiting for it
Great, thank you :-) It will be out in 2 hours! Always some last minute editing.
I need this matchin
We can after almost one year confirm that we still love it!
where can i get gerber control? I have flatcam.
found it already. Great video. Thanks.
Nice overview of pcb milling on cheap CNC, but it misses important parameters like feed rate, speed and so on
Hi cpassuel! We are currently working on a how to video where we are going to cover all settings and options in-depth. Hope to see you back for that video!
Hi guys!
I have some issues with my CNC 3018 and i hope you can help me.
1. After i charge the PCB from Flatcam,most times the CNC start milling without turning on the Spindle.I stop the process,i set all axes to 0 again and i try again but same thing...sometimes after the first try,i here the CNC try to turn on the spindle but only for 1 sec after i get an error something like (something went wrong error) .After few tries like this,work.
2. After the CNC milling the traces,i charge the file for drilling the holes...the CNC start but after 1-2 or 3 holes ,stops and i must reset everything,even the USB i must remove it ad plug it in again thats mean i loose every coordonates. If i didn't make sign with marker on the PCB,i will neer know the 0 point
3. I connect 3 limit switches but doesn't matter where i set the X,Y,Z to be 0 point...the CNC never go there if i press "Home" button, appear a message like "this function is disable" and i didn't find an setings or something for enable that.
After all of this errors and issues i thing the problem comes from CH340 driver or from communication but im not sure. The software for CNC is "GRBL Controller",almost like "Candle" but "candle" i also download it but the buttons for axes not works at all
If you can help me with some information about this or if you have some recommendation,let me know!
Thanks!
Hi! Did you buy one of the models we recommend and link to? If so, can you share the link. This is important for the modules used on the main board as well as the design of can machine can influence as well,
Can you not mill it on to the corner? Seems like a lot of waste
We try to use the left overs form all videos! It saves both money and the environment 🌎🌍🌏
3018 can mill a soldermask?
Mariusz Woźniak sure! Not a problem!
@@DIYTECHBROS So Wegstr is waste money and time?
@@mariuszwozniak6918 No, from what can see from their videos it seems like a very good product. BUT, that being said,, the 3018 can handle all the specs we need for a PCB. We can mill the same trace width and clearance as when we order a PCB from China.
@@DIYTECHBROS I overspend a bit of time looking at cnc's again. It more about the toy than the actual usage I fear.
Can you make a reliable trace under a 0805, or 0603 smd resistor?
I allready have a setup for single sides UV exposed pcb's. I have the chemicals and some experience. I think I would want to be able to do double sided.
My hobbyprojects mainly involve using the atmega328p-au chip. and a few sot23 sized parts. And of course 2 sides to prevents the use of bridges. Traces are 0,20-0,25mm. (8mil) Distance between traces are a minimum of 0,2mm though I do try 0,15mm. Which works of course with commercial pcb suppliers and a bit with uv exposure at home.
Would you say the machine is up for the task, or continue with uv exposure and learn to do two sides?
I have never experimented with solder masks, but I have determined I should definitely try this, looks easy.
@@joerideman Hi!
That's a great question! 0805 is not a problem. But I would say that it is starting to push the limit.
The CNC it self is not going to be the biggest issue. Just create a higher "resolution" height map and it will perform very accurately.
The quality of the copper clad board and the bit in the milling process is whats going to be the biggest challenge.
A good quality PCB (with an even layer of copper and good adhesion to the fiberglass) is going to be key.
And next up is the bit and feed rate. You need to make sure the bit will not tare off too much copper.
If you have a layout you want to mill, I can have a go at it and see what results I can get. See our "about" page to get our email!
You are doing great videos, but you are always looking like you are holding hands :D
Hehe... yeah... we are not that experienced with making videos, but feedback is always welcome. That’s how we learn. Thank you :-)
It may just be me, but you may want to be looking into a replacement chuck. I'm seeing a decent amount of runout on that bit.
Regardless, good vid.
I almost didn't make it through your intro, lol.
@0:40 to avoid ear rape
Step by step walk through my ass. What drills do you use? What feed rate? What RPM?
Hi! See this video th-cam.com/video/--Cb11heuHc/w-d-xo.html
:)
☑️we like!
After promising a hardcore action movie, u guys made us watch two gay bunnies 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
I was not expecting a THAT kind of profile picture with that kind of comment :-p
But your comment still made me laugh :-)
Oh man, so slow and with visible shaking millbit :)
No, the shaking is more an optical illusion. We are milling very fine PCBs without any problem. That would not be possible if shaking! But, yes, the spindle should be upgraded if you want to work faster!
I was instantly turned off from the music in the intro, its one thing I cant stand ... EPIC NOISE then I saw it was for the lolz, so good job
The tutorial may be great but the Cecil B DeMille opening (like so many tutorials) sucks. Why do so many tutorial producers think they are movie directors? Sorry for the rant. And sorry for taking it out on you. It’s many providers. Perhaps your intro was even louder and longer than usual or perhaps I’m just tired. Now I’ll watch the tutorial. And, again, I want to apologize for my bitching.
Выточить и выбросить.
I believe this video is fake.
Sorry to hear that you believe that. If you are really interested in PCB milling on a CNC just drop us an email (see about page) and we are happy to share additional footage.
@@DIYTECHBROS make a video showing the cnc clearly while milling a pcb. And withoıt changing place. Zoom on pcb to see the details of carved traces. I repeat; this video is fake.
@@cagataytezsezen I am pretty sure this video is a wink to a certain brand of PCB milling machines.
Without any arguments of what you need to see to believe it I believe you are mostly trolling now. So I am interested in why you think this is fake. Please enlighten me.
Have you looked at there follow up video's?
You are right. You cant graving like this result with cnc 3018