Honestly, I know DNegs is giving off crazy old man get off my lawn vibes these days, but he's mostly right about all of this. Some of the details his position may exaggerate, but I agree with the spirit of what he's saying. A lot of the meta these days is detracting from the pure intentionality of the game.
He's an intellectual player. Seeing advantages and taking note of all these is how he capitalizes I'm the game. He's bringing up topics that others can't even see yet (different level of play) The man's smart 💯
What do you do when you skill is way behind todays elite. You get sponsorships. How do you get sponsorships? You create controversy to stay relevant. More rake is better folks!!
Honestly, there should be one hard and fast rule... Once cards are put in front of a player, they cannot leave their seat until mucked or the hand is done. No Chris Moneymaker running to rail whining due to being behind in an all-in, and DEFINITELY not the case we saw in the finals of the WSOP. Poker, at least live, should SOLELY be player vs table. If you want to get up AFTER you are no longer in a hand, or if it's between hands to talk to your 'team', that's fine. But once cards are in front of you, you should be forced to remain seated at the table or forfeit the hand if you get up and do more than simply stand behind your chair.
In those tournaments you had to go to your rail so the Cameras could get a good shot of everyone around the table. shouldn't be allowed during other tournament situations but it has a reason for happening at a live-streamed final table.
@@smackinmatt All in is different, but the problem is if you start making 'exceptions' there will ALWAYS be players who whine and whine and whine and eventually the rule become corrupted.
I agree with him totally. I delt poker for years. It's getting out of hand with stupid little issues that he brings up. Negranu is actually a really good guy.
You know what else it's not good for poker? GG poker disgusting rake and shitty rakeback for regs, the main poker site in the world tries to get every single penny, can't even leave us preflop pots like any other poker site, but I guess Negreanu really likes that big fat check he gets
@@aarongn8083If only it was that easy, here in the Netherlands they only allow GG. All other poker sites don't have a license. Stars is gone since 2021 here, and I'm sure we're not the only country 😢
The one chip issue does come up a few times in a location I play at. I have found that when I see a player move chips in (1 or 2 left behind) and not say "All-In" and I say the words "All-In" and not throw my cards up, it has induced a few attitudes from said players.
90% = ALL-IN suggestion doesn't make any sense because if they accept this rule people will just throw in 85% of their chips in order not to go all-in. But I agree with DNeg about card protectors and face coverings. If you are afraid that you'll give away some tells, just play online, bro. Why have you come to a live event?
While you are correct, the 15% back represents a lot more equity than the single chip back to avoid the bubble. The times the 85% of the stack all in wins, they make much less money. Overtime, this will hurt the players using this strategy.
i think he just wants to ban face coverings because reading people is part of his game. maybe not as big as in the past but i'm sure he still likes to use it. i also want to say that i don't think it's possible to make poker more watchable for an average person. there is not enough personality in high level tournament poker if we compare it to the wsop 2000s era. everything is too mathematical at this point
He's not wrong, either. The point of live poker is that you get to look a man/woman/whatever in the eye before you make a decision, not to hide under an elaborate disguise so no one can get a read on you because you can't keep it together.
@@maximofernandez196 What? Good players understand the weaknesses in their game and strive to continuously improve on them. If you know you have a very expressive face and take measures to ensure others can't take advantage of that, you're the very definition of a good player.
@@maximofernandez196If that's true, they'll not make it very far even if you can't see any part of them regardless, so it won't really matter in the end. It's annoying, sure, but if you as a poker player are able to annoy your opponent, they're likely to make worse decisions than they would otherwise, and that's a valid strategy. There are rules and there's etiquette. Rules are specific, but every individual's comfort level with etiquette is a little different. It's tough to make those judgment calls when it comes to what some people think is acceptable or not. I don't really think you can police people's face coverings with rules imo. Daniel had some decent suggestions for how you could potentially approach this as a rule change, but in the long term, the better player wins regardless of what they're wearing. Obviously it's poker and there is certain luck involved, but some kid's hoodie is never going to be why you lost a tournament.
I came across a 95% of stack bet in one of last year's WSOP dailies. It was before the bubble and I determined he didn't want to be put all in which led to me raising and successfully getting him off of a better hand. He didn't make it past the bubble.
@@OneOut1right? Who is gonna put in 95% of their stack just to fold? If they are so scared about the bubble you'd think they wouldn't bet the 95% in the first place...
@@pugsnhogz He's trying to make himself sound good cos he got someone to "fold a better hand" after having 95% of his stack in. I don't believe his story because even fish will not fold those spots.
Hes right about most of this, The chip protectors got out of hand. Used to be a chip or small token you would use, now people bring huge items for "LUCK" and set them on the table.
I used card cover because I have had my hand mucked twice by a dealer... Different dealer's. However I do agree with you. I have a metal coin. Not big but you can see it. I agree all this good luck and bring half a bag of stuff and putting it on the table is ridiculous.
I usually hate when ppl commentate over clips rather than just letting the clips speak for themselves. But your insight is great. And the way you structured the video was very entertaining. New sub here 👍
As much as I think some of these coverings are silly, why should it be a rule? People’s external skills have nothing to do with the game. Can there be a tshirts only rule? I need to be able to see the hairs on people’s arms to pickup tells. Other than confirming a player’s identity and that they don’t have cheating devices, you can’t really tell people to not wear whatever they want.
I think the takeaway from DN here is that poker (like any game with intention to grow) needs to evaluate and adjust for the better of the game. Look at professional sports for an example. Are there any professional sports that haven't implemented change for the better of the game? Even further, those sports have even changed at the amateur level (ex. NFL has multiple changes from protection of the QB to what is deemed a catch. The NHL also has a new icing ruling among many others)... rules like this trickle down to the amateur level. These changes have all been to 1) improve the game and 2) protect those players. Those seem to be the exact 2 reason DN is proposing for these changes. On top of that, didn't the WSOP announce at the begging of the tournament that no devices were technically allowed (if wrong please correct but pretty sure I saw a video announcing this rule)? If so this would seem to be a gray line people are crossing, and with tech growing at such a rapid pace it's certainly only going to hurt the game moving forward.
I think the biggest problem is televising players cards so those that have access study players styles and betting habits from a tv.....the other is long drawn out decisions.....time is necessary to make decisions but some get ridiculous with it. I could care less about card protectors
Using technology while in play at the WSOP was NOT allowed within the rules. Negreanu played a recording that was played at the beginning of every tournament. During the recording it said that any use of solvers within the the tournament area is prohibited and could result in a penalty.
I agree with all of those except the card protector rule. Many important hands have been mucked because of a dealer or player mistake. I remember some main event back in the day where this lady had her hand mucked by the dealer because he thought she was folding, but she wasn't. Definitely need them if you sit in seats 1 or 9.
So chips or a larger coin? 0 reason to take toys and figures to the table. I get the personalization and fun aspect, but some people's card holders are too big and distracting.
I agree with his points except the 90% of stack should be an all-in, that’s a nonsense and is a fair tactic especially if you are about to ladder up to the next pay level
Look, I don't want to play poker, with an exploded basket of clothes, hiding a human being at a table. The sunglasses can be an issue because they can be like mirrors. A really good player can use the glasses to gain an edge on the players ,next to the one wearing the sunglasses. The high dealing is something the management needs to make sure their dealers never do. The card 'protectors' are just childish. They came about specifically because of television programming. I prefer to see adults playing cards. Well, except when Phil Helmuth explodes.
There were people who won millions in Europe because they could see others' cards from a phone/small camera next to the dealer...there are tools that you can sit next to a marked deck and it instantly tells you who will have what hand. Cheating is real.
If people bring nonsensical card protectors, they could simply regulate them.. Like nothing larger than a card or higher than 2 inches, something like that. I've seen multiple videos about dealers mucking cards that were still in play... No card protectors would mean the players have to keep their hands on their cards 100% of the time. That does not seem like something that "would make poker better" imho.
"Knowing the action is the players's responsibility. The dealers will help you as much as they can, but it is ultimately on the player to know what the action is." These are things the floor says at the beginning of every tournament.
If a rule is made to address the tanking issue, then that should fix the new player experience. I've never been to the WSOP, but if I did go and the players at my table were taking at least a minute to make every decision then I definitely wouldn't come back.
Funny how my #1 thing is players with their phones out during hands. I recall one time around maybe 12 years ago where I'm in a PLO game with 500-3000 buy ins and some asshole is on his phone immediately after folding and even when he's still in a hand and nobody seems to have a problem with it when I pull the pit boss aside so I just rack up and leave. I recall saying something about how even just revealing what cards you muck in PLO pre-flop to a friend at the table is a huge advantage...
Unless I missed something I dont think any of these turn it into a strategy game for recreationals. Its all pretty straight forward if you agree or not. No excessive face coverings. Only chips and cards on the table. Chess clocks arent rocket science. You hit the clock and it runs and runs out. Holding money back, i dont see anything happening with that. Players just need to pay more attention. The game changes and people adapt
I don't like this "they should be paying more attention" argument. Would you say the same if I won a few big pots and as I re-stacked my chips I "happened" to put a few high value chips behind the tower of lower denominations? And you bet 100k of your 400k stack thinking I could have no more than 80k or so and I re-raise you all-in, actually having you covered? I mean, you could have paid more attention to the pots I won and the chips in my stack. You could have asked for a count. I really don't see how those situations are any different. I've seen some pretty "creative" 1 chip techniques, like "toppling" a stack past the bet line with one chip that looooks like it was part of the toss, but isn't, and is behind the line (and above the amount of the announced bet) and using the cards as a "chip protector" to help hide it. If you were "paying more attention", you'd have noticed both of those moves but that doesn't make them any less scummy.
The 1 chip strategy is only benefitial due to the bb ante. If there was no bb ante, there would be no problem with it. Very solvable, e.g. you are eligable to the bb ante only for the amount of your stack. I think he is right that it is not really beneficial strategically besides angling (tanking, getting cards shown) - given there is no bb ante. Given the bb ante, it must be a viable strategy
I agree in spirit but I think your proposed rule is untenable. Because what happens when the natural result of a hand is someone being left with 1 chip, like 2 players all in and they cover by 1 chip. Should that player not be eligible for bb ante next hand? Doesn't seem right.
He is eligable, just for the amount that he has. Just like with no ante, you create a side pot for this person's matching stack. So if the bb is 100 and he has 10, the pot he is eligable for is 30, and not 120. @@pugsnhogz
So, i think i understand from a purity stand point. If you want to prevent live reads, then just play online. In a live setting, live facial reads are part of the game. I agree with daniel. You should be able to see the eyes and/or the mouth and throat.
I agree with banning face coverings. I will even go further and ban actions intended to cover the face, such as dipping your head down or pulling up your shirt (it's okay if it's momentarily). I don't think people should have to have their face in full view all the time, but there's no excitement in a table full of people doing everything they can to make their faces invisible.
A chess clock would lead to much more irrational decision making. If a person knows they have 30 seconds, it gives them enough time to think. A chess clock would make some players run out of time completely. It would be a mess. I better way to get people to respect everyone’s time would be to incentivize people to save time. Maybe give quicker players extra time banks as their saved time adds up.
Not in every case. You may want to watch the video before asking questions that get answered during them, or at least go back and delete them after you get your answer.
The goal of tournament is to be last man standing. The means to that end is to maximize your chances within a set of rules. When a rec player is competing against pros in big tournaments, finding every little advantage can keep you in the game longer. And if I ever find myself facing off against Daniel in a tournament (not likely), you can bet I'm gonna use EVERY advantage I can, including slow play. I don't have the same toolkit a pro does. The amount of hours I can afford to play, and the caliber of players I see are very different than someone at Daniel's level, so we're already at a HUGE disadvantage. Still, Daniel's not wrong, and every sporting activity will sometimes direct the regulating body to adjust or tighten the rules, for better game play and better experience for spectators.
I just feel everything is already right, let people use the technology or softwares or concelaments to their advantage, you cant monitor every table and every scenario everytime so just for consistency I feel it is easier to let it be what it already is.
Are you serious? So why don't we make all the Olympic Games with no rules? Steroids for everyone. doesn't matter if they only live to 25 but as long as they win. I could tell you're under 25 years old. Of course you go along with the cheat rules.
The host just said why wouldn't the chip leader put the most pressure on smaller stacks. Exactly. Why would a chip leader make a bet of 290k when the opponent has 300 k. Even if it's a 2-1 chip lead they wouldn't just put that person all in within tournament style play the object is to get people out not give people a chip to build from. The host totally contradicts himself unless I misunderstood the hosts explanation. Which is possible
The players giving the most to the poker economy are there for social aspects. Being anti social is bad for the games. Hoodies and face coverings aren’t conducive to social aspects and makes for worse games
just a stopwatch for each player basically. that counts down only when it's his action. logistically, it would be weird. another thing to carry around.
from what I understand , it's not leaving a chip behind per say that he sees as the problem, but the stalling they create while doing so. It's annoying to the players and the VIEWERS.
Poker is an ungodly stupid game that is kept stupid because they don't want the losers to clearly understand that they are the meat in the sandwich. 1. Deal everyone the same hands over a long stretch to even out the crap streaks. 2.After someone loses, figure out the odds that they beat and make them forfeit 30% of that amount. 3. Get rid of 2s,3s and 4s. This would wast much less time and get down to business. There are other easy fixes to increase the skill in poker and take out the stupid part. Minimize the effects of sucking out.
Chip and a chair theory in FULL EFFECT here. Doyle would be bothered by Daniel contesting this. It's strategic, especially in Tournaments. Mostly Everything else he suggested I'm in favor for.
as a viewer, not an active player, I have zero interest in watching games where the players are so wrapped up they cannot be seen at all. It would be like watching online games with no cams, dry and boring. If this rule does not change the sport see viewership slack off over time. It is the small things that will erode the sports popularity
As he ages he talks more, what bothers me is the phones delaying the game not paying attention or checking the GTO Wizard who knows. Those guys usually lose money though not focusing on the players traits.
I'm going to have to add on top of all this, the entertainment value is just going down drastically. I remember when I was a big fan, watching pokerstars with some big names like Negreanu, Hellmuth, Tony G, Phil Laak, Vanessa, Antonio, etc. and there were just great table talk moments. I have no intention of watching a guy with a hoodie and sunglasses not say a word or make a motion for 2 and a half minutes, there's no entertainment in that. And the tournament money comes from 2 places: entries, and casino advertisement. With poker being big on tv or streaming sites, that would highly increase advertisement, therefor it's in the games best interest to increase its entertainment value. Nothing fun about watching EV plays with robot like humans and 0 interaction.
I kinda like the chess clock idea. It would be difficult to implement. Because it drives me nuts when people burn their entire 30 seconds on every hand. If you look down at T5o utg 9 handed just fucking muck it. It doesn't take 30 seconds to figure it out. I dont like the ban chip protector thing. Because i have personally seen a player throw their cards into another players to muck their hand. Its a shitty thing to do, and should have its own reproductions. He says you can use a chip. What if im short stacked and go all in into 2 players. The next to act asks for a count. While im pushing my chips out that player throws his cards into mine. No chips available to be on the cards because they were being counted. My hands were busy so i cant hold them. Now my hand is dead. Absolute best case scenario is they chop that players money between me and the other remaining player. But what if i had the absolute nuts and was very likely to get a call from the remaining player? I just got fucked out of a double up. Its an unlikely scenario but not impossible. For tournaments just check the protection devices for electronics.
I agree with the protectors being off the table personally but it wouldn't stop me from playing one way or the other, as for the glasses or face covering. Whatever the rules are I'm fine with. I am sure there could be tournaments or companies that could create those rules and pay him to join their promotion of tourney and he would draw interest and that would play to his strengths. I also don't care about Tamayo using tech to win, if it's in the rules and someone uses the rules better than an opponent I am fine with that. Being a Rule's Warden pays, if you can do it better than everyone else.
Alex I also play at MGM national harbor as well myself, I do have to say, at the 1/3 there the sunglasses help. I say this because I imagine you know how most 1/3 players at our card room are, mostly with giving away their tells physically. I’m fairly chatty and outgoing at the table to help me feel more relaxed, but the shades help me not feel terrible about watching what my opponent is doing the whole hand. Most of the players in the 1/3 at MGM (not all card rooms but the small stakes at MGM specifically) give away their tells with their eyes/body language. Without the shades, I’d obviously feel strange blatantly eye-fucking my opponent. In most cases, if shades were banned, I wouldn’t mind and I’d still watch what my opponent is doing, for me it’s more of a comfort thing where no one knows where my eyes are. I do agree though on the “one or the other rule” that’s proposed, with choosing either shades or face-coverings at the table. Just my two cents regarding the usage of shades.
I agree with the face covering because you could have a ear piece in with someone talking in your ear... Cheating. I guess the card cover thing makes sense but I have used a card cover because I actually have had my hand mucked by a dealer twice! The first time I just wrote it off... Was still upset but fine. The second time by a different dealer... Nope we ain't doing that anymore!
The unnecessary tanking and hiding behind a mask hoodie and glasses takes the fun out of it for recreational players. Daniel is smart enough to know that recs are needed for the game to survive
Anyone who's doesn't think card protectors are needed to protect against dealer error hasn't played in many crappy home games with people dealing from weird angles. I'll admit, I've personally accidentally mucked a player's hand when it was my turn to deal. I've done that twice, actually. On big feature tables with designated spots for your cards... yeah, probably not needed there.
Using the computer on the rail was NOT within the rules, that's what made that cheating so outrageous. Jonathan Tamayo should have been arrested by Nevada Gaming enforcement agents.
I'm not a huge fan of Daniel but he's correct on this. Everyone is trying to pull off the mask/sunglasses/hoodie combo and it's making the game insufferable. Card protectors are just fun though, old men have a problem with anything that isn't what they would do and having a pokemon toy is an issue to them apparently.
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![How 'GAMBLEDORE' Became an Overnight Poker Sensation [MUST WATCH]](/img/tr.png)
![This Has NEVER HAPPENED Before!!!! [Feat. Nik Airball]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/JrRUdpvKfHE/mqdefault.jpg)
Honestly, I know DNegs is giving off crazy old man get off my lawn vibes these days, but he's mostly right about all of this. Some of the details his position may exaggerate, but I agree with the spirit of what he's saying. A lot of the meta these days is detracting from the pure intentionality of the game.
The crazy old man vibes is also known as passion. Couple that with experience and it turns into fkn Gandalf.
LOLOL how many tournaments have you guys run in your life? 😂😂😂😂😂
@@Yaseen47 how many have you run?
He's an intellectual player. Seeing advantages and taking note of all these is how he capitalizes I'm the game. He's bringing up topics that others can't even see yet (different level of play)
The man's smart 💯
What do you do when you skill is way behind todays elite. You get sponsorships. How do you get sponsorships? You create controversy to stay relevant.
More rake is better folks!!
I think the rake is just too low
😂
BIGGER Rake in 2025 🙏
Lmao 👏🏻👏🏻
Players aren't loosey goosey any more 😂
Definitely too low 🤣🤣🤣
Honestly, there should be one hard and fast rule...
Once cards are put in front of a player, they cannot leave their seat until mucked or the hand is done.
No Chris Moneymaker running to rail whining due to being behind in an all-in, and DEFINITELY not the case we saw in the finals of the WSOP.
Poker, at least live, should SOLELY be player vs table. If you want to get up AFTER you are no longer in a hand, or if it's between hands to talk to your 'team', that's fine. But once cards are in front of you, you should be forced to remain seated at the table or forfeit the hand if you get up and do more than simply stand behind your chair.
If you're all-in you should be allowed get out of your seat
In those tournaments you had to go to your rail so the Cameras could get a good shot of everyone around the table. shouldn't be allowed during other tournament situations but it has a reason for happening at a live-streamed final table.
100% agree
Just wondering, why do you care if a player is all in and goes to sweat it with their rail? It's not like any advantage is gained.
@@smackinmatt All in is different, but the problem is if you start making 'exceptions' there will ALWAYS be players who whine and whine and whine and eventually the rule become corrupted.
I agree with him totally. I delt poker for years. It's getting out of hand with stupid little issues that he brings up. Negranu is actually a really good guy.
You know what else it's not good for poker? GG poker disgusting rake and shitty rakeback for regs, the main poker site in the world tries to get every single penny, can't even leave us preflop pots like any other poker site, but I guess Negreanu really likes that big fat check he gets
Why play there then ? Play on stars
Stars is illegal in my country nowadays gg has a monopoly here@@aarongn8083
@@aarongn8083If only it was that easy, here in the Netherlands they only allow GG. All other poker sites don't have a license. Stars is gone since 2021 here, and I'm sure we're not the only country 😢
I thought he said more rake was good 🧐
Gg poker + wpt global ruined my life
The one chip issue does come up a few times in a location I play at. I have found that when I see a player move chips in (1 or 2 left behind) and not say "All-In" and I say the words "All-In" and not throw my cards up, it has induced a few attitudes from said players.
90% = ALL-IN suggestion doesn't make any sense because if they accept this rule people will just throw in 85% of their chips in order not to go all-in.
But I agree with DNeg about card protectors and face coverings. If you are afraid that you'll give away some tells, just play online, bro. Why have you come to a live event?
While you are correct, the 15% back represents a lot more equity than the single chip back to avoid the bubble. The times the 85% of the stack all in wins, they make much less money. Overtime, this will hurt the players using this strategy.
Yeah. I really disagree with him on the 90% thing. DON'T SHOW CARDS IF NOT ALL IN! That's all!
i think he just wants to ban face coverings because reading people is part of his game. maybe not as big as in the past but i'm sure he still likes to use it.
i also want to say that i don't think it's possible to make poker more watchable for an average person. there is not enough personality in high level tournament poker if we compare it to the wsop 2000s era. everything is too mathematical at this point
I really agree with that. If you need to hide your face completely to not reveal your hand, then you're not a very good player.
He's not wrong, either. The point of live poker is that you get to look a man/woman/whatever in the eye before you make a decision, not to hide under an elaborate disguise so no one can get a read on you because you can't keep it together.
No personality is probably because everyone is hiding
@@maximofernandez196 What? Good players understand the weaknesses in their game and strive to continuously improve on them. If you know you have a very expressive face and take measures to ensure others can't take advantage of that, you're the very definition of a good player.
@@maximofernandez196If that's true, they'll not make it very far even if you can't see any part of them regardless, so it won't really matter in the end. It's annoying, sure, but if you as a poker player are able to annoy your opponent, they're likely to make worse decisions than they would otherwise, and that's a valid strategy.
There are rules and there's etiquette. Rules are specific, but every individual's comfort level with etiquette is a little different. It's tough to make those judgment calls when it comes to what some people think is acceptable or not. I don't really think you can police people's face coverings with rules imo. Daniel had some decent suggestions for how you could potentially approach this as a rule change, but in the long term, the better player wins regardless of what they're wearing. Obviously it's poker and there is certain luck involved, but some kid's hoodie is never going to be why you lost a tournament.
This wasn't in this tweet but Negranau's best idea imo is a continuous chess clock style timer for moves instead if the current clock system.
How would that work? Like a 1-minute increment for each betting situation?
I came across a 95% of stack bet in one of last year's WSOP dailies. It was before the bubble and I determined he didn't want to be put all in which led to me raising and successfully getting him off of a better hand. He didn't make it past the bubble.
Must’ve have 6 high
,,Things that didn't happen for a $100 Alex
@@OneOut1right? Who is gonna put in 95% of their stack just to fold? If they are so scared about the bubble you'd think they wouldn't bet the 95% in the first place...
@@OneOut1 why would anyone say this if it didn't happen? there's no benefit
@@pugsnhogz He's trying to make himself sound good cos he got someone to "fold a better hand" after having 95% of his stack in. I don't believe his story because even fish will not fold those spots.
I've dealt. You can pitch and slide at the same time. Tolt the deck hand downward.
Hes right about most of this, The chip protectors got out of hand. Used to be a chip or small token you would use, now people bring huge items for "LUCK" and set them on the table.
I used card cover because I have had my hand mucked twice by a dealer... Different dealer's. However I do agree with you. I have a metal coin. Not big but you can see it. I agree all this good luck and bring half a bag of stuff and putting it on the table is ridiculous.
Even if I disagree with any of his points, I like that a player with his stature is starting conversations.
5:06 Bro looks like Best Jeanist lmao
I usually hate when ppl commentate over clips rather than just letting the clips speak for themselves. But your insight is great. And the way you structured the video was very entertaining. New sub here 👍
Agree 100% w no face coverings and sunglasses. If you want to hide play online
As much as I think some of these coverings are silly, why should it be a rule? People’s external skills have nothing to do with the game. Can there be a tshirts only rule? I need to be able to see the hairs on people’s arms to pickup tells. Other than confirming a player’s identity and that they don’t have cheating devices, you can’t really tell people to not wear whatever they want.
I think the takeaway from DN here is that poker (like any game with intention to grow) needs to evaluate and adjust for the better of the game. Look at professional sports for an example. Are there any professional sports that haven't implemented change for the better of the game? Even further, those sports have even changed at the amateur level (ex. NFL has multiple changes from protection of the QB to what is deemed a catch. The NHL also has a new icing ruling among many others)... rules like this trickle down to the amateur level. These changes have all been to 1) improve the game and 2) protect those players. Those seem to be the exact 2 reason DN is proposing for these changes. On top of that, didn't the WSOP announce at the begging of the tournament that no devices were technically allowed (if wrong please correct but pretty sure I saw a video announcing this rule)? If so this would seem to be a gray line people are crossing, and with tech growing at such a rapid pace it's certainly only going to hurt the game moving forward.
I think the biggest problem is televising players cards so those that have access study players styles and betting habits from a tv.....the other is long drawn out decisions.....time is necessary to make decisions but some get ridiculous with it. I could care less about card protectors
If you are playing outside like in the WSOP 1997, sunglasses is a must for UV protection!
Using technology while in play at the WSOP was NOT allowed within the rules. Negreanu played a recording that was played at the beginning of every tournament. During the recording it said that any use of solvers within the the tournament area is prohibited and could result in a penalty.
He is absolutely right, i agree with negreanu.
I agree with all of those except the card protector rule. Many important hands have been mucked because of a dealer or player mistake. I remember some main event back in the day where this lady had her hand mucked by the dealer because he thought she was folding, but she wasn't. Definitely need them if you sit in seats 1 or 9.
If we are thinking of the same hand, that poor lady was all in too 😥
And with Aces, she is a french celebrity @@zachschacher6142
So chips or a larger coin? 0 reason to take toys and figures to the table. I get the personalization and fun aspect, but some people's card holders are too big and distracting.
@@fifthtyp3 - Yeah something small and reasonable. Maybe nothing larger than 2”x2”.
I agree with his points except the 90% of stack should be an all-in, that’s a nonsense and is a fair tactic especially if you are about to ladder up to the next pay level
I died listening to Ivey tell a professional dealer how to deal the cards 😂😂😂😂
Look, I don't want to play poker, with an exploded basket of clothes, hiding a human being at a table. The sunglasses can be an issue because they can be like mirrors. A really good player can use the glasses to gain an edge on the players ,next to the one wearing the sunglasses. The high dealing is something the management needs to make sure their dealers never do. The card 'protectors' are just childish. They came about specifically because of television programming. I prefer to see adults playing cards. Well, except when Phil Helmuth explodes.
There were people who won millions in Europe because they could see others' cards from a phone/small camera next to the dealer...there are tools that you can sit next to a marked deck and it instantly tells you who will have what hand. Cheating is real.
If you call, don't show your hand first - that eliminates the angle.
Keating has a nice cabin
If people bring nonsensical card protectors, they could simply regulate them..
Like nothing larger than a card or higher than 2 inches, something like that.
I've seen multiple videos about dealers mucking cards that were still in play...
No card protectors would mean the players have to keep their hands on their cards 100% of the time. That does not seem like something that "would make poker better" imho.
What is the table or the game with Ivey at I want to watch the video of the poker game ???
If you can figure out how I would fit a camera in my challenge coin, which I use as a card protector, go for it.
Someone smarter than you could definitely figure that out brother.
You can't just throw your last chip in all loosey goosey
I wholeheartedly agree with every one of these proposals.
"Knowing the action is the players's responsibility. The dealers will help you as much as they can, but it is ultimately on the player to know what the action is." These are things the floor says at the beginning of every tournament.
If a rule is made to address the tanking issue, then that should fix the new player experience. I've never been to the WSOP, but if I did go and the players at my table were taking at least a minute to make every decision then I definitely wouldn't come back.
in my experience, players bad enough to wear sunglasses are often giving away the biggest tells, which ironically often involve the sunglasses itself
I’ve always felt people taking the sunglasses off and then putting them on after looking at cards can be a giveaway…
…they can reflect your cards too…I’ve seen that live before…
Funny how my #1 thing is players with their phones out during hands.
I recall one time around maybe 12 years ago where I'm in a PLO game with 500-3000 buy ins and some asshole is on his phone immediately after folding and even when he's still in a hand and nobody seems to have a problem with it when I pull the pit boss aside so I just rack up and leave. I recall saying something about how even just revealing what cards you muck in PLO pre-flop to a friend at the table is a huge advantage...
Unless I missed something I dont think any of these turn it into a strategy game for recreationals. Its all pretty straight forward if you agree or not. No excessive face coverings. Only chips and cards on the table. Chess clocks arent rocket science. You hit the clock and it runs and runs out. Holding money back, i dont see anything happening with that. Players just need to pay more attention. The game changes and people adapt
I don't like this "they should be paying more attention" argument.
Would you say the same if I won a few big pots and as I re-stacked my chips I "happened" to put a few high value chips behind the tower of lower denominations? And you bet 100k of your 400k stack thinking I could have no more than 80k or so and I re-raise you all-in, actually having you covered?
I mean, you could have paid more attention to the pots I won and the chips in my stack. You could have asked for a count.
I really don't see how those situations are any different. I've seen some pretty "creative" 1 chip techniques, like "toppling" a stack past the bet line with one chip that looooks like it was part of the toss, but isn't, and is behind the line (and above the amount of the announced bet) and using the cards as a "chip protector" to help hide it. If you were "paying more attention", you'd have noticed both of those moves but that doesn't make them any less scummy.
Agreed with the first 2, a bit confused about the last 2.
I agree about covering the face and eyes. Also using the computer should be illegal.
this opinion should only apply to the high rollers. recs should wear whatever they want
The chess clock is a good idea, but wearing sunglasses is classic poker and shouldn't be banned.
I think he's right about the face covering. A big part of being a pro is having the skill to hide live tells.
The 1 chip strategy is only benefitial due to the bb ante. If there was no bb ante, there would be no problem with it. Very solvable, e.g. you are eligable to the bb ante only for the amount of your stack. I think he is right that it is not really beneficial strategically besides angling (tanking, getting cards shown) - given there is no bb ante. Given the bb ante, it must be a viable strategy
I agree in spirit but I think your proposed rule is untenable. Because what happens when the natural result of a hand is someone being left with 1 chip, like 2 players all in and they cover by 1 chip. Should that player not be eligible for bb ante next hand? Doesn't seem right.
He is eligable, just for the amount that he has. Just like with no ante, you create a side pot for this person's matching stack. So if the bb is 100 and he has 10, the pot he is eligable for is 30, and not 120. @@pugsnhogz
I have no problem with someone wearing sunglasses 😎
Well thats that sorted then 👍🏼
So, i think i understand from a purity stand point. If you want to prevent live reads, then just play online. In a live setting, live facial reads are part of the game. I agree with daniel. You should be able to see the eyes and/or the mouth and throat.
I agree with banning face coverings. I will even go further and ban actions intended to cover the face, such as dipping your head down or pulling up your shirt (it's okay if it's momentarily).
I don't think people should have to have their face in full view all the time, but there's no excitement in a table full of people doing everything they can to make their faces invisible.
A chess clock would lead to much more irrational decision making. If a person knows they have 30 seconds, it gives them enough time to think. A chess clock would make some players run out of time completely. It would be a mess.
I better way to get people to respect everyone’s time would be to incentivize people to save time. Maybe give quicker players extra time banks as their saved time adds up.
Love the chess clock idea. Next we can have Poker Grandmasters!
I've seen cards from dealers at local games where they pitch really high. Gotta be careful....
Haven't seen it all but I definately agree with what I've seen so far.
Been playing pot limit 5/5 since the late 70s. I'm 68.
Reading and hiding tells is a huge part of the game, this should have been a no brainer a long time ago!
Can't you call a clock on a player at any time?
Not in every case. You may want to watch the video before asking questions that get answered during them, or at least go back and delete them after you get your answer.
Great video Alex.
When is part 2 of Gambledore winning in Triton?
Working on it 😅
The goal of tournament is to be last man standing. The means to that end is to maximize your chances within a set of rules.
When a rec player is competing against pros in big tournaments, finding every little advantage can keep you in the game longer. And if I ever find myself facing off against Daniel in a tournament (not likely), you can bet I'm gonna use EVERY advantage I can, including slow play. I don't have the same toolkit a pro does. The amount of hours I can afford to play, and the caliber of players I see are very different than someone at Daniel's level, so we're already at a HUGE disadvantage.
Still, Daniel's not wrong, and every sporting activity will sometimes direct the regulating body to adjust or tighten the rules, for better game play and better experience for spectators.
I just feel everything is already right, let people use the technology or softwares or concelaments to their advantage, you cant monitor every table and every scenario everytime so just for consistency I feel it is easier to let it be what it already is.
Are you serious? So why don't we make all the Olympic Games with no rules? Steroids for everyone. doesn't matter if they only live to 25 but as long as they win. I could tell you're under 25 years old. Of course you go along with the cheat rules.
The host just said why wouldn't the chip leader put the most pressure on smaller stacks. Exactly. Why would a chip leader make a bet of 290k when the opponent has 300 k. Even if it's a 2-1 chip lead they wouldn't just put that person all in within tournament style play the object is to get people out not give people a chip to build from. The host totally contradicts himself unless I misunderstood the hosts explanation. Which is possible
The players giving the most to the poker economy are there for social aspects. Being anti social is bad for the games. Hoodies and face coverings aren’t conducive to social aspects and makes for worse games
I 100% agree with Daniel!! The game needs to be pure
Using a chip as a card protector seems like a reasonable solution.
Everything he said is spot on. Literally all of it
Vogel sang unnecessary tanking destroys the game. This is selfish of him. I played with him before .
What about using a smartphone at the table
For tv, you shouldn't be covered uo. It looks ridiculous. Excessive tanking is a problem as well.
I had a dealer sweep my pair of kings. After I was card dead for 6 hours. Still stings.
not sure how a chess clock would work in poker
Maybe a time bank concept.
I guess it would be virtual or something, because an analogic one would only work in heads-up.
just a stopwatch for each player basically. that counts down only when it's his action. logistically, it would be weird. another thing to carry around.
Lot of dealers with a high pitch out there
from what I understand , it's not leaving a chip behind per say that he sees as the problem, but the stalling they create while doing so. It's annoying to the players and the VIEWERS.
Poker is an ungodly stupid game that is kept stupid because they don't want the losers to clearly understand that they are the meat in the sandwich.
1. Deal everyone the same hands over a long stretch to even out the crap streaks. 2.After someone loses, figure out the odds that they beat and make them forfeit 30% of that amount. 3. Get rid of 2s,3s and 4s. This would wast much less time and get down to business. There are other easy fixes to increase the skill in poker and take out the stupid part. Minimize the effects of sucking out.
Chip and a chair theory in FULL EFFECT here. Doyle would be bothered by Daniel contesting this. It's strategic, especially in Tournaments. Mostly Everything else he suggested I'm in favor for.
as a viewer, not an active player, I have zero interest in watching games where the players are so wrapped up they cannot be seen at all. It would be like watching online games with no cams, dry and boring. If this rule does not change the sport see viewership slack off over time. It is the small things that will erode the sports popularity
As he ages he talks more, what bothers me is the phones delaying the game not paying attention or checking the GTO Wizard who knows. Those guys usually lose money though not focusing on the players traits.
Exactly...those kind of players are absolutel goofballs
So it bothers you, but you also know you're going to take their money? Seems like an easy pay day.
I hope these rules actually get put into place.
Reading your opponents tells is part of the game. If you aren't enough aware and/or in control of your tells, maybe poker isn't your game.
I'm going to have to add on top of all this, the entertainment value is just going down drastically.
I remember when I was a big fan, watching pokerstars with some big names like Negreanu, Hellmuth, Tony G, Phil Laak, Vanessa, Antonio, etc. and there were just great table talk moments.
I have no intention of watching a guy with a hoodie and sunglasses not say a word or make a motion for 2 and a half minutes, there's no entertainment in that.
And the tournament money comes from 2 places: entries, and casino advertisement. With poker being big on tv or streaming sites, that would highly increase advertisement, therefor it's in the games best interest to increase its entertainment value.
Nothing fun about watching EV plays with robot like humans and 0 interaction.
I kinda like the chess clock idea. It would be difficult to implement. Because it drives me nuts when people burn their entire 30 seconds on every hand. If you look down at T5o utg 9 handed just fucking muck it. It doesn't take 30 seconds to figure it out. I dont like the ban chip protector thing. Because i have personally seen a player throw their cards into another players to muck their hand. Its a shitty thing to do, and should have its own reproductions. He says you can use a chip. What if im short stacked and go all in into 2 players. The next to act asks for a count. While im pushing my chips out that player throws his cards into mine. No chips available to be on the cards because they were being counted. My hands were busy so i cant hold them. Now my hand is dead. Absolute best case scenario is they chop that players money between me and the other remaining player. But what if i had the absolute nuts and was very likely to get a call from the remaining player? I just got fucked out of a double up. Its an unlikely scenario but not impossible. For tournaments just check the protection devices for electronics.
Chess clock will be great improvement!!! Tanking is so bad for the game even for professionals cuz they benefit of playing more hands.
I agree with the protectors being off the table personally but it wouldn't stop me from playing one way or the other, as for the glasses or face covering. Whatever the rules are I'm fine with. I am sure there could be tournaments or companies that could create those rules and pay him to join their promotion of tourney and he would draw interest and that would play to his strengths. I also don't care about Tamayo using tech to win, if it's in the rules and someone uses the rules better than an opponent I am fine with that. Being a Rule's Warden pays, if you can do it better than everyone else.
Chris Brewer's response is just the company motto for Activision's COD devs
Alex I also play at MGM national harbor as well myself, I do have to say, at the 1/3 there the sunglasses help. I say this because I imagine you know how most 1/3 players at our card room are, mostly with giving away their tells physically. I’m fairly chatty and outgoing at the table to help me feel more relaxed, but the shades help me not feel terrible about watching what my opponent is doing the whole hand. Most of the players in the 1/3 at MGM (not all card rooms but the small stakes at MGM specifically) give away their tells with their eyes/body language. Without the shades, I’d obviously feel strange blatantly eye-fucking my opponent. In most cases, if shades were banned, I wouldn’t mind and I’d still watch what my opponent is doing, for me it’s more of a comfort thing where no one knows where my eyes are. I do agree though on the “one or the other rule” that’s proposed, with choosing either shades or face-coverings at the table.
Just my two cents regarding the usage of shades.
I totally get that. I've not played much at the table, but sunglasses can certainly help with the awkwardness of how much staring there is in poker.
I agree with the face covering because you could have a ear piece in with someone talking in your ear... Cheating. I guess the card cover thing makes sense but I have used a card cover because I actually have had my hand mucked by a dealer twice! The first time I just wrote it off... Was still upset but fine. The second time by a different dealer... Nope we ain't doing that anymore!
Stop Rustling the Chips
Clicking is Insane
G'day Mate
Do a video on the downfall of HCL
I agree with no face coverings and tanking.i hate both
The unnecessary tanking and hiding behind a mask hoodie and glasses takes the fun out of it for recreational players. Daniel is smart enough to know that recs are needed for the game to survive
Clickbait without even watching the video. Daniel would never say Vogelsang sucks
Anyone who's doesn't think card protectors are needed to protect against dealer error hasn't played in many crappy home games with people dealing from weird angles. I'll admit, I've personally accidentally mucked a player's hand when it was my turn to deal. I've done that twice, actually.
On big feature tables with designated spots for your cards... yeah, probably not needed there.
You can put your chips over the cards to protect them.
Literally...your chips.... your hands. USE THEM.
🤦♂️ just don't leave your cards within dealers reach
it's an interesting comment given that the topic of discussion is expressly not home games
One thing as well, people in Chess are colluding all the time!
He forgot, increase the rake across all games…
People still believe on reading someone or catching “tells”?
😂😂😂 you obv dont play winning live poker... not every brainfart should be posted my guy... 🤦🏻♂️🤡
I used a chip to cover my hand once and the dealer grabbed my cards and placed them into the muck. Had aces.
Uh huh, yeah me too brother.
@ sucks doesn’t it?
Wow when Phil Ivey called that guy short lol I would have been like alright I guess your too tall start pitching the cards like you were. 😂
He’s 100% correct about the chess clock. Everything else he’s just being a grumpy old man.
I am no exploitive player, but the GTO and angles at live tables have gone too far
Using the computer on the rail was NOT within the rules, that's what made that cheating so outrageous. Jonathan Tamayo should have been arrested by Nevada Gaming enforcement agents.
I'm not a huge fan of Daniel but he's correct on this. Everyone is trying to pull off the mask/sunglasses/hoodie combo and it's making the game insufferable. Card protectors are just fun though, old men have a problem with anything that isn't what they would do and having a pokemon toy is an issue to them apparently.
Daniel is thinking for the poker community....you are thinking as a player. Daniel is right
Can we agree that what Daniel wants mostly helps Daniel and not the majority of players?
Screw every single person that covers their face and wears sunglasses, I’ve been calling this bullshit out since 2003
"when 2 players take an action that benefits them and not the others, that's collusion"
>.>
Old man yelling at clouds