Mint also had her own happy ending too. She cultivated such a positive crowd around her that she returned and she too is thriving and in a much better place.
@@Justa_Clipper a little? she literally has imposter syndrome on her imposter syndrome, "am I good enough to have imposter syndrome? I dont want to offend people with actual imposter syndrome" 🤣 But it's okay, her chat got her back. They make fun of her but they will aggressively show their love when she's putting herself down. Her community has always been amazing even during Niji 😎
Michi is an S-tier yapper and I always tune in because she always keeps the conversation going whether it turns unhinged or not. Also her voice is oddly relaxing to listen to so I would usually fall asleep to her streams. She really shines in this new environment because she gets to let loose and truly engage with her audience which is great to see. Also letting loose and engaging with her colleagues in Vshojo is a breath of fresh air from where I used to watch her. Just happy for her.
man, mata’s comment about immigrant families generally being like “if you’re making money, suck it up” hit home because i’ve been thinking about leaving my job for years but only recently has it gotten so bad that telling my immigrant mom about it had her saying “what are you waiting for??”
Yeah that's how it usually is, the best ones want you to find a job that you are happy with. The best people come here to build a new life and give their children a better start than they did.
The fact they abused one of the nicest mom figures. Or bully one of the most collaborative people. Makes me wonder how the remaining nice people like Scarle or Rosemi are doing. TBH in the old company she always seems so reserved. But now she free and happy, she laughing more. Im so happy for her. and NGL i love her new model. A bit creeped out at first but its still a darn good model.
If something is traumatic and you finally find a place and the people who make you feel comfortable and even more, who have gone through somewhat of the same traumatic event you usually open up and talk about it freely. Slowly your brain starts to remember more stuff and you talk about it more. Of course thats not to say that its always the case. Everyone deals with trauma differently but this is what happens in most cases. Hope that helps!! @@sopanhaleng8644
@@sopanhaleng8644 traumatic in a way that you can't believe the good things that's happening to you right now that's why you can't help but end up talking and comparing both experiences, like "I can't believe I thought that was normal" when it's abuse.
I remember after that big first euro trip w/ fox mom and a lot of the boys I was so surprised to find out there was a very vocal group that was hating on her. It was just sad to see how much abuse was being thrown at her and yet felt like little was done to protect her/other talents
As a huge fan of the talent in Nijisanji En, I hated everything about the environment even before Yugo mysteriously left. As they said, the fanbase is so weird. The community and the culture is super weird. The company attitude towards that culture is super weird. I liked watching clips compilation of niji purely because I don't need to interact with the culture.
Bruh, I loved everyone’s interactions. They bounced off each other so well, and it was super fun to watch them having fun. I wish they would have fun in the future
Probably one of the biggest points of this (and applies to anyone who left JP corporate) is that when these people go indie or to a smaller company/viewership, their community is composed of mainly people who are actually fans, not just following since they're part of the same company. These two both talked about (here and "elsewhere") how non-fans of a person would watch them make a joke with a friend, and the fans would be offended by it since they didn't know the person's sense of humor. So sure, they have a smaller fanbase, but they're more supportive and these streamers get more viewership per stream than before.
14:10 im not surprised at all they’re not paying her for anything she still might be owed contractually simply out of spite. It sounds like for Mata it’s not worth going after them, because of course the only motive would be simply out of principle. As much as I’d love to see her get her due just to spite them, good on her and her happiness taking the high road. They’ll reap what they sow eventually once the parasocial fans finally fade away and they’re no longer and the talent pool willing to join dries up. May not be this year, may not be for another 10 years. But one day it’ll happen.
"May not be this year, may not be for another 10 years. But one day it’ll happen." I mean, that's going to happen with every company. Niji will die. Hololive with die. Vshojo will die. Niji going on for another decade is not some victory.
Matara thinking that she was pushy to Michi mean that she hasnt seen a single of her member streams The most chill comment on those streams were "GIRL LEAVE THIS HELLHOLE OF A COMPANY PLEASE!!!"
More like they have tried the waters and didn't get a larger blowback (and honestly Doki kinnda "tanked" most of the Niji attempts quite recently). So they are less afraid Niji is going to attack them now. Notice they still aren't name dropping, which would specificaly be covered by the NDA. Saying "old company" is quite ambiguous and they could always argue they talked hypotheticals or different employer...
I'm more of a VShojo mainstay at this point, but I'm glad to see all three of them acclimate to it and thrive here because VShojo and its core fan community has changed for the better too. I think it's been a boon for everyone involved. Edit: And that they can freely interact with indies, Mint, Quinn, and Doki without any real issue for that matter.
back in the day all i heard were people thought she was toxic in the comments and in twitter but when you look closely to how her friends and coworkers talk to her, they get the jokes and value her and worry a lot about her. if i was 5 years younger i may have joined the bandwagon but experiencing similar to what she experienced, i became a more skeptical person and im proud of that. kinda lonely not being directly in a community though but ill find something for me
@@tsnightmare7097 i was raised to care a lot about what people think, social suicide was worse than death. I wish i had better adults and role models in my life but i didn't. i was born dumb and i learned. that's the way it is
@@sanobunz oh no i get you i have ( yes still have but i am moving out soon ) so many adults in my life who more cared what people though of me then what i felt inside and if the thing i did made me happy or not
Funny how the trauma isn't even exclusive to back room drama. It's also related to the community at large. Toxic shippers, in fighting, etc. _That company_ is the Elephant's Foot of Vtubing.
i was initially just a dog detective fan way back when,,, wasn’t rly a fox mama fan solely because i just didn’t actually check her streams out. i loved when these two would collab because their energies were lovely together and it was clear they found lots of joy in each others’ company. around the last 6 months of kuro’s past career it was so clear to me that he was getting burnt out and frustrated and it hurt my soul when he announced his graduation even though i saw it coming. i’m so happy that he came back and gave it another shot and matara as well. i’m such a huge fan of this silly guy n hearing him so happy just makes me smile because i saw what it was like for him when he genuinely was not. big love to kuro n matara,,, they deserve everything they have now.
The “Matara hates Mint” (old names of course) threads used to have entire novels about why she’s an uncontrollable bully to her. Which now may sound silly, but I can assure you it sounded silly then too because they always interacted this way lol
Having been introduced to Mata through her colabs with Bricky and Ray Narveaz Jr, i never would have figured this is what she went through. Glad they both got out and found their people.
Very happy we are currently living in the good timeline where all the talents that I watched and cared about have left and are much happier for it. As for the ones I used to care about who are still there, I learned how they're really like and haven't even gone to see how they're doing... except for Scarle and Rosemi, hope they're both doing well.
😮y so? Is it stg bad? Sorry im new to the scene... heard things are messy here lol would like to get some context before decided to stan anyone, i just left the kpop fan toxicity n didn't wanna jump into another firehole again
@@xxnowyouseemexx4207 I think they're implying that the specific voice Mata put on for this quote is a hint towards someone from her previous life that Mata used to think she was close with, but ended up finding out that they didn't care as much as she thought. Since Mata left her previous life, I'm pretty sure she doesn't interact with them anymore.
First time I saw her was when she was on Mousey's talkshow and she was holding like a hundred wine glasses and kept adding more. I thought she was awesome. I think that was also one of the longest episodes. She and Mousey kept talking forever and the vibes were great. Never knew she had so many problems at her old company until she started talking about some of it after her redebut at VShojo.
Mousey's show it's amazing because it did the same for me. I got to know a lot of amazing creators through that. The one I liked most is the pikamee one 😭
Holy shit such an eye opener So if what they and Sayu said were true, then the EN management is just a middle management who played it way too safe because they were unsure of what's allowed or not. That the JP management is the one holding real power but unwilling to do anything except anything that makes direct profit (e.g., merchs and shows) One thing I'm still confused of is why they need to convince Michi to leave. Everyone in ID already know that they have no management and only thing left to do there is leave. I'm not blaming anyone, mind you, just wondering why she bothered staying or what held her up there
I think the reason is the fear of starting again... And the comfort and bliss of repeated motions... She started from being indie, kinda grew in NJ... Then the idea of just leaving that all behind can be a scary thing, even when you see the sh*tty stuff happening... And they still have good friends within that company that also made it harder to leave... That kinda gives that "hope" that it could be not as sh*tty and it will be better, even if you have to lie to yourself about it...
I can kind of answer the Michi one and they do discuss it here. Change is scary. You look at your current life and go yeah it sucks my job sucks. But like... It's not the worst and if I quit my job now... I don't have anything lined up so like. Probably better to just stick it out here where at least I know what life is like.
Michi talked about this recently. She didn't have a big group of fans, and she thought that the only thing keeping people watching was the house name, not her. So, when she left, she didn't even know if it was possible to still have a streaming career
@@Justa_Clipperyeah, both Michi and Mint seemed to have really bought into the whole "without the company you're nothing" narrative that was pushed on them. I'm honestly pretty sure that if Mint hadn't met with Kiara, Matara, and the twins when she was in Japan before she came back, she might have never come back. They all helped show her how much she's loved.
@@mrmxypltk Mint had me in tears when she announced that she was going to continue streaming despite her giving an initial time frame earlier in the year. Asking her audience if it was OK, as though anyone would have said no. She seemed so genuinely unsure and it broke my heart that she was ever made to feel that she wasn't worthy of the success she had and that she only had it because some company gave it to her. That any of the talents who've left were made to feel that way just breaks my heart.
Sorry but are we gonna gloss over how mata's still waiting on a percentage of merch sales and litterally said ' i dont think I'll ever receive it' ??? Thats fucking insane
After the selen shit went down, I stopped watching niji because I finally realised how toxic it is at that company behind the scenes. But not long after, I also stopped watching holo. Because the shit hololive fans said and the toxic comparisons they made made me realise the entire idol fandom is just a cesspool of teens and young adults worshiping their oshi like some kind of deity. “Idol culture” is often used as an explanation to justify the toxic feedback loop between those streamers and their fans. I hate that. No one should support “idol culture”.
Don't let fans dictate who you like to watch. Not watching niji is justifiable for all they've done, but not watching hololive cause bad fans exist is just silly if you enjoy the talent. I feel like if the community is so bad that it ends up affecting the talents performance (girls having to constantly yell at chat etc.) That's a good reason, but otherwise who care what some toxic fan thinks.
@@thunderhogTH it’s the fact that “idol” streamers don’t call out those toxic parasocial behaviour and sometimes even subtly nod to it (holostar in particular does it a lot to their female audience) to keep the most hardcore whales happy. It’s the fact that it’s not just fans, it’s a feedback loop. You’d be insane to not get away from that entire circle.
@thunderhogTH nah, you're both right in different ways. Be mindful of which content you consume, but also know that a lot of vtubers do reinforce some of the toxic aspects of the culture and the community in general. This is something that's not just limited to nijen
I used to watch niji before the Selen stuff, and I did not like the comminities there. There were no boundaries being enforced. Now I mainly watch holostars, and tbh i havent noticed any toxic behavior (except for one fandom). But the rest have been lovely and generally accepting and chill. I havent given hololive a try yet because of the fans, and Im not their target audience tbh. I think holostars EN enforce their boundaries well compared to the idol groups. To me holostars EN at least dont hold to that idol culture, they are more like bros hanging out imo.
You know I remember a comment on another video comparing Vshojo to Xavier School for talented youths from the X-men. That quote just keeps aging better as the weeks go by. Now if only we can get Rosemi and Scarle out of there
I don’t get when people say they are happy for the pain struggle and failure my life has been all that but there is never any pay off in the end will I ever get to that point where it’s all worth it
It always seems like there’s no light at the end of the tunnel, that’s normal - but it’s there, in one way or another. As long as you’re true to yourself, all the obstacles and issues you’re facing now will eventually just be things you can look back on and be proud you faced.
I was there when the whole thread and article of Matara Past went down on twitter. It influenced me a lot and i believed it for a while. Especially when she couldn't explain or defend herself back then. That was also the time i slowly pulled back from the fandom of Nijisanji because it was influencing me to be toxic and parasocial. I'm still so embarrassed about that and i guess i still am immature. (I also wonder why my oshi is staying there)
Been a while since I've been active in watching vtubers cause of college stuff and I kinda stopped knowing any updates about them after mom left Niji. Now I'm slowly catching up and here I am watching this vid sobbing •́ ‿ ,•̀
I don't tune it to Kuro so can someone explain why his new outfit looks way different from his original one. Is it even a different outfit or a different character altogether 😭
Made me sad when she said she had to get therapy or when kuro kept saying he had trauma 😢😢😢 was it really that bad 😢😢 i loved niji but I'm so shocked to hear more
I can’t say how the talents of the company act, but I can definitely say the company itself and its fans are not good people. The fans are full of activists and Twitter puritans. They’re hateful and aggressive, they switch on talents at the drop of a dime, and they wish death on people who think differently than them. To top it off, nijisanji caters to fans before talents. They would rather let one of their talents die, than to lose a nickel over a game of chess.
As someone who is just looking into Kuro n Vtubers in genral Wtf is going on, im missing soo much context 😭 Can someome like fill in me abt Kuro n Matara too. And Michi whos she? I feel lost. I think they were part of Nijisanji EN, thats all ik
It's complicated haha. Michi is Michi Mochievee, the lasted Vshojo Member. The context is that all of them were members of Nijisanji EN, where they had a terrible time because of a mixture of bad management and bad fans. Matara got a lot of bulling for the way she interacted with other members, and Kuro got kinda a bad group of female fans (shipping and things like that). Leaving was a painful process, but with the Doki attempt things changed and people started to see the problems within Niji, so they kinda had a redemption even on the eyes of the bad fans. It's complicated, but that's a little sloppy summary
@@smacc3968 I feel bad for asking this. Like prying for things I'm not supposed to, opening an old wound. It feels wrong to do so, cus we need to focus on the present, but how can I truly grasp everything if I don't know where they're coming from. I wanna know their previous name. I just want to do some proper research n understand them more. Kuro was Mysta, so I was able to understand him for the most part (since I wasnt present when shit went down, I just picked up random bits of info here n there, I am sure I'm missing a lot of his story too), but not the girls, I do want to understand them as well.
@@forgotmyname4807 be safe, some people are really mean, if its too much you can take a break. you dont have to know everything. After all it's entertainment and we cannot really completely know what really happened.
its not really popularity, it was the way the company managed and treated them (maybe even other talents, but that's just speculation) that poor treatment and management that lead to a very toxic fanbase, so its not popularities fault.
Is crazy how one of the big things that impacted their happiness is the switch and shift of community, is something I always knew, but it's still crazy, there was too much nasty mean people in the communities, even for some of us was hard to enjoy the good part of the community, and one of things that made me really sad was that a large part of the toxic community migrated to Doki's fandom during the incident 😢, because sadly I enjoy Mata, Michi and Kuro previous "creative endeavors place" communities how are they right now, the same way I enjoy Mata and Kuro's new communities and this good parts of the communities have shown so much support without feeding dramas. Also that part they talked about how previous Michi no matter what new things she could do, the things weren't going to improve because things there either plateu low or high and moving out of any of that is haaaaard, because there's not support from any side, neither the company nor the audience weren't good back then, their advice of leaving and find a new place and audience is the biggest advice they could've give her, right now I'm glad thing are healing in the vtubing community, as long as the people that feeds and create dramas stay out of 4chan, quiet and just giving positive support from a distance things will keep getting better ❤❤
It seems like Doki has been quite successful in controlling her audience I think 🤔. I think both Mata and Kuro has been really good friends to Michi because making her understand what you just said while also not sounding like a negative or pessimistic person is something quite difficult. They help her to not only get out, but to gain a new healthy community
I'm so confused, who's safwan? or is it his accent that's throwing me off? LMAO also all this happened bc EN management sucks I saw a twt saying 'old EN ppl should stop adding fuel to the fire' No they aren't. They have freedom to share their frustrations or experiences so stfu
tbh it sounded like her 😂 but i guess there really wasn't much that anyone can do about it back then.. defending her would mean being dragged down together. sometimes it's the overall environment that's dictating the narrative, and there really is so much individual livers can do, especially when there's literally 0 support from the company (they're the biggest obstacle too even).
Hmm... more Vtuber Ideas coming to my brain. I am definitely juggling a last unicorn inspired OC, that was in the sea along with the other unicorns until freed in the last unicorn movie, and desired to understand why someone would do what was done to them, and intentionally became human, only to still not understand. Unrelated.
I'm aware this seems backwards but I believe kson should return to Hololive. Her audience is shrinking and her vshojo help isn't really helping. Her only JP counterpart has a ton of irl issues going on and nobody else in vshojo seems to be available.
She makes 6 figures doing what she enjoys doing and clearly has no desire to do more idol stuff so why would she want to go back? She's literally in Yakuza games as herself ffs lol
As much as i want this to happen i think she is doing fine. Also towa said that the current hololive will be too much for coco now and iirc its also the knonw reason why aqua leave because hololive is so big now and not focusin on streaming like the old days
Seeing Kuro as a dog pirate is such a throwback man. Remembered watching him when he was indie. Thing really was just a cycle.
It looks god on him!
theres one clip that i'll never forget even if i get dementia and its when he stood in a fountain and screamed: "SQUIRT IT IN MY ASSSSSSSS!!" 😂😂
Mint also had her own happy ending too. She cultivated such a positive crowd around her that she returned and she too is thriving and in a much better place.
Michis great, and she seems so happy right now. She's way more talented than she thinks
She has a little bit of imposter syndrome 😔
@@Justa_Clipper yea she does, but I think alot of that is a carryover from her old job. I think she will get past it eventually
@@Justa_Clipper a little? she literally has imposter syndrome on her imposter syndrome, "am I good enough to have imposter syndrome? I dont want to offend people with actual imposter syndrome" 🤣
But it's okay, her chat got her back. They make fun of her but they will aggressively show their love when she's putting herself down. Her community has always been amazing even during Niji 😎
Michi is an S-tier yapper and I always tune in because she always keeps the conversation going whether it turns unhinged or not. Also her voice is oddly relaxing to listen to so I would usually fall asleep to her streams. She really shines in this new environment because she gets to let loose and truly engage with her audience which is great to see. Also letting loose and engaging with her colleagues in Vshojo is a breath of fresh air from where I used to watch her. Just happy for her.
man, mata’s comment about immigrant families generally being like “if you’re making money, suck it up” hit home because i’ve been thinking about leaving my job for years but only recently has it gotten so bad that telling my immigrant mom about it had her saying “what are you waiting for??”
I hope you find a better job situation 💚
Yeah that's how it usually is, the best ones want you to find a job that you are happy with. The best people come here to build a new life and give their children a better start than they did.
The fact they abused one of the nicest mom figures. Or bully one of the most collaborative people. Makes me wonder how the remaining nice people like Scarle or Rosemi are doing. TBH in the old company she always seems so reserved. But now she free and happy, she laughing more. Im so happy for her. and NGL i love her new model. A bit creeped out at first but its still a darn good model.
The cockroach approach was unexpected, right?
I will always love the fox model more. Specially the I wanna say second outfit she had. BUT I do think the roach mom model REALLY REALLY grew on me.
Idk bout wosemibut scarle generally doing her own thing now and rarely collab with anyone anymore
@@barubary218 Her new outfit is amazing!
I honestly got into vtubers through matara, only because of the cockroach model.. I absolutely love it. No regrets!
I'm so happy for them that they left that place.
This was a lovely talk. I'm gonna go back and watch the whole vod.
The whole talk was like 4 hours long, so I really recommended it!!
Is it on yt yet
God.. i feel so happy for them. They're so much happier now, it even makes me emotional for them.
You should watch Michi's reaction to this conversation, it was really heartwarming
Mind posting that? Can't find it anywhere. @@Justa_Clipper
@@Justa_Clipper where can we see it ?
@@ysbrann3059 It's on Racoonclips channel, here's a link: th-cam.com/video/X90fTPzYKl0/w-d-xo.html
Hope it helps!
@@Justa_Clipper thx you !
The fact that they're STILL discussing the topic says a lot about how traumatizing Niji experience was...
Just asking, if it's a traumatic experience why would they still talk about it? Wouldn't you want to avoid the topic?
If something is traumatic and you finally find a place and the people who make you feel comfortable and even more, who have gone through somewhat of the same traumatic event you usually open up and talk about it freely. Slowly your brain starts to remember more stuff and you talk about it more. Of course thats not to say that its always the case. Everyone deals with trauma differently but this is what happens in most cases. Hope that helps!! @@sopanhaleng8644
@@sopanhaleng8644 traumatic in a way that you can't believe the good things that's happening to you right now that's why you can't help but end up talking and comparing both experiences, like "I can't believe I thought that was normal" when it's abuse.
@@Konpikopon oh okay, thank you for this as I was a bit confused
@sopanhaleng8644 It's kinda a way of moving on and being comfortable with it without letting it fester into something at least that's how I see it
I remember after that big first euro trip w/ fox mom and a lot of the boys I was so surprised to find out there was a very vocal group that was hating on her. It was just sad to see how much abuse was being thrown at her and yet felt like little was done to protect her/other talents
"Michi, you either leave that guy or I'm dragging you away for your own good"
Really good comparison
I'm so happy not only for kuro and matara but also to mint,matara, kuro,michi as well as U san and Doki
Soon Victoria as well
As a huge fan of the talent in Nijisanji En, I hated everything about the environment even before Yugo mysteriously left. As they said, the fanbase is so weird. The community and the culture is super weird. The company attitude towards that culture is super weird. I liked watching clips compilation of niji purely because I don't need to interact with the culture.
Talents are weird too brother,let's not forget to mention 'em
@@braken63 we dont know that
@@ninicazb1 we do. Are the clique or Vox a joke to you?
@@braken63 there is no "the clique" matara literally met up with them this year dummy
@@ninicazb1 so?That means nothing to the existence of the clique,Matara is not involved in that matter.
Bruh, I loved everyone’s interactions. They bounced off each other so well, and it was super fun to watch them having fun. I wish they would have fun in the future
Probably one of the biggest points of this (and applies to anyone who left JP corporate) is that when these people go indie or to a smaller company/viewership, their community is composed of mainly people who are actually fans, not just following since they're part of the same company.
These two both talked about (here and "elsewhere") how non-fans of a person would watch them make a joke with a friend, and the fans would be offended by it since they didn't know the person's sense of humor.
So sure, they have a smaller fanbase, but they're more supportive and these streamers get more viewership per stream than before.
"Apologize for the wrong things"
When you realize It was crazy back then...
14:10 im not surprised at all they’re not paying her for anything she still might be owed contractually simply out of spite. It sounds like for Mata it’s not worth going after them, because of course the only motive would be simply out of principle. As much as I’d love to see her get her due just to spite them, good on her and her happiness taking the high road.
They’ll reap what they sow eventually once the parasocial fans finally fade away and they’re no longer and the talent pool willing to join dries up. May not be this year, may not be for another 10 years. But one day it’ll happen.
I think it's just something that shows how little they care for their employees. Completely unnecessary
If it's merch sales, it probably amounts to like $20. Remember, talents only got 2%
@@TheKyrix82 i think the merch of a graduated talent would sell really good, so probably good money
@Justa_Clipper She gets 2 cents for every dollar, and a LOT of Niji fans hated Nina
"May not be this year, may not be for another 10 years. But one day it’ll happen."
I mean, that's going to happen with every company. Niji will die. Hololive with die. Vshojo will die. Niji going on for another decade is not some victory.
I am really glad they are both happy now ❤
Michi as well :)
Matara thinking that she was pushy to Michi mean that she hasnt seen a single of her member streams
The most chill comment on those streams were "GIRL LEAVE THIS HELLHOLE OF A COMPANY PLEASE!!!"
Really? omg haha
Your daily reminder of the fact that in many ways, we are currently locked in to the Good Ending route, this is the good timeline.
That's because they both rock, love her attitude and openness
guys i think their NDA expired.
all jokes aside, glad they are enjoying themselves again.
More like they have tried the waters and didn't get a larger blowback (and honestly Doki kinnda "tanked" most of the Niji attempts quite recently). So they are less afraid Niji is going to attack them now.
Notice they still aren't name dropping, which would specificaly be covered by the NDA. Saying "old company" is quite ambiguous and they could always argue they talked hypotheticals or different employer...
I hope Matara would become our next Sidorovich
I'm more of a VShojo mainstay at this point, but I'm glad to see all three of them acclimate to it and thrive here because VShojo and its core fan community has changed for the better too. I think it's been a boon for everyone involved.
Edit: And that they can freely interact with indies, Mint, Quinn, and Doki without any real issue for that matter.
It is impressive how they give them liberty to collab with whoever they want
back in the day all i heard were people thought she was toxic in the comments and in twitter but when you look closely to how her friends and coworkers talk to her, they get the jokes and value her and worry a lot about her. if i was 5 years younger i may have joined the bandwagon but experiencing similar to what she experienced, i became a more skeptical person and im proud of that. kinda lonely not being directly in a community though but ill find something for me
Its creazy that getting thou bad things makes you skeptical of other peoples intencions
@@tsnightmare7097 i was raised to care a lot about what people think, social suicide was worse than death. I wish i had better adults and role models in my life but i didn't. i was born dumb and i learned. that's the way it is
@@sanobunz oh no i get you i have ( yes still have but i am moving out soon ) so many adults in my life who more cared what people though of me then what i felt inside and if the thing i did made me happy or not
@@tsnightmare7097 oh sorry about that. but i hope we both find what makes us truly happy
Funny how the trauma isn't even exclusive to back room drama. It's also related to the community at large. Toxic shippers, in fighting, etc. _That company_ is the Elephant's Foot of Vtubing.
i was initially just a dog detective fan way back when,,, wasn’t rly a fox mama fan solely because i just didn’t actually check her streams out. i loved when these two would collab because their energies were lovely together and it was clear they found lots of joy in each others’ company. around the last 6 months of kuro’s past career it was so clear to me that he was getting burnt out and frustrated and it hurt my soul when he announced his graduation even though i saw it coming. i’m so happy that he came back and gave it another shot and matara as well. i’m such a huge fan of this silly guy n hearing him so happy just makes me smile because i saw what it was like for him when he genuinely was not. big love to kuro n matara,,, they deserve everything they have now.
thanks for clippin this!
Im not familiar with twitch n havent actively look up them, yet so glade to see that they are doin great 😌
❤️🖤💛
The “Matara hates Mint” (old names of course) threads used to have entire novels about why she’s an uncontrollable bully to her.
Which now may sound silly, but I can assure you it sounded silly then too because they always interacted this way lol
I remember those. I would read them and be like "you guys know its a bit right?"
@@MOONWOLF7395Mata and Mint are, for lack of a better term, guy friends. They're bros with estrogen
They would literally collab and have incredible energy. How could someone watch that and not get it?
@@brningpyre because those people don't actually have friends. Just people they talk to online.
I didn't know about this... it sounds insane tbh
I like pirate kuro
I love this design ❤️❤️
what's old is new again
it really is a great design for him though
Pirate Kuro feels somehow waaaaaaay more relaxed, like he found a bit of freedom and he is enjoying the shit out of it.
He is on his Luffy's phase XD
I'm glad they're with us in Vshojo. They've all been such wonderful additions
This is my favorite model ever. Pirate Kuro looks so fire.
It's amazing! He looks really good, and the detailed background is a plus
Having been introduced to Mata through her colabs with Bricky and Ray Narveaz Jr, i never would have figured this is what she went through. Glad they both got out and found their people.
Her relationship with Bricky is wholesome. A nice friendship for mata :)
its so interesting to learn that Michi used to do fashion design! i never couldve guessed
She does analysis of fashion on her streams every now and then
@@Justa_Clipper that's so cool! I didn't know
and shes the girl that using a damn DICK as her earring KSON vouch for it xD
Very happy we are currently living in the good timeline where all the talents that I watched and cared about have left and are much happier for it. As for the ones I used to care about who are still there, I learned how they're really like and haven't even gone to see how they're doing... except for Scarle and Rosemi, hope they're both doing well.
I agree.. I used to adore Ike but I saw that black screen stream and was like no f/// you. F/// all of you. 😂
So that's why Mochi was so weirdly determined to leave,
Good on you for helping her.
Kuro back at being a pirate
I can't help but be nice to Michi because she is AWESOME!!!!
Michi is a sweet sweet girl
her getting "sorry that sucks *hehe*, anyway, wanna collab?" from her old "friends" is WILD
Disappointed, but not surprised
29:02 that… is definitely a choice of voice to put on
😮y so? Is it stg bad? Sorry im new to the scene... heard things are messy here lol would like to get some context before decided to stan anyone, i just left the kpop fan toxicity n didn't wanna jump into another firehole again
@@xxnowyouseemexx4207because that voice sounds awfully familiar to someone from her previous job
@@xxnowyouseemexx4207 I think they're implying that the specific voice Mata put on for this quote is a hint towards someone from her previous life that Mata used to think she was close with, but ended up finding out that they didn't care as much as she thought. Since Mata left her previous life, I'm pretty sure she doesn't interact with them anymore.
it was so evident when she did the voice lmao she sounds cute with it tho
First time I saw her was when she was on Mousey's talkshow and she was holding like a hundred wine glasses and kept adding more. I thought she was awesome. I think that was also one of the longest episodes. She and Mousey kept talking forever and the vibes were great. Never knew she had so many problems at her old company until she started talking about some of it after her redebut at VShojo.
Mousey's show it's amazing because it did the same for me. I got to know a lot of amazing creators through that. The one I liked most is the pikamee one 😭
Holy shit such an eye opener
So if what they and Sayu said were true, then the EN management is just a middle management who played it way too safe because they were unsure of what's allowed or not. That the JP management is the one holding real power but unwilling to do anything except anything that makes direct profit (e.g., merchs and shows)
One thing I'm still confused of is why they need to convince Michi to leave. Everyone in ID already know that they have no management and only thing left to do there is leave. I'm not blaming anyone, mind you, just wondering why she bothered staying or what held her up there
I think the reason is the fear of starting again... And the comfort and bliss of repeated motions...
She started from being indie, kinda grew in NJ... Then the idea of just leaving that all behind can be a scary thing, even when you see the sh*tty stuff happening...
And they still have good friends within that company that also made it harder to leave... That kinda gives that "hope" that it could be not as sh*tty and it will be better, even if you have to lie to yourself about it...
I can kind of answer the Michi one and they do discuss it here. Change is scary. You look at your current life and go yeah it sucks my job sucks. But like... It's not the worst and if I quit my job now... I don't have anything lined up so like. Probably better to just stick it out here where at least I know what life is like.
Michi talked about this recently. She didn't have a big group of fans, and she thought that the only thing keeping people watching was the house name, not her. So, when she left, she didn't even know if it was possible to still have a streaming career
@@Justa_Clipperyeah, both Michi and Mint seemed to have really bought into the whole "without the company you're nothing" narrative that was pushed on them. I'm honestly pretty sure that if Mint hadn't met with Kiara, Matara, and the twins when she was in Japan before she came back, she might have never come back. They all helped show her how much she's loved.
@@mrmxypltk Mint had me in tears when she announced that she was going to continue streaming despite her giving an initial time frame earlier in the year. Asking her audience if it was OK, as though anyone would have said no. She seemed so genuinely unsure and it broke my heart that she was ever made to feel that she wasn't worthy of the success she had and that she only had it because some company gave it to her.
That any of the talents who've left were made to feel that way just breaks my heart.
Sorry but are we gonna gloss over how mata's still waiting on a percentage of merch sales and litterally said ' i dont think I'll ever receive it' ??? Thats fucking insane
Mint said that she didn't receive a lot of fan mail, so at this point nothing can surprise me really :(
After the selen shit went down, I stopped watching niji because I finally realised how toxic it is at that company behind the scenes. But not long after, I also stopped watching holo. Because the shit hololive fans said and the toxic comparisons they made made me realise the entire idol fandom is just a cesspool of teens and young adults worshiping their oshi like some kind of deity. “Idol culture” is often used as an explanation to justify the toxic feedback loop between those streamers and their fans. I hate that. No one should support “idol culture”.
Don't let fans dictate who you like to watch. Not watching niji is justifiable for all they've done, but not watching hololive cause bad fans exist is just silly if you enjoy the talent. I feel like if the community is so bad that it ends up affecting the talents performance (girls having to constantly yell at chat etc.) That's a good reason, but otherwise who care what some toxic fan thinks.
@@thunderhogTH it’s the fact that “idol” streamers don’t call out those toxic parasocial behaviour and sometimes even subtly nod to it (holostar in particular does it a lot to their female audience) to keep the most hardcore whales happy. It’s the fact that it’s not just fans, it’s a feedback loop. You’d be insane to not get away from that entire circle.
@Ballacha well thats a case of the streamer showing toxic tendencies, so im that sense im not wrong in my statement.
@thunderhogTH nah, you're both right in different ways. Be mindful of which content you consume, but also know that a lot of vtubers do reinforce some of the toxic aspects of the culture and the community in general. This is something that's not just limited to nijen
I used to watch niji before the Selen stuff, and I did not like the comminities there. There were no boundaries being enforced. Now I mainly watch holostars, and tbh i havent noticed any toxic behavior (except for one fandom). But the rest have been lovely and generally accepting and chill. I havent given hololive a try yet because of the fans, and Im not their target audience tbh. I think holostars EN enforce their boundaries well compared to the idol groups. To me holostars EN at least dont hold to that idol culture, they are more like bros hanging out imo.
love kuro's pirate model
Is so good!!
You know I remember a comment on another video comparing Vshojo to Xavier School for talented youths from the X-men.
That quote just keeps aging better as the weeks go by.
Now if only we can get Rosemi and Scarle out of there
Bizarre that Rosemi is still there
I imagine she's too nervous to rock the boat anymore than it has been. @@Justa_Clipper
@@dracotias that's a shame :/
Can we include Petra Gurin too?
@@dracotias bro the boat is flipped like the black pearl in “at world’s end”. The kraken could do more damage to but riku did the job for it
I don’t get when people say they are happy for the pain struggle and failure my life has been all that but there is never any pay off in the end will I ever get to that point where it’s all worth it
It always seems like there’s no light at the end of the tunnel, that’s normal - but it’s there, in one way or another.
As long as you’re true to yourself, all the obstacles and issues you’re facing now will eventually just be things you can look back on and be proud you faced.
I was there when the whole thread and article of Matara Past went down on twitter. It influenced me a lot and i believed it for a while. Especially when she couldn't explain or defend herself back then. That was also the time i slowly pulled back from the fandom of Nijisanji because it was influencing me to be toxic and parasocial. I'm still so embarrassed about that and i guess i still am immature. (I also wonder why my oshi is staying there)
Who's your oshi? i think elira has kinda kill her career with the Doki video.... i hope still that rosemi gets out :(
Been a while since I've been active in watching vtubers cause of college stuff and I kinda stopped knowing any updates about them after mom left Niji. Now I'm slowly catching up and here I am watching this vid sobbing •́ ‿ ,•̀
Mata talks every now and then about it, and it seems like it was a painful experience :( it's good they are better now
"wE aRe BeTtEr"
No, I'm not mocking the livers.
I'm mocking y'all
Nijisister
Most nijji livers probably have the same mindset about their viewers tbh
I don't tune it to Kuro so can someone explain why his new outfit looks way different from his original one. Is it even a different outfit or a different character altogether 😭
th-cam.com/users/livegsG53AIcizM?si=Txam8vqXFH-bcUDl here, watch the lore video on the outfit review stream! It explains the changes
Made me sad when she said she had to get therapy or when kuro kept saying he had trauma 😢😢😢 was it really that bad 😢😢 i loved niji but I'm so shocked to hear more
It seems like Mata had a really rough time :( but she's better now
Why is the original clip the on for her reacting to the kson
What do you mean?
@@Justa_Clipperin the description its her reacting to reacting zen reacting reacting to kson instead of this vod-
I never knew people didn't like her
They kinda hated her, absolutely stupid
thats because the parasocial nijifans were being psychotic especially when she collabs with the men like kuro who is her friend even behind the screen
This vid is so "Put me in the video, Parrot"
I’m confused who’s saph 1?
I can’t say how the talents of the company act, but I can definitely say the company itself and its fans are not good people. The fans are full of activists and Twitter puritans. They’re hateful and aggressive, they switch on talents at the drop of a dime, and they wish death on people who think differently than them. To top it off, nijisanji caters to fans before talents. They would rather let one of their talents die, than to lose a nickel over a game of chess.
saying this as if you can’t apply this to every other vtuber company and its fanbase be for real. grasping for straws atp
Who's safwon are they talking about michi?
That's an artists and Kuro's friend
anyone knows who's the vt with a limp that they mention?
😂 cycle will come back dont worried. 🎉
As someone who is just looking into Kuro n Vtubers in genral
Wtf is going on, im missing soo much context 😭
Can someome like fill in me abt Kuro n Matara too. And Michi whos she? I feel lost.
I think they were part of Nijisanji EN, thats all ik
It's complicated haha. Michi is Michi Mochievee, the lasted Vshojo Member. The context is that all of them were members of Nijisanji EN, where they had a terrible time because of a mixture of bad management and bad fans. Matara got a lot of bulling for the way she interacted with other members, and Kuro got kinda a bad group of female fans (shipping and things like that). Leaving was a painful process, but with the Doki attempt things changed and people started to see the problems within Niji, so they kinda had a redemption even on the eyes of the bad fans. It's complicated, but that's a little sloppy summary
Michi was ID btw, what more do you wanna know? can you be a little more specific
@@smacc3968 I feel bad for asking this. Like prying for things I'm not supposed to, opening an old wound. It feels wrong to do so, cus we need to focus on the present, but how can I truly grasp everything if I don't know where they're coming from.
I wanna know their previous name. I just want to do some proper research n understand them more.
Kuro was Mysta, so I was able to understand him for the most part (since I wasnt present when shit went down, I just picked up random bits of info here n there, I am sure I'm missing a lot of his story too), but not the girls, I do want to understand them as well.
@@forgotmyname4807 It's ok, don't worry. Michi was Mika Melatika and Matara was Nina Kosaka
@@forgotmyname4807 be safe, some people are really mean, if its too much you can take a break. you dont have to know everything. After all it's entertainment and we cannot really completely know what really happened.
Popularity comes with a price. Kuro might regret a lot of things, but I'm sure he doesn't regret the house he got to buy for his mom
its not really popularity, it was the way the company managed and treated them (maybe even other talents, but that's just speculation) that poor treatment and management that lead to a very toxic fanbase, so its not popularities fault.
Is crazy how one of the big things that impacted their happiness is the switch and shift of community, is something I always knew, but it's still crazy, there was too much nasty mean people in the communities, even for some of us was hard to enjoy the good part of the community, and one of things that made me really sad was that a large part of the toxic community migrated to Doki's fandom during the incident 😢, because sadly I enjoy Mata, Michi and Kuro previous "creative endeavors place" communities how are they right now, the same way I enjoy Mata and Kuro's new communities and this good parts of the communities have shown so much support without feeding dramas. Also that part they talked about how previous Michi no matter what new things she could do, the things weren't going to improve because things there either plateu low or high and moving out of any of that is haaaaard, because there's not support from any side, neither the company nor the audience weren't good back then, their advice of leaving and find a new place and audience is the biggest advice they could've give her, right now I'm glad thing are healing in the vtubing community, as long as the people that feeds and create dramas stay out of 4chan, quiet and just giving positive support from a distance things will keep getting better ❤❤
It seems like Doki has been quite successful in controlling her audience I think 🤔. I think both Mata and Kuro has been really good friends to Michi because making her understand what you just said while also not sounding like a negative or pessimistic person is something quite difficult. They help her to not only get out, but to gain a new healthy community
I'm so confused, who's safwan? or is it his accent that's throwing me off? LMAO
also all this happened bc EN management sucks
I saw a twt saying 'old EN ppl should stop adding fuel to the fire' No they aren't. They have freedom to share their frustrations or experiences so stfu
saffwon is one of kuro's longtime close friends and does a lot of art for him! (e.g. his lore videos and model concept art). she's really cool!
@@stephie-ku ohhh really is that her username??
Please tell me enna is not one of the bullies im so nervous
tbh it sounded like her 😂 but i guess there really wasn't much that anyone can do about it back then.. defending her would mean being dragged down together. sometimes it's the overall environment that's dictating the narrative, and there really is so much individual livers can do, especially when there's literally 0 support from the company (they're the biggest obstacle too even).
Hmm... more Vtuber Ideas coming to my brain.
I am definitely juggling a last unicorn inspired OC, that was in the sea along with the other unicorns until freed in the last unicorn movie, and desired to understand why someone would do what was done to them, and intentionally became human, only to still not understand.
Unrelated.
"Filth and Lies!!" -Niji-sisters. Probably? No. Definitely would say that.
vShoujo, the Asylum for NijiEN refugees
God bless the both of them and everyone else (except Kyo, fuck Kyo) who got out of there.
Hopefully everyone escape s one day (except for the clique)
why fuck him?
"the clique" is a fanfiction, matara literally met them this year
Wtf did kyo do???
@@spaciousdawggseriously, I wish people wouldn't just assume that everyone else knew their gossip.
“The clique” ok grandma lets get you to bed!
I'm aware this seems backwards but I believe kson should return to Hololive. Her audience is shrinking and her vshojo help isn't really helping. Her only JP counterpart has a ton of irl issues going on and nobody else in vshojo seems to be available.
Why are you bringing this up here exactly?
She makes 6 figures doing what she enjoys doing and clearly has no desire to do more idol stuff so why would she want to go back? She's literally in Yakuza games as herself ffs lol
Kson is able to express herself the way she wants to, smaller audience doesn't mean unfulfilled goals she aims to achieve
She literally collabed with Michi earlier today.
As much as i want this to happen i think she is doing fine. Also towa said that the current hololive will be too much for coco now and iirc its also the knonw reason why aqua leave because hololive is so big now and not focusin on streaming like the old days