If he was serious, Gotenks would annihilate Kid Buu. Unfortunately, he would probably mess around for a bit, giving Buu enough time to blow up the planet, killing Gotenks in the process.
Pretty much, or get turned into candy or get absorbed again. Despite seeing how durable and regenerative Buu is, multiple times, Gotenks kept wasting stamina on stupid techniques to try and showboat. The Galactica Donut obviously has no effect on Buu, but he kept doing it anyway. In the manga, Kid Buu was attempting to turn Goku into candy in one of the panels, Gotenks would have fallen for it.
Even if he was serious, Kid Buu especially has crazy regen and stamina, while SSJ3 Gotenks' biggest weakness (other than his attitude) is his lack of stamina. He might be able to do it, but I'm not sure.
@@CPhelps1247 1. I don’t think he could hold his breath for the necessary amount of time, 2. I highly doubt Gotenks knows where New Namek is in the first place
I do appreciate the line “I bet Piccolo’s in there slowing you down,” making it clear that it’s not that Piccolo’s power wouldn’t be a boost to Buu, but that Piccolo is actively doing everything he can to resist from the inside. Piccolo once again clutching out an important play that gets canceled by the Saiyan’s stupidity.
I love the small details Toriyama incorporated in the buu saga. Gotenks is childish and loves to make things a spectacle. He is focused on silly techniques and the funny poses he likely takes from observing saiyaman (Gohan) who got his hero poses directly from the Ginyu Force. This dynamic is hilariously highlighted in Fighterz.
I have been telling these fools that gotenks would stomp kid buu big ups to laughingstock media for breaking it down next time do kid buu vs the original fat buu that came out of the cocoon that match up would be more interesting than this
I wonder if there's some kinda sentai show in their universe, the great saiya man is absolutely inspired by that and I like to think Gohan was inspired by the comics he was reading
In terms of strength, Gotenks positively violates. If Gotenks is hypothetically bloodlusted and has his eyes solely on the prize, he'd annihilate Kid Buu. He was about to kill Super Buu, after all. Unfortunately, this is *Gotenks* we're talking about, and Gotenks beats nobody. Goten has a higher win-rate than him.
@@longlivetheblackmamba2-8-24 He also got violated by Copy Vegeta. I hate that arc as much as the next guy, but it's canon to the anime. I like Gotenks a lot, but they never give him a dub. To his credit, he did defeat Hirudegarn's first form.
@@longlivetheblackmamba2-8-24 Ohh. Then yeah, you're right. He only fought against Fat and Super Buu, but that's all they could really give him during that saga. I think Toriyama thought ahead and saw that a team of Gotenks, Gohan, Vegeta, Goku, and Buu would make the final battle too easy
Agreed. Even when I know the answer myself I still love to listen to him carefully explain the answers in such detail. Great content. It's a shame Super isn't really nuanced enough to give us interesting DB content
Great video! I think you covered almost everything you could. One of the arguments I hear for why Gotenks couldn't beat Kid Buu is how Goku's reaction to the prospect of Gotenks and Gohan coming to fight Kid Buu was kind of nonchalant compared to his reaction to the prospect of Buucolo vs Gohan.
As soon as Gotenks breaks himself and Piccolo out of the room, he tells Super Buu to die because he’s ate everyone and attacks him. He couldn’t harm Buu. Needed Piccolo’s assistance. And admitted that he couldn’t weaken Buu physically. Buu’s Ki never diminished. Thus never took damage. And Toriyama illustrated Gotenks with Pinocchio’s lying nose when Gotenks said he was the strongest.
1. Buu was def afraid when gotenks was about to blast him before defusing, AND gotenks had him on the ropes. 2. Piccolo assisted ONLY with the volleyball gimmick 3. Essentially all of the buus, yes all, have near infinite stores of stamina (no statements or signs of fatigue from any buus across all the fights) except ONLY when vegeta remarks when fat buu fought kid buu 4. Gotenks almost certainly throughout the entire story is a gag character so not sure what this point is supposed to prove? It’s prettt clear in the fight gotenks is relative to super buu
He could harm buu, he just couldn't keep the damage done to stick over time. Same with Buuhan vs Vegeto, we see Buuhan get wreaked and then after a brief period he's back to full if given the time. It's also why goku couldn't hurt fat buu or kid buu, goku didn't have the power to make any lasting damage before they'd heal up.
@@everettjohnson9374 Kid Buu’s Ki signature never dropped vs Goku, meaning Goku never damaged Kid Buu. Vegetto permanently destroyed Buuhan’s head tentacle, which couldn’t be regenerated and had to be regrown from the rest of his body. Meanwhile, Super Buu could regenerate from ash/smoke vs Gotenks. And Kid Buu could regenerate from nothing vs his own Ki blast, and from nothingness from Vegeta’s barrage of Ki blasts.
When you mentioned the size & power requirements for fusion it just reminded me about the constant height fluctuations in Dragon ball , because Vegeta was nowhere near the height of Goku which makes me wonder what does Toriyama mean by "similar size"
Ssj2 pre majin should be at cell as he seemed to hold himself above ssj2 gohan who was more or less a rival to dabura who they held at about the same lvl as cell and then said they underestimated him a bit and they still think they could win As for super janemba I don't know I want to say super janemba based on the fact he was bullying ssj3 Goku and ssj2 Vegeta but Gohan could do the same and that's only if you assume the gokus are equal
I love the drawings you use in the thumbnails. The one of Gotenks here is awesome but I would've loved to have seen him as a SSJ3 in this art style for your thumbnail considering the title. As for the topic, it's a shame we never really see Gotenks as a SSJ3 or Kid Buy go all out as Gotenks was messing around (+ Buu was stalling for Gohan) and it didn't look like Kid Buu was taking his fight with SSJ3 Goku that serious either.
Great video as always. Myself I say no Kid Buu wins the fight. Because telling Gotenks not to play around is very tough if not impossible and I'll give you that Kid Buu is weaker than Super Buu if not Buu's absorbed forms, so doubtful Gotenks wouldn't play around. But let's say Gotenks goes round two on the Kai's world, I still say no. Because Goku realized to me not only is Kid Buu far more powerful than almost anyone they had faced, but he can't be reasoned with like others, he has no desires of his own so he can't be tricked, and his stamina and regeneration are through the roof. Because even when Vegeta who pulled no punches against Majin Buu realized I have to use the Final Explosion it's strong enough to reduce him to shreds but Buu still got up, and when the Super Ghost Kamikaze attack was used on Super Buu that turned him to shreds and the shreds were reduced to ash if not smoke yet he still came back. The only attack that seemed to work was the Spirit Bomb, now whether that was do to magical or harnessing the good if not souls of all living things, or if at full power it's just that strong, does change the Spirit Bomb was the only thing to keep Buu down for good. So Gotenks doesn't have an attack that vould do that even if he tried a kamehameha I doubt it would far better than a super ghost attack. Also stamina Buu would have greater stamina than a full power SS3 Gotenks. Buu ironically takes the best aspects of all the major villains in DBZ, the overwhelming power of Freiza, Cell, and the Androids, but he also has the stamina of the Androids were he power doesn't really seem to go down, and he has Cell's regeneration to come back from pretty much anything but never looses stamina when regenerating. No matter the time Gotenks is Trunks vs Cell a less experienced fighter that wouldn't be able to put all this together in enough time to win, let alone having an attack to seal the deal.
That’s actually a good debate. That Gohan should be around Buu Saga Vegeta as ss2. Gotebks should clap him but that Gohan has also been freshly trained by Goku…definitely a good one. But Kid Buu washing Gotenks and it ain’t even close imo
I made two assumptions. Pre-ROSAT Gotenks because Post-ROSAT Gotenks is OBVIOUSLY clappin 11 year old Gohan. Assumption 2: they meant ss2 Gohan. Gotenks disnt do that hot against Fat Buu before the Time Chamber. Ss2 11 year old Gohan coulda been stronger. Gotenks doesn’t show us he’s on ss3 Goku’s level until after the chamber.
@@maniacslap1623 I would argue that Goku and Vegeta were stronger as SSJ2 during Boo Saga than Gohan SSJ 2 during Cell Saga BUT Vegeta was around 40 and Gohan 12 sooooooo....
I always wanted to see Gotenks fight in SS2 form. It wouldn't burn out his fusion as fast, and he would still be extremely powerful. Twice as strong as his SS1-self but a quarter of his SS3-self.
@@JayKay-on2gr think you’re right. Idk where, but I heard that apparently he thought ssj3 was ssj2 and so just completely forgot about the actual ssj2. Don’t quote me on that tho, might just be something fans made up
it's easy if we take feats instead of statements, elder kai and shin add so much unneeded nonsense, they hype up kid buu like he's stronger than buuhan, when clearly he isn't. everytime they open their mouths they add more confusion to the situation.
They actually downplay Kid Buu power wise. The Kai’s and the saiyans. They all underestimate Kid Buu lol Also, they make multiple statements about the Fat Kai calming Buu’s soul when in fact, the feat of sealing someone that wasn’t capable of being sealed before implies more than just a calm soul. It implies a weakening. In reality, everybody blew Buu to shyts multiple times, all versions that fought, were blown up by characters who we were told were stronger. None of it worked. In the final fight, ss3 Goku hammers this point home by blowing up Kid Buu multiple times. They then use a technique that’s bare minimum 30x stronger than what Goku can produce on his own. All the Buu’s were more powerful than the cast knew. The ending just doubles down on that. Kid Buu was the strongest.
@@maniacslap1623 The first point is false because a downplay would mean that the character is actually strong when others think that he isn't, which isn't the case kid buu can't beat SS3 goku whereas Super buu buutenks and buuhan would beat Goku to the point where Goku doesn't even want to fight them. the kais words can't be taken seriously because time and time again they say something and it turns out either completely wrong or irrelevant they are exposition characters that don't do their job. and another thing is Goku doesn't downplay opponents HE KNOWS he can beat fat buu and kid buu and he knows he can't beat super buu and his variations. sensing ki has been an ability since the saiyan saga. the calming thing has absolutely 0 statements made about it. the only thing that we know is that it made buu reasonable that's it. and from the fights we know that kid buu is weaker than super buu. for the 3rd point what blowing him up easily means is that he has 0 durability and relies purely on his regeneration which is what was being hammered home. the characters say it time and time again, that if there's enough power output then they can kill him. Gotenks wasn't going all out against super buu and he even says he could've killed him with relative ease. Gohan 100% could've killed super buu as well but his arrogance always comes back to bite him. Vegito could've wiped out Buuhan. and Goku if not for the SS3 drain could've gathered enough energy to obliterate kid buu. They need the spirit bomb specifically because Goku couldn't gather energy in SS3 to one shot kid buu. it's actually absurd how much evidence we have for Kid buu being one of the weakest forms of buu and despite that there are still people that think that somehow kid buu is the strongest.
Part of the problem the last few years has been some more popular powerscalers really latching onto questionable sources like anime filler, databooks that have basically nothing to do with Toriyama, magazines that have nothing to do with TOriyama, statements from ANIME MOVIE WRITERS, etc. It's always a bit odd seeing something like "THE TRUTH ABOUT SUPER BUU VS KID BUU" and pretty much all evidence in favor of Kid Buu is anime filler or a magazine that says some shit like "GOKU AND VEGETA FOUGHT REPLICAS IN SUPER BUU'S BODY THAT WERE TOTALLY AS STRONG AS THE REAL WARRIORS!". That and "well actually Goku was lying or just wrong" when it comes to his statements about being able to beat Kid Buu or lose to Super Buu which..... make no sense since Goku doesn't really lie much and when he does, it's either really obvious or he mentions it.
I totally agree on all the points you make in your video. and regarding the idea that kid buu is the strongest buu, apart from the obvious and logical arguments you put forward I have the impression that people don't see goku's reaction. against kid buu, he's confident and doesn't want to merge, even going one-on-one against kid buu (in the end, the two are on the same level if you don't take stamina into account). against super buu, goku doesn't want to fight even with vegeta's help, he absolutely wants to merge with vegeta against buupicollo , he wants gohan to beat him against buutenks , he panics and goes straight into ssj3 and begs buu to wait for gohan to find the potala and merge with goku against buuhan, goku is so desperate (as never before in the manga) that he's ready to fuse with dendé or satan, and even supposing that fusion would make him less strong, he still takes the risk of throwing the potala at satan a few seconds before feeling vegeta's ki. fat buu and kid buu are the only buu goku can fight the other versions of buu are simply in a different category of power, far far far superior to him and far far far superior to kid buu or fat buu original
Goku obviously wasn’t at full power at any of the times prior to Vs Kid Buu since Vegeta said Goku is stronger than he imagined after sensing every power up and the fight vs Fat Buu.
Love these videos keep em coming. I think whne it comes to Raw Power Gotenks has the edge but just like we saw him in his battle against Super Buu he is not as serious. Going up against a deadly opponent as Kid Buu would not be so mercyful. Kid Buu would ultimatly win.
@@XZAVIER-DAA-GOD Not sure. 19 might be able to absorb the death saucers. I think the issue is that Frieza might need to get to 100% power which will drain fast due to low stamina and power draining.
Frieza can’t sense Ki, he’d think 19 was a push over and get more and more of his Ki absorbed until it’s too late. Frieza is hard to kill but he does get tired.
These videos remind me of long threads in old dragon ball boards about who was stronger. When they use the namek dragon balls, don't they say "you're going to bring Gohan and the boys here, to fight buu?" And that's when vegeta says no, earth saves itself. Genki dama time. Was that anime only?
After the Elder Kaioshin says Kid Buu is the most difficult, Young KibitoKaioshin says yeah, Buu’s power was reduced by the absorptions and he’s now returned to his original self by losing all that he absorbed. The fact of the matter is that Southern Kaioshin and Dai Kaioshin weakened Kid Buu far more than any Z fighter strengthened Super Buu.
The Grand Supreme Kai definitely. He’s the only one shown to weaken Buu but he’s also the only one who Buu had no reason to absorb…makes me think he planned it…which would make a lot of sense if your only other choice was death lol
The grand kai for sure, southern no. In universe it doesn’t make sense for the southern absorptions to weaken buu as well given the fact that the “soul” he gains is in direct relation to his power loss. Buff buu is definitely still VERY evil, and very much a mindless brute. Yeah he says absorptions, but what we see in universe begs to differ. We know for certain after the grand Kai’s absorption, his power dropped because he gained a soul at THAT absorption, not with the southern absorption
@@maniacslap1623 Re watch the fight with Kid Buu vs Southern Kaioshin. Kid Buu had no reason to absorb him. Kid Buu is described as a being without reason. So to say he ever had a reason for anything I’d naivety. And both the manga and anime state that both the Kaioshin (absorptions, plural; and souls, plural) weakened Buu.
@@bzdagoat The Japanese manga and Japanese anime literally state that the absorptions (plural) weakened Kid Buu. The English manga said the souls (plural) tamed Kid Buu. Which means to make less powerful and easier to control.
@@trailsandtribulations7137 the pluralism is really semantics, it’s pretty clear there is the correlation with having gotten a “soul” and weakening, in order to weaken you have to gain a soul n like I said buff buu very clear was still very much evil and wild. Hbd doesn’t fully gain a “soul” till absorbing grand kai as we see in his playful nature and always wanting sweets for example
One thing I disagree with Laughingstock on is that the Spirit Bomb being comprised of only "genki" doesn't put the attack down, nor makes it weaker in any way. Genki seems to be exponential in nature (when comparing it to the times he used it and the bit of energy he gathered vs Vegeta and Frieza...vs Kid Buu, he needed everyone's energy, including the Earth itself). The 3 times Goku used the Spirit Bomb (vs Vegeta, vs Frieza and vs Kid Buu), his ultimate attack was always far stronger than his max power at the time. Vs Vegeta, he didn't do much damage even after surpassing him with Kaioken X3 and a X4 Kamehameha. However, half of the Spirit Bomb almost killed Vegeta and did the most amount of damage that entire fight. Same with Frieza, x20 was blocked by Frieza with a little bit of damage, yet the Spirit Bomb almost killed him. Btw, he did all these feats with almost 0 energy like when vs Kid Buu. With Kid Buu, the energy itself wasn't enough, he needed to add his SSJ power and detonate it. It's pretty clear when comparing it to the other times he used it
I never said the Spirit Bomb is somehow weaker because of it being comprised of Genki, just that the inclusion of Gohan’s power in it and Buu resisting doesn’t mean Kid Buu is stronger than Gohan, which people often contend. You also missed the entire point I made about how the energy from humanity and some others who all combined had less battle capabilities/power than Gohan multiplied that power many-fold. Something you can visually see depicted on screen. Buu resisted because Goku had no energy left to detonate the bomb. If he had energy remaining and threw it, he would have killed Buu right away. That was proven when he had his energy restored by Porunga. And that was just SSJ1 Goku, which is obviously far less powerful than Gohan, Gotenks, or Kid Buu.
@@LSMMIKE I recognize that I may have misunderstood some parts of the video. Thanks for the reply. I will rewatch it again. The one thing I still disagree with you on is the point you just made. The Goku who launched the Spirit Bomb at Frieza also had almost 0 energy, yet the attack didn't require for it to be "detonated" to almost kill Frieza who was way more powerful than Kaioken x20, let alone this Goku. It seems Kid Buu was still able to block the attack and Goku needed SSJ to magnify the Spirit Bomb. Knowing that the attack was created to destroy beings like Kid Buu, that is a very impressive feat for the little monster.
As I said in the video, the idea of requiring energy for detonation contradicts the previous examples of the spirit Bomb and likely was added by Toriyama at the last second to stretch out the ending and further increase the tension of the climax. If you really want to you can make an in-universe argument that he was drained even more by using SSJ3 than Kaioken, but it’s a stretch either way.
@@LSMMIKE I agree that it seems inconsistent when comparing it to the previous times he used it. Thank you for clarifying it for me. Guess some things will remain unclear due to Toriyama's sometimes forgetful nature. I enjoyed discussing these points with you. Keep up the good content 😁
Ik it's been 7mos since it was originally released but Goku's anime statement of "Buu is on a whole nother level" could be taken as "Wow this buu is on a whole other level, now we may actually be able to defeat him." It causes confusion either way but the tone and context of it is different in that regard.
I’m tired of the kid buu disrespect he would solo zeno 😠😂Jp but he would just blow up the planet then go to other world to get more smoke from the dead opp gotenks . I’m just playing. W video!!!!!!!!! Love watching ur videos
Honestly this whole argument is based on interpreting different comments goku made. The actual facts often disagree with what goku says. 1) to clarify goku did not explicitly say gotenks is stronger than him. He only said he told that to buu likely in an attempt to buy them time. And based on how the following scenes play out its likely that is not actually the case. At least not initially. As a reminder as soon as the boys unlock fusion they go off to fight buu. In the Manga the fight happens off screen but it still happens. When they return they are badly beaten. Ie at least initially goku is greater than gotenks initial appearance since we know goku was stronger than the fat buu who beat gotenks handily. 2) super buu himself is actually most likely not that much stronger than the initial fat buu. What the fans call super buu is actually just the initial fat buu but not holding back due to the influence of the kais. He is tamed and restrained but we do see that when the fat buu gets angry his energy increases. Super buu is just a fat buu with rage boost by default. 3)this is open to interpretation but the scene where goku says super buu is stronger them is qualified by the phrase "like this". Ie miniaturized versions of themselves. They had no idea leaving buu would cause them to revert. Their whole plan was improvised since the fusion wore off. Remember they thought it was supposed to be permanent. 4) vegetas statements of we can take him don't make sense in any context. We already know vegeta is no match for the initial fat buu let alone kid buu who is clearly stronger. This just another example of vegeta being overconfident which is consistent withbhis character. It's explicitly stated buu is getting stronger. People can downplay that all they want but that is explicitly what is said by goku who has more insight than vegeta does. At least in Z. Also as a little side note the God ki aspect of kid buu could be a nice little retcon to explain why vegeta couldn't sense his full power. But obvious toriyama hadn't thought of that yet
Facts. They just heavily underestimated Buu from the jump. Literally, right out of the shell. They had every reason to believe removing the Fat Buu would make him weaker. They wouldn’t know the Fat Kai was the only thing holding Kid Buu’s power back. Super Buu knew this. He also knew once the Fat Kai was removed, he would no longer exist as a personality. He literally won’t be himself anymore. They do this and there’s an immediate personality struggle with Super Buu being the first one “killed” followed by Buff Buu. Leaving Kid Buu, the original personality back in control. We see this play out on screen but since Goku/Vegeta don’t understand exactly what’s goin on, following their narrative we come to false conclusions like they could “probably” take the small buu. We then see Kid Buu. In the anime he sends a small blast to destroy earth. Vegeta stops it, he smiles and sends so much energy they couldn’t hope to stop it. Proving this narrative wrong. The last underestimation was Vegeta saying Goku could win. He showed us repeatedly he couldn’t. Not with his own power. Leading to Vegeta suggesting the Spirit Bomb. A technique that uses outside energy and doesn’t require much energy to wield. Remember, the wish for Goku’s energy was Dende’s idea. This proves that Vegeta was wrong. Without that wish, they die. The fact that it was Vegeta’s idea only highlights our characters at the idea. They both WANTED to fight Kid Buu. They’re saiyan lol They wanted to see if they could win with their own power. Vegeta realizes he doesn’t stand a chance almost instantly. Goku did a little better. Once it became clear they probably weren’t gonna win with their own power, Spirit Bomb. And this leads to Goku making the wish for Uub. Because he couldn’t overcome Kid Buu with his own power. Poetic lol In Super, I like the God Ki thing but they missed the mark a little bit IMO like Kid Buu had God Ki from the Grand Supreme Kai. Cool but why not the South Supreme Kai? The Kai that, for all we know was still apart Kid Buu when Goku killed him? LSM did a video about him and I’m like shyt, maybe they just forgot lol but I digress. I think all the Buu’s are underrated. Him having multiple personalities makes him so interesting lol then his crazy absorption and the Kai’s just add to the cleverness of the character. If Fat Buu was on that timing, Gotenks would’ve ran into battle and been killed instantly lol If Super Buu went to blow up the Earth, could Gohan have actually stopped him? We don’t know lol Kid Buu doing what he did made me really question if anybody really stood a chance up to that point lol if any other Buu decided to go the Kid Buu route, who at the time could really stop it? Kid Buu only fought AFTER he blew up the Earth. Every other Buu didn’t try lol
Kid Buu Wins Gotenks is a Gag Character Despite Gotenks being far Superior in strength, the Character is just hard to be taken seriously his purpose is to be comedic relief and has never gotten anything done because of it. Maybe until Goten and Trunks are Adults it’s probably gonna always be that way.
Goku was trolling to make buu want to wait on gotenks. The reason goku said the fusion would be stronger than him is becsuse he wants the new generation to save the earth not a dead guy. Motivation to sum it up.
I dont think Gotenks would screw around too much, like you said, he was already absorbed by Super Buu and knows very well the consequences of screwing around. But even if he does, somebody most likely Piccolo or Vegeta or even Goku, would let him know that he should finish it immediately.
I never understood why Gotenks was ALWAYS goofing off. I mean we saw how serious Goten and Trunks could be, yet every time they fused, it was like comedy hour, or in this case half hour.
Because individually they always had people above them. But as a fusion they were literally the strongest person in the universe (before Gohan shows up) that kind of power makes a kid over confident. It's like Gohan during the cell games if he wasn't so angry
As I wrote when you asked: Even if Gotenks went all out as serious as inhumanly possible, he'd still never be able to actually kill Buu before his time was up. Rip him to shreds, blow him up and probably while not taking much damage, sure, but not kill. That's my take.
I have 2 great questions. Would Gotenks has been able to reach ssj3 if Goten and Trunks didn't see and feel it? And does beast Gohan have God ki? I thought Vegeta got super Saiyan God from fighting people with God ki. It was mentioned in battle of gods that Goku felt God ki and remembered it, or something like that.
Another thing about this theory is that what if, if kid buu would have decided to play around too much just for Gotenks to diffuse and he kills both Goten and Trunks. But it would have been fun to see. Imagine if Fat Buu, Gohan, Piccolo, and Gotenks would have fought off Kid Buu while Goku gathered his strength and charged up the Spirit Bomb. If old Kai would have been smart he could have sent someone to heal and give sense beans to Vegeta and Goku. Another thing is imagine if Goku would have turned into a Golden Oozaru seeing all those moons on Supreme Kai world if old Kai would have pulled out his tail.
Bro, that spiritbomb feat is one one of the strongest feats in the entire series..... Vegeta got his ass handed to him by a tiny sprititbomb formed from plants and stuff on the earth. Frieza got his ass handed to him by one created by the entire Namek Solar system.... The one that killed Kid Buu was powered by The Z fighter, the androids, King Yemma and his entire work force, the namekians and the supreme kais AND the ENTIRE population of the earth..... No matter how you slice it, that's STRONG AS HELL. For you to invalidate that feat is truly insane. At no other point in dragonball has anyone ever qualified the type of Ki energy used as a reason as to why an attack didn't work or is not as strong of an attack...... In dragonball, characters CANNOT stop, block, or deflect an attack stronger than themselves EVER. You WILL NOT find an instance where this is NOT true. Frieza didn't do it. Vegeta didn't do it. For you to say Kid Buu WAS NOT stronger than the spiritbomb thrown at him is just an insane interpretation of things, given that whole rule. And proof from BOTH of those encounters, that they tried their damnest and could not stop the attack...... 29:49 Detonate the explosion?????????? That's NOT how the spiritbomb works. Neither time Goku used this before did he actively work to detonate it..... Nor did anyone else. The one that got Vegeta, hit him instantly and started damaging him. Goku was wasted on the sidelines.The one that got Frieza, Goku was ducking for cover, it went off on it's own..... Here Goku actively threw his own power on top to push the attack over the edge..... The attack was STOPPED by Kid Buu's power and Goku then OVERLOADED IT WITH HIS OWN POWER. And after doing that, he was exhuasted again.... I usually agree with you takes on this, but here it seems like you had a conclusion in mind already, then interpreted things to support it.... I mean you literally gloss over the fact that BOTH Vegeta and Goku admit that they underestimated Kid Buu, in the manga..... and that Kid Buu never went all out against him.... Also, WEAKER character have time and time again have been shown to be able to distract, disrupt, hold off, and block character FAR more powerful than themselves. Examples: - Goku holding Raditz so Piccolo can charge hte Speical Beam Cannon - Gohan and Krillen vs Frieza MUTLTIPLE times - Tien using the Tri-Beam on Semi-Perfect Cell If this can happen here, noting the great power differences, then why can't this be the case for Fat Buu vs Kid Buu???? On top of that you say that Fat Buu no longer has the influnce of the Kais in him, so he's much weaker, well where the hell did they go???? They're not inside Kid Buu......So where are they. South Supreme Kai, who you say powered up Kid Buu IS inside Fat Buu still.....So honestly, his power SHOULDN'T have changed at all...... The only thing that's missing is the evil natural nature of the original Buu... The power from the Daikiaoshin and South Supreme Kai are still inside Fat Buu AND both of them are more powerful than Kid Buu individually. Idk man, there's just SO much wrong in this video. You can interpret things how you _want_, but that doesn't disprove how others interpret things at all..... You haven't at all proven anything here.... The spiritbomb feat is HUGE, one of the strongest feats in the series. Goku couldn't fucking pull that off. Gohan and the other certainly couldn't. If you want a REAL definitive answer to this question, PROVE that Gotenks could stop that Spiritbomb attack. Then me and anyone else who disagrees can't say anything.
@@XZAVIER-DAA-GODif they underestimated his power at first then it's fair to say goku and vegetas earlier statements aren't valid when scaling kid buu and super buu
@@elijahwatjen9839 yeah but if kid Buu was really stronger then super Buu which still wouldn't make sense because super Buu is a fusion of two buu's, they would actually need Gogeta or Vegito to win
A Super Saiyan Gotenks vs Kid Buu would be a helluva fun fight. Pretty fucking hilarious I'd imagine too. They'd be fairly evenly matched I would think. Of course SS3 Gotenks should obviously beat Kid Buu but that should go without saying.
Piccolo was confident that ssj1 Gotenks could handle Fat Buu, so ssj1 Gotenks is either comparable or stronger than the ssj3 Goku who battled Fat Buu and that's BEFORE Goten and Trunks trained in the time chamber. Post Time Chamber SSJ1 Gotenks would be stronger than SSJ3 Goku was when he fought Kid Buu. SSJ3 Gotenks would literally OneShot Kid Buu 😅
Bruh didn’t one shot anything the whole saga yet he gone one shot Kid Buu? Fukk no. He blows up Kid Buu, Kid Buu comes back and it’s curtains. Y’all see repeatedly nobody generates enough energy to kill any Buu until the Spirit Bomb. Y’all also see Gotenks blow Super Buu to shyts multiple times and it doesn’t work. The anime does a good job at showing this. Go watch Goku point blank Kid Buu to the head and fail and tell me u really believe Gotenks could do it. Goku outright states they should be able win and minutes later Kid Buu unleashes a blast that him and Vegeta cant stop. What does that tell u fam? That they had severely underestimated Kid Buu. I just don’t see it. That’s before taking into account Gotenks personality, in which case, he definitely gettin washed. No ifs, no buts.
Kid Buu Wins Mid-High Difficulty Kid Buu is already toying with ssj3 goku and remember that this ssj3 goku didn't hold back like when he fought fat buu also he held the spirit bomb which contains most of Z Fighters and some earthling population also goku stated that kid buu has gotten a lot powerful and dangerous when he last faced him so this just proves that kid buu would absolutely beat super buu also not to mention that gotenks recklessness and childish behavior would led to his easier defeat. Just for fun: Vegito>>>>Buuhan>Buutenks>>Ultimate Gohan>Kid Buu>Buff Buu>Buuccolo>Gotenks=Super Buu>Evil Buu>SSJ3 Goku>Fat Buu>>SSJ2 Majin Vegeta
If he wanted too, Gotenks could definitely win a decisive victory. But most likely he would play with his food due to the power gap, and because he’s a fool, and his power up would definitely fade before he has a chance to kill Kid Buu.
@maniacslap1623 not at first. He plays around too much. And it’s heavily implied he was close maybe finishing Super Buu until his SSJ3 wore off. Does that mean he would killed him. Idk. Personally I don’t really think so, but regardless of that fact. The fact of the matter that is that he is relevant to Super Buu. And Super Buu is far stronger than Kid Buu. So Gotenks would stomp Kid Buu if he really tried too.
The Kid Buu disrespect is amazing as usual. And this one statement by Goku seems to triumph over everything else. Vegita pulls out Fat Buu from Super Buu stating Super Buu power will go down. It is stated to go up. But it must have gone back down due to Goku statement. Regardless that makes no sense. Regardless that no one ever says it. Regardless that Vegita once they defused stated fusion wasn’t necessary anymore as he was never that afraid of super Buu. And regardless that from a writing perspective it at worst makes no sense and at best is confusing if you have a character give a plan the plan is executed the intended result doesn’t happen but then it does happen but the writer doesn’t state it happens it must be inferred. Seriously? Elder Kioshin states Kid Buu is the most dangerous or difficult (the Japanese word means powerful or dangerous or difficult depending on context according to Herms) That can’t mean power due to Goku statement. It must mean personality. Where has anyone been less intelligent and less powerful but been more difficult? Goku states Vegita’s wish is to have Gohan and Gotenks fight with them. Somehow either could individually defeat him but he doesn’t say that. Even though Goku stated Gotenks can beat Fat Buu and Gohan can beat Buu with piccolo. Goku makes a Genki Dama but that’s only Genki. Even though Vegita says Goku is going to get as much energy as he can. Even though a person puts his hands up and he states it took all my energy. Even though ogre in King Yama are on the ground as they gave energy too a physical showing that it is all ki. Even though the Namekians states categorically they gave all their Ki to the Genki Dama, Gohan must not have because Goku stated he can’t beat Super Buu but can beat Kid Buu so Kid Buu must be weaker. I guess Gohan unlike the namekians, king Yama, and random humans, didn’t want to defeat Buu as he only gave a small portion of his ki.
Super Saiyan gotenks easily would slap around kid buu. However, nothing is certain with any version of buu. I reckon kid buu finds a way to absorb gotenks. Hence why they didn't fight on the kaio world. Kid buu would reabsorb gohan/gotenks. Buu almost got goku lol (when kid buu turned into a square and approached goku).
Gotenks getting washed. Don’t act like he wasn’t trying against Super Buu. He tried he failed. The Kid would blow his shyt like he tried to do with Goku. If he survives, he gettin hands until his fusion wear off. It’s like the Gohan fight. We know Gohan coulda won but he lost because he was arrogant. With Gotenks, we don’t even know if he woulda won. He thinks he wins that fight multiple times. Even Piccolo thinks he wins at one point. Both wrong. Notice Goku went from confidently saying he could, to running from his life when Kid Buu unleashed on the Earth. Gotenks getting clapped and it ain’t even close.
On lore: My head canon is that Kid Buu “possessed” God Ki but could not access it. He didn’t know how. Thank Kami he never got around anyone who could utilize God Ki because he’d then just summon his own and be UI level and one shot the macrocosm. I head canon that the Cell Jrs. Wandered around aimlessly before eventually finding 17s island. 17 had been training for like… a week, and so was already Perfect Cell level. Considering he’s SSB level by the time of the TOP 9 years or so later, and SSB is tens if not hundreds of thousands of times stronger than SS2, this is actually a reasonable linear growth rate for 17.
Kid Buu might not be the most powerful but he is the most dangerous bc he isn’t held back by any other motivations. He goes from planet to planet destroying them immediately-along with himself, just to regenerate and move onto the next target. This threat is more concerning to the Z warriors because he doesn’t waste time with vanity, pleasure or proving himself strongest like the other forms of Buu.
@@francisgomes9976 oookay? Definitely a dragonball fan. You can’t read clearly, because the first thing I said is kid buu isn’t the strongest. Kid buu tries to immediately destroy each planet he goes to. None of the other buu forms do that. He also tries to immediately destroy the planet of the Kai’s immediately before goku and vegeta interrupt him and fight. Watch the anime
@@cslack813 I have already read your first post, you said "kid Buu may not be blah blah but he is most dangerous" Lol now you are saying "cz how he destroys/blows up each planet right way" , so what does destroying planet had to do with this fight?? 😂😂 Is he going to pull a Freeze move?? That's not what he did when Goku and Vegeta/fat Buu were fighting him.. he didn't go for destroying planet. This video is about SSJ3 Gotenks vs Kid Buu fight.. it's not about who can destroy the planet fastest 😂😂😂
@@francisgomes9976 are you always this stupid? My comment was never about the fight. If you were familiar with the anime you would know that the whole reason people thought kid buu might be the strongest is because they call him the “most dangerous” form of buu. Specifically Supreme Kai says this. Which brings us back to my first comment…
After reading through the comments, I'm glad to see a majority of viewers are thinking the same way; Gotenks is superior in power and takes the win BUT only if he takes things seriously and quickly ends Buu. Seriously, we know this kid would either get absorbed again of play with his prey for too long and Buu would just blow up whatever planet they are on and reform when it's all said and done. Honestly, I don't even think Gotenks NEEDS to go Super Saiyan 3. Just Super Saiyan 1 Gotenks should be able to get the job done. He should only go SS3 if he NEEDS to and if he is trying to get the job done ASAP because remember SS3 Gotenks only lasts for 5 minutes. Once his energy runs out, he reverts back to base and then defuses quickly after.
Kid buu easy, both would most certainly play around too much and that would frustrate Gotenks distracting them even further. Also we only can assume the regeneration is weaker, but it also isn't insane to think kid buu would still be able to come back from smoke, and Gotenks never showed a more destructive attack to handle that
Original Dragon Ball Z anime says “this is the purely evil, absolutely most powerful, ultimate Majin Buu” about Kid Buu. And the original anime has Goku say Kid Buu is stronger than anyone he ever fought. Which includes Fat Buu, Buutenks, Buuhan, Super Buu, and Kid Buu.
Don’t forget to mention when Vegeta says Goku is stronger than he imagined. Just like with Dabura being felt and compared to Cell, then called stronger.. Vegeta sees and feels Goku’s SSJ3 display vs Fat Buu from Other World. The same display was felt in the Kaioshin Realm. Meaning if you’re in Universe 7’s living realm, Universe 7’s afterlife (Other World), or the Kaioshin Realm orbiting Universe 7, and Goku uses SSJ3, you will sense his Ki. Which brings me to the next two times Goku transforms into SSJ3. Once for Gohan on the Kaioshin Planet. And once for Buutenks on Earth. Since Vegeta was in Universe 7’s Other World, he’d be close enough to sense both SSJ3 power ups from Goku. Yet when Goku powers up vs Kid Buu (what the Super Exciting Guide described as Full Power is credited as authored by Toriyama), Vegeta admits Goku is stronger than he imagined. Meaning Goku vs Kid Buu is stronger than Goku was vs Fat Buu, for Gohan, and vs Buutenks.
1. Saiyans get LARGE boosts from: zenkais(near death) fighting long battles, or rage boosts. None of which occur for goku in any continuity other than kid buu. I’m between these ssj3 showings, we see no plausible instance (based on the aforementioned 3 items) to say goku got stronger 2. Goku fought fat buu not with the intent to win, but to stall him. The fight isn’t very long, and once trunks gets the radar goku powers down and we can clearly tell his stamina has just plummeted. 3. Since goku rlly was trying to stall, there’s no reason to believe he was using all his power. Dbz characters fight all the time without being at 100% during a fight. Especially in a fight where the objective is not to win, but stall. For example, cell vs goku. And when you actually analyze the fight, goku was putting it a lot more attacks than fat buu lol.
Goku started the fight with Kid Buu with what the manga, the Super Exciting Guide, and the Daizenshuu 2 Story Guide describe as “full power Super Saiyan 3” and a “full throttle Kamehameha” from close range. Had zero effect on Kid Buu’s Ki signature. Thus zero damage. Goku said he had BEEN TRYING to obliterate Buu and none of his blasts works (2 Kamehameha). So he wanted to charge like he did vs Raditz, how Piccolo did vs Raditz, and how Granolah did vs Gas. Goku admits at the end that he’d train and get super strong for a rematch. Twice. And starts Super stating that he had no chance on his own.
The fight would objectively go however Kid Buu wanted it to go. If Kid Buu wanted to drag it out and dance on him like he did Goku, he would. And it’d look like Gotenks was fairing well, like it looked like Goku did. But if Kid Buu put forth effort to finish Gotenks from the beginning, then Kid Buu would slaughter Gotenks. Quickly. As he would do to Ultimate Gohan.
1. Idk why people act like kid buu was dancing on goku the ENTIRE fight 😭😭 2. It was one panel and one scene kid buu was dancing and mocking goku because like all the other buus their stamina and regeneration are off the charts. 3. When he danced goku literally was mad and referenced buu taking his time in regenerating himself. 4. If characters are holding back in dragon ball, you will find statements, instances in a fight where one person takes the advantage and keeps it, etc. example, cell vs goku. Frieza vs everybody. 5. If kid buu is far above goku, it makes no sense for him to not beat the crap outta goku immediately LIKE HE DID VEGETA. Sure vegeta was way weaker than goku, but according to y’all, they are all fodder to kid buu? A mindless, incarnation of evil? Why would an insane character entertain someone way weaker than him and make it seem like goku was holding his own? 6. In the entire fight, the two are fighting relative. Kid buu has stamina and regeneration (like all the other buus) and ssj3 goku’s energy is plummeting like crazy. Which toriyama makes SEVERAL statements about in universe for us the readers to understand. 7. Ultimate gohan slaughters kid buu
Hello, I'm new to your channel. I was wondering if you would make a video explaining why Vegeta skipped ssj3, and most importantly, why he couldn't reach ssj4 on his own. I find that disrespectful to Vegeta because he trains harder than Goku.
Thank you for your generosity. I made a video about Why Vegeta Never Went SSJ3 which you can find here: Why Vegeta Never Became A Super Saiyan 3 th-cam.com/video/lK1I0sSW3DY/w-d-xo.html I have another video planned for later this year about why Baby Vegeta didn’t become an SSJ4, where I’ll discuss the machine and everything else.
Personally I don't think gotenks has the firepower needed to obliterate Buu. He definitely would overpower buu But would he have enough in him to keep him from regenerating? I feel like compared to a super Buu kid buus regeneration is on a different level.
That’s what I’m saying. Like Goku used the Spirit Bomb for no reason…Gotenks would be clapped as soon as soon Buu woke up. I can think of hypotheticals where he COULD win, knowing what we know, he won’t lol
You have no evidence to support his regeneration is better Goku is Vastly weaker than Gotenks as Stated multiple times Of course buu can regen against a weaker opponent Please read manga
It's a close match but I think cell would have the slight edge I want you to understand cell was stronger than ssj Gohan who was stronger than cell arc ssj Goku and Goku in the Buu saga is not much stronger than Gohan was I think he does lose but extreme diff
@@King-Star9402 yeah only way Goku could win is if we take into account Gohan's rage boost into ssj2 which is very easy to argue and then Goku caught up with Gohan rage boost self which I think turns this in the other direction
Kid Buu is not full power Buu fights a piece of himself. Next Goku and Vegeta are not reliable narrators. They're shown and not be able to detect the kaioshin power. They judge the demon King to be around the same level as Cell when he's arguably more powerful. And Goku expected Gotenks to beat fat buu. Not with more training or with Grade 6 just regular super Saiyan Gotenks. I'll ended with Goku has been using Spirit bombs against opponents who are at a minimum three times more powerful than himself. The attack has either done serious damage or just straight-up defeated them. The Spirit bomb against buu being bolstered by Goku. I don't see Gohan or Gotenks tanking it. It's not a big deal with Gohan or Gotenks to be more powerful than Goku but I don't see either one of them being three or four times more powerful. Just saying that the fight between these two might be a little bit more competitive than we think.
It's not just the dub the anime throws in one line about kid buu being stronger. But events in the anime contradict it. The manga is free of contradictions
A lot of people here seem to think Gotenks would ruin it AGAIN by playing around. I don't think so; he was a boasting kid, not a raging moron... He'd be furious for his previous humiliations and nuke Buu.
Chi and Ki are the same concept. “Chi” is the Chinese pronunciation, “Ki” is the Japanese. The manga spells it using Chi, so manga readers tend to use that pronunciation. I alternate pronunciations for Ki, character names and other elements throughout my videos, in part because my audience is comprised of various demographics who use varied pronunciations.
If Gotenks took the fight seriously and tried to kill Buu immediately, then yeah he'd definitely win. As far as raw power goes Gotenks is much stronger than Buu. The issue is he's as arrogant, if not more so, than Vegeta and would likely screw around and burn through his energy without actually killing Buu. I don't see Gotenks behaving in a way completely uncharacteristically of him so I'll say Kid Buu will win despite being outclassed in power.
Facts. And it’s not even close. More likely Gohan could but even that’s debatable. That stamina/regeneration ain’t going anywhere and the only scenarios Gotenks wins is if we disregard that lol But fans gon fans If he had a technique like the Spirit Bomb, whole different argument. Or something like the Tri-Beam. He would definitely use it and it might work the first time.
It was kind of interesting how much stronger buutenks was than gohan. There is a feat from gohan that briefly impressed buutenks and that’s when he broke out of the ring constraints he was put in. So I can see gohan being able to easily beat buuiccolo. But this was in the anime, that said it seems to add up to show how close gohan was to buutenks just not enough to keep up that intensity.
Gotenks is beating kid buu pretty easily. People forget normal gotenks is already stronger than ssj3 Goku after training super Saiyan alone would be enough to take out Kid buu after his training with ssj3 as a last resort I don’t think he would need to use it against kid buu anyways.
Imagine if gotenks learned the parapara damce with theyre ghosts. i know parara isnt really explained but if it could work on anyone it would be strong.
Genki is the aspect of Ki that is energy, that is energy beams, that is aura. Genki is influenced by Shoki and Yuki which results in the Chi level. The Genki Dama is the title of the technique, but Goku collects Chi. Not Chi. Goku can gather from inanimate objects.
Wow I actually never ever thought about this fight at all. But I’m agreeing with the comments saying Kid Buu would get annihilated by a serious Gotenks.
But if we have to make an assumption, a heavy one at that, what does that tell u lol Lemme make an assumption too, assuming Kid Buu decides to blow up the Kai world instead of actually fighting, Gotenks getting cooked just like Goku and Vegeta almost did if it wasn’t for Kibito.
I had always grown up with the notion of: Kid Buu =< SSJ3 Goku =< SSJ1 Gotenks < SSJ3 Gotenks < Ultimate Gohan, which gives me some sense as to how this would play out.
I always looked at Gotenks as a disgrace even though hes a kid. If they bring him back in a Super movie. Hopefully hes more serious and not a joke like he been.
The whole idea was a way for Toyotaro to try and make Uub relevant retroactively after they introduced numerous characters far beyond the power of Kid Buu, which in turn made Uub’s potential seem inconsequential. However, based on how God Ki(and Buu’s absorption) actually works, Kid Buu never would have kept it after the split and without the ability to harness/convert it, the God Ki would have reverted to normal Ki. But, as is often the case, Toyotaro didn’t actually think this idea through when he added it into the manga, or realize the greater implications it had on the story.
If he was serious, Gotenks would annihilate Kid Buu. Unfortunately, he would probably mess around for a bit, giving Buu enough time to blow up the planet, killing Gotenks in the process.
Pretty much, or get turned into candy or get absorbed again.
Despite seeing how durable and regenerative Buu is, multiple times, Gotenks kept wasting stamina on stupid techniques to try and showboat. The Galactica Donut obviously has no effect on Buu, but he kept doing it anyway.
In the manga, Kid Buu was attempting to turn Goku into candy in one of the panels, Gotenks would have fallen for it.
If Buu doesn't get crazy pissed off first and pummels Gotenks to death. And THEN he blows up the Earth.
Even if he was serious, Kid Buu especially has crazy regen and stamina, while SSJ3 Gotenks' biggest weakness (other than his attitude) is his lack of stamina. He might be able to do it, but I'm not sure.
He could hold his breath and fly to New Namek….
@@CPhelps1247 1. I don’t think he could hold his breath for the necessary amount of time, 2. I highly doubt Gotenks knows where New Namek is in the first place
I do appreciate the line “I bet Piccolo’s in there slowing you down,” making it clear that it’s not that Piccolo’s power wouldn’t be a boost to Buu, but that Piccolo is actively doing everything he can to resist from the inside. Piccolo once again clutching out an important play that gets canceled by the Saiyan’s stupidity.
Piccolo power isn’t a boast to buu but can you imagine wild and unpredictable kid buu having piccolo’s intelligence would make him more dangerous
@@juswavvy9634Picolo is just him
I love the small details Toriyama incorporated in the buu saga. Gotenks is childish and loves to make things a spectacle. He is focused on silly techniques and the funny poses he likely takes from observing saiyaman (Gohan) who got his hero poses directly from the Ginyu Force. This dynamic is hilariously highlighted in Fighterz.
I have been telling these fools that gotenks would stomp kid buu big ups to laughingstock media for breaking it down next time do kid buu vs the original fat buu that came out of the cocoon that match up would be more interesting than this
I wonder if there's some kinda sentai show in their universe, the great saiya man is absolutely inspired by that and I like to think Gohan was inspired by the comics he was reading
In terms of strength, Gotenks positively violates. If Gotenks is hypothetically bloodlusted and has his eyes solely on the prize, he'd annihilate Kid Buu. He was about to kill Super Buu, after all. Unfortunately, this is *Gotenks* we're talking about, and Gotenks beats nobody. Goten has a higher win-rate than him.
Man’s had one real fight saying he beats nobody ain’t fair
@@longlivetheblackmamba2-8-24 He also got violated by Copy Vegeta. I hate that arc as much as the next guy, but it's canon to the anime. I like Gotenks a lot, but they never give him a dub. To his credit, he did defeat Hirudegarn's first form.
@@supagreatman2826 I agree. Trunks ruined them with that "let's make it a spectacle" bs
@@_Koyomi_ we talking about buu saga not after. Copy vegeta had all of vegeta power. What’s was after vegeta has god ki that’s a bad example
@@longlivetheblackmamba2-8-24 Ohh. Then yeah, you're right. He only fought against Fat and Super Buu, but that's all they could really give him during that saga. I think Toriyama thought ahead and saw that a team of Gotenks, Gohan, Vegeta, Goku, and Buu would make the final battle too easy
If Ssj3 Gotenks matched Super Buu, then Kid Buu wouldn't be that much a challenge if he fought seriously. You assessment is correct.
Wrong as fukk lol
Kid Buu is stronger than super boo
@@RobinDTonynah. He not
@@ParadiseDB7well if we use that logic than we can assume that kid buu is stronger than Buuhan right?
@@jirrelljkid buu is definitely arguably stronger and if its anime kid buu he’s definitely stronger
Mike you have been killing it lately. Your the best DBZ YT by far
Agreed. Even when I know the answer myself I still love to listen to him carefully explain the answers in such detail. Great content. It's a shame Super isn't really nuanced enough to give us interesting DB content
Great video! I think you covered almost everything you could.
One of the arguments I hear for why Gotenks couldn't beat Kid Buu is how Goku's reaction to the prospect of Gotenks and Gohan coming to fight Kid Buu was kind of nonchalant compared to his reaction to the prospect of Buucolo vs Gohan.
As soon as Gotenks breaks himself and Piccolo out of the room, he tells Super Buu to die because he’s ate everyone and attacks him.
He couldn’t harm Buu.
Needed Piccolo’s assistance.
And admitted that he couldn’t weaken Buu physically.
Buu’s Ki never diminished. Thus never took damage.
And Toriyama illustrated Gotenks with Pinocchio’s lying nose when Gotenks said he was the strongest.
1. Buu was def afraid when gotenks was about to blast him before defusing, AND gotenks had him on the ropes.
2. Piccolo assisted ONLY with the volleyball gimmick
3. Essentially all of the buus, yes all, have near infinite stores of stamina (no statements or signs of fatigue from any buus across all the fights) except ONLY when vegeta remarks when fat buu fought kid buu
4. Gotenks almost certainly throughout the entire story is a gag character so not sure what this point is supposed to prove? It’s prettt clear in the fight gotenks is relative to super buu
He could harm buu, he just couldn't keep the damage done to stick over time. Same with Buuhan vs Vegeto, we see Buuhan get wreaked and then after a brief period he's back to full if given the time. It's also why goku couldn't hurt fat buu or kid buu, goku didn't have the power to make any lasting damage before they'd heal up.
@@everettjohnson9374
Kid Buu’s Ki signature never dropped vs Goku, meaning Goku never damaged Kid Buu.
Vegetto permanently destroyed Buuhan’s head tentacle, which couldn’t be regenerated and had to be regrown from the rest of his body.
Meanwhile, Super Buu could regenerate from ash/smoke vs Gotenks. And Kid Buu could regenerate from nothing vs his own Ki blast, and from nothingness from Vegeta’s barrage of Ki blasts.
When you mentioned the size & power requirements for fusion it just reminded me about the constant height fluctuations in Dragon ball , because Vegeta was nowhere near the height of Goku which makes me wonder what does Toriyama mean by "similar size"
Within a couple inches or height I'm sure I'm pretty sure they're both only 5'9" and 5'5" or 5'6" respectively
Super Perfect Cell vs Pre Majin Vegeta.
Super Janemba vs Ultimate Gohan. Thank You.
Damn I hope he see this lol
Ssj2 pre majin should be at cell as he seemed to hold himself above ssj2 gohan who was more or less a rival to dabura who they held at about the same lvl as cell and then said they underestimated him a bit and they still think they could win
As for super janemba I don't know I want to say super janemba based on the fact he was bullying ssj3 Goku and ssj2 Vegeta but Gohan could do the same and that's only if you assume the gokus are equal
@Nathan24634 Yes, I pretty much agreed with you on this topic and answers.
I love the drawings you use in the thumbnails. The one of Gotenks here is awesome but I would've loved to have seen him as a SSJ3 in this art style for your thumbnail considering the title. As for the topic, it's a shame we never really see Gotenks as a SSJ3 or Kid Buy go all out as Gotenks was messing around (+ Buu was stalling for Gohan) and it didn't look like Kid Buu was taking his fight with SSJ3 Goku that serious either.
Great video as always. Myself I say no Kid Buu wins the fight. Because telling Gotenks not to play around is very tough if not impossible and I'll give you that Kid Buu is weaker than Super Buu if not Buu's absorbed forms, so doubtful Gotenks wouldn't play around. But let's say Gotenks goes round two on the Kai's world, I still say no. Because Goku realized to me not only is Kid Buu far more powerful than almost anyone they had faced, but he can't be reasoned with like others, he has no desires of his own so he can't be tricked, and his stamina and regeneration are through the roof. Because even when Vegeta who pulled no punches against Majin Buu realized I have to use the Final Explosion it's strong enough to reduce him to shreds but Buu still got up, and when the Super Ghost Kamikaze attack was used on Super Buu that turned him to shreds and the shreds were reduced to ash if not smoke yet he still came back. The only attack that seemed to work was the Spirit Bomb, now whether that was do to magical or harnessing the good if not souls of all living things, or if at full power it's just that strong, does change the Spirit Bomb was the only thing to keep Buu down for good. So Gotenks doesn't have an attack that vould do that even if he tried a kamehameha I doubt it would far better than a super ghost attack. Also stamina Buu would have greater stamina than a full power SS3 Gotenks. Buu ironically takes the best aspects of all the major villains in DBZ, the overwhelming power of Freiza, Cell, and the Androids, but he also has the stamina of the Androids were he power doesn't really seem to go down, and he has Cell's regeneration to come back from pretty much anything but never looses stamina when regenerating. No matter the time Gotenks is Trunks vs Cell a less experienced fighter that wouldn't be able to put all this together in enough time to win, let alone having an attack to seal the deal.
Thank you for helping me get through my work days! Great content
Some people really underestimate Gotenks. Even just in SSJ.
Last week I saw people on insta debating whether Gotenks in SSJ could be cell saga Gohan.
Must be crack that they're smoking.
Gotenks as a ssj solos the saga
That’s actually a good debate. That Gohan should be around Buu Saga Vegeta as ss2. Gotebks should clap him but that Gohan has also been freshly trained by Goku…definitely a good one. But Kid Buu washing Gotenks and it ain’t even close imo
I made two assumptions.
Pre-ROSAT Gotenks because Post-ROSAT Gotenks is OBVIOUSLY clappin 11 year old Gohan.
Assumption 2: they meant ss2 Gohan.
Gotenks disnt do that hot against Fat Buu before the Time Chamber. Ss2 11 year old Gohan coulda been stronger.
Gotenks doesn’t show us he’s on ss3 Goku’s level until after the chamber.
@@maniacslap1623 I would argue that Goku and Vegeta were stronger as SSJ2 during Boo Saga than Gohan SSJ 2 during Cell Saga BUT Vegeta was around 40 and Gohan 12 sooooooo....
I always wanted to see Gotenks fight in SS2 form. It wouldn't burn out his fusion as fast, and he would still be extremely powerful. Twice as strong as his SS1-self but a quarter of his SS3-self.
I think Toriyama forgot about Ss2. Or that he just intended each time we see a SS it is actually the Ascended ss2 form?
@@JayKay-on2grIt’s as simple as aesthetics.
@@JayKay-on2gr think you’re right. Idk where, but I heard that apparently he thought ssj3 was ssj2 and so just completely forgot about the actual ssj2. Don’t quote me on that tho, might just be something fans made up
@@randomcommenter6498yeah, that's true. He said it in an interview years ago when BOG came out.
With SS1 doing what it did to buu, I would think that SS2 would be just enough with epic battle of course .
Anime: Kid Buu
Manga: Gotenks EASILY
Its crazy how many of these fights are so controversial yet dbz is seen as the time when power scaling was easy
It was really easy until buu saga
it's easy if we take feats instead of statements, elder kai and shin add so much unneeded nonsense, they hype up kid buu like he's stronger than buuhan, when clearly he isn't. everytime they open their mouths they add more confusion to the situation.
They actually downplay Kid Buu power wise. The Kai’s and the saiyans. They all underestimate Kid Buu lol
Also, they make multiple statements about the Fat Kai calming Buu’s soul when in fact, the feat of sealing someone that wasn’t capable of being sealed before implies more than just a calm soul. It implies a weakening.
In reality, everybody blew Buu to shyts multiple times, all versions that fought, were blown up by characters who we were told were stronger. None of it worked.
In the final fight, ss3 Goku hammers this point home by blowing up Kid Buu multiple times. They then use a technique that’s bare minimum 30x stronger than what Goku can produce on his own.
All the Buu’s were more powerful than the cast knew. The ending just doubles down on that.
Kid Buu was the strongest.
@@maniacslap1623 The first point is false because a downplay would mean that the character is actually strong when others think that he isn't, which isn't the case kid buu can't beat SS3 goku whereas Super buu buutenks and buuhan would beat Goku to the point where Goku doesn't even want to fight them. the kais words can't be taken seriously because time and time again they say something and it turns out either completely wrong or irrelevant they are exposition characters that don't do their job. and another thing is Goku doesn't downplay opponents HE KNOWS he can beat fat buu and kid buu and he knows he can't beat super buu and his variations. sensing ki has been an ability since the saiyan saga. the calming thing has absolutely 0 statements made about it. the only thing that we know is that it made buu reasonable that's it. and from the fights we know that kid buu is weaker than super buu. for the 3rd point what blowing him up easily means is that he has 0 durability and relies purely on his regeneration which is what was being hammered home. the characters say it time and time again, that if there's enough power output then they can kill him. Gotenks wasn't going all out against super buu and he even says he could've killed him with relative ease. Gohan 100% could've killed super buu as well but his arrogance always comes back to bite him. Vegito could've wiped out Buuhan. and Goku if not for the SS3 drain could've gathered enough energy to obliterate kid buu. They need the spirit bomb specifically because Goku couldn't gather energy in SS3 to one shot kid buu. it's actually absurd how much evidence we have for Kid buu being one of the weakest forms of buu and despite that there are still people that think that somehow kid buu is the strongest.
Part of the problem the last few years has been some more popular powerscalers really latching onto questionable sources like anime filler, databooks that have basically nothing to do with Toriyama, magazines that have nothing to do with TOriyama, statements from ANIME MOVIE WRITERS, etc. It's always a bit odd seeing something like "THE TRUTH ABOUT SUPER BUU VS KID BUU" and pretty much all evidence in favor of Kid Buu is anime filler or a magazine that says some shit like "GOKU AND VEGETA FOUGHT REPLICAS IN SUPER BUU'S BODY THAT WERE TOTALLY AS STRONG AS THE REAL WARRIORS!".
That and "well actually Goku was lying or just wrong" when it comes to his statements about being able to beat Kid Buu or lose to Super Buu which..... make no sense since Goku doesn't really lie much and when he does, it's either really obvious or he mentions it.
Two fights that look alike:
SS3 Gotenks vs Super Buu
SS Gotenks vs Kid Buu
I totally agree on all the points you make in your video.
and regarding the idea that kid buu is the strongest buu, apart from the obvious and logical arguments you put forward
I have the impression that people don't see goku's reaction.
against kid buu, he's confident and doesn't want to merge, even going one-on-one against kid buu (in the end, the two are on the same level if you don't take stamina into account).
against super buu, goku doesn't want to fight even with vegeta's help, he absolutely wants to merge with vegeta
against buupicollo , he wants gohan to beat him
against buutenks , he panics and goes straight into ssj3 and begs buu to wait for gohan to find the potala and merge with goku
against buuhan, goku is so desperate (as never before in the manga) that he's ready to fuse with dendé or satan, and even supposing that fusion would make him less strong, he still takes the risk of throwing the potala at satan a few seconds before feeling vegeta's ki.
fat buu and kid buu are the only buu goku can fight
the other versions of buu are simply in a different category of power, far far far superior to him and far far far superior to kid buu or fat buu original
Goku obviously wasn’t at full power at any of the times prior to Vs Kid Buu since Vegeta said Goku is stronger than he imagined after sensing every power up and the fight vs Fat Buu.
Buu arc most powerful to least
Vegito
Buuhan
Buutenks
Gohan
Gotenks
Superbuu
Kidbuu - Goku
Majin buu
Vegeta
crazy how many ppl were actually stronger than kid buu
“The very small increase he got from absorbing Piccolo” Why you do Piccolo like that? 😂
Hell absorbing Piccolo boosted his intelligence... He wasn't even able too properly speak until he absorbed Piccolo
You have violated my feed enough...I subbed 😂 awesome content and thanks for rekindling my love for the manga
I’m just here looking for that one comment about Mike giving credit, respecting the audience and such lol
Super Buu vs Janemba would be a good “What if?” Fight!
Love these videos keep em coming. I think whne it comes to Raw Power Gotenks has the edge but just like we saw him in his battle against Super Buu he is not as serious. Going up against a deadly opponent as Kid Buu would not be so mercyful. Kid Buu would ultimatly win.
Very interesting! Maybe a "Android 19 vs. Namek Frieza?"
Honestly Frieza could just cut of 19's hands off
@@XZAVIER-DAA-GOD Not sure. 19 might be able to absorb the death saucers. I think the issue is that Frieza might need to get to 100% power which will drain fast due to low stamina and power draining.
@@johnquach8821 I don't think 19 could absorb the death saucers or maybe not even the death beam, but the Supernova and death Ball probably,
Frieza can’t sense Ki, he’d think 19 was a push over and get more and more of his Ki absorbed until it’s too late. Frieza is hard to kill but he does get tired.
These videos remind me of long threads in old dragon ball boards about who was stronger. When they use the namek dragon balls, don't they say "you're going to bring Gohan and the boys here, to fight buu?" And that's when vegeta says no, earth saves itself. Genki dama time. Was that anime only?
The thing is kid buu didn’t exist in mind of Akita during the super buu arc. Such a missed opportunity.
Hilarious how you skip over the Super manga in Ch31 stating that the version of Buu who was reincarnated into Uub was the most formidable.
After the Elder Kaioshin says Kid Buu is the most difficult, Young KibitoKaioshin says yeah, Buu’s power was reduced by the absorptions and he’s now returned to his original self by losing all that he absorbed.
The fact of the matter is that Southern Kaioshin and Dai Kaioshin weakened Kid Buu far more than any Z fighter strengthened Super Buu.
The Grand Supreme Kai definitely. He’s the only one shown to weaken Buu but he’s also the only one who Buu had no reason to absorb…makes me think he planned it…which would make a lot of sense if your only other choice was death lol
The grand kai for sure, southern no. In universe it doesn’t make sense for the southern absorptions to weaken buu as well given the fact that the “soul” he gains is in direct relation to his power loss. Buff buu is definitely still VERY evil, and very much a mindless brute. Yeah he says absorptions, but what we see in universe begs to differ. We know for certain after the grand Kai’s absorption, his power dropped because he gained a soul at THAT absorption, not with the southern absorption
@@maniacslap1623
Re watch the fight with Kid Buu vs Southern Kaioshin. Kid Buu had no reason to absorb him.
Kid Buu is described as a being without reason. So to say he ever had a reason for anything I’d naivety.
And both the manga and anime state that both the Kaioshin (absorptions, plural; and souls, plural) weakened Buu.
@@bzdagoat
The Japanese manga and Japanese anime literally state that the absorptions (plural) weakened Kid Buu.
The English manga said the souls (plural) tamed Kid Buu. Which means to make less powerful and easier to control.
@@trailsandtribulations7137 the pluralism is really semantics, it’s pretty clear there is the correlation with having gotten a “soul” and weakening, in order to weaken you have to gain a soul n like I said buff buu very clear was still very much evil and wild. Hbd doesn’t fully gain a “soul” till absorbing grand kai as we see in his playful nature and always wanting sweets for example
That would have been an interesting fight to have seen, though, to be honest 🤔
One thing I disagree with Laughingstock on is that the Spirit Bomb being comprised of only "genki" doesn't put the attack down, nor makes it weaker in any way.
Genki seems to be exponential in nature (when comparing it to the times he used it and the bit of energy he gathered vs Vegeta and Frieza...vs Kid Buu, he needed everyone's energy, including the Earth itself).
The 3 times Goku used the Spirit Bomb (vs Vegeta, vs Frieza and vs Kid Buu), his ultimate attack was always far stronger than his max power at the time.
Vs Vegeta, he didn't do much damage even after surpassing him with Kaioken X3 and a X4 Kamehameha. However, half of the Spirit Bomb almost killed Vegeta and did the most amount of damage that entire fight. Same with Frieza, x20 was blocked by Frieza with a little bit of damage, yet the Spirit Bomb almost killed him. Btw, he did all these feats with almost 0 energy like when vs Kid Buu.
With Kid Buu, the energy itself wasn't enough, he needed to add his SSJ power and detonate it. It's pretty clear when comparing it to the other times he used it
I never said the Spirit Bomb is somehow weaker because of it being comprised of Genki, just that the inclusion of Gohan’s power in it and Buu resisting doesn’t mean Kid Buu is stronger than Gohan, which people often contend. You also missed the entire point I made about how the energy from humanity and some others who all combined had less battle capabilities/power than Gohan multiplied that power many-fold. Something you can visually see depicted on screen.
Buu resisted because Goku had no energy left to detonate the bomb. If he had energy remaining and threw it, he would have killed Buu right away. That was proven when he had his energy restored by Porunga. And that was just SSJ1 Goku, which is obviously far less powerful than Gohan, Gotenks, or Kid Buu.
@@LSMMIKE I recognize that I may have misunderstood some parts of the video. Thanks for the reply. I will rewatch it again.
The one thing I still disagree with you on is the point you just made. The Goku who launched the Spirit Bomb at Frieza also had almost 0 energy, yet the attack didn't require for it to be "detonated" to almost kill Frieza who was way more powerful than Kaioken x20, let alone this Goku.
It seems Kid Buu was still able to block the attack and Goku needed SSJ to magnify the Spirit Bomb.
Knowing that the attack was created to destroy beings like Kid Buu, that is a very impressive feat for the little monster.
As I said in the video, the idea of requiring energy for detonation contradicts the previous examples of the spirit Bomb and likely was added by Toriyama at the last second to stretch out the ending and further increase the tension of the climax. If you really want to you can make an in-universe argument that he was drained even more by using SSJ3 than Kaioken, but it’s a stretch either way.
@@LSMMIKE I agree that it seems inconsistent when comparing it to the previous times he used it. Thank you for clarifying it for me. Guess some things will remain unclear due to Toriyama's sometimes forgetful nature.
I enjoyed discussing these points with you. Keep up the good content 😁
Thanks for watching. I appreciate it.
Ik it's been 7mos since it was originally released but Goku's anime statement of "Buu is on a whole nother level" could be taken as "Wow this buu is on a whole other level, now we may actually be able to defeat him." It causes confusion either way but the tone and context of it is different in that regard.
I’m tired of the kid buu disrespect he would solo zeno 😠😂Jp but he would just blow up the planet then go to other world to get more smoke from the dead opp gotenks . I’m just playing. W video!!!!!!!!! Love watching ur videos
Long story short. Ssj Gotenks stomps KidBuu. Ssj3 is overkill
Seriously... they are both crazy personalities. Kids are kids... they would both GOOF OFF
Honestly this whole argument is based on interpreting different comments goku made. The actual facts often disagree with what goku says.
1) to clarify goku did not explicitly say gotenks is stronger than him. He only said he told that to buu likely in an attempt to buy them time. And based on how the following scenes play out its likely that is not actually the case. At least not initially.
As a reminder as soon as the boys unlock fusion they go off to fight buu. In the Manga the fight happens off screen but it still happens. When they return they are badly beaten. Ie at least initially goku is greater than gotenks initial appearance since we know goku was stronger than the fat buu who beat gotenks handily.
2) super buu himself is actually most likely not that much stronger than the initial fat buu. What the fans call super buu is actually just the initial fat buu but not holding back due to the influence of the kais. He is tamed and restrained but we do see that when the fat buu gets angry his energy increases. Super buu is just a fat buu with rage boost by default.
3)this is open to interpretation but the scene where goku says super buu is stronger them is qualified by the phrase "like this". Ie miniaturized versions of themselves. They had no idea leaving buu would cause them to revert. Their whole plan was improvised since the fusion wore off. Remember they thought it was supposed to be permanent.
4) vegetas statements of we can take him don't make sense in any context. We already know vegeta is no match for the initial fat buu let alone kid buu who is clearly stronger. This just another example of vegeta being overconfident which is consistent withbhis character. It's explicitly stated buu is getting stronger. People can downplay that all they want but that is explicitly what is said by goku who has more insight than vegeta does. At least in Z. Also as a little side note the God ki aspect of kid buu could be a nice little retcon to explain why vegeta couldn't sense his full power. But obvious toriyama hadn't thought of that yet
Facts. They just heavily underestimated Buu from the jump. Literally, right out of the shell.
They had every reason to believe removing the Fat Buu would make him weaker. They wouldn’t know the Fat Kai was the only thing holding Kid Buu’s power back.
Super Buu knew this. He also knew once the Fat Kai was removed, he would no longer exist as a personality. He literally won’t be himself anymore.
They do this and there’s an immediate personality struggle with Super Buu being the first one “killed” followed by Buff Buu. Leaving Kid Buu, the original personality back in control.
We see this play out on screen but since Goku/Vegeta don’t understand exactly what’s goin on, following their narrative we come to false conclusions like they could “probably” take the small buu.
We then see Kid Buu. In the anime he sends a small blast to destroy earth. Vegeta stops it, he smiles and sends so much energy they couldn’t hope to stop it. Proving this narrative wrong.
The last underestimation was Vegeta saying Goku could win. He showed us repeatedly he couldn’t. Not with his own power. Leading to Vegeta suggesting the Spirit Bomb. A technique that uses outside energy and doesn’t require much energy to wield. Remember, the wish for Goku’s energy was Dende’s idea. This proves that Vegeta was wrong. Without that wish, they die.
The fact that it was Vegeta’s idea only highlights our characters at the idea. They both WANTED to fight Kid Buu. They’re saiyan lol They wanted to see if they could win with their own power. Vegeta realizes he doesn’t stand a chance almost instantly. Goku did a little better. Once it became clear they probably weren’t gonna win with their own power, Spirit Bomb.
And this leads to Goku making the wish for Uub. Because he couldn’t overcome Kid Buu with his own power.
Poetic lol
In Super, I like the God Ki thing but they missed the mark a little bit IMO like Kid Buu had God Ki from the Grand Supreme Kai. Cool but why not the South Supreme Kai? The Kai that, for all we know was still apart Kid Buu when Goku killed him?
LSM did a video about him and I’m like shyt, maybe they just forgot lol but I digress.
I think all the Buu’s are underrated. Him having multiple personalities makes him so interesting lol then his crazy absorption and the Kai’s just add to the cleverness of the character.
If Fat Buu was on that timing, Gotenks would’ve ran into battle and been killed instantly lol If Super Buu went to blow up the Earth, could Gohan have actually stopped him? We don’t know lol
Kid Buu doing what he did made me really question if anybody really stood a chance up to that point lol if any other Buu decided to go the Kid Buu route, who at the time could really stop it? Kid Buu only fought AFTER he blew up the Earth. Every other Buu didn’t try lol
Pure excellent breakdown dude
This would be a great fight to see.
Thanks for the video 🔥🔥🔥🔥
Kid Buu Wins Gotenks is a Gag Character Despite Gotenks being far Superior in strength, the Character is just hard to be taken seriously his purpose is to be comedic relief and has never gotten anything done because of it. Maybe until Goten and Trunks are Adults it’s probably gonna always be that way.
Goku was trolling to make buu want to wait on gotenks. The reason goku said the fusion would be stronger than him is becsuse he wants the new generation to save the earth not a dead guy. Motivation to sum it up.
Can u please do a video on why no one ever tried to master SSJ3. To reduce the stamina drain.
Because dbz ended and super quickly replaced it with ssjg thus making it a pointless form
@@exia7777and then replaced god with blue, blue with blue kk, blue kk with ui, etc. i hate super
@@_Meltedburrito same
I dont think Gotenks would screw around too much, like you said, he was already absorbed by Super Buu and knows very well the consequences of screwing around. But even if he does, somebody most likely Piccolo or Vegeta or even Goku, would let him know that he should finish it immediately.
I never understood why Gotenks was ALWAYS goofing off. I mean we saw how serious Goten and Trunks could be, yet every time they fused, it was like comedy hour, or in this case half hour.
Because individually they always had people above them. But as a fusion they were literally the strongest person in the universe (before Gohan shows up) that kind of power makes a kid over confident. It's like Gohan during the cell games if he wasn't so angry
They also enable each other really bad. Goten tends to defer to trunks, so they kinda bring out the worse in each other's bad habits.
Trunks is Vegeta's son.
Goten is Goku's son.
They're children of 7 and 8.
Do the math
As I wrote when you asked: Even if Gotenks went all out as serious as inhumanly possible, he'd still never be able to actually kill Buu before his time was up. Rip him to shreds, blow him up and probably while not taking much damage, sure, but not kill. That's my take.
I have 2 great questions. Would Gotenks has been able to reach ssj3 if Goten and Trunks didn't see and feel it?
And does beast Gohan have God ki? I thought Vegeta got super Saiyan God from fighting people with God ki. It was mentioned in battle of gods that Goku felt God ki and remembered it, or something like that.
If you pay attention you get the awnsers
Another thing about this theory is that what if, if kid buu would have decided to play around too much just for Gotenks to diffuse and he kills both Goten and Trunks.
But it would have been fun to see. Imagine if Fat Buu, Gohan, Piccolo, and Gotenks would have fought off Kid Buu while Goku gathered his strength and charged up the Spirit Bomb. If old Kai would have been smart he could have sent someone to heal and give sense beans to Vegeta and Goku.
Another thing is imagine if Goku would have turned into a Golden Oozaru seeing all those moons on Supreme Kai world if old Kai would have pulled out his tail.
Bro, that spiritbomb feat is one one of the strongest feats in the entire series..... Vegeta got his ass handed to him by a tiny sprititbomb formed from plants and stuff on the earth. Frieza got his ass handed to him by one created by the entire Namek Solar system.... The one that killed Kid Buu was powered by The Z fighter, the androids, King Yemma and his entire work force, the namekians and the supreme kais AND the ENTIRE population of the earth..... No matter how you slice it, that's STRONG AS HELL.
For you to invalidate that feat is truly insane. At no other point in dragonball has anyone ever qualified the type of Ki energy used as a reason as to why an attack didn't work or is not as strong of an attack...... In dragonball, characters CANNOT stop, block, or deflect an attack stronger than themselves EVER. You WILL NOT find an instance where this is NOT true.
Frieza didn't do it. Vegeta didn't do it. For you to say Kid Buu WAS NOT stronger than the spiritbomb thrown at him is just an insane interpretation of things, given that whole rule. And proof from BOTH of those encounters, that they tried their damnest and could not stop the attack......
29:49 Detonate the explosion?????????? That's NOT how the spiritbomb works. Neither time Goku used this before did he actively work to detonate it..... Nor did anyone else. The one that got Vegeta, hit him instantly and started damaging him. Goku was wasted on the sidelines.The one that got Frieza, Goku was ducking for cover, it went off on it's own..... Here Goku actively threw his own power on top to push the attack over the edge..... The attack was STOPPED by Kid Buu's power and Goku then OVERLOADED IT WITH HIS OWN POWER. And after doing that, he was exhuasted again....
I usually agree with you takes on this, but here it seems like you had a conclusion in mind already, then interpreted things to support it.... I mean you literally gloss over the fact that BOTH Vegeta and Goku admit that they underestimated Kid Buu, in the manga..... and that Kid Buu never went all out against him....
Also, WEAKER character have time and time again have been shown to be able to distract, disrupt, hold off, and block character FAR more powerful than themselves. Examples:
- Goku holding Raditz so Piccolo can charge hte Speical Beam Cannon
- Gohan and Krillen vs Frieza MUTLTIPLE times
- Tien using the Tri-Beam on Semi-Perfect Cell
If this can happen here, noting the great power differences, then why can't this be the case for Fat Buu vs Kid Buu????
On top of that you say that Fat Buu no longer has the influnce of the Kais in him, so he's much weaker, well where the hell did they go???? They're not inside Kid Buu......So where are they. South Supreme Kai, who you say powered up Kid Buu IS inside Fat Buu still.....So honestly, his power SHOULDN'T have changed at all...... The only thing that's missing is the evil natural nature of the original Buu... The power from the Daikiaoshin and South Supreme Kai are still inside Fat Buu AND both of them are more powerful than Kid Buu individually.
Idk man, there's just SO much wrong in this video. You can interpret things how you _want_, but that doesn't disprove how others interpret things at all..... You haven't at all proven anything here.... The spiritbomb feat is HUGE, one of the strongest feats in the series. Goku couldn't fucking pull that off. Gohan and the other certainly couldn't.
If you want a REAL definitive answer to this question, PROVE that Gotenks could stop that Spiritbomb attack. Then me and anyone else who disagrees can't say anything.
The Kid Buu disrespect is crazy lmao
Gotenks could have killed super buu if he would stop dicking around and kid buu is weaker than super buu
What disrespect? You mean the overrated power people think he has?
Facts can't be disrespectful
@@XZAVIER-DAA-GODif they underestimated his power at first then it's fair to say goku and vegetas earlier statements aren't valid when scaling kid buu and super buu
@@elijahwatjen9839 yeah but if kid Buu was really stronger then super Buu which still wouldn't make sense because super Buu is a fusion of two buu's, they would actually need Gogeta or Vegito to win
Gotenks could win, but he never takes anybody seriously.
A Super Saiyan Gotenks vs Kid Buu would be a helluva fun fight. Pretty fucking hilarious I'd imagine too. They'd be fairly evenly matched I would think. Of course SS3 Gotenks should obviously beat Kid Buu but that should go without saying.
Piccolo was confident that ssj1 Gotenks could handle Fat Buu, so ssj1 Gotenks is either comparable or stronger than the ssj3 Goku who battled Fat Buu and that's BEFORE Goten and Trunks trained in the time chamber.
Post Time Chamber SSJ1 Gotenks would be stronger than SSJ3 Goku was when he fought Kid Buu. SSJ3 Gotenks would literally OneShot Kid Buu 😅
Bruh didn’t one shot anything the whole saga yet he gone one shot Kid Buu? Fukk no. He blows up Kid Buu, Kid Buu comes back and it’s curtains.
Y’all see repeatedly nobody generates enough energy to kill any Buu until the Spirit Bomb. Y’all also see Gotenks blow Super Buu to shyts multiple times and it doesn’t work.
The anime does a good job at showing this. Go watch Goku point blank Kid Buu to the head and fail and tell me u really believe Gotenks could do it.
Goku outright states they should be able win and minutes later Kid Buu unleashes a blast that him and Vegeta cant stop. What does that tell u fam? That they had severely underestimated Kid Buu.
I just don’t see it. That’s before taking into account Gotenks personality, in which case, he definitely gettin washed. No ifs, no buts.
I think kidd buu is stronger than everyone thinks he is. I don’t think he actually starts trying until that spirit bomb
Talking about this 20 years later
Fr
@@jaylen76 content 🤷♂️
30:35 i think on kid buu is just on another level of not stamina, ruthlessness and unpredictability.
Kid Buu Wins Mid-High Difficulty
Kid Buu is already toying with ssj3 goku and remember that this ssj3 goku didn't hold back like when he fought fat buu also he held the spirit bomb which contains most of Z Fighters and some earthling population also goku stated that kid buu has gotten a lot powerful and dangerous when he last faced him so this just proves that kid buu would absolutely beat super buu also not to mention that gotenks recklessness and childish behavior would led to his easier defeat.
Just for fun:
Vegito>>>>Buuhan>Buutenks>>Ultimate Gohan>Kid Buu>Buff Buu>Buuccolo>Gotenks=Super Buu>Evil Buu>SSJ3 Goku>Fat Buu>>SSJ2 Majin Vegeta
Can you do a video on friezas transformation multipliers
I love your videos Man
If he wanted too, Gotenks could definitely win a decisive victory. But most likely he would play with his food due to the power gap, and because he’s a fool, and his power up would definitely fade before he has a chance to kill Kid Buu.
So, u saying he wasn’t trying against Super Buu? Cause I remember him trying and that shyt not working lol
@maniacslap1623 not at first. He plays around too much. And it’s heavily implied he was close maybe finishing Super Buu until his SSJ3 wore off. Does that mean he would killed him. Idk. Personally I don’t really think so, but regardless of that fact.
The fact of the matter that is that he is relevant to Super Buu. And Super Buu is far stronger than Kid Buu. So Gotenks would stomp Kid Buu if he really tried too.
The Kid Buu disrespect is amazing as usual. And this one statement by Goku seems to triumph over everything else.
Vegita pulls out Fat Buu from Super Buu stating Super Buu power will go down. It is stated to go up. But it must have gone back down due to Goku statement. Regardless that makes no sense. Regardless that no one ever says it. Regardless that Vegita once they defused stated fusion wasn’t necessary anymore as he was never that afraid of super Buu. And regardless that from a writing perspective it at worst makes no sense and at best is confusing if you have a character give a plan the plan is executed the intended result doesn’t happen but then it does happen but the writer doesn’t state it happens it must be inferred. Seriously?
Elder Kioshin states Kid Buu is the most dangerous or difficult (the Japanese word means powerful or dangerous or difficult depending on context according to Herms) That can’t mean power due to Goku statement. It must mean personality. Where has anyone been less intelligent and less powerful but been more difficult?
Goku states Vegita’s wish is to have Gohan and Gotenks fight with them. Somehow either could individually defeat him but he doesn’t say that. Even though Goku stated Gotenks can beat Fat Buu and Gohan can beat Buu with piccolo.
Goku makes a Genki Dama but that’s only Genki. Even though Vegita says Goku is going to get as much energy as he can. Even though a person puts his hands up and he states it took all my energy. Even though ogre in King Yama are on the ground as they gave energy too a physical showing that it is all ki. Even though the Namekians states categorically they gave all their Ki to the Genki Dama, Gohan must not have because Goku stated he can’t beat Super Buu but can beat Kid Buu so Kid Buu must be weaker. I guess Gohan unlike the namekians, king Yama, and random humans, didn’t want to defeat Buu as he only gave a small portion of his ki.
Gotenks with his mind right 1 shots in ssj3.. But Kid Buu is like a guy fired from the job he loves.. Absolute maniac
Super Saiyan gotenks easily would slap around kid buu. However, nothing is certain with any version of buu. I reckon kid buu finds a way to absorb gotenks.
Hence why they didn't fight on the kaio world. Kid buu would reabsorb gohan/gotenks. Buu almost got goku lol (when kid buu turned into a square and approached goku).
Gotenks getting washed. Don’t act like he wasn’t trying against Super Buu. He tried he failed. The Kid would blow his shyt like he tried to do with Goku. If he survives, he gettin hands until his fusion wear off.
It’s like the Gohan fight. We know Gohan coulda won but he lost because he was arrogant. With Gotenks, we don’t even know if he woulda won. He thinks he wins that fight multiple times. Even Piccolo thinks he wins at one point. Both wrong.
Notice Goku went from confidently saying he could, to running from his life when Kid Buu unleashed on the Earth.
Gotenks getting clapped and it ain’t even close.
On lore: My head canon is that Kid Buu “possessed” God Ki but could not access it. He didn’t know how. Thank Kami he never got around anyone who could utilize God Ki because he’d then just summon his own and be UI level and one shot the macrocosm.
I head canon that the Cell Jrs. Wandered around aimlessly before eventually finding 17s island. 17 had been training for like… a week, and so was already Perfect Cell level. Considering he’s SSB level by the time of the TOP 9 years or so later, and SSB is tens if not hundreds of thousands of times stronger than SS2, this is actually a reasonable linear growth rate for 17.
PREACH MIKE
More duper bashing. It deserves every bit of it..... (moment of self reflection) I'm really still salty that super exists.....
I feel like this can be used to Argue Gohans Superiority to Ssj3 Goku
Kid Buu might not be the most powerful but he is the most dangerous bc he isn’t held back by any other motivations. He goes from planet to planet destroying them immediately-along with himself, just to regenerate and move onto the next target. This threat is more concerning to the Z warriors because he doesn’t waste time with vanity, pleasure or proving himself strongest like the other forms of Buu.
Lol what?? Kid Buu was playing around with SSJ3 Goku. Anyway powergap is hugh between SSJ3 Gotenks and Kid buu.
@@francisgomes9976 oookay? Definitely a dragonball fan. You can’t read clearly, because the first thing I said is kid buu isn’t the strongest. Kid buu tries to immediately destroy each planet he goes to. None of the other buu forms do that. He also tries to immediately destroy the planet of the Kai’s immediately before goku and vegeta interrupt him and fight. Watch the anime
@@cslack813 I have already read your first post, you said "kid Buu may not be blah blah but he is most dangerous"
Lol now you are saying "cz how he destroys/blows up each planet right way" , so what does destroying planet had to do with this fight?? 😂😂
Is he going to pull a Freeze move?? That's not what he did when Goku and Vegeta/fat Buu were fighting him.. he didn't go for destroying planet.
This video is about SSJ3 Gotenks vs Kid Buu fight.. it's not about who can destroy the planet fastest 😂😂😂
@@francisgomes9976 are you always this stupid? My comment was never about the fight. If you were familiar with the anime you would know that the whole reason people thought kid buu might be the strongest is because they call him the “most dangerous” form of buu. Specifically Supreme Kai says this. Which brings us back to my first comment…
@@francisgomes9976 yeah power gap is huge, ssj3 gotenks DESTROYS kid buu.
After reading through the comments, I'm glad to see a majority of viewers are thinking the same way; Gotenks is superior in power and takes the win BUT only if he takes things seriously and quickly ends Buu. Seriously, we know this kid would either get absorbed again of play with his prey for too long and Buu would just blow up whatever planet they are on and reform when it's all said and done.
Honestly, I don't even think Gotenks NEEDS to go Super Saiyan 3. Just Super Saiyan 1 Gotenks should be able to get the job done. He should only go SS3 if he NEEDS to and if he is trying to get the job done ASAP because remember SS3 Gotenks only lasts for 5 minutes. Once his energy runs out, he reverts back to base and then defuses quickly after.
I feel like it would end the same way it did super buu though better or worse depending on what you think
Kid buu easy, both would most certainly play around too much and that would frustrate Gotenks distracting them even further. Also we only can assume the regeneration is weaker, but it also isn't insane to think kid buu would still be able to come back from smoke, and Gotenks never showed a more destructive attack to handle that
Original Dragon Ball Z anime says “this is the purely evil, absolutely most powerful, ultimate Majin Buu” about Kid Buu.
And the original anime has Goku say Kid Buu is stronger than anyone he ever fought. Which includes Fat Buu, Buutenks, Buuhan, Super Buu, and Kid Buu.
Don’t forget to mention when Vegeta says Goku is stronger than he imagined.
Just like with Dabura being felt and compared to Cell, then called stronger..
Vegeta sees and feels Goku’s SSJ3 display vs Fat Buu from Other World. The same display was felt in the Kaioshin Realm. Meaning if you’re in Universe 7’s living realm, Universe 7’s afterlife (Other World), or the Kaioshin Realm orbiting Universe 7, and Goku uses SSJ3, you will sense his Ki.
Which brings me to the next two times Goku transforms into SSJ3.
Once for Gohan on the Kaioshin Planet.
And once for Buutenks on Earth.
Since Vegeta was in Universe 7’s Other World, he’d be close enough to sense both SSJ3 power ups from Goku.
Yet when Goku powers up vs Kid Buu (what the Super Exciting Guide described as Full Power is credited as authored by Toriyama), Vegeta admits Goku is stronger than he imagined.
Meaning Goku vs Kid Buu is stronger than Goku was vs Fat Buu, for Gohan, and vs Buutenks.
1. Saiyans get LARGE boosts from: zenkais(near death) fighting long battles, or rage boosts. None of which occur for goku in any continuity other than kid buu. I’m between these ssj3 showings, we see no plausible instance (based on the aforementioned 3 items) to say goku got stronger
2. Goku fought fat buu not with the intent to win, but to stall him. The fight isn’t very long, and once trunks gets the radar goku powers down and we can clearly tell his stamina has just plummeted.
3. Since goku rlly was trying to stall, there’s no reason to believe he was using all his power. Dbz characters fight all the time without being at 100% during a fight. Especially in a fight where the objective is not to win, but stall. For example, cell vs goku. And when you actually analyze the fight, goku was putting it a lot more attacks than fat buu lol.
Goku started the fight with Kid Buu with what the manga, the Super Exciting Guide, and the Daizenshuu 2 Story Guide describe as “full power Super Saiyan 3” and a “full throttle Kamehameha” from close range.
Had zero effect on Kid Buu’s Ki signature.
Thus zero damage.
Goku said he had BEEN TRYING to obliterate Buu and none of his blasts works (2 Kamehameha). So he wanted to charge like he did vs Raditz, how Piccolo did vs Raditz, and how Granolah did vs Gas.
Goku admits at the end that he’d train and get super strong for a rematch. Twice. And starts Super stating that he had no chance on his own.
The fight would objectively go however Kid Buu wanted it to go.
If Kid Buu wanted to drag it out and dance on him like he did Goku, he would. And it’d look like Gotenks was fairing well, like it looked like Goku did.
But if Kid Buu put forth effort to finish Gotenks from the beginning, then Kid Buu would slaughter Gotenks. Quickly.
As he would do to Ultimate Gohan.
Facts
1. Idk why people act like kid buu was dancing on goku the ENTIRE fight 😭😭
2. It was one panel and one scene kid buu was dancing and mocking goku because like all the other buus their stamina and regeneration are off the charts.
3. When he danced goku literally was mad and referenced buu taking his time in regenerating himself.
4. If characters are holding back in dragon ball, you will find statements, instances in a fight where one person takes the advantage and keeps it, etc. example, cell vs goku. Frieza vs everybody.
5. If kid buu is far above goku, it makes no sense for him to not beat the crap outta goku immediately LIKE HE DID VEGETA. Sure vegeta was way weaker than goku, but according to y’all, they are all fodder to kid buu? A mindless, incarnation of evil? Why would an insane character entertain someone way weaker than him and make it seem like goku was holding his own?
6. In the entire fight, the two are fighting relative. Kid buu has stamina and regeneration (like all the other buus) and ssj3 goku’s energy is plummeting like crazy. Which toriyama makes SEVERAL statements about in universe for us the readers to understand.
7. Ultimate gohan slaughters kid buu
Hello, I'm new to your channel. I was wondering if you would make a video explaining why Vegeta skipped ssj3, and most importantly, why he couldn't reach ssj4 on his own. I find that disrespectful to Vegeta because he trains harder than Goku.
I believe him and Geekdom made a video on it together
He did do a video on it, 2 months ago
Ssj3 drains way too much power so he decided not to use it
Thank you for your generosity. I made a video about Why Vegeta Never Went SSJ3 which you can find here: Why Vegeta Never Became A Super Saiyan 3
th-cam.com/video/lK1I0sSW3DY/w-d-xo.html
I have another video planned for later this year about why Baby Vegeta didn’t become an SSJ4, where I’ll discuss the machine and everything else.
@@LSMMIKEAwesome! That's one i'm looking forward to❤❤❤❤❤❤❤
Personally I don't think gotenks has the firepower needed to obliterate Buu. He definitely would overpower buu But would he have enough in him to keep him from regenerating? I feel like compared to a super Buu kid buus regeneration is on a different level.
That’s what I’m saying. Like Goku used the Spirit Bomb for no reason…Gotenks would be clapped as soon as soon Buu woke up. I can think of hypotheticals where he COULD win, knowing what we know, he won’t lol
You have no evidence to support his regeneration is better
Goku is Vastly weaker than Gotenks as Stated multiple times
Of course buu can regen against a weaker opponent
Please read manga
I’m reading, he was vastly stronger than Goku lol or was the Spirit Bomb for no reason?
Regular Full Powered Perfect Cell vs Buu Saga SSj1 Goku.
Goku neg diffs
It's a close match but I think cell would have the slight edge I want you to understand cell was stronger than ssj Gohan who was stronger than cell arc ssj Goku and Goku in the Buu saga is not much stronger than Gohan was I think he does lose but extreme diff
@Nathan24634 I agreed also Cell was on a totally different level of power strength.
@@King-Star9402 yeah only way Goku could win is if we take into account Gohan's rage boost into ssj2 which is very easy to argue and then Goku caught up with Gohan rage boost self which I think turns this in the other direction
Goku bodies easily
Who would win between Ultimate Gohan vs Buff Buu?
If Gotenks was SERIOUS from the start then yes
Kid Buu is not full power Buu fights a piece of himself.
Next Goku and Vegeta are not reliable narrators. They're shown and not be able to detect the kaioshin power. They judge the demon King to be around the same level as Cell when he's arguably more powerful. And Goku expected Gotenks to beat fat buu. Not with more training or with Grade 6 just regular super Saiyan Gotenks.
I'll ended with Goku has been using Spirit bombs against opponents who are at a minimum three times more powerful than himself. The attack has either done serious damage or just straight-up defeated them.
The Spirit bomb against buu being bolstered by Goku. I don't see Gohan or Gotenks tanking it. It's not a big deal with Gohan or Gotenks to be more powerful than Goku but I don't see either one of them being three or four times more powerful.
Just saying that the fight between these two might be a little bit more competitive than we think.
See people who only watch the American dub and played the video game always believe kid buu was stronger
It's not just the dub the anime throws in one line about kid buu being stronger. But events in the anime contradict it. The manga is free of contradictions
@@psychotropicfan elder kai spouting nonsense is always what ruins it.
A lot of people here seem to think Gotenks would ruin it AGAIN by playing around. I don't think so; he was a boasting kid, not a raging moron... He'd be furious for his previous humiliations and nuke Buu.
Kid buu! Gotenks ego will be his undoing as always and kid buu will gladly play with him to drag things out
Yep, he defuse and dead meat, I like gotenks but he isn't ready for kid buu
Y’all are reaching 😂
Is there a reason he says chi instead of ki? Genuinely curious I just haven’t heard anyone else pronounce it that way.
Chi and Ki are the same concept. “Chi” is the Chinese pronunciation, “Ki” is the Japanese. The manga spells it using Chi, so manga readers tend to use that pronunciation.
I alternate pronunciations for Ki, character names and other elements throughout my videos, in part because my audience is comprised of various demographics who use varied pronunciations.
If Gotenks took the fight seriously and tried to kill Buu immediately, then yeah he'd definitely win. As far as raw power goes Gotenks is much stronger than Buu. The issue is he's as arrogant, if not more so, than Vegeta and would likely screw around and burn through his energy without actually killing Buu.
I don't see Gotenks behaving in a way completely uncharacteristically of him so I'll say Kid Buu will win despite being outclassed in power.
Facts. And it’s not even close. More likely Gohan could but even that’s debatable.
That stamina/regeneration ain’t going anywhere and the only scenarios Gotenks wins is if we disregard that lol
But fans gon fans
If he had a technique like the Spirit Bomb, whole different argument. Or something like the Tri-Beam. He would definitely use it and it might work the first time.
It was kind of interesting how much stronger buutenks was than gohan. There is a feat from gohan that briefly impressed buutenks and that’s when he broke out of the ring constraints he was put in. So I can see gohan being able to easily beat buuiccolo. But this was in the anime, that said it seems to add up to show how close gohan was to buutenks just not enough to keep up that intensity.
I hope Sparking Zero gets into some what ifs like this. Gotenks vs Kid Buu and Gohan vs Kid Buu Gotenks absorbed
Gotenks is beating kid buu pretty easily. People forget normal gotenks is already stronger than ssj3 Goku after training super Saiyan alone would be enough to take out Kid buu after his training with ssj3 as a last resort I don’t think he would need to use it against kid buu anyways.
what if kid buu starts training for 10 min? he'd be invincible
if that was the case he would become stronger during the fight. which he didn't do so no
@@seksaouiabderraouf2531how do you know
2:35 don't forget the TM 🤣
Imagine if gotenks learned the parapara damce with theyre ghosts. i know parara isnt really explained but if it could work on anyone it would be strong.
Genki is the aspect of Ki that is energy, that is energy beams, that is aura.
Genki is influenced by Shoki and Yuki which results in the Chi level.
The Genki Dama is the title of the technique, but Goku collects Chi. Not Chi.
Goku can gather from inanimate objects.
They're both childish, goofy characters, I'd like to see that what-if fight in one of the games.
Gotenks would use him like a jump rope like he’s in one piece.
Kid Buu wouldn’t be smart enough to avoid the Super Ghost Kamikaze. Imagine how powerful SSJ3 Ghosts would have been!
Wow I actually never ever thought about this fight at all. But I’m agreeing with the comments saying Kid Buu would get annihilated by a serious Gotenks.
But if we have to make an assumption, a heavy one at that, what does that tell u lol
Lemme make an assumption too, assuming Kid Buu decides to blow up the Kai world instead of actually fighting, Gotenks getting cooked just like Goku and Vegeta almost did if it wasn’t for Kibito.
I had always grown up with the notion of:
Kid Buu =< SSJ3 Goku =< SSJ1 Gotenks < SSJ3 Gotenks < Ultimate Gohan, which gives me some sense as to how this would play out.
I always looked at Gotenks as a disgrace even though hes a kid. If they bring him back in a Super movie. Hopefully hes more serious and not a joke like he been.
If Kid Buu had God ki, that would pretty much contradict all the scaling in the Buu arc entirely. How would SS3 Goku even be able to hurt him?
Kid Buu couldn't use it,it was locked within
The whole idea was a way for Toyotaro to try and make Uub relevant retroactively after they introduced numerous characters far beyond the power of Kid Buu, which in turn made Uub’s potential seem inconsequential. However, based on how God Ki(and Buu’s absorption) actually works, Kid Buu never would have kept it after the split and without the ability to harness/convert it, the God Ki would have reverted to normal Ki.
But, as is often the case, Toyotaro didn’t actually think this idea through when he added it into the manga, or realize the greater implications it had on the story.
God ki doesn't = stronger necessarily, since broly didn't have god ki and he was stronger than both goku and vegeta who had god ki.
The god ki was lying dormant it would seem.
Ass pull to beat Moro + Bad writing I would say lol