To add on to the Qingque thing: That's basically the entire conclusion to Fontaine in Genshin. The prophecy of Celestia still had to come to pass, but the Traveler and their allies were able to change the details of the journey (as pointed out earlier by Nicole). Even though Fontaine did flood and its people were judged, the actual nature of those things were left ambigueous and subject to change. This also mirror Elio's scripts. Like Kafka points out in the opening, if Elio doesn't mention it directly, then it doesn't matter how it is dealt with. Same for Firefly's 'deaths'. The script only says she has to die, it never says how. The conclusions are inevitable, but their details are in flux.
I was thinking about finality and since it is a path related to the tree of imaginary numbers which are the square root of negative numbers (denoted by symbol i) and the fact that imaginary numbers follow a certain cyclical pattern when raised to positive integer exponents such as i^0= 1, i^1= i, i^2=-1, i^3= -i, i^4= 1, i^5= i, i^6=-1 and so on, this implies that finality is not the path representing an end but rather a continuous cycle of repeating imaginary quantities (due to the positive integer exponent that i is being raised to most likely represents the periodic phase of that specific universe; this is why there is most likely only 4 unique discernible variants of Welt that have existed on the imaginary tree. We only have yet experienced one variant of Welt (Variant 1), however, theoretically it is possible to encounter three more unique versions of him in the future. Slight genetic alterations of a character such as with firefly which would be represented as variant 0 (i^0) and would function as the same type of variant as variant 4 (i^4) even though they would genetically and phenotypically be distinct. This is because both firefly variant 0 and firefly variant 4 would both LACK any imaginary energy whatsoever due to them only containing real energy. This is the only notable similarity between such variants. Overall, this connects to a deeper hypothesis about the imaginary tree (y-axis) and how it essentially functions as being a cyclical representation of imaginary numbers located above the reality bridge (x-axis) with variants 1,5,9,13 and so on are most likely the most compatible with forming a connection with the imaginary tree resulting in the birth of a 1D imaginary projection representing the conception of an idea and the person as its overseer (guardian) that still remains following the next cycle (this is why Fuli is programmed to be concerned with memories as they still exist in a continuous state. What happens to those that do happen to ascend to an aeonic state (ID imaginary projection of themselves)? Consequently, their consciousness is transferred to the 1D projection and then modified substantially while establishing the effects of the primum mobile to ensure the projection is not compromised by the discrete properties of the sea of quanta. This is to ensure maximum continuity. Individuals who are variants 1,5,9,13 and so on are probably those attributed with the imaginary element in game such as Yukong, Dr. Ratio, Loucha, and Welt. These individuals have the highest probabilities to ascend to an aeonic state due to their natural infinity to the continuous fluctuations of imaginary numbers and serve as eternal guardians of the tree. Individuals such as Clara, Natasha, Boothill, Robin, Sushang are all physical type characters that signify real numbers and thus belong to Version 0,4,8,12 and so on. I am unsure of how the other types within the game correlate to the other versions relating to -i, and -1. The trailblazer I hypothesize is a unique example of this cyclical effect within the game as he is first found playable as a physical type character and then transitions into an imaginary type character later on. This character complicates the correlation as how can a character such as the trailblazer be highly compatible with the imaginary tree and yet at the same time be grounded on the bridge of reality. This is because I think the trailblazer represents two characters in one; a dual version similar to how any individual QUANTIZED can exhibit two states at the same time; a particle and a wave. In case you don’t know, a wave can be categorized through the function f(x)= cosx+ isinx which explains exactly why the trailblazer can swap between real, physical power (cosx) and imaginary power (isinx) at any time as well as explaining the quantum connection that the trailblazer has and why the trailblazer is the true opposition of the imaginary tree. Finality’s purpose I hypothesize is simply to transition the imaginary tree to the next version of numbers which would randomize the character’s version DATA and thus amplify the amount of possible projections that the tree can establish further growing the continuity it seeks to expand exponentially. All the data from the characters thus most likely comes from the sea of data and this is how the tree seeks to absorb the sea by continuously converting the sea’s data to Aeons or extensions of itself which is why the primum mobile exists which is to prevent rebellion from the sea of quanta. Characters are after all the smallest possible playable unit in the game making them all “quantum”. The trailblazer is truly unique as I hypothesize the player is the sole reason. As the player continues to collect more and more quantized playable units, the imaginary tree consequently has less opportunities to absorb the data to continue nourishing and sustaining itself. The trailblazer functions kind of as a vacuum absorbing all of the characters preventing the tree from growing properly by assimilating the sea’s data as part of its own 1D projections. Final thoughts: Many consider Aeons to be powerful entities within the lore of Honkai Star rail considered to be gods among the peoples. However, as aeons are considered to be addressed as THEY by the game and bound by THEIR primum mobile, something seems a bit off. As one understands the true nature of imaginary numbers and how they are used to represent rotations among the complex plane, and how there are various “versions” or “expies” of characters sprinkled among Hoyoverse games, one seems to wonder the true purpose of these characters and why some characters are designated as imaginary, physical, or something in between. And then, one would come to hypothesize about the connections between the imaginary tree and the sea of quanta and how the tree supposedly absorbs the sea. Why are characters like Nanook pushed into such desperate situations where products of the Aeons in the form of the Swarm disaster and rebellious inorganic lifeforms coincidentally trigger the rise of another Aeon? Or what about the mockery of Dr. Veritas Ratio and how products of Quilpoth (IPC) and Nous (Genius Society) lead Dr. Ratio down a similar tragic path as Nanook? This is just a hypothesis I have about the greater implications of Aeons and how I think that like Nanook, Terminus the Aeon was formed by similar circumstances involving the products of some forms of Aeons and thus is doomed to an eternity of a niche exclusively guarding over the cyclical nature of imaginary numbers to ensure the imaginary tree can keep on expanding exponentially, continuously, forever.
This is probably the best explanation of the relationship between the Imaginary Tree and the Sea of Quanta I have read up to date. You, Sir/Ma'am, deserve an award.
It was great the learn all of this. I'm so curious about the relationship between Idrila and Terminus , in fables of the stars They appeared right after the beauty but hidden and Idrila is also called the end of all things
Yeah, Finality shows up a few times in that last section. I interpreted it as a way of showing that Finality was hidden, or that they had something to do with all the aeons.
Honestly, Idrila heavily reminds me of Elysia. I mean, it's mostly just speculation, but, considering what happen to Elysia in HI3 and Idrila's connection to finality... Their fates may be similar, just saying.
The Trailblazer's existence also changed Elio's scripts for the Stellarons, as he would often revolve and expand around ones of particular importance, which Firefly noted he no longer followed after the Trailblazer's existence.
Wow, nice one. I had some similar thoughts (about HoYo's usage of Samsara, a concept of Finality in HI3 and other stuff) but never managed to dig that deep, that's brilliant. The only thing I can say against Elio being a plot-maker against Finality (and it actually bothers me) is Aeon's primum mobile. For example, Nanook destroys since he's Destruction, Yaoshi creates life, mostly in its ugliest forms, because they can't do anything against it and so on. So, Terminus, the very essense of a permanent path to an inevitable end, whispers prophecies in their dreams... what would those phophecies lead to? I mean, if their primum mobile is reaching the end of the cycle and starting anew, shouldn't their prophecies work according to their primum mobile? So basically, if you decipher them, recieve a revelation from Terminus and go with it, you're about to bring the Finality a little bit closer. But okay, let's say Elio deciphers Terminuse's prophecies and goes against them... but if his source of knowledge about the future are Terminuse's whispers, he can't make his scripts that detailed because, well, if you do what is said in prophecy, you just do it as written. But if you go against what was "said", you... there's just too many options and variables to make a "script" that works time and time again because you don't know what will happen outside of what was said in the prophecy right? So, judging by Elio's fairly detailed scripts, he's doing exactly what Terminus says. And because of primum mobile, it should bring the world to Finality again, not to breaking the cycle. Also it's pretty interesting how TB holds his Destruction bat tightly through the course of the story. Not a flaming lance, not a funny hat -- a bat. Could it be... Destruction's authority can somehow suppress Finality's authority and basically Destruct the fate and the cycle itself? I mean, not by itself but after a ton of preparations. This thought really bugs me.
Maybe I didnt explain it well enough, but your reasoning is pretty much exactly why I thought that Elio WASN'T working with Finality. See, if dreaming about the future is something any shapeless (and friends) can do independently, that means Elio can make scripts beyond what Terminus says. It really comes down to whether or not Terminus is the sole distributor of prophecy (which I doubt, cause no other aeon is the sole distributor of their trait - merely a specialist).
@@LalodysLore , hmm. But only counts if he both deciphers prophecies and have another source of seeing future. An interesting thought, yeah, maybe I'm still sleepy and wasn't able to add 2+2 haha. I thought you implied Elio really believes what Terminus "whispers" and follows it, unlike some other characters who use their ability to gain power and profit even from/using Terminus.
Elio's and Terminus relationship could be similar to Acheron and IX. "Treading the path of" doesn't really mean "following" like "obeying" the will or orders of the Aeon. The relationship between the Paths and the pathstriders is complicated.
@@ascaron137 , yeah, by all means. It just bugged me how detailed Elio's scripts are, meaning if they're detailed, then he follows what Terminus whispers (because he knows only what Terminus whispers and can't do detailed plots outside those whispers). But if Lalody is right and Elio has other ways to predict future in great detail, then yeah, he can counterplot against Terminus' prophecies. All this is relevant only if I'm right and Terminus, driven by his primum mobile that's supposed to lead to the Finality, "prophesies" things that have to happen for the world to reach its end (i. e. Finality) since this is what we strive to stop.
your lore videos are always a treat! id like to add some things ive noticed ingame about the finality: when you try using finality's vision (the function allowing lower leveled players to access later quests), finality is described as the antithesis to the trailblaze (which is very true, but i feel like it an interesting way for them to put things) in the "factions" part of the data bank, it is not said that the stellaron hunters are followers of terminus, even though jade declared (or theorized, i dont remember which) they were; this proves there's more to it than just. elio being a follower of terminus imo
Another new great video! :D your theories are always a treat to watch. and for a video suggestion : a sunday and robin deepdive. their connection to oroboros + ena is super interesting, and hoyo is gatekeeping their lore before they came to gopher wood ;_; their mom is super sus…the oroboros stuff could be relevant to finality, their endgame, and perhaps the stellaron hunters :3 oh, i keep going to the beach and watching the sunset and sunrise. it reminds me of oroboros’s red sea at the edge of the universe whenever i go , which is probably fueling my suggestion xD
@@LalodysLoreThere is also the subtle hints that Sunday may join us at the astral express crew and become part of it in the future. I'd love it if you talked about him, hoyo wants to keep him in the basement for some reason 😭
Your videos are always SO GOOD it makes me wanna devour every bit of lore there is Now for a suggestion, how do you feel about making videos about the individual stories of some characters?
Ahh!! That's so good to hear!! And making videos about individual character stories could be really fun!?? Somewhat similar to my video about Mikhail but less dense...
Honestly I really appreciate you dossecting the lore in all yhose texs because I wish I had the patience to. Defo my go to Hsr lore channel . Extra points for the gay stuff.
idk where this part can fit in the video, but it would be nice if you mentioned how of all things in the HSR universe, Yaoshi wants to "cure" the Finality from the universe, because the idea of Finality clashes with their ideology of everlasting blessings. (this is referenced from the Data Bank.)
I think it's actually the case for most of the aeons, except maybe Oroboros who seems tied with the samsara conceptually. The cure to the infinite samsara can be approached in many ways... yaoshi wants to prevent it, and nanook probably wants to destroy everything so it can't reset. Remembrance wants to preserve the data before it resets (presumably to reload everything). Aha is doing god knows what but they probably orchestrated swarm disaster which stopped the Oroboros, so I assume they're also on the stop samsara side. Xipe is a likely a product of Qlipoth+Aha's transmutation shenanigans... Equilibrium is the 'gamemaster' that seems to control everything so idk what box to put them in. In both gnosticism and buddhist/hindu philosophies, the goal is to ascend beyond the mortal planes. Beat the oroboros = gnosticism, beat the samsara = eastern philosophy. That's probably the agenda of most of the aeons, so it should come down to us (ascenders) vs them (samsara enforcers).
What if Terminus is not technically an Aeon, but rather sth close, cos rather than a path/ way of existence, it represents the culmination and end of all paths, which is why it seems so different from the others. If thats the case, it would be interesting to see if and how it is related to the cocoon of finality. Hoyo decided to name it a cocoon after all
the leviathan dying and splitting into smaller shapeless beings could correlate with oroboros randomly disappearing while working closely with the swarm before qilpoth destroyed split tazzyroth and encased his remains in amber
My theory about the Stelleron is different than yours but I like yours too. What if Stelleron are what is needed for one to ascend to Aeonhood. If you think about it, every wish that the Stelleron granted was a twisted version of the path that the individual followed. The eternal freeze was caused because of a wish to preserve one’s own people. Frozen in ice. Frozen in time. Preserved in ice. The exact opposite to what the Amber Lord represents. A burning determination to fight against change. The lance of preservation has powers related to fire and protection. While the eternal freeze is inherently cold. The wish for the Arbor to grow once again. The wish for an abundant future where you can live life to its fullest. Lifespans were increased but at a cost. One’s own mind was altered. You are physically alive but mentally you are no longer who you once were. The eternal dream, a wish for order and harmony amongst the people. It became a prison of ones of desires. A dream turned to nightmare. And then there is what happened to Cocolia. She tried to absorb the Stelleron and became what resembled a Fragmentum monster. But she also kinda resembled the Aeon of Remembrance Fuli. I personally believe that Cocolia almost became an Aeon but was not able to withstand the power. Perhaps there was a prerequisite that she didn’t achieve. That leads to my next point, the Trailblazer. What is their wish? To reach the end of the story in their own way? Perhaps, we just don’t know yet. They lost their memory and as a result they are a husk of who they once were. Perhaps that lack of self was what allowed them to contain a Stelleron inside them. Because without a wish to grant, the Stelleron is practically powerless. But when the Trailblazer wanted to protect March from the Doomsday Beast, the Stelleron reacted to that wish. Luckily Welt was able to seal the Stelleron before anything could happen. While the Stelleron is sealed, the Trailblazer can have a sense of self, a goal to strive for. Perhaps at the end of their journey, the seal will be lifted and the Trailblazer will be able to tap into the power of the Stelleron and be able to ascend into Aeonhood. I call this theory the Stelleron Seed Theory. Stelleron are the Seeds of the Aeons.
*Amphoreus* gonna have something to do with Finality I bet, and their gimmick is *Time Bending* My current theory is Amphoreus is a *lost place that existed outside of our "System Hour".* The beginning of time started very late there compared to our time, therefore if we were to visit that place, they may not exist already, and technically our timeline/system hour is their future. But the Remembrance has the ability to collect memories from the present and the past, that's why Black Swan can sense their existence through their memories. And if this is true, in their timeline, Amphoreus is currently heading towards their end/final which will be tied to Finality and the quote: "everything will start again" when we broke the rules and go back in time (with the aid of Black Swan/Elio) to save Amphoreus from whatever will happen to them, thus we created a Butterfly effect when saving them. After we go back to the future (our timeline/system hour), Amphoreus will now exist in our timeline but not only that, because of our own making, the whole universe will have some minor or major changes. We will also notice that our fuel got filled by a lot of Trailblazing experience because of how we fast forwarded in time from "Amphoreus time matrix/the Past" to "System Hour/the Present", this is counted as years of trailblazing experiences.
Big Crunch is considered very unlikely these days, if anything Big Rip is more likely because the expansion of the universe is accelerating; but the predominant theory is Heat Death.
Great video and editing skill! I still disagree with Elio's part, but nice write up. 👍 I think you should keep the wubawoo for branding lmao, it's too cute.
since the next xz arc will have March's new path, maybe they'll reveal more about March's past. also since the "heartwarming and uplifting" writer is doing the script, maybe March will also get impaled and Danheng will use the forbidden vidyadhara resurrection spell turning March into a bow user pink elf
I wonder how the path of Finality will work gameplay wise just wondering other I do have an idea of Finality characters messing with buffs and debuffs on noth alies and enemies
Could the seawater be in reference to the sea of Quanta? Also, is the Sea of Quanta the memory zone? I always thought the memory zone was different, but the Nhility/sleep connections and *potential* Genshin connections (I don't know if you watch Ashikai, but they did a really good world structure theory that I think probably does apply too the rest of the hoyo-verse)
the issue is, how accurate is the info we get from Elegy? remember, Elegy never meet Terminus, Elegy in this case is similar to Duke Inferno, they haven't got gazed by the aeons they are worshipping. are all the infos she said is true or is it a biased view because they worship Finality?
Is there anything she said that might not be true that was mentioned in this video? We've already seen Finality silence the Order (and thus Xipe by extension) and we know they're the shapeless prince against the current from the aeons myriad trailer.
@@someoneinasia They don't I guess but it's not very likely that they'd write all this lore up only for it to be totally wrong on something like that I think
It doesn't make sense when you consider the ending of hi3. And yes, the games are linked whether people believe it or not. What about the fact that only Kiana has successfully embraced finality? And even senadina failed? This is all a mess. This retcons the entire ending and part 2 of hi3. No aeon has reached earth. Yet, Kiana is an emanator level herrscher of finality.
@GolgothianSylex I wasn't very clear with my comment but that's exactly my point. This video tries to link the two but it can't be the case, which is why I said it doesn't make sense. My point that I was trying to express is that the only person to successfully embrace finality is Kiana. My final sentence was more of a sarcastic response than a statement. This person is claiming she is an emanator level yet the cocoon isn't even an Aeon. In fact the cocoon transcends dimensions and isnt tied to the tree unlike aeons which are tied to it.
@@KoKoNuTz232 Hoyo loves Samsara, so most points are correct, especially if Elegy is to be believed. And Hoyo loves reusing old story - Ena's dream, for example. Exact relation of Cocoon has no meaning in this(even entity has no meaning - only story theme matters). It is just that Terminus knows everything and it is very hard to plot anything against their Finality.
@@GolgothianSylex in hi3, the earth has transcended the samsara. And as stated, in all the billions of years that the cocoon has existed only Kiana has been the successful embrace. Not one other being has ever embraced the cocoon successfully. Therefore, there cannot be an Aeon of finality, especially not the same finality as hi3. On top of that, aeon's are not as high dimensional beings as the cocoon is. The Cocoon exists independent of the imaginary tree, aeons do not. So there cannot be an Aeon of the same finality as hi3. And the Hanzi used supports this statement. Finality is not clairvoyance, finality is time, as stated by kevin. If the cocoon knew that only Kiana would ever embrace it, then what was the purpose of the cocoon using trial and error on Venus and Mars before the earth? The terminus in hsr just does not match up with finality and the established lore in honkai impact 3rd, and especially not in ggz.
Path of Finality and Beauty feud is a nod to Kiana. She's the Herrscher of Finality / End, yet she's the protector of Earth and all that's 'beautiful', which is Schicksal's motto created by Otto and inspired by Kallen: "To protect all that's beautiful in this world." Kiana is definitely a Pathstrider of Beauty by nature yet she have alignment to the Finality by being the 'Emanator' of the Cocoon of Finality as mentioned in HI3rd Part 2 Chapter 5 by a Memokeeper who intrudes Kiana's dream.
![The Birth of Tayzzyronth | Swarm Disaster Origin Universe [SU-1]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/wXePVXbqxQY/mqdefault.jpg)
To add on to the Qingque thing: That's basically the entire conclusion to Fontaine in Genshin. The prophecy of Celestia still had to come to pass, but the Traveler and their allies were able to change the details of the journey (as pointed out earlier by Nicole). Even though Fontaine did flood and its people were judged, the actual nature of those things were left ambigueous and subject to change.
This also mirror Elio's scripts. Like Kafka points out in the opening, if Elio doesn't mention it directly, then it doesn't matter how it is dealt with. Same for Firefly's 'deaths'. The script only says she has to die, it never says how. The conclusions are inevitable, but their details are in flux.
I love how Qingque little story is such a huge hint to connect things haha
We need to keep a eye on her, she keeps showing up when we least expect!
Definitely worth keeping a close eye on her...
video suggestion: herta memory bubbles
That's definitely an interesting idea
Once again, you cooked, especially with the Elio being a Heliobus!
Right?? I'm so sure about that but we'll see haha
Terminus and Finality related things always fascinate me
I was thinking about finality and since it is a path related to the tree of imaginary numbers which are the square root of negative numbers (denoted by symbol i) and the fact that imaginary numbers follow a certain cyclical pattern when raised to positive integer exponents such as i^0= 1, i^1= i, i^2=-1, i^3= -i, i^4= 1, i^5= i, i^6=-1 and so on, this implies that finality is not the path representing an end but rather a continuous cycle of repeating imaginary quantities (due to the positive integer exponent that i is being raised to most likely represents the periodic phase of that specific universe; this is why there is most likely only 4 unique discernible variants of Welt that have existed on the imaginary tree. We only have yet experienced one variant of Welt (Variant 1), however, theoretically it is possible to encounter three more unique versions of him in the future. Slight genetic alterations of a character such as with firefly which would be represented as variant 0 (i^0) and would function as the same type of variant as variant 4 (i^4) even though they would genetically and phenotypically be distinct. This is because both firefly variant 0 and firefly variant 4 would both LACK any imaginary energy whatsoever due to them only containing real energy. This is the only notable similarity between such variants.
Overall, this connects to a deeper hypothesis about the imaginary tree (y-axis) and how it essentially functions as being a cyclical representation of imaginary numbers located above the reality bridge (x-axis) with variants 1,5,9,13 and so on are most likely the most compatible with forming a connection with the imaginary tree resulting in the birth of a 1D imaginary projection representing the conception of an idea and the person as its overseer (guardian) that still remains following the next cycle (this is why Fuli is programmed to be concerned with memories as they still exist in a continuous state.
What happens to those that do happen to ascend to an aeonic state (ID imaginary projection of themselves)? Consequently, their consciousness is transferred to the 1D projection and then modified substantially while establishing the effects of the primum mobile to ensure the projection is not compromised by the discrete properties of the sea of quanta. This is to ensure maximum continuity. Individuals who are variants 1,5,9,13 and so on are probably those attributed with the imaginary element in game such as Yukong, Dr. Ratio, Loucha, and Welt. These individuals have the highest probabilities to ascend to an aeonic state due to their natural infinity to the continuous fluctuations of imaginary numbers and serve as eternal guardians of the tree. Individuals such as Clara, Natasha, Boothill, Robin, Sushang are all physical type characters that signify real numbers and thus belong to Version 0,4,8,12 and so on. I am unsure of how the other types within the game correlate to the other versions relating to -i, and -1.
The trailblazer I hypothesize is a unique example of this cyclical effect within the game as he is first found playable as a physical type character and then transitions into an imaginary type character later on. This character complicates the correlation as how can a character such as the trailblazer be highly compatible with the imaginary tree and yet at the same time be grounded on the bridge of reality. This is because I think the trailblazer represents two characters in one; a dual version similar to how any individual QUANTIZED can exhibit two states at the same time; a particle and a wave. In case you don’t know, a wave can be categorized through the function f(x)= cosx+ isinx which explains exactly why the trailblazer can swap between real, physical power (cosx) and imaginary power (isinx) at any time as well as explaining the quantum connection that the trailblazer has and why the trailblazer is the true opposition of the imaginary tree.
Finality’s purpose I hypothesize is simply to transition the imaginary tree to the next version of numbers which would randomize the character’s version DATA and thus amplify the amount of possible projections that the tree can establish further growing the continuity it seeks to expand exponentially. All the data from the characters thus most likely comes from the sea of data and this is how the tree seeks to absorb the sea by continuously converting the sea’s data to Aeons or extensions of itself which is why the primum mobile exists which is to prevent rebellion from the sea of quanta. Characters are after all the smallest possible playable unit in the game making them all “quantum”.
The trailblazer is truly unique as I hypothesize the player is the sole reason. As the player continues to collect more and more quantized playable units, the imaginary tree consequently has less opportunities to absorb the data to continue nourishing and sustaining itself. The trailblazer functions kind of as a vacuum absorbing all of the characters preventing the tree from growing properly by assimilating the sea’s data as part of its own 1D projections.
Final thoughts: Many consider Aeons to be powerful entities within the lore of Honkai Star rail considered to be gods among the peoples. However, as aeons are considered to be addressed as THEY by the game and bound by THEIR primum mobile, something seems a bit off. As one understands the true nature of imaginary numbers and how they are used to represent rotations among the complex plane, and how there are various “versions” or “expies” of characters sprinkled among Hoyoverse games, one seems to wonder the true purpose of these characters and why some characters are designated as imaginary, physical, or something in between. And then, one would come to hypothesize about the connections between the imaginary tree and the sea of quanta and how the tree supposedly absorbs the sea. Why are characters like Nanook pushed into such desperate situations where products of the Aeons in the form of the Swarm disaster and rebellious inorganic lifeforms coincidentally trigger the rise of another Aeon? Or what about the mockery of Dr. Veritas Ratio and how products of Quilpoth (IPC) and Nous (Genius Society) lead Dr. Ratio down a similar tragic path as Nanook? This is just a hypothesis I have about the greater implications of Aeons and how I think that like Nanook, Terminus the Aeon was formed by similar circumstances involving the products of some forms of Aeons and thus is doomed to an eternity of a niche exclusively guarding over the cyclical nature of imaginary numbers to ensure the imaginary tree can keep on expanding exponentially, continuously, forever.
This is probably the best explanation of the relationship between the Imaginary Tree and the Sea of Quanta I have read up to date. You, Sir/Ma'am, deserve an award.
That was one heck hell of explanation
Im simply astounded
It was great the learn all of this. I'm so curious about the relationship between Idrila and Terminus , in fables of the stars They appeared right after the beauty but hidden and Idrila is also called the end of all things
Yeah, Finality shows up a few times in that last section. I interpreted it as a way of showing that Finality was hidden, or that they had something to do with all the aeons.
Honestly, Idrila heavily reminds me of Elysia. I mean, it's mostly just speculation, but, considering what happen to Elysia in HI3 and Idrila's connection to finality... Their fates may be similar, just saying.
The Trailblazer's existence also changed Elio's scripts for the Stellarons, as he would often revolve and expand around ones of particular importance, which Firefly noted he no longer followed after the Trailblazer's existence.
Wow, nice one. I had some similar thoughts (about HoYo's usage of Samsara, a concept of Finality in HI3 and other stuff) but never managed to dig that deep, that's brilliant.
The only thing I can say against Elio being a plot-maker against Finality (and it actually bothers me) is Aeon's primum mobile. For example, Nanook destroys since he's Destruction, Yaoshi creates life, mostly in its ugliest forms, because they can't do anything against it and so on. So, Terminus, the very essense of a permanent path to an inevitable end, whispers prophecies in their dreams... what would those phophecies lead to? I mean, if their primum mobile is reaching the end of the cycle and starting anew, shouldn't their prophecies work according to their primum mobile? So basically, if you decipher them, recieve a revelation from Terminus and go with it, you're about to bring the Finality a little bit closer. But okay, let's say Elio deciphers Terminuse's prophecies and goes against them... but if his source of knowledge about the future are Terminuse's whispers, he can't make his scripts that detailed because, well, if you do what is said in prophecy, you just do it as written. But if you go against what was "said", you... there's just too many options and variables to make a "script" that works time and time again because you don't know what will happen outside of what was said in the prophecy right? So, judging by Elio's fairly detailed scripts, he's doing exactly what Terminus says. And because of primum mobile, it should bring the world to Finality again, not to breaking the cycle.
Also it's pretty interesting how TB holds his Destruction bat tightly through the course of the story. Not a flaming lance, not a funny hat -- a bat. Could it be... Destruction's authority can somehow suppress Finality's authority and basically Destruct the fate and the cycle itself? I mean, not by itself but after a ton of preparations. This thought really bugs me.
Maybe I didnt explain it well enough, but your reasoning is pretty much exactly why I thought that Elio WASN'T working with Finality. See, if dreaming about the future is something any shapeless (and friends) can do independently, that means Elio can make scripts beyond what Terminus says. It really comes down to whether or not Terminus is the sole distributor of prophecy (which I doubt, cause no other aeon is the sole distributor of their trait - merely a specialist).
@@LalodysLore , hmm. But only counts if he both deciphers prophecies and have another source of seeing future. An interesting thought, yeah, maybe I'm still sleepy and wasn't able to add 2+2 haha. I thought you implied Elio really believes what Terminus "whispers" and follows it, unlike some other characters who use their ability to gain power and profit even from/using Terminus.
Elio's and Terminus relationship could be similar to Acheron and IX. "Treading the path of" doesn't really mean "following" like "obeying" the will or orders of the Aeon. The relationship between the Paths and the pathstriders is complicated.
@@ascaron137 , yeah, by all means. It just bugged me how detailed Elio's scripts are, meaning if they're detailed, then he follows what Terminus whispers (because he knows only what Terminus whispers and can't do detailed plots outside those whispers). But if Lalody is right and Elio has other ways to predict future in great detail, then yeah, he can counterplot against Terminus' prophecies.
All this is relevant only if I'm right and Terminus, driven by his primum mobile that's supposed to lead to the Finality, "prophesies" things that have to happen for the world to reach its end (i. e. Finality) since this is what we strive to stop.
Have never felt disappointed whenever you post something. Always very interesting topics that I really enjoy!! ♥️
I'm glad you enjoyed it!
Wheeeeeeee new video! Speak your truth Elio 🙏
17:37 "beneath the silent waters lies an endless abyss". --Black Swan
HELLL YEA, I WAS WAITING FOR THIS!!!!
I love your videos and theories, they are great
Thank you!
15:03 THANK YOU IM SO GLAD IM NOT THE ONLY ONE WHO THINKS THIS IT MAKES SO MUCH SENSE
your lore videos are always a treat! id like to add some things ive noticed ingame about the finality:
when you try using finality's vision (the function allowing lower leveled players to access later quests), finality is described as the antithesis to the trailblaze (which is very true, but i feel like it an interesting way for them to put things)
in the "factions" part of the data bank, it is not said that the stellaron hunters are followers of terminus, even though jade declared (or theorized, i dont remember which) they were; this proves there's more to it than just. elio being a follower of terminus imo
I imagine Elio will look like Sebastian from Black Butler, but with cat ears.
In before hoyo uses the picture you used for the actual Finality. Would be a great bit
Hire me Hoyo
Another new great video! :D your theories are always a treat to watch. and for a video suggestion : a sunday and robin deepdive. their connection to oroboros + ena is super interesting, and hoyo is gatekeeping their lore before they came to gopher wood ;_; their mom is super sus…the oroboros stuff could be relevant to finality, their endgame, and perhaps the stellaron hunters :3
oh, i keep going to the beach and watching the sunset and sunrise. it reminds me of oroboros’s red sea at the edge of the universe whenever i go , which is probably fueling my suggestion xD
Oh that's an interesting suggestion - there's a lot I could say about them...
@@LalodysLoreThere is also the subtle hints that Sunday may join us at the astral express crew and become part of it in the future. I'd love it if you talked about him, hoyo wants to keep him in the basement for some reason 😭
Your videos are always SO GOOD it makes me wanna devour every bit of lore there is
Now for a suggestion, how do you feel about making videos about the individual stories of some characters?
Ahh!! That's so good to hear!! And making videos about individual character stories could be really fun!?? Somewhat similar to my video about Mikhail but less dense...
Honestly I really appreciate you dossecting the lore in all yhose texs because I wish I had the patience to. Defo my go to Hsr lore channel . Extra points for the gay stuff.
idk where this part can fit in the video, but it would be nice if you mentioned how of all things in the HSR universe, Yaoshi wants to "cure" the Finality from the universe, because the idea of Finality clashes with their ideology of everlasting blessings.
(this is referenced from the Data Bank.)
I think it's actually the case for most of the aeons, except maybe Oroboros who seems tied with the samsara conceptually. The cure to the infinite samsara can be approached in many ways... yaoshi wants to prevent it, and nanook probably wants to destroy everything so it can't reset. Remembrance wants to preserve the data before it resets (presumably to reload everything). Aha is doing god knows what but they probably orchestrated swarm disaster which stopped the Oroboros, so I assume they're also on the stop samsara side. Xipe is a likely a product of Qlipoth+Aha's transmutation shenanigans... Equilibrium is the 'gamemaster' that seems to control everything so idk what box to put them in.
In both gnosticism and buddhist/hindu philosophies, the goal is to ascend beyond the mortal planes. Beat the oroboros = gnosticism, beat the samsara = eastern philosophy. That's probably the agenda of most of the aeons, so it should come down to us (ascenders) vs them (samsara enforcers).
First good lore channel that instead of wanting to get on with it I wish there was more said
What if Terminus is not technically an Aeon, but rather sth close, cos rather than a path/ way of existence, it represents the culmination and end of all paths, which is why it seems so different from the others. If thats the case, it would be interesting to see if and how it is related to the cocoon of finality. Hoyo decided to name it a cocoon after all
the leviathan dying and splitting into smaller shapeless beings could correlate with oroboros randomly disappearing while working closely with the swarm before qilpoth destroyed split tazzyroth and encased his remains in amber
My theory about the Stelleron is different than yours but I like yours too.
What if Stelleron are what is needed for one to ascend to Aeonhood. If you think about it, every wish that the Stelleron granted was a twisted version of the path that the individual followed. The eternal freeze was caused because of a wish to preserve one’s own people. Frozen in ice. Frozen in time. Preserved in ice. The exact opposite to what the Amber Lord represents. A burning determination to fight against change. The lance of preservation has powers related to fire and protection. While the eternal freeze is inherently cold. The wish for the Arbor to grow once again. The wish for an abundant future where you can live life to its fullest. Lifespans were increased but at a cost. One’s own mind was altered. You are physically alive but mentally you are no longer who you once were. The eternal dream, a wish for order and harmony amongst the people. It became a prison of ones of desires. A dream turned to nightmare. And then there is what happened to Cocolia. She tried to absorb the Stelleron and became what resembled a Fragmentum monster. But she also kinda resembled the Aeon of Remembrance Fuli. I personally believe that Cocolia almost became an Aeon but was not able to withstand the power. Perhaps there was a prerequisite that she didn’t achieve. That leads to my next point, the Trailblazer. What is their wish? To reach the end of the story in their own way? Perhaps, we just don’t know yet. They lost their memory and as a result they are a husk of who they once were. Perhaps that lack of self was what allowed them to contain a Stelleron inside them. Because without a wish to grant, the Stelleron is practically powerless. But when the Trailblazer wanted to protect March from the Doomsday Beast, the Stelleron reacted to that wish. Luckily Welt was able to seal the Stelleron before anything could happen. While the Stelleron is sealed, the Trailblazer can have a sense of self, a goal to strive for. Perhaps at the end of their journey, the seal will be lifted and the Trailblazer will be able to tap into the power of the Stelleron and be able to ascend into Aeonhood.
I call this theory the Stelleron Seed Theory.
Stelleron are the Seeds of the Aeons.
*Amphoreus* gonna have something to do with Finality I bet, and their gimmick is *Time Bending*
My current theory is Amphoreus is a *lost place that existed outside of our "System Hour".*
The beginning of time started very late there compared to our time, therefore if we were to visit that place, they may not exist already, and technically our timeline/system hour is their future. But the Remembrance has the ability to collect memories from the present and the past, that's why Black Swan can sense their existence through their memories.
And if this is true, in their timeline, Amphoreus is currently heading towards their end/final which will be tied to Finality and the quote: "everything will start again" when we broke the rules and go back in time (with the aid of Black Swan/Elio) to save Amphoreus from whatever will happen to them, thus we created a Butterfly effect when saving them.
After we go back to the future (our timeline/system hour), Amphoreus will now exist in our timeline but not only that, because of our own making, the whole universe will have some minor or major changes. We will also notice that our fuel got filled by a lot of Trailblazing experience because of how we fast forwarded in time from "Amphoreus time matrix/the Past" to "System Hour/the Present", this is counted as years of trailblazing experiences.
Big Crunch is considered very unlikely these days, if anything Big Rip is more likely because the expansion of the universe is accelerating; but the predominant theory is Heat Death.
Elegy... like for the End? Huh
Great video and editing skill! I still disagree with Elio's part, but nice write up. 👍
I think you should keep the wubawoo for branding lmao, it's too cute.
since the next xz arc will have March's new path, maybe they'll reveal more about March's past. also since the "heartwarming and uplifting" writer is doing the script, maybe March will also get impaled and Danheng will use the forbidden vidyadhara resurrection spell turning March into a bow user pink elf
I wonder how the path of Finality will work gameplay wise just wondering other I do have an idea of Finality characters messing with buffs and debuffs on noth alies and enemies
ITS CONFIRMED THE STELLARON HUNTERS WERE ON BELOBOG?
Morch 7nd is an emanator of the Voracity becusde she can vore a city
Ur videos are too good
How does your stellaron theory connect with Nanook? It seems like there's been some implicit connections drawn between the two
Let's remember the only one Finality that matters is Imaginery Finality.....aka Tunality
15:16 Yo am i missing something, since when where they at Belobog???!!!
Could the seawater be in reference to the sea of Quanta?
Also, is the Sea of Quanta the memory zone? I always thought the memory zone was different, but the Nhility/sleep connections and *potential* Genshin connections (I don't know if you watch Ashikai, but they did a really good world structure theory that I think probably does apply too the rest of the hoyo-verse)
It’s even in the name. H(Elio)bus.
Yo the waters may be related to the sea of quanta, I think you are into something there.
the issue is, how accurate is the info we get from Elegy? remember, Elegy never meet Terminus, Elegy in this case is similar to Duke Inferno, they haven't got gazed by the aeons they are worshipping.
are all the infos she said is true or is it a biased view because they worship Finality?
Is there anything she said that might not be true that was mentioned in this video? We've already seen Finality silence the Order (and thus Xipe by extension) and we know they're the shapeless prince against the current from the aeons myriad trailer.
@@LalodysLore uh huh, we've already seen finality silence order? remind me where?
@@someoneinasia swarm disaster beyond the sky choir
@@LalodysLore you mean the Simulated Universe: Swarm Disaster? then how do you know which info in SU actually true and which is simulated?
@@someoneinasia They don't I guess but it's not very likely that they'd write all this lore up only for it to be totally wrong on something like that I think
It doesn't make sense when you consider the ending of hi3. And yes, the games are linked whether people believe it or not. What about the fact that only Kiana has successfully embraced finality? And even senadina failed? This is all a mess. This retcons the entire ending and part 2 of hi3. No aeon has reached earth. Yet, Kiana is an emanator level herrscher of finality.
Finality in HI3 is written in different Hanzi. They are different beings. I personally think that they are connected, but they are not the same.
@GolgothianSylex I wasn't very clear with my comment but that's exactly my point. This video tries to link the two but it can't be the case, which is why I said it doesn't make sense. My point that I was trying to express is that the only person to successfully embrace finality is Kiana. My final sentence was more of a sarcastic response than a statement. This person is claiming she is an emanator level yet the cocoon isn't even an Aeon. In fact the cocoon transcends dimensions and isnt tied to the tree unlike aeons which are tied to it.
@@KoKoNuTz232 Hoyo loves Samsara, so most points are correct, especially if Elegy is to be believed. And Hoyo loves reusing old story - Ena's dream, for example. Exact relation of Cocoon has no meaning in this(even entity has no meaning - only story theme matters). It is just that Terminus knows everything and it is very hard to plot anything against their Finality.
@@GolgothianSylex in hi3, the earth has transcended the samsara. And as stated, in all the billions of years that the cocoon has existed only Kiana has been the successful embrace. Not one other being has ever embraced the cocoon successfully. Therefore, there cannot be an Aeon of finality, especially not the same finality as hi3. On top of that, aeon's are not as high dimensional beings as the cocoon is. The Cocoon exists independent of the imaginary tree, aeons do not. So there cannot be an Aeon of the same finality as hi3. And the Hanzi used supports this statement.
Finality is not clairvoyance, finality is time, as stated by kevin. If the cocoon knew that only Kiana would ever embrace it, then what was the purpose of the cocoon using trial and error on Venus and Mars before the earth? The terminus in hsr just does not match up with finality and the established lore in honkai impact 3rd, and especially not in ggz.
Video suggestion: Stellaron Hunter Sunday
Path of Finality and Beauty feud is a nod to Kiana. She's the Herrscher of Finality / End, yet she's the protector of Earth and all that's 'beautiful', which is Schicksal's motto created by Otto and inspired by Kallen: "To protect all that's beautiful in this world."
Kiana is definitely a Pathstrider of Beauty by nature yet she have alignment to the Finality by being the 'Emanator' of the Cocoon of Finality as mentioned in HI3rd Part 2 Chapter 5 by a Memokeeper who intrudes Kiana's dream.