I'd like to make a counter-argument to part of this video: "Get naked in the shower." is a universally positive message. Showering with clothes on rarely works out well.
Personally, I know that I could enjoy such movies before because I didn't have any political lens until I turned like 26. I used to hate debating because I didn't think I had any opinion in these matters but after a lot of kicking and crying and endless denial, I've come to realize that we're living in a society.
@@Harkescreative it’s ok for someone to have an opinion and push the envelope BUT you only get to have one line in the whole movie, it has to be in character, and you can’t just replace the character with wokel 1.0a to deliver the line. It used to pass the sniff test and even then… there were alternate opinions out there. Top Gun Maverick doesn’t care if you dislike the military industrial complex. But Lady Ghostbusters doesn’t like it if you aren’t keen on female empowerment. And weirdly… why would I watch the movie if I did not want female empowerment? Kinda explains why it failed so badly. It’s pushing away half the audience and the rest of the audience can’t afford to simply donate to leftist companies making movies regardless of quality. It’s not a church!!!
@@iluvyunie Explain to me how looking at rotten tomatoes which is at a 40% atm is coping, when my man is saying the score is 0% based on propably a single reviewer right after release is not trying to cope even harder. The fact of the matter is the dave chapelle slander is blown way out of proportion. The people who actually thinks hes a transphobic whatever are such a tiny minority there's no reason to give them the light of day. Twitter mongoloids don't really exist in the real world. He said it himself.
Its funny that some youtubers dedicate there channel to discrediting him when the drinker is saying what we are all thinking and i cant wait for his movie to come out while im waiting im going to read his books thats all for today go away now 🍻
Trust your own opinion. There isn’t a rule that says you have to agree with critics or audience side of RT or that they have to agree with you. Opinions don’t have to agree. That is why they are called opinions. Everyone thinks differently
There was a reason why it was considered bad manners/impolite to discuss politics, religion, and money with most people. These are discussions you can have with close friends... not normal, every day encounters. If you want to make a film, game, or comic that discusses these things you have to do it with some class. Now days when these topics are brought up in film, games, or comics it's done with all the nuance of a sledgehammer.
I've done that for years, with all critics, especially in the press. The more they hate it, the better. I remember when Star Trek VI came out. One UK critic referred to the Klingon Homeworld as the 'Planet Kling'. I realised then that they don't really watch the movies they review, except for the excellent Mark Kermode, who never lets personal preference or otherwise colour his reviews. He acknowledges that different people have different tastes.
Anime still has the "work really hard and you will succeed" message for the most part. I'm so worried about getting preached at and agenda bombed when I start a new show that I exclusively watch anime now unless a trusted friend has already vetted something else.
the japanese are based like that. while they have problems of their own, they don't want to make a contagion of their misery through the entertainment they provide.
It is designed to sow division. It is obvious nonsense so that people will push against it and then be revealed as being as 'toxic' as the ideology says they are. Furthermore, it's like having a discussion on the strengths and weaknesses of any political group or subject. Amongst the sensible discussions you will have the nutters who scream 'whateverphobe' at every criticism, or simple detailing of weakness, and the frothers who really, really hate whatevers. After the discussion the frothers will be held up by the media as the 'reality', because today you can make big money attacking majorities, whilst the vast majority of sensible folk who had a good, informative discussion will be ignored. Meanwhile, the frothers are pushed further and further away from stability and whatevers are made more and more wary of every non-whatevers out there. Do this for long enough and the frothers become the main perception of reality despite most people not really giving a shit one way or another about whatever. It's Marxism 101.
@@markfirth3204 you just hate art and even humanity if you don't have a problem with woke movies. woke is anti-art, it's a war against everything good, true and beautiful.
@@bmacaulay18 I just find CDs whinging reactionary take really tedious. If he doesn't like a film it has to be about the "woke" agenda. Films have always been "political" in one way or another. There have always been good and bad films. Perhaps his hang-up is with a little bit of liberalism rather than a right wing perspective. I happen to think that "Dirty Harry" is a great thriller but the character is a "wee bit" of a fascist when it comes down to it. After "Magnum Force" the later films were just rubbish - same character, same politics - crap films.
I don't know what makes me more upset - the fact that they're deliberately trying to target and transform all the franchises I liked as a kid, or the fact that they gaslight me and call me a toxic fan for being angry at them doing it.
The guys in suits think slapping a beloved IP on their latest nonsense is enough to make the fans like it. And when the fans don't, they try and deflect blame. Don't hate-watch things. Just close your wallet, pirate it (if you absolutely must), and move on with your day.
B. I’ve seen franchises get transformed before. We may not have liked it but in general it was understood that the people making the changes were taking the risk of being hated. Now we are taking the blame for not liking their “genius” decisions.
@Christian Hartman he watched it thinking it was going to be a continuation of a good thing. He has that right. And maybe he stopped watching afterwards.
It all started with the abolition of IMDB’s message boards in 2016, when TLJ and Wokebusters came out to scathing reviews. They called it “hate speech”, shut it all down, and then had a virtual monopoly of tv/film criticism. It’s sad, cause it was a great discussion forum to find out interesting tidbits on all the older films.
@@griffiththewhitefalcon69420 you referring to Biden, the guy who was elected POTUS by more than 7 million votes over Trump? Biden, the guy who's currently living in the White House. Hey, whatever makes you feel better.
I miss the days when the message or theme in a film had to be figured out by actually watching the movie and taking the plot in. If there was some hidden narrative in the plot that you only figure out after watching a movie half a dozen times and you finally come to that eye opening moment that’s when a film has done its job. Today there is no attempt at reading the plot of a movie between the lines because the “message” is blatantly being spelled out for the audiences now.
I watched the drinkers review on Thor 4 and he either didn't watch it or just watched it in the background because he said "you can weld the hammer when you have cancer", when actually Jane was able to weld the hammer because Thor told the hammer to take care of her.
As someone that grew up watching the 50-60s stuff on tv as a kid, then catching up on the 70s movies and watching the movies in the 80s as a teen, I find it hard to believe anyone my age would expect me to watch the garbage they churn out now. Where are the great directors from the 70s/80s? Why aren't they calling this out? Too many great movies through the decades and across the world to waste my time.
Yeah, I grew up in the 80s and 90s watching a ton of older movies and shows. I remember pretty vividly that political propaganda was mocked in entertainment for being obvious and ridiculously over the top. Now, political propaganda IS our entertainment. I of course use "entertainment" very lightly as its not meant to be entertainment at all.
Slight technical note: differences in percentages are referred to as percentage points. For example a movie with a 75 percent critics' store and 25 percent audience score would be a 50 percentage point difference.
@@kroon275 No it isn't, they're entirely different things. A 4% increase is not the same as an increase of 4 percentage points. Percentage math doesn't work like that.
@@kroon275 I hate Americanisms except when they're useful - i.e. there's no British equivalent. In this case, the distinction between percentage and percentage points is useful and I'll probably use it.
Scooby Doo was made because parental groups hated Space Ghost, Herculoids, and other action packed HB cartoons. I hated that but I like Scooby Doo because of the detective angle. I liked figuring out the mysteries. That was the fun part of the show.
There has always been a gap between critics ratings on films and audience ratings. The more interesting thing to examine is that the reason for this difference has changed. Popular appeal has always been different from critical appeal. In my day, people thought that films like Meatballs or Caddyshack or Commando or Zoolander should win best picture. Audiences weren't interested in things like symbolism or subtle performances or a deep underlying theme. They thought that comedies should win more best pictures but you can bet that most of them were not interested in watching Annie Hall. Film critics were students of film who studied what it was to make a film well. Today, film critics are political activists, film makers and writers are political activists, and college graduates and professors are political activists. You can say what you want about liberals, but at one time, they at least had intellectual integrity. Today, they despise it because most intelligent thought originally derives from historical white males. I worry about the future of our society through higher education, since the left wants to use colleges as cult indoctrination and the right wants to use college as a professional trades school. Either way, where do advancements in science or philosophical thought come from? (real philosophical thought -- not the current hijacking of it which leads back to cultist indoctrination) Where do we study the great art or music, or for that matter, film, so that we can learn from it?
Rotten Tomatoes has been trash for so long. MAN I miss the old days when it was simply a place to see actual critical reviews. You would ALWAYS have critics divided on a ton of films, except the seriously good ones... but even then you'd probably have 1 or 2 naysayers. Now, it's essentially a place that critics can bandwagon a film, and Rotten Tomatoes lets them do it.
I don't think "audiences are right and critics are wrong" and I don't think "critics are right and audiences are wrong" either. In some cases audiences and critics agree and the movie is bad, and in some cases they agree and the movie is good. I think the issue is that what is considered "good" is mostly bifurcated because audiences and critics value different things, or at least value things differently. A LOT of modern critics think social messaging is super important, so they will forgive the most ham-handed attempts at "messaging" that betray realism or other storytelling elements. Audiences tend to value entertainment quality the most so they will forgive a lot of empty spectacle so long as the product is entertaining. I tend to agree with audiences more, because the wisdom of crowds while it occasionally rewards pandering to the lowest common denominator is also more likely to produce art for the greatest common factor because certain films will appeal to the best qualities in every person instead of lecturing or pandering in the kind of way that appeals to critics.
Rotten Tomatoes used to have one of the most awesome online communities. So many bright young film students talking about interesting and unique films. I was so lucky to find their forum before it was shutdown after RT was bought out.
The Last Jedi was 5 years ago and stuck a chord with angry Star Wars nerds, but critics and audiences are more often closer in their rankings than not, even on movies “The Drinker” says are crap. And audiences often love a movie more than the critics even when the movie is panned by Geeks and Gamers/Nerdrotic/and CD…Spider-Man No Way Home 93% critics 98% audience…Top Gun 96/99…Woman King 94/99….Wakanda Forever 84/94…All Quiet on the Western Front 90/90…Love and Thunder 63/77…Ant Man 3 48/83….Disney Pinocchio (2022) 29/28…Del Toro Pinocchio 97/91…EDIT: Oh, and the Drinker heaped mountains of Praise on Puss in Boots: The Last Wish, alongside the so called "woke critics" who gave it 95 and the audience 93....This notion that if the critics like something then the audience will hate it or vice versa is nonsense.
Agreed , both perspectives are gender driven to some degree in a woke/anti woke stance . I guess it depends on how one defines the woke that is disagreeable. For me that would be when you push a pro narrative one way and s**t all over lets say white /straight/heterosexual men or men in general and make all the characters that are not the straight men, super Mary Sue's or whatever and the men clumsy little clots. Like they made Temuera Morrison in 'Book of Boba Fett'. I have not watched that yet as i don't have Disney, though i have seen clips of it on TH-cam and those clips seem to confirm the bad reviews people like Nerdrotic gave it.. However that does not mean i would be happy if we were never allowed to make fun of that demographic. Everyone is game as far as I'm concerned.
I work in QC and if I gave the same message that these movies give the young women about how you're perfect in every way nothing ever will go wrong we would have planes falling from the sky and trucks driving over Bridges. Constructive criticism is essential!
If I was a white man, I would be soo flattered by all the vitriole. Could you imagine winning so hard that everyone hated you? Its quite the compliment.
No. But I expect it would be similar to being knocked down in the hallways and having people taunt you for being "li'l miss perfect." The fact that you know you aren't and every attempt to try to be better will only accelerate this treatment doesn't improve the situation at all.
The cool think about drinker is that it’s fun to watch his reviews and occasionally disagree with them, because you know they’re his honest opinions. He’s not always “right” but he’s authentic, so disagreement is a just a good chance for a discussion, rather than a window on to an institutionalised viewpoint. Obviously there are elements of the Drinker persona that are in part an act, but I think that’s there to divert off the offendophiles.
On hearing “feels like being whipped” I immediately thought of Last Jedi - and then you gave that as an example. Before seeing the second show of Jedi in the theater I watched the first show audience leaving and was surprised at the silent down-look on their faces.
On the other hand, critics and audiences are very like-minded about Arcane and Cobra Kai, both receiving high praise. Unfortunately, this is the exception rather than the rule.
Avatar 2 had a basic story but effective. Just a Man protecting his family. His wife didn’t agree with everything he decided. but still respected him and follow his lead. Nothing wrong with a woman following her husband. That is not weakness at all. Movie made money because it resonated with so many people.
So refreshing to see two intelligent, articulate Brits for change and not one f bomb at all. It's also nice and short so I don't have to wade through 3 hours of noisy, testosterone ridden banter.
That's why I like to watch The Horror Geek, as he reviews and makes jokes about old obscure horror movies from the 70s and 80s. And most of them can be watched on TH-cam.
Well, sometimes critics can still be right. For example with the Transformers movies. I really dont know why those make so much money. Also, believing in yourself is not a bad message in itself. You need to believe in yourself so you can push forward and improve. If you dont believe in yourself, your not going to succeed and your not going to try, and your not going to get better. So you do need to believe in yourself first, before you can try and grow and improve. Its only when the message is, if you believe in yourself you can instantly do anything, thats the problem.
8:30 'perfect at everything ...' I'm sorry to say but that REALLY is how it is at the moment in some primary schools. When they do tests or exams they just say "you don't need the results. You are perfect the way you are ..." as a tutor who then goes around and tries to help these poor kids it is more than slightly worrisome.
I haven't watched a thing from Disney for the last decade and refuse to spend a penny on any Marvel movies. Most movies & dramas are so lame and Netflix is meh at best. I quitted Netflix for a while, never look back since. Instead I subscribe Paramount+ to support Taylor Sheridan great dramas, the Yellowstone and the prequels are so epic and awesome.
Your comment about how people are encouraged to force the world to change to accommodate them makes me think of the Michael Jackson rebuttal. I can't remember which song it is but one of Michael Jackson's songs ends with the line "If you want to make the world a better place take a look at YOURSELF and make a change."
It is one thing for filmmakers to propagandize a particular agenda when the audience has no idea they are doing so, and quite another when the audience knows that they are. Also, it is one thing for filmmakers to propagandize a particular agenda when the long-term consequences of it have not yet come to pass in their everyday lives, and quite another when they have. Audiences may not be left or right-wing as no one seems to know what these terms mean anymore but the vast majority are conservative by nature even if they never have had the slightest clue as to what being conservative by nature means. Progressive politics is like progressive music. It starts out great, gets better, and then soon enough becomes self-indulgent, childishly utopian BS with nothing left to offer but ever more of the same. Maybe it is time for politics to go Punk?
Agenda setting theory has ruined recent filmmaking. Ideology is pushed so hard that plots seem twisted to accommodate the woke. Boring and predictable plots as well. Hollywood appears to be sinking under the weight of its perceived self importance.
The big problem is the current cultural disconnect between effort and reward, and the idea of rights without responsibility. It undermines how human society has always operated. If nobody works then nothing gets made.
You just can't trust critics anymore because 99% of them are paid promoters - not critics. Nowadays critics are programmed by the studios. They are given all kinds of compensation and more importantly - access for giving positive reviews and pushing the studio narrative. Back in the day film critics were actual critics. Most of them worked for a local newspaper or television station (with the exception a few super critics like Siskel & Ebert, Leonard Maltin, Gene Shalit. etc.). They would usually go see movies at off peak times. Early premier showings were closed events and not the spectacles they are nowadays. They would watch the film, take notes, go back to their office or studio and write / tape their honest review. Once you found a critic that liked the same kind of films you like - you would follow them or give their opinion more weight than a critic you were not as familiar with. But most everyone would give reviews that were somewhere in the same ballpark and you could trust them. Those days are gone.
The problem is every single marvel movie still gets like 80-90% audience score no matter how mediocre they are so you honestly can't trust either of them.
I have a few metrics for deciding if I want to spend the small fortune to see a new movie at the cinema. Jon’s opinion is a critical deciding factor for me…His appraisals are spot on👍
They just got lazy and instead of making the audience think, they try to shove the message in dry without any flirting or foreplay trough the back door
I'm whiter than Casper, and I LOVE Boyz N The Hood. I think it's a great film. I'm not represented in it at all (don't need to be), but the characters are so well written and the story is legit. That is what is missing from films these days. Race-swapping characters is not representation. Create new characters, new stories, and treat races or religions or whatever as human beings, and you don't run into this divide. People want to be entertained, sure, but challenged is fine, too. Just hire actual writers rather than someone who looks the way you like and f*cks the thing you like.
No, you must be able to see visually on screen someone of your exact race/sex/religion/sexuality to even attempt empathy and understanding. We’re that simple.😂
Yep, I also saw this coming when they shut down the immensely popular IMDB message boards back when Wokebusters and TLJ came out. Their reviews suddenly became filtered to the max, with only positive reviews and feedback for the wokest films/tv? Sad.
All the things Hollywood fails to do (terrible writing) Japan is brilliant at. If you want quality storytelling similar to what made marvel good (back in the day) then go check out some anime.
Rotten Tomatoes critics scores used to be a great barometer for good movies. But in last several years it has become strictly a wokeness score, not an actual score of how good the movie is. Famous critics are now "forced" to give good scores to movies that have any underlying woke component (minority main actors, directors, LGBT plot lines, Empowered women roles, etc), else they will get gaslighted. so I understand why they would not give those films a thumbs down.
Great video! I couldn't agree more with your analysis of modern Hollywood. It's sad to see the loss of innocence and creativity that once made Hollywood so magical. It seems like everything nowadays is focused on pushing modern ideologies, rather than allowing characters to grow and develop organically. Whether you're a hero or a villain, character arcs are what make a story truly captivating. The modern approach is opposite, if you are female you are instantly a hero of strength rather than the story of overcoming resistance to build strength in adversity.
It's just about content now. Movies are struggling to keep me interested. Have started watching 70s and 80s movies, mostly thrillers. Practical effects and stunts can't be replaced by CGI. I'm done with the MCU and DCEU.
Dan Murrell says you are supposed to read the critics average score on RT and the Audience average score on RT not the overall percentage. The overall percentage tells the percentage of how many critics that liked a movie or TV show vs how many hate the movie or TV show. There are times when I agree with critics and times when I don’t. There are times when I agree with the audience side and times when I don’t. It depends on the show or movie. I remember people got upset over the RT critics score for the Seth McFarland show Orville. I like the show but I don’t find all the jokes funny. I think it could be better. Sometimes Seth’s humor is funny and sometimes it isn’t. I am watching American Dad right now and I don’t find all the episodes funny. I think sometimes he needs better writing.
The reality is that the movie business is failing because of an adherence to the current social justice madness. Look at the numbers for all major studies and Netflix.
When I was a kid, I had great parents but I still idolized many characters from TV and movies to emulate. Bruce Banner (Bill Bixby) was one of those kind of good characters a kid could count on to do the right thing. I weep for today's adolescents and all the woke victimhood confusion they are bombarded with. Thanks Chris Williamson and Critical Drinker for speaking some common sense to combat the lunacy today.
The same thing happened to Ebert & Roeper; Their opinion of movies was always pretty inaccurate to the actual quality of a film. Unless it was the most watered down, PG, boring, family friendly movies they would give it bad ratings. Ever since them, I have given literally zero F's about critic opinion on anything. Gaming review critics are even worse because 9 out of 10 will perform subornation of perjury on their scores. Basically, when it comes to a movie, tv show or game. Never trust a critic.
There is a stark difference between exploring a complex or difficult concept in media ... and the media preaching to its audience about the One True Correct Conclusion To Have. Media that does the former tends to do well and examples of that are legion. Media that serves only as a propaganda mechanism thinly veiled with some story backdrop of some popular IP ... does not.
Wish we could remove paid “critic reviews” and replace them with user reviews in all services that use them. That would be a much healthier perspective than what we’ve got right now.
I think the divergence is somewhat in part to audiences feeling increasingly burned by studios' output, therefore possessing less disposable goodwill and charitableness for frequent culprits, whilst anything approaching even averageness in terms of quality is awarded liberally because it's so scarce. There is certainly an element of audiences being spoiled, at least by visual effects, so whereas some time ago audiences might have forgiven things because they looked interesting, or the production value was on screen, it's become a less and less reliable crutch as the quality of storytelling evaporates.
And sometimes even the critic websites fudge their own audience score numbers. I refuse to accept that 80% of people loved the Chip & Dale: Rescue Rangers movie.
Bonjour you legends. Watch the full episode with Drinker here - th-cam.com/video/UF24n487FrA/w-d-xo.html
I'd like to make a counter-argument to part of this video: "Get naked in the shower." is a universally positive message. Showering with clothes on rarely works out well.
I remember when I could relax and watch movies without being bombarded by political nonsense... good times they were..
Problem is I'm super sensitive to political messages in older movies now. They were always there, they just used to be more subtle.
Just like every other aspect of life. You can't escape it anywhere these days.
Personally, I know that I could enjoy such movies before because I didn't have any political lens until I turned like 26. I used to hate debating because I didn't think I had any opinion in these matters but after a lot of kicking and crying and endless denial, I've come to realize that we're living in a society.
@@Harkescreative it’s ok for someone to have an opinion and push the envelope BUT you only get to have one line in the whole movie, it has to be in character, and you can’t just replace the character with wokel 1.0a to deliver the line.
It used to pass the sniff test and even then… there were alternate opinions out there. Top Gun Maverick doesn’t care if you dislike the military industrial complex. But Lady Ghostbusters doesn’t like it if you aren’t keen on female empowerment. And weirdly… why would I watch the movie if I did not want female empowerment?
Kinda explains why it failed so badly. It’s pushing away half the audience and the rest of the audience can’t afford to simply donate to leftist companies making movies regardless of quality. It’s not a church!!!
What is that time when movies had no political agenda?
Dave Chapelles special had a 0% critic score and a 99% audience score.
It could only be clearer by 1%.
Didnt the critics refuse to review it
The lowest all time rating of his is 10% why are you lying?
@Freeze what are you on about, his equanimity special had exactly those numbers at release
You are coping
@@iluvyunie Explain to me how looking at rotten tomatoes which is at a 40% atm is coping, when my man is saying the score is 0% based on propably a single reviewer right after release is not trying to cope even harder. The fact of the matter is the dave chapelle slander is blown way out of proportion. The people who actually thinks hes a transphobic whatever are such a tiny minority there's no reason to give them the light of day. Twitter mongoloids don't really exist in the real world. He said it himself.
@@fVNzO tense is key here, is English your first language
The Critical Drinker is an international treasure. We must protect him at all costs.
Nah it'll be foine
Absolutely agree.
Meh, he's predictable at best/worst.
@@CSestp Says the guy who has three subscribers.
Its funny that some youtubers dedicate there channel to discrediting him when the drinker is saying what we are all thinking and i cant wait for his movie to come out while im waiting im going to read his books thats all for today go away now 🍻
Rotten Tomatoes is the gold standard for woke lies.
@@devilselbow it means they only recommend movies that fit their ideology with regards to sexual orientation and race.
@@devilselbow Did you watch the video?
Lol
Trust your own opinion. There isn’t a rule that says you have to agree with critics or audience side of RT or that they have to agree with you. Opinions don’t have to agree. That is why they are called opinions. Everyone thinks differently
@@dougcrane8031 that is why you go by the critics average score. I am just quoting Dan Murell. That is how he says to read RT.
There was a reason why it was considered bad manners/impolite to discuss politics, religion, and money with most people. These are discussions you can have with close friends... not normal, every day encounters. If you want to make a film, game, or comic that discusses these things you have to do it with some class. Now days when these topics are brought up in film, games, or comics it's done with all the nuance of a sledgehammer.
10 years ago i used to check rotten tomatoes to see if a movie was worth watching, i still do it now but the process has done a complete 180
Haha agreed. 0%, guess I'll watch it!
I've done that for years, with all critics, especially in the press. The more they hate it, the better.
I remember when Star Trek VI came out. One UK critic referred to the Klingon Homeworld as the 'Planet Kling'.
I realised then that they don't really watch the movies they review, except for the excellent Mark Kermode, who never lets personal preference or otherwise colour his reviews. He acknowledges that different people have different tastes.
if rotten tomatoes says the movie is certified fresh, i know for sure not to watch that BS lol
Go by audience score, but when they RARELY agree, listen.
Top Gun Maverick 96% from critics.
Anime still has the "work really hard and you will succeed" message for the most part. I'm so worried about getting preached at and agenda bombed when I start a new show that I exclusively watch anime now unless a trusted friend has already vetted something else.
huh, it never occurred to me in those terms but now that you said it I do the same
I thought I was the only one. 😂
the japanese are based like that. while they have problems of their own, they don't want to make a contagion of their misery through the entertainment they provide.
It's astonishing how rotten the ideology being foisted is. Absolutely agree with the Critical Drinker.
It is designed to sow division. It is obvious nonsense so that people will push against it and then be revealed as being as 'toxic' as the ideology says they are. Furthermore, it's like having a discussion on the strengths and weaknesses of any political group or subject. Amongst the sensible discussions you will have the nutters who scream 'whateverphobe' at every criticism, or simple detailing of weakness, and the frothers who really, really hate whatevers.
After the discussion the frothers will be held up by the media as the 'reality', because today you can make big money attacking majorities, whilst the vast majority of sensible folk who had a good, informative discussion will be ignored. Meanwhile, the frothers are pushed further and further away from stability and whatevers are made more and more wary of every non-whatevers out there. Do this for long enough and the frothers become the main perception of reality despite most people not really giving a shit one way or another about whatever.
It's Marxism 101.
It's astonishing how rotten the CD ideology being foisted is. Absolutely disagree with the Critical Drinker.
@@markfirth3204 you just hate art and even humanity if you don't have a problem with woke movies. woke is anti-art, it's a war against everything good, true and beautiful.
@@markfirth3204 I guess you must be a professional movie critic then. 🤣😂🤣😂
@@bmacaulay18 I just find CDs whinging reactionary take really tedious. If he doesn't like a film it has to be about the "woke" agenda. Films have always been "political" in one way or another. There have always been good and bad films. Perhaps his hang-up is with a little bit of liberalism rather than a right wing perspective. I happen to think that "Dirty Harry" is a great thriller but the character is a "wee bit" of a fascist when it comes down to it. After "Magnum Force" the later films were just rubbish - same character, same politics - crap films.
I don't know what makes me more upset - the fact that they're deliberately trying to target and transform all the franchises I liked as a kid, or the fact that they gaslight me and call me a toxic fan for being angry at them doing it.
The guys in suits think slapping a beloved IP on their latest nonsense is enough to make the fans like it. And when the fans don't, they try and deflect blame.
Don't hate-watch things. Just close your wallet, pirate it (if you absolutely must), and move on with your day.
B. I’ve seen franchises get transformed before. We may not have liked it but in general it was understood that the people making the changes were taking the risk of being hated. Now we are taking the blame for not liking their “genius” decisions.
@Madkingstow Keep calling it out, brother. Five years ago they were winning. Now they're getting crushed.
you can just not watch the movies, nobody is forcing you to do anything
@Christian Hartman he watched it thinking it was going to be a continuation of a good thing. He has that right. And maybe he stopped watching afterwards.
The power of self improvement is why anime has taken off in America. That message is needed.
That's why I listen to 80's movie OSTs a lot
100%
Anime is the opposite of self improvement lmao
@@alexreyes7237 How so? Do you mean people who sit around all day doing nothing but watching it?
@@JulesLife the vast majority of male anime watchers yes they literally do cosplay
There are a lot of really good YT entertainment reviewers out there right now (Chris Gore, Nerdrotic) but the Drinker is the gold standard. 🍻
It all started with the abolition of IMDB’s message boards in 2016, when TLJ and Wokebusters came out to scathing reviews. They called it “hate speech”, shut it all down, and then had a virtual monopoly of tv/film criticism. It’s sad, cause it was a great discussion forum to find out interesting tidbits on all the older films.
"It's like a parasite that's embodied a loved institution."
Yes. 109 times.
🤣👍 It's just 109 countries that are ist-O-phobes, it has nothing to do with their actions!!
Based.
Those who know, know.
Calling Rotten tomatoes a trustful source is like calling Joe Biden the most popular president in American history
...or Trump.
PO💩TUS-Joe🥴
& the
*WAR* *WORLD*
💥💥💥🎯💥💥💥
@@amarshmuseconcepta6197 Maybe blame Putin, you know, the guy who attacked Ukraine and started all of this.
@@griffiththewhitefalcon69420 you referring to Biden, the guy who was elected POTUS by more than 7 million votes over Trump? Biden, the guy who's currently living in the White House. Hey, whatever makes you feel better.
@@WilliamTheMovieFan How did Putin start all of this exactly?
I miss the days when the message or theme in a film had to be figured out by actually watching the movie and taking the plot in. If there was some hidden narrative in the plot that you only figure out after watching a movie half a dozen times and you finally come to that eye opening moment that’s when a film has done its job. Today there is no attempt at reading the plot of a movie between the lines because the “message” is blatantly being spelled out for the audiences now.
And it will feel incredibly dated in just a few short years of next major political epoch.
Critical Drinker: the right man in the right place at the right time.
The Drinker is literally the only reviewer I trust.
I watched the drinkers review on Thor 4 and he either didn't watch it or just watched it in the background because he said "you can weld the hammer when you have cancer", when actually Jane was able to weld the hammer because Thor told the hammer to take care of her.
As someone that grew up watching the 50-60s stuff on tv as a kid, then catching up on the 70s movies and watching the movies in the 80s as a teen, I find it hard to believe anyone my age would expect me to watch the garbage they churn out now. Where are the great directors from the 70s/80s? Why aren't they calling this out? Too many great movies through the decades and across the world to waste my time.
Well, the demographics they care about end at age 49 - beyond that, we don't exist.
Yeah, I grew up in the 80s and 90s watching a ton of older movies and shows. I remember pretty vividly that political propaganda was mocked in entertainment for being obvious and ridiculously over the top. Now, political propaganda IS our entertainment. I of course use "entertainment" very lightly as its not meant to be entertainment at all.
Chris and Critical. The mashup I never knew I needed.
I'm SO glad their are men like you out there! It gives me hope for my young adult children!
Slight technical note: differences in percentages are referred to as percentage points. For example a movie with a 75 percent critics' store and 25 percent audience score would be a 50 percentage point difference.
@@kroon275 No it isn't, they're entirely different things. A 4% increase is not the same as an increase of 4 percentage points. Percentage math doesn't work like that.
@@kroon275 I hate Americanisms except when they're useful - i.e. there's no British equivalent. In this case, the distinction between percentage and percentage points is useful and I'll probably use it.
The critical drinker is one of my favorite TH-cam critics.. Definitely going to the full show for this one 🥰
Scooby Doo was made because parental groups hated Space Ghost, Herculoids, and other action packed HB cartoons. I hated that but I like Scooby Doo because of the detective angle. I liked figuring out the mysteries. That was the fun part of the show.
There has always been a gap between critics ratings on films and audience ratings. The more interesting thing to examine is that the reason for this difference has changed. Popular appeal has always been different from critical appeal. In my day, people thought that films like Meatballs or Caddyshack or Commando or Zoolander should win best picture. Audiences weren't interested in things like symbolism or subtle performances or a deep underlying theme. They thought that comedies should win more best pictures but you can bet that most of them were not interested in watching Annie Hall. Film critics were students of film who studied what it was to make a film well. Today, film critics are political activists, film makers and writers are political activists, and college graduates and professors are political activists. You can say what you want about liberals, but at one time, they at least had intellectual integrity. Today, they despise it because most intelligent thought originally derives from historical white males. I worry about the future of our society through higher education, since the left wants to use colleges as cult indoctrination and the right wants to use college as a professional trades school. Either way, where do advancements in science or philosophical thought come from? (real philosophical thought -- not the current hijacking of it which leads back to cultist indoctrination) Where do we study the great art or music, or for that matter, film, so that we can learn from it?
Same thing is also happening with video game reviews. They only get early review keys/stuff if they give a game a glowing positive review.
Rotten Tomatoes has been trash for so long. MAN I miss the old days when it was simply a place to see actual critical reviews. You would ALWAYS have critics divided on a ton of films, except the seriously good ones... but even then you'd probably have 1 or 2 naysayers. Now, it's essentially a place that critics can bandwagon a film, and Rotten Tomatoes lets them do it.
I don't think "audiences are right and critics are wrong" and I don't think "critics are right and audiences are wrong" either. In some cases audiences and critics agree and the movie is bad, and in some cases they agree and the movie is good. I think the issue is that what is considered "good" is mostly bifurcated because audiences and critics value different things, or at least value things differently.
A LOT of modern critics think social messaging is super important, so they will forgive the most ham-handed attempts at "messaging" that betray realism or other storytelling elements. Audiences tend to value entertainment quality the most so they will forgive a lot of empty spectacle so long as the product is entertaining.
I tend to agree with audiences more, because the wisdom of crowds while it occasionally rewards pandering to the lowest common denominator is also more likely to produce art for the greatest common factor because certain films will appeal to the best qualities in every person instead of lecturing or pandering in the kind of way that appeals to critics.
I always enjoy the conversations you have with others. ❤️
Critics are almost all of the same political persuasion. They see every movie through a far left wing lens.
Remember Barry Norman? Those were good days.
Rotten Tomatoes used to have one of the most awesome online communities. So many bright young film students talking about interesting and unique films. I was so lucky to find their forum before it was shutdown after RT was bought out.
The Last Jedi was 5 years ago and stuck a chord with angry Star Wars nerds, but critics and audiences are more often closer in their rankings than not, even on movies “The Drinker” says are crap. And audiences often love a movie more than the critics even when the movie is panned by Geeks and Gamers/Nerdrotic/and CD…Spider-Man No Way Home 93% critics 98% audience…Top Gun 96/99…Woman King 94/99….Wakanda Forever 84/94…All Quiet on the Western Front 90/90…Love and Thunder 63/77…Ant Man 3 48/83….Disney Pinocchio (2022) 29/28…Del Toro Pinocchio 97/91…EDIT: Oh, and the Drinker heaped mountains of Praise on Puss in Boots: The Last Wish, alongside the so called "woke critics" who gave it 95 and the audience 93....This notion that if the critics like something then the audience will hate it or vice versa is nonsense.
Agreed , both perspectives are gender driven to some degree in a woke/anti woke stance . I guess it depends on how one defines the woke that is disagreeable. For me that would be when you push a pro narrative one way and s**t all over lets say white /straight/heterosexual men or men in general and make all the characters that are not the straight men, super Mary Sue's or whatever and the men clumsy little clots. Like they made Temuera Morrison in 'Book of Boba Fett'. I have not watched that yet as i don't have Disney, though i have seen clips of it on TH-cam and those clips seem to confirm the bad reviews people like Nerdrotic gave it.. However that does not mean i would be happy if we were never allowed to make fun of that demographic. Everyone is game as far as I'm concerned.
I've saved a LOT of money listening to Critical Drinker. Many thanks, man, I appreciate those heads up.
I watched Ghostbusters 2016 on a plane - I wanted to open the door and jump out after 20 minutes.
I work in QC and if I gave the same message that these movies give the young women about how you're perfect in every way nothing ever will go wrong we would have planes falling from the sky and trucks driving over Bridges. Constructive criticism is essential!
If I was a white man, I would be soo flattered by all the vitriole. Could you imagine winning so hard that everyone hated you? Its quite the compliment.
And to turn it around, I would be embarrassed to my bones to be anything else, who needs so much help to achieve even the most basic things…
Most people do have to imagine it, because winning, they aren't...
No. But I expect it would be similar to being knocked down in the hallways and having people taunt you for being "li'l miss perfect." The fact that you know you aren't and every attempt to try to be better will only accelerate this treatment doesn't improve the situation at all.
The cool think about drinker is that it’s fun to watch his reviews and occasionally disagree with them, because you know they’re his honest opinions. He’s not always “right” but he’s authentic, so disagreement is a just a good chance for a discussion, rather than a window on to an institutionalised viewpoint. Obviously there are elements of the Drinker persona that are in part an act, but I think that’s there to divert off the offendophiles.
I forget who said it, but authenticity is the currency of the 21st century.
On hearing “feels like being whipped” I immediately thought of Last Jedi - and then you gave that as an example. Before seeing the second show of Jedi in the theater I watched the first show audience leaving and was surprised at the silent down-look on their faces.
Thankful that I declined to watch anything Star Wars after Awakens. Haven't seen the last two nor will I ever.
Yes - join the club -
On the other hand, critics and audiences are very like-minded about Arcane and Cobra Kai, both receiving high praise.
Unfortunately, this is the exception rather than the rule.
I gave cobra kai a 0, it was the cheesiest cringe cliche and contrived mess... I'll never understand how that show caught on
Avatar 2 had a basic story but effective. Just a Man protecting his family. His wife didn’t agree with everything he decided. but still respected him and follow his lead. Nothing wrong with a woman following her husband. That is not weakness at all. Movie made money because it resonated with so many people.
So refreshing to see two intelligent, articulate Brits for change and not one f bomb at all. It's also nice and short so I don't have to wade through 3 hours of noisy, testosterone ridden banter.
It's a good time to go back in time. I watch old movies that I haven't seen before, thanks to TH-cam channels and DVD.
That's why I like to watch The Horror Geek, as he reviews and makes jokes about old obscure horror movies from the 70s and 80s. And most of them can be watched on TH-cam.
It's gotten so bad, that everything is guilty until proven innocent, sadly.
Well, sometimes critics can still be right. For example with the Transformers movies. I really dont know why those make so much money.
Also, believing in yourself is not a bad message in itself. You need to believe in yourself so you can push forward and improve. If you dont believe in yourself, your not going to succeed and your not going to try, and your not going to get better. So you do need to believe in yourself first, before you can try and grow and improve. Its only when the message is, if you believe in yourself you can instantly do anything, thats the problem.
8:30 'perfect at everything ...' I'm sorry to say but that REALLY is how it is at the moment in some primary schools. When they do tests or exams they just say "you don't need the results. You are perfect the way you are ..." as a tutor who then goes around and tries to help these poor kids it is more than slightly worrisome.
Hold the line!
They will fail. They will give this up.
Turn the crap off and tell them why.
I haven't watched a thing from Disney for the last decade and refuse to spend a penny on any Marvel movies. Most movies & dramas are so lame and Netflix is meh at best. I quitted Netflix for a while, never look back since. Instead I subscribe Paramount+ to support Taylor Sheridan great dramas, the Yellowstone and the prequels are so epic and awesome.
Rotten tomatoes audience scores are suspect anymore
Your comment about how people are encouraged to force the world to change to accommodate them makes me think of the Michael Jackson rebuttal. I can't remember which song it is but one of Michael Jackson's songs ends with the line "If you want to make the world a better place take a look at YOURSELF and make a change."
"Man in the Mirror" from the "Bad" album.
I used to love watching Film '90 with Barry Norman, his reviews was spot on 💯
Disney needs a serious direction change.
It is one thing for filmmakers to propagandize a particular agenda when the audience has no idea they are doing so, and quite another when the audience knows that they are. Also, it is one thing for filmmakers to propagandize a particular agenda when the long-term consequences of it have not yet come to pass in their everyday lives, and quite another when they have. Audiences may not be left or right-wing as no one seems to know what these terms mean anymore but the vast majority are conservative by nature even if they never have had the slightest clue as to what being conservative by nature means.
Progressive politics is like progressive music. It starts out great, gets better, and then soon enough becomes self-indulgent, childishly utopian BS with nothing left to offer but ever more of the same. Maybe it is time for politics to go Punk?
i need more crossover between you two!!
Agenda setting theory has ruined recent filmmaking. Ideology is pushed so hard that plots seem twisted to accommodate the woke. Boring and predictable plots as well. Hollywood appears to be sinking under the weight of its perceived self importance.
"THE MESSAGE" is such a hilarious thing I love that it's spread, lmao
The big problem is the current cultural disconnect between effort and reward, and the idea of rights without responsibility. It undermines how human society has always operated. If nobody works then nothing gets made.
Yes and everything you’re saying about movies is WORSE in video games.
Look into destiny 2.
Who needs destiny 2 when you can play sex 2?
You just can't trust critics anymore because 99% of them are paid promoters - not critics. Nowadays critics are programmed by the studios. They are given all kinds of compensation and more importantly - access for giving positive reviews and pushing the studio narrative. Back in the day film critics were actual critics. Most of them worked for a local newspaper or television station (with the exception a few super critics like Siskel & Ebert, Leonard Maltin, Gene Shalit. etc.). They would usually go see movies at off peak times. Early premier showings were closed events and not the spectacles they are nowadays. They would watch the film, take notes, go back to their office or studio and write / tape their honest review. Once you found a critic that liked the same kind of films you like - you would follow them or give their opinion more weight than a critic you were not as familiar with. But most everyone would give reviews that were somewhere in the same ballpark and you could trust them. Those days are gone.
It just shows how far studios have fallen
The problem is every single marvel movie still gets like 80-90% audience score no matter how mediocre they are so you honestly can't trust either of them.
The Drinker is awesome!
I have a few metrics for deciding if I want to spend the small fortune to see a new movie at the cinema. Jon’s opinion is a critical deciding factor for me…His appraisals are spot on👍
They just got lazy and instead of making the audience think, they try to shove the message in dry without any flirting or foreplay trough the back door
Chato's latest video on the Disney fiasco is brilliant.
Critical drinker and Chato are my definite go-to guys to find out what's worth my time.
7:31 I learned how to use handbrake to compress down my own stuff to put on my phone to watch. What they have to watch on the plane is craptastic
Wait, Drinker actually has eyeballs behind those sunglasses?!
I'm whiter than Casper, and I LOVE Boyz N The Hood. I think it's a great film. I'm not represented in it at all (don't need to be), but the characters are so well written and the story is legit. That is what is missing from films these days. Race-swapping characters is not representation. Create new characters, new stories, and treat races or religions or whatever as human beings, and you don't run into this divide. People want to be entertained, sure, but challenged is fine, too. Just hire actual writers rather than someone who looks the way you like and f*cks the thing you like.
i liked boyz in the hood but cant stand the message "never join a white mans army" message that influenced many to not pursue a military carreer
No, you must be able to see visually on screen someone of your exact race/sex/religion/sexuality to even attempt empathy and understanding. We’re that simple.😂
Rotten Tomatoes is co-owned by Time Warner & Disney, I warned people of how their reviews were going to change 10 years ago.
Yep, I also saw this coming when they shut down the immensely popular IMDB message boards back when Wokebusters and TLJ came out. Their reviews suddenly became filtered to the max, with only positive reviews and feedback for the wokest films/tv? Sad.
The Dirt was 34% and 96%. A good movie it was! Way better than Bohemian Rhapsody.
The Last Jedi was the first movie I'd ever seen, where I actively hated it while I watched it
All the things Hollywood fails to do (terrible writing) Japan is brilliant at. If you want quality storytelling similar to what made marvel good (back in the day) then go check out some anime.
Yep, just their anime alone, is phenomenal and much better than anything coming out of Hollyweird?
Rotten Tomatoes critics scores used to be a great barometer for good movies. But in last several years it has become strictly a wokeness score, not an actual score of how good the movie is. Famous critics are now "forced" to give good scores to movies that have any underlying woke component (minority main actors, directors, LGBT plot lines, Empowered women roles, etc), else they will get gaslighted. so I understand why they would not give those films a thumbs down.
Once again you're absolutely right and have nailed it drinker. That's why about 95% of my film and TV show collection pre-dates 2000. GO AWAY NOW!
I’ve had a studio executive demand my romantic comedy need to be re-written to be woke!…… I NEED HELP!
Great video! I couldn't agree more with your analysis of modern Hollywood. It's sad to see the loss of innocence and creativity that once made Hollywood so magical. It seems like everything nowadays is focused on pushing modern ideologies, rather than allowing characters to grow and develop organically. Whether you're a hero or a villain, character arcs are what make a story truly captivating. The modern approach is opposite, if you are female you are instantly a hero of strength rather than the story of overcoming resistance to build strength in adversity.
You can still use the critic’s scores as a guide though, just reverse the meaning! High score = bad movie, low score = good movie! 😂
It's just about content now. Movies are struggling to keep me interested. Have started watching 70s and 80s movies, mostly thrillers. Practical effects and stunts can't be replaced by CGI. I'm done with the MCU and DCEU.
I'm glad people are noticing the WHAT, but no one is asking the WHY
Dan Murrell says you are supposed to read the critics average score on RT and the Audience average score on RT not the overall percentage. The overall percentage tells the percentage of how many critics that liked a movie or TV show vs how many hate the movie or TV show. There are times when I agree with critics and times when I don’t. There are times when I agree with the audience side and times when I don’t. It depends on the show or movie. I remember people got upset over the RT critics score for the Seth McFarland show Orville. I like the show but I don’t find all the jokes funny. I think it could be better. Sometimes Seth’s humor is funny and sometimes it isn’t. I am watching American Dad right now and I don’t find all the episodes funny. I think sometimes he needs better writing.
I never look at the critic scores, just the audience.
A will always wait to hear from The Drinker before spending my hard earned money on a movie. I can't remember when he has ever led me astray.
Thanks!
In the 70s, Scooby Doo was about a stoner and his dog. Which was against morals of the time.
The reality is that the movie business is failing because of an adherence to the current social justice madness.
Look at the numbers for all major studies and Netflix.
I don’t think I’ve ever seen CD without his iconic sunglasses….
When I was a kid, I had great parents but I still idolized many characters from TV and movies to emulate. Bruce Banner (Bill Bixby) was one of those kind of good characters a kid could count on to do the right thing. I weep for today's adolescents and all the woke victimhood confusion they are bombarded with. Thanks Chris Williamson and Critical Drinker for speaking some common sense to combat the lunacy today.
*David Banner, but yeah.
@@Jehannum2000 Good catch. Thanks. It's been a minute since then. I totally forgot they used David instead of Bruce in that series.
So true. The lesson the movies are teaching us today is a psychological and spiritual time bomb.
The same thing happened to Ebert & Roeper; Their opinion of movies was always pretty inaccurate to the actual quality of a film. Unless it was the most watered down, PG, boring, family friendly movies they would give it bad ratings. Ever since them, I have given literally zero F's about critic opinion on anything. Gaming review critics are even worse because 9 out of 10 will perform subornation of perjury on their scores.
Basically, when it comes to a movie, tv show or game. Never trust a critic.
There is a stark difference between exploring a complex or difficult concept in media ... and the media preaching to its audience about the One True Correct Conclusion To Have.
Media that does the former tends to do well and examples of that are legion. Media that serves only as a propaganda mechanism thinly veiled with some story backdrop of some popular IP ... does not.
Rotten tomatoes was my go-to movie 🍿 review and I compared critics and public but not anymore, I was hoping for a new source to go to?
Wish we could remove paid “critic reviews” and replace them with user reviews in all services that use them. That would be a much healthier perspective than what we’ve got right now.
Critics rate rate based on their politics. The audience does not.
Rotten tomatoes used to mean something.
What's the point of a critic that no-one shares an opinion with?
I think the divergence is somewhat in part to audiences feeling increasingly burned by studios' output, therefore possessing less disposable goodwill and charitableness for frequent culprits, whilst anything approaching even averageness in terms of quality is awarded liberally because it's so scarce. There is certainly an element of audiences being spoiled, at least by visual effects, so whereas some time ago audiences might have forgiven things because they looked interesting, or the production value was on screen, it's become a less and less reliable crutch as the quality of storytelling evaporates.
It is funny how rotten Rotten Tomatoes is
I guess it is in the name
captain Marvel Real rating before censored = 23% never forget !
And sometimes even the critic websites fudge their own audience score numbers. I refuse to accept that 80% of people loved the Chip & Dale: Rescue Rangers movie.