When I talk about my issues with antimlm content- I just want to clarify if it wasn’t said well in the video that I’m talking about *my* antimlm content, not others. There are so many positive antimlm videos and channels- but I wanted to reflect on the tone I have when speaking about the mlm distributors in my videos, and wanted to include more love and positivity on my channel itself! 💜🌟
Madison Harnish I appreciate you talking more about this because I think it’s important to not only look at the flash marketing and sales tactics but also think about the psychological warfare that takes place. I think it’s important that us outsiders of the MLM world consider how to help those still struggling within it.
I so agree with your last point. I have MANY people I love in MLMs. I don't hate them because they joined one. I do get annoyed when they try and get me into it, but most of then are my friends. My best friend is in arbonne actually. She mainly is just in it for the discount and doesn't try and sell her products all over her Facebook, but I love her. I was part of an anti mlm Facebook group and had to leave because the posts started telling people that we need to cut people out of our lives who are in MLMS. I'm dead serious. I was like "the hell? Don't we always bash MLM huns for cutting people out of their lives? Why would we do the same?!" I can agree to disagree with people. It is unfortunately an art that is lost on many people today though. You either agree, or we c ant be friends 😒. I love that you have a heart like me. Most of these women are not the enemy. The company itself is.
My mom was the bread winner in our family. She told me once that she loved her family more than anything in the world, but we weren’t her entire world. She took a lot of satisfaction and joy out of her work and women like this used to try to guilt her for not staying home with us. Jokes on them, we were raised by a loving mother who went out of her way to make time for us and was also an amazing example of a strong woman who was a fucking boss.
I’m pregnant with my first child and I plan on being out for a year then going back to work, because I love my job and my husband likes the extra money that I bring in with my income.
I am a stay-at-home mom and I know plenty of women who love working, thrive in an office environment and do not desire to "kiss every boo boo." Guess what, they are still fantastic moms and they love their kids just as much as I do.
Period. Plenty of us do both, loads of us do every second of the first stage, work on our careers, take some time off if there’s a family loss or a course altering diagnosis, go back stronger, we’re always the same people, continuously growing, both independent and nurturing and capable and soft and tough and warm. With appropriate support and living wages and access to safe childcare, we can have it all and that scares them enough to pretend that we can’t.
Indeed, good luck with making me feel guilty for being "one of those that prefer going to the office and leave their kids". I love my kids to death but I also love my job. I cannot imagine myself staying with them all day (and I really admire you for doing it, it requires real mental strength). I see my kids happy to go to school and actually, my husband works less hours than me and takes great care of his children. I guess MLMs are really not for me, lucky me ;-)
I am a stay at home mom but if I have to work I will because that's supporting our families by any means. I am educated and have a great work history. My mom worked and took care of our home like nobodies business. We all love our families and I know us women will do anything to provide and care for our families. I understand how parents get hooked into these scams.
I am NOT a mom, but I will say MY mom has been a working mom for as long as I can remember and not ONCE did I feel neglected or feel any lack of love from her for not staying home. Instead, I admired her for being a career mom and showing her daughter that women can DO BOTH (have a career AND family) and that it’s our choice! She gave me plenty of love and I also was able to learn the independence and self-sufficiency to not have her around 24/7, helping me to learn to grow on my own while also having her there enough too to feel her support, love, and care. I never wanted for anything, whether material possessions or the love and nurture of my parents. Now I am in graduate school pursuing my own career path and know that I too want to have a family some day while I have said career and that it is possible and, most importantly, 100% acceptable. ❤️❤️❤️
Yup!! Just get a job women, come on. They can enjoy the weekends and afterschool with their children. They can take vacations with their families. And these moms definately shame other moms. what do their spouses think about all this? What about them, they still have to go to work, are they suddenly the bad parent? No because without that income they couldnt have what they need.
😂 Yep. My husband would bitch slap me with his eyes if I tried to join an MLM scam. I quit FB because I was tired of telling friends no all the time or ignoring them completely.
We don't have to slam working moms to support stay at home moms and we don't have to slam stay at home moms to support working moms. Some women want to work and some don't. Both options are fine, do what works best for you and your family. They prey on stay at home moms because our country doesn't value unpaid work and if the mom doesn't have a good support system it is very lonely and isolating, which makes the "passive income" and "sisterhood" appealing. But what about the moms that want to work and the dads that want to stay at home? She must be a "refrigerator mom" and he's suddenly "not a man" because he's not making all the money or a "creepy weirdo". Let's just stop judging each other for our family/parenting choices and support each other. That's the best way to kill the MLM.
I agree 100%. It seems that many of those in mlm's like to focus on talking negatively about moms who work full-time outside the home. That's why many anti-mlm TH-camrs talk more often about working full-time and getting benefits, as such. It's sort of become a stay-at-home MLM vs Corporate moms w/ benefits kind of debate. There are moms who work full-time or part-time and don't receive benefits from their job, alone. That doesn't get discussed enough. I do agree with your statement! I think if women supported and accepted the different lifestyles, there wouldn't be as much hostility.
So much of this would be remedied or reduced by federal laws that ensure income/financial aid for stay at home parents. The whole appeal of getting to stay home but still "making money" would fly out the window - it's entirely based on financial insecurity to begin with when they target the type of "stay at home mom" we see in the video. It's also about recognition - you can decide to stay home, and people will praise you for focusing on your kids. Yet at the same time, capitalist societies devalue those who are not economically productive. What do you actually get in return, outside of the interpersonal interactions with your child/ren? You may still experience that you're putting financial strain on yourself, your partner and your family. Paid parental leave puts a monetary value to your time spent at home. It's worth so much to society that you're supported in it entirely, just like if you were working. But that's socialism, am I right?
What is wrong with a woman, a mother enjoying going out to work? Like if she is more fulfilled by working out of the home, she is probably more present when she is with her kids.
yes! my mom was a stay at home mom for the first 10 years of my life. she's been a nurse for the majority of my life and she has inspired me to also be a woman who can have it all! so many of my friends have moms that are apart of an mlm and it's just not the same. one of these friends had to stay at my house in the summer for a week when we were in high school and all she did was complain about how she was bored at my house the whole time. I didn't have my license so we couldn't go anywhere. that's how *all* of my summers were before my 16th birthday. I didn't have anywhere to go or anything to do and it rubbed me the wrong way that her mom just let her think that it wasn't okay to work or that she was entitled to be able to go out everyday. they're even still going out all the time during quarantine 🙃
Absolutely! I remember my mom being happier when she was able to go to work and come home to us afterward. She's retired nowadays, but she was a wonderful middle school teacher and one of the reasons I'm a middle/high school educator.
@@cruelworldhappymind Even when I was tiny and she was home with me, my mom put me in daycare so I would get some social interaction with other kids. It was good for me, and she needed a break!
My two year old actually loves to go to daycare! She has friends and does so many activities, they play outside every day they can, and she her teachers have become like family members. And I enjoy going to work. These MLMers think that all of us don’t want to work and if we do want to we are awful parents. Yes, I have to work. But I also like working. I am lucky to have a job where they let me work from home two days a week and they are super flexible when my daughter is sick or has appointments.
Yes exactly! I loved daycare as a child, it’s so important to learn to socialize imo! My mom loved working and I looked up to that, I don’t think one or the other is bad it’s just all about personal preference and no one should be guilted for doing what makes them happy or what they need to do for their family!
Kris Bailey I never thought about it before until I saw where somebody is blind or has to have their texts read aloud for whatever reason. I can’t imagine how annoying that has to be!
HIT that nail on the head!! After I had my son, I was needing adult interaction anyways. When this girl wanted to “get lunch” or “hang out” ASAP, I was so excited. It’s embarrassing now how enamored I was with her. I was willing to do whatever she wanted me to do, just to keep her as a friend.
The worst one to me was the hun who said “if you don’t mind leaving your kids...” that’s such a manipulative thing to say. Especially when whoever posted that probably is losing money in her mlm. 😩
I can’t see how it’d be possible for women who are doing MLMs to own a car & home with that sole income. There’s no way they’d see your income that is 100% flexible/not guaranteed and allow you to purchase a house or car. This set-up relies on a hefty secondary income. So these posts are particularly damaging to single moms, who HAVE to work traditional jobs. It’s shameful.
@@kittymervine6115 well the hunbots are not likely to get loans, but their loving husbands with traditional jobs and good credit history are something else, if you know what i'm saying
I don’t know about how hunbots get loans, but my aunt was able to buy a new car while she didn’t have a job and hadn’t started receiving unemployment yet.
The mom-shaming angers me so much. It's more than just shaming women who can't afford to leave work: it's shaming women for enjoying or finding fulfillment from anything but being a mom and raising their kids. There's this insidious undercurrent of "If you don't want to spend every single waking moment with your kids, then you're a terrible mother." It's OKAY to want some time to yourself. It's OKAY to have a life and an identity outside of taking care of your kids. It's OKAY to enjoy your job. All of that is okay! It doesn't make you a bad mom or a bad person. For all their talk of female empowerment, these MLMers push a weirdly uber-conservative ideal of motherhood. (Not to say there's anything wrong with being a stay-at-home mom! If that's what works for you and your family and that's a decision you've made, that's great! Go for it. Just don't act like it's the One And Only True Way to be a Good Mom (TM).)
I applaud the woman who replied to that snobby 'I'm at the spa in Spain, ahaha!' MLM woman. She told 100% truth. If you are spamming everybody and their dog on social media how are you actually spending your time with your family???? You are just a zombie staring at your stupid phone!
Her Spain comment really bothered me as someone who travels a lot with my family, even my grandparents. I can't imagine traveling without my family and my parents in the future. If she was really making the money she was saying she was making, she would have been braging about being able to taking her family to Spain. Since spending family time is so important to her. Her attitude doesn't seems like she even thought about taking her children once she got the offer. Yeah I understand traveling alone for work, but being in a mlm isn't a job
It was really funny, too, cause "woo they sent me on a vacation in Spain I'm there right now" girl what are you doing on your phone recruiting people? Aren't you on a free vacation?
I am a male and yet even I got solicited by another guy at WORK during our lunch break to join an MLM. He sat down with me in the cafeteria and struck up a conversation asking me about what department I worked in, if I was married, if I had kids, etc. He asked how old my kids were and we had a pleasant chat - I thought this guy was sincerely trying to form a friendship with me. I was excited at the chance to make a new friend, as I don't form new friendships easily. As our lunch break started to wind down he started the pitch and I recognized the MLM format instantly. I was deeply hurt by this bait and switch. I cut him off and said, "I am sorry but I don't want to waste your time, I am just not interested in this kind of thing." I was trying to be polite. He became indignant and said, "I am just trying to help you earn more money for your family bro! You telling me you can turn down easy money?" It was my turn to be indignant and I said, "I meant what I said, and it's inappropriate for you to keep trying this after I've said no. I don't want you to ever speak to me again or I will go straight to HR, do you understand?" He walked away and I never heard from him again. Technically what he was doing was "soliciting at work" which was against company policy. Of course, I had a full time job at the time, so it was easy for me to turn him down. I imagine were that not the case I'd have been far more vulnerable.
I live near an mlm mom- it definitely looks like she’s doing well from all the home improvements going on....but the interesting part is that she regularly has sitters, puts her kids in camps etc to get time to work. I could go on and on, but that whole “spend time with your loved ones” is for sure a fallacy. Even on family vacations she works because, “the great thing is that I can work from anywhere!!” So she ends up working everywhere.
Yeah, I'm a guy and one of your 10% audience. It is an extremely well presented analysis of the MLM industry and its negative effects. One of my friends' marriage was almost ruined because of his wife's involvement in these things. Luckily her husband was promoted at his work and she could afford to stay home and care for their 2 year old. She also found alot of support from our church to help her. She actually wants to work now and is currently applying for administration office / receptionist posts.
@@goldsilvertravel They are all doing fine now. She working as a receptionist at a doctor's office. Her husband (my friend) is a production manager at a dairy product factory. But many guys are also getting trapped into all kinds of investment scams, forex trading, cryptocurrency, etc.
years ago, a friend from my high school with dreams of doing makeup and starting a makeup line fell into an mlm trap like AVON for a second. she tried to recruit me and I entertained her at first (knowing I wasn't doing it, not because I knew it was an MLM, but because I was too lazy to care lol). so she forwards me to talk to the person who recruited her, and I immediately shut that person down so I wouldn't have to shut my friend from high school down... well later on that day, she sent me a text basically upset that I told her recruiter no while "leading her on". she was upset and thought I wasn't supporting her... so yes, this is how friendships get screwed with... but im happy to report she got out of it and now does actually do her freelance makeup and sells her own products on the side. I supported her in that a few months ago. glad we both made it out still being friends.
When my cousin had her son she b ad really had postpartum depression. After a few months she decided to go back to work part time and it really helped her bounce back. (Obviously in tandem with other treatment) I’m just tired of people shaming moms. If they stay at home or go to work, people always have something to say.
S. Ramlad She is shaming mlm companies, and the people who hound their friends to buy, buy, buy. Working outside the home is fine. I hope all moms get to choose where they work. Mlms tell so many lies to the women they recruit. It’s so sad.
As a mom with two kids, I have ALWAYS worked. Even if I didn't have to, I would CHOOSE to work. My kids are 26 and 14 now. They seem to have turned out fine and I feel no guilt whatsoever about working. I'm lucky enough to work a LEGITIMATE job from home now, and am very happy. Mom-shaming is the worst.
I didn't know what an mlm is for a pretty long time, my only real interaction with a hunbot was pretty bad (I don't really use facebook alot) she asked me if I wanted to join her fitness and shake program and put me in a private group without even asking me. I told her several times I wasn't interested, she asked why and I told her I was suffering from bulimia and that I didn't think this program would help my recovery and she honest to god told me this program could cure bulimia and shed helped other ed sufferes previously with the program. I really despise these people with a passion to take advantage of others in bad situations. Sorry for the rambling and great video💕
This also happened to me. My "friend" of over five years, who already knew I had an eating disorder, continuously tried to sell me It Works weight-loss products, while I was in recovery for anorexia. She KNEW I was working on becoming weight restored and she STILL tried to sell me these damn products. I eventually had to block her because her constantly suggesting I should or need to lose weight while I absolutely had to gain weight for my health was seriously messing with my recovery. I really hope you've been able to get help and recover - it's so hard but I promise its possible. Rooting for you 💕💕💕
Wow- that’s got to be the worst thing ever! I had orthorexia for a good while and was so susceptible to false dieting information, etc. and probably would have listened to these mlm reps 😕
I’ve had several friends stay at home with their kids and work their own business. They started a shop on Etsy, their own floral design business, they sold crafts through marketplace and they make more hustling their own product than through an MLM.
MLM sales rep: "I get to spend all my time with my family!" Also MLM sales rep: "I'm on a retreat in Spain right now while you're stuck at home (with your family)!" It's such a good point that the sales reps are also the targets. Like you said, they're literally immersed in the "hey hun" culture all day every day, so it becomes hard for them to see the irony of their words. I would love to see a video on how to actually reach and "de-radicalize" these people.
i love that you have a lot of compassion for ppl who fall victim to these scams. some anti mlm ppl are needlessly rude to the mlmers and i think that enforces the idea within these mlms that its them against the world, which only serves to push them further into it. i think if more anti mlm ppl tried to educate about the dangers and reality of this business model in a much more kind and gentle way the way you do, it would make mlmers a lot more open to listening to what we're saying
Thank you for seeing my intent- it’s a hard balance because yes people should be called out for wrong doings, but we should also understand why they did what they did and how we can support them to achieve better and do greater things! A balance I’ll always be trying to find on my channel!
I believe in the notion that we should be holding huns accountable for their scummy actions, as well as having compassion for the fact that huns are victims too.
I love that you addressed the toxic female friendships thing. I totally agree that it's one of the biggest barriers to us being able to help them and to stop more people from joining.
I am definitly more emotion than logic, even if I learned to stop and be logical, and have almost been roped into a good dozen mlm's. But, I am also lazy and never follow through. Lazyness has saved me thousands.
I feel you on that. I was a member of Amway but I felt strange trying to sell their products to friends and family, so I never tried / did, after a year (Free-membership) I quit. Also, I didn't see the point of paying the fee. XD So glad that I love to save money where ever possible and also, that I didn't have much back then. It sure saved my A***. That they are a MLM I only found out after watching #anti-MLM videos from Kiki Channel. And I have to admit they say the same thing everywhere.
I’m lucky. Before Coronavirus, I was working 20 hours a week in a school so my son is in daycare for about 7-8 hours and we were both happy with our schedule . Since I don’t work 40 hours I had a bit of energy when I pick him up but I also have purpose in my career. When he was a newborn however we were in a shit financial situation. I had just recently graduated and hubby wasn’t making enough to support 3 people. An MLM hun tried to recruit me and she used so many manipulative tactics, including reaching out when my grandfather passed away. Luckily I never gave her a penny.
Wow- can’t believe the thing with the grandfather and mlm rep, so sad to hear when stuff like that happens! I grew up in daycare (my mom was the primary earner of the family) and I loved daycare! So glad you have an awesome family and work life situation! 💜💜
My older sister's boyfriend's mom is in an mlm and when you mentioned that someone gets brainwashed by mlm's, it was so true. She is apparently always on her phone, even when she is supposed to be spending time with my older sister at the nail salon, and she is barely making 100 dollars a week (and who knows if that's true), but she is perfectly happy and thinks that she is super successful in this company. The saddest part of this is that my sister's boyfriend said that his mom doesn't even really feel like a person anymore. Only a xyngular salesperson. Also yes the mlm is called xyngular. Do you hear me? XYNGULAR!!! I am emphasizing this so much so that anyone who reads this comment doesn't fall into the trap of that mlm. It is really a PYRAMID SCHEME
this is 1 year late but thankyou for this. love and compassion is ESSENTIAL. for emotionally manipulated people, logic may not even be processed. you need to approach this from an empathetic angle and truly show them you are trying to care, because these vulnerable people dont want to be in an even worse, shitty state cause you made them feel like that after telling them about their horribly decisions. ive been struggling to get my mom out of these scams and i searched up ways to help because my mum was really broken after i said i did not want to support her in her "business ventures". but shes in a fragile state, i regardless should have been there to support her emotionally and mentally. thank you for this video.
Thanks for being so respectful in all your videos. I have relatives caught up in these, but they are basically good people who just have poor judgment in this area . I won’t watch some anti-MLM channels because they are just catty and immature towards these people; you always seem kind and genuine in your concern.
Thank you so much! There are some bad people out there- but most people in mlms are just like us, and have been convinced that mlms are an opportunity that they’re simply not. My passion is exposing unethical businesses and I have to point them out but I struggle with the idea of maybe hurting a lot of peoples feelings in the process... want to go about it in the right way!
I sometimes feel a little uncomfortable about the way people discuss mlms. In quite a lot of cases, the people who get involved are victims themselves who then get stuck in a negative loop and they're convinced the only way out is to start recruiting more people to their down-line. I really appreciate the self-reflection you've done. One thing you don't mention that I think is very important is the Concorde fallacy (or the sunk cost fallacy) - "the idea that you should continue to spend money on a project, product, etc. in order not to waste the money or effort you have already put into it, which may lead to bad decisions" (Cambridge). When people pay for a "starter kit" or a "franchise fee", they're more likely to buy stock they can't sell, or put more of their own money into a business that isn't going well. Your videos are great and keep getting better. Keep up the good work.
Thank you so much for acknowledging that these women (for the most part) aren't evil, they're just brainwashed. I feel like some of the channels I watch seem to forget that.
Love how they talk like being in your kids space all day every day is even enotionaly healthy. Children havr to go to school, meet new people, grow into the people they are going to be outside of the house. They aren't going to get that inside their mother's nest.
when my best friend had her first kid, she was going crazy from staying at home with her after a couple of months. plenty of women want to go back to work, contribute to society, socialize with adults etc. other than the obvious attempts to guilt women, there's something very anti-feminist about all of this, some old fashioned notion that what women should do is stay at home with their kids.
Love this video and hate how relatable it is. My step mother tried to get me on her down line in Monat when I was about 19 or so, she asked me what I thought about mlm’s and I was like oh so a pyramid scheme and she just saw there smiling at me like coraline’s other mother, turned to my dad with that same look, and he nervously looked back at me and kind of laughed as though he had just proved his point (assuming he cautioned her about it) through my reaction. I’m 22 now and am so grateful I knew better then. Cuz geesh, she has DEFINITELY not been successful and her posting and prodding has been so overwhelming.
Madison Harnish there are a ton of typos in my paragraph but glad you understood. Haha 😅 but it’s crazy how mlms can brainwash people into thinking it’s okay to target young women, let alone your own family members.
Honestly, it's actually good for kids to socialize. I'm getting the feeling that these mom's who think you HAVE to be there ALL THE TIME seem like helicopter parents. Not saying mlm mom's believe that but the ones that do 👀
Michayla Lawrence Right! It’s even recommended that you put your children in daycare for at least two days out of the week even if you’re a stay at home parent so they can have social interaction.
@@Bettersucksaul I’m so sorry you had a bad experience with daycare ☹️ these experiences are def individualized from child to child based on environment, circumstances, and the people involved….but, for the most part, daycare is still proven to be quite beneficial in a young child’s growth and development. U probably learned a lot more from that negative experience u had than fully conscious of.
You can socialize your children without risking their safety and health at a daycare. I've heard too many horror stories to want to enroll my child in daycare. Not even that, but the ones that likely are safe are waaaay out of our budget. Parks exist. Family and friends with their own kids exist.
Thank you for calling this out, I see this all the time in MLM content. Kiki Chanel (who you've referenced) has a whole video on MLMers using their kids to try and shill products, which is a similar issue. I'd love to see you do a video about how MLMs target military wives as well. Many military wives want a community to be apart of, because they constantly have to move with their husbands to new places where they have no friends, and likely will have a difficult time getting a job. Military wives suffer depression, anxiety, and other mental health issues at greater rates than the general population due to many of these reasons (social isolation, lack of social support, etc). In swoops an MLM hun promising them a community of women who will be their friend and support them in their "business" without question. I know Lularoe, in particular, was aggressively targeting military wives and ended up bankrupting many of the women. Its so upsetting how many different unsavory tactics MLMs use to take advantage of people.
No way, I’m currently editing a video on military wives and mlms! Considering I am one myself, it’s a topic super close to my heart and I hope I explain all of these issues well in that video!
@@cruelworldhappymind I can't wait to see it! All your other videos have been wonderful so I'm sure it'll be great, and I definitely think it is an under-reported issue. My dad was in the marine corps for 30 years and has since retired, so I'm definitely extra angry when I hear MLMs targeting military personnel too
Thank you for this! I have always felt that a lot of anti mlm content was more anti women than anything else and I'm glad you spoke up about it! but that being said I do know way too many stay at home moms who are apart of mlms such as Young Living, Nuskin, Mary Kay, etc who live in all of these super fancy houses, have nice cars and expensive purses. it's clearly because their husbands are doctors and whatnot but they are so unfortunately brainwashed into thinking that it's their mlm income that gave them all of those luxuries. I also think that a lot of generations where women are put down by each other constantly are more likely to join an MLM bc it's all they've ever known from each other
I’m one of the 10% males subbed. I know most of these topics don’t directly pertain to me..but you (along with others like Amandathejedi) have helped me look out for my vulnerable family and friends. Also the tea is fun..thanks for what you do!
I’m not gonna lie I just realized I’m like the only guy in the comments… your content is just so well put together. I like Coffezilla but I low key binged all his videos at work and I find your approach and execution very positive and uplifting. It’s inspiring!
I super appreciate brining light to how mean a lot of Anti MLM can be, and agree, making fun of people isn't necessary. But, these vulnerable woman are still adults, and I'm having a harder and harder time seeing the hate, cruelty, and stupidity spewed from my sisters mouth and life and "feeling bad" for her or cutting her some slack cause she is/was vulnerable and got sucked into an MLM. Woman who abuse their children are vulnerable too. Everyone is vulnerable in some way, doesn't give them a free pass to treat others as lesser, LOTS of women rise above and keep their dignity. I've found in my situation, love doesn't help, hate doesn't help, so I've checked out until THEY reach out for help.
I "accidentally" stumbled upon your channel today, so to speak, as I'm generally not into "youtubers", influencers, gossip, or op-ed esque channels. But I'm so glad I did, I really like you, your approach, your succinct yet fully informative content, and how you give facts and logical opinions without speaking solely from emotion. Intelligent, and beautiful to boot (sans being overly sexual/using t&a to gain viewership). I never thought I'd subscribe to an opinion-based channel, yet here I am! I genuinely look forward to watching both your past and your future content!!
Thank you for saying being a SHAM is respectable and enough. I’ve been a one for almost eight years now (retiring in the next two years when my youngest goes to school.) I am constantly barraged by MLMs. The number of times I have gotten a message from a fellow SAHM that started with “HEY HUN!” or got invited to their launch party is terrifying. I got sucked into a MLM when I was straight out of college but backed out before I lost a lot of money or friends, so I feel for them. MLMs are preying on moms by using mother’s guilt and isolation...it’s disgusting.
When I was a younger kid, like I couldn't entirely take care of myself, my mom worked and watched me and my sister. She was with us during the day, but worked at night while there was nothing going on to miss.
I always feel weird when people say food service are hero’s rn because we have to work it definitely doesn’t feel heroic because most food service is easy and it feels normal for us
I know- but the fact that you guys have to work right now is what makes it a heroic thing! Your providing food for people who want/need it during this time and that’s a really important thing for even just keeping people happy!
You are being exposed to a lot of people that could be infected. You are doing your job while risking your own health and also providing an income so you and your loved ones can survive. You might not see it but you are being heroic just by being there to provide an essential service to a lot of people.
Because you guys are putting yourselves at risk every day for the rest who can/have to stay at home. You are keeping the economy going. Without you guys everything would be so much worse. I can do my office job from home and go out only if i need to buy groceries but you are going to work everyday and it needs to be appreciated now more than ever.
My SAHM put me in daycare because she felt it would be in my best interest. Based on her own childhood, her BA in Early-Childhood Education, and her many years teaching and working with latchkey kids, she was concerned about me not getting enough socialization... especially being the only kid living at home way out in the middle of nowhere. It's obviously a privilege to be able to do that, but my point is that daycare shouldn't be seen as some great tragedy. Neither my mom nor I feel like we missed out on anything by spending some time apart when I was little. I also have so many happy memories of daycare and I met two girls there whom I still count among my closest friends over 25 years later.
As someone living with (well, really, more suffering through if I'm being totally honest) leukemia, reading that message to that person dying from cancer made me seriously angry. I cannot believe a human being could sit down and seriously write something like that. I really have no words for how seething angry I am right now.
I appreciate your message towards the end. You have such an open mind and it’s very refreshing. I agree with you. We should be helping people instead of attacking them. I can’t watch some of the other anti mlm channels because they are just so filled with negativity and anger. Not that this isn’t a negative thing. You are just such a positive light that I actually enjoy hearing you talk about it and informing us on things and hearing your unbiased point of view. And this video proved that. I respect you so much.
I've been really into the Anti MLM content lately because my parents were in Amway as a kid, and it really messed me up. I know the people recruited into these "businesses" think they are doing the best for their kids when it's pretty damaging to kids, I was trained at like 5 and 6 to be in sales. My parents involved me in embarrassing little skits to sell soap. They were always gone at Meetings and we had babysitters most nights of the week. I'm pretty good at arts and crafts, and even went to a prestigious design school, because I was taught from an early age to monetize my life. As an adult, being able to make my own choices, I wish I had just been able to enjoy making art without thinking about how to sell it. I literally get triggered, like a PSTD trigger, when anyone tells me "I should sell those" about something I make. I was a professional artist for a while, and was pretty successful, but I was super miserable being a salesperson all the time. I'm much happier now working for someone else at a regular job.
It’s so frustrating because I don’t know what to do about it! Thinking about complaining to TH-cam, although it is funny to see mlm companies wasting all their ad money on videos that debunk them... still frustrating they’re being advertised to my audience!
This is such an important video!!👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼 this is something that does not get touched on enough. Motherhood can be very isolating, even though it’s wonderful, and these direct selling companies target that, knowing full well that so many of these Mamas are starved for adult human contact and to do something other than wipe runny noses and change diapers. And the fact that they’re being targeted by other moms who have “drunk the punch” is so true.... I know a mom like that. She’s a die-hard believer in MLM, and won’t hear anything to the contrary. And she’s a smart lady!! Anyway, loved his video, awesome job. And Happy Easter!!🙏🏼🌸✨
My mom's friend that used to babysit me and my brother posts about how she can't be friends with people who shop at Ulta or Sephora because she sells Younique
It’s so frustrating because I don’t know what to do about it! Thinking about complaining to TH-cam, although it is funny to see mlm companies wasting all their ad money on videos that debunk them... still frustrating they’re being advertised to my audience!
Loved this video! It is really important that you bring up how these women are victims. They’re being exploited and indoctrinated. And in a typical cycle of abuse they then push it onto other vulnerable women. I love how genuinely caring and compassionate you are while being passionate about the subject and helping these women. Thumbs up to you!
Nice to be one of the 10%! I really appreciate your perspective on attacking women in MLMs. women are continuing to shoulder the burden of childcare and home making even in an economy with stagnated wages and a disappearing middle class. What does this lead to? A conflicted woman that might not have gotten any formal training because she prepared herself to be a stay at home mom like her mom was. She was encouraged by her older female family, role models, and mommy blogs to stay at home. But her husband hasn’t seen a raise in 5 years. The economy is broken. And her husband might even exert control over her for being the income earner. She might be more aware of the family finances. The woman feels responsible for the direction of her household. So when a trusted friend tells her she can work from home and earn a living, it can be incredibly attractive. Add to all of this, the woman might be in a state of vulnerability. If she is lonely or in an abusive relationship or isolated from family, she is even more vulnerable.
One of the reasons I deleted my Facebook was because of my mom friends ALWAYS messaging me about Plexis, Rodan and Fields or essential oils. It was ridiculous. Thanks for sharing.
I watched this yesterday but I just wanted to pop back in and tell you how much I appreciate your perspective on the anti-MLM community. It seems like it has exploded on TH-cam in the last few months, and while there is quite a bit of good information available, admittedly a lot of it comes off as mean spirited or arrogant. There is something to be said about the psychological aspect behind MLMs and what would make someone fall prey to one....we’ve all now heard about attraction marketing, we know about the income disclosure statements, we know it’s all BS, and yet people are still falling for MLMs on a regular basis. Why? What level of desperation, sadness or lack of purpose must one be feeling to subject themselves to something that forces them to completely suspend reality in order to participate? If not that, what level of ignorance must be present? IMO, that is the most dangerous (and interesting) aspect of what are essentially selling cults and the aspect that seems to be talked about the least. The #1 way to keep someone in a cult, or in an abusive relationship, or in any otherwise toxic situation is to shame them for it and that is exactly what a lot of anti-MLM content is becoming. I agree with you that these people (mostly women) should be lifted up and made to feel valuable, special and smart and should be shown what their hard work could produce if they would channel that energy elsewhere. If they don’t get that, at the very least they shouldn’t be made to feel stupid for trying. That is why (I think) so many go from MLM to MLM. No one is intervening in a healthy and positive way. Anyway. That’s my rant. Thanks if you read this far! Lol
I actually think it’s really healthy for moms AND dad’s to have ambitions and lives outside their homes and kids. When parents have passions and careers that they get to cultivate outside the house it usually makes them better and more present parents at home. Quality over quantity.
I was the primary earner in my house and we were trying to get pregnant and then I lost my job. The Mary Kay hun swept in and got me... looking back in the 6ish months I had been in I lost a few hundred dollars. That was with me not even buying all the inventory they wanted me to.
It’s so frustrating because I don’t know what to do about it! Thinking about complaining to TH-cam, although it is funny to see mlm companies wasting all their ad money on videos that debunk them... still frustrating they’re being advertised to my audience!
This episode is fantastic. Thank you for all your content and hard work with sharing this information. I'm starting a grassroots funded fictional docu-drama tv show, focusing on a BIPOC family and other marginalized communities in the midst of the 2020 pandemic. With my team, we are writing an episode that's going to dive into mlms and explore the pchyology and trauma they can bring. It's going to be heavily anti mlm, but it's not going to demonize those who are in them; as I've seen noted on many other anti mlm channels---that they are part of the bigger issue and as you mentioned, they are vaulnerable people who were targeted and roped in, and how we must address the whole problem. Same goes with all "get rich quick" scams. I got roped into one and caused a lot of trauma that I still deal with.
I've always wondered how otherwise reasonably cognizant women could actually fall for these types of schemes. You've given great insight into this perplexing industry. Edit - I sound like such a pretentious nerd lol
as a full time astay at home mom, i fully enjoy any little break i can get from my monster. i love my son to pieces and i am so grateful to my husband for working so hard to provide for us but i am human and can only handle so many "mommies a day"! i miss working and going to the gym because i got a break and that helped me maintain my sanity. also gave my son time to socialize with other people besides myself. i also suffer from OCD, severe anxiety and chronic depression, i get overwhelmed easily, even when i try to hold it together i lose it and it's hard for me to snap out of my funk sometimes. these huns that shame moms for not being perfect parents should be ashamed of themselves.
I say this full well as a mother myself, who has barely any mom friends for this reason, the reason that mom shaming happens is because women have been subjected to having kids being their only achievable accomplishment in their life for so long. Women weren’t able to get other accomplishments for a very long time at all. When it comes down to it children shouldn’t be viewed as an accomplishment if they turn out good and are good kids, And are helpful and don’t get in trouble that should be the accomplishment, not simply Having children and being around them 24 seven. unfortunately it’s like women shame other women for doing things outside of that now societal norm of children being the only thing women could accomplish, they feel bad and jealous because they haven’t accomplished anything else in their lives, and are using their children, a area where no matter what a mother will feel guilt in some sense, to gain moral superiority
I know moms who love their children but also love their careers. Women are more than just mothers. We don't shame men for having aspirations outside of the home and we need to stop doing that to women. You ARE allowed to want to be more than just a mom and no one should make you feel like a bad mom for loving your career as well. If you love being a mom and want to stay at home with your children, that is fine too. Do what fulfills YOUR life and don't let people talk down to you no matter WHAT you decide to do with your life. EDIT: My best friend has been a stay at home mom since she had her son 2 years ago. She has always wanted to be a stay at home mom but her passion has always been in the fashion industry. She began by buying bulk clothing and accessories and even made herself a website. She now has an entire company she built herself (on little money I might add) and does spend most if not all of the day with her son. She does do Facebook lives once for an hour every few days. She is able to spend time with him while collecting orders, making labels, and mailing out per products. She did actually make her own business, not buy into one where the only way she'll make money is by spending 15+ hours staring at her phone and hoping she can recruit enough people to make $20 a month.
"Oh, you just enjoy going to work and leave your children?" Also: It's totally o.k. for women to enjoy going to work and get a break from their kids. It doesn't mean they love them any less. Let's not shame working mothers if they do, in fact, like working (or at least don't hate it). Off topic but: I love your hair and my toddler thinks you're a magic fairy. "Pretty fairy!"
About three years out of high school I began to lose friends to MLM's. Especially young women who were also in certain religions. Asking to please not send me messages about cleaning products or essential oils got two "Why are you being so negative? Why won't you support your friends?" It wasn't pretty. I wish them well, but also if you can't respect my boundaries there's a block button for that.
I appreciate the part when you talked about how the distributors are also vulnerable people and I think we should always remember that when we discuss about people's behavior vs company behavior. Still, there are plenty examples of victims becoming abusers, and it's important to put that in balance too. At the end of the day, we shouldn't assume these people are naive and ignorant (and of course, I don't think Madison does that). As it is not lack of intelligence that makes these people fall for the schemes, but vulnerability, they should be held accountable for the harm they do. Once they gaslight and manipulate other vulnerable people, I find it very hard to empathise with them, or see them as still being in the same side as me. As perpetrators, they should know what they are doing to the people above them, and are actively working for and siding with unethical practices. Although I agree that compassion is needed when dealing with such delicate situations, I think these perpetrators should be made aware of the abusive role they played and held responsible for it. If one doesn't doesn't aknowledge it's fault, then there's little point in forgiveness. As for influencers promoting mlms, I hold much less empathy. I think they should be legally accounted for the spread of dangerous lies and scams, even if they had good intentions at one point. Either way, I did not write this as to disagree with her point. I think Madison is extremely intelligent and hits the nail in the head in every one of her deep dives, in the most humane way possible. I trust her judgment when regarding both the representatives and companies actions. My point was that athough we should be compassionate, sometimes people who suffered the same as us are not in our team and can become unethical themselves. Although they were unprotected victims, we shouldn't automatically protect abusers out of compassion for their past (Again, not implying that Madison said we should). I apologize for any grammar mistakes, english is not my mother language.
My cousin recently closed her legitimate small business cause her kids were growing up and she wanted to be there for them.... Less than a week after she closed that business, she turned her Facebook group for her legitimate small business into a Red Aspen group. I ended up leaving the group and unfollowing her page after she announced it. My mom doesn't realize how bad MLMs can mess people over. (She works consignment and she sees MLM products come in all the time.) While watching my cousin's live vid, my mom turned to me and asked, "Didn't she close [Legitimate Small Business Name] in order to spend time with her kids? I see her online trying to sell these nails all the time." My mom hasn't joined an MLM. But she's starting to realize that these businesses aren't what they seem.
OMG I LOVE YOU SO MUCH. Im the daughter of a mother who is spending my inheritance on Paparazzi jewelry, Facebook Pearl parties, cases and cases of leggings in the spare bedroom and of course Monat. My momma has a room full of Monat. I showed your videos to my dad and we both agreed if we showed her these she would just get mad.
Stay at home moms are easy targets because they’re lonely and you don’t have to pay them well. I’m a 30 something stay at home mom. I get hit with MLM pitches A LOT. A lot of times they grab interest with the promise of money but they keep them with community, sense of purpose and friendship, how ever misguided that may be.
I had a friend who started selling younique and tried recruiting me bc I love makeup. I almost felt targeted bc of my natural interests, but Just bc I love makeup doesn’t mean I want to buy from or try every brand. I was genuinely not interested in youniques products whether she was selling it or not. I told her I have more than enough makeup and don’t feel comfortable pressuring friends and families to buy products they’re not interested in. Luckily it didn’t come between us but there were points where I struggled with feeling guilty for “not supporting” her. I had to remind myself that she doesn’t do anything to financially support me so why do I feel the need to buy products I’m not interested in especially when it’s not even her business. (If she came up with her own makeup brand that would be completely different and i would absolutely support it) I would never expect my friends, family or anyone for that matter to buy things from me just bc we’re close. If they wanted to they would reach out. I’m so grateful i stood my ground and never caved. We’re still friends and she doesn’t sell for mlms anymore 😂
I just want to say, in EVERY area of life, there are people doing ot badly, and people doing it well. The same is in MLM. It's so unfortunate that that this industry has got such a bad rep because of the money hungry distributors. I am not on my phone when I'm with my children. I wake up earlier than them and I work on my business. They nap, I work on my business, if they are content and playing together I work on my business and then when they go to bed, I work on my business. We are encouraged to think " how many people can I help today." We help those who we relate to. For me, it is sahm's because I am one too. I know the struggle and the worry. And I've helped mums to earn from home. It's hard work in the beginning to give freedom later. If it's done right, it's a place of belonging, good values, and helping others.
I noticed from some MLM peeps in a fitness group- people saying "I made $150 this month and now I can afford things". I wondered. The BASE products are at LEAST that amount, and if *you* don't buy and consume your own company's products- how does that look? I might be wrong, but I am 99% sure when they quote what they make, they aren't taking into account what they have spent. Once I started doing more research- there are products with BETTER ingredients that cost 1/2 the amount and you don't have to sell or convert people. And if someone wants to argue that then you don't get personalized coaching- you can take the savings and hire an actual certified nutritionist or personal trainer. The other group that they target is college students. It make zero sense to me that someone can be a "nutrition coach" with NO health/fitness/nutrition background and before they have personally tried it. I have full out seen people "joining the team" before they have even received their products. I have to admit that I fell in with an MLM group (but never became a distributor). Honestly, there are some fakey people, but like you said there are SO many people who have been brainwashed and they honestly want that sense of community. They are told that all they need to do is "be positive" and that if you aren't making the $, that it is on YOU. And you are told that it *isn't* "bugging" people or "nagging" it is sharing and recommending just like if you rave about a new restaurant or movie. So people get sucked into it. Team meetings are the same "positive, inspirational" journeys of all the distributors in the groups. When you feel disconnected it is a easy trap to fall into.
As someone who is a SAHM to twins, I’m 24, thank you for standing up for me ❤️❤️ I’ve been harassed by so many mlms and I just tell em to fuck off lmao
About a year ago there was a post on the antiMLM subreddit from a parent talking about their daughter constantly getting into MLMs and ending up broke and trying to sell shit to family. Everyone in the replies had the same answer: cut the daughter off, block her everywhere, she's a lost cause. I tried to suggest that maybe, since the daughter clearly is very easy prey for these companies, some therapy and compassion would be a better option. That the parents could perhaps help the daughter financially but control her finances entirely until she has enough therapy and mental strength to resist these ghouls preying on her. The replies to my suggestion were entirely negative, no one had any interest in seeing the woman as a victim, only as a scammer, as someone evil who is intent on bankrupting her parents. That was the last time I ever engaged with the antiMLM subreddit. I just felt disgusted and horrified at the absolute lack of empathy towards someone who, as described by her own parents, had been victimized by MLM companies multiple times and needed serious, professional, help.
I really love that your making a more positive video that doesnt attack the women that I would be able to share with my friend. Because I dont want to make her think i dont support her. I want nothing but success and the best for her! She says she isnt losing money and that she will be able to retire soon. But at the same time I just dont trust mlm and direct selling businesses. And also just think she could use her time and talents elsewhere, even if she feels like this is what's best..
Guilty pleasure watching your content. I don't want to know about the scams but I wanna know something's being done about them. Some of the scams I almost feel victim to. Freebots for example. I like watching your content cause it confirms my suspecions about them being scams.
The reason it really is so cruel Bc if ur a mom you understand how difficult it is to afford childcare. Childcare alone can be the cost of your rent in a month. You run on very little sleep to the point it almost drives you insane and then when you really need a day off you can’t take it: you have to go to work sick as hell bc you have to save any sick days for when your child is sick and can’t go to daycare. My work only allows 8 call ins a year which I think is pretty generous. But I’ve literally had to take medical leaves in order to not be fired, and also provide the best health care for my child. Like anytime my child runs a fever she isn’t allowed at daycare. Diaharrea, rash, fever, cough, etc are all reasons your child can not be at daycare. That happens more often in a year then you think. So when I tell you, you would do anything to be able to work from home or have a job that allows you to be around your child. That’s why they prey on moms and that’s why it works so well.
"Just being a stay at home mom is more respectful" YES! A lot of women have the money to be a SAHM if they budgeted correctly, like my mom was and like many lower income women are. But because we live in a society that equates capitol with value and labels people by their career a lot of women only feel justified to stay home with their kids if they're a "girl boss" and "making good money", even if they're actually losing money in the process. ALSO I wish more MLM "hunbots" would discuss a.) the power of product sales/investments/passive income in general and how pairing your partners active income with your passive income as a SAHM can give you multiple revenues of income and more financial stability in your savings and b.) the power of working from home for a normal job. More and more companies have WFH jobs or hybrid jobs. You don't have to sell overpriced products at awkward parties or send cringey messages to your distant relatives, you can just work for one of many legitimate businesses virtually.
You have a new subscriber here, Madison - awesome video and, honestly, the best message I have ever heard regarding MLMs. I've had close family members and friends pulled in to the MLM black hole (in the form of Arbonne, NuSkin, LuLaRoe and a few others), and this is the best possible message everyone can hear. Bravo! Looking forward to your future videos (and am about to watch a few more of your previous videos!)
Also daycare/nursery can often to educational and enriching environments for children especially where they learn language, co-operation & confidence skills communicating with their peers.
I love your anti mlm comment about the women who join are vulnerable. Kiki is one of my favourite anti mlm contributors I was hooked into Roden and fields when I was extremely vulnerable. I had had a preemie and he has some health challenges. I was broke and Was looking on how to stay home with him. And then myself and my up line fell pray to this as a solution We both believed that we could do this. We both Tried. She also had a child with health challenges. I felt so stupid for falling for this as an “opportunity” But now I see it for what it was. Being manipulated by people taking advantage of our vulnerability I hate that I bothered people to buy the products or worse join 🤦♀️
Thank you! Trying to provide resources to a family member who was nearly recruited by some instant coffee MLM with the promise of being able to eventually forgo her anxiety medication was really difficult without exposing her to the amount of vitriol for sellers that’s present in the anti-MLM community. Nearly every resource was either incredibly condescending or minimized the company’s role and vilifies the sellers. I’m looking forward to your video, the anti-MLM community could use a dose of compassion, we’re all struggling under capitalism together, and calling people stupid for believing they could have a good life is antithetical to the “bootstraps” messaging we receive basically from birth.
Thank you for doing this! Mom shame is so real and it’s disgusting how these scams prey on that guilt. How about Moms support each other and lift one another up instead of tearing each other down.
When I talk about my issues with antimlm content- I just want to clarify if it wasn’t said well in the video that I’m talking about *my* antimlm content, not others. There are so many positive antimlm videos and channels- but I wanted to reflect on the tone I have when speaking about the mlm distributors in my videos, and wanted to include more love and positivity on my channel itself! 💜🌟
Madison Harnish I appreciate you talking more about this because I think it’s important to not only look at the flash marketing and sales tactics but also think about the psychological warfare that takes place. I think it’s important that us outsiders of the MLM world consider how to help those still struggling within it.
Madison Harnish ❤️
💗 thank you for clarifying this.
I can respect that. I thought you were gonna quit all together tbh lol I'm glad that's not the case.
I so agree with your last point. I have MANY people I love in MLMs. I don't hate them because they joined one. I do get annoyed when they try and get me into it, but most of then are my friends. My best friend is in arbonne actually. She mainly is just in it for the discount and doesn't try and sell her products all over her Facebook, but I love her.
I was part of an anti mlm Facebook group and had to leave because the posts started telling people that we need to cut people out of our lives who are in MLMS. I'm dead serious. I was like "the hell? Don't we always bash MLM huns for cutting people out of their lives? Why would we do the same?!" I can agree to disagree with people. It is unfortunately an art that is lost on many people today though. You either agree, or we c ant be friends 😒.
I love that you have a heart like me. Most of these women are not the enemy. The company itself is.
My mom was the bread winner in our family. She told me once that she loved her family more than anything in the world, but we weren’t her entire world. She took a lot of satisfaction and joy out of her work and women like this used to try to guilt her for not staying home with us. Jokes on them, we were raised by a loving mother who went out of her way to make time for us and was also an amazing example of a strong woman who was a fucking boss.
YES!! EXACTLY! My mother has three masters degrees and was the primary earner of our family and I looked up to that growing up it inspired me!!
💚💚💚
❤❤
I’m pregnant with my first child and I plan on being out for a year then going back to work, because I love my job and my husband likes the extra money that I bring in with my income.
are you translating from portuguese or is "bread winner" a real english expression?
I am a stay-at-home mom and I know plenty of women who love working, thrive in an office environment and do not desire to "kiss every boo boo." Guess what, they are still fantastic moms and they love their kids just as much as I do.
This is lovely ☺️
Period. Plenty of us do both, loads of us do every second of the first stage, work on our careers, take some time off if there’s a family loss or a course altering diagnosis, go back stronger, we’re always the same people, continuously growing, both independent and nurturing and capable and soft and tough and warm. With appropriate support and living wages and access to safe childcare, we can have it all and that scares them enough to pretend that we can’t.
Indeed, good luck with making me feel guilty for being "one of those that prefer going to the office and leave their kids". I love my kids to death but I also love my job. I cannot imagine myself staying with them all day (and I really admire you for doing it, it requires real mental strength). I see my kids happy to go to school and actually, my husband works less hours than me and takes great care of his children. I guess MLMs are really not for me, lucky me ;-)
I am a stay at home mom but if I have to work I will because that's supporting our families by any means. I am educated and have a great work history. My mom worked and took care of our home like nobodies business. We all love our families and I know us women will do anything to provide and care for our families. I understand how parents get hooked into these scams.
I am NOT a mom, but I will say MY mom has been a working mom for as long as I can remember and not ONCE did I feel neglected or feel any lack of love from her for not staying home. Instead, I admired her for being a career mom and showing her daughter that women can DO BOTH (have a career AND family) and that it’s our choice! She gave me plenty of love and I also was able to learn the independence and self-sufficiency to not have her around 24/7, helping me to learn to grow on my own while also having her there enough too to feel her support, love, and care. I never wanted for anything, whether material possessions or the love and nurture of my parents. Now I am in graduate school pursuing my own career path and know that I too want to have a family some day while I have said career and that it is possible and, most importantly, 100% acceptable. ❤️❤️❤️
"Hard - is arguing with your significant other about finances"
Yes. Join an MLM, it'll make that *SO* much easier for you!
Yup!! Just get a job women, come on. They can enjoy the weekends and afterschool with their children. They can take vacations with their families. And these moms definately shame other moms. what do their spouses think about all this? What about them, they still have to go to work, are they suddenly the bad parent? No because without that income they couldnt have what they need.
Ikr!! Too true... 😅
😂 Yep. My husband would bitch slap me with his eyes if I tried to join an MLM scam. I quit FB because I was tired of telling friends no all the time or ignoring them completely.
Ma’am I honestly laughed heartily at this comment
Hard is getting through their entire spiel with a straight face…
We don't have to slam working moms to support stay at home moms and we don't have to slam stay at home moms to support working moms. Some women want to work and some don't. Both options are fine, do what works best for you and your family. They prey on stay at home moms because our country doesn't value unpaid work and if the mom doesn't have a good support system it is very lonely and isolating, which makes the "passive income" and "sisterhood" appealing. But what about the moms that want to work and the dads that want to stay at home? She must be a "refrigerator mom" and he's suddenly "not a man" because he's not making all the money or a "creepy weirdo". Let's just stop judging each other for our family/parenting choices and support each other. That's the best way to kill the MLM.
Thank you, I agree 100% with everything said here... you explain this so well!!
I agree 100%. It seems that many of those in mlm's like to focus on talking negatively about moms who work full-time outside the home. That's why many anti-mlm TH-camrs talk more often about working full-time and getting benefits, as such. It's sort of become a stay-at-home MLM vs Corporate moms w/ benefits kind of debate. There are moms who work full-time or part-time and don't receive benefits from their job, alone. That doesn't get discussed enough. I do agree with your statement! I think if women supported and accepted the different lifestyles, there wouldn't be as much hostility.
So much of this would be remedied or reduced by federal laws that ensure income/financial aid for stay at home parents. The whole appeal of getting to stay home but still "making money" would fly out the window - it's entirely based on financial insecurity to begin with when they target the type of "stay at home mom" we see in the video. It's also about recognition - you can decide to stay home, and people will praise you for focusing on your kids. Yet at the same time, capitalist societies devalue those who are not economically productive. What do you actually get in return, outside of the interpersonal interactions with your child/ren? You may still experience that you're putting financial strain on yourself, your partner and your family. Paid parental leave puts a monetary value to your time spent at home. It's worth so much to society that you're supported in it entirely, just like if you were working.
But that's socialism, am I right?
I'm a SAHM both by need and choice. I enjoy it, but I also didn't have a choice because childcare is super expensive where I live.
@@catherinearredondo2092 so expensive 🤯
What is wrong with a woman, a mother enjoying going out to work? Like if she is more fulfilled by working out of the home, she is probably more present when she is with her kids.
YES! My mother worked full time throughout my life, I “grew up in daycare” but her career passions and intelligence inspired me as a child.
yes! my mom was a stay at home mom for the first 10 years of my life. she's been a nurse for the majority of my life and she has inspired me to also be a woman who can have it all! so many of my friends have moms that are apart of an mlm and it's just not the same. one of these friends had to stay at my house in the summer for a week when we were in high school and all she did was complain about how she was bored at my house the whole time. I didn't have my license so we couldn't go anywhere. that's how *all* of my summers were before my 16th birthday. I didn't have anywhere to go or anything to do and it rubbed me the wrong way that her mom just let her think that it wasn't okay to work or that she was entitled to be able to go out everyday. they're even still going out all the time during quarantine 🙃
Absolutely! I remember my mom being happier when she was able to go to work and come home to us afterward. She's retired nowadays, but she was a wonderful middle school teacher and one of the reasons I'm a middle/high school educator.
@@cruelworldhappymind Even when I was tiny and she was home with me, my mom put me in daycare so I would get some social interaction with other kids. It was good for me, and she needed a break!
I know right? Ultimately who cares...we’re all here under capitalism, we all gotta make it work for ourselves in one way or another
My two year old actually loves to go to daycare! She has friends and does so many activities, they play outside every day they can, and she her teachers have become like family members. And I enjoy going to work. These MLMers think that all of us don’t want to work and if we do want to we are awful parents. Yes, I have to work. But I also like working. I am lucky to have a job where they let me work from home two days a week and they are super flexible when my daughter is sick or has appointments.
Yes exactly! I loved daycare as a child, it’s so important to learn to socialize imo! My mom loved working and I looked up to that, I don’t think one or the other is bad it’s just all about personal preference and no one should be guilted for doing what makes them happy or what they need to do for their family!
The same with my son. Unfortunately, due to the pandemic we had to take him out. He was so upset and it took awhile for him to adjust.
What is this obsession with using an overload of emojis in their messages?? It is not endearing at all. It looks super fake and annoying.
Yes!! Totally agree!!
This is especially annoying for people like me who love emojis. 😩 😂 They’ve ruined it for the rest of us.
The idea is that a long plain text post won’t catch someone’s attention, but if you add a bunch of emojis you’re like, “Wait. What’s going on here?”
r0ck3r_ch1ck You nailed it. I’m always left wondering what in the world is going on. And if I think there’s too many emojis then there’s a problem. 😂
Kris Bailey I never thought about it before until I saw where somebody is blind or has to have their texts read aloud for whatever reason. I can’t imagine how annoying that has to be!
HIT that nail on the head!! After I had my son, I was needing adult interaction anyways. When this girl wanted to “get lunch” or “hang out” ASAP, I was so excited. It’s embarrassing now how enamored I was with her. I was willing to do whatever she wanted me to do, just to keep her as a friend.
Yes! I’ve never had a lot of girlfriends in my life and it’s so sad that some people use friendship just to line their pockets 😕😔
The worst one to me was the hun who said “if you don’t mind leaving your kids...” that’s such a manipulative thing to say. Especially when whoever posted that probably is losing money in her mlm. 😩
Exactly!!!!!!!!
I can’t see how it’d be possible for women who are doing MLMs to own a car & home with that sole income. There’s no way they’d see your income that is 100% flexible/not guaranteed and allow you to purchase a house or car. This set-up relies on a hefty secondary income. So these posts are particularly damaging to single moms, who HAVE to work traditional jobs. It’s shameful.
THANK 👏 YOU👏 !!!
I didn't even THINK of this. What BANK would loan these people money?
@@kittymervine6115 well the hunbots are not likely to get loans, but their loving husbands with traditional jobs and good credit history are something else, if you know what i'm saying
I don’t know about how hunbots get loans, but my aunt was able to buy a new car while she didn’t have a job and hadn’t started receiving unemployment yet.
Aka husbands
The mom-shaming angers me so much. It's more than just shaming women who can't afford to leave work: it's shaming women for enjoying or finding fulfillment from anything but being a mom and raising their kids. There's this insidious undercurrent of "If you don't want to spend every single waking moment with your kids, then you're a terrible mother." It's OKAY to want some time to yourself. It's OKAY to have a life and an identity outside of taking care of your kids. It's OKAY to enjoy your job. All of that is okay! It doesn't make you a bad mom or a bad person. For all their talk of female empowerment, these MLMers push a weirdly uber-conservative ideal of motherhood.
(Not to say there's anything wrong with being a stay-at-home mom! If that's what works for you and your family and that's a decision you've made, that's great! Go for it. Just don't act like it's the One And Only True Way to be a Good Mom (TM).)
Yes!! Totally agree!!!! Its such a hypocritical situation- “we empower each other” “you need to stay home if you care about your kids!”
I applaud the woman who replied to that snobby 'I'm at the spa in Spain, ahaha!' MLM woman. She told 100% truth. If you are spamming everybody and their dog on social media how are you actually spending your time with your family???? You are just a zombie staring at your stupid phone!
Exactly!!
Her Spain comment really bothered me as someone who travels a lot with my family, even my grandparents. I can't imagine traveling without my family and my parents in the future. If she was really making the money she was saying she was making, she would have been braging about being able to taking her family to Spain. Since spending family time is so important to her. Her attitude doesn't seems like she even thought about taking her children once she got the offer. Yeah I understand traveling alone for work, but being in a mlm isn't a job
It was really funny, too, cause "woo they sent me on a vacation in Spain I'm there right now" girl what are you doing on your phone recruiting people? Aren't you on a free vacation?
Nailed it!
I know this comment is super old but I have to say it; the line “spamming everybody and their dog” made me laugh so loud
I am a male and yet even I got solicited by another guy at WORK during our lunch break to join an MLM. He sat down with me in the cafeteria and struck up a conversation asking me about what department I worked in, if I was married, if I had kids, etc. He asked how old my kids were and we had a pleasant chat - I thought this guy was sincerely trying to form a friendship with me. I was excited at the chance to make a new friend, as I don't form new friendships easily. As our lunch break started to wind down he started the pitch and I recognized the MLM format instantly. I was deeply hurt by this bait and switch. I cut him off and said, "I am sorry but I don't want to waste your time, I am just not interested in this kind of thing." I was trying to be polite. He became indignant and said, "I am just trying to help you earn more money for your family bro! You telling me you can turn down easy money?" It was my turn to be indignant and I said, "I meant what I said, and it's inappropriate for you to keep trying this after I've said no. I don't want you to ever speak to me again or I will go straight to HR, do you understand?" He walked away and I never heard from him again. Technically what he was doing was "soliciting at work" which was against company policy.
Of course, I had a full time job at the time, so it was easy for me to turn him down. I imagine were that not the case I'd have been far more vulnerable.
I live near an mlm mom- it definitely looks like she’s doing well from all the home improvements going on....but the interesting part is that she regularly has sitters, puts her kids in camps etc to get time to work. I could go on and on, but that whole “spend time with your loved ones” is for sure a fallacy. Even on family vacations she works because, “the great thing is that I can work from anywhere!!” So she ends up working everywhere.
Yeah, I'm a guy and one of your 10% audience. It is an extremely well presented analysis of the MLM industry and its negative effects. One of my friends' marriage was almost ruined because of his wife's involvement in these things. Luckily her husband was promoted at his work and she could afford to stay home and care for their 2 year old. She also found alot of support from our church to help her. She actually wants to work now and is currently applying for administration office / receptionist posts.
We are "lucky" as guys we don't get approached by the MLMers on anywhere near the level that girls seem to. What happened with your friend's wife?
@@goldsilvertravel They are all doing fine now. She working as a receptionist at a doctor's office. Her husband (my friend) is a production manager at a dairy product factory. But many guys are also getting trapped into all kinds of investment scams, forex trading, cryptocurrency, etc.
years ago, a friend from my high school with dreams of doing makeup and starting a makeup line fell into an mlm trap like AVON for a second. she tried to recruit me and I entertained her at first (knowing I wasn't doing it, not because I knew it was an MLM, but because I was too lazy to care lol). so she forwards me to talk to the person who recruited her, and I immediately shut that person down so I wouldn't have to shut my friend from high school down... well later on that day, she sent me a text basically upset that I told her recruiter no while "leading her on". she was upset and thought I wasn't supporting her... so yes, this is how friendships get screwed with... but im happy to report she got out of it and now does actually do her freelance makeup and sells her own products on the side. I supported her in that a few months ago. glad we both made it out still being friends.
When my cousin had her son she b
ad really had postpartum depression. After a few months she decided to go back to work part time and it really helped her bounce back. (Obviously in tandem with other treatment) I’m just tired of people shaming moms. If they stay at home or go to work, people always have something to say.
Wow- that’s so amazing and I’m so happy for her! Moms should have the freedom to choose the life that makes them the happiest!
S. Ramlad She is shaming mlm companies, and the people who hound their friends to buy, buy, buy. Working outside the home is fine. I hope all moms get to choose where they work. Mlms tell so many lies to the women they recruit. It’s so sad.
Jaci Rogers I agree. MLMs deserve to shamed for their unethical business practices and hounding of family/friends.
As a mom with two kids, I have ALWAYS worked. Even if I didn't have to, I would CHOOSE to work. My kids are 26 and 14 now. They seem to have turned out fine and I feel no guilt whatsoever about working. I'm lucky enough to work a LEGITIMATE job from home now, and am very happy. Mom-shaming is the worst.
Exactly!! I loved daycare as a kid and looked up to my own mother for working full time and still being on top of things at home!
I didn't know what an mlm is for a pretty long time, my only real interaction with a hunbot was pretty bad (I don't really use facebook alot) she asked me if I wanted to join her fitness and shake program and put me in a private group without even asking me. I told her several times I wasn't interested, she asked why and I told her I was suffering from bulimia and that I didn't think this program would help my recovery and she honest to god told me this program could cure bulimia and shed helped other ed sufferes previously with the program. I really despise these people with a passion to take advantage of others in bad situations. Sorry for the rambling and great video💕
This also happened to me. My "friend" of over five years, who already knew I had an eating disorder, continuously tried to sell me It Works weight-loss products, while I was in recovery for anorexia. She KNEW I was working on becoming weight restored and she STILL tried to sell me these damn products. I eventually had to block her because her constantly suggesting I should or need to lose weight while I absolutely had to gain weight for my health was seriously messing with my recovery. I really hope you've been able to get help and recover - it's so hard but I promise its possible. Rooting for you 💕💕💕
Wow- that’s got to be the worst thing ever! I had orthorexia for a good while and was so susceptible to false dieting information, etc. and probably would have listened to these mlm reps 😕
I’ve had several friends stay at home with their kids and work their own business. They started a shop on Etsy, their own floral design business, they sold crafts through marketplace and they make more hustling their own product than through an MLM.
Exactly!! There are so many better ways to work from home than an mlm!
MLM sales rep: "I get to spend all my time with my family!"
Also MLM sales rep: "I'm on a retreat in Spain right now while you're stuck at home (with your family)!"
It's such a good point that the sales reps are also the targets. Like you said, they're literally immersed in the "hey hun" culture all day every day, so it becomes hard for them to see the irony of their words. I would love to see a video on how to actually reach and "de-radicalize" these people.
i love that you have a lot of compassion for ppl who fall victim to these scams. some anti mlm ppl are needlessly rude to the mlmers and i think that enforces the idea within these mlms that its them against the world, which only serves to push them further into it. i think if more anti mlm ppl tried to educate about the dangers and reality of this business model in a much more kind and gentle way the way you do, it would make mlmers a lot more open to listening to what we're saying
Thank you for seeing my intent- it’s a hard balance because yes people should be called out for wrong doings, but we should also understand why they did what they did and how we can support them to achieve better and do greater things! A balance I’ll always be trying to find on my channel!
I believe in the notion that we should be holding huns accountable for their scummy actions, as well as having compassion for the fact that huns are victims too.
I really like the way you go about presenting the information and explaining how you're going to dive into the topics
Thank you so much!!! I try to make the sequence of my video as logical and easy to understand as possible!!
@@cruelworldhappymind you're doing a great job!
I love that you addressed the toxic female friendships thing. I totally agree that it's one of the biggest barriers to us being able to help them and to stop more people from joining.
Yes!!
Thank you 🌟
I am definitly more emotion than logic, even if I learned to stop and be logical, and have almost been roped into a good dozen mlm's. But, I am also lazy and never follow through. Lazyness has saved me thousands.
Yes!! I’m the same way lol 🤣🤣
I feel you on that. I was a member of Amway but I felt strange trying to sell their products to friends and family, so I never tried / did, after a year (Free-membership) I quit. Also, I didn't see the point of paying the fee. XD So glad that I love to save money where ever possible and also, that I didn't have much back then. It sure saved my A***. That they are a MLM I only found out after watching #anti-MLM videos from Kiki Channel. And I have to admit they say the same thing everywhere.
I’m lucky. Before Coronavirus, I was working 20 hours a week in a school so my son is in daycare for about 7-8 hours and we were both happy with our schedule . Since I don’t work 40 hours I had a bit of energy when I pick him up but I also have purpose in my career. When he was a newborn however we were in a shit financial situation. I had just recently graduated and hubby wasn’t making enough to support 3 people. An MLM hun tried to recruit me and she used so many manipulative tactics, including reaching out when my grandfather passed away.
Luckily I never gave her a penny.
Wow- can’t believe the thing with the grandfather and mlm rep, so sad to hear when stuff like that happens! I grew up in daycare (my mom was the primary earner of the family) and I loved daycare! So glad you have an awesome family and work life situation! 💜💜
Madison Harnish 💟💟 thanks! Love your vids xx
My older sister's boyfriend's mom is in an mlm and when you mentioned that someone gets brainwashed by mlm's, it was so true. She is apparently always on her phone, even when she is supposed to be spending time with my older sister at the nail salon, and she is barely making 100 dollars a week (and who knows if that's true), but she is perfectly happy and thinks that she is super successful in this company. The saddest part of this is that my sister's boyfriend said that his mom doesn't even really feel like a person anymore. Only a xyngular salesperson. Also yes the mlm is called xyngular. Do you hear me? XYNGULAR!!! I am emphasizing this so much so that anyone who reads this comment doesn't fall into the trap of that mlm. It is really a PYRAMID SCHEME
this is 1 year late but thankyou for this. love and compassion is ESSENTIAL. for emotionally manipulated people, logic may not even be processed. you need to approach this from an empathetic angle and truly show them you are trying to care, because these vulnerable people dont want to be in an even worse, shitty state cause you made them feel like that after telling them about their horribly decisions.
ive been struggling to get my mom out of these scams and i searched up ways to help because my mum was really broken after i said i did not want to support her in her "business ventures". but shes in a fragile state, i regardless should have been there to support her emotionally and mentally.
thank you for this video.
Thanks for being so respectful in all your videos. I have relatives caught up in these, but they are basically good people who just have poor judgment in this area . I won’t watch some anti-MLM channels because they are just catty and immature towards these people; you always seem kind and genuine in your concern.
Thank you so much! There are some bad people out there- but most people in mlms are just like us, and have been convinced that mlms are an opportunity that they’re simply not. My passion is exposing unethical businesses and I have to point them out but I struggle with the idea of maybe hurting a lot of peoples feelings in the process... want to go about it in the right way!
I sometimes feel a little uncomfortable about the way people discuss mlms. In quite a lot of cases, the people who get involved are victims themselves who then get stuck in a negative loop and they're convinced the only way out is to start recruiting more people to their down-line. I really appreciate the self-reflection you've done.
One thing you don't mention that I think is very important is the Concorde fallacy (or the sunk cost fallacy) - "the idea that you should continue to spend money on a project, product, etc. in order not to waste the money or effort you have already put into it, which may lead to bad decisions" (Cambridge). When people pay for a "starter kit" or a "franchise fee", they're more likely to buy stock they can't sell, or put more of their own money into a business that isn't going well.
Your videos are great and keep getting better. Keep up the good work.
Thank you so much for acknowledging that these women (for the most part) aren't evil, they're just brainwashed. I feel like some of the channels I watch seem to forget that.
Love how they talk like being in your kids space all day every day is even enotionaly healthy. Children havr to go to school, meet new people, grow into the people they are going to be outside of the house. They aren't going to get that inside their mother's nest.
I KNOW RIGHT!!
when my best friend had her first kid, she was going crazy from staying at home with her after a couple of months. plenty of women want to go back to work, contribute to society, socialize with adults etc.
other than the obvious attempts to guilt women, there's something very anti-feminist about all of this, some old fashioned notion that what women should do is stay at home with their kids.
Yes ikr! Mlms preach female empowerment while spreading the message that you’re not a good mother if you’re not staying home with your children
Olga after my baby is born in April I’m getting a summer job. I need human interaction.
Love this video and hate how relatable it is. My step mother tried to get me on her down line in Monat when I was about 19 or so, she asked me what I thought about mlm’s and I was like oh so a pyramid scheme and she just saw there smiling at me like coraline’s other mother, turned to my dad with that same look, and he nervously looked back at me and kind of laughed as though he had just proved his point (assuming he cautioned her about it) through my reaction. I’m 22 now and am so grateful I knew better then. Cuz geesh, she has DEFINITELY not been successful and her posting and prodding has been so overwhelming.
No way, I have an aunt who has done a similar thing! So upsetting when they try and rope in young family members 🤦♀️
Madison Harnish there are a ton of typos in my paragraph but glad you understood. Haha 😅 but it’s crazy how mlms can brainwash people into thinking it’s okay to target young women, let alone your own family members.
Honestly, it's actually good for kids to socialize. I'm getting the feeling that these mom's who think you HAVE to be there ALL THE TIME seem like helicopter parents. Not saying mlm mom's believe that but the ones that do 👀
Michayla Lawrence Right! It’s even recommended that you put your children in daycare for at least two days out of the week even if you’re a stay at home parent so they can have social interaction.
Yes! It’s important for kids to develop their own identity, imo!
@@liyah5726 I would’ve hated that as a kid, daycare was terrible for me
@@Bettersucksaul I’m so sorry you had a bad experience with daycare ☹️ these experiences are def individualized from child to child based on environment, circumstances, and the people involved….but, for the most part, daycare is still proven to be quite beneficial in a young child’s growth and development. U probably learned a lot more from that negative experience u had than fully conscious of.
You can socialize your children without risking their safety and health at a daycare. I've heard too many horror stories to want to enroll my child in daycare. Not even that, but the ones that likely are safe are waaaay out of our budget.
Parks exist. Family and friends with their own kids exist.
Thank you for calling this out, I see this all the time in MLM content. Kiki Chanel (who you've referenced) has a whole video on MLMers using their kids to try and shill products, which is a similar issue. I'd love to see you do a video about how MLMs target military wives as well. Many military wives want a community to be apart of, because they constantly have to move with their husbands to new places where they have no friends, and likely will have a difficult time getting a job. Military wives suffer depression, anxiety, and other mental health issues at greater rates than the general population due to many of these reasons (social isolation, lack of social support, etc). In swoops an MLM hun promising them a community of women who will be their friend and support them in their "business" without question. I know Lularoe, in particular, was aggressively targeting military wives and ended up bankrupting many of the women. Its so upsetting how many different unsavory tactics MLMs use to take advantage of people.
No way, I’m currently editing a video on military wives and mlms! Considering I am one myself, it’s a topic super close to my heart and I hope I explain all of these issues well in that video!
@@cruelworldhappymind I can't wait to see it! All your other videos have been wonderful so I'm sure it'll be great, and I definitely think it is an under-reported issue. My dad was in the marine corps for 30 years and has since retired, so I'm definitely extra angry when I hear MLMs targeting military personnel too
Thank you for this! I have always felt that a lot of anti mlm content was more anti women than anything else and I'm glad you spoke up about it! but that being said I do know way too many stay at home moms who are apart of mlms such as Young Living, Nuskin, Mary Kay, etc who live in all of these super fancy houses, have nice cars and expensive purses. it's clearly because their husbands are doctors and whatnot but they are so unfortunately brainwashed into thinking that it's their mlm income that gave them all of those luxuries. I also think that a lot of generations where women are put down by each other constantly are more likely to join an MLM bc it's all they've ever known from each other
I’m one of the 10% males subbed. I know most of these topics don’t directly pertain to me..but you (along with others like Amandathejedi) have helped me look out for my vulnerable family and friends. Also the tea is fun..thanks for what you do!
I’m not gonna lie I just realized I’m like the only guy in the comments… your content is just so well put together. I like Coffezilla but I low key binged all his videos at work and I find your approach and execution very positive and uplifting. It’s inspiring!
I super appreciate brining light to how mean a lot of Anti MLM can be, and agree, making fun of people isn't necessary. But, these vulnerable woman are still adults, and I'm having a harder and harder time seeing the hate, cruelty, and stupidity spewed from my sisters mouth and life and "feeling bad" for her or cutting her some slack cause she is/was vulnerable and got sucked into an MLM. Woman who abuse their children are vulnerable too. Everyone is vulnerable in some way, doesn't give them a free pass to treat others as lesser, LOTS of women rise above and keep their dignity. I've found in my situation, love doesn't help, hate doesn't help, so I've checked out until THEY reach out for help.
The heroes ARE at work. LONGGGG before this.
👏👏👏 yes! 🌟
I "accidentally" stumbled upon your channel today, so to speak, as I'm generally not into "youtubers", influencers, gossip, or op-ed esque channels.
But I'm so glad I did, I really like you, your approach, your succinct yet fully informative content, and how you give facts and logical opinions without speaking solely from emotion.
Intelligent, and beautiful to boot (sans being overly sexual/using t&a to gain viewership).
I never thought I'd subscribe to an opinion-based channel, yet here I am!
I genuinely look forward to watching both your past and your future content!!
Thank you for saying being a SHAM is respectable and enough. I’ve been a one for almost eight years now (retiring in the next two years when my youngest goes to school.) I am constantly barraged by MLMs. The number of times I have gotten a message from a fellow SAHM that started with “HEY HUN!” or got invited to their launch party is terrifying. I got sucked into a MLM when I was straight out of college but backed out before I lost a lot of money or friends, so I feel for them. MLMs are preying on moms by using mother’s guilt and isolation...it’s disgusting.
When I was a younger kid, like I couldn't entirely take care of myself, my mom worked and watched me and my sister. She was with us during the day, but worked at night while there was nothing going on to miss.
I always feel weird when people say food service are hero’s rn because we have to work it definitely doesn’t feel heroic because most food service is easy and it feels normal for us
I know- but the fact that you guys have to work right now is what makes it a heroic thing! Your providing food for people who want/need it during this time and that’s a really important thing for even just keeping people happy!
You are being exposed to a lot of people that could be infected. You are doing your job while risking your own health and also providing an income so you and your loved ones can survive. You might not see it but you are being heroic just by being there to provide an essential service to a lot of people.
Because you guys are putting yourselves at risk every day for the rest who can/have to stay at home. You are keeping the economy going. Without you guys everything would be so much worse. I can do my office job from home and go out only if i need to buy groceries but you are going to work everyday and it needs to be appreciated now more than ever.
I wouldn't say food service is easy; simple yes. At the end of the day it's a customer service job with a shitty pay; not easy at all lol
My SAHM put me in daycare because she felt it would be in my best interest. Based on her own childhood, her BA in Early-Childhood Education, and her many years teaching and working with latchkey kids, she was concerned about me not getting enough socialization... especially being the only kid living at home way out in the middle of nowhere.
It's obviously a privilege to be able to do that, but my point is that daycare shouldn't be seen as some great tragedy. Neither my mom nor I feel like we missed out on anything by spending some time apart when I was little. I also have so many happy memories of daycare and I met two girls there whom I still count among my closest friends over 25 years later.
As someone living with (well, really, more suffering through if I'm being totally honest) leukemia, reading that message to that person dying from cancer made me seriously angry. I cannot believe a human being could sit down and seriously write something like that. I really have no words for how seething angry I am right now.
I appreciate your message towards the end. You have such an open mind and it’s very refreshing. I agree with you. We should be helping people instead of attacking them. I can’t watch some of the other anti mlm channels because they are just so filled with negativity and anger. Not that this isn’t a negative thing. You are just such a positive light that I actually enjoy hearing you talk about it and informing us on things and hearing your unbiased point of view. And this video proved that. I respect you so much.
Thank you for seeing my intent with this video 🙏🙏🌟🌟 that really means the world and I’m so happy you agree with me!
I've been really into the Anti MLM content lately because my parents were in Amway as a kid, and it really messed me up. I know the people recruited into these "businesses" think they are doing the best for their kids when it's pretty damaging to kids, I was trained at like 5 and 6 to be in sales. My parents involved me in embarrassing little skits to sell soap. They were always gone at Meetings and we had babysitters most nights of the week. I'm pretty good at arts and crafts, and even went to a prestigious design school, because I was taught from an early age to monetize my life. As an adult, being able to make my own choices, I wish I had just been able to enjoy making art without thinking about how to sell it. I literally get triggered, like a PSTD trigger, when anyone tells me "I should sell those" about something I make. I was a professional artist for a while, and was pretty successful, but I was super miserable being a salesperson all the time. I'm much happier now working for someone else at a regular job.
I keep getting “become an entrepreneur!” type scam ads,,odd to see on an anti-mlm video
Bored As can be I think some antimlm videos might have similar tags to promlm videos and so advertisers see it might fit their desired demographics
It’s so frustrating because I don’t know what to do about it! Thinking about complaining to TH-cam, although it is funny to see mlm companies wasting all their ad money on videos that debunk them... still frustrating they’re being advertised to my audience!
This is such an important video!!👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼 this is something that does not get touched on enough. Motherhood can be very isolating, even though it’s wonderful, and these direct selling companies target that, knowing full well that so many of these Mamas are starved for adult human contact and to do something other than wipe runny noses and change diapers. And the fact that they’re being targeted by other moms who have “drunk the punch” is so true.... I know a mom like that. She’s a die-hard believer in MLM, and won’t hear anything to the contrary. And she’s a smart lady!! Anyway, loved his video, awesome job.
And Happy Easter!!🙏🏼🌸✨
YES!! So well said!! Happy Easter to you too (even though this is a later reply) 🐣💜
My mom's friend that used to babysit me and my brother posts about how she can't be friends with people who shop at Ulta or Sephora because she sells Younique
As someone who has a single mom growing up after losing my dad to cancer when I was young, this pisses me off so bad!
I am so sorry to hear that 😔 you are so sweet, your mother must be an amazing person!!
TH-cam is crazy! They put mlm ads on anti mlm videos 😂😂
It’s so frustrating because I don’t know what to do about it! Thinking about complaining to TH-cam, although it is funny to see mlm companies wasting all their ad money on videos that debunk them... still frustrating they’re being advertised to my audience!
Loved this video! It is really important that you bring up how these women are victims. They’re being exploited and indoctrinated. And in a typical cycle of abuse they then push it onto other vulnerable women. I love how genuinely caring and compassionate you are while being passionate about the subject and helping these women. Thumbs up to you!
Nice to be one of the 10%! I really appreciate your perspective on attacking women in MLMs. women are continuing to shoulder the burden of childcare and home making even in an economy with stagnated wages and a disappearing middle class. What does this lead to? A conflicted woman that might not have gotten any formal training because she prepared herself to be a stay at home mom like her mom was. She was encouraged by her older female family, role models, and mommy blogs to stay at home. But her husband hasn’t seen a raise in 5 years. The economy is broken. And her husband might even exert control over her for being the income earner. She might be more aware of the family finances. The woman feels responsible for the direction of her household. So when a trusted friend tells her she can work from home and earn a living, it can be incredibly attractive. Add to all of this, the woman might be in a state of vulnerability. If she is lonely or in an abusive relationship or isolated from family, she is even more vulnerable.
One of the reasons I deleted my Facebook was because of my mom friends ALWAYS messaging me about Plexis, Rodan and Fields or essential oils. It was ridiculous. Thanks for sharing.
I watched this yesterday but I just wanted to pop back in and tell you how much I appreciate your perspective on the anti-MLM community. It seems like it has exploded on TH-cam in the last few months, and while there is quite a bit of good information available, admittedly a lot of it comes off as mean spirited or arrogant. There is something to be said about the psychological aspect behind MLMs and what would make someone fall prey to one....we’ve all now heard about attraction marketing, we know about the income disclosure statements, we know it’s all BS, and yet people are still falling for MLMs on a regular basis. Why? What level of desperation, sadness or lack of purpose must one be feeling to subject themselves to something that forces them to completely suspend reality in order to participate? If not that, what level of ignorance must be present? IMO, that is the most dangerous (and interesting) aspect of what are essentially selling cults and the aspect that seems to be talked about the least. The #1 way to keep someone in a cult, or in an abusive relationship, or in any otherwise toxic situation is to shame them for it and that is exactly what a lot of anti-MLM content is becoming. I agree with you that these people (mostly women) should be lifted up and made to feel valuable, special and smart and should be shown what their hard work could produce if they would channel that energy elsewhere. If they don’t get that, at the very least they shouldn’t be made to feel stupid for trying. That is why (I think) so many go from MLM to MLM. No one is intervening in a healthy and positive way. Anyway. That’s my rant. Thanks if you read this far! Lol
I’m so glad i found your stuff, I hate MLMs and scammers.
I actually think it’s really healthy for moms AND dad’s to have ambitions and lives outside their homes and kids. When parents have passions and careers that they get to cultivate outside the house it usually makes them better and more present parents at home. Quality over quantity.
I was the primary earner in my house and we were trying to get pregnant and then I lost my job. The Mary Kay hun swept in and got me... looking back in the 6ish months I had been in I lost a few hundred dollars. That was with me not even buying all the inventory they wanted me to.
Wow I’m so sorry you experienced that! So frustrating, but I’m so happy you got out of that!
Most ironic thing: an ad for an MLM company played partway through this video 😂
It’s so frustrating because I don’t know what to do about it! Thinking about complaining to TH-cam, although it is funny to see mlm companies wasting all their ad money on videos that debunk them... still frustrating they’re being advertised to my audience!
Kimberleigha did a vid on this, if we watch the mlm add then money does to the content producer.
This episode is fantastic. Thank you for all your content and hard work with sharing this information. I'm starting a grassroots funded fictional docu-drama tv show, focusing on a BIPOC family and other marginalized communities in the midst of the 2020 pandemic. With my team, we are writing an episode that's going to dive into mlms and explore the pchyology and trauma they can bring. It's going to be heavily anti mlm, but it's not going to demonize those who are in them; as I've seen noted on many other anti mlm channels---that they are part of the bigger issue and as you mentioned, they are vaulnerable people who were targeted and roped in, and how we must address the whole problem. Same goes with all "get rich quick" scams. I got roped into one and caused a lot of trauma that I still deal with.
I've always wondered how otherwise reasonably cognizant women could actually fall for these types of schemes. You've given great insight into this perplexing industry.
Edit - I sound like such a pretentious nerd lol
Not pretentious, great insightful reply tbh 👏
as a full time astay at home mom, i fully enjoy any little break i can get from my monster. i love my son to pieces and i am so grateful to my husband for working so hard to provide for us but i am human and can only handle so many "mommies a day"! i miss working and going to the gym because i got a break and that helped me maintain my sanity. also gave my son time to socialize with other people besides myself. i also suffer from OCD, severe anxiety and chronic depression, i get overwhelmed easily, even when i try to hold it together i lose it and it's hard for me to snap out of my funk sometimes. these huns that shame moms for not being
perfect parents should be ashamed of themselves.
I say this full well as a mother myself, who has barely any mom friends for this reason, the reason that mom shaming happens is because women have been subjected to having kids being their only achievable accomplishment in their life for so long. Women weren’t able to get other accomplishments for a very long time at all. When it comes down to it children shouldn’t be viewed as an accomplishment if they turn out good and are good kids, And are helpful and don’t get in trouble that should be the accomplishment, not simply Having children and being around them 24 seven. unfortunately it’s like women shame other women for doing things outside of that now societal norm of children being the only thing women could accomplish, they feel bad and jealous because they haven’t accomplished anything else in their lives, and are using their children, a area where no matter what a mother will feel guilt in some sense, to gain moral superiority
I know moms who love their children but also love their careers. Women are more than just mothers. We don't shame men for having aspirations outside of the home and we need to stop doing that to women. You ARE allowed to want to be more than just a mom and no one should make you feel like a bad mom for loving your career as well. If you love being a mom and want to stay at home with your children, that is fine too. Do what fulfills YOUR life and don't let people talk down to you no matter WHAT you decide to do with your life.
EDIT: My best friend has been a stay at home mom since she had her son 2 years ago. She has always wanted to be a stay at home mom but her passion has always been in the fashion industry. She began by buying bulk clothing and accessories and even made herself a website. She now has an entire company she built herself (on little money I might add) and does spend most if not all of the day with her son. She does do Facebook lives once for an hour every few days. She is able to spend time with him while collecting orders, making labels, and mailing out per products. She did actually make her own business, not buy into one where the only way she'll make money is by spending 15+ hours staring at her phone and hoping she can recruit enough people to make $20 a month.
"Oh, you just enjoy going to work and leave your children?" Also: It's totally o.k. for women to enjoy going to work and get a break from their kids. It doesn't mean they love them any less. Let's not shame working mothers if they do, in fact, like working (or at least don't hate it). Off topic but: I love your hair and my toddler thinks you're a magic fairy. "Pretty fairy!"
So glad i found your channel! You've improved so much and I look forward to seeing more content and being apart of the community!
Thank you! 💜💜💜
This is such an important message and I'm incredibly grateful to you for sharing it.
THANK YOU! 💜
About three years out of high school I began to lose friends to MLM's. Especially young women who were also in certain religions. Asking to please not send me messages about cleaning products or essential oils got two "Why are you being so negative? Why won't you support your friends?" It wasn't pretty. I wish them well, but also if you can't respect my boundaries there's a block button for that.
I appreciate the part when you talked about how the distributors are also vulnerable people and I think we should always remember that when we discuss about people's behavior vs company behavior. Still, there are plenty examples of victims becoming abusers, and it's important to put that in balance too.
At the end of the day, we shouldn't assume these people are naive and ignorant (and of course, I don't think Madison does that). As it is not lack of intelligence that makes these people fall for the schemes, but vulnerability, they should be held accountable for the harm they do. Once they gaslight and manipulate other vulnerable people, I find it very hard to empathise with them, or see them as still being in the same side as me. As perpetrators, they should know what they are doing to the people above them, and are actively working for and siding with unethical practices. Although I agree that compassion is needed when dealing with such delicate situations, I think these perpetrators should be made aware of the abusive role they played and held responsible for it. If one doesn't doesn't aknowledge it's fault, then there's little point in forgiveness.
As for influencers promoting mlms, I hold much less empathy. I think they should be legally accounted for the spread of dangerous lies and scams, even if they had good intentions at one point.
Either way, I did not write this as to disagree with her point. I think Madison is extremely intelligent and hits the nail in the head in every one of her deep dives, in the most humane way possible. I trust her judgment when regarding both the representatives and companies actions. My point was that athough we should be compassionate, sometimes people who suffered the same as us are not in our team and can become unethical themselves. Although they were unprotected victims, we shouldn't automatically protect abusers out of compassion for their past (Again, not implying that Madison said we should).
I apologize for any grammar mistakes, english is not my mother language.
My cousin recently closed her legitimate small business cause her kids were growing up and she wanted to be there for them.... Less than a week after she closed that business, she turned her Facebook group for her legitimate small business into a Red Aspen group. I ended up leaving the group and unfollowing her page after she announced it.
My mom doesn't realize how bad MLMs can mess people over. (She works consignment and she sees MLM products come in all the time.) While watching my cousin's live vid, my mom turned to me and asked, "Didn't she close [Legitimate Small Business Name] in order to spend time with her kids? I see her online trying to sell these nails all the time."
My mom hasn't joined an MLM. But she's starting to realize that these businesses aren't what they seem.
It might be cause you're both from LA but you remind me a lot of god is grey like the clear way you speak and your cadence is really calming
OMG I LOVE YOU SO MUCH. Im the daughter of a mother who is spending my inheritance on Paparazzi jewelry, Facebook Pearl parties, cases and cases of leggings in the spare bedroom and of course Monat. My momma has a room full of Monat. I showed your videos to my dad and we both agreed if we showed her these she would just get mad.
Stay at home moms are easy targets because they’re lonely and you don’t have to pay them well. I’m a 30 something stay at home mom. I get hit with MLM pitches A LOT. A lot of times they grab interest with the promise of money but they keep them with community, sense of purpose and friendship, how ever misguided that may be.
You are so wise and wish more young women were as well spoken and actually talk about thought provoking issues and do it with love ❤
I had a friend who started selling younique and tried recruiting me bc I love makeup. I almost felt targeted bc of my natural interests, but Just bc I love makeup doesn’t mean I want to buy from or try every brand. I was genuinely not interested in youniques products whether she was selling it or not. I told her I have more than enough makeup and don’t feel comfortable pressuring friends and families to buy products they’re not interested in. Luckily it didn’t come between us but there were points where I struggled with feeling guilty for “not supporting” her. I had to remind myself that she doesn’t do anything to financially support me so why do I feel the need to buy products I’m not interested in especially when it’s not even her business. (If she came up with her own makeup brand that would be completely different and i would absolutely support it) I would never expect my friends, family or anyone for that matter to buy things from me just bc we’re close. If they wanted to they would reach out. I’m so grateful i stood my ground and never caved. We’re still friends and she doesn’t sell for mlms anymore 😂
I just want to say, in EVERY area of life, there are people doing ot badly, and people doing it well. The same is in MLM. It's so unfortunate that that this industry has got such a bad rep because of the money hungry distributors. I am not on my phone when I'm with my children. I wake up earlier than them and I work on my business. They nap, I work on my business, if they are content and playing together I work on my business and then when they go to bed, I work on my business. We are encouraged to think " how many people can I help today." We help those who we relate to. For me, it is sahm's because I am one too. I know the struggle and the worry. And I've helped mums to earn from home. It's hard work in the beginning to give freedom later. If it's done right, it's a place of belonging, good values, and helping others.
I noticed from some MLM peeps in a fitness group- people saying "I made $150 this month and now I can afford things".
I wondered. The BASE products are at LEAST that amount, and if *you* don't buy and consume your own company's products- how does that look? I might be wrong, but I am 99% sure when they quote what they make, they aren't taking into account what they have spent.
Once I started doing more research- there are products with BETTER ingredients that cost 1/2 the amount and you don't have to sell or convert people. And if someone wants to argue that then you don't get personalized coaching- you can take the savings and hire an actual certified nutritionist or personal trainer.
The other group that they target is college students. It make zero sense to me that someone can be a "nutrition coach" with NO health/fitness/nutrition background and before they have personally tried it. I have full out seen people "joining the team" before they have even received their products.
I have to admit that I fell in with an MLM group (but never became a distributor). Honestly, there are some fakey people, but like you said there are SO many people who have been brainwashed and they honestly want that sense of community. They are told that all they need to do is "be positive" and that if you aren't making the $, that it is on YOU. And you are told that it *isn't* "bugging" people or "nagging" it is sharing and recommending just like if you rave about a new restaurant or movie. So people get sucked into it.
Team meetings are the same "positive, inspirational" journeys of all the distributors in the groups. When you feel disconnected it is a easy trap to fall into.
Why do they all use the same language? Every MLM says the same thing it's curious to me
Most of them are given a some templates on what to use; they'll just copy and paste what their upline has given them
Yes, even in translated in German.
As someone who is a SAHM to twins, I’m 24, thank you for standing up for me ❤️❤️ I’ve been harassed by so many mlms and I just tell em to fuck off lmao
IKR!! I’m so sorry you experience that I can’t imagine the frustration 😕 so glad you enjoyed this video 💜
I literally binge watched like 30 videos of your in one day and I love your message keep up the great work!!!
About a year ago there was a post on the antiMLM subreddit from a parent talking about their daughter constantly getting into MLMs and ending up broke and trying to sell shit to family. Everyone in the replies had the same answer: cut the daughter off, block her everywhere, she's a lost cause.
I tried to suggest that maybe, since the daughter clearly is very easy prey for these companies, some therapy and compassion would be a better option. That the parents could perhaps help the daughter financially but control her finances entirely until she has enough therapy and mental strength to resist these ghouls preying on her.
The replies to my suggestion were entirely negative, no one had any interest in seeing the woman as a victim, only as a scammer, as someone evil who is intent on bankrupting her parents. That was the last time I ever engaged with the antiMLM subreddit. I just felt disgusted and horrified at the absolute lack of empathy towards someone who, as described by her own parents, had been victimized by MLM companies multiple times and needed serious, professional, help.
ma’am may i say your cheekbones look particularly poppin today. also, great vid!
Thank you 🥰🌟
Quite shocking, but the TH-cam ads I saw while watching this video was a bloody MLM!!!
Loving your work. Perfect stuff to watch while I paint 😊
I really love that your making a more positive video that doesnt attack the women that I would be able to share with my friend. Because I dont want to make her think i dont support her. I want nothing but success and the best for her! She says she isnt losing money and that she will be able to retire soon. But at the same time I just dont trust mlm and direct selling businesses. And also just think she could use her time and talents elsewhere, even if she feels like this is what's best..
Thank you!! 💜💜🌟
Guilty pleasure watching your content. I don't want to know about the scams but I wanna know something's being done about them. Some of the scams I almost feel victim to. Freebots for example. I like watching your content cause it confirms my suspecions about them being scams.
The reason it really is so cruel Bc if ur a mom you understand how difficult it is to afford childcare. Childcare alone can be the cost of your rent in a month. You run on very little sleep to the point it almost drives you insane and then when you really need a day off you can’t take it: you have to go to work sick as hell bc you have to save any sick days for when your child is sick and can’t go to daycare. My work only allows 8 call ins a year which I think is pretty generous. But I’ve literally had to take medical leaves in order to not be fired, and also provide the best health care for my child. Like anytime my child runs a fever she isn’t allowed at daycare. Diaharrea, rash, fever, cough, etc are all reasons your child can not be at daycare. That happens more often in a year then you think.
So when I tell you, you would do anything to be able to work from home or have a job that allows you to be around your child.
That’s why they prey on moms and that’s why it works so well.
"Just being a stay at home mom is more respectful" YES! A lot of women have the money to be a SAHM if they budgeted correctly, like my mom was and like many lower income women are. But because we live in a society that equates capitol with value and labels people by their career a lot of women only feel justified to stay home with their kids if they're a "girl boss" and "making good money", even if they're actually losing money in the process.
ALSO I wish more MLM "hunbots" would discuss a.) the power of product sales/investments/passive income in general and how pairing your partners active income with your passive income as a SAHM can give you multiple revenues of income and more financial stability in your savings and b.) the power of working from home for a normal job. More and more companies have WFH jobs or hybrid jobs. You don't have to sell overpriced products at awkward parties or send cringey messages to your distant relatives, you can just work for one of many legitimate businesses virtually.
You have a new subscriber here, Madison - awesome video and, honestly, the best message I have ever heard regarding MLMs. I've had close family members and friends pulled in to the MLM black hole (in the form of Arbonne, NuSkin, LuLaRoe and a few others), and this is the best possible message everyone can hear. Bravo! Looking forward to your future videos (and am about to watch a few more of your previous videos!)
Wow thank you so much this means the world to me!!! 🙏💜💜💜🌟
Also daycare/nursery can often to educational and enriching environments for children especially where they learn language, co-operation & confidence skills communicating with their peers.
Proud to be in that 10% supporting your videos, keep up the good work, shining a light on the predatory behaviour is a great thing.
I love your anti mlm comment about the women who join are vulnerable. Kiki is one of my favourite anti mlm contributors
I was hooked into Roden and fields when I was extremely vulnerable. I had had a preemie and he has some health challenges. I was broke and Was looking on how to stay home with him.
And then myself and my up line fell pray to this as a solution
We both believed that we could do this. We both Tried. She also had a child with health challenges. I felt so stupid for falling for this as an “opportunity”
But now I see it for what it was. Being manipulated by people taking advantage of our vulnerability
I hate that I bothered people to buy the products or worse join 🤦♀️
I’m so sorry to hear this!! 😕 it’s frustrating that a culture of preying on the vulnerable is so encouraged within mlms!
Hey! Part of the 10% here! I have been watching all of your videos, lol.
Thank you!
Trying to provide resources to a family member who was nearly recruited by some instant coffee MLM with the promise of being able to eventually forgo her anxiety medication was really difficult without exposing her to the amount of vitriol for sellers that’s present in the anti-MLM community. Nearly every resource was either incredibly condescending or minimized the company’s role and vilifies the sellers.
I’m looking forward to your video, the anti-MLM community could use a dose of compassion, we’re all struggling under capitalism together, and calling people stupid for believing they could have a good life is antithetical to the “bootstraps” messaging we receive basically from birth.
Thank you 🙏
I love getting adds for get rich quick schemes on your vids lol, Growth Cave
Thank you for doing this! Mom shame is so real and it’s disgusting how these scams prey on that guilt. How about Moms support each other and lift one another up instead of tearing each other down.