Good video. Thanks for talking about aggro and FB cause if BBE and Lab are hit then they may just get replaced by FB, or aggro. I think a more complex ban list needs to happen to make better balance and not just the two big threats. -Jacob
7:00 I still remember the game in my locals where I played against a guy who always plays White Control. He had established a strong board, he had a Battery Bull to prevent destruction, he had his Frost Tiger, he had Naumangard to refresh his cores, he had drawn with Starblessed Draws, he had multiple dream bombs, avalances, supressions, etc. in hand, to put it simply he had established a game state where even a Gale deck wouldn't be able to go through any day soon.........and it just didn't matter because I had 2 of these f**kers and a Hydra to attack with every turn and just enough ice shields to keep me alive until I milled him which happened VERY fast. He kept shaking his head throughout the whole thing due to how stupid and ridiculous it was.
One thing to consider is they would probably hit as little starter deck cards as possible to keep the starter deck legal to play right from the box. Also, even the set have come out, I would like to see you reviews of the remaining cards.
This is a good point! I tend to really dislike games where due to a restriction list your starter deck is technically illegal out of the box! We will be releasing the set reviews for the last few colour combinations super soon so please look forward to that! - Kieran
21:50 If they bring back Netherworld Depths, I will run 3-4 copies of Netherworld Depths with 3-4 copies of Burning Force or Hellcrack in the main deck of almost every single list I make from that point on.
Agreed! Set 5 is a lot of fun but let's get any restrictions or hits out of the way as soon as possible so we can focus on the future events (not that there's many anyway...) - Kieran
Finally got a play group to play this game. I just hope they hit the labyrinth because it's easier to hit, same for big bang even though I have an alt art 😢
Having aggro and even blitz aggro in yoru game is important. Thats like removing Control decks. Sure some aggros peep the top 8 in some events, but how many, and in a row, have won back to back to back. People forget Volc Break gate kept the color Yellow.
At this moment personally, I hope that everything will be unbanned I think unbanning everything helps with both competitive games and casual games 1. Making the casual decks more interesting As set 5 is going to be multicolor. These restrictions will only limit people's ideas. Have interesting ideas playing some combos or something you come up with when you are deck building. With a larger card pool having more choices can increase the consistency of getting the combo (specifically volcanic break). Or the ability to control a certain situation. This creates a point where how much you understand the game and how creative you are. Besides some of them could be tech cards on the side deck. As the game started to move over to a less competitive market. Giving more freedom for deck building would be interesting for locals or less competitive players 2. Making decks more precise helps with competitive games The above point talks about how the game will change in local scenes. It also helps in the competitive scene. With everything unbanned every deck could be more precise. Being able to build a more precise deck will help you pursue your game plan wisely in tournaments or competitive plays (more table). TCG is a rock paper scissor game where aggro eats up control midrange eats up aggro and control eats up midrange. Having that in mind. Building up a more precise deck could enable the ability to get absolute advantages on certain match-ups. This will lower the chance of having fluke or luck wins between players if it is a bo1. BSS is a bo3 game, if players have a more precise deck, the matchup bias will be more foreseeable before the tournament, and the more precise side deck or tech cards could be built on side decks. Then it would be more interesting for competitive players to play mind games on tech cards or switch to a whole different style tackling a foreseeable worse match-up. Alongside, if every deck build could be more precise the meta will be more diverse or healthy. Players could potentially choose from different style decks instead of chasing the previous game-winning decklists. Imagine having a meta where a lot of control is topped in NA GO. Instead of having a lot of control take over the next GO, aggro takes over. After that midrange takes over. Let's take a recap on how precise the deck could be built from meta decks that have won in previous huge tournaments if everything is unbanned. Terassaur is a hyper-tempo deck. Its deck style is a pretty aggressive deck. With the aid of Oviraptodon, the deck can be sharpened in early games. This helps to quicken the game plan of tempo plays after the opponent plays defense. Purple Axebiter is a control deck that can drag the game for a long and finish with unlockables. With netherworld depth being a resource-gaining nexus it makes the deck more able to control the board or build a wall These two decks were on the ban list which I think exceeds the power level from set 1/2 However, when it comes to 3 more sets I don't think it will be a problem. With more cards and tech cards against these decks, such as nexus removal from Star Dragon or board nuke on main leaving axebiter. Or tech cards such as Flood Stream and Raging Tides against Teressaur. Let's talk about everything on paper for Hydra and ira. If everything is unbanned players can make a precise deck. Hydra and Ira would not be a problem as well. As mentioned above it is a rock paper scissor idea. Hydra is afraid of hyper aggro which is proven by how well white or green aggro could top in a few large events. And ira might struggle against some non-nexus reliant deck or some high roll deck. But with Ovi unbanned is turbo Ira mixing with Terassaur viable and wins Star Dragon build? Or even Axebiter could hold off ira? That is something that we could look into. But having everything unbanned definitely could help you to build a more precise deck and I personally think that it lowers the chances of unlucky games which would really be based on how players pursue game plans on match-ups or even follow-ups on game 2 and 3. This is something from a different perspective other than thinking or requesting for a ban list.
I agree that they likely won't ban the X rares, but I think they probably should? Ira wipes the board, refills your hand AND leaves you with the biggest spirit in the game on board - who thought this was ok?😅 Having said that, BBE is a card which likely ends up banned at some point in the future anyway - access to mana cheating in a colour with such good card draw is always going to be a problem eventually. As for the Hydra deck I could see hitting Labrinth being enough? It'd slow the deck down, so it can't be a combo control deck that can win on turn 3 anymore - if Hydra is hit, Tsathoggua is a non issue - I think hitting flood stream is a bad idea, because I personally don't want to be playing an aggro only meta
@@dreadlord8628 the frog? Why? Hydra still wins on turn 3 regardless of if they have a frog in play - it gives the deck extra options if the game goes long, but I don't think those are the reasons Hydra has such a big portion of the meta
@@kidzurag the Toad wins games by itself, in Wolverhampton one of my opponents, only saw 1 Hydra and that one was milled from his deck dye to Pollon in the early game he dug and dug and couldn't get one. But he got tve toads this and kept milling me out and taking life from me, after outing my Frost Tiger with Deadly Balance he kept milling my ascend targets and I kept drawing blanks, even after the game I check milling the same amount he would've done and drawing for turn what I would've gotten and 8 cards later I got an ascend target and by ascend target I mean the cost target. If it was Hyrda I wouldn't have been milled that hard and would've gotten another Frost Tiger out as I had 3 in my hand I couldn't summon due to obvious reasons. Is didn't help he had a few Pollons out too.
@@dreadlord8628 that just sounds like regular variance - the cards you mill and the cards you draw are theoretically random - so while it worked out that he milled everything you wanted, he could just as easily have milled you over things you don't - it sounds like essentially any spirit with crush+1 would've done the same thing in this situation, and it really doesn't sound like grounds for banning a card
To NOT bann or restrict a card because of alt arts is kinda madness if you think about it. That's like a "lets wait until people have invested into getting the Alts...then fix it later" mentality.
I am a person who thinks that the core problem should be dealt with, not cutting things around it, and in this case the problems, imo, are the 2 X key Spirits. They just make every other card stronger just because those cards have access to those 2 cards. Like, all the other cards around them, especially in Hydra decks, really lose almost all their threat potential since you do not have this gigantic multi headed fish coming down helped by the nexus nor the multiple attack that makes the Frog power spike up (also, I think the Flood Stream hate comes mostly from aggro players :3 - I mean, set 5 kind of needs a card like this to keep at bay some of the additions imo). Also I admit I have a random fear for Genbu Cost 8 rn looking at the new set 5 cards and how much of a big deck it was and can easily come back to be since the only reason it wasn't so relevant (like ... all decks) in set 4 was bcs of those 2 big bullies. Like, just a limit to 1 would be fine for me tbh. Regarding aggros, they will fell off in time, unless a specific deck similar to old Terrasaur will be created. I do not really feel like they will ever get it. At most the Map butterly (dam u 0 costs that can atk >:( ) About when to ban, I agree that it should happen when the set is about to release and be applied on its release date. Bandai announced, back with the first banlist, that they planned to update it once when a new set came around to deal with previously large threats. This just to say that, that was their original intention so this shouldn't be too surprising even tho they are indeed late on delivery (or even starting the delivery), but that seems to be their trend rn unfortunately :p I fear of ovi coming back I DONT want Axebiter back. We cut 2 annoying decks to put back another army of them? no ty xd Netherworld would have been fine if Caldera wasn't a thing xd
If they do decide they want to hit the key spirits it would resolve all of this a lot easier for sure! However I just don't see them doing that and based on the comments on FB and X, if they follow the community feedback it looks like BBE and Lab will be the direction they take. The Yellow concern is still pretty valid, while Yellow failed to do much this format due to Ira, thanks to their incredible set 5 support in Wendigloom its not hard to see Fabled beasts making a resurgence. Personally I do like the faster games over the long grindy ones but I do hope we get more anti aggro tools haha, losing in a few minutes isn't fun and aggro in BSS is pretty insane mechanically, but I do expect they'll keep giving us more anti aggro tools. Regarding the current hit cards, I do think Depths is likely to remain on the ban list for an indefinite period of time with all the paying for free/reviving nexuses that blue has. Thanks for watching! - Kieran
@@synclyric5762 I too like if games last around 10 intense turns or even more (as long as It Is not some kind of boring stalking axebiter style xd And I too do not like aggro games that much but yeah I am optimistic on the fact aggro Will be dealt with in time and we got quite a lot of counters for It (Without Ira and Hydra decks Will have room for some cards to fight them.. such a Dreams :_) )
Didn't plan to comment, but I see others having fun leaving words, so I guess I'll give some general thoughts as well. Never liked to discuss about ban list myself, simply because most of the time it results in fruitless conversations. Plus I don't play the game as much as the others now, and with my biased knowledge from the Japanese game, my opinions often differ. First of all, choice restriction/ban is almost impossible for this game. While it's true that most cards are unique to each other in terms of their functions in decks, some of their effects are fundamentally the same and very easy to categorise. Using Labyrinth as an example, it's easy to say now to choice ban between Labyrinth and Seabed because, well, both of these cards possess abilities which no other cards have at the moment. Leaving the point of how in the future similar cards can be released and create a pseudo-combo, with the nature of how this game allows you to mix every card together, there's always a potential combo with the other cards, such as Seabed + Ira, or Labyrinth + 10th Angel, which can still equally make the combo or deck off the chart. My point is that there are simply too many combinations in this game that choice restricting a certain combo wouldn't stop the cards from running wild. Choice restriction usually works for games where decks are 100% bound to their own archetypes, like Weiss Schwarz and Vanguard. I agree that Ira and Hydra themselves won't be banned. From a marketing perspective, they're still two new decks which can still make money for Bandai, and banning them (Hydra specifically) would simply remove two decks for them to sell. Learning from the developers of JP BS, JP BS also has the philosophy of keeping the meta diverged (not necessarily just the winning lists, but just what decks people bring into the tournament), and there's a high chance that Saga carries this ideal as well. So unless we're talking about decks which can kill you on first turn, or loop to win in a single turn, they'd most likely just nerf the cards around Ira and Hydra to lower their consistency. Ira itself is an interesting card. While it's certainly one of the most broken cards in the game right now, I do think it's integral for the Red colour. Without Ira, Red (Star Dragons especially) has a really hard time to get past Red Armor, and Ira is their solution. Without Ira, Calista for example, would be a very scary card to them. Though of course, I think the value it can keep is way over the top, so I think limiting it to one is a possible solution. Blazing Boar still exists, so it's not the end of the world for Star Dragon players. It slows down the Red player, while also giving them a solution towards their nemesis. But mentioning Blazing Boar, honestly I think it's also a potential target for the ban list, especially if the developers decide that the Red Spirits (whether it be Ira or Andromeda) should go down to one instead of banned, because Blazing Boar would just render the reduced number pointless. However, same comment, limit to one is possible, because it means that the player has to choose what Spirits to recycle with Boar, and they have only one chance. I can see a lot of people worrying about Cost 8 Genbu after the ban list, but from my point of view, in comparison with the new cards in set 5, Genbu is just a really expensive spirit that can give Astral to other spirits (it's a metaphor). Plus, it's not like it has any protection or very high BP, so it's still relatively easy to stop it. Spiral Tower does exist but it probably won't be a main choice in deck, considering how expensive it is to use, and all the other varieties of cards the deck can make use of. In terms of the current cards in the ban list, Oviraptodon can probably come back. I think Volcanic Break should still stay at one. 6k or less is still a big range, and minimum 3 costs is unironically still a very cheap cost to pay to get rid of a finisher, and even in other decks, if people are willing to pay 5 for Dream Bomb or Flood Stream, then they're willing to pay 5 for Volcanic Break. People may not bet an eye on it now because it's limited to 1 and the Soul Core requirement can be a handicap, so it really comes to chances whether you can use it in the game, but if it goes back to 4, I think it'd be a different topic due to the increased consistency (especially for Red, like geez, if you don't like Ira or Nova, honestly, don't say you want Volcanic Break back). Even though I'm a Purple player, I gotta say that Netherworld Depth has to stay in the ban list, and Axebiter... maybe at 1? But certainly not 4. Not much to say on BBE and Labyrinth. Either way, despite everything I said, I just don't really mind with any decision the developers eventually makes. I find a way to adapt to the new environment and that's the only thing which matters to me.
Curious. Ppl mentioned genbu a few times....but genbu has a built in weakness. If playing 4 vanilla cards out 50 to counter a deck is too much. I'm not sure what to say to you or anyone that thinks that. But my take...not every card NEEDS to do something. 🤷♂️
Good video. Thanks for talking about aggro and FB cause if BBE and Lab are hit then they may just get replaced by FB, or aggro. I think a more complex ban list needs to happen to make better balance and not just the two big threats. -Jacob
Thanks! And agreed
7:00 I still remember the game in my locals where I played against a guy who always plays White Control. He had established a strong board, he had a Battery Bull to prevent destruction, he had his Frost Tiger, he had Naumangard to refresh his cores, he had drawn with Starblessed Draws, he had multiple dream bombs, avalances, supressions, etc. in hand, to put it simply he had established a game state where even a Gale deck wouldn't be able to go through any day soon.........and it just didn't matter because I had 2 of these f**kers and a Hydra to attack with every turn and just enough ice shields to keep me alive until I milled him which happened VERY fast. He kept shaking his head throughout the whole thing due to how stupid and ridiculous it was.
One thing to consider is they would probably hit as little starter deck cards as possible to keep the starter deck legal to play right from the box. Also, even the set have come out, I would like to see you reviews of the remaining cards.
This is a good point! I tend to really dislike games where due to a restriction list your starter deck is technically illegal out of the box!
We will be releasing the set reviews for the last few colour combinations super soon so please look forward to that! - Kieran
Good video, sound reasoning. I appreciate the talk about Pollon, that one is on my list.
21:50 If they bring back Netherworld Depths, I will run 3-4 copies of Netherworld Depths with 3-4 copies of Burning Force or Hellcrack in the main deck of almost every single list I make from that point on.
Bring back Depths!
@@TheNexusTCG No.
I hope BANDAI takes action soon enough so we could make our arrangements to take part in future events.
Agreed! Set 5 is a lot of fun but let's get any restrictions or hits out of the way as soon as possible so we can focus on the future events (not that there's many anyway...) - Kieran
Finally got a play group to play this game. I just hope they hit the labyrinth because it's easier to hit, same for big bang even though I have an alt art 😢
Having aggro and even blitz aggro in yoru game is important. Thats like removing Control decks. Sure some aggros peep the top 8 in some events, but how many, and in a row, have won back to back to back.
People forget Volc Break gate kept the color Yellow.
Lab is good in other decks tho, was hard to play multi color ascend strats with both HIMdra and HIMra out there
Elephant city to one
At this moment personally, I hope that everything will be unbanned
I think unbanning everything helps with both competitive games and casual games
1. Making the casual decks more interesting
As set 5 is going to be multicolor. These restrictions will only limit people's ideas. Have interesting ideas playing some combos or something you come up with when you are deck building. With a larger card pool having more choices can increase the consistency of getting the combo (specifically volcanic break). Or the ability to control a certain situation. This creates a point where how much you understand the game and how creative you are. Besides some of them could be tech cards on the side deck. As the game started to move over to a less competitive market. Giving more freedom for deck building would be interesting for locals or less competitive players
2. Making decks more precise helps with competitive games
The above point talks about how the game will change in local scenes. It also helps in the competitive scene. With everything unbanned every deck could be more precise. Being able to build a more precise deck will help you pursue your game plan wisely in tournaments or competitive plays (more table). TCG is a rock paper scissor game where aggro eats up control midrange eats up aggro and control eats up midrange. Having that in mind. Building up a more precise deck could enable the ability to get absolute advantages on certain match-ups. This will lower the chance of having fluke or luck wins between players if it is a bo1. BSS is a bo3 game, if players have a more precise deck, the matchup bias will be more foreseeable before the tournament, and the more precise side deck or tech cards could be built on side decks. Then it would be more interesting for competitive players to play mind games on tech cards or switch to a whole different style tackling a foreseeable worse match-up. Alongside, if every deck build could be more precise the meta will be more diverse or healthy. Players could potentially choose from different style decks instead of chasing the previous game-winning decklists. Imagine having a meta where a lot of control is topped in NA GO. Instead of having a lot of control take over the next GO, aggro takes over. After that midrange takes over.
Let's take a recap on how precise the deck could be built from meta decks that have won in previous huge tournaments if everything is unbanned.
Terassaur is a hyper-tempo deck. Its deck style is a pretty aggressive deck. With the aid of Oviraptodon, the deck can be sharpened in early games. This helps to quicken the game plan of tempo plays after the opponent plays defense.
Purple Axebiter is a control deck that can drag the game for a long and finish with unlockables. With netherworld depth being a resource-gaining nexus it makes the deck more able to control the board or build a wall
These two decks were on the ban list which I think exceeds the power level from set 1/2
However, when it comes to 3 more sets I don't think it will be a problem. With more cards and tech cards against these decks, such as nexus removal from Star Dragon or board nuke on main leaving axebiter. Or tech cards such as Flood Stream and Raging Tides against Teressaur.
Let's talk about everything on paper for Hydra and ira. If everything is unbanned players can make a precise deck. Hydra and Ira would not be a problem as well. As mentioned above it is a rock paper scissor idea. Hydra is afraid of hyper aggro which is proven by how well white or green aggro could top in a few large events. And ira might struggle against some non-nexus reliant deck or some high roll deck. But with Ovi unbanned is turbo Ira mixing with Terassaur viable and wins Star Dragon build? Or even Axebiter could hold off ira? That is something that we could look into.
But having everything unbanned definitely could help you to build a more precise deck and I personally think that it lowers the chances of unlucky games which would really be based on how players pursue game plans on match-ups or even follow-ups on game 2 and 3.
This is something from a different perspective other than thinking or requesting for a ban list.
I agree that they likely won't ban the X rares, but I think they probably should? Ira wipes the board, refills your hand AND leaves you with the biggest spirit in the game on board - who thought this was ok?😅
Having said that, BBE is a card which likely ends up banned at some point in the future anyway - access to mana cheating in a colour with such good card draw is always going to be a problem eventually.
As for the Hydra deck I could see hitting Labrinth being enough? It'd slow the deck down, so it can't be a combo control deck that can win on turn 3 anymore - if Hydra is hit, Tsathoggua is a non issue - I think hitting flood stream is a bad idea, because I personally don't want to be playing an aggro only meta
The promo should go instead.
@@dreadlord8628 the frog? Why? Hydra still wins on turn 3 regardless of if they have a frog in play - it gives the deck extra options if the game goes long, but I don't think those are the reasons Hydra has such a big portion of the meta
@@kidzurag the Toad wins games by itself, in Wolverhampton one of my opponents, only saw 1 Hydra and that one was milled from his deck dye to Pollon in the early game he dug and dug and couldn't get one.
But he got tve toads this and kept milling me out and taking life from me, after outing my Frost Tiger with Deadly Balance he kept milling my ascend targets and I kept drawing blanks, even after the game I check milling the same amount he would've done and drawing for turn what I would've gotten and 8 cards later I got an ascend target and by ascend target I mean the cost target.
If it was Hyrda I wouldn't have been milled that hard and would've gotten another Frost Tiger out as I had 3 in my hand I couldn't summon due to obvious reasons.
Is didn't help he had a few Pollons out too.
@@dreadlord8628 that just sounds like regular variance - the cards you mill and the cards you draw are theoretically random - so while it worked out that he milled everything you wanted, he could just as easily have milled you over things you don't - it sounds like essentially any spirit with crush+1 would've done the same thing in this situation, and it really doesn't sound like grounds for banning a card
@@kidzurag the Toad is what lost me the game I had the defence but no targets if it were just Hyrda there would've been no mills at all
To NOT bann or restrict a card because of alt arts is kinda madness if you think about it. That's like a "lets wait until people have invested into getting the Alts...then fix it later" mentality.
I am a person who thinks that the core problem should be dealt with, not cutting things around it, and in this case the problems, imo, are the 2 X key Spirits. They just make every other card stronger just because those cards have access to those 2 cards. Like, all the other cards around them, especially in Hydra decks, really lose almost all their threat potential since you do not have this gigantic multi headed fish coming down helped by the nexus nor the multiple attack that makes the Frog power spike up (also, I think the Flood Stream hate comes mostly from aggro players :3 - I mean, set 5 kind of needs a card like this to keep at bay some of the additions imo).
Also I admit I have a random fear for Genbu Cost 8 rn looking at the new set 5 cards and how much of a big deck it was and can easily come back to be since the only reason it wasn't so relevant (like ... all decks) in set 4 was bcs of those 2 big bullies. Like, just a limit to 1 would be fine for me tbh.
Regarding aggros, they will fell off in time, unless a specific deck similar to old Terrasaur will be created. I do not really feel like they will ever get it. At most the Map butterly (dam u 0 costs that can atk >:( )
About when to ban, I agree that it should happen when the set is about to release and be applied on its release date.
Bandai announced, back with the first banlist, that they planned to update it once when a new set came around to deal with previously large threats. This just to say that, that was their original intention so this shouldn't be too surprising even tho they are indeed late on delivery (or even starting the delivery), but that seems to be their trend rn unfortunately :p
I fear of ovi coming back
I DONT want Axebiter back. We cut 2 annoying decks to put back another army of them? no ty xd
Netherworld would have been fine if Caldera wasn't a thing xd
If they do decide they want to hit the key spirits it would resolve all of this a lot easier for sure! However I just don't see them doing that and based on the comments on FB and X, if they follow the community feedback it looks like BBE and Lab will be the direction they take.
The Yellow concern is still pretty valid, while Yellow failed to do much this format due to Ira, thanks to their incredible set 5 support in Wendigloom its not hard to see Fabled beasts making a resurgence.
Personally I do like the faster games over the long grindy ones but I do hope we get more anti aggro tools haha, losing in a few minutes isn't fun and aggro in BSS is pretty insane mechanically, but I do expect they'll keep giving us more anti aggro tools.
Regarding the current hit cards, I do think Depths is likely to remain on the ban list for an indefinite period of time with all the paying for free/reviving nexuses that blue has.
Thanks for watching! - Kieran
@@synclyric5762 I too like if games last around 10 intense turns or even more (as long as It Is not some kind of boring stalking axebiter style xd
And I too do not like aggro games that much but yeah I am optimistic on the fact aggro Will be dealt with in time and we got quite a lot of counters for It
(Without Ira and Hydra decks Will have room for some cards to fight them.. such a Dreams :_) )
Didn't plan to comment, but I see others having fun leaving words, so I guess I'll give some general thoughts as well. Never liked to discuss about ban list myself, simply because most of the time it results in fruitless conversations. Plus I don't play the game as much as the others now, and with my biased knowledge from the Japanese game, my opinions often differ.
First of all, choice restriction/ban is almost impossible for this game. While it's true that most cards are unique to each other in terms of their functions in decks, some of their effects are fundamentally the same and very easy to categorise. Using Labyrinth as an example, it's easy to say now to choice ban between Labyrinth and Seabed because, well, both of these cards possess abilities which no other cards have at the moment. Leaving the point of how in the future similar cards can be released and create a pseudo-combo, with the nature of how this game allows you to mix every card together, there's always a potential combo with the other cards, such as Seabed + Ira, or Labyrinth + 10th Angel, which can still equally make the combo or deck off the chart. My point is that there are simply too many combinations in this game that choice restricting a certain combo wouldn't stop the cards from running wild. Choice restriction usually works for games where decks are 100% bound to their own archetypes, like Weiss Schwarz and Vanguard.
I agree that Ira and Hydra themselves won't be banned. From a marketing perspective, they're still two new decks which can still make money for Bandai, and banning them (Hydra specifically) would simply remove two decks for them to sell. Learning from the developers of JP BS, JP BS also has the philosophy of keeping the meta diverged (not necessarily just the winning lists, but just what decks people bring into the tournament), and there's a high chance that Saga carries this ideal as well. So unless we're talking about decks which can kill you on first turn, or loop to win in a single turn, they'd most likely just nerf the cards around Ira and Hydra to lower their consistency.
Ira itself is an interesting card. While it's certainly one of the most broken cards in the game right now, I do think it's integral for the Red colour. Without Ira, Red (Star Dragons especially) has a really hard time to get past Red Armor, and Ira is their solution. Without Ira, Calista for example, would be a very scary card to them. Though of course, I think the value it can keep is way over the top, so I think limiting it to one is a possible solution. Blazing Boar still exists, so it's not the end of the world for Star Dragon players. It slows down the Red player, while also giving them a solution towards their nemesis.
But mentioning Blazing Boar, honestly I think it's also a potential target for the ban list, especially if the developers decide that the Red Spirits (whether it be Ira or Andromeda) should go down to one instead of banned, because Blazing Boar would just render the reduced number pointless. However, same comment, limit to one is possible, because it means that the player has to choose what Spirits to recycle with Boar, and they have only one chance.
I can see a lot of people worrying about Cost 8 Genbu after the ban list, but from my point of view, in comparison with the new cards in set 5, Genbu is just a really expensive spirit that can give Astral to other spirits (it's a metaphor). Plus, it's not like it has any protection or very high BP, so it's still relatively easy to stop it. Spiral Tower does exist but it probably won't be a main choice in deck, considering how expensive it is to use, and all the other varieties of cards the deck can make use of.
In terms of the current cards in the ban list, Oviraptodon can probably come back. I think Volcanic Break should still stay at one. 6k or less is still a big range, and minimum 3 costs is unironically still a very cheap cost to pay to get rid of a finisher, and even in other decks, if people are willing to pay 5 for Dream Bomb or Flood Stream, then they're willing to pay 5 for Volcanic Break. People may not bet an eye on it now because it's limited to 1 and the Soul Core requirement can be a handicap, so it really comes to chances whether you can use it in the game, but if it goes back to 4, I think it'd be a different topic due to the increased consistency (especially for Red, like geez, if you don't like Ira or Nova, honestly, don't say you want Volcanic Break back). Even though I'm a Purple player, I gotta say that Netherworld Depth has to stay in the ban list, and Axebiter... maybe at 1? But certainly not 4.
Not much to say on BBE and Labyrinth. Either way, despite everything I said, I just don't really mind with any decision the developers eventually makes. I find a way to adapt to the new environment and that's the only thing which matters to me.
Its like everyone is scared to bann anything. Fine, lets continue this 2 deck 70% twin teir 0 meta.
I disagree with the idea to unban axe and volcanic. I think that also naumy and genbu would be Great target for this ban list
Curious. Ppl mentioned genbu a few times....but genbu has a built in weakness. If playing 4 vanilla cards out 50 to counter a deck is too much. I'm not sure what to say to you or anyone that thinks that.
But my take...not every card NEEDS to do something. 🤷♂️