ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 1 มิ.ย. 2024
- The ancient diesels are trusty pieces of kit. Some trust them to fail when needed most… All in all, with all of the dirty downsides we still cant find anything better for long term cruising. However now.. Things are changing and electric has a place. More power, more range and lees maintenance.
Electric is still not for everyone but it finding a place, in this episode we check out mid sized motors to power a small boat, around the 10m range so perfect for fast sail boats and power boats alike.. possibly a big tender too, so long as you can charge the battery that is!
Let us know your thoughts on electric, still on the fence?
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#electric #motor #compare
#engine #power #fast #light # 20kw # mid sized #lithium #epropulsion #e’dyn #parsun #torqueedo #mitek #alco #boat #conversion #swap #charger #autonomy #range #anxiety #diesel #petrol #yacht #sailing #15hp #tender
00:00 Intro
00:18 E’Dyn
02:12 Elco
05:32 E’Propulsion
09:10 Parsun - วิทยาศาสตร์และเทคโนโลยี
Thanks for the comparison. It was interesting 😊
Cheers guys!
Electric motors are fine, lithium, batteries, questionable not all diesels are dirty… thanks for the video👍
You got that right! Couldn’t agree more. Thanks for commenting!
Sailor comment here (I get that most of this stuff is powerboat oriented) I think it's rock and a hard place with the electric motors for sailors. The big motors (6kW/9+hp equivalents) need a massive battery so they're not feasible for a sailboat tender (good luck with your davit setup, or your back if you're hauling the battery onboard before the motor before the dinghy). The smaller ones are basically trolling motors (I have yet to see any of them get a tender up on a plane, they are either 1kW and don't have enough power, or they're 3kW+ and the battery weight is making it a zero sum game). A 6kW motor with a quick swap battery setup would be super interesting, store a couple extra batteries on the dinghy for faster/heavier runs, keep them in a lazarette on the boat otherwise. For those worried about 6kW chewing through a small battery, a current limiter dial on the tiller is all that's needed. It could be operated at an equivalent to 1kW, 2kW, 3kW...
Yup, us sailors have it tough!
So, it’s a negative feedback loop we have,
more power = more weight = need for more power and so on and so forth.
There is however things on the horizon, but it involves a complete re think and the market gets nervous 😂 the salty sea dogs in us like long keels and 2t motors (there is a reason for this though). Still… it’s going to take a couple of years to see it on the market properly.
As for the dial limiter on the outboards, we could just use the throttle.
@@SailHub With new sailboats at 1/4 million and 50 years of GRP sailboats refusing to die I'm not expecting a re-think to explode the outboard market any time soon... and I'm impatient, I want to leave my gasoline outboard in the past. But for now, there's nothing remotely close to replacing it. It's not about price either, even if I had $20K it wouldn't make sense to put a 6kW motor and massive battery in my tender. BTW What is 2t?
@peterjmcgowan sure, that makes sense. EPropulsion are driving the price down at present, which although hard for other manufacturers it’s forcing everyone to concentrate on price overall. Their new 500w motor was just released at £975. It’s a sewing machine so by the sounds of it not really for you but none the less a long awaited move in the right direction for cost.
2t an abbreviation for a two stroke combustion engine.
@@SailHub ahh, never heard that term used over here in the USA. They’re banned for years now.
@peterjmcgowan how strange, maybe it’s a more of a engineering/motorsports thing? You can usually see 2T written on the the oil bottles. Well in the UK/EU anyhow!
As for being banned, yes that’s right.. but they go forever! There’s hundreds around from the 70’s! The question still remains, which is more sustainable. An old 2T or remanufacturing a new model with lithium and plastics?!
I am liking these mid range outboards. They are powerful enough to power day runabout boats in the 4 to 6 meter length (13-19 feet) and you can actually get some decent speeds (faster than row boats and displacement boat speeds). The prices are fairly reasonable. However, the limitations are still the batteries. While they are improving, they are still quite heavy and expensive for these smaller to mid size runabouts.
I have an old 14 foot fiberglass boat in my garage right now with a 33 hp outboard on it, and the boat is certified for up to 50 hp. These 30 to 40 kw outboards would work well on it, but the associated batteries are still a bit too heavy and expensive. They are getting there, but are not quite there yet.
Yup I think you’ve nailed it! It’s worth noting a 20kw would be expected to more powerful than a 50 Hp and your likely to only use a small amount of the available power most of the time. So the batteries may just work.
Still, it’s great to see the industry progressing around us. Batteries are getting better, their density not so much at present but the safety is becoming awesome!
Ooooph, really sorry! I pressed the wrong button and lost your last comment!
So, if I’m right, yyou have seen plenty of evidence that the 20kw is not enough get up and go for you. That’s good to know m, thanks for letting us know.
I would like to see the models mind, I think there is a lot of strange things going on in electric motors these days as what some manufacturers say are not quite true etc etc, and of course there’s the prop too. That’s the biggest thing effecting performance but little is mentioned about them.
So, we’ve got to go off what people say more than anything so thanks for broadening our knowledge 👍
E Propulsion have stepped up their game. Kudos kids good job
They are taking over! It seems they have an ability to turn new design to product in only a few months. In this industry that’s simply unreal!
Amazing mate,,,
Ah right, cheers
Well done video covering these electric outboards! We agree, electric power is not (yet) for every boater but the benefits are compelling. Prices will become competitive once past the early adopter phase, just like Teslas!
For sure! I think it’s gonna take more than price to convince the majority - we do have a plan to help starting this though!
@@SailHub Just attended a seminar at The Seattle Boat Show by Joe Grez of EPCarry. He maintains that the small boat market will be first to cross over into mainstream but so much needs to be done to ensure efficiency of propulsion. Pricing will become more competitive. Charging is an issue for extended cruising and better suited for use cases where the boat returns to dock each day. But we are living in interesting times. So much $$ investment flowing into ePropulsion. Thank you for your work to shed light on this topic!
Sounds good to me, we’ve been thinking the same for a long while.. check out our website, our project goes live in September and we’re on a mission to solve what we believe is the main issue here… efficiency!
It’s a long haul for sure and we can’t do it by ourselves but we’ve made a start and we have some interest now so let’s make this happen!
Elco 👍🏻
Yeah, they are great 👍
Can you run it off a small gas generator?
Most of them can take an external input but you would need to be specific as to which model.
all we need now is a solar panel canopy...
Lewmar have you sorted there my friend!
As always with new technology everything is way too expensive. They produce these products for pennies on the dollar. Competition will bring the price down. As with electric cars there are many heavy batteries needed.
They should offer this product with gas powered generators as an option. At least until the cost of batteries comes way down and less batteries or lighter weight batteries are available.
All true, I think electric is for a different mindset. The weight is less than a diesel set up but the range is less. If your into sailing it makes sense as your motor becomes a true auxiliary.
@sheaconnelly4287 hmm, this seems very popular for some reason but personally I don’t see why you wouldn’t just go hybrid with something like Integrel’s new system.
YOUR TESTING SOMETHING DO TELL LOL?
No testing here.. Well, no motors at present anyhow! Hopefully by the end of next season we will have our very own electric motor project on the go!
yeah that's my focus too i want an all electric yacht eventually on the snapdragon 24@@SailHub
Ah nice, that’s a great boat for it too!
@ e-propulsion - 40kw at 96 Volt. hmm. Am I doing the math right. 400+ amps?
Yup.
I want to love this motor as it is the one I want in my boat. Just so curious about how they get 400 amps continual to actually work.
Would love more info if anybody has real world experience.
@@carterjohnson25 why wouldn’t it work? Lithium can provide a massive current and the voltage is high so the wires don’t need to be huge.
I guess I’d we look at most electric companies everyone is going high voltage these days, 96v seems to be a standard but others are going higher and if we want power we’ve got to do this! For me, I’m lucky as average sailboats can manage with 48v. I like that because it just seems safer, all though in theory it’s no different.
@SailHub
See my comment. And click the link on the wire gauge calculator. While 96 volt seems like a lot. It's not compared to that amperage. Remember nothing is big (or small) until compared to something else 😊
The physics that needs to be conquered has is not in regards to the discharge rate of the lithium batteries. It's how it's transported. 400 amps for electricity is quite extreme. (Anecdotally, many super high wattage lines that feed entire neighborhoods run at under one amp, but many thousands of volts, which is why the wire can be so thin)
Per Google - At 96 volt DC to carry 400 amps sustained, you need a wire that is 3/4 in thick
Any thinner wire you will have one of two issues.
1) significant voltage drop
2) overheating
Per the voltage calculator you need that 3/4 inch thick pure copper wire if you plan on running 400 amps just 7 ft without One of the two issues above occurring.
Anyhow, I know their motor is obviously working, But physics is physics so something is giving.
This is why I'm curious if someone has real world knowledge of what is giving.
1) are their wires actually that thick all the way to the battery pack?
2) are they running them above 75° f?
3) are they ignoring the voltage drop?
4) or possibly they just don't expect anybody to run it full throttle for any long period of time.
5) maybe if you do run full throttle at a long period of time it fixes itself by cranking down the amps, or power, just like your computer would when the Intel chip overheats.
Anyhow I love this product. And I truly believe in what e propulsion is doing. An electric motor like this is in my future.
I'm just super curious how they get around the pretty hefty physical requirements to move 400 amps over 96 volts.
Maybe some other electrical engineer can chime in to better articulate my concern.
Sure, I see your conundrum. I haven’t seen anyone running exceptionally long cable runs personally. Mind you, one thing is for sure, the cables are huge on these things so I would say your cabling suggestion is what they are using.
Funny thing about these electric alternatives. They all use plastic parts down to the prop. Plastic is a fossil fuel product. And plastic props are crap. So they will need to be replaced regularly. The whole electric powered by batteries motion is crap. Doesn’t help the environment.
Yeah, that gets me 100%. SeaDrive and EPTenchologies I believe are the only ones that actually act responsibly in this department.
Torqeedo finito
Finito? They’ve just been acquired by Yamaha so I would be watching those guys, they will have a point to prove!
@@SailHub No, I mean that after Torqeedo, is the chaos, the Germans are many years ahead.
@stefanoskolovouris7223 interesting, I’m not so sure these days..
No, thank you.
No? Whats up?
yes please.
@@licencetoswill 😂
I’ll stick to my reliable diesel inboards I’ll know I will reach my destination
Indeed, mine Volvo Penta MD18 2000 series 1976, never let me down, no electronics to go wrong also nearly impossible to mount an outboard on my yacht lol
You can’t beat a diesel when it’s working that’s for sure, and most of the time they are working! I think electric has a place but it’s not for everyone.