VRM Basics Part 1 - LFC
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 27 พ.ค. 2024
- I've been threatening to make a video about VRMs for a while now, but when I got down to it, it's harder than I thought. In any case, here's the basics for you so when people start talking about phases and regulators, you'll be able to follow along.
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Couple of notes: The B550-f Strix has 'non-smart' power stages, which don't have quite as much sensing as smart stages do. They're in the same category though, so close enough for the purposes of this video.
It's also worth noting that some of the VRM phases on every mobo are dedicated to powering other things in the CPU, such as the SoC in an AMD chip or the on-board GPU on an Intel chip. I'm not getting into that for this video because it's another complication, when we go down that rabbit hole, there's also notes that CPUs have half a dozen other power rails going to them as well as vcore, and we're getting outside the scope of this video.
i was looking at the asus tuf x570 pro to pair with 9 3900x, is that a good choice for moderate gaming?
@@ldenorio I have that combo, its been fine for me.
the b550 strix-f has a 8 phase controller and is a 6 phase vcore set up with component doubling (+1 for soc) using vishay sic639 50A power stages
@@cluthz actually it runs a 4-2 pahse (cpu+soc) setup, ASUS uses 3 power stages per cpu vrm phase on this model
This is absolutely fascinating. More of this, please.
I class myself as a well educated tech head. However I still find great pleasure in watching Graham & his beard and increase and update my own knowledge . Keep them coming. Stay safe.
Was looking for the 'Part 2' when I realized I'm not as much of a time traveler as I had thought >__< thanks for all the videos!!
Excellentissime vidéo ! Vous êtes, Monsieur, un champion de l'électronique et de l'informatique. I'm quite sure this doesn't require any translation. Except that I would add you undeniably have real teaching skills.
Oh hey, the ROG Strix B550-F! It's my board, and one of the best boards I've ever owned. I have a 3900X running on this thing, with a 4 x 8GB kit of Trident Z Neo 3600 16-16-16-36. Stellar performance.
Such a underrated channel. So glad I've found you. I especially like the "Lets try to fix this PC"-videos.
Thanks , my teacher, I want lessons of this kind
You deserve more subscribers, brilliantly conveyed information.
Great engineer!
Thanks.
This man is the most underrated tech youtuber on yt! Absolutely fascinating!
wow i really appreciate this kind of videos
i already know some of the basics about VRM's
but your explanation is much better and makes more sense
Thank you for the brief explanation
Good Job
Great video as always. Very well explained. Good job!
very educating and informative of basic of understanding motherboards. More of these please!
Thank you 🙏 so much sir , I hope all is well . This info is very helpful and give me a better point of view ! I like the way you mix it up and show the difference in other mother boards !
You are a true hero sir. keep up the fascinating work.
Thanks for posting Graham. It’s amazing how things have moved on over the past 25 or 30 years. I remember when a crude resistor seemed to be the only way to drop voltages
Thank you for the awesome explanation of VRMs.
Great video, good sir. Very well done, very clear, well explained. Keep up the great work!
This is very much appreciated. Thank you for the video.
well presented - I remember the vrm sockets when they 1st came out on AT boards - they had a couple of jumpers on them if you were fitting a 5v chip but removed the jumpers and fitted a small module if you were fitting a 3.3v chip - those boards were not in circulation for long if memory serves it was close to the time of motherboard cache shortages and some manufacturers were fitting fake cache chips with the words 'write back' embossed on them and also featured a bios tweaked to hide the crime... and of course the performance was awful
Good video, I already knew how the VRM worked but I learned a little more with you, keep it up Bro.
Wow! 90Amps is massive! And that's PER POWER STAGE!
A residential main breaker- for the ENTIRE house's current, is usually rated at around 40-60Amps.
An arc welder delivers a steady stream of current for a good weld, when it is around 100Amps.
That, is, a, massive, amount of current available to the CPU! And again- that is PER power stage! Glorious really! The engineering is just amazing!
*Thinking about it now... I know it's low-voltage, but is there a danger of serious injury, or even death from these things, Graham?*
60-90 Amps is frightening.
Comparing a 220V installation to a 1V one is kinda silly!!
@@sassuki I don't know much about electricity- I'm a software engineer, which is why I'm amazed and why I asked if there is any danger in that.
If you don't know something, you ask, don't you? Doesn't matter how "st3wp|d" it may sound.
Very nice explained on the paper 👌🏻 better than most of teachers in university
Best video on VRMs/ motherboard.. very informative.. Thank You !
This is brilliant. Do more of these please.
Thankyou for explaining very intresting
A nasty subject that can get out of hand explaining it, but you kept it simple and clear. Nice job so far. Can't wait for part 2. Cheers!
Very cool content. Looking forward to the next one.
Bloody good idea for a video, thank you good work.
There it is, promised multiphase Vcore video!😊 Thanks Graham, precise and informative as always!😉👍👍
Thanks very much for interesting and educational, more of it please...
I don't know how you don't have millions of subs. Love your channel!! Its like I'm at school you just have a way with words and makes its fun to watch!!. Keep them coming! Oh btw what are your thoughts on tuf x570-plus wifi motherboard?
Thank you, Little Clive.
Great video m8 very informative
Best Adam video so far.. that i´ve seen.. : ) .. Bis.
Very good explanation that my smooth brain can understand.
Great video, thanks
When you explain it like that, it's so simple :)
I waited for a long time to see a video regarding VRM's
very educational and interesting, i would love if you made more of these for other components in a computer aswell! i think it would be a big help for those starting in IT and computer science like me and such.
how true indeed, have a b550m el cheapo board mining monero with a 3950x, was throttling, the vrms have no heat sinks so had to install a cooling fan to get it to work right.
good video well made video looking forward to part 2
Very helpful, thank you.
There was a TV series back in the 70's called Adam Adamant, he was a super hero.
Very nice useful video
Nice. Really nice. More of this.
We need more of this
10:15 Ok, Jay
great video ...big fan from Syria
we stand in solidarity with you guys in the face of terrorist bombing by Israel
A true scholar
Will look forward to the next video. I actually have the MSI X470 gaming plus max board that you showed in this video paired with a Ryzen 7 2700X. I thought this board was a little cheap on VRMs but I'm not overclocking so I think it will be ok.
Thank you!.
Now this is what I call a real educational video!!! Excellent stuff, and nice pace too. Now could you explain the whole motherboard please. 😁😀
Hold up, we're not even done with the VRMs yet!
love it!
Amazing video man. Thanks. You are very good in your subject and you explain very well. One question: How you learned all these things do you have electronic engineering degree, from books, videos, online classes...?
Thanks
Very interesting.......more
mindblowing :D
I have the Asus x570 Pro Prime - the white-plastic accented consumer board, not the creator board.
I knew this ahead of time, but it claims "12" phases, but it's a four phase with each power stage Tripled and a crazy amount of filtration. Totally capable, yes, but a very silly way to get the correct power output. That said, it's not had a single issue, so...
Wonderful
Thanks for this, wish I understood that before buying my current MB.
I was worried about BIOSs (as I had no old AMD CPU) and decided to go with a cheap 570 board (X570-A PRO).
Not a problem with my 3600 CPU but somewhat limiting for future upgrades.
I recently bought parts for a new PC and i was going to get the b550-f but i ended up with the b450-f because it was £100 cheaper
wow....... thankyou
Ok, this is weird. I just bought a x470, this exact board. I picked it up because it was so cheap but I was suspect of it because it had that small heatsink over the vrm's. Thanks to your video I returned it and picked up a x570 instead. I want the 8 phase vrm's with a nice heatsink and the x570 gaming plus has got it and a lot more goodies. I just know I would regret it everyday knowing I only had 4 phases and plus it doesn't make it very sellable
This is funny, I have a GA-K8 Ultra 9, that I just recently ordered a Athlon X2 4800+ to build it up into some youngtimer sort of thing.
These old boards are great for explaining stuff, I even still have some Pentium 1 boards with an actual, slotted VRM module that you can exchange.
Slotted VRM? That's rad, I didn't know they ever used literal modules on computer motherboards. I thought that was just in integrated systems.
@@Adamant_IT Once I have one of the old Siemenses open again I'll send you a picture.
I think it had to do with the fact that on Socket 7 some CPU's required adifferent core voltage that other, like 2.2 instead of 3 or so, i don't remember from top of my head now.
Very good explanation on how VRMs work, my only complaint is that at 7:14 the phases are connected directly to the PWM controller without doublers.
YOU DA MAN
Watching here from philippines..:)
great video, could you explain how coil works and go more in-depth on it? i'm most interested in that stuff you were showing on paper, and then the visual follow-up on the motherboards. thing is, i feel like more needs to be explained on the paper about the basics like how a capacitor and inductor actually works.
You are exceptionally knowledgeable about electronics
and now you'll have to do a video explaining Mosfets
Very interesting but I got lost after, “Hello Interwebs” 🤪
13:32
**cough**
Intel
**cough**
I a m sick of intel too.
Brill More Please
Thank you graham for the great video (sorry teaching).i think iam the only one listening but all the comments on below struck me .every one listening to you.so kindly please upload basic repairing study materials of laptops
Great video Graham, to the layperson ,we wouldn't even notice this ,but even in electronics ,you can still cut corners! I have a MSI Tomahawk B450 Max which I am pleased with .I have the Ryzen 5 3600 which does me fine .I do mostly photography editing and don't game ,but as far as I know this board is rated pretty high . Could you please tell what the maximum CPU I could run on this board for what I do ?
Well, spoiler for Part 2, VRMs matter less than you might think in the majority of cases. For overclocking or number crunching, choice comes into play, but for general gaming and productivity, basic VRMs will do just fine.
No need to ask Graham. Just go to the MSI website and look it up yourself. Probably a Ryzen 9.
Go for a beefier VRM than what you think you will need.
hello. can i use the thermal paste on my vrm heatsink instead of thermal pad? since itry to clean my vrm heatsink but i messed my stock thermal pad. i mean it was cut and messed. my board ia msi b550m mortar. thank you
You could try it, but you might not get a very firm mount. The push pins for the heatsink will usually assume that there's 1 or 2mm of thermal pad. If the heatsink fits ok (not loose) with thermal paste alone though, you should be fine.
How does the gigabyte b550 Aorus master vrm’s compare? I hear the master is way over engineered and run roughly 10°C less than almost all other b550 motherboards.
I was wondering does this then pull down more amps ?
Yes, bigger VRM setups can supply more amps. However, in theory a mobo should be capable of powering any CPU that's on its supported list.
Is that board same like ROG Strix B550-A model ?
what a coincidence, my relative has this board for his rig lol
Hi everyone
If anyone can help ?
My laptop charger was broken i tried to repaired it but the moment i plugged it my laptop it went off ( no lights is turning on ) and the charging lights is not turning on i sent it for repair and it was diagnosed that the motherboard was fried and the motherboard needs to be replaced . Can it be be fixed without changing the motherboard?? (Laptop model dell inspiron 5521)
Please help
Asus skimped on the intel bioards previous 2 generations put 4 phase vrms they marketed as 8 or 12 phase vrms while charging more than the boards with real 12 or 16 phase vrms and then people were wondering why their overclocked CPUs were throttling when they well within temp spec .......
Valrage Regulafor Module :-) Your Handwriting teacher must be so proud, LOL.. Oh wait; they killed handwriting lessons in the uk ;-)
It took me so many takes to do that scene. After I messed up the hand writing I was like "yo know, I don't care. That'll do. Everyone will know what I mean." 😅
@@Adamant_IT I really am joking dude. I love your vids. But be kind to me, how could I not point that out? Had to do it :-)
What IT certifications do you have?
None of note. I am 99% self-taught from experience and other TH-cam channels.
I technically have an Advance Vocational Certificate in ICT, which I guess is similar to the A+, except it covers more topics. I did that in UK College (age 16-18). It was more useful in deciding what career direction to take than actually training me though.
I own the B550-E. When I installed it it was rock solid. With a 5600X. Which has better VRM's than B550-F, with old EVGA Supernova Nex 750 watt Gold PSU
However, I wanted a power supply with silent running and installed it a week ago. The Corsair PSU did not like running on my PC and crashed 2 to 3 times a day for no reason, and found it hard to run my CPU and motherboard. I gave up after two days and reinstalled my old five year old power supply.
Now, my concern is that I may have damaged the motherboard or the new RTX Suprim 3070 from MSI. Or the DDR 4 memory. With the crap Corsair RMX 750 watt that has been found faulty by Scan....
Today , had random bluescreens. Civilisation 6 and a general Windows failure. Civ 6 has a known fault apparently with Logitech peripheral software. So uninstalled that. and adjusted the logi software It crashed once more. So uninstalled ASUS AI suite, Amory Crate and Dragon master MSI.
My next options are, mem test to test the 32 gig of RAM. Reinstall Windows 10, because, its bluescreens and restarts.
Any suggestions to identify the fault?
PS, I have the 8 slot PSU CPU cable plugged in and the extra 4 pin since reinstalling onto the motherboard with old PSU.
Yea start with memory testing. Unlikely that the mobo was damaged by the PSU in my experiance.
Try going to Bios and running base memory speeds for a few days, then enable xmp, if it's fine. I've had a memory overclock run solid for years, and then only crashed in one particular game, bluescreens and all. It passed 24 hours of mem test, too, but downclocking the RAM made it stable for the one title.
@@JonathanSias Put BIOS on auto memory. I will see if system stability returns/remains.
That Corsair PSU...hope it did not do a number on system. Its brand new (the system).
@@Adamant_IT I took drastic option and reinstalled Windows. Testing continues.
Do motherboards for Intel processors have similar VRM Issues?
Yup, Intel is very similar, only differences are technicalities - AMD needs an extra phase or two for SoC, Intel uses one for on-board GPU, that sort of thing. Main CPU vcore requirements are very similar though. Intel currently gets more thirsty than AMD, but we're still talking 100-200w stock speed, 200-300w typical overclock. Extreme overclocking can get wild, you'll head into 400w and up categories, but that's why top end mobos cost $400 and have 16-phase 90amp smart power stages.
👏👏👏👏👏👏
Can you explain why CPUs have two power supplies? Yes, the ones without an integrated GPU have two power supplies, as the GA-K8NMF-9 has one above.
System Agent, System on Chip, stuff like that. The CPU is a very complicated device and has 5-7 different voltage rails feeding it. Vcore is just the big workhorse one.
Is that middle stage missing a cap?
The outputs from the Inductors are all joined together, so from that point onwards you can more or less add capacitors wherever you like. They tend to get positioned wherever there's space (they have to make sure there's standard clearances for CPU heatsinks) rather than making sure there's an even number for each phase. So long as there's enough in total that's what really matters.
👍👍👍
I have a 5600x on a b450 pro-m2. Bad VRM, but it works fine.
👍
Hoping for someone to help me modify my EVGA Z370 Micro-atx board with LLC, it doesn't come with the mobo bios -_-
Asus motherboards are the best by far nearly all issues are caused by the user I have used hundreds of them and have only had one issue since 1999.
@@ihatepokemonthings you are obviously a novice with computers I didn't say they don't have failures but they have way less especially the more expensive boards Asrock have a high rate of failure as do Gigabyte MSI are virtually as good. But as said previously a lot of failure is human error when building the PC.
You would be more accurate to call these "buck converters" rather than VRM's usually a mosfet, inductor, capacitor. Also called level shifters.
are you threatening me ?!?!?!?!?!? :D
Phase doubling
Hello my asus tuf x570 gaming plus
😆😆😆😆
Yea Asus have been a bit cheeky with phase doubling or even tripling on some boards, but the power stages still make for a decent setup on mid-range boards.
Well